Rabbinical Court Excommunicates Senator Lieberman
Noach
http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
--
***************************************************************************
Truth is stranger than fiction and Usenet is stranger than truth.
****************************************************************************
****************
Get Rebates for Shopping at Many Online Stores:
http://www.ebates.com/index.jsp?referrer=ocean...@mybizrate.com
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
: See:
: http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
He turned *me* into a newt.
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"an optimist is a guy/ that has never had/ much experience"
Colin Rosenthal
>In article <8tjrs9$cs7$1...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>, Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>
>: See:
>: http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
>He turned *me* into a newt.
No fair! I demand to be excommunicated too.
--
Colin Rosenthal
Astrophysics Institute
University of Oslo
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> See:
> http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
And besides a web-site what does this group have? How many "leading"
Rabbis Roshei Yeshiva are members? Somehow I am underwhelemed by the
whole story. <yawn>
> ***************************************************************************
> Truth is stranger than fiction and Usenet is stranger than truth.
> ****************************************************************************
Now _this_ .sig I really like.
Moshe Schorr
It is a tremendous Mitzvah to be happy always! - Reb Nachman of Breslov
Dr. Shlomo Argamon
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il writes:
>
> "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> writes:
> > See:
> > http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
> And besides a web-site what does this group have? How many "leading"
> Rabbis Roshei Yeshiva are members? Somehow I am underwhelemed by the
> whole story. <yawn>
Indeed. Who is on this "New York Torah Court Bet Din", anyway? They
further imply that they were involved in the `herem against
R. Mordechai Kaplan, when of course "Jews for Morality" didn't even
exist then. And what serious Orthodox Jewish group refers to
"Judeo-Christian civilization"?? Blech.
-Shlomo-
Eliot Shimoff
>
> See:
> http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
One wonders about the impact of such a press release.
If the press release specified some statements by Senator Lieberman that
were inconsistent with Judaism, it would at least have been educational,
and might conceivably have had some impact.
But a statement that some group of rabbis (the stature of which is,
to say the least, unknown to the public at large) has excommunicated
the Senator will either be ignored or will be one of those short
little column fillers that will make Jews in general look foolish.
--
Eliot Shimoff
UMBC Psychology
Baltimore, MD 21250
410 455-2973 (lab)
410 455-2567 (dept. office)
410 455-1055 (fax)
http://www.umbc.edu/~shimoff
shi...@umbc.edu
Lisa Beth
wrote:
>See:
>http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
Sure, and it'd be nice if he cared, but what's the authority behind
this?
Lisa
creedmoor_...@my-deja.com
"Noach" <noa...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> See:
> http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
Would this rabbinical court be similar to the one which I refer to from
time to time in my postings on SCI and SCJ; that is to say one which
operates out of a certain facility in Queens?
IS
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>
> : See:
> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
> He turned *me* into a newt.
Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
please explain "newt". TIA
Colin Rosenthal
><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>>
>> : See:
>> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>
>> He turned *me* into a newt.
>
>Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
>English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
>please explain "newt". TIA
"any of more than 40 species and 10 genera of salamanders constituting the
widely distributed family Salamandridae of the order Caudata."
It's a Monty Python thing. Think "witch-hunt". If that doesn't
work you _really_ really_ need to watch "Monty Python and the Holy
Grail".
Lisa Beth
><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>>
>> : See:
>> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>
>> He turned *me* into a newt.
>
>Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
>English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
>please explain "newt". TIA
It's a small lizard. Most dictionaries have the word.
It's a quote from Monty Python and the Holy Grail. A paraphrase,
rather.
HTH,
Lisa
--
I take responsibility:
I will be voting for Moshe Feiglin in the Likud primaries.
Ask me how you can, too.
Roger Williams
> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>> He turned *me* into a newt.
> Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
> English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
> please explain "newt". TIA
"Newt" is an English word, actually. It refers to amphibians in a
subset related to the salamander family (taxonomically speaking,
"salamandridae"). Some people call any predominantly aquatic salamander a
newt, but the distinctions can be fuzzy. I've kept certain species of newt
in captivity, and I can assure you, "newt" is a bonafide English word!
I don't think it means anything else in any other language.
Some information on newts and salamanders:
http://www.geocities.com/Heartland/Hills/9397/newtfaq.html
--
{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{} \|/
{} RogerW rog...@newsguy.com {} 0< -- parrot.net!
{} http://www.parrot.net ad...@parrot.net {} ^^^^(*)^^^^
{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{}{} ^^ / \ ^^
Hadass Eviatar
>
> In article <8tjrs9$cs7$1...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>, Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>
> : See:
> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
> He turned *me* into a newt.
Now, if he had turned you into a gringrich (what happened to him, BTW?),
I'd be *really* impressed.
Kol tuv, Hadass
--
Hadass Eviatar
Winnipeg, Canada
http://www.superhwy.net/~eviatar
Lisa Beth
Shlomo Argamon ) wrote:
The kind of group that Noach has made it clear he supports. I don't
know if you remember, but some of Noach's first posts on SCJ were ones
yelping about negative comments being made about Christianity. He's
since then lionized Daniel Lapin, a "rabbi" who believes the US is and
should be a Christian country, and that things are better for Jews
when Christians are running things. He's awfully big on Christianity
and loves the Falwell/Robertson/Buchanan axis. And Noach is a big fan
of his, for some reason.
Dan Kimmel
<mos...@mm.huji.ac.il> wrote in message
news:2000Oct3...@mm.huji.ac.il...
> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
> > Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
> >
> > : See:
> > : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
> >
> > He turned *me* into a newt.
>
> Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
> English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
> please explain "newt". TIA
I can't tell if your response is joking or serious. The "newt" line is a
reference to "Monty Python and the Holy Grail." In the "witch trial" scene
various people shout out accusations at the supposed witch. One person
declares, "She turned me into a newt. (Pause, as everyone realizes that it
is a human and not a salamander who said this; then, understated:). I got
better."
The One - Orgasmatron
> It's a small lizard.
Nope. Newts are amphibians. It's an important zoological distinction,
actually.
Lizards are classified as reptiles, a group that includes snakes,
lizards, turtles, crocodilians and tuataras. Amphibians are a group
that includes frogs, salamanders and newts, frogs and toads, and
caecilians.
Examples of a small lizard would be geckoes, anoles, or any number of
the species of legless lizards. Any similarity between salamanders or
newts and small lizards is purely coincidental (to steal a phrase).
soc.culture.jewish.moderated content? Um, ok. Let's see. Are there any
kosher reptiles? They're a delicacy in some cultures. Indeed - most taste
like chicken. From what I recall, though, they're not kosher. Then again,
certain locusts and grasshoppers are, so I'll let an expert answer the
question.
Simcha Streltsov
: Indeed. Who is on this "New York Torah Court Bet Din", anyway? They
and people called me hateful - in all years of Adar Rabbanut, I dont
think I ever excommunicated anyone!
--
Simcha Streltsov disclaimer, as requested by Mo-he S-rr
sim...@bu.edu all punctuation marks in this article
are equivalent to (-:
meirm...@erols.com
arg...@sunlightNOSPAM.cs.biu.ac.il (Dr. Shlomo Argamon ) posted:
>
>mos...@mm.huji.ac.il writes:
>
>>
>> "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> writes:
>> > See:
>> > http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>
>> And besides a web-site what does this group have? How many "leading"
>> Rabbis Roshei Yeshiva are members? Somehow I am underwhelemed by the
>> whole story. <yawn>
>
>Indeed. Who is on this "New York Torah Court Bet Din", anyway? They
It does seem like they should at least give the names of its members.
All they give is the name of a spokesman, and a contact name and
number, although the contact is part of Jews for Morality and not
necessarily a member of the court.
>further imply that they were involved in the `herem against
>R. Mordechai Kaplan, when of course "Jews for Morality" didn't even
>exist then.
I'm not sure it said that.
> And what serious Orthodox Jewish group refers to
>"Judeo-Christian civilization"?? Blech.
I couldn't find that phrase either.
But I do think it was nice that they "declared" that an excommunicated
Jew still remains a Jew. :)
>
> -Shlomo-
mei...@QQQerols.com
e-mail by removing QQQ
Colin Rosenthal
>In soc.culture.jewish.moderated on 31 Oct 2000 13:39:47 GMT
>arg...@sunlightNOSPAM.cs.biu.ac.il (Dr. Shlomo Argamon ) posted:
>> And what serious Orthodox Jewish group refers to
>>"Judeo-Christian civilization"?? Blech.
>
>I couldn't find that phrase either.
It's on their front page :- "concerning the kulturkampf of secular
humanism against Judeo-Christian civilization."
Charming choice of words.
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> mos...@mm.huji.ac.il <mos...@mm.huji.ac.il> wrote:
>><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>>> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>>>
>>> : See:
>>> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>>
>>> He turned *me* into a newt.
>>
>>Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
>>English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
>>please explain "newt". TIA
>
> "any of more than 40 species and 10 genera of salamanders constituting
> the widely distributed family Salamandridae of the order Caudata."
Thanks Colin. _Most_ of the words you used, I do understand. I just
don't understand the comparison between excomunicated and a salamander.
Maybe that's what you're addressing in the secon part of your post.
> It's a Monty Python thing. Think "witch-hunt". If that doesn't
> work you _really_ really_ need to watch "Monty Python and the Holy
> Grail".
Thanks Colin, for the advice, but I pass. Part of my intention in my
post, besides trying to understand "newt" was to point out how _many_
people use an "esoteric" term and assume everyone will understand it.
I suppose that's a normal human condition. But if someone uses a
Hebrew phrase or quotes the Torah, s/he gets blasted for _daring_ to
use non-English words. Does "double standard" seem relevant?
Thanks again.
Lisa Beth
"Newt" is standard English. The context made it understandable only
to people who shared a certain cultural background. It's like posting
a "Who's On First" joke. No one who hasn't seen the classic Abbot and
Costello routine or at least heard of it is going to get it. But it's
not the same as using jargon.
I use jargon. Because often it's the only way to attain clarity. But
your analogy is incorrect, and there is no double standard here
whatsoever.
"Newt" is not an esoteric term.
Sheldon Glickler
"Simcha Streltsov" <sim...@bu.edu> wrote in message
news:8tnfij$e26$3...@news3.bu.edu...
> Dr. Shlomo Argamon (arg...@sunlightNOSPAM.cs.biu.ac.il) wrote:
>
> : Indeed. Who is on this "New York Torah Court Bet Din", anyway? They
>
> and people called me hateful - in all years of Adar Rabbanut, I dont
> think I ever excommunicated anyone!
Let it be known publicly that I am not part of that group of "people". I
can call Simcha many things, but I would not include "hateful" among them.
<g>
Shelly
Sheldon Glickler
<mos...@mm.huji.ac.il> wrote in message
news:2000Nov...@mm.huji.ac.il...
>
> Thanks Colin, for the advice, but I pass. Part of my intention in my
> post, besides trying to understand "newt" was to point out how _many_
> people use an "esoteric" term and assume everyone will understand it.
> I suppose that's a normal human condition. But if someone uses a
> Hebrew phrase or quotes the Torah, s/he gets blasted for _daring_ to
> use non-English words. Does "double standard" seem relevant?
No, not really. When it comes to a Hebrew phrase the presumption must be
that most people in the world and that most people on this news group will
**not** understand the term. We simply do not know Hebrew, and some of us
know some words only from repeated exposure. On the other hand, all English
words are fair game (if they are in the dictionary) as that is the language
of this news group and the presumption must be that all will understand
them.
Granted, when it comes to a cultural reference that may not be the case.
Here we get into the realm of people in the US and the UK presuming that the
rest of the English speaking world will understand the reference as, <g>of
course<g>, they are also familiar with the culture. While this may be a
little bit of "snobbery" or "elitism", in a small sense it is also somewhat
warranted as the non-US/UK English speaking world **is** much more familiar
with those cultures than they often care to admit.
Well, Moshe, at least you can take some small comfort in that I also did not
understand the connection with "newt" as I have watched very little Monty
Python.
Shelly
Noach
news:slrn8vvo34...@toliman.uio.no...
> It's on their front page :- "concerning the kulturkampf of secular
> humanism against Judeo-Christian civilization."
>
> Charming choice of words.
When fighting a bitter cultural war against vicious enemies it is often
difficult, if not impossible, to be charming.
Noach
"Sheldon Glickler" <sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote in message
news:8tpajp$ke4$1...@condor.nj.org...
> Well, Moshe, at least you can take some small comfort in that I also did
not
> understand the connection with "newt" as I have watched very little Monty
> Python.
Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
--
Patrick J. Buchanan would be the only decent choice for president...if not
for his anti-Jewish baggage.
Get Rebates for Shopping at Many Online Stores:
http://www.ebates.com/index.jsp?referrer=ocean...@mybizrate.com
Benefit your favorite charity from shopping online:
http://igive.com and http://shop2give.com
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
: "Sheldon Glickler" <sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote in message
: news:8tpajp$ke4$1...@condor.nj.org...
:> Well, Moshe, at least you can take some small comfort in that I also did
:> not understand the connection with "newt" as I have watched very little
:> Monty Python.
: Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
Monty Python was considerably less "low comedy" than Benny Hill, but you
would have found it equally offensive. Even without their Sam Peckinpah
version of Julian Slade's "Salad Days."
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system
of government."
Dan Kimmel
> > mos...@mm.huji.ac.il <mos...@mm.huji.ac.il> wrote:
> >><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
> >>> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> : See:
> >>> :
http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
> >>>
> >>> He turned *me* into a newt.
> >>
<snip>
>
> > It's a Monty Python thing. Think "witch-hunt". If that doesn't
> > work you _really_ really_ need to watch "Monty Python and the Holy
> > Grail".
>
> Thanks Colin, for the advice, but I pass. Part of my intention in my
> post, besides trying to understand "newt" was to point out how _many_
> people use an "esoteric" term and assume everyone will understand it.
> I suppose that's a normal human condition. But if someone uses a
> Hebrew phrase or quotes the Torah, s/he gets blasted for _daring_ to
> use non-English words. Does "double standard" seem relevant?
No one should be "blasted" for using a Hebrew phrase in a Jewish newsgroup,
but since not everyone here is fluent in Hebrew it is a matter of courtesy
to translate or, at the very least, to not take offense when someone says,
"Huh? What does that mean?"
But you're right that sometimes the discussion REQUIRES the use of Hebrew.
Of course we'll all differ on when that requirement arises. :)
Jordi Sod
Noach, the last time I checked, I was not a vicious enemy of yours,
and I do consider myself something of a secular humanist.
The last time I checked, I just wanted to be able to live in
a place where free thought, free expression, free movement, etc.
is protected.
BTW, how can I get in touch with the NY Torah Court - Beit Din?
I want to be excommunicated. No, my LOR won't do it -- I want
a _bogus_ excommunication only, one I can laugh at, please.
Also, it would be an honor to be in a select group together
with R. Mordecai M. Kaplan, a fine Jewish thinker and AFAIK
a nice guy as well.
--
Jordi Sod,
member of the Menschliches Kulturkampf Sonderkommando
Sheldon Glickler
"Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote in message
news:8tpeqk$m6j$1...@slb0.atl.mindspring.net...
>
>
>
> "Sheldon Glickler" <sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote in message
> news:8tpajp$ke4$1...@condor.nj.org...
>
> > Well, Moshe, at least you can take some small comfort in that I also did
> not
> > understand the connection with "newt" as I have watched very little
Monty
> > Python.
>
> Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
No, not in the least. His stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with messages)".
Hill's stuff is sexual.
Shelly
>
> --
> Patrick J. Buchanan would be the only decent choice for president...if not
> for his anti-Jewish baggage.
....and anti-any-minority baggage.....and nazi-like
speeches....and....and....and....
He is by **far** the worst and most dangerous of the lot.
Shelly
Jordi Sod
"Noach" <noa...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> See:
> http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
I would encourage folks to browse through this site, in order
to understand the context of the above link.
Here's a small taste of the treasures you'll find there:
From http://www.jewsformorality.org/immigration.htm :
" There is no obligation to grant full voting rights and citizenship
to pagan peoples who still accept such barbaric practices as
infanticide, forced abortion, worshipping cows, and voodoo witchcraft.
There is no obligation for the American people to commit national
suicide in favor of third-world heathens. "
No comments.
>
> --
>
************************************************************************
***
> Truth is stranger than fiction and Usenet is stranger than truth.
>
************************************************************************
****
> ****************
> Get Rebates for Shopping at Many Online Stores:
> http://www.ebates.com/index.jsp?referrer=ocean...@mybizrate.com
>
--
Jordi Sod
Simcha Streltsov
: yelping about negative comments being made about Christianity. He's
: since then lionized Daniel Lapin, a "rabbi" who believes the US is and
: should be a Christian country, and that things are better for Jews
should we go thru another cycle about the quotation marks about the titles?
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
:> Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
:
: No, not in the least. His [sic] stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with messages)".
: Hill's stuff is sexual.
You have obviously never seen Monty Python's "Ken Russell's Gardening
Club" or "Pasolini's the Third Test Match" or the Dirty Vicar sketch
or the Summarize Proust Competition. . .
Hadass Eviatar
>
> "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote in message
> news:8tpeqk$m6j$1...@slb0.atl.mindspring.net...
>
> No, not in the least. His stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with messages)".
> Hill's stuff is sexual.
Oooh, Shelly, since you admit to having watched very little Monty
Python, I wouldn't post about them (not him). They can be VERY sexual
8-).
I admit the newt went by me, too. It's been too many years since I saw
The Holy Grail. I do remember the rabbit, though, and of course the
knights who say Ni.
Hadass Eviatar
I second this motion. Dr. Streltsov is many things, but not, generally,
hateful.
Sheldon Glickler
are off topic here.
]
<sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> wrote in message
news:8tpnle$760$1...@news.huji.ac.il...
> In article <8tplq5$ni6$1...@condor.nj.org>, Sheldon Glickler
<sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>
> :> Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
> :
> : No, not in the least. His [sic] stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with
messages)".
> : Hill's stuff is sexual.
>
> You have obviously never seen Monty Python's "Ken Russell's Gardening
> Club" or "Pasolini's the Third Test Match" or the Dirty Vicar sketch
> or the Summarize Proust Competition. . .
You are correct. I stated earlier that I didn't watch much of Monty Python.
I spoke from what I had seen (like the knight who loses a limb at a time).
By contrast, Hill's stuff is basically all T&A.
Shelly
med...@shore.net
> "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote in message
>> Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
> No, not in the least. His stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with messages)".
> Hill's stuff is sexual.
1. There is no "he" - Monty Python is not a person.
2. MP's "stuff" can be just as vulgar as Benny Hill's - but is much
funnier, IMO.
toi...@my-deja.com
"Noach" <noa...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> See:
> http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
I suppose most people here consider me a narrow minded ultra orthodox
fanatic. Well let me say, that I and all my fellow orthodox fanatics
consider this excommunication a farce. The only thing this
excommunication succeeded in doing is to make Orthodox Judaism look
stupid. If Lieberman had any back bone he would say that the
excommunication should go back to its sender, which is standard
procedure when somebody has been excommunicated unjustly and would
result in these so called rabbis being in excommunication themselves.
toichen
Jordi Sod
toi...@my-deja.com wrote:
> In article <8tjrs9$cs7$1...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>,
> "Noach" <noa...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> > See:
> >
http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
> I suppose most people here consider me a narrow minded ultra orthodox
> fanatic. Well let me say, that I and all my fellow orthodox fanatics
Narrow minded? Not for me to say. Literal minded? Perhaps.
Othodox? Sure.
Fanatic? Not particularly. Fanatics tend to be overly nasty.
You are not overly so... even though Ms. Matsumoto and I are still
waiting for your apology.
> consider this excommunication a farce. The only thing this
> excommunication succeeded in doing is to make Orthodox Judaism look
> stupid. If Lieberman had any back bone he would say that the
Amen.
> excommunication should go back to its sender, which is standard
> procedure when somebody has been excommunicated unjustly and would
> result in these so called rabbis being in excommunication themselves.
Or he could ignore it altogether. Why should he answer a group
of bufoons? If he ends up becoming V.P. he should stick to
important issues. As for jewsformorality.org (or shall I say
jewsformortality.org ?), no flaming from an internet site that
endorses Pat Buchanan can hurt him.
> toichen
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
--
Jordi Sod,
who doesn't ignore the group of bufoons mentioned above because
he is relaxing on a Heathen Mexican Holiday. So there.
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> mos...@mm.huji.ac.il wrote:
>><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>>> Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>>>
>>> : See:
>>> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>>
>>> He turned *me* into a newt.
>>
>>English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
>>please explain "newt". TIA
>
>
> It's a quote from Monty Python and the Holy Grail. A paraphrase,
> rather.
Thanks.
But that brings up a different point. References to Monty Python seem
to be acceptible, but G-fobid you should say a word in Hebrew without
translating.
Moshe Schorr (Posting in Don Quixote mode)
Colin Rosenthal
Jordi Sod <jord...@my-deja.com> wrote:
>BTW, how can I get in touch with the NY Torah Court - Beit Din?
>I want to be excommunicated. No, my LOR won't do it -- I want
>a _bogus_ excommunication only, one I can laugh at, please.
>Also, it would be an honor to be in a select group together
>with R. Mordecai M. Kaplan, a fine Jewish thinker and AFAIK
>a nice guy as well.
Their email is spok...@jewsformorality.org . I have sent them
the following application:
Dear Sir,
I wish to apply to be excommunicated by the New York Torah Court. I
have read of your recent cherem against Senator Lieberman and feel
that I am at least as well qualified for excommunication as he is. I
am a halchically born Jew who self-identifies as a secular humanist.
My family have always attended, and continue to attend, Orthodox
synagogues in the areas in which they live.
I have consistently supported, and actively campaigned for, both gay
rights and abortion rights, and have been a member of a political
party which supported public ownership of the means of production,
distribution, and exchange. I lead an entirely secular lifestyle.
Unlike Sen. Lieberman I did not attend shul during any of the recent
Yom Tovim. Neither did I fast on Yom Kippur. I have publicly and
flagrantly violated shabbat on numerous occasions. I also live
openly with my non-Jewish girlfriend.
It is, frankly, shameful that I have not been seen fit to be placed under
a cherem when an apparently committed and practising Jew such as
Sen. Lieberman is catapulted to the front of the excommunication
queue. One is tempted to suggest that Sen. Lieberman's special
treatment arises solely from his public position, although it is
hard to imagine any rabbinical court being swayed by such
purely-secular concerns.
I await the Court's decision at your earliest convenience.
I remain your humble and obedient servant,
Colin Rosenthal
(Hebrew name, Kalman Shmariahu ben Zelek)
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
:> You have obviously never seen Monty Python's "Ken Russell's Gardening
:> Club" or "Pasolini's the Third Test Match" or the Dirty Vicar sketch
:> or the Summarize Proust Competition. . .
: You are correct. I stated earlier that I didn't watch much of Monty Python.
: I spoke from what I had seen (like the knight who loses a limb at a time).
: By contrast, Hill's stuff is basically all T&A.
Apparently, the take-home message, namely, that when you don't know what
you are talking about, it's time to stop talking, has yet to sink in.
But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman, who
is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"French bread makes very good skis"
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
: But that brings up a different point. References to Monty Python seem
: to be acceptible, but G-fobid you should say a word in Hebrew without
: translating.
Frankly, I for one refuse to lower myself to some sort of common
denominator and only allude to things that everyone is guaranteed
to understand. The reason that I think that one should translate Hebrew
is that the purpose of the group is for discussion of things Jewish;
translating Hebrew terms is a positive step toward making that goal
easier for people with less Jewish education. On the other hand, the
primary purpose of this group is *not* general education of the masses.
Thus, if I allude to Monty Python or to F. Scott Fitzgerald, I am not
going to take the time to point out the allusion -- if you get it, you
get it; if you don't, you don't, but you can ask if you are curious.
Thus, if I write "binot deshe yarbitzeni," I will translate it to
"he maketh me to lie down in green pastures," but if I write "he maketh
me to lie down in green pastures," I am not necessarily going to give
the source of the quotation (of course I might, depending on the context).
Incidentally, if there are any people out there who *don't* recognize the
above quotation, don't feel bad. Once, an English TV program was shown
in Israel that quoted the above line, and the person doing the subtitles,
instead of providing the Biblical quote in Hebrew, chose instead to
write something like "yashkiv oti bisdeh yaroq," which is a literal back
translation. (I'm not sure about the "yashkiv oti," but they definitely
used "s'deh yaroq" in place of "binot deshe.")
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"I love people. But I don't suffer fools gladly."
-- Deborah Lipstadt
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> arg...@sunlightNOSPAM.cs.biu.ac.il (Dr. Shlomo Argamon ) wrote:
>>mos...@mm.huji.ac.il writes:
>>> "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> writes:
>
>>> > See:
>>> > http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>>>
>>> And besides a web-site what does this group have? How many "leading"
>>> Rabbis Roshei Yeshiva are members? Somehow I am underwhelemed by the
>>> whole story. <yawn>
>>
>>R. Mordechai Kaplan, when of course "Jews for Morality" didn't even
>>"Judeo-Christian civilization"?? Blech.
I was wondering where you got that quote. It's not on the page Noach
cited. Then I went to their home page and sure enough. In rather
small letters, right at the top. <sigh>
> The kind of group that Noach has made it clear he supports. I don't
> know if you remember, but some of Noach's first posts on SCJ were ones
> yelping about negative comments being made about Christianity. He's
> since then lionized Daniel Lapin, a "rabbi" who believes the US is and
> should be a Christian country, and that things are better for Jews
> when Christians are running things. He's awfully big on Christianity
> and loves the Falwell/Robertson/Buchanan axis. And Noach is a big fan
> of his, for some reason.
Lisa, you keep insinuating about Noach. I refuse to believe them.
Just because Christians say something it doesn't mean Jews must say
the exact opposite.
Moshe Schorr
meirm...@erols.com
<sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> posted:
>In article <8tppjb$oc7$1...@condor.nj.org>, Sheldon Glickler <sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote:
>
>:> You have obviously never seen Monty Python's "Ken Russell's Gardening
>:> Club" or "Pasolini's the Third Test Match" or the Dirty Vicar sketch
>:> or the Summarize Proust Competition. . .
>
>: You are correct. I stated earlier that I didn't watch much of Monty Python.
>: I spoke from what I had seen (like the knight who loses a limb at a time).
>: By contrast, Hill's stuff is basically all T&A.
>
>Apparently, the take-home message, namely, that when you don't know what
>you are talking about, it's time to stop talking, has yet to sink in.
>
>But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
>a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
>God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
>British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
>Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman, who
>is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
>in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
>
ali g: real name sacha baron cohen. ali g shot to fame on english
channel 4's 11 o'clock show as spoof artist--he embarrassed public
figures by interviewing them.
bud flanagan: he was one of the most popular english comedians
before wwii (with his partner chesney allen). he and his partner
dressed up like tramps. a song flanagan wrote "underneath the arches"
was the english musical hall signature tune of its day, and perhaps of
all time. (its about tramps sleeping outdoors). later he was in a
popular group called "the crazy gang". born bud weinthrop. he's one of
those guys on the "sgt. pepper" album cover that most americans
say--wonder who that is?
david baddiel: english jewish comedian and author who is
extremely well-known in britain, but hardly known in the us. he is
seen as something of a voice for "gen-x'ers". he started in a comedy
duo and was on two high rated bbc comedy programs. later became
the co-host of the popular bbc program "fantasy football". he is the
author of the outrageous comedy novel "time for bed".
jerry sadowitz: scottish jewish comedian who is a television star
in britain--known for his savage wit. and you maybe thought there were
no jews in scotland?
jo brand: british female stand-up who has twice won competitions
for best comedian in britain. should come over to the states.
lenny beige: the stage name of steve furst. "lenny beige" is a
huge hit in britain. furst appears as this character on the bbc and in
personal appearances. from what we can gather, he dresses and acts
likes an old fashioned '60's lounge lizard in velvet jackets and
carries it off exceedingly well. (mr. beige is supposed to be jewish).
robin williams and others have lined-up to appear with lenny. if you
visit the beige web site you will find a wonderful coincidence: there
is a game to pick the jewish entertainer from several choices.
its called jew who?
[funny because this is all from www.jewhoo.com It's incredible how
many people turn out to be Jews.]
ruby wax: american-born comedienne who has parlayed her "jewish"
persona into a highly successful tv career in britain
At least one print source the webpage looked at said that Benny Hill
was Jewish but he wasn't.
Your Maurine Lipman shows up as an English actress but not as a
comedian, so I may have missed some others like that too. I
searched under England English Britain & British and I got added
entries in each search. If there is another way to say Britain, maybe
there are more.
ben elton: british comedian. writer for "blackadder" and "the
young ones."
martin lewis: british-american comedian (monologues include
"great exploitations!" and "oy to the world! (a very jewish
christmas)", producer of numerous entertainment tv shows and music
videos, such as "the secret policeman's other ball," tv commentator
and celebrity interviewer, self-described beatles historian,
relentless self-promoter. has said, "there are very, very few
british-jewish humorists in the 323 area code."
stephen fry: british comic, actor, and author best known for
starring in the "black adder" television series. see actors. mother,
jewish.
You can search their files on any set of words.
Here is a short answer to a question I asked months ago related to
Lieberman:
pierre mendes-france: mendes-france was an important figure in
french politics virtually his entire life. born in 1907, he became a
the radical socialist member of parliament in the '30s. (despite its
name, the party was not that radical or socialist). he opposed the
rise of nazi germany and the appeasment policy. he escaped to england
in 1941 and allied himself with degaulle during the war. mendes-france
was elected prime minister in 1954 with a huge majority and ended
french involvement in the indochina war. he was defeated in 1955 over
disagreements about french colonies in n. africa. but he remained an
important figure in french politics and he was known for his
consistent and vocal support of the state of israel. he died in 1982
It doesn't say how observant he was, but it seems he surely identified
as a Jew. And the next one too.
rene mayer: mayer served as premier of france from january to
may, 1953. a wwi veteran, he joined the resistance during wwii. after
the war, he served as finance and justice minister in various
governments. from 1955 to 1958, mayer served as head of the eur. coal
& steel community--a forerunner of the common market. he was active in
the jewish community
>-----
>Richard Schultz
mei...@QQQerols.com
e-mail by removing QQQ
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> <mos...@mm.huji.ac.il> wrote in message
>> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
>> > Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>> >
>> > : See:
>> > : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>> >
>> > He turned *me* into a newt.
>>
>> Richard, the language of this NG is English. Just because you used
>> English letters, doesn't mean you used English words. Could you
>> please explain "newt". TIA
>
Unfortunately, it was perfectly serious. Living in Israel has
permanently defiled my wellsprings of English <but I'm not sorry I
live here!>
This question of mine has generated more responses and e-mails than
anything else I can recall. (But I have a poor memory)
> The "newt" line is a reference to "Monty Python and the Holy Grail."
_Many_ people have told me this. You are the first to explain it.
> In the "witch trial" scene various people shout out accusations
> at the supposed witch. One person declares, "She turned me into
> a newt. (Pause, as everyone realizes that it is a human and not a
> salamander who said this; then, understated:). I got better."
Cute.
What I see as a sad commentary on our SCJM "community" is that a
Monty Python quotation is immediately recognized, yet often when
someone uses a word of Hebrew s/he is villified for not writing
English.
Moshe Schorr (in Don Quixote mode)
Jordi Sod
> What I see as a sad commentary on our SCJM "community" is that a
> Monty Python quotation is immediately recognized, yet often when
> someone uses a word of Hebrew s/he is villified for not writing
> English.
Actually, all of the participants in the Monty Python discussion
have some inklings of Hebrew -- and at least one of them is
an Orthodox Israeli, so don't despair.
>
> Moshe Schorr (in Don Quixote mode)
Moshe, that's Sancho Panza mode. Reb Quixotele, the idealist,
would assume that all people would know their Hebrew.
> It is a tremendous Mitzvah to be happy always! - Reb Nachman of
Breslov
>
--
Jordi Sod
James Kahn
>But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
>a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
>God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
>British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
>Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman, who
>is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
>in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
Somehow I had the idea that Tracy Ullman is Jewish. There's a comedian
who is famous in the UK (twice won the "Best Comedian in Britain" award)
named Jo Brand. There are those who insist that Charlie Chaplin
was Jewish, though I've yet to see hard evidence for (other
than the fact that he was very funny) or against.
--
Jim
New York, NY
(Please remove "nospam." to get my e-mail address)
http://www.panix.com/~kahn
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
:
: stephen fry: british comic, actor, and author best known for
: starring in the "black adder" television series. see actors. mother,
: jewish.
I forgot about him. He's also written three very funny novels (which are
not recommended for the easily offended).
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"How many boards would the Mongols hoard if the Mongol hordes got bored?"
Henry Goodman
"James Kahn" <ka...@nospam.panix.com> wrote in message
news:8truoc$8pt$1...@panix6.panix.com...
Rory Bremner
Vic Oliver
Ben Elton
Max Miller
Bud Flanagan
Bernie Winters
--
Henry Goodman
henry....@virgin.net
Dan Kimmel
<meirm...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:fta20t0bmgug5mm12...@4ax.com...
> stephen fry: british comic, actor, and author best known for
> starring in the "black adder" television series. see actors. mother,
> jewish.
Of the whole list he's the only one whose work I've actually seen. Very
funny, and quite a good actor, too. I interviewed him when he was promoting
a film in which he played Oscar Wilde. He often appears (as he did in
"Black Adder") with his writing/performing partner Hugh Laurie. They both
have solo careers now, but they still work together.
Dan Kimmel
> > The "newt" line is a reference to "Monty Python and the Holy Grail."
>
> _Many_ people have told me this. You are the first to explain it.
>
> > In the "witch trial" scene various people shout out accusations
> > at the supposed witch. One person declares, "She turned me into
> > a newt. (Pause, as everyone realizes that it is a human and not a
> > salamander who said this; then, understated:). I got better."
>
> Cute.
>
> What I see as a sad commentary on our SCJM "community" is that a
> Monty Python quotation is immediately recognized, yet often when
> someone uses a word of Hebrew s/he is villified for not writing
> English.
>
> Moshe Schorr (in Don Quixote mode)
> It is a tremendous Mitzvah to be happy always! - Reb Nachman of Breslov
Well, if I can play Sancho for a moment, I think that reflects the nature of
the 'net. While I think it's wonderful that this newsgroup is drawing
people from other countries like Israel and Norway, it's a primarily
American group, and there will be inevitable American references (even to
popular British comedies). As someone else noted, if you don't get it, just
ask.
Since we're communicating in English here, it's just a courtesy to not write
at length in another language without helping out those of us not fluent in
it. Now it's unlikely that anyone will "vilify" you for referring to "Adon
Olom" without translation (but watch out for the Transliteration Police!),
but if you're giving us a passage that is not generally familiar, then why
NOT translate it? Presumably you WANT to be understood.
And if you assume everyone should know it and one or more of us don't, no
problem. Someone will ask and you or someone else will translate. And any
one who "vilifies" you for that should be sent to that New York "court" for
a good working over. :)
Dan Kimmel
Ah, another example of the hilarity that is associated with the Scandinavian
nations the world over. :)
Thanks for starting my day off with a good laugh!
Lisa Beth
Rosenthal) wrote:
Well, as much as I can't do anything but condemn the secular and
communist stuff, I think this letter totally rocks.
Lisa
Brett Weiss
too late, Russell, could you possible remove it?
Take care.
Brett
law...@erols.com
http://www.erols.com/lawyer
----- Original Message -----
From: "Noach" <azur...@mindspring.com>
To: "SCJM Submissions" <sc...@scjm.nj.org>; "SCJM Moderators"
<scjm-mo...@scjm.nj.org>
Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2000 3:14 PM
Subject: Fw: Rabbinical Court Excommunicates Senator Lieberman
>
> Please do not post this last msge. of mine.
>
> Thank you.
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Noach" <add...@reply-to.is.accurate>
> Newsgroups: soc.culture.jewish.moderated
> Sent: Thursday, November 02, 2000 3:08 PM
> Subject: Re: Rabbinical Court Excommunicates Senator Lieberman
>
>
> >
> > "Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
> > news:3A006838...@superhwy.net...
> > > Sheldon Glickler wrote:
> >
> > > > Let it be known publicly that I am not part of that group of
"people".
> > I
> > > > can call Simcha many things, but I would not include "hateful" among
> > them.
> > > > <g>
> > >
> > > I second this motion. Dr. Streltsov is many things, but not,
generally,
> > > hateful.
> >
> > Have you forgetten, _I'm_ the hateful (and evil) one?
> >
> >
> > --
> > Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
> > G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
Brett Weiss
--
Brett
> > > Was Monty Python as vulgar as Benny Hill?
> >
> > No, not in the least. His stuff is (IMO) "silly (but with messages)".
> > Hill's stuff is sexual.
>
> Um, Python isn't a "he" but a "they." It was the name of a comedy troupe
of
> five Brits and one American (animator turned director Terry Gilliam).
meirm...@erols.com
jjb...@panix.com (Jonathan J. Baker) posted:
>In <> meirm...@erols.com writes:
>><sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> posted:
>
>>>But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
>>>a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
>>>God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
>
>Watching the Friars Club Roast last night (of Rob Reiner) was fascinating:
>almost everyone there was Jewish. Alan King read a fax allegedly from
>Sen. Lieberman congratulating Reiner in Yiddish, and practically everyone
>got it (including me, so the yiddish was not too hard - I know very little).
>
>>>British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
>>>Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman, who
>>>is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
>>>in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
>
>
>> ali g: real name sacha baron cohen. ali g shot to fame on english
>> bud flanagan: he was one of the most popular english comedians
>> david baddiel: english jewish comedian and author who is
>> jerry sadowitz: scottish jewish comedian who is a television star
>> jo brand: british female stand-up who has twice won competitions
>> lenny beige: the stage name of steve furst. "lenny beige" is a
>> ruby wax: american-born comedienne who has parlayed her "jewish"
>>Your Maurine Lipman shows up as an English actress but not as a
>> ben elton: british comedian. writer for "blackadder" and "the
>> martin lewis: british-american comedian (monologues include
>> stephen fry: british comic, actor, and author best known for
>
>None of whom I've heard of on this side of the pond.
>
Me neither, except for the French premiers. :)
>How about Tracy Ullman? She's Jewish & English, but has made a big
>name for herself over here.
This is what it says about her,
tracey ullman: not jewish. for informational purposes.
multi-talented star (tracey ullman show). in ullman's autobiography,
she states that her paternal grandmother may be a convert from judaism
to christianity. her father, who died when she was young, was an
immigrant from poland. mother, not jewish.
It also doesn't mention England, so I didn't find it the first time.
BTW, to anyone, I know Colin is from Scotland, I was only quoting the
website.
meirm...@erols.com
ka...@nospam.panix.com (James Kahn) posted:
>
>Somehow I had the idea that Tracy Ullman is Jewish. There's a comedian
See other post
>who is famous in the UK (twice won the "Best Comedian in Britain" award)
>named Jo Brand. There are those who insist that Charlie Chaplin
>was Jewish, though I've yet to see hard evidence for (other
>than the fact that he was very funny) or against.
Both of these entries are quite interesting www.jewhoo.com :
ben affleck: not jewish. heads the top twenty-plus of commonly or
sometimes assumed- but not jewish along with charlie chaplin/jennifer
aniston/bill gates/george m. cohan/walt weiss/norman jewison/ethel
merman/ rod carew/sandra bullock/julia roberts/darryl zanuck/david
shipler/bruce springsteen/mark wahlberg/david letterman/iggy pop/max
planck/pete rose/ringo star/jon voight/john lennon/charlize
thereon/molly ringwald/john goodman/embetz davidtz/(giggle)- pamela
anderson/marilyn manson/sharon stone/renee zellwegger.
[I was sure Ethel Merman, born Mermelstein, was. One poster here
thought I was female and I assume he was confusing me with her, so
I've felt a special connection. meirman]
charlie chaplin: not jewish. his biographers have gone over his
past and it is clear that chaplin was not remotely jewish. he was,
however, on a nazi list of persons to be arrested immediately in the
event of a successful wwii invasion. "the great dictator",
chaplin's satire, ruffled some feathers. final word: chaplin mentions
no jewish ancestry in his autobiography. his recent biographers have
found no such ancestry despite pretty massive digging. is it possible
that he had some jewish ancestry? of course it is possible. i have
been cited a quote from one memoir in which he supposedly said "i'm
jewish"--this contrasts with a quote from another memoir in which he
said he "wasn't". so, what we are left with is one quote versus
everything else. just look at this way--in the common sense of
being jewish--raised by a clearly jewish parent(s)--with a sense of
jewishness--chaplin was not jewish. whether he had some jewish
ancestry will never be resolved to an absolute certainty. and while it
may seem odd in the context of jewhoo, we find the debate beyond
tedious at this point. chaplin was a staunch opponent of fascism and
an enemy of prejudice. let's just call him a citizen of the world and
leave it at that.
meirm...@erols.com
meirm...@erols.com posted:
>Both of these entries are quite interesting www.jewhoo.com :
This site covers scientists and politicians and everyone. I'm only
giving entertainers.
>
> ben affleck: not jewish. heads the top twenty-plus of commonly or
>sometimes assumed- but not jewish along with charlie chaplin/jennifer
>aniston/bill gates/george m. cohan/walt weiss/norman jewison/ethel
>merman/ rod carew/sandra bullock/julia roberts/darryl zanuck/david
>shipler/bruce springsteen/mark wahlberg/david letterman/iggy pop/max
>planck/pete rose/ringo star/jon voight/john lennon/charlize
>thereon/molly ringwald/john goodman/embetz davidtz/(giggle)- pamela
>anderson/marilyn manson/sharon stone/renee zellwegger.
>
>[I was sure Ethel Merman, born Mermelstein, was. One poster here
>thought I was female and I assume he was confusing me with her, so
>I've felt a special connection. meirman]
>
adam sandler: [Jewish,] became well-known as a cast member of
saturday night live. his somewhat to very silly movies (the
"waterboy", etc.) have done huge box office. his chanukah songs are
great but we wish he would consult jewhoo before making any more
mistakes like saying rod carew converted (there are five other factual
mistakes by our count). sandler grew up in a nice jewish home in new
hampshire, the son of stan and judy.
rod carew: this great panama born baseball player was long
rumored to have converted to judaism following his marriage to a
jewish woman. he recently confirmed he never converted in an interview
with minnesota-based american jewish world. a pity; not many great
jewish and black players. his children have been raised jewish. adam
sandler simply got it wrong in his hannukah song.
[this guy keeps his old text, appending corrections. So Ernest
Borgnine is complicated.]
ethel merman: not jewish. often assumed to be but was not. born
and raised lutheran. her husband of 32 days (who was in her weight
class) was ernest borgnine. apparently some list floats around the web
that says he is jewish. his real name is ermes effron borgino, and he
is the son of southern italian immigrants. while "effron" is curious,
it is extremely unlikely that he is jewish given the tiny number of
italian jewish immigrants to america. especially from the south of
italy. update: well, we were contacted by a relative of borgnine's
second wife (after merman) who confirmed that borgnine did indeed
convert to judaism when he married the relative in the '50's. this
fact is hardly known and the web list we have seen mis-spells his
"real" name to sound much more "jewish". but, in a weird way, we stand
corrected.
darryl zanuck: famous as the most famous non-jewish hollywood
mogul of the golden age. head of 20th century fox. zanuck was once
refused admission to a hotel that would not admit jews because the
hotel thought he was jewish. by the way, such discrimination was
perfectly legal in most of the united states until the civil rights
act of 1965.
The paragraph above is the ones who aren't Jewish. Just about
everyone else we think is, is, I guess, plus plenty more I've never
guessed.
R. S. Y. Buchanan
>Can anyone out there in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
Alexei Sayle, who used to play the entire Balowski family as well
as Benito Mussolini on "The Young Ones," and who later had several
shows of his own, but who most Americans only know as the Sultan
from "Indian Jones and the Last Crusade."
scott
--
R. S. Y. Buchanan | "The English have no respect for their language
yeho...@world.std.com | and will not teach their children to speak it."
world.std.com/~yehoshua | -- G. B. Shaw
Colin Rosenthal
>
>"Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
>news:3A006838...@superhwy.net...
>> Sheldon Glickler wrote:
>
>> > Let it be known publicly that I am not part of that group of "people".
>I
>> > can call Simcha many things, but I would not include "hateful" among
>them.
>> > <g>
>>
>> I second this motion. Dr. Streltsov is many things, but not, generally,
>> hateful.
>
>Have you forgetten, _I'm_ the hateful (and evil) one?
That depends. Do you support the proposition advanced by your friends
at JewsForMorality that hindus should not be allowed to vote?
Susan Cohen
Dan Kimmel wrote:
> "James Kahn" <ka...@nospam.panix.com> wrote in message
> news:8truoc$8pt$1...@panix6.panix.com...
> > In <8tr7v0$7nl$1...@news.huji.ac.il> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
> >
> > >But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
> > >a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
> > >God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
> > >British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
> > >Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman,
> who
> > >is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
> > >in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
> >
> > Somehow I had the idea that Tracy Ullman is Jewish. There's a comedian
> > who is famous in the UK (twice won the "Best Comedian in Britain" award)
> > named Jo Brand. There are those who insist that Charlie Chaplin
> > was Jewish, though I've yet to see hard evidence for (other
> > than the fact that he was very funny) or against.
>
> Chaplin was definitely NOT Jewish. (I've taught Chaplin in my film classes
> and have read several books, including David Robinson's extensive
> biography.) There may be some confusion because he played his tramp
> character as a Jewish barber in "The Great Dictator" (1940).
>
> However there is a lovely story about Chaplin being asked if he was Jewish
> during WWII, when the Nazi propaganda machine routinely referred to him as
> "the Jew Chaplin." Chaplin's reply was that so long as they attacking him
> with this as an accusation, he mustn't deny it. He didn't want to seem to
> agree with them that it was an insult to be avoided.
>
> So he may not have been Jewish, but he was a mensch!
You can't say that Chaplin definitely wasn;t Jewish.
In (I believe) "The Book of Lists", they tell the story
of someone who went to cheder with him.
Susan
Dan Kimmel
<meirm...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:ut740t8vvl3m635j2...@4ax.com...
> In soc.culture.jewish.moderated on 3 Nov 2000 02:06:33 GMT
> meirm...@erols.com posted:
>
> >Both of these entries are quite interesting www.jewhoo.com :
<snip>
> darryl zanuck: famous as the most famous non-jewish hollywood
> mogul of the golden age. head of 20th century fox. zanuck was once
> refused admission to a hotel that would not admit jews because the
> hotel thought he was jewish. by the way, such discrimination was
> perfectly legal in most of the united states until the civil rights
> act of 1965.
Oh, Zanuck is much more interesting in that in the context of Jews and
entertainment. Being one of only two major non-Jewish studio heads (Walt
Disney was the other), he was in a position his rivals were not: after World
War II it was Zanuck who bought the rights to the novel "Gentleman's
Agreement" and made what was supposed to have been the first major Hollywood
film against anti-semitism. "Supposed" is the key word.
Zanuck personally produced the film -- very unusual for a studio boss --
because he felt it was an important, prestige production. His fellow moguls
pleaded with him not to make the film, but he pressed on. Then he learned
that feisty RKO -- and Jewish production chief Dore Schary -- were making a
little film called "Crossfire." In it antisemite war veteran Robert Ryan
kills Sam Levene, and vet Robert Mitchum and police detective Robert Young
track him down. When Zanuck learned of this, he was furious.
He called up Schary and demanded to know how RKO could make this film when
Zanuck was personally making this major film on the subject. Schary's reply
is classic: "First, you didn't discover antisemitism," he said. "And
second, it's going to take more than two films to wipe it out."
"Crossfire" ended up being released a few weeks before "Gentleman's
Agreement." Zanuck's film, however, was the big hit, and ending winning
several Oscars, including Best Picture.
Dan Kimmel
"Susan Cohen" <fla...@hers.com> wrote in message
news:3A023E1B...@hers.com...
Chaplin *definitely* was NOT Jewish. The story is either a fabrication or a
mistake.
There are similar stories about Cary Grant, who also was not Jewish.
However he contributed money for Palestine during World War II (when
"Palestine" was considered a Jewish cause) and rumors got started. Some
made it into print and once that happens other people cite those stories.
Doesn't make them true.
Now if you want to be surprised at somebody being Jewish that most people
don't know about, Bud Abbott -- of Abbott and Costello -- was Jewish. So
were the Three Stooges, but that's more widely known.
Dan Kimmel
news:mpa60tgnhr1qee6u0...@4ax.com...
> In soc.culture.jewish.moderated on 3 Nov 2000 14:18:08 GMT "Dan
> Kimmel" <dan.k...@worldnet.att.net> posted:
>
> >Oh, Zanuck is much more interesting in that in the context of Jews and
> >entertainment. Being one of only two major non-Jewish studio heads (Walt
> >Disney was the other), he was in a position his rivals were not: after
World
> >War II it was Zanuck who bought the rights to the novel "Gentleman's
> >Agreement" and made what was supposed to have been the first major
Hollywood
> >film against anti-semitism. "Supposed" is the key word.
> >
> >Zanuck personally produced the film -- very unusual for a studio boss --
> >because he felt it was an important, prestige production. His fellow
moguls
> >pleaded with him not to make the film, but he pressed on. Then he
learned
>
> antisemitism I suppose. Did it have that effect? What effect did it
> have at the time.
Absolutely. There's a famous story of Samuel Goldwyn hiring the late Ring
Lardner, Jr. to adapt a novel about Jews in Montreal. When Lardner
submitted the script Goldwyn was shocked. "I hired you to write like a
WASP and you betrayed me by writing like a Jew." Needless to say, the
script went unproduced.
The film, which has not dated well, was a huge hit at the time and
apparently had a positive impact. Surveys measuring American antisemitism
showed that more than three-quarters of people who saw the movie were
disposed to think better of Jews as a result. (Oddly, some 20% said they
were inclined to think LESS of Jews, so perhaps the Jewish moguls had a
point.)
> >that feisty RKO -- and Jewish production chief Dore Schary -- were making
a
> >little film called "Crossfire." In it antisemite war veteran Robert Ryan
> >kills Sam Levene, and vet Robert Mitchum and police detective Robert
Young
> >track him down. When Zanuck learned of this, he was furious.
> >
> >He called up Schary and demanded to know how RKO could make this film
when
> >Zanuck was personally making this major film on the subject. Schary's
reply
> >is classic: "First, you didn't discover antisemitism," he said. "And
> >second, it's going to take more than two films to wipe it out."
> >
> >"Crossfire" ended up being released a few weeks before "Gentleman's
> >Agreement." Zanuck's film, however, was the big hit, and ending winning
> >several Oscars, including Best Picture.
>
> I don't think I ever saw Crossfire.
Most people haven't. It's worth checking out if you can find it. It's
based on a novel called "The Brick Foxhole" where the murder victim wasn't a
Jew but a homosexual. Trying turning THAT into a movie in 1947 Hollywood.
Perhaps it shows how things progressed that two years later when they filmed
the play "Home of the Brave," the Jewish character facing discrimination was
turned into a black man.
Dan Kimmel
>
>
> Dan Kimmel wrote:
>
> > "Susan Cohen" <fla...@hers.com> wrote in message
> > news:3A023E1B...@hers.com...
> > >
> > > In (I believe) "The Book of Lists", they tell the story
> > > of someone who went to cheder with him.
> >
> > Chaplin *definitely* was NOT Jewish. The story is either a fabrication
or a
> > mistake.
>
I'm a film critic and have read extensively on Chaplin. The David Robinson
biography is the authoritative text here. Chaplin was definitely not
Jewish.
Dan Kimmel
"Simcha Streltsov" <sim...@bu.edu> wrote in message
news:8tuqm5$bin$4...@news3.bu.edu...
> 952...@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>
> X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.2 PL2]
>
> Dan Kimmel (dan.k...@worldnet.att.net) wrote:
>
> : > > and have read several books, including David Robinson's extensive
> : > > biography.) There may be some confusion because he played his tramp
> : > > character as a Jewish barber in "The Great Dictator" (1940).
>
> to the Siberian camp.
What movie is that? I'm not aware of Chaplin ever playing such a role.
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
: Now if you want to be surprised at somebody being Jewish that most people
: don't know about, Bud Abbott -- of Abbott and Costello -- was Jewish. So
: were the Three Stooges, but that's more widely known.
Except for Curly Joe, who was of (non-Jewish) Italian extraction.
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"an optimist is a guy/ that has never had/ much experience"
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
>> > The "newt" line is a reference to "Monty Python and the Holy Grail."
>
>> Monty Python quotation is immediately recognized, yet often when
>> someone uses a word of Hebrew s/he is villified for not writing
>> English.
>
>> Moshe Schorr (in Don Quixote mode)
>> It is a tremendous Mitzvah to be happy always! - Reb Nachman of Breslov
>
> Reb Nachman) and not OK for others (e.g. Monty Python)?
I don't just make a "cultural reference" to Reb Nachman, I _quote_
him. As to Son Quixote...
TOUCHE'
Moshe Schorr (in embarassed mode)
David J. Greenberger
> I also live openly with my non-Jewish girlfriend.
Openly? At least you're avoiding issues of yichud.
--
David J. Greenberger
Department of Computer Science, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Michael Shimshoni
Susan Cohen <fla...@hers.com% writes:
%
%
%Dan Kimmel wrote:
%
%> "James Kahn" <ka...@nospam.panix.com> wrote in message
%> news:8truoc$8pt$1...@panix6.panix.com...
%> > In <8tr7v0$7nl$1...@news.huji.ac.il> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
%> >
%> > >But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
%> > >a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
%> > >God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
%> > >British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
%> > >Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman,
%> who
%> > >is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
%> > >in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
%> >
%> > Somehow I had the idea that Tracy Ullman is Jewish. There's a comedian
%> > who is famous in the UK (twice won the "Best Comedian in Britain" award)
%> > named Jo Brand. There are those who insist that Charlie Chaplin
%> > was Jewish, though I've yet to see hard evidence for (other
%> > than the fact that he was very funny) or against.
%>
%> Chaplin was definitely NOT Jewish. (I've taught Chaplin in my film classes
======================================
You did? How old are you?
Rest snipped.
%Susan
Michael Shimshoni
Dan Kimmel
<sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> wrote in message
news:8u2u55$82h$2...@news.huji.ac.il...
> In article <D9BM5.15869$UL.9...@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Dan
Kimmel <dan.k...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
> : Now if you want to be surprised at somebody being Jewish that most
people
> : don't know about, Bud Abbott -- of Abbott and Costello -- was Jewish.
So
> : were the Three Stooges, but that's more widely known.
>
> Except for Curly Joe, who was of (non-Jewish) Italian extraction.
Correct, but I was talking about the original Stooges (Moe, Larry, Curly,
Shemp) and not the later substitutes like Joe DeRita. But while we're on
the subject, Joe Besser (the one after Curly and Shemp and BEFORE Curly Joe)
presumably was Jewish.
meirm...@erols.com
<sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> posted:
>In article <D9BM5.15869$UL.9...@bgtnsc07-news.ops.worldnet.att.net>, Dan Kimmel <dan.k...@worldnet.att.net> wrote:
>
>: Now if you want to be surprised at somebody being Jewish that most people
>: don't know about, Bud Abbott -- of Abbott and Costello -- was Jewish. So
>: were the Three Stooges, but that's more widely known.
>
>Except for Curly Joe, who was of (non-Jewish) Italian extraction.
from www.jewhoo.com Of course there is always the chance he is
wrong. In addition for some good reasons he doesn't note when the
mother of an entry was a convert, but he says there are only three,
Ben Stiller, whose mother is famous too so has her own entry, another
where he mentions it, and one more.
curly howard : one of the three stooges. born jerome lester
horwitz. the youngest of the brothers. his "nuck-nucks" probably came
from the fact he couldn't remember lines.
joe besser: joe besser was real name. joined the three stooges
(larry, moe) in the late '50's following the death of curly and shemp.
larry fine : born larry feinberg. one of three stooges. update:
we noticed that our local hallmark store was selling a line of
"hallmark" brand christmas tree ornaments. larry, moe, and curly were
among those offered. we also saw harrison ford (as "han solo"). is
this a trend? jewish actors on the xmas tree?(of course, certain
religious figures of jewish background are also for sale). we suspect
that a really determined shopper could adorn a whole small tree with
jewish entertainers. which would truely rank up there on the weird
scale. and come to think of it, why doesn't someone make a menorah
that features jewish comedians as the candleholders? light up groucho
the first night, etc. or make them historical figures and have a
lesson each night?
moe howard : moe of three stooges. born moses horwitz. brother of
shemp and curly horwitz/howard. moe's wife, helen, was a cousin of the
famous magician harry houdini (who, of course, was jewish). moe and
his wife both died within a few months of their 50th wedding
anniversary.
shemp howard: born samuel horwitz. one of the three stooges. was
original to the act; left it and came back when curly became sick.
nickname came from the way his immigrant mother pronounced the english
name "sam".
Wasn't there a sixth one. Maybe he was the non-Jewish one, or maybe
there is another choice.
and for some wierd completeness
paul ben-victor: starred as moe howard in the recent big budget
television film on the "three stooges". many smaller supporting roles,
incl. a recurring role on "nypd blue".
>
>-----
>Richard Schultz
meirm...@erols.com
Kimmel" <dan.k...@worldnet.att.net> posted:
>
Sorry. I knew there were six but didn't know there was a Curly, a
Joe, and a Curly Joe. Shouldn't there be some sort of federal
regulation to prevent this. :)
Dan Kimmel
"Michael Shimshoni" <MA...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il> wrote in message
news:13680AB...@weizmann.weizmann.ac.il...
Ho, ho, ho. I've taught Chaplin's FILMS in my class. (And, no, I didn't
use to double date with Rutherford B. Hayes.)
Simcha Streltsov
: > : > > character as a Jewish barber in "The Great Dictator" (1940).
: >
: > maybe also from his other movie, where he plays a Polish Jew taken
: > to the Siberian camp.
: What movie is that? I'm not aware of Chaplin ever playing such a role.
unfortunately, me too. A shame ...
--
Simcha Streltsov disclaimer, as requested by Mo-he S-rr
sim...@bu.edu all punctuation marks in this article
are equivalent to (-:
Dan Kimmel
<meirm...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:c0hc0t4g95tophda0...@4ax.com...
He took the name of his two predecessors. Maybe it's where the pope got the
same idea. :)
Hadass Eviatar
> Have you forgetten, _I'm_ the hateful (and evil) one?
Anyone who likes Edith Piaf has got to have *some* good in him 8-).
BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now (or my father would
never have joined his shul - they are as far apart politically as is
possible to imagine).
>
> --
> Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
> G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
This, OTOH, *is* hateful, IMHO.
Kol tuv, Hadass
--
Hadass Eviatar
Winnipeg, Canada
http://www.superhwy.net/~eviatar
Alan D Glick
Jewish disgrace of yourself as has Lieberman, they'll take care of the rest.
Alan Glick
"Jordi Sod" <jord...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:8tpi5g$5i0$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
Amitai Halevi
; In article <8tppjb$oc7$1...@condor.nj.org>, Sheldon Glickler
;sheldonlg_f...@mediaone.net> wrote:
;
; :> You have obviously never seen Monty Python's "Ken Russell's Gardening
; :> Club" or "Pasolini's the Third Test Match" or the Dirty Vicar sketch
; :> or the Summarize Proust Competition. . .
;
; : You are correct. I stated earlier that I didn't watch much of Monty Python.
; : I spoke from what I had seen (like the knight who loses a limb at a time).
; : By contrast, Hill's stuff is basically all T&A.
;
; Apparently, the take-home message, namely, that when you don't know what
; you are talking about, it's time to stop talking, has yet to sink in.
;
; But in order to bring this back on topic: Jews have historically made
; a huge contribution to American comedy -- from the Marx Brothers to,
; God help us, Jerry Seinfeld. Have they made a similar contribution to
; British comedy? My initial thought is that they have not (the only
; Jewish British comic who comes immediately to my mind is Maureen Lipman, who
; is hardly in the same league as Alec Guinness). Can anyone out there
; in net land think of Famous Jewish British Comics?
;
Hermione Gingold (1897-1987) would qualify, but only if "Jewish
by patrilineal descent'" is acceptable.
Amitai
*--------------------------------------------------------------------*
| E. Amitai Halevi <chr...@aluf.technion.ac.il> |
| Department of Chemistry, Technion-Israel Institute of Technology |
| http://www.technion.ac.il/technion/chemistry/staff/halevi |
| |
| "`Od yenuvun be-seva, deshenim ve-ra`ananim yihyu", Psalms 92,15 |
*--------------------------------------------------------------------*
; -----
; Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
; Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
; Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
; -----
; "French bread makes very good skis"
;
Polar
wrote:
>Noach wrote:
>> Have you forgetten, _I'm_ the hateful (and evil) one?
>
>Anyone who likes Edith Piaf has got to have *some* good in him 8-).
>
>BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
>was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
>He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now (or my father would
>never have joined his shul - they are as far apart politically as is
>possible to imagine).
My son went there years ago -- briefly I hasten to add! - because a
friend of his was a member.
I threw a garden party for my son & wife when they came out to the
Coast, and invited "friend" and his equally ultra-O wife. Spent a
young fortune to get glatt kosher food for them. They didn't eat a
bite and behaved crudely in general.
Lapin has created quite a business empire!
--
Polar
mos...@mm.huji.ac.il
> Susan Cohen <fla...@hers.com% writes:> %> > In <8tr7v0$7nl$1...@news.huji.ac.il> <sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il> writes:
big snip
> %> > Somehow I had the idea that Tracy Ullman is Jewish. There's a comedian
> %> > who is famous in the UK (twice won the "Best Comedian in Britain" award)
> %> > named Jo Brand. There are those who insist that Charlie Chaplin
> %> > was Jewish, though I've yet to see hard evidence for (other
> %> > than the fact that he was very funny) or against.
> %>
> %> Chaplin was definitely NOT Jewish. (I've taught Chaplin in my film classes
> ======================================
> You did? How old are you?
LOL! Michael, you often refer to Amitai as your mentor. I see you
picked up his excellent sense of humor as well. Thanks.
Moshe Schorr
Alan D Glick
anti-semitism would increase. They probably believed in the assimilationist
ideal -- 'If we go away, they won't hurt us.'
Interestingly enough, the movie itself refers to this incident. IIFC
the movie concerns a gentile newpaper editor who hires Gregory Peck to
masquerade as a Jew so as to uncover incidents of anti-semitism. A group of
Jewish leaders meets with the newspaper man and ask him to abandon the
effort for the reasons mentioned. I think one of them even uses the phrase,
"let's not stir it up."
It's a movie worth seeing.
Alan Glick
<meirm...@erols.com> wrote in message
news:mpa60tgnhr1qee6u0...@4ax.com...
Micha Berger
:: and what do you mean by 'newt'?
: As far as I know, the word "newt" only has one meaning ("any one of a
: number of small semiaquatic salamanders" from certain specific genera).
I assume, given the political web sites Noach reads often enough to site
frequently, that Noach most often sees Newt in conjunction with Gingrich.
-mi
Noach
news:8tln8v$3op$1...@news.huji.ac.il...
> In article <8tjrs9$cs7$1...@slb7.atl.mindspring.net>, Noach
<add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>
> : See:
> : http://jewsformorality.org/press_releases/lieberman_excommunicated.htm
>
> He turned *me* into a newt.
Who? and what do you mean by 'newt'?
--
"There are parts of the British Virgin Islands so beautiful, you'd happily
marry the closest iguana just so you could stay there forever. " - Lonely
Planet
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
:> He turned *me* into a newt.
: Who?
Senator Lieberman. I mentioned it in case anyone doubted his worthiness
for excommunication.
: and what do you mean by 'newt'?
As far as I know, the word "newt" only has one meaning ("any one of a
number of small semiaquatic salamanders" from certain specific genera).
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system
of government."
Noach
news:3A0701EB...@superhwy.net...
> BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
> was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
> He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now
The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest someone,
does not make that person crazy.
Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
[The following was in my sig.]
> > --
> > Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
> > G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
>
> This, OTOH, *is* hateful, IMHO.
This is off-topic but I will just say that I do not say it without ample and
legitimate reason.
Eric Simon
wrote:
>"Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
>news:3A0701EB...@superhwy.net...
>
>> BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
>> was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
>> He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now
>
>The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest someone,
>does not make that person crazy.
>
>Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
>which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
>
>[The following was in my sig.]
>> > --
>> > Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
>> > G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
>>
>> This, OTOH, *is* hateful, IMHO.
>
>This is off-topic but I will just say that I do not say it without ample and
>legitimate reason.
That doesn't make it a correct thing to say.
My other response is to throw your words back at you, slightly edited:
"The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest
someone," does not mean you should publically declare that they will
sell their mother, or someone else's mother.
And, while I'm at it, I'll also requote you a second time:
>Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
>which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
-- Eric
Hadass Eviatar
>
> "Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
> news:3A0701EB...@superhwy.net...
>
> > BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
> > was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
> > He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now
>
> The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest someone,
> does not make that person crazy.
This is true. However, I was being charitable.
>
> Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
> which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
Does Rabbi Lapin post here?
>
> [The following was in my sig.]
> > > --
> > > Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
> > > G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
> >
> > This, OTOH, *is* hateful, IMHO.
>
> This is off-topic but I will just say that I do not say it without ample and
> legitimate reason.
And the rule against derogatory personal remarks was again ...
Susan Cohen
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il wrote:
> In article <8udr1v$di2$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net>, Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
>
> :> He turned *me* into a newt.
>
> : Who?
>
> Senator Lieberman. I mentioned it in case anyone doubted his worthiness
> for excommunication.
Yes, but did you get better?
Susan
sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il
: sch...@gefen.cc.biu.ac.il wrote:
:> In article <8udr1v$di2$1...@slb6.atl.mindspring.net>, Noach <add...@reply-to.is. : accurate> wrote:
:>:> He turned *me* into a newt.
:>: Who?
:> Senator Lieberman. I mentioned it in case anyone doubted his worthiness
:> for excommunication.
: Yes, but did you get better?
It looks that way. Does one have to bentch gomel after having been
turned into a newt and then recovering?
-----
Richard Schultz sch...@mail.biu.ac.il
Department of Chemistry, Bar-Ilan University, Ramat-Gan, Israel
Opinions expressed are mine alone, and not those of Bar-Ilan University
-----
"Life is a blur of Republicans and meat." -- Zippy
Noach
thread about Gingrich's policy positions. ]
"Micha Berger" <mi...@aishdas.org> wrote in message
news:8uefpu$hmd$2...@bob.news.rcn.net...
> I assume, given the political web sites Noach reads often enough to site
> frequently, that Noach most often sees Newt in conjunction with Gingrich.
Cute but I would like to point-out that Gingrich is among the types of
politician that I detest the most and find furthest from Jewish values:
Sleazy, low on the culture war issues while high on free-market absolutist
and libertarian rhetoric and issues.
--
"...the island isn't a typical Caribbean powdered-sugar beach destination -
in fact, it has hardly any beaches at all." - Lonely Planet, Intro. to Saba
Micha Berger
:> I assume, given the political web sites Noach reads often enough to site
:> frequently, that Noach most often sees Newt in conjunction with Gingrich.
: Cute but I would like to point-out that Gingrich is among the types of
: politician that I detest...
I didn't intend to imply otherwise. I was just saying that given what
you've shown us of your taste in reading, you're bound to see "Newt
G." far more often than any mention of amphibians that look like lizards.
I read many things I disagree with.
-mi
--
Micha Berger When you come to a place of darkness,
mi...@aishdas.org you do not chase out the darkness with a broom.
http://www.aishdas.org You light a candle.
(973) 916-0287 - R' Yekusiel Halberstam of Klausenberg zt"l
Noach
> On 9 Nov 2000 23:01:38 GMT, Noach <add...@reply-to.is.accurate> wrote:
> I didn't intend to imply otherwise. I was just saying that given what
> you've shown us of your taste in reading, you're bound to see "Newt
> G." far more often than any mention of amphibians that look like lizards.
Well, yes and I did at first think that it was ref. to Gingrich. Although,
based on my recent sig. quotes, it wouldn't be unreasonable to think that I
see references to lizard-like creatures as well.
:o)
> I read many things I disagree with.
This is a very good point which should really be obvious but unfortunately
seems to need continual repeating. Listening-to, watching and reading
something in no way implies any endorsement of it or agreement with it.
meirm...@erols.com
<add...@reply-to.is.accurate> posted:
>"Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
>news:3A0701EB...@superhwy.net...
>
>> BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
>> was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
>> He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now
>
>The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest someone,
>does not make that person crazy.
>
>Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
>which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
>
Lots of people are meshugee.
>[The following was in my sig.]
>> > --
>> > Al Gore would sell his own mother for a high enough price. I don't think
>> > G.W. would. Someone else's mother, maybe, but at least not his own.
>>
>> This, OTOH, *is* hateful, IMHO.
>
>This is off-topic but I will just say that I do not say it without ample and
>legitimate reason.
Yes you do say it without ample or legitimate reason. If they did
something you don't like, complain about that. Don't make stuff up.
We assumed you believed you had reason in the first place and saying
it explicitly doesn't make your sig any better.
An antisemite might say a Jewish store owner is a moneygrubber but if
he says he would sell his own or someone else's mother, it's hateful
(which is far worse for those who need details). And far worse
than calling someone meshuginer btw.
BTW, I'm not concerned with Al Gore or GWB because of your sig. I'm
worried that you can write it.
Russell Steinthal
Hadass Eviatar <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote:
>Noach wrote:
>>
>> "Hadass Eviatar" <evi...@superhwy.net> wrote in message
>> news:3A0701EB...@superhwy.net...
>>
>> > BTW, Rabbi Lapin actually conducted my first wedding. This was when he
>> > was rabbi of a little shul in Venice, CA, where my parents were members.
>> > He wasn't quite as meshiginer then as he is now
>>
>> The fact that you vehemently disagree with someone, or even detest someone,
>> does not make that person crazy.
>
>This is true. However, I was being charitable.
>
>>
>> Also, why wasn't this deemed in violation of the provision of the charter
>> which prohibits derogatory personal remarks?
>
>Does Rabbi Lapin post here?
For the record, that is irrelevant- the charter prohibits offensive or
derogatory statements about individuals or groups, without reference
to whether or not they contribute to SCJM.
Everything is a matter of degree, but now that the thread has lost
whatever on-topic content it had at the beginning, let's try to end
it.
Note followups.
-Russell
Moderator, SCJM
--
Russell Steinthal Columbia Law School, Class of 2002
<rm...@columbia.edu> Columbia College, Class of 1999
<ste...@nj.org> UNIX System Administrator, nj.org
gynosaur
i found the following from the same rabbi in the congressional record:
www.sklar.com/cr-bf.html
IN THE MATTER OF REPRESENT- ATIVE BARNEY FRANK (House of
Representatives - July 26, 1990)
[Page: H5633]
Mr. DANNEMEYER. Mr. Speaker, I offer a privileged resolution (H. Res.
442) on the expulsion of Representative Barney Frank, and ask for its
immediate consideration.
[some ways down]
Whereas, the Beth Din Zedek, according to Halacha (Jewish law),
supported by the Rabbinical Alliance of America and the Union of
Orthodox Rabbis, and presided over by Rabbi Joseph Friedman, on June
27, 1990 in New York City, excommunicated Barney Frank from the
Jewish
faith for `Desecrating the name of God and the Jewish people, for
bringing dishonor and disgrace upon the high office of congressman,
and for promoting and encouraging the moral corruption of society. A
prominent Jewish public official, to our deep embarrassment Frank has
been a blatant promoter of moral depravity.'
Noach
news:8uk20u$rv7$1...@news.fas.harvard.edu...
> Whereas, the Beth Din Zedek, according to Halacha (Jewish law),
> supported by the Rabbinical Alliance of America and the Union of
> Orthodox Rabbis, and presided over by Rabbi Joseph Friedman, on June
> 27, 1990 in New York City, excommunicated Barney Frank from the
> Jewish
> faith for `Desecrating the name of God and the Jewish people, for
> bringing dishonor and disgrace upon the high office of congressman,
> and for promoting and encouraging the moral corruption of society. A
>
> prominent Jewish public official, to our deep embarrassment Frank has
> been a blatant promoter of moral depravity.'
Nothing to disagree with there.
--
We need a president with the populism of Nader, the eloquence in fighting
the cultural war of Buchanan and the stature, experience and broad appeal of
McCain.
med...@shore.net
>
> Isn't the Union of Orthodox Rabbis the group that declared a year or two
> ago that Reform Jews weren't Jews? (Whatever it is, it's not the OU.)
> I don't think the UOR has any standing in any segment of the Jewish
> community, O or otherwise.
Every couple of weeks someone repeats the lie above. No, they never
declared that "Reform Jews weren't Jews". They did declare that the
religion that Reform Jews follow is not Judaism.
David J. Greenberger
> i found the following from the same rabbi in the congressional record:
> www.sklar.com/cr-bf.html
>
> IN THE MATTER OF REPRESENT- ATIVE BARNEY FRANK (House of
> Representatives - July 26, 1990)
>
> [Page: H5633]
>
> Mr. DANNEMEYER. Mr. Speaker, I offer a privileged resolution (H. Res.
> 442) on the expulsion of Representative Barney Frank, and ask for its
> immediate consideration.
>
> [some ways down]
>
> Whereas, the Beth Din Zedek, according to Halacha (Jewish law),
> supported by the Rabbinical Alliance of America and the Union of
> Orthodox Rabbis, and presided over by Rabbi Joseph Friedman, on June
[etc.]
Isn't the Union of Orthodox Rabbis the group that declared a year or two
ago that Reform Jews weren't Jews? (Whatever it is, it's not the OU.)
I don't think the UOR has any standing in any segment of the Jewish
community, O or otherwise.
--
David J. Greenberger
Department of Computer Science, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Harry Weiss
>> i found the following from the same rabbi in the congressional record:
>> www.sklar.com/cr-bf.html
>>
>> IN THE MATTER OF REPRESENT- ATIVE BARNEY FRANK (House of
>> Representatives - July 26, 1990)
>>
>> [Page: H5633]
>>
>> Mr. DANNEMEYER. Mr. Speaker, I offer a privileged resolution (H. Res.
>> 442) on the expulsion of Representative Barney Frank, and ask for its
>> immediate consideration.
>>
>> [some ways down]
>>
>> Whereas, the Beth Din Zedek, according to Halacha (Jewish law),
>> supported by the Rabbinical Alliance of America and the Union of
>> Orthodox Rabbis, and presided over by Rabbi Joseph Friedman, on June
> [etc.]
> Isn't the Union of Orthodox Rabbis the group that declared a year or two
> ago that Reform Jews weren't Jews? (Whatever it is, it's not the OU.)
First, they said Reform and Conservativea re not Judaism. They DID NOT
say they were not Jews.
Some of their Rabbis are highly respected, other are not. One of the
leaders of one of these organzations gives the suprevsion to Hebrew
National, probably the least trusted name in thekohser business.
> I don't think the UOR has any standing in any segment of the Jewish
> community, O or otherwise.
> --
> David J. Greenberger
> Department of Computer Science, University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
--
Harry J. Weiss
hjw...@panix.com