Die Gedanken Sind Frei

[HHW]

http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind-frei/

[mirjam]

On Wednesday, August 22, 2012 11:20:06 PM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
> http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind-frei/


Yes yes thoughts are FREE ,,,,,
Inciting speech is also free, but his arrogance is so big thhat he failed hi,self exposed his REAL intentions and later asked to take this off the net....as it harmed his PR


http://www.jewlicious.com/2012/02/norman-finkelstein-exposes-the-bds-movement-as-dishonest-a-cult/

mirjam

[HHW]

On 22 ago, 23:28, mirjam <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote:
> On Wednesday, August 22, 2012 11:20:06 PM UTC+3, HHW wrote:

> >http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind...

>
> Yes yes thoughts are FREE ,,,,,
> Inciting speech is also free, but his arrogance is so big thhat he failed hi,self exposed his REAL intentions and later asked to take this off the net....as it harmed his PR

I got it yesterday from his blog. So apparently it doesn't bother him.
What's your problem, that the refrain is sung in German?
>
> http://www.jewlicious.com/2012/02/norman-finkelstein-exposes-the-bds-...
>
> mirjam

[mirjam]

On Thursday, August 23, 2012 8:26:23 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
>
> I got it yesterday from his blog. So apparently it doesn't bother him.
>
> What's your problem, that the refrain is sung in German?

By the way Do you Understand /speak German ??? i do not think so
So how would you understand any of it ?
mirjam

>
> >
>
> > http://www.jewlicious.com/2012/02/norman-finkelstein-exposes-the-bds-...
>
> >
>
> > mirjam

[HHW]

On 23 ago, 05:23, mirjam <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote:
> On Thursday, August 23, 2012 8:26:23 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
>
> > I got it yesterday from his blog. So apparently it doesn't bother him.
>
> > What's your problem, that the refrain is sung in German?
>
> By the way Do you Understand /speak German ??? i do not think so
> So how would you understand any of it ?
> mirjam

I don't affect, like some others here, to be multi-lingual. That's
rare among Americans who came out of our rural Middle West in the
1950s.

I can bring some of it back to conscious memory, especially with a
little prompting, e.g., from a newspaper, but my two years of it in
college were a half century ago and I haven't run into a half dozen
native speakers since. Spanish would have been a much better choice.
In short: Mein Deutsch ist aus dem Fenster geflogen.

> > >http://www.jewlicious.com/2012/02/norman-finkelstein-exposes-the-bds-...

By the way, I don't agree with Norman on bds, but that's a mere
tactical matter within the movement. He will eventually be honored not
only as a fine scholar and courageous beyond the call, but as a great
American, an historic figure. He appears to have no ego and would
probably bristle at the idea, but it's true anyway. His reputation
will be secured in the passage of time when Americans can see his life
in context. Biographies will be written and he will have a secure
place in the history of our era.


>
> > > mirjam

[mirjam]

On Saturday, August 25, 2012 12:28:12 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:

>
> > By the way Do you Understand /speak German ??? i do not think so
>
> > So how would you understand any of it ?
>
> > mirjam
>
>
>
> I don't affect, like some others here, to be multi-lingual.

Well Mr HHW, for once you are telling a true fact about yourself. but you ruin the effect by stating that others here affect their being multi Lingual.... At least i am exactly that.

That's

> rare among Americans who came out of our rural Middle West in the

> 1950s.

and that is your excuse or just an anecdote?

> I can bring some of it back to conscious memory, especially with a
>
> little prompting, e.g., from a newspaper, but my two years of it in
>
> college were a half century ago and I haven't run into a half dozen
>
> native speakers since.

And why did you choose to learn German in college ?? anyone at home spoke it?

> In short: Mein Deutsch ist aus dem Fenster geflogen.

pity for you

but it explains a lot about your reactions here.

> By the way, I don't agree with Norman on bds,

you did not mention this when you posted the Utube,

And i must say that at first i did not want to look at the utube, but since i happen to know about the history of that specific song, spoke with some History Expert, and decided to look and see it.
And Was not surprised to see how Finkelstein again Distorts History by using this song to accompany a Foul filled with Anti Semitic propaganda film.
This is Way beyond BDS , this is Pure Incitement, done by somebody, filled with hysterical hate. Unable to judge what he portrays,
There is nothing Tactical at this film that has been made the manner that Nazi propaganda.
If you as an American citizen living in your free country and enjoying it`s benefits and telling us day after day year after year, that you spread hate `because you love your country` can watch such Nazi Filth.
Than i am sorry to tell you , that You do not love your country you hate it!
You do not have the slightest idea what Freedom means, You do not understand what respect to other cultures is, you barely know what culture is.

You probably did not only forgot you German studies, but also any other Studies you ever learned...
You lost the ability to think and judge for yourself!!!!

Poor HHW, i pity you.
mirjam ,

[HHW]

Well, Ms. Mirjam, in the first place there is no chance that I am
going to apologize for anything which might be found on Norman
Finkelstein's blog. If he is sending signals to Israelis or American
Jews by posting that film there, there's nothing I can help you with.
I admire the man. He has immense courage, judgment and an impeccable
moral sense. The lyrics of the song are compelling. They are a hymn to
freedom in the face of oppression. IF they are a Jewish hymn to
freedom from the Nazi era then all the better because they also
reflect his life and career. I think that's the irony here. I doubt
you know much of his life and career. Of course he is a Jew, the son
of Holocaust survivors. He fights the good fight in a cause which can
only benefit everyone involved. He gets more than the benefit of the
doubt from me. As you know I'm convinced he's a great American.

The lyrics are not "inciting". They are gentle and reflect the human
condition in a general sense. Whoever wrote them rose above the
particular even if he might have written them in a Nazi camp. The song
itself inspires. It does not incite. If, however, it has a particular
context understood by Jews which affects you so, why have you withheld
it from us? I'm a curious man. I tend to want to know most everything
"that's fit to print."

Perhaps it's the three or four non-Norman images which have you in
such a rage. One of them shows a demonstrator with a cardboard sign
which has the word fascist on it. Another is an image of your
apartheid wall with "Ghetto" painted on it and Norman standing there
with the paint brush. Does it drive you into a rage that someone might
see parallels between the history of Zionism in power and of the
Nazis? After all there are in fact some parallels.

And then there is the issue which is more mine than Norman's, the fact
that we American's are entangled with you and are having a terrible
time regaining our autonomy in our own legislature and in the White
House. We have a hell of a lot at stake in this mess and you are not
cooperating. We have an absolute right to tell you what we think about
our "forty years together", your conduct in the relationship and in
Palestine and about any historical parallels which we believe in good
faith to be apposite. We have paid a greater price as a result of our
"friendship" than Israel has shouldered on behalf of herself in her
entire history. You will not silence us. That humiliating,
pusillanimous era in our history is over.

[HHW]

So, Mirjam, tell us what your obviously calculated and dishonest
hysteria was about. It was certainly not this noble song from the
German tradition, the lyrics for which go back to 1780. See below. I
knew that relying on Dr. Finkelstein was the course to take and this
Wiki article proves it. You turn your Zionist aggression on and off
like a faucet. You can't be trusted. You should be ashamed of
yourself, and not try to shame other people because you don't like
their political views. You politics is fair game and the fact that you
are Jewish doesn't alter that fact one bit.

Now, if you wish to discuss the four political images in the film I'll
be happy to accomodate you.


Die Gedanken sind frei
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Die Gedanken sind frei. Hoffmann von Fallersleben, Ernst Heinrich
Leopold Richter, Schlesische Volkslieder mit Melodien, 1842

"Die Gedanken sind frei" is a German song about the freedom of
thought. The text and the melody can be found in Lieder der Brienzer
Mädchen, printed in Bern, Switzerland between 1810 and 1820. The
original lyricist and the composer are unknown, though the most
popular version Aus Neukirch bei Schönau (Nowy Kościół) was rendered
by Hoffmann von Fallersleben in his 1842 collection Schlesische
Volkslieder mit Melodien.
Contents [hide]
1 Text
2 The lyrics
3 Adaptations
4 Notes
5 External links
[edit]Text

The idea represented in the title — that thoughts are free — was
expressed as early as in Antiquity[1] and became prominent again in
the Middle Ages, when Walther von der Vogelweide (c.1170-1230) wrote:
joch sint iedoch gedanke frî ("yet still thoughts are free").[2] In
the 12th century, Austrian minnesinger Dietmar von Aist (presumably)
had composed the song Gedanke die sint ledic vrî ("only thoughts are
free"). About 1229, Freidank wrote: diu bant mac nieman vinden, diu
mîne gedanke binden. ("this band may no one twine, that will my
thoughts confine").[3]
The text as it first occurred on leaflets about 1780 originally had
four strophes, to which a fifth was later added. Today, their order
may vary. An early version in the shape of a dialogue between a
captive and his beloved can be found under the title Lied des
Verfolgten im Thurm. Nach Schweizerliedern ("Song of the persecuted in
the tower. After Swiss songs") in Achim von Arnim and Clemens
Brentano's circa 1805 folk poetry collection Des Knaben Wunderhorn,
Vol. III. This version was given a new musical setting by Gustav
Mahler in his 1898 Lieder aus "Des Knaben Wunderhorn" for voice and
orchestra.
[edit]The lyrics

Die Gedanken sind frei, wer kann sie erraten,
sie fliegen vorbei wie nächtliche Schatten.
Kein Mensch kann sie wissen, kein Jäger erschießen
mit Pulver und Blei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Ich denke was ich will und was mich beglücket,
doch alles in der Still', und wie es sich schicket.
Mein Wunsch und Begehren kann niemand mir wehren,
es bleibet dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Und sperrt man mich ein im finsteren Kerker,
das alles sind rein vergebliche Werke.
Denn meine Gedanken zerreißen die Schranken
und Mauern entzwei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Drum will ich auf immer den Sorgen absagen
und will mich auch nimmer mit Grillen mehr plagen.
Man kann ja im Herzen stets lachen und scherzen
und denken dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Ich liebe den Wein, mein Mädchen vor allen,
sie tut mir allein am besten gefallen.
Ich sitz nicht alleine bei einem Glas Weine,
mein Mädchen dabei: Die Gedanken sind frei!

Thoughts are free, who can guess them?
They flee by like nocturnal shadows.
No man can know them, no hunter can shoot them
with powder and lead: Thoughts are free!

I think what I want, and what delights me,
still always reticent, and as it is suitable.
My wish and desire, no one can deny me
and so it will always be: Thoughts are free!

And if I am thrown into the darkest dungeon,
all this would be futile work,
because my thoughts tear all gates
and walls apart: Thoughts are free!

So I will renounce my sorrows forever,
and never again will torture myself with whimsies.
In one's heart, one can always laugh and joke
and think at the same time: Thoughts are free!

I love wine, and my girl even more,
Only her I like best of all.
I'm not alone with my glass of wine,
my girl is with me: Thoughts are free!

The rhyme scheme of the lyrics is a - b/ a - b/ c - c/ d - d.
[edit]Adaptations

Since the days of the Carlsbad Decrees and the Age of Metternich Die
Gedanken sind frei was a popular protest song against political
repression and censorship, especially among the banned
Burschenschaften student fraternities. In the aftermath of the 1848
German Revolution the song was proscribed.

The song was important to certain anti-Nazi resistance movements in
Germany.[4] In 1942, Sophie Scholl, a member of the White Rose
resistance group, played the song on her flute outside the walls of
Ulm prison, where her father Robert had been detained for calling the
Nazi dictator Adolf Hitler a "scourge of God". Earlier, in 1935, the
guards at the Lichtenburg concentration camp had ordered prisoners to
stage a performance in celebration of Hitler's 46th birthday; the
imprisoned Jewish lawyer Hans Litten recited Die Gedanken sind frei in
response.[5]

Pete Seeger recorded the song in 1966 on his Dangerous Songs!? album.
Norwegian composer Alf Cranner translated and recorded it as Din tanke
er fri in 1985. Parts of the poem were also taken as the basis of a
song by the Brazilian Girls on their self-titled 2005 album Brazilian
Girls (album).

Die Gedanken sind frei was used as the theme and was sung by the
Allied prisoners of war in the 1971 TV movie The Birdmen, which was a
fictionalized dramatization of an attempt to escape from the German
Oflag IV-C camp at Colditz Castle in World War II. It was also
featured in the 1998 German movie 23 about the hacker Karl Koch.
In Canadian author Jean Little's 1972 book From Anna the song is used
to represent the freedom the titular character's father craves for his
children, and as such figures predominantly into the plot at the
beginning of the novel.
Die Gedanken Sind Frei is a track by the German band Megaherz on their
Wer Bist Du? album.
[edit]Notes

^ Cicero: Liberae sunt (...) nostrae cogitationes, ("Free are our
thoughts") Pro Milone, XXIX. 79., 52 BC
^ Der keiser als spileman.
^ Bescheidenheit, 38. Von Erkantnisse.
^ Melon, Ruth Bernadette. Journey to the White Rose in Germany. Dog
Ear Publishing, 2007. ISBN 1-59858-249-6. p. 122.
^ Jon Kelly (19 August 2011). "Hans Litten: The man who annoyed Adolf
Hitler". BBC News. Retrieved 19 August 2011.

[mirjam]

On Saturday, August 25, 2012 12:26:45 PM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
Poor Mr HHW

> Well, Ms. Mirjam, in the first place there is no chance that I am
>
> going to apologize for anything which might be found on Norman
>
> Finkelstein's blog.

No need to apologize to me about your reading habits!!!
But it tells a lot about you.

>If he is sending signals to Israelis or American
>
> Jews by posting that film there, there's nothing I can help you with.

Norman Finkelstein does not send signals, he is plainly and unashamedly spouting Hate and inciting against his own Biological people, and against his own country like you he hates America,

>
> I admire the man. He has immense courage, judgment and an impeccable
>
> moral sense.

Of course you do admire him, But he has no moral using a song that was sung by Anti Nazis to promote Nazi ideas is not moral.

> The lyrics of the song are compelling. They are a hymn to
> freedom in the face of oppression. IF they are a Jewish hymn to

This Song has no Jewish roots, it is German.

> freedom from the Nazi era then all the better because they also

> reflect his life and career.

Really the poor man has a classic Stockholm syndrome, and some other problems that 2nd Generation Holocaust survives have, denial that it happened, and total refusal to face what happened to their parents.

> I think that's the irony here. I doubt

> you know much of his life and career.

Well, you would be surprised that i took the time to read about his life and `career` Unllike you i have a strange habit of making up my own mind about people and ideas.

> Of course he is a Jew,

Why the `of course`

> the son of Holocaust survivors.

And i am a Jew both a survivor and daughter of survivors.

> He fights the good fight in a cause which can

> only benefit everyone involved.

The only fight he fights is making money from hate speech from denying what and how the Holocaust Harmed his parents and him.

> He gets more than the benefit of the

>doubt from me. As you know I'm convinced he's a great American.

No wonder he gets respect from you ,,,, as a classical Jew hater, you must have your Pet Jew. And you chose a poor confused man, who has never treated his childhood traumas of growing up in the house of survivors.

>
> The lyrics are not "inciting". They are gentle and reflect the human
>
> condition in a general sense.

The lyeuics are used to incite when shown with the photos they have been added to.

Whoever wrote them rose above the
>
> particular even if he might have written them in a Nazi camp.

They were written in 18th century

> context understood by Jews which affects you so,

I wrote exactly that i thought Finkelstein`s use of it as distorting history !!! because i happen to know it`s history ....

> it from us? I'm a curious man. I tend to want to know most everything
>
> "that's fit to print."

hahahahah you only like anything that you can use against others.

>
>
>
> Perhaps it's the three or four non-Norman images which have you in
>
> such a rage.

Me in rage, mr HHW ,,,, i grew up amongst the likes of you, and alas met and knew some poor souls like finkelstein, rage does not help those people, only pity for their illness.

One of them shows a demonstrator with a cardboard sign
>
> which has the word fascist on it.

Since you constantly post and spread fascist like materials here.... it probably pleased you.

Another is an image of your

> apartheid wall with "Ghetto" painted on it and Norman standing there
>
> with the paint brush.

Really where exactly was this picture taken????

> Does it drive you into a rage that someone might
> see parallels between the history of Zionism in power and of the
> Nazis? After all there are in fact some parallels.

Stupid words do not drive me into anything, just sadness for the stupid person, in ability to distinguish between life and Fantasia stories.

> And then there is the issue which is more mine than Norman's, the fact
> that we American's are entangled with you and are having a terrible
> time regaining our autonomy in our own legislature and in the White
> House.

There you go again with your Anti American hate post America has no Autonomy ??? you are beyond healing mister ....Your Millions of Voters Vote for your Government !!! and they rule in your American way to benefit your Americans !!!

>We have a hell of a lot at stake in this mess and you are not
> cooperating. We have an absolute right to tell you what we think about
> our "forty years together", your conduct in the relationship and in

There we go again ,
What have you in the stake exactly ?

>. We have paid a greater price as a result of our
>
> "friendship" than Israel has shouldered on behalf of herself in her
>
> entire history.

Name one Price ??????

> You will not silence us. That humiliating,
>
> pusillanimous era in our history is over.

?????????????????

Mr you have a strange Imagination do you use something ?
mirjam

[mirjam]

On Sunday, August 26, 2012 3:08:20 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
> So, Mirjam, tell us what your obviously calculated and dishonest
>
> hysteria was about.

Hahahahah HHW
in your former post [several minutes ago !!!! ]you had no clue what this song was
You Assumed it was a Jewish song and or that it was written in a Nazi camp ...
While i specific wrote that i did not like Finkelstein`s disrespect to it`s historical meaning !!!

> It was certainly not this noble song from the
>
> German tradition,

Good you went and checked !!!!! Now after you already showed everyone that you have no clue about this song
i happened to grow up amongst people who remembered some members of the `White Rose ` and they sung it to me once , i knew what it was from the subject line ,, you had no clue several moments ago.

mirjam

[HHW]

On Aug 25, 11:18 pm, mirjam <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote:
> On Saturday, August 25, 2012 12:26:45 PM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
>
> Poor Mr HHW
>
> > Well, Ms. Mirjam, in the first place there is no chance that I am
>
> > going to apologize for anything which might be found on Norman
>
> > Finkelstein's blog.
>
> No need to apologize to me about your reading habits!!!
> But it tells a lot about you.

You're saying nothing. Explain your innuendo and I'll reply directly.

>
>  >If he is sending signals to Israelis or American
>
> > Jews by posting that film there, there's nothing I can help you with.
>
> Norman Finkelstein does not send signals, he is plainly and unashamedly spouting Hate and inciting against his own Biological people,

You are a religion, not a biological people. You share a religious
culture, a zeitgeist, and too many of you a political ideology.

Of course he is direct and candid. How else are typical Zionist
activists to be dealt with? It's the truth they detest. And the last
thing he "spouts" is hate. For example Israel DOES have a "lunatic
regime". That's a fair description of your current government. You
can't defeat him because he can neither be shamed nor intimidated by
Zionists. Dr. Finkelstein is deeply critical of Israeli policy and
historical behavior. He pursues justice and peace in Palestine. None
of this is remotely antisemitic. Objectively he is pro-Israel. Had you
your head on straight you'd be able to understand the dangers you face
precisely because your colleagues here have conquered Capitol Hill in
Washington.

and against his own country like you he hates America,

Ultimate nonsense. Malicious too. Like most of what emanates from you
doctrinaire apologists for Israeli criminality. He wants American
policy toward Israel to change. That's in the interest of both the
United States and Israel. He is, at least in the present era, an anti-
Zionist. That's a *political* position, a perfectly legitimate
political position, and it is neither left nor right. It's one of the
few things which is in the interests of both countries and shouldn't
partake of partisanship.

> > I admire the man. He has immense courage, judgment and an impeccable
>
> > moral sense.
>
> Of course you do admire him, But he has no moral using a song that was sung by Anti Nazis to promote Nazi ideas is not moral.

"...sung by Anti Nazis to promote Nazi ideas...?! I'm sorry, but that
re-writing of history doesn't pass the smell test. That song was sung
by the Anti-Nazi White Rose group in *opposition* to the Nazis. Their
leadership gave their lives in that struggle, guillotined for the
opposite of what you falsely say. I don't think what you wrote here
was a mistake.

What you seem further to suggest is that there can be no parallel
whatever drawn between specific crimes of the Nazis or the Marxist/
Leninists and specific crimes of Israeli Zionists? We can admire the
White Rose society for their honor and courage in opposing the Nazis,
but we're not permitted to honor anti-Zionists who criticize similar
behavior on the part of the Israelis. In sum that position is
hypocritical.

> > The lyrics of the song are compelling. They are a hymn to
> > freedom in the face of oppression. IF they are a Jewish hymn to

> > freedom from the Nazi era then all the better because they also
> > reflect his life and career.

> This Song has no Jewish roots, it is German.

That's right.

>
> Really the poor man has a classic Stockholm syndrome

Bullshit. You simply can not do without baseless name-calling. It's
characteristic of your ideology

, and some other problems that 2nd Generation Holocaust survives have,
denial that it happened, and total refusal to face what happened to
their parents.

Finkelstein denies nothing. What he refuses to do is to draw immoral
conclusions from the Holocaust and his parents' experience. He rejects
the cynical USES of the Holocaust in present day politics which in
fact are abuses of the memory of Jewish suffering in WW II.

> > I think that's the irony here. I doubt
> > you know much of his life and career.
>
> Well, you would be surprised that i took the time to read about his life and `career` Unllike you i have a strange habit of making up my own mind about people and ideas.
>
> > Of course he is a Jew,
>
> Why the `of course`

> the son  of Holocaust survivors.
>
> And i am a Jew both a survivor and daughter of survivors.

I can't imagine having any interest in denying that.

Yes, but his political views in light of the Holocaust and his
parents' suffering are defensible. They follow logically. Yours do
not. Were you not averse to discussing them we might make some
progress here.

> > He fights the good fight in a cause which can
> > only benefit everyone involved.

> The only fight he fights is making money from hate speech from denying what and how the Holocaust Harmed his parents and him.

Of course NF's parents were harmed by the Holocaust. That's part of
the definition for survivors. So were the survivors of the rest of the
beastliness in Europe associated with the "revolutionary" era from
1917 to 1945. In fact, globally, the Marxist/Leninists alone caused
the deaths of roughly 100,000,000 defenseless subject peoples in the
20th Century. You make no effort at all to see your experience as a
Jew in perspective.

> > He gets more than the benefit of the
> >doubt from me. As you know I'm convinced he's a great American.

> No wonder he gets respect from you ,,,, as a classical Jew hater, you must have your Pet Jew.

If so he's Woody Allen.

And you chose a poor confused man, who has never treated his childhood
traumas of growing up in the house of survivors.

May I presume you are a Freudian?

But are not you a poor confused woman incapable of applying universal
moral principles to your present situation? The victims of the
Holocaust were Europeans as their ancestors had been for many
centuries. Their persecutors were European Germans and their
subordinate allies, also Europeans. The Palestinians have lived in
Palestine for centuries and may well have even been the descendents of
Jews from the time of Christ. They lost their Jewishness in something
like the Seventh Century. They had nothing to do with the Holocaust.
Palestine is in Asia, not Europe. Bavaria I could see at a shallow
level but to take the homeland of an innocent people on another
continent by brute force can not be justified morally by the
persecution of Jews in Europe.

Right now you have a chance to see your title to 78% of Palestine
legitimated in exchange for a settlement with the Palestinians. But
your ideological radicalism and thirst for vengeance blind you to your
own interests.

>
>
>
> > The lyrics are not "inciting". They are gentle and reflect the human
>
> > condition in a general sense.
>
> The lyeuics are used to incite when shown with the photos they have been added to.

More nonsense. It's a perfectly legitimate commentary on NF's life and
struggle. It's a fine and honest film. The West Bank and Gaza are
indeed analogous to the racial ghettos in Europe. That's a function of
what you have "had" to do to fulfill your Zionist destiny. The problem
is that it's a criminal course you've taken.

>  Whoever wrote them rose above the particular even if he might have written them in a Nazi camp. They were written in 18th century

>  > context understood by Jews which affects you so,

> I wrote exactly that i thought Finkelstein`s use of it as distorting history !!! because i happen to know it`s history ....

What you thought was not comprehensible as argument. It's mere
assertion.

>  > it from us? I'm a curious man. I tend to want to know most everything "that's fit to print."
>
> hahahahah you only like anything that you can use against others.

I support the political interests of my homeland, my native country.
They are not the same as Israel's by any means.

> > Perhaps it's the three or four non-Norman images which have you in
>
> > such a rage.

> Me in rage, mr HHW ,,,, i grew up amongst the likes of you, and alas met and knew some poor souls like finkelstein, rage does not help those people, only pity for their illness.

Your post was filled with rage. There is no basis for it.

More bullshit.

> One of them shows a demonstrator with a cardboard sign which has the word fascist on it.

> Since you constantly post and spread fascist like materials here.... it probably pleased you.

Opposition to Zionism is immediately characterized as fascist and anti-
Semitic by Zionists.

>  Another is an image of your
>
> > apartheid wall with "Ghetto" painted on it and Norman standing there
>
> > with the paint brush.
>
> Really where exactly was this picture taken????

The "image" is not a photograph.

> > Does it drive you into a rage that someone might
> > see parallels between the history of Zionism in power and of the
> > Nazis? After all there are in fact some parallels.

> Stupid words do not drive me into anything, just sadness for the stupid person, in ability to distinguish between life and Fantasia stories.

Just like the Holocaust, the Naqba HAPPENED. I don't deny either. You
on the other hand......

> > And then there is the issue which is more mine than Norman's, the fact
> > that we American's are entangled with you and are having a terrible
> > time regaining our autonomy in our own legislature and in the White
> > House.

> There you go again with your Anti American hate post America has no Autonomy ???

It is not anti-American to point out that a tiny minority has
thoroughly intimidated our Congress by the most brutal political
tactics seen in our history.

 you are beyond healing mister ....Your Millions of Voters Vote for
your Government !!! and they rule in your American way to benefit your
Americans !!!

You might try explaining that.

> >We have a hell of a lot at stake in this mess and you are not
> > cooperating. We have an absolute right to tell you what we think about
> > our "forty years together", your conduct in the relationship and in
>
> There we go again ,
> What have you in the stake exactly ?

The immense damage to our interests in the Muslim World which our
prostrate relationship with Israel has caused. 9/11 which would not
have taken place but for that unhealthy relationship. Afghanistan
which would not have taken place were it not for our relationship with
Israel. Iraq which we assaulted twice at least partially to strengthen
Israel's strategic situation in the region and in the latter case
based upon fraudulent Israeli "intelligence" smuggled past our
intelligance agencies to the Defense Department and thus to the White
House. The neoconservative influence on policy, most specifically the
fantasy of nation-building to "democratize" Israel's neighborhood.
AIPAC's literal authorship of American legislation relating to Israel.
The Lobby's assault on our democratic system of determining Middle
Eastern policy and our Israel policy. The immense expense associated
with Israel and the wars she wanted us to fight for her is a major
factor in our present financial collapse. The deaths and maimings of
our young men and women in our wars in Israel's region, though in the
interests of Israel, almost none of which has been shared by either
Israelis or American Jews. I could go on at length and will.

>
> >. We have paid a greater price as a result of our
>
> > "friendship" than Israel has shouldered on behalf of herself in her
>
> > entire history.
>
> Name one Price ??????

Look above.

>
> > You will not silence us. That humiliating,
>
> > pusillanimous era in our history is over.
>
> ?????????????????

Study your English.

> Mr you have a strange Imagination do you use something ?
> mirjam

Common sense and history are what I use.

Readers: "The Israel Lobby and American Foreign Policy", by John
Mearsheimer and Stephen Walt: "The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine", by
Ilan Pappe.

[HHW]

On Aug 25, 11:38 pm, mirjam <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote:
> On Sunday, August 26, 2012 3:08:20 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
> > So, Mirjam, tell us what your obviously calculated and dishonest
>
> > hysteria was about.
>
> Hahahahah HHW

> in your former post [several minutes ago !!!! ]you had no clue what this song  was
> You Assumed it was a Jewish song and or that it was written in a Nazi camp ...
> While i specific wrote that i did not like Finkelstein`s disrespect to it`s historical meaning !!!

Does your Zionism make you clairvoyant? In any event, no single use of
that song determines its historical meaning.

>
> > It was certainly not this noble song from the
>
> > German tradition,
>
> Good you went and checked !!!!! Now after you already showed everyone that you have no clue about this song
> i happened to grow up amongst people who remembered some members of the `White Rose ` and they sung it to me once , i knew what it was from the subject line ,, you had no clue several moments ago.

Your problem, Mirjam, is that you think you Zionists should own that
song when in fact you had to lie about it to make your point. I
explain that in the previous post.

[mirjam]

On Tuesday, September 4, 2012 4:37:18 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:

Another funny and mixed up post HHW

You Assumed that it was a Jewish song and i corrected you and pointed out to you what this song was and meant ,,,,,

now you end this letter and claim that i think we should `own` the song ?

> Your problem, Mirjam, is that you think you Zionists should own that
>
> song when in fact you had to lie about it to make your point. I
>

I never think that anybody can own a song, besides the writer/composer.
And it was YOU not Me that assumed it was a Jewish song I TOLD you it was a German Song , and I told you who sung it and when .......
mirjam

[NefeshBarYochai]

> > > mirjam- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

German is a language of heathens and idolators. Many Germans smell
like the asshole of pig when it has been eating and shitting small
toad stools.

[drahcir]

On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 13:20:06 -0700 (PDT), HHW
<coaste...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind-frei/

Unbelievable. That was the funniest thing you have ever posted, H.
What kind of sicko would put that on his own website? I have no words
but "thanks".

[drahcir]

On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 13:20:06 -0700 (PDT), HHW
<coaste...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind-frei/

You know, H, I just realized - you and Fink have a lot in common - you
both are completely shameless in your public masturbation.

[walt tonne]

No, you are talking about the German Jews and Yiddish.
Be aware that many American Jews of Germanic origins
would not let their dogs piss on those from the east.

[mirjam]

On Tuesday, September 4, 2012 5:14:15 PM UTC+3, drahcir wrote:
Did you notice how he first thought it was a Jewish song, than when i told him what it really was he accused me that We as Jews want it to belong to us,
As to his elongated letter [ no wonder it took him 8 days to come out with it ,, there are so much nonsenses
that i am not wasting my time to answer it ,,,
mirjam

[Tell it like it is.]

That's what mirjam thinks of anyone dumb enough to respond to ANYTHING
SHE HAS TO SAY.
react and respond "not one FREE THOUGHT at all."

"HHW..." has never had " one FREE THOUGHT at all.
-mirjam"
"YOu're right!
-Drahcir"

[HHW]

On Sep 3, 10:55 pm, mirjam <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote:
> On Tuesday, September 4, 2012 4:37:18 AM UTC+3, HHW wrote:
>
> Another funny and mixed up post HHW
>
> You Assumed that it was a Jewish song and i corrected you and pointed out to you what this song was and meant ,,,,,
>
> now you end this letter and claim that i think we should `own` the song ?
>
> > Your problem, Mirjam, is that you think you Zionists should own that
>
> > song when in fact you had to lie about it to make your point. I
>
> I never think that anybody can own a song, besides the writer/composer.
> And it was YOU not Me that assumed it was a Jewish song I TOLD you it was a German Song , and I told you who sung it and when .......
> mirjam
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> > > in your former post [several minutes ago !!!! ]you had no clue what this song  was
>
> > > You Assumed it was a Jewish song and or that it was written in a Nazi camp ...
>
> > > While i specific wrote that i did not like Finkelstein`s disrespect to it`s historical meaning !!!
>
> > Does your Zionism make you clairvoyant? In any event, no single use of
>
> > that song determines its historical meaning.
>
> > > > It was certainly not this noble song from the
>
> > > > German tradition,
>
> > > Good you went and checked !!!!!

Now after you already showed everyone that you have no clue about this
song

Of course I did. I listened to it. I evaluated the lyrics. That's why
I posted it. It was in fact perfect and I recommend that all of our
readers go back to it. Listen to the lyrics. Better yet read them in
the Wiki article above. Your hysterics are fraudulent. You simply can
not justify your pseudo anger about Dr. Finkelstein having posted it
on his blog.

> > > i happened to grow up amongst people who remembered some members of the `White Rose ` and they sung it to me once , i knew what it was from the subject line ,, you had no clue several moments ago.

That's false but what difference would it have made were it true.
Attacking me when such a matter is before us is devious. The question
raised is the meaning of the song in the context of this film.

[HHW]

On Sep 4, 9:14 am, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 13:20:06 -0700 (PDT), HHW
>

> <coaster132...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind...

>
> Unbelievable. That was the funniest thing you have ever posted, H.
> What kind of sicko would put that on his own website? I have no words
> but "thanks".

You are welcome, Miss Ratner. Only the thoughtful matter.

[HHW]

On Sep 4, 9:33 am, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
> On Wed, 22 Aug 2012 13:20:06 -0700 (PDT), HHW
>

> <coaster132...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >http://www.normanfinkelstein.com/norman-finkelstein-die-gedanken-sind...

>
> You know, H, I just realized - you and Fink have a lot in common - you
> both are completely shameless in your public masturbation.

Only the thoughtful, Miss Ratner.

[HHW]

Nefesh, we have no idea what you refer to.

[drahcir]

On Fri, 7 Sep 2012 08:23:20 -0700 (PDT), HHW <coaste...@yahoo.com>
wrote:

So, is this your new snappy retort?

[HHW]

On Sep 7, 12:47 pm, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 7 Sep 2012 08:23:20 -0700 (PDT), HHW <coaster132...@yahoo.com>

Snappy? No, accurate. How ya doing, Richie? Living the good life are
you?

[drahcir]

You throw that out like a fisherman chums, hoping some naive idiot
might think you actually mean something by it.

[HHW]

But I do. You are miserable.

[drahcir]

Why are you not ashamed to stroke your withered member so
energetically in public?

[HHW]

Another demonstration of just how miserable a specimen you are, Missey.

[drahcir]

Um no, H it has nothing to do with me. When you indulge your
completely subjective fantasies and broadcast them publicly, that is
masturbation, plain and simple.

[HHW]

Bugger off, Ratner. Come back when you're ready to protect the
interests of Israel's neofascist colonial aggressors.

[NefeshBarYochai]

> interests of Israel's neofascist colonial aggressors.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

HHW You still smell like rodent shit.

[drahcir]

Oops, just noticed this gem. What can HHW possibly mean by the above
except that he feels that, at present, I am not "ready to protect the
interests of Israel's neofascist colonial aggressors", whoever they
may be. In his, um, "mind", doesn't that make me one of the good guys,
at least for now? Maybe I'm not getting something. H, help me out
here, will ya?

[NEMO]

'' HHW You still smell like rodent shit.''

HHW gives a bad name to rodent shit!

[HHW]

I'm afraid not Ratner. You NEVER attempt to defend Israel's
colonialism and bigotry. You simply attack her critics personally by
misrepresentation of their motives and honesty. Intellectually it's
shameful.

Maybe I'm not getting something. H, help me out
> here, will ya?

You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.

[NEMO]

HHW, all you arsehole/asswipe Jew - baiters could be next!

On the Jewish Brigade killing Nazis: ''Then we strangled them. With
our bare hands.We just killed them like you kill a bug.''! (


A good end for Nazi scum!


To facilitate execution of Nazis, Jewish Brigade members would
traverse post-war Europe in bands of three and four. Zorea explained:


'' We only eliminated those directly involved in the slaughter of
Jews. At first we put a bullet through their heads. Then we strangled
them. With our bare hands. We never said anything before we killed
them. Not why or who we were. We just killed them like you kill a
bug.

[mirjam]

On Saturday, November 17, 2012 1:33:44 AM UTC+2, HHW wrote:
HHW in another post you claimed that calling you an Anti Semite is smearing you ????
But Lo and Behold YOU JUST WROTE HERE

>
>
>
> You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
>
> in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.

You admit you are one !!!!
mirjam

[drahcir]

Hmm, well, let me then ask you, if that is true, why have you been
shown unable to refute my proofs of your lying on even one occasion?
No, H, there is no one in this group who will see the above as
anything but what it is - your usual attempt to paint your critics as
dishonest and unobjective when in fact nothing could be further from
the truth. You're unable to defend because your are woefully ignorant
of the topics you purport to discuss (how could it be otherwise -
you've never read a book on the subject of Israel, and the websites
you frequent have no creditility, with the possible exception of
wikipedia), and you are forced to lie in order to preserve a point of
view motivated by your bias.

>
> Maybe I'm not getting something. H, help me out
>> here, will ya?
>
>You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
>in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.

Your antisemitism is your motivation, your raison d'etre. There is no
one here who can possibly believe otherwise.

[Count 1]

>> You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
>> in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.
>
> Your antisemitism is your motivation, your raison d'etre. There is no
> one here who can possibly believe otherwise.

Absolutely true. His constant use of negative Jewish stereotypes, heavy
reliance on white supremacist websites, and absolute inability (or
interest) to achieve a well informed view of an incredibly complex topic
like Israel - Palestinian history can only be attributed to an (obvious)
anti-Jewish bias.

His claims of being a critic of Israeli policy are laughable, as he's
consistently shown he is completely ignorant of said policy. It is time
the rational actors on these boards (yourself, myself, mirjam, and all
the rest who regularly pummel him until he inevitably runs from his
threads) completely ignore him like we do an Aviroce, or other deeply
hate filled anti-semites.

Eventually he'll go away, despondent over his inability to convince
anyone around here that he was anything more than just another
anti-semitic nutjob.

[HHW]

Where do I do that, mirjam? Can't one dislike a single Jew without
being an anti-Semite?

[HHW]

It's not an "if", it is true.

why have you been
> shown unable to refute my proofs of your lying on even one occasion?

You lie about that, Ratner. And as a matter of logical procedure
you're not permitted to lead with a conclusion. You must earn the
right to your conclusion by setting-forth your premises which
allegedly lead to it.

> No, H, there is no one in this group who will see the above as
> anything but what it is - your usual attempt to paint your critics as
> dishonest and unobjective

You are particularly dishonest and unobjective. An example, tiny as it
may be, is set forth in my previous sentence above.

when in fact nothing could be further from
> the truth.

Truthfulness is also a conclusion which you are almost never justified
in claiming. You lie about it.

You're unable to defend

Defend what? Against your assertions? What a joke. You gave up
attempting to make legitimate historical arguments years ago.

because your are woefully ignorant
> of the topics you purport to discuss

A conscious lie unworthy of response.

(how could it be otherwise -
> you've never read a book on the subject of Israel,

Another conscious lie unworthy of a response. To the readers I suggest
an example: "The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine" by Dr. Ilan Pappe.
There is no single volume better for one new to this matter who wishes
to understand to origins of Zionist-Israeli abuse of the Palestinian
people. Thanks for the opportunity, Ratner.

and the websites
> you frequent have no creditility, with the possible exception of
> wikipedia),

I suggest that the readers consult Dr. Juan Cole, Dr. Noam Chomsky,
Dr. Norman Finkelstein and the renowned journalist Phil Weiss
(Mondoweiss) as the tip of the iceberg of authors I consult on a daily
basis. Thanks for this opportunity too, Ratner.

and you are forced to lie in order to preserve a point of
> view motivated by your bias.

My opposition is to Israeli colonialism, ethnic cleansing, racism and
the Zionist abuse of the American political system. If this is to be
deemed "bias", so be it.

> > Maybe I'm not getting something. H, help me out
> >> here, will ya?
>
> >You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
> >in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.
>
> Your antisemitism is your motivation, your raison d'etre.

For you the false accusation of anti-Semitism is the equivalent of
oxygen. You would die without it. Anyone who follows you knows this.
You don't do anything else.

There is no
> one here who can possibly believe otherwise.

A couple of years ago there were 16,000 reads of my posts in a single
week. What do you know about the opinions of these people?

[HHW]

On Nov 17, 9:48 am, Count 1 <omnipitus2...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> >> You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
> >> in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.
>
> > Your antisemitism is your motivation, your raison d'etre. There is no
> > one here who can possibly believe otherwise.
>
> Absolutely true. His constant use of negative Jewish stereotypes,

Point them out.

heavy
> reliance on white supremacist websites,

Attempt to prove that lie.

and absolute inability (or
> interest) to achieve a well informed view of an incredibly complex topic
> like Israel - Palestinian history can only be attributed to an (obvious)
> anti-Jewish bias.

Proof?

>
> His claims of being a critic of Israeli policy are laughable, as he's
> consistently shown he is completely ignorant of said policy.

Israel's policy is to achieve a "Greater Israel" irrespective of
international law, its impact on the Palestinian people, the Middle
East the United States and, strangely enough, upon herself.

It is time
> the rational actors on these boards (yourself, myself, mirjam, and all
> the rest who regularly pummel him until he inevitably runs from his
> threads) completely ignore him like we do an Aviroce, or other deeply
> hate filled anti-semites.
>
> Eventually he'll go away, despondent over his inability to convince
> anyone around here that he was anything more than just another
> anti-semitic nutjob.

Pathetic. You can't ignore me. It's impossible precisely because WHAT
I SAY is credible and you can not refute IT. WHAT I SAY is the
central reason you Zionist obfuscationists are here yourselves. IT is
what you would like to defend against but simply don't dare attempt
it. Your only option is slander of the messenger and that has become
a transparent joke from overuse, from crying wolf all day long every
day.

Absent a political earthquake the next couple of years are going to be
inexorably worse for Israel and thus for her defenders and activists
here in the U.S. Her right wing fanatics have pushed her to the very
cusp of disaster, facing existential dilemmas to which there are no
rational solutions consistent with the greater Israel outcome. None.
Absent a political sea change before long there will be no solutions
available even with a change of leadership. What we are witnessing is
what's been described as "The Tragedy of Zionism" before which Jewry's
great men have been struck dumb.

[drahcir]

LOL! This is simply amazing. Anyone can do a google groups search with
me as author containing the words [liar proof HHW] (or any of your
other various aliases), and your above assertion will be disproven.

And as a matter of logical procedure
>you're not permitted to lead with a conclusion.

Say what?? If you didn't have pasta in place of brain cells, you'd
realize that "leading with a conclusion" is what most call an
assertion. I have above given instructions where anyone who doubts my
assertion can be enlightened. YOU, on the other hand, asserted that I
"NEVER attempt to defend Israel's colonialism and bigotry". Of course,
that is true only becuase you've incorporated a falsehood into it,
namely that Israel is colonialist and bigoted. I have not "defended"
it because I do not defend lies.

You must earn the
>right to your conclusion by setting-forth your premises which
>allegedly lead to it.

Laughable. See above.

>
>
>> No, H, there is no one in this group who will see the above as
>> anything but what it is - your usual attempt to paint your critics as
>> dishonest and unobjective
>
>You are particularly dishonest and unobjective. An example, tiny as it
>may be, is set forth in my previous sentence above.

It seems you are suffering from delusions, poor boy. You have no proof
of any dishonesty on my part - I've challenged you on numerous
occasions to attempt to support similar assertions, and you invariably
flee.

>
>
> when in fact nothing could be further from
>> the truth.
>
>Truthfulness is also a conclusion which you are almost never justified
>in claiming. You lie about it.

Prove it or be shown to be lying.

>
>You're unable to defend
>
>Defend what? Against your assertions? What a joke. You gave up
>attempting to make legitimate historical arguments years ago.

Empty assertion until proven.

>
>because your are woefully ignorant
>> of the topics you purport to discuss
>
>A conscious lie unworthy of response.

> (how could it be otherwise -
>> you've never read a book on the subject of Israel,
>
>Another conscious lie unworthy of a response. To the readers I suggest
>an example: "The Ethnic Cleansing of Palestine" by Dr. Ilan Pappe.

I meant a history, not a fantasy. Besides, I'm quite certain you
haven't read it in its entirety.

>There is no single volume better for one new to this matter who wishes
>to understand to origins of Zionist-Israeli abuse of the Palestinian
>people.

LOL! As if you have a clue about "single volumes", you ignoramus. It's
great for an antisemitic pig like yourself to convince himself that
his approach has a smidgen of objectivity, but someone who truly
wanted to educate himself would read the reivews of this garbage and
find something better.

Thanks for the opportunity, Ratner.

???

>
> and the websites
>> you frequent have no creditility, with the possible exception of
>> wikipedia),
>
>I suggest that the readers consult Dr. Juan Cole, Dr. Noam Chomsky,
>Dr. Norman Finkelstein and the renowned journalist Phil Weiss

ROFLMAO!!! Did you add that last one just for laughs?

>(Mondoweiss) as the tip of the iceberg of authors I consult on a daily
>basis. Thanks for this opportunity too, Ratner.

Tip of the iceberg? So there must be, say, 50 more, since 90% of an
iceberg is submerged. Please enlighten the group about only 20% of the
other authors you consult on a daily basis, or be proven yet again a
liar whose ego demands that he aggrandize himself for a bunch of
strangers on usenet.

>
>and you are forced to lie in order to preserve a point of
>> view motivated by your bias.
>
>My opposition is to Israeli colonialism, ethnic cleansing, racism and
>the Zionist abuse of the American political system. If this is to be
>deemed "bias", so be it.

Finally some truth from you.

>> > Maybe I'm not getting something. H, help me out
>> >> here, will ya?
>>
>> >You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
>> >in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.
>>
>> Your antisemitism is your motivation, your raison d'etre.
>
>For you the false accusation of anti-Semitism is the equivalent of
>oxygen. You would die without it. Anyone who follows you knows this.
>You don't do anything else.

Nothing false about it. The record speaks for itself. You've tried
every ridiculous angle in the book to attack jews, from charity to the
military and everything in between. You've let slip plenty of direct
evidence of your antisemitism, so your denials can only be seen as
humor.

>
> There is no
>> one here who can possibly believe otherwise.
>
>A couple of years ago there were 16,000 reads of my posts in a single
>week. What do you know about the opinions of these people?

What a complete, utter idiot you are.

[drahcir]

On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 07:48:26 -0700, Count 1 <omnipi...@yahoo.ca>
wrote:

A rational suggestion, but the sad truth is that pummelling HHW is one
of the few relaxing forms of entertainment I allow myself to indulge
in.

[drahcir]

For any newcomers not understanding what a devious liar HHW is, you
can start with this:

https://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/msg/d306980b0ac5b63e?hl=en

It is one of many

[HHW]

Answer the question.

[HHW]

On Nov 17, 6:20 pm, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 07:48:26 -0700, Count 1 <omnipitus2...@yahoo.ca>

Pay attention, Ratner. Israel is treading a dangerous path:

Targeting Gaza Civilians: Israel’s Specialty

by Stephen Lendman on 11/17/2012

Hanan Tafesh, 10 months old, killed by Israeli assaults on Gaza
Bullies choose easy adversaries to pummel. Equal fights are shunned.
It’s the same in schoolyards or battlefields.
America and Israel operate this way. They avoid foes able to give as
much as they take. Rogue governments never say they’re sorry.

During Cast Lead in January 2009, Professor Jeremy Salt wrote “A
Message to the brave Israeli Airmen.” His comments apply to what’s now
ongoing.

What’s it like firing missiles at people you can’t see, he asked?

Does it help being unable to see who you’re killing?

Is your conscience eased by inflicting disproportionate force on
people unable to fight back and civilian infrastructure?

Are you comfortable about slaughtering civilian men, women, children,
and infants?

Does this weigh on your conscience, or are you at ease?

Do you sleep well or have nightmares about men, women and children you
killed at home, in beds, kitchens, living rooms, schools, mosques, at
work, or at play?

Do farmers in their fields, mothers with children, teachers in
classrooms, imams in mosques, children at play, the elderly, frail or
disabled threaten your security?

Do you ever question what you’ve done and why?

Have you no shame, no sense of decency, no idea of the difference
between right and wrong?

Do you know the law? If so, why do you violate it? Doing so makes you
complicit in crimes of war and against humanity? Do you know that?

Do you blindly follow orders or have a mind of your own?

Have you murdered civilians before?

Will you do it again if ordered?

Will you keep following orders blindly or do the right thing?

“Brave” Israeli airmen, soldiers, sailors, and other security force
personnel are cowards. They’ve acted lawlessly for decades.

Palestinian suffering is a way of life. Imagine living every day not
sure if you’ll live or die. Imagine young children growing up this
way. Do Israeli children know what Palestinian ones endure? Are they
told? Do they care? Do their parents?

Israel’s moving thousands of troops and heavy weapons to Gaza’s
border. Mossad-connected DEBKAfile said:

“Chief of Staff Lt. Gen. Benny Gantz and the high IDF command are
pushing for the ground operation, Stage B of the Pillar of Cloud
operation, to start without delay. The prime minister and defense
minister prefer to wait.”

Another potential holocaust looms. Civilians always suffer most.
Israel and America willfully target them. It part of the imperial
strategy of both countries. Human lives don’t matter, just conquest,
dominance, and exploitation.

Cast Lead took a terrible toll. Missiles, bombs, shells, and illegal
weapons were used against defenseless people. Mass slaughter and
destruction followed.

Horrific crimes of war and against humanity were committed.
Responsible officials remain unaccountable. Security Council no-fly
zone protection wasn’t ordered.

Over 1,400 Gazans perished. More than 80% were civilians. Over 300
were children. Around 5,300 were injured. Over 1,600 were children or
infants. Israel willfully targeted them.

Neighborhoods, schools, universities, mosques, hospitals, UN
facilities, fishing boats, civilian factories and workshops, municipal
buildings, charitable foundations, civilian infrastructure, and other
noncombatant sites were bombed and shelled.

Farmland was bulldozed. Power facilities and irrigations systems were
destroyed. International leaders were indifferent about human
slaughter and suffering. Only three low-level Israeli soldiers
received punishments too minor to matter.

The al-Samouni family lost 27 members. Salah Talala al-Samouni saw his
mother blown apart. Rocket and shell fire killed his two-year old
daughter, father, aunt, cousin, and entire family. Media scoundrels
said nothing. They support Israel’s worst crimes.

Under siege, Gazans haven’t recovered from Cast Lead. Now they face
the prospect of more war perhaps worse than 2008-09.

International leaders share culpability through silence, indifference,
and/or complicity. Washington is involved in all Israeli wars.
Weapons, munitions and funding are supplied. Political support is
given.

Obama told Netanyahu, go ahead and bomb and shell at will. Call it
“self-defense” and pretend no one knows it’s not. On November 15, the
Senate unanimously passed a non-binding supportive resolution. Not a
single profile in courage expressed opposition.

AIPAC thanked Obama and Senate members for supporting Israel. Gazan
civilians and resistance fighters are maliciously called terrorists.
They’re heroes, not criminals.

On November 14, Anti-Defamation League (ADL) national director Abe
Foxman expressed support for Israeli bombing and shelling, saying:

“Israel has shown tremendous restraint in the face of the unceasing
rocket and mortar fire launched from Gaza. This operation is directly
targeting the leadership responsible for these attacks, as well as the
warehouses and facilities housing their weapons.”

“No country in the world would stand by and tolerate such attacks on
more than a million civilians.”

“The international community has a clear obligation to condemn these
attacks and to support the actions taken by Israel against Hamas and
other terror organizations operating in Gaza as Israel carries out its
basic duty to defend its civilian population.”

For almost a century, ADL fronted for Jewish supremacy. It backs
occupation harshness. It’s mindless about Palestinian suffering. It
conducts smear campaigns against critics.

Its entire history is loathsome. Israeli crimes are called self-
defense. It plays the same blame the victim game as Israel,
Washington, AIPAC, and other Zionist organizations. Only Jewish rights
matter. Palestinians are criminalized for defending themselves.

Israel agreed to halt military operations during Egyptian Prime
Minister Hersham Kandil’s visit. He and Egyptian cabinet ministers
arrived in Gaza Thursday. He’ll return Friday. Israeli attacks
continued.

At Al Shifa Hospital, Kandil visited victims. He denounced Israeli
attacks, saying: “This tragedy cannot pass in silence, and the world
should take responsibility for stopping this aggression.” Cairo will
try to mediate a truce, he added.

Since Saturday, over 40 Palestinians were killed. Hundreds more were
injured. Many are in serious condition. Dozens of air strikes
continue. Death and injury numbers may rise exponentially. Current
figures underestimate the toll because some victims lie beneath
rubble.

The International Middle East Media Center (IMEMC) said Israel
conducted 30 sorties in less than 30 minutes on Friday. At 10PM
Thursday, the IDF said it struck 70 targets in the previous hour.

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Civilian sites and government buildings were bombed and shelled. Two
UN schools were struck. Heavy damage was reported. The Ahrar Center
for Detainees’ Studies said a church under construction was targeted.

IMEMC said, “Children, infants, women and elderly are among the
casualties, including children whose bodies were severely mutilated
and burnt due to Israeli shells. A pregnant woman and her unborn fetus
are among the killed.”

Gazan resistance fighters said they won’t honor truce conditions as
long as Israel keeps killing Palestinian men, women, children,
infants, and the elderly. On Thursday evening, a Beit Hanoun home was
bombed. Three children died. One was nine years old.

A 10-month old infant was killed when another home was struck. Through
early Friday morning, at least eight children, a pregnant woman, and
two elderly men died.

Thirty thousand IDF reservists were called up. Military leaves were
cancelled. Tanks, armored vehicles, and troops are mobilizing on
Gaza’s border. Invasion looks ominously likely.

On November 16, Mathaba said the Kuala Lumpur (Malaysia) War Crimes
Commission (KLWCC) “received numerous complaints on the atrocities and
possible war crimes committed against the Palestinian people.”

On November 20 and 21, two days of open hearings will be held.

Commission members include former Magistrate Musa Ismail, former
Universiti Teknologi MARA (UiTM) Dean Zulaiha Ismail, Center for
Global Research Director Michel Chossudovsky, and two former Iraq UN
humanitarian coordinators – Hans von Sponeck and Denis Halliday.

On November 16, Alternative News.org headlined “No safe haven:
Civilians under attack in the Gaza Strip.” An eyewitness visited Al
Shifa Hospital. Many injured Gazans are in serious condition.

Forty-year old Salem Waqef suffered brain injury. He’s in a coma on a
ventilator. It’s unclear if he’ll survive.

Ten-month old Haneen Tafesh was admitted unconscious. She suffered a
skull fracture and brain hemorrhage. She’s also in a coma on a
ventilator. Doctors said her condition deteriorated since admitted.
Hours later she died.

Ahmed Durghmush suffered brain trauma. Shrapnel penetrated his skull.
Brain matter protruded from his head wound. His condition also
deteriorated after surgery.

Throughout Thursday, emergency room staff were handling numerous
arrivals. Injuries range from easily treatable to severe to life
threatening.

Justice Ministry public information director, Khalid Hamad, was at
home when shelling targeted a neighbor’s house. Israel “targeted
civilians deliberately,” he said. “The Israeli forces don’t make
mistakes.”


Duaa Hejazi (Photo: Lydia De Leeuw)
Thirteen-year old Duaa Hejazi was brought in “bleeding a lot.” She
sustained upper body shrapnel wounds. Pieces are still embedded in her
chest. She sent a message to other Gazan children, saying:
“I say, we are children. There is nothing that is our fault to have to
face this. They are occupying us and I will say, as Abu Omar said. If
you’re a mountain, the wind won’t shake you. We’re not afraid. We’ll
stay strong.”

Al Shifa director general Dr. Mithad Abbas explained the dire
conditions under which hospital staff must cope, saying:

“When those cases arrive at our hospital, it is not under normal
circumstances. They come on top of the siege, the blockade, which has
resulted in a lack of vital medicines and required medical supplies.”

Al Shifa lacks essential medicines, some equipment and supplies. They
include antibiotics, IV fluid, anesthesia, gloves, catheters, external
fixators, Heparin, sutures, detergents and spare parts for medical
equipment.

Power outages exceed 12 hours daily. Small amounts of fuel maintain
operations at those times. Dr. Abbas said his supply will be exhausted
in days if current conditions continue.

He doesn’t know where the next missile or shell will strike. Perhaps
Al Shifa will be targeted. Israel considers all civilian sites fair
game.

On November 15, the Global BDS Movement issued the following statement
in part:

“Stop a New Israeli Massacre in Gaza: Boycott Israel Now!”

Despite biased Western media reports, Israel “initiated and escalated
this new assault on the eve of its upcoming parliamentary elections,
underlining the time-honored Israeli formula of Palestinian bodies for
ballots.”

“Israel will continue its belligerence, aggression and state terrorism
unless it is made to pay a heavy price for its crimes against the
Palestinian, Lebanese and other Arab peoples.”

“It is high time for BDS against Israel. This is the clearest path to
freedom, justice and equality for Palestinians and the entire region.”

At issue also is a pending November 29 vote on Palestinian UN non-
member observer status. Israel and Washington have gone all out to
subvert it. Member States have all the more reason to support
Palestine. In less than two weeks we’ll know.

Hezbollah leader Sayyed Hassan Nasrallah urged Arab leaders to use all
means to halt Israeli attacks on Gaza.

“No one is telling Arab countries today, ‘Please go open your borders
and begin the operation to liberate Palestine.’ What we want is to end
the attack on Gaza.”

This is everyone’s battle… We’re not asking you for a solution. We’re
asking for effort.”

“Some say the Arabs don’t have the courage to stop oil production.
Decrease your oil exports or raise the price a little and you will
shake the United States. You will shake Europe.”

“Brothers, if you can’t cut off oil, decrease your production or raise
the price. Put on some pressure. No one is calling for armies or tanks
or planes.”

Nasrallah called Israel’s Gaza attack “criminal aggression.” Multiple
crimes of war and against humanity are committed.

Much is at stake in Palestine, the region and beyond. Washington’s
aggressive wars continue. New ones are planned. Israel’s a key
partner. Both countries have imperial agendas. War features
prominently in achieving them.

Michel Chossudovsky calls attacking and invading Gaza “part of the
broader US-NATO-Israel military agenda.” Based on what’s happened
post-9/11, expect the worst ahead.

Article By Stephen Lendman | © Sabbah Report: http://sabbah.biz/mt/?p=15206

[HHW]

On Nov 17, 6:40 pm, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
> For any newcomers not understanding what a devious liar HHW is, you
> can start with this:

Clip

Today's gleaning from Noam Chomsky:

Noam Chomsky on Gaza, and the 2 Positives of Election 2012: The Worst
Didn’t Happen — and It’s Over


US scholar and activist Noam Chomsky at a press conference to support
the Gaza-bound flotilla in the port of Gaza City on 20 October 2012.
(Ashraf Amra / APA images)
Last Sunday, Democracy Now! spoke with Noam Chomsky, the world-
renowned political dissident, linguist, author, and MIT professor.
Chomsky, who recently returned from his first visit to the Gaza Strip,
discusses the rapidly deteriorating situation, and publicly calls on
Israel to put an end to the blockade on the Hamas-ruled coastal
enclave.

Chomsky said: “People still, you know — fight for their rights, and
don’t just succumb. It’s a lesson for people from the West. I mean,
you know, we talk about repression, but it’s undetectable by
comparison with what most people in the world face. If they can
struggle on under really harsh and brutal conditions, it tells us we
ought to be doing a lot more.”



Video link: http://youtu.be/4wnxYjSYK80

Transcript

AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and
Peace Report, as we wrap up today with Noam Chomsky. Nermeen?

NERMEEN SHAIKH: Israel and Palestinian leaders in Gaza have agreed to
a tacit truce following days of violence in the Gaza Strip. At least
seven Palestinians, including four civilians, have been killed in
Israeli attacks on Gaza since Saturday. Eight Israeli civilians have
also been wounded by Palestinian rockets. The temporary ceasefire was
brokered by the Egyptian government, but both sides say they’re
prepared to resume attacks if it fails.

AMY GOODMAN: Well, on Sunday, I spoke about the situation in Gaza with
the world-renowned political dissident, linguist, author, MIT
professor, Noam Chomsky. He was speaking in Princeton at the 32nd
anniversary of the Coalition of Peace Action. Noam Chomsky recently
returned from his first visit to Gaza, which he entered from the
Egyptian side of the Rafah Crossing as a member of an academic
delegation attending a conference at Gaza’s Islamic University. This
is Noam Chomsky talking about his experience there.

NOAM CHOMSKY: It’s kind of amazing and inspiring to see people
managing somehow to survive in—as essentially caged animals and
subject to constant, random, sadistic punishment only to humiliate
them, no pretext. They’re—Israel and the United States keep them
alive, basically. They don’t want them to starve to death. But the
life is set up so that you can’t have a dignified, decent life. In
fact, one of the words you hear most often is “dignity.” They would
like to have dignified lives. And the standard Israeli position is
they shouldn’t raise their heads. And it’s a pressure cooker, could
blow up. You know, people can’t live like that forever.

AMY GOODMAN: You described it in a piece you wrote as an “open-air
prison.”

NOAM CHOMSKY: It’s an open-air prison. As soon as you—you know, we’ve
all been in jail for civil disobedience and so on. The overwhelming
feeling everyone gets is somebody else is in total control of you.
There’s an arbitrary authority who can control anything you do. Stand
up, sit down, you know, find something to eat, go to the bathroom—
whatever it may be, they all determine it; you can’t do anything. Now
that’s basically what it’s like living there. And, you know, there’s—
people find ways to adapt, but it’s just a constant—it’s constant
subjugation to an external force, which has no purpose except to
humiliate you. Of course, they have pretexts—everybody has pretexts—
but they don’t make any sense.

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AMY GOODMAN: This was the first time you were there, though you’ve
written about this for decades.

NOAM CHOMSKY: I’ve written about it forever, and I’ve tried to get in
a couple of times from the Israeli side, but couldn’t—it was always
closed. So this is the first time I made it, and came through Egypt.

AMY GOODMAN: And how hard was it to get through from Egypt?

NOAM CHOMSKY: There’s a lot of bureaucratic hassles, and the border is
still apparently controlled by the Mukhabarat, you know, the old
security services who were close to—I mean, they were under Mubarak.
They’re close to the Mossad, close to Israeli—to the CIA. And a lot of
it—it’s hard to know how much is just bureaucrats trying to make life
difficult for you and how much is planned harassment. I mean, for
people like us, you know, what does it matter? So we wasted two days.
But for the Gazans, it’s no joke. I mean, any—if you want to go
through something like passport control, you sit for three hours,
while they—doing pointless things. That’s just more humiliation.

AMY GOODMAN: While you were there, the Freedom—another Freedom
Flotilla ship tried to get in through from Scandinavia. What was the
response on land?

NOAM CHOMSKY: The Estelle. Yeah, we had a—there was a lot of
excitement. The people like to—you know, obviously are very happy to
know that somebody knows they’re there, and that people are actually
willing to risk something, because it’s not a joke, you know, to try
to break through. And we had a press conference at the port. And to my
amazement, it was actually covered in the most reactionary newspaper
in Israel, Sheldon Adelson’s newspaper, Israel Hayom. Look it up. They
had a fair report of it, quoted the press conference, even had a clip
of it. But for the people there, it’s just a sign: You haven’t
forgotten us, you know? Maybe we’ll get out somehow.

AMY GOODMAN: And we’re speaking for the first time after President
Obama was just re-elected. Your thoughts?

NOAM CHOMSKY: Well, there are two good things about it. One is, the
worst didn’t happen, and it might have. The second is, it’s over. So
we can put it behind us and get back to work, exactly what you said
today. I mean, the whole electoral extravaganza, in my view, ought to
take maybe five minutes of the time of an activist, because it’s a
farce. I mean, there are some differences; it’s not zero impact, you
know. So you decide, OK, I’m going to deal with it this way—five
minutes, finish—now I go back to what matters: the changing of the
circumstances so we don’t have to endure things like this every four
years.

AMY GOODMAN: And with something like Gaza, what you’ve covered, as you
said, forever, what gives you hope?

NOAM CHOMSKY: Well, it’s the usual thing that you see everywhere, that
you’ve seen everywhere a lot more than I have: people’s resilience.
They just don’t give up. Under the worst conditions, horrendous
conditions, people still, you know, fight for their rights and don’t
just succumb. And, you know, it’s a lesson for people from the West. I
mean, you know, we talk about repression, but, you know, undetectable
by comparison with what most people in the world face. And if they can
struggle on under really harsh and brutal conditions, tells us we
ought to be doing a lot more.

AMY GOODMAN: Professor Noam Chomsky, just back from his first trip to
Gaza. This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace
Report. Our previous best, Glenn Greenwald, will be speaking at Bard
College tonight at 7:30 at Bito Auditorium.

[HHW]

Really now, mirjam, your comment is really revealing as to how oxygen-
like accusations of anti-Semitism are to you Jewish Zionists. You
can't live without them. You simply can not defend Israeli policy.

[brian lamb]

The Arab World's response to the bombing of the Gaza Strip by the
IDF:
"Funny idiot muslim arab dance gay"!


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[drahcir]

On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 18:00:32 -0800 (PST), HHW
<coaste...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>On Nov 17, 6:40�pm, drahcir <s...@sgscc.com> wrote:
>> For any newcomers not understanding what a devious liar HHW is, you
>> can start with this:
>
>Clip

LOL! poo witto H must have wet his diaper (at his age they're called
"Depends"), and to make himself feel a bit better about having to once
again confront proof of his hying, thinks he can make aw da bad hurtee
go away by "clipping" it. Meanie drahcir will just put it right back
for you, little H.

https://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.usa/msg/d306980b0ac5b63e?hl=en

Wittoo H is completely defenseless, just like a 5 year old girl, and,
without anything else to do, he posts some irrelevancies to try to
soothe himself.

[drahcir]

I did, and by asking again for an answer, you prove it true.

[drahcir]

Um, Steve, don't you think that if Israel were targeting Gaza's
civilians, there would be a lot more of them dead? What point would
assasinations serve if not to save civilian life? Guess those little
tidbits never crossed your "mind". Of course it never crossed H's
either, because his became plaque-infested quite some time ago.

[mirjam]

On Saturday, November 17, 2012 8:36:27 PM UTC+2, HHW wrote:

Here HHW is your admition in your own words ,,,,,,

> > > You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew

> > > in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.

This are YOUR WORDS !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

> Where do I do that, mirjam? Can't one dislike a single Jew without
>
> being an anti-Semite?

maybe you don`t realize what you wrote READ it again ,,,
mirjam

[mirjam]

On Sunday, November 18, 2012 4:04:30 AM UTC+2, HHW wrote:
> On Nov 17, 1:36 pm, HHW <coaster132...@yahoo.com> wrote:

You are writing with your own words

>
> > > > You know exactly what you are doing. Again, if you were the only Jew
> > > > in the world I'd be an anti-Semite.

admit that you are one ,,,,,

>
> > Where do I do that, mirjam? Can't one dislike a single Jew without
>
> > being an anti-Semite?


> Really now, mirjam, your comment is really revealing as to how oxygen-
>
> like accusations of anti-Semitism are to you Jewish Zionists.

Come on Mr HHW , you know i am not throwing this term around every day .
And yes i am proud Zionist, but we were not talking about Israel here we were discussing your continuous posts that are always against Jews and against Israel.

>You
> can't live without them.

i can easily live very well without reading your hate posts, the Question is CAN YOU LIVE without your Daily Hate postings fix?

I research documents and papers from 1942-1945, thus i see enough of those Hate terminology,, i really do not need to read more.

[Count 1]

lol. Pummel away then! He's in my kill filter with all the other western
muslim converts who advocate genocide and terrorism. Since I regularly
read mondoweiss, informed comment, chomsky, and a host of other bottom
feeding lying scumballs who need to consistently ignore the genocidal
intention's of Israel's enemies to engage in their biased, hate filled,
ignorant bashing of a great ally to the western hemisphere, I find no
reason to read him at all.

[drahcir]

> Targeting GazaCivilians: Israel’s Specialty

>
> by Stephen Lendman on 11/17/2012

You DARE ask me to pay attention to your ridiculously stupid posts?
The only time I pay attention to you is when I can make you look
stupid or prove you an antisemite or a liar - haven't you gleaned that
by now?

Now, to the business at hand. You saw fit to post some article written
by some moron from some ignored corner of the internet for one reason
only - it demonizes jews. Want proof that you and he are scum? Here it
is, from the NEW YORK TIMES today:

"In all, 57 Palestinians have been killed, including 24 civilians"

http://news.yahoo.com/israel-egypt-talk-gaza-ceasefire-strikes-widen-141058597.html

Now, does that sound like civilians are being targeted to you,
imbecile? Do you have any idea in your feeble "brain" how incredibly
difficult it is to exterminate these cockroaches without doing harm to
the surrounding population? Can you strain what remaining active
neurons you have and imagine what the casualty numbers would look like
were Israel targeting civilians as you suggest? You're a fucking
antisemitic liar through and through - this is simply one more example
of it.

>
> Hanan Tafesh, 10 months old, killed by Israeli assaults on Gaza
> Bullies choose easy adversaries to pummel. Equal fights are shunned.
> It’s the same in schoolyards or battlefields.
> America and Israel operate this way. They avoid foes able to give as
> much as they take. Rogue governments never say they’re sorry.
>
> During Cast Lead in January 2009, Professor Jeremy Salt wrote “A
> Message to the brave Israeli Airmen.” His comments apply to what’s now
> ongoing.
>
> What’s it like firing missiles at people you can’t see, he asked?
>
> Does it help being unable to see who you’re killing?

LOL! I just noticed this surreal gem - stated at a time when in the
last few days over 400 missiles have been directed not at IDF, but at
Israeli cities. Only antisemitism could possibly be responsible for
such lack of objectivity.

> Another potential holocaust looms.Civiliansalways suffer most.

> Israel and America willfully target them. It part of the imperial
> strategy of both countries. Human lives don’t matter, just conquest,
> dominance, and exploitation.
>
> Cast Lead took a terrible toll. Missiles, bombs, shells, and illegal
> weapons were used against defenseless people. Mass slaughter and
> destruction followed.
>
> Horrific crimes of war and against humanity were committed.
> Responsible officials remain unaccountable. Security Council no-fly
> zone protection wasn’t ordered.
>

> Over 1,400 Gazans perished. More than 80% werecivilians. Over 300

> were children. Around 5,300 were injured. Over 1,600 were children or
> infants. Israel willfully targeted them.
>
> Neighborhoods, schools, universities, mosques, hospitals, UN
> facilities, fishing boats, civilian factories and workshops, municipal
> buildings, charitable foundations, civilian infrastructure, and other
> noncombatant sites were bombed and shelled.
>
> Farmland was bulldozed. Power facilities and irrigations systems were
> destroyed. International leaders were indifferent about human
> slaughter and suffering. Only three low-level Israeli soldiers
> received punishments too minor to matter.
>
> The al-Samouni family lost 27 members. Salah Talala al-Samouni saw his
> mother blown apart. Rocket and shell fire killed his two-year old
> daughter, father, aunt, cousin, and entire family. Media scoundrels
> said nothing. They support Israel’s worst crimes.
>
> Under siege, Gazans haven’t recovered from Cast Lead. Now they face
> the prospect of more war perhaps worse than 2008-09.
>
> International leaders share culpability through silence, indifference,
> and/or complicity. Washington is involved in all Israeli wars.
> Weapons, munitions and funding are supplied. Political support is
> given.
>
> Obama told Netanyahu, go ahead and bomb and shell at will. Call it
> “self-defense” and pretend no one knows it’s not. On November 15, the
> Senate unanimously passed a non-binding supportive resolution. Not a
> single profile in courage expressed opposition.
>

> AIPAC thanked Obama and Senate members for supporting Israel. Gazanciviliansand resistance fighters are maliciously called terrorists.

> Commission members include former Magistrate...
>
> read more »

[drahcir]

On Sun, 18 Nov 2012 07:52:57 -0700, Count 1 <omnipi...@yahoo.ca>

Well, you obviously have a more interesting life than I do...

[HHW]

By your dishonest standards the entire world demonizes Jews:

Worldwide protests against Israeli aggression in Gaza
by Adam Horowitz on November 14, 2012 25
15152Facebook1546Twitter1StumbleUpon12Reddit27
Google

A protest in London in 2009. (Photo: AFP)

Here is a list of Emergency Global Actions for Gaza being planned
around the world. This list is being constantly updated, please check
here for the latest. Tweet @southsouth or @riverdryfilm to add events
to the list.

FRIDAY, 16th November

Aberystwyth (UK) | Aberystwyth University, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Albuquerque (USA) | UNM Bookstore, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Aosta (Italy) | Piazza Chanoux, 9:00 p.m. [link]
Athens (Greece) | Israeli Embassy, 5 p.m. [link]
Asheville (USA) | Vance Monument, 4:30 p.m. [link]
Belfast (Ireland) | International Wall Divis St., 5:30 p.m.
Benghazi (Libya) | Tahrir Square, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Berlin (Germany) | Brandenburger Tor, Pairser Platz 2:30 p.m.
Birmingham (USA) | 1400 University Boulevard, 1:30 p.m. [link]
Boston (USA) | Copley Square, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Bristol (UK) | The Fountains, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Brussels (Belgium) | Place de la Bourse, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Cairo (Egypt) | Mohamed Mahmoud st, 12:30 p.m. [link]
Cairo (Egypt) | Tahrir Square
Cairo (Egypt) | Mosireen (action meeting), 9:00 p.m. [link]
Calgary (Canada) | City Hall, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Cape Town (South Africa) | Outside Parliament, 12:00 p.m.
Charleston SC (USA) | Marion Sq, 3:00 p.m.
Cincinnati (USA) | MLK Boulvard and Clifton Avenue, 4:30 p.m. [link]
Cleveland (USA) | Public Square, 4:30 p.m. [link]
Denver (USA) | West side of the Denver Capitol, 4:00 p.m.
Derna (Libya) | Sahet Tahrir, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Detroit (USA) | Windsor Detroit Tunnel, 4:30 p.m. [link]
Durban (South Africa) | City Hall, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Durham, NC (USA) | Duke University, West Campus bus stop, 5:00 p.m.
Florida (USA) | Gainesville, Turlington Hall, 11:00 a.m. [link]
Forth Worth (USA) | Courthouse, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Haifa (Palestine) | prisoners' square Carmel (Ben Gurion), 7:30 p.m.
[link]
Hebden Bridge (UK) | Central Intersection, 5:00 p.m.
Houston (USA) | Intersection of Westheimer & Post Oak Boulevard, 4:30
p.m. [link]
Glasgow (Scotland) | Donald Dewer Statue, Buchanan st., 5:00 p.m.
[link]
Johannesburg (South Africa) | Luthuli House, 2:00 p.m.
Johannesburg (South Africa) | Wits Jamaa Khana, 7:00 p.m. [link]
Kuala Lumpur (Malaysia) | US Embassy, 2 p.m. [link]
L’Aquila (Italy) | Fontana Luminosa, 6:30 p.m. [link]
Lannion (France) | Town Hall, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Limerick (Ireland) | Thomas Street, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Liverpool (UK) | Outside BBC Radio Merseyside, 5:30 p.m. [link]
London (UK) | Israeli Embassy, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Madison (USA) | In front of Memorial Library, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Madrid (Spain) | Israeli Embassy, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Mälmo (Sweden) | Triangeln, uppgång Smedjegatan, 6:00 p.m.
Manchester (UK) | Picadilly Gardens, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Michigan | the Diag, University of Michigan, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Milan (Italy) | Piazza del Duomo, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Munich (Germany) | Israeli Consulate General, 3:00 p.m.
Munich (Germany) | Odeonsplatz, 6:30 p.m.
Nanaimo (CA) Terminal & Commercial st., 12:00 p.m
Nantes (France) | Intersection of trams (50 otages/Commerce), 5:30
p.m [link]
New York (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Nijmegen (Holland) | Intersection Molenstraat/Broerstraat, 2:00 p.m.
[link]
Norman OK (USA) | University of Oklahoma, 9:00 a.m. [link]
Ohio, (USA) | Columbus, Ohio Statehouse, 5:00 p.m.
Ottawa (Canada) | Israeli Embassy, 50 O’Connor b/w Queen and Albert,
12:00 p.m. [link]
Palermo (Italy) | Piazza Giuseppe Verdi, 5 p.m. [link]
Perth (Australia) | Murray Street Mall, Perth City, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Philadelphia (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 19th and JFK Boulevard, 12:00
p.m. [link]
Pittsburgh (USA) | U.S. Federal Building, 1000 Liberty Avenue, 5:00
p.m. [link]
Ramallah (Palestine) Almanara, 1:00 p.m.
Rochester (USA) | Federal Office Building, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Rouen (France) | courthouse, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Rome (Italy) | Montecitoria, 5:30 p.m. [link]
São Paulo (Brazil) | MASP, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Sacramento (USA) | Federal Building, 5th and I Street, 4:30 p.m.
San Francisco (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 4:00 p.m. [link]
San Jose (USA) | Santana Row, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Seoul (Korea) | Israeli Embassy, Kabool Bulding, 149 Seorin-dong,
110-726, 1:00 p.m.
Seville (Spain) | Plaza Nueva, 7:00 p.m.
Sousse (Tunisia) | Sahet al Chelli, 12:00 p.m. [link]
St. Catherine’s, ON (Canada) | 61 Geneva St, 2:00 p.m. [link]
St. Louis (USA) | Robert Young Federal Building, 4:00 p.m. [link]
St. Paul (MN) | Snelling & Summit Ave, 4:15 p.m. [link]
Tempe AZ (USA) | Arizona State University, NW corner of Mill Ave, 5:00
p.m. [link]
Tripoli (Libya) | Shuhadaa Square, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Tucson AZ (USA) | SW corner of Euclid Ave & Speedway, 5:00 p.m.
Vienna (Austria) | Stephansplatz, 1010, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Waterford (Ireland) | Red Square, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Wellington (New Zealand) | Cuba Mall, by the Buckets, 12:00 p.m.
[link]
West Lafayette (USA) | Memorial Mall (south end), 1:30 p.m. [link]
Zawiya (Libya) | Shuhadaa Square, 4:00 p.m. [link]

SATURDAY, 17th November

Aberdeen (Scotland) | St. Nicholas Square, 12:00 p.m.
Amherst (USA) | Student Union, UMass Amherst, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Amsterdam (Holland) | Dam Sq, 1:00 p.m. [link]
Annecy (France) | In Front of the prefecture , 2:30 [link]
Aubenas (France) | marche et cheateau square , 10:30 a.m. [link]
Aukland (New Zealand) | Aotea Square, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Barcelona (Catalonia) | Placa Saint Jaume, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Belfort (France) | Corbis Square, 2:30 p.m. [link]
Bergen (Norway) | Torgallmenningen, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Bonn (Germany) | 1600 Muensterplatz, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Bologna (Italy) | Piazza di Porta Ravegnana, 4:30 p.m.
Bordeaux (France) | Place De La Comedie, 11:30 a.m. [link]
Boulogne Sur Mer (France) | Monsigny and Theirs Street , 12:00 p.m.
[link]
Bournemouth (UK) | The Square 10 Exeter Road, 1:00 p.m. [link]
Brisbane (Australia) | Brisbane Sq, 12:30 p.m. [link]
Cairo (Egypt) | Arab League HQ, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Cambridge (UK) | Market Sq, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Canterbury (UK) | High Street, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Cardiff (UK) | Aneurin bevan Statue, Queen Street, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Chateauroux (France) | 1 Jules Massenet Street 36000, 8:00 p.m.
[link]
Cheltenham (UK) | High st near Topshop, 3:30 p.m. [link]
Denver (USA) | Denver Capitol, 1:00 p.m. [link]
Dublin (Ireland) | The Spire, 14:00 p.m. [link]
Edinburgh (UK) | Charlotte sq, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Edmonton (Canada) | Edmonton City Hall South steps, 103a Av & 100 St,
1:00 p.m. [link]
Every (France) | Townhall, Human Rights Square, 12:00 [link]
Frankfurt (Germany) | Hauptwache, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Geneva (Switzerland) | In front of the UN (Places des Nation), 2:00
p.m. [link]
Genoa (Italy) | Piazza De Ferrari, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Gothenburg (Sweden) | Gustav Adolfs torg, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Indianapolis (USA) | Monument Circle, 2:00 p.m.
Lisbon (Portugal) | Israeli Embassy, 5:00 p.m. [link]
London (UK) | Hyde Park Corner ==> Israeli Embassy, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Lyon (France) | Place Bellecour, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Malaga (Spain) } Plaza de la Contiticion, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Mälmo (Sweden) | Gustaf Adolfs Torg, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Melbourne (Australia) | Bourke St Mall, 12:30 p.m. [link]
Modena (Italy) | Near Ghirlandina, 4:00 p.m.
Montpellier (France) | Place De La Comedie, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Newcastle (UK) | Grey’s Monument, 12:00 p.m. [link]
New Haven (USA) | 141 Church St., across from the Green, 12:00 p.m.
[link]
Nimes (France) | Carre D’art , 3:00 p.m. [link]
Norman OK (USA) | University of Oklahoma, 12:30 p.m. [link]
Nottingham (UK)| Nottingham Market Square, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Oklahoma City (USA) | Penn Sq Mall, 12:30 p.m. [link]
Orleons (France) | Arc Square, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Oslo (Norway) | Israeli Embassy, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Padova (Italy) | In front of City Hall, 4:30 p.m.
Paris (France) | Place De L’opera, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Paris (France) | Place de la Bastille, 3:00 p.m. [link]
Pau (France) | Pyrénées Atlantiques , 12:00 p.m. [link]
Portland (USA) | Pioneer Courthouse Sq, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Reading (UK) | Broad st, 12:30 p.m.
Regina (Canada) | Victoria Park 3:00 p.m. [link]
Rome (Italy) | Piazzo Montecitorio, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Sacramento (USA) | Federal Building, 4:00 p.m. [link]
San Sebastian (Spain) | Boulevard de Donosti, 12:00 p.m.
Santiago (Chile) | Israeli Embassy, 11:00 a.m. [link]
Sheffield (UK) | Outside the Town Hall, 12:00 p.m. [link]
Southampton (UK) | Bargate Shopping Centre, 12:00 p.m.
Stockholm (Sweden) | Israeli Embassy 3:00 p.m. [link]
Stransbourg (France) | Place Keleber 4:00 p.m. [link]
St Paul (USA) | Snelling & Summit Ave, 4:15 p.m. [link]
Stuttgart (Germany) | Schlossplatz, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Swansea (UK) | Castle sq, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Tarbes (France) | Verdum , 3:00 p.m. [link]
Torino (Italy) | Corso G Cesare, 2:30 p.m. [link]
Toulouse (France) | Franklin Roosevelt and Jean Jaures, 4:30 p.m.
[link]
Valence (France) | Townhall , 2:30 p.m. [link]
Venice (Italy) | Campo Santa Margherita, 16:30
Warsaw (Poland) | Israeli Embassy, 1:00 p.m. [link]
Wrexham (UK) | Hope st., near Barclays, 11:00 p.m. [link]


SUNDAY, 18th November

Anges, (France) | Place Ralliment, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Antwerp (Belgium) | ProvincieHuis, 1:00 p.m. [link]
Berlin (Germany) | Hermannplatz, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Gijon (Spain) | Paseo de Begona, frente el teatro jovellanos, 7:00
p.m.
Hong Kong (China) | Victoria Park, 2:00 p.m. [link]
Kansas City (MO, USA) | JC Nichols Fountain Country Club Plaza, 3:00
p.m.
Lille (France) | Metro Wazemmes , 11 a.m. [link]

MONDAY, 19th November

Berlin (Germany) | Brandenburger Tor, Pariser Platz 5:00 p.m.
Romans (France) | Place Charles de Gaulle, 4:30 p.m. [link]

[PREVIOUSLY]

WEDNESDAY, 14 Nov
Bethlehem | Manger Square, 7:30 p.m.
Istanbul | al Fateh Mosque, 9:00 p.m.
Jerusalem | Damascus Gate, 7:00 p.m.
Ramallah | al Manara Square, 7:00 p.m.
Tel Aviv | Ehud Barak's doorstep, 8:00 p.m.
Quebec | Hall Building, Concordia U, 1455 de Maisonneuve West, 6:00
p.m. [link]


THURSDAY, 15 Nov

Alexandria (Egypt) | Qaid Ibrahim, 12:00 p.m.
Amsterdam (Holland) | Zuidelijke Wandelweg 41, 6:45 p.m. [link]
Ann Arbor (USA) | Campus Diag, in front of Hatcher Graduate Library,
3:00 p.m. [link]
Austin (USA) | I-35 and 12th Street (overpass), 2:00 p.m. [link]
Atlanta (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 4 p.m. [link]
Beirut (Lebanon) | Cola, 10:00 a.m.
Belfast (Ireland) | City Hall, 7:00 p.m.
Boston (USA) | 4:30 p.m., Copley Square [link]
Bradford (UK) | 4.30 p.m. [link]
Brighton (UK) | Outside EcoStream HQ, 12:00 p.m. [twitter]
Brighton (UK) | Victoria Gardens, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Cairo (Egypt) | Omar Makram, 12:30 p.m.
Cairo (Egypt) | Arab League, 4:00 p.m.
Chicago (USA) | Outside Obama HQ, 130 E Randolph Street, 4:00 p.m.
[link]
Cork (Ireland) | Daunt square 6:00 p.m. [link]
Denver (USA) | Colorado State Capital, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Dublin (Ireland) | Israeli Embassy, 5:30 p.m.
Durham (UK) | Market sq, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Florence (Italy) | Piazza della Repubblica (flash mob), 6:00 p.m.
[link]
George Mason University (USA) | The North Plaza, 1:30 p.m. [link]
Glasgow (Scotland) | Ahl al Bayt Centre, 6 p.m. [link]
Haifa (Palestine) | Karma House, 7:00 p.m. [link]
Jerusalem (Palestine) | Outside Hebrew University, 12:00 p.m.
Limerick (Ireland) | Thomas st, 6:15 p.m. [link]
Leeds (UK) | Parkinson Steps, University of Leeds, LS2 9JT, 1:00 p.m.
[link]
London (UK) | Israeli Embassy, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Los Angeles (USA) | UCLA, Meyerhoff Park, 11:30 a.m. [link]
Los Angeles (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 11766 Wilshire Boulvard, 4:00
p.m. [link] [link]
Manchester (UK) | Piccadilly Gardens, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Memphis (USA) | Poplar and Highland, 5:00 p.m. [link]
Mexico City (Mexico) | Israeli Embassy, 4:00 p.m.
Montreal (Canada) | Hall Building, Concordia University, 5:00 p.m.
Nashville (USA) | Centennial Park, 3:00 pm [link]
Nazareth (Palestine) | Kassarat Crossroad, 6:30 p.m. [link]
New York (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 42nd Street & 2nd Ave, 5:00 p.m.
[link]
Nottingham (UK)| Nottingham Market Square, 5:30 p.m. [link]
Olympia (USA) | Red Square at Evergreen State College, 12:00 p.m.
[link]
Ontario (Canada) | University of Windsor, CAW Student Centre, 12:00
p.m.
Ottawa (Canada) | Israeli Embassy, 6:00 p.m.
Oxford (UK) | Cornmarket Street, 4:00 p.m. [link]
Paris (France) | Ministry of Justice, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Princeton (USA) | Princeton University, outside of Frist Campus
Center, 12:30 p.m.
San Diego (USA) | US Federal Building, 880 Front Street, 4:30 p.m.
[link]
San Francisco (USA) | Israeli Consulate, 5:15 p.m. [link]
Santiago (Chile) | Palestine Stadium (Vitacura 8049) to Israel
Stadium, 9:00 p.m. [link]
Seattle (USA) | Henry Jackson Federal Building, 915 2nd Avenue, 4:00
p.m. [link]
Spokane (USA) | Corner of Maine and Division, 5:00 p.m.
Sydney (Australia) | Parmatta Town Hall, 6:00 p.m. [link]
Tel Aviv (Palestine) | Main Entrance, Tel Aviv University 11:30 a.m.
[link]
Toronto (Canada) | Israeli Consulate, 180 Bloor Street (E. of St.
George TTC), 6:00 p.m.
Tunis (Tunisia) | In front of the National Theatre, 11:00 a.m.
Tunis (Tunisia) | Front of all Trade Association Buildings (Sa7et
Mohamed Ali) 1:00 p.m.
Vancouver (Canada) | The Art Gallery, Hornby and Robson Streets, 5:00
p.m. [link]
Washington D.C. (USA) | March from State Department, 6:00 p.m. [link]


About Adam Horowitz
Adam Horowitz is Co-Editor of Mondoweiss.net.
-------------------------------

Want proof that you and he are scum? Here it
> is, from the NEW YORK TIMES today:
>
> "In all, 57 Palestinians have been killed, including 24 civilians"
>

> http://news.yahoo.com/israel-egypt-talk-gaza-ceasefire-strikes-widen-...

>
> Now, does that sound like civilians are being targeted to you,
> imbecile?

The last time there was an Israeli "incursion" into the Gaza open-air
prison camp run by the Israelis the final result was @1,4000 dead,
the vast bulk of them "civilians" including hundreds of elderly, women
and children. That event was preceded by the call up of reserves by
the tens of thousands and the massing of armor and artillery at the
borders. The protesters in the west understand that despite your
pretense not to.

Do you have any idea in your feeble "brain" how incredibly
> difficult it is to exterminate these cockroaches without doing harm to
> the surrounding population?

The Palestinian Resistance Movement is made up largely of brave and
principled men and women who fight their oppressors with what they
have.. That you reflexively equate your mortal enemies with insects, a
habit of Nazi and Communist propagandists, is a patent sign of
desperation.

Can you strain what remaining active
> neurons you have and imagine what the casualty numbers would look like
> were Israel targeting civilians as you suggest? You're a fucking
> antisemitic liar through and through - this is simply one more example
> of it.

1,400 last time, Ratner. The present pattern of increased violence,
mobilization and preparations for another invasion of Gaza is the same
as it was before. The imprisonment and gross abuse of the Arab people
in Palestine by Jewish colonialists from Europe and the United States
has continued since 1967. The present Israeli regime has learned
nothing.

>
>
>
> > Hanan Tafesh, 10 months old, killed by Israeli assaults on Gaza
> > Bullies choose easy adversaries to pummel. Equal fights are shunned.
> > It’s the same in schoolyards or battlefields.
> > America and Israel operate this way. They avoid foes able to give as
> > much as they take. Rogue governments never say they’re sorry.
>
> > During Cast Lead in January 2009, Professor Jeremy Salt wrote “A
> > Message to the brave Israeli Airmen.” His comments apply to what’s now
> > ongoing.
>
> > What’s it like firing missiles at people you can’t see, he asked?
>
> > Does it help being unable to see who you’re killing?
>
> LOL! I just noticed this surreal gem - stated at a time when in the
> last few days over 400 missiles have been directed not at IDF, but at
> Israeli cities. Only antisemitism could possibly be responsible for
> such lack of objectivity.

Speaking of the surreal, those home-made Palestinian rockets have no
guidance systems. And the imprisoned and oppressed Palestinian people
have no other weapons at all except for a few small arms. Your
paranoid Israelis on the other hand have one of the world's most
modern and powerful militaries thanks primarily to the United States
Congress which is essentially terrorized by the Zionist Israel Lobby,
and the Israelis ARE THEREFORE FREE TO USE THOSE AMERICAN WEAPONS
indiscriminately against helpless, imprisoned people because we can
not even enforce our laws regulating use of our arms exports when it
comes to the Israelis. This is quite clearly, Ratner, because the
Israelis happen to be Jews who don't have to play by the rules because
of the wealth and brutal tactics of their American Lobby. You affect
rage that these primitive rockets are used because Jewish non-
combatants might be injured even though the IDF specializes in the
indiscriminate killing of civilians under the umbrella of 'self-
defense'. You, Ratner, are a hypocrite and a special pleader for the
policies which are leading Israel into a corner from which she is
unlikely to emerge whole much less with any shred of honor. If you are
willing to discuss that openly I'm ready, but you have yet to summon
up the intellectual honesty to do it.

[HHW]

Reposted to correct a typo in the number of Palestinians killed by the
Israeli war machine in the last Gaza incursion.

>
> The last time there was an Israeli "incursion" into the Gaza open-air

> prison camp run by the Israelis  the final result was @1,400 dead,

[drahcir]

As usual, you allude to some phantom dishonesty of mine, but fail to
specify. What you DID you is of course COMPLETELY dishonest - you
snipped my evidence that you are an antisemitic moron and "think" you
can blithely continue with some irrelevancy. Sorry, not on my watch.

I'll replace what you don't have the courage to face, little child:

****

Now, to the business at hand. You saw fit to post some article written
by some moron from some ignored corner of the internet for one reason

only - it demonizes jews. Want proof that you and he are scum? Here it

is, from the NEW YORK TIMES today:

"In all, 57 Palestinians have been killed, including 24 civilians"

http://news.yahoo.com/israel-egypt-talk-gaza-ceasefire-strikes-widen-141058597.html

Now, does that sound like civilians are being targeted to you,

imbecile? Do you have any idea in your feeble "brain" how incredibly

difficult it is to exterminate these cockroaches without doing harm to

the surrounding population? Can you strain what remaining active

neurons you have and imagine what the casualty numbers would look like
were Israel targeting civilians as you suggest? You're a fucking
antisemitic liar through and through - this is simply one more example
of it.
>

> Hanan Tafesh, 10 months old, killed by Israeli assaults on Gaza
> Bullies choose easy adversaries to pummel. Equal fights are shunned.
> It�s the same in schoolyards or battlefields.
> America and Israel operate this way. They avoid foes able to give as
> much as they take. Rogue governments never say they�re sorry.
>
> During Cast Lead in January 2009, Professor Jeremy Salt wrote �A
> Message to the brave Israeli Airmen.� His comments apply to what�s now
> ongoing.
>
> What�s it like firing missiles at people you can�t see, he asked?
>
> Does it help being unable to see who you�re killing?

LOL! I just noticed this surreal gem - stated at a time when in the
last few days over 400 missiles have been directed not at IDF, but at
Israeli cities. Only antisemitism could possibly be responsible for
such lack of objectivity.

****

It should be clear to the group that if you had the wherewithal to
refute any of my points above, you would not have snipped them away
and fled like a scared five year old girl.

>
>Worldwide protests against Israeli aggression in Gaza

Big deal- some people are protesting. WOW, amazing. Fact is a hugely
greater percentage are NOT protesting.

>M�lmo (Sweden) | Triangeln, uppg�ng Smedjegatan, 6:00 p.m.

>S�o Paulo (Brazil) | MASP, 5:00 p.m. [link]

>M�lmo (Sweden) | Gustaf Adolfs Torg, 3:00 p.m. [link]

>Melbourne (Australia) | Bourke St Mall, 12:30 p.m. [link]
>Modena (Italy) | Near Ghirlandina, 4:00 p.m.
>Montpellier (France) | Place De La Comedie, 4:00 p.m. [link]
>Newcastle (UK) | Grey�s Monument, 12:00 p.m. [link]
>New Haven (USA) | 141 Church St., across from the Green, 12:00 p.m.
>[link]
>Nimes (France) | Carre D�art , 3:00 p.m. [link]
>Norman OK (USA) | University of Oklahoma, 12:30 p.m. [link]
>Nottingham (UK)| Nottingham Market Square, 5:30 p.m. [link]
>Oklahoma City (USA) | Penn Sq Mall, 12:30 p.m. [link]
>Orleons (France) | Arc Square, 3:00 p.m. [link]
>Oslo (Norway) | Israeli Embassy, 2:00 p.m. [link]
>Padova (Italy) | In front of City Hall, 4:30 p.m.
>Paris (France) | Place De L�opera, 3:00 p.m. [link]
>Paris (France) | Place de la Bastille, 3:00 p.m. [link]

>Pau (France) | Pyr�n�es Atlantiques , 12:00 p.m. [link]

[mirjam]

On Monday, November 19, 2012 3:40:51 AM UTC+2, HHW wrote:

>
> Speaking of the surreal, those home-made Palestinian rockets have no
>
> guidance systems.

All missiles are Grads , fajrs Built in Iran and assembled under Iranian guifdance in Azza .



http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/grad-rocket-fired-from-gaza-severely-damages-two-houses-in-netivot-1.463607

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fajr-5

[HHW]

On Nov 18, 10:42 am, drahcir <rsrat...@gmail.com> wrote:

An Israeli surgical strike:

http://tribune.com.pk/multimedia/slideshows/467692/

[Cedo]

Richard Ratner is not to be read until his sexual depravities are
controlled.

[NoSpamAtAll]

In article <k8copv$62u$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com> wrote:

> until his sexual depravities are controlled.

That's rich. aussie filth talking about sexual depravities...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=31983
"About 20 convicted Australian pedophiles unsuccessfully tried to
travel to Indonesia and Thailand immediately after the Dec. 26 tsunami
to prey on vulnerable children, a newspaper reported on Saturday."

http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/austral.htm
"Child prostitution in Australia was studied by ECPAT, which collected
information from early 471 government and non-government agencies working
with children. The study, the first of its kind, revealed a vicious cycle
leading to child commercial sexual activities."

http://www.atimes.com/oceania/AC27Ah03.html
"It also confirmed suspicions the Pacific region has become a new target
for Australian pedophiles fleeing police crackdowns on child sex offences
at home and elsewhere in Asia."

http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/06/11/1086749893067.html?from=moreStories
"Australian pedophiles are part of an organised crime ring preying on
Thailand's vulnerable children, writes Mark Baker."

[Cedo]

"NoSpamAtAll" <spa...@not.home> wrote in message
news:k8cs14$mv7$1...@pcls6.std.com...

> In article <k8copv$62u$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> until his sexual depravities are controlled.

And yours

[Cedo]

"mirjam" <mir...@actcom.co.il> wrote in message
news:35ca1525-7e0d-4351...@googlegroups.com...

> On Monday, November 19, 2012 3:40:51 AM UTC+2, HHW wrote:
>
>>
>> Speaking of the surreal, those home-made Palestinian rockets have no
>>
>> guidance systems.
>
> All missiles are Grads , fajrs Built in Iran and assembled under
> Iranian guifdance in Azza .
>

It's Gaza, jew slime.

Most of your weapons come from israel west, aka the United States. You seem
OK with that, jew slime

[NoSpamAtAll]

In article <k8cvhs$81u$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]

"sexual depravities", aussie filth?...

[Cedo]

"NoSpamAtAll" <spa...@not.home> wrote in message

news:k8d06l$vc3$1...@pcls6.std.com...

> In article <k8cvhs$81u$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
> "sexual depravities",

Something jews have specialized in for ever

From: sschwa...@infinet.com Sara Schwartz aka Sara Salzman
<catam...@concentric.net>
Newsgroups: alt.sex.bondage
Subject: My Master Holds The Ropes Just So (poem)
Date: Sun, 05 Feb 1995 14:49:12 -0500
Organization: InfiNet
Lines: 114
Message-ID: <sschwartz-0502951449120...@p21.infinet.com>
NNTP-Posting-Host: p21.infinet.com

My Master holds the rope just so.

He knows me. Knows my moods. Knows the fear behind my eyes, both real and
imagined.

Those eyes widen as he gently lays the rope down, as he carefully,
methodically, systematically, lays the toys down on the bed.

Soft moans escape from behind gagged lips. I have been told to watch.
To see each and know that soon each will touch me.

He looks up briefly as he lays each down on the bed. Checking reactions.
Watching.

The short whip. A sigh.
The deerskin. The suede.

The small braided thong, the one that stings. A short moan.

The horsehair that stings but never marks.

The canes. The paddles. A pause.

I wait, knowing.

The small velvet bag that holds clamps. Clamps too severe for my breasts,
yet applied anyway.

A gasp. And then his smile.

He knows me. He knows I will take the pain to please him. He knows the
sacrifice I make to his Gods of Pain. He sees the torment in my eyes. The
desire to please. The love. The fear of the pain.

My Master holds the rope just so.

Through his fingers, around my wrists, making delicate rings softer than
steel. Stronger than steel. One on each wrist, a gentle bracelet that is
soon pulled tight, stretched to the bedposts and wrapped tightly. One on
each ankle. No matter how I tighten my muscles as he wraps the rope, still
it is perfectly tight. The circulation moves.
The ankle does not.

I lie face-up on the bed, my body a perfect X. Face up. Oh, Goddess, he's
going to whip my breasts.

But first, two small wooden clothespins bob before my eyes. I turn my
head, remember I am instructed to watch, turn back. The clothespins bite
the delicate flesh of each nipple. Grasp. Sting. Burn. He waits.

My Master knows me. Knows he can whip me, clothespins and all. Knows the
pain, where it will hurt the most, what I can and cannot take.
He waits.

The burning increases as the pins are removed. Ah, he will not whip me
with clothespins in place. But the moment when I was unsure, when the
blood pounded in my temples and the fear covered me like a shroud, then he
watched my eyes.

The whip falls. Which one is it now? I cannot turn my head to see which he
reaches for. But I know them all. I arch my back, try to stay still.

My Master knows me. Knows I will hold position as long as possible, before
the pain forces me to writhe, to turn, to try in vain to shield my
breasts. Knows the moment when I can no longer stay still. And precisely
then, says gently, "Don't move."

My Master holds the rope just so. Gently tugging at the knots, to release
arms and legs from bondage. Gently unwraps each wrist, each ankle. Rubs
each, and kisses the places where the rope has left its mark. The gag is
removed. I swallow.

"Kneel."

I crouch on the bed, head down, ass up, as he mounts the bed behind me.
His hands caress my ass softly, then spank sharply. Slowly, quickly, his
hand falls upon my ass. I wait for the moment, the pain/pleasure as he
will enter me. But not yet. First a gentle tapping, soft touch, as he
marks the place the cane will fall. I brace myself, plead with myself to
hold position, knowing each stroke brings a fire hotter than any flame.

Five strokes. Six. I have not moved. As the pain from each begins to
subside, a soft, half-sob. "Thank you, Master."

Eight. Nine. My knees give out, and I fall to the bed, sobbing. But
immediately back on my knees again. "Thank you, Master."

Ten. I am aware of nothing, save the pain. And his voice, as I am
commanded to orgasm, not from stimulation, not from his fingers or his
cock, but from pain alone. My body responds without hesitation. My
pleasure is screamed out for his pleasure.

Later, I will feel his cock inside me. I will feel the force as he thrusts
deep into me, bruising the tender flesh with his strength. Later I will
come, and come, and come, but only by his command. Later, we will lie
back, exhausted, as he cradles me in his arms, strokes me gently, whispers
in my ear.

But not yet.

Now he rises from the bed, returns to the toys so carefully laid out before
me.

My Master holds the rope just so.

<END>

[NoSpamAtAll]

In article <k8d0j2$dth$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com> wrote:

> "sexual depravities",

The aussie claim to fame.

[Cedo]

"NoSpamAtAll" <spa...@not.home> wrote in message

news:k8d0l5$gfk$1...@pcls6.std.com...

> In article <k8d0j2$dth$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> "sexual depravities",
>

Jew sexual depravity

[NoSpamAtAll]

In article <k8d0t6$fei$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]

aussie sexual depravity -- a tiny sample
****************************************

[Cedo]

"NoSpamAtAll" <spa...@not.home> wrote in message

news:k8d169$cm1$1...@pcls6.std.com...

> In article <k8d0t6$fei$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
> [...]
>

> jew sexual depravity -- a tiny sample

[NoSpamAtAll]

In article <k8d1be$ho3$1...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedon...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]

aussie sexual depravity -- a tiny sample:

[drahcir]

Yes H, that is exactly what war looks like - very good!

Here's what HHW "clipped" from the post he pretends to reply to. It
contains casualty figures from the NY Times - exactly what HHW cannot
and will not respond to. Those figures prove that, in spite of Hamas
cockroaches shooting from within and behind civilians, the militant to
civilian ratio is impressively high, contrary to the remarkably stupid
post from some unknown blogger that HHW provided to the group in this
subthread.

>By your dishonest standards the entire world demonizes Jews:

As usual, you allude to some phantom dishonesty of mine, but fail to
specify. What you DID you is of course COMPLETELY dishonest - you
snipped my evidence that you are an antisemitic moron and "think" you
can blithely continue with some irrelevancy. Sorry, not on my watch.

I'll replace what you don't have the courage to face, little child:

****

[HHW]

On Nov 19, 3:52 am, NoSpamAtAll <spam...@not.home> wrote:

> In article <k8copv$62...@dont-email.me>, Cedo <cedonul...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > until his sexual depravities are controlled.
>
> That's rich. aussie filth talking about sexual depravities...
>
>    http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=31983
>    "About 20 convicted Australian pedophiles unsuccessfully tried to
> travel to Indonesia and Thailand immediately after the Dec. 26 tsunami
> to prey on vulnerable children, a newspaper reported on Saturday."
>
>    http://www.uri.edu/artsci/wms/hughes/austral.htm
>    "Child prostitution in Australia was studied by ECPAT, which collected
> information from early 471 government and non-government agencies working
> with children. The study, the first of its kind, revealed a vicious cycle
> leading to child commercial sexual activities."
>
>    http://www.atimes.com/oceania/AC27Ah03.html
>    "It also confirmed suspicions the Pacific region has become a new target
> for Australian pedophiles fleeing police crackdowns on child sex offences
> at home and elsewhere in Asia."
>

>    http://www.theage.com.au/articles/2004/06/11/1086749893067.html?from=...

>    "Australian pedophiles are part of an organised crime ring preying on
> Thailand's vulnerable children, writes Mark Baker."

If this gentleman is even Australian, how do you connect him
personally with the information above? Explain what is obviously your
innuendo.

[HHW]

On Nov 18, 9:53 am, Count 1 <omnipitus2...@yahoo.ca> wrote:
> On 11/17/2012 4:20 PM, drahcir wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>

> > On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 07:48:26 -0700, Count 1 <omnipitus2...@yahoo.ca>

I'm pleased and flattered that you put me in such company.