What BillionGraves is, is like Find a Grave, except a smartphone app
is used to take pictures of the headstones at any cemetery, the app
adds GPS data, and the user then uploads the pictures taken to the
BillionGraves website. As soon as they are uploaded, the photos are
immediately browsable.
Others then transcribe the data, and as soon as a transcription is
finished and the user transcribing goes to the next image, that
information is also searchable.
BillionGraves is already a FamilySearch affiliate, so they have been
working with them for nearly a year now. But now FamilySearch is
going to make the data searchable through its own search engine, which
will allow matches for headstones to show alongside results for other
records like say, a 1940 Census record or some other record that
FamilySearch has.
You'll still be able to search globally and by cemetery at
BillionGraves, the FamilySearch integration will allow for finding
multiple records for the same person. So if you are looking for the
headstone and BillionGraves has it, it will be there alongside any
other types of records, or if you are looking for that other type of
record, and BillionGraves has a headstone, that will show alongside
the other search.
BillionGraves also has an ambitious goal for May, to collect 1 million
new headstone photos. More on that at their website.
Here's the FamilySearch blog post that mentions the integration of the
database with FamilySearch's own search results, and the article also
has the best description of how it works, some FamilySearch employees
went out and shot through a large cemetery, gathering pictures of over
14,000 headstones in a single day last month.
> What BillionGraves is, is like Find a Grave, except a smartphone app
> is used to take pictures of the headstones at any cemetery, the app
> adds GPS data, and the user then uploads the pictures taken to the
> BillionGraves website. As soon as they are uploaded, the photos are
> immediately browsable.
And when I told them about the errors the app introduced into items I uploaded, they did NOT correct them. They have the coordinates of one cemetery about a half a mile from where it really is, but when I took two photos several miles from both the correct and incorrect locations, they still listed it as that cemetery. And I canceled out of uploads later that day even further away when I saw they were about to do the same thing.
And I have to assume that the volunteer transcribing is almost as bad as that already on familysearch.org. I say almost, because _some_ of the errors in familysearch are due to FS _telling_ people to alter the text of the records, i.e., to correct what we (volunteers) _think_ are errors in the original document!
Add that to the volunteer's own lack of knowledge, e.g.,
My ancestors surnamed _Giffin_ are sometimes indexed _Grifin_ even when (I checked) the original document quite plainly and obviously has no 'r'
My wife's ancestor Wiktorya Słomiana indexed as Wiktorya Stomiany
(one who knows nothing of Polish should not be indexing Polish names)
Or the volunteer's negligence: Surely not even FS told this person to get date of marriage from the date of license column , even when the correct column plainly said "no marriage occurred"
If you don't see the source yourself, assume they got it wrong.
And that applies to everything on my database, too. You have no way of knowing whether I practice what I preach. And I'll tell you up front, there was a time when I did not practice what I now preach.
Off my soapbox and off to bed....
-- Wes Groleau
There are more Baroque musicians than any other kind.
What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
or two where the orange pushpins simply don't show up for the cemetery
where there might be a couple hundred gravestones photographed.
BillionGraves themselves say some Androids have crappy GPS, and that
may be what was used to shoot those cemeteries you mention. Also,
iPhones before 3GS are a little suspect too.
Also, I understand that down the line, probably after this year given
the work on Family Tree that is apparently top priority, they plan to
have a way eventually to send in corrections to FamilySearch Indexing
data. Not sure how it will work, but it is on their 'to do' list of
things they want to do.
> What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
> it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
> the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
> or two where the orange pushpins simply don't show up for the cemetery
> where there might be a couple hundred gravestones photographed.
> BillionGraves themselves say some Androids have crappy GPS, and that
> may be what was used to shoot those cemeteries you mention. Also,
> iPhones before 3GS are a little suspect too.
> Also, I understand that down the line, probably after this year given
> the work on Family Tree that is apparently top priority, they plan to
> have a way eventually to send in corrections to FamilySearch Indexing
> data. Not sure how it will work, but it is on their 'to do' list of
> things they want to do.
How is the BillionGraves site different from FindaGrave.com? Both seem to offer researchers the same information and images, with the latter having been working and growing for a number of years now. On Findagrave, a search on my surname brings 522 hits. On BillionGraves it yields three.
> > What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
> > it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
> > the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
> > or two where the orange pushpins simply don't show up for the cemetery
> > where there might be a couple hundred gravestones photographed.
> > BillionGraves themselves say some Androids have crappy GPS, and that
> > may be what was used to shoot those cemeteries you mention. Also,
> > iPhones before 3GS are a little suspect too.
> > Also, I understand that down the line, probably after this year given
> > the work on Family Tree that is apparently top priority, they plan to
> > have a way eventually to send in corrections to FamilySearch Indexing
> > data. Not sure how it will work, but it is on their 'to do' list of
> > things they want to do.
> How is the BillionGraves site different from FindaGrave.com? Both seem to
> offer researchers the same information and images, with the latter having
> been working and growing for a number of years now. On Findagrave, a search
> on my surname brings 522 hits. On BillionGraves it yields three.
All of the big cemetery sites are different. I've maintained in
talking with people about researching is that you use all of them,
even for the same data, as one site will have data or information the
other sites don't, or will have a detail that another site won't have
for whatever reason. Also, the method of presenting the data is
different with each one, and that can mean some things may be on one
site that are not on another even for the same grave.
The major difference between Findagrave, which everyone should use
anyway because of its depth of coverage and that because it's the
oldest of the cemetery sites, and BillionGraves is the cemetery
mapping, as even with the occasional GPS errors, including those
mentioned earlier in the thread, you can go in and find where the
stone is on the Google map, and also zoom in and see other headstones
nearby, just click on an orange pushpin, you'll see it's photo pop up
just like any other data put in.
And the stones can be seen and show on the map as soon as the person
who took them uploads them to the site.
I'd also use Interment.net and the various Rootsweb and US Genweb
pages, especially for register data where stones are missing and so
don't show in any mapping sites like BillionGraves or Names in Stone.
I've heard a report that that last one has had some downtime issues,
but checked it and it's back up again, seems to load faster as well so
I believe the downtime to have been ISP and/or hosting service tech
issues.
> "James W Anderson"<jand...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:937f6e88-b50b-4760-bab8-148f9feb7123@wp13g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>> What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
>> it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
>> the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
>> or two where the orange pushpins simply don't show up for the cemetery
>> where there might be a couple hundred gravestones photographed.
>> BillionGraves themselves say some Androids have crappy GPS, and that
>> may be what was used to shoot those cemeteries you mention. Also,
>> iPhones before 3GS are a little suspect too.
>> Also, I understand that down the line, probably after this year given
>> the work on Family Tree that is apparently top priority, they plan to
>> have a way eventually to send in corrections to FamilySearch Indexing
>> data. Not sure how it will work, but it is on their 'to do' list of
>> things they want to do.
> How is the BillionGraves site different from FindaGrave.com? Both seem to
> offer researchers the same information and images, with the latter having
> been working and growing for a number of years now. On Findagrave, a search
> on my surname brings 522 hits. On BillionGraves it yields three.
IME, the images are worse, there are far fewer of 'em, none from my research area, and close to none on any of my surnames.
Still, doesn't hurt to look, particularly if you're desperate.
James W Anderson wrote:
> And the stones can be seen and show on the map as soon as the person
> who took them uploads them to the site.
That's true of Find-a-Grave too, AFAIK. All the images I've upped have appeared within minutes.
> I'd also use Interment.net and the various Rootsweb and US Genweb
> pages, especially for register data where stones are missing and so
> don't show in any mapping sites like BillionGraves or Names in Stone.
Haven't seen that last one, James. Care to share the URL (assuming it's not obvious).
>> And the stones can be seen and show on the map as soon as the person
>> who took them uploads them to the site.
> That's true of Find-a-Grave too, AFAIK. All the images I've
> upped have appeared within minutes.
>> I'd also use Interment.net and the various Rootsweb and US Genweb
>> pages, especially for register data where stones are missing and so
>> don't show in any mapping sites like BillionGraves or Names in Stone.
> Haven't seen that last one, James. Care to share the URL
> (assuming it's not obvious).
-- Robert G. Melson | Rio Grande MicroSolutions | El Paso, Texas
-----
The greatest tyrannies are always perpetrated
in the name of the noblest causes -- Thomas Paine
> What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
> it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
> the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
Go to Billion Graves (BG) Cemetery Lookup.
Put in United States, Indiana, Allen County
Select "Saint Pauls Cemetery" (Why do people hate apostrophes?)
That is not a cemetery, and as far as I know, never has been.
See Coldwater Road and the Interstate to the east? Just north is Ludwig Road. Drag the intersection of Coldwater and Ludwig to the center. Zoom all the way in, and you will see the stones in the real St. Paul's Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery. Or go to
<http://tinyurl.com/896jl7x> (AGAIN a missing apostrophe!)
Back on BG, click on "Headstone Images (193)" I took all of these photos. The BG app uploaded them and labeled them "Saint Pauls Cemetery"
If you show map on the first two, you will see that they are miles from both St. Paul's Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery and from the bogus location.
The first one I looked at has been transcribed incorrectly, but I did not want it to be uploaded because the fellow is not deceased!
I asked them to fix it back in January. When they began SPAMMING me
last month, I told them how disappointed I was that they hadn't fixed it, and that I wanted my account deleted. I guess I should have been
clearer:
********************************************************************
* I hereby rescind any permission for Billion Graves to display my *
* name anywhere, and I revoke any permission for them to use any *
* of the photos I took. I am NOT a contributor to Billion Graves *
* and must not be listed as such. *
********************************************************************
On 05-03-2012 23:35, James W Anderson wrote:
> What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
> it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
> the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
Go to Billion Graves (BG) Cemetery Lookup.
Put in United States, Indiana, Allen County
Select "Saint Pauls Cemetery" (Why do people hate apostrophes?)
That is not a cemetery, and as far as I know, never has been.
See Coldwater Road and the Interstate to the east? Just north is Ludwig Road. Drag the intersection of Coldwater and Ludwig to the center. Zoom all the way in, and you will see the stones in the real St. Paul's Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery. Or go to
<http://tinyurl.com/896jl7x> (AGAIN a missing apostrophe!)
Back on BG, click on "Headstone Images (193)" I took all of these photos. The BG app uploaded them and labeled them "Saint Pauls Cemetery"
If you show map on the first two, you will see that they are miles from both St. Paul's Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery and from the bogus location.
The first one I looked at has been transcribed incorrectly, but I did not want it to be uploaded because the fellow is not deceased!
I asked them to fix it back in January. When they began SPAMMING me
last month, I told them how disappointed I was that they hadn't fixed it, and that I wanted my account deleted. I guess I should have been
clearer:
********************************************************************
* I hereby rescind any permission for Billion Graves to display my *
* name anywhere, and I revoke any permission for them to use any *
* of the photos I took. I am NOT a contributor to Billion Graves *
* and must not be listed as such. *
********************************************************************
Yeah, I agree. You'd think they'd list the national cemeteries, at least. I did notice, however, that the cemeteries are "voluntary members". Still, their listings are minimal.
S. O. B.
-- Robert G. Melson | Rio Grande MicroSolutions | El Paso, Texas
-----
The greatest tyrannies are always perpetrated
in the name of the noblest causes -- Thomas Paine
One of the things Names in Stone does is work with cemeteries, and
while they are trying to get others involved, that has not worked out
as well as desired for either us or them, and so that one cemetery may
be one they actually worked with.
The potential here is that if a cemetery works with them, they can
tell Names in Stone of recent burials and their locations on a regular
basis, that's something not common with any of the other headstone
list sites. Everything else seems to be hit or miss on that score,
that is why one should view as many sources for burial information as
possible.
I'll do some more checking on the three locations you gave the links
to, it's more to get some things written about the discrepancies so
that when people look for the headstones they go to the right pages to
find the information, and so the citations of the sources show the
correct information as well.
Obviously, knowing where those or any headstones really are, versus
where they were displayed as being at, will make a big difference in
stating what was found where, and where to go if you want to actually
visit the place.
Bob Melson wrote:
> On Friday 04 May 2012 19:57, singhals (singh...@erols.com) opined:
>> James W Anderson wrote:
>>> And the stones can be seen and show on the map as soon as the person
>>> who took them uploads them to the site.
>> That's true of Find-a-Grave too, AFAIK. All the images I've
>> upped have appeared within minutes.
>>> I'd also use Interment.net and the various Rootsweb and US Genweb
>>> pages, especially for register data where stones are missing and so
>>> don't show in any mapping sites like BillionGraves or Names in Stone.
>> Haven't seen that last one, James. Care to share the URL
>> (assuming it's not obvious).
Wes Groleau wrote:
> On 05-04-2012 22:36, Bob Melson wrote:
>> Just on a lark ... It IS pretty obvious:www.namesinstone.com
> VERY nice looking website. Much better than any of the "competitors"
> mentioned in this thread.
> But since they only have ONE cemetery in the whole state of Indiana, it
> doesn't even seem worth the time to look for anything.
Yeah, it's pretty. May be slicker'n goose grease on hi-speed, but I can't see using most of the features (mapping, f'instance) on dial-up or mobile.
This one and BG share a fascination with form over content. I prefer F-a-G.
I found 0 hits on one of my more populous names, and 5 on one of the lesser-known ones...all two time zones away from the name's population center. I clicked on "Deceased Page" which brought up a pretty but informationless page that added to what was on the results screen ONLY the name of the county(ies) involved. I hit BACK to try another tab and got "Page expired". Hit RELOAD, "need to resend OK?"
Hitting GRAVE brought up a plot-map and the same info as above. If there's a photo of either the cemetery entrance or the stone itself it wasn't here. But at least, there's a Back to search results on this one.
OK, it's a place to look, but they found only 5100 SMITHs. ;)
> On 05-03-2012 23:35, James W Anderson wrote:
> > What pages on BillionGraves have the GPS errors? I'll make a note of
> > it where they appear in other places. That way users will be aware of
> > the issue with those cemeteries. I think I've run across a cemetery
> Go to Billion Graves (BG) Cemetery Lookup.
> Put in United States, Indiana, Allen County
> Select "Saint Pauls Cemetery" (Why do people hate apostrophes?)
> That is not a cemetery, and as far as I know, never has been.
> See Coldwater Road and the Interstate to the east? Just north is Ludwig
> Road. Drag the intersection of Coldwater and Ludwig to the center. Zoom
> all the way in, and you will see the stones in the real St. Paul's
> Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery. Or go to
> <http://tinyurl.com/896jl7x> (AGAIN a missing apostrophe!)
> Back on BG, click on "Headstone Images (193)" I took all of these
> photos. The BG app uploaded them and labeled them "Saint Pauls Cemetery"
> If you show map on the first two, you will see that they are miles from
> both St. Paul's Evangelical Lutheran Cemetery and from the bogus location.
> The other 191 are in Parker Cemetery, also miles away from St. Paul's.
> See <http://tinyurl.com/7d4htma>
> The first one I looked at has been transcribed incorrectly, but I did
> not want it to be uploaded because the fellow is not deceased!
> I asked them to fix it back in January. When they began SPAMMING me
> last month, I told them how disappointed I was that they hadn't fixed
> it, and that I wanted my account deleted. I guess I should have been
> clearer:
> ********************************************************************
> * I hereby rescind any permission for Billion Graves to display my *
> * name anywhere, and I revoke any permission for them to use any *
> * of the photos I took. I am NOT a contributor to Billion Graves *
> * and must not be listed as such. *
> ********************************************************************
From their FAQ Page:
"What if my smartphone says I’m in a different cemetery when I’m taking pictures?
If you are in a cemetery, the camera view will list the name of the cemetery on the side of your screen. If the cemetery name is not the cemetery you are in, you can change it. Tap the cemetery name, and a list of possible cemeteries will come up (those in close proximity with your GPS location). Tap the name of the cemetery you are in. If, however, your cemetery is not listed or the camera does not recognize that you are in a cemetery, you can add a cemetery. From the Home screen, tap Cemeteries, and then either tap the “+” at the top of the screen or the Add a New Cemetery button at the end of the list of cemeteries. Save the cemetery you create, and then go back to the camera view, verify the correct cemetery name is showing, and start taking pictures.
"What if the map coordinates for the cemetery I added aren’t accurate?
If the coordinates are inaccurate, for whatever reason, please notify us of the problem and provide the correct latitude and longitude values for the cemetery (try using Google Maps to get the values).
What if the map coordinates for my photo aren’t accurate?
We are constantly working to improve and update the GPS capabilities of the BillionGraves app. However, due to varying cell service quality and other factors, your phone’s GPS is not always 100% accurate. However, even if a photo has inaccurate coordinates assigned to it, the coordinates are often close enough to provide anyone searching for a GPS-tagged headstone with a reasonably narrowed area in which to look. If you wish to provide a more accurate set of coordinates and can acquire them through another means, please notify us, referencing the photo and including accurate latitude and longitude values.
They acknowledge that the technology is inconsistent and sometimes inaccurate but they do provide a means to correct them.
That being said, I don't use Billion Graves because I can not afford a smart phone and feel that it is shortsighted of them to exclude all other means when it would be relatively easy to upload batches of photos with Cemetery names and co-ordinates with out a smart phone.
> This one and BG share a fascination with form over content. I prefer
> F-a-G.
Ditto. I sent BG two messages, one about the error, and one saying
"Since you are more concerned with making it pretty than making it work, delete my account and photos. They didn't. (Not surprising, since they also chose not to fix the error.)
That last bit surprised me, though. Developer is LDS (I know due to having seen him in some online forums), so why wouldn't he want to ensure the information is accurate?
But then, as I've griped about elsewhere, FamilySearch also doesn't share my views on accuracy.
-- Wes Groleau
I've noticed lately that the paranoid fear of computers becoming
intelligent and taking over the world has almost entirely disappeared
from the common culture. Near as I can tell, this coincides with
the release of MS-DOS.
— Larry DeLuca
> "What if my smartphone says I’m in a different cemetery when I’m taking
> pictures?
> If you are in a cemetery, the camera view will list the name of the
> cemetery on the side of your screen. If the cemetery name is not the
Must be new. If "Saint Pauls" [sic] had been on my screen when I was not at St. Paul's, I would have noticed.
> "What if the map coordinates for the cemetery I added aren’t accurate?
> If the coordinates are inaccurate, for whatever reason, please notify us
> of the problem and provide the correct latitude and longitude values for
Notified of all these errors more than once. Nothing happened.
-- Wes Groleau
I've noticed lately that the paranoid fear of computers becoming
intelligent and taking over the world has almost entirely disappeared
from the common culture. Near as I can tell, this coincides with
the release of MS-DOS.
— Larry DeLuca
> That being said, I don't use Billion Graves because I can not afford a
> smart phone and feel that it is shortsighted of them to exclude all
> other means when it would be relatively easy to upload batches of photos
> with Cemetery names and co-ordinates with out a smart phone.
Find-a-Grave makes it fairly easy, but they don't automatically copy the coordinates from the EXIF, nor do they attempt to create information on their own. Which is as it should be, IMHO.
-- Wes Groleau
I've noticed lately that the paranoid fear of computers becoming
intelligent and taking over the world has almost entirely disappeared
from the common culture. Near as I can tell, this coincides with
the release of MS-DOS.
— Larry DeLuca
