Peshwa Brahmins destroyed the Maratha Tribes and Empire
Kunal Singh
>
> After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
> control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
> and power until Bhiyas/Bengalis helped the British chase and kill
> the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s. This is how Marathas got
> stuck in Fudusthan after getting independence from the Mogul-Rajput
> hindusthani empire (50% of Mogul army/administration/officers were
> HINDUS from Rajputanna).
>
> Lesson: Low caste Brahmins have always been fit only to lead monkey armies,
> read Maratha, Jat, Sikh, and Rajput palms, and beg for food. Never let
> them become your political masters.
A very good point. I found the 50% of Mogul army being Rajputs quite intriguing
as Rajputs and Brahmins comprised 80% of the British army! These people have been
betraying the Bharatiya people for centuries in their lust for power! What is
even more interesting to me is that Rajputs who inherited Harshavardhan's empire
largely due to the grace of Brahmins to this day proudly call themselves THAKURS
which going by Bihari tradition makes them a Brahmin's assistant! And all these
Rajputs keep proudly claiming to be Thakurs in UP, if you go there you will most
likely run into one who will declare it quite proudly. What a joke of history,
sometimes I laugh just thinking about it! Actually it is a good thing that the
Muslims kicked all their butts and spoiled the Brahmin plans for becoming the
superior caste for good! With the Rajputs they had literally reduced Kshatriya
tradition to becoming servants of Brahmins! What is even more hilarious is that I
used to know a Rajput who was absolutely in awe of the Brahmin's intelligence and
claimed that nobody could ever do better in studies than a Brahmin! Learning
history sure gives you a different perspective.
gan...@my-dejanews.com
10033...@compuserve.com (Mo) wrote:
> . . . the Marathas had destroyed Afghan
> and Mughal power for them
The Marathas tribes (considered sudras by dasya Brahmins)
booted Moguls out of their Saka lands (Shivaji to Shahu).
Peshwa Brahmins USURPED their court and were a complete
disaster. These Peshwa traitors and backstabbers then became allies
of (RSS's hated) Muslim Mogul Emporers between 1730-1760 until Moguls
decided to betray them to Afghans who crushed the entire Maratha
Army in 1761.
The foolishness of the Brahmin usurper Peshwas in betraying the
Maratha tribes and forming an alliance with the Moguls (who had
killed Shivaji and his successors in the most cruel fashion) cost
the Maratha tribes over 100,000 Kshatriyas in 2 days and lead to
their collapse.
After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
and power until Bhiyas/Bengalis helped the British chase and kill
the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s. This is how Marathas got
stuck in Fudusthan after getting independence from the Mogul-Rajput
hindusthani empire (50% of Mogul army/administration/officers were
HINDUS from Rajputanna).
Lesson: Low caste Brahmins have always been fit only to lead monkey armies,
read Maratha, Jat, Sikh, and Rajput palms, and beg for food. Never let
them become your political masters.
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
Kishore Joshi
>In article <751bhu$ih3$1...@eros.clara.net>,
> 10033...@compuserve.com (Mo) wrote:
>> . . . the Marathas had destroyed Afghan
>> and Mughal power for them
>
> The Marathas tribes (considered sudras by dasya Brahmins)
Are you fucking nuts ?
Marathas were Kshatriyas sub-divided into the "96-clans".
Which dasya Brahmin are you consulting nowadays.
You need to have your head examined
> booted Moguls out of their Saka lands (Shivaji to Shahu).
> Peshwa Brahmins USURPED their court and were a complete
> disaster. These Peshwa traitors and backstabbers then became allies
GAND-A-SA JI
Your feeble attempt at recreating the lost history of Sakastan
is too sorry to even qualify as bed time saka kid stories.
Talking of those who ditched the Marathas (led by peshwas)
Lets
talk about the refusal of Sikhs and Rajputs
to fight the Afghans with the Marathas. The Sikhs and Rajputs were scared of
the Maratha strength and refused to cooperate. Talk about "Fuddu"
Sakastani-brotherhood now.
In fact the opportunist Sikhs fought the Afghans after they had
been almost vanquished by the Marathas.
> of (RSS's hated) Muslim Mogul Emporers between 1730-1760 until Moguls
> decided to betray them to Afghans who crushed the entire Maratha
> Army in 1761.
>
> The foolishness of the Brahmin usurper Peshwas in betraying the
> Maratha tribes and forming an alliance with the Moguls (who had
> killed Shivaji and his successors in the most cruel fashion) cost
Where are you pulling these gems from ? Now take that hand out of your pants
and wash it before stroking your keyboard ...... You are simply amusing
Gandasa ji.
> the Maratha tribes over 100,000 Kshatriyas in 2 days and lead to
> their collapse.
>
> After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
> control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
After Peshwas, there was no single power to unite Marathas and like
all Indians they fell prey to the British tricks.
> and power until Bhiyas/Bengalis helped the British chase and kill
> the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s. This is how Marathas got
> stuck in Fudusthan after getting independence from the Mogul-Rajput
> hindusthani empire (50% of Mogul army/administration/officers were
> HINDUS from Rajputanna).
Tha Marathas are the fiercely loyal,brave soldiers and patriots of India
>
> Lesson: Low caste Brahmins have always been fit only to lead monkey armies,
Low caste Brahmins ! Aren't Whites are a minority in US.
All Germans are black. Horses can fly and you can probably lay eggs!
Time to go for you mental therapy class. Bye Bye Gandasa-ji.
> read Maratha, Jat, Sikh, and Rajput palms, and beg for food. Never let
> them become your political masters.
>
>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
--
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
1. Money is not the root of All Evil, It is the perceived lack of it....
mvel...@hotmail.com
gan...@my-dejanews.com wrote:
> In article <751bhu$ih3$1...@eros.clara.net>,
> 10033...@compuserve.com (Mo) wrote:
> > . . . the Marathas had destroyed Afghan
> > and Mughal power for them
>
........
>
> The foolishness of the Brahmin usurper Peshwas in betraying the
> Maratha tribes and forming an alliance with the Moguls (who had
> killed Shivaji and his successors in the most cruel fashion)
Can somebody explain, who killed Shivaji ???
>
> After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
> control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
> and power until Bhiyas/Bengalis helped the British chase and kill
> the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s.
>
Who was in power of Maratha kingdom, when the British took control ???
-Mahesh
gan...@my-dejanews.com
kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> In article <753gdu$76j$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, <gan...@my-dejanews.com>
wrote:
> >In article <751bhu$ih3$1...@eros.clara.net>,
> > 10033...@compuserve.com (Mo) wrote:
> >> . . . the Marathas had destroyed Afghan
> >> and Mughal power for them
> >
>
> Are you fucking nuts ?
Kishori-bhiya dont go nuts, we are having a factual discussion
on history.
> Marathas were Kshatriyas sub-divided into the "96-clans".
Maratha tribes who created the Maratha Federation are of
Saka origin and are connected to the Satrap and Yadava Sakas
(300BC) who settled the Gujarat/Southern Rajasthan region
from the Bolan pass. Saka settlements, cities, coins and
inscriptions have been found at Ujjain, Kaithwar and Vidharba
(northern Maharasthra - same region of Maratha tribes). They
were later pushed southward and eastward by Huns from Bolan
pass during 5th century AD. They retained their traditional
"noble" Saka occupations of soldiering, agriculture and herding
till the time of Mahavir Shivaji. Even the Maratha language
is close to Brij and Punjabi than southern, central or eastern
languages.
Brahmin usurpers always considered Marathas to be "low caste
shudras" even though they were fed by them - always biting the
hand which feeds them like a thankless dog. Go ask MahaviraSaka
Bal Thackery, who used to be a good Maratha in his younger days.
Unfortunately, he also lost his head - both of them - to bhiya-kirar
fantasies and laundias exported from Gangasthan by RSS, Dasya samaj,
Hindu-maha-Saba, other bania/bahman dream organizations.
But dont worry, he wants to kick the bhiyas out and join
the Saka Federation of Independent States. In fact, we want to
make him the first of rotationg Saka Presidents with title:
MahaViraSaka.
The Saka federation will run from Mumbai to western Tibet
- once all the Sakas boot China out of our previous Khotan
province; then from Ganga river to west. Within 15 years,
the 200 million Sakas will be the Japan of Asia, Germany of
Europe and regain the past 1500 year glories of Sakasthana of
Asia in 15 years.
The next 2 year terms will rotate between MahaviraSaka
Sahib Singh, MahaviraSaka Shekawat Singh, MahaviraSaka
Badal Singh, MahaviraSaka Bansi Lal, . . .
All members will have complete economic freedom and
independent parliaments/executive/political system,
equal army representation.
> Which dasya Brahmin are you consulting nowadays.
> You need to have your head examined
>
> > booted Moguls out of their Saka lands (Shivaji to Shahu).
> > Peshwa Brahmins USURPED their court and were a complete
> > disaster. These Peshwa traitors and backstabbers then became allies
>
> GAND-A-SA JI
>
> Your feeble attempt at recreating the lost history of Sakastan
> is too sorry to even qualify as bed time saka kid stories.
RECREATE from hardcore coins, inscriptions, texts as opposed to
monkey tales of Bahmans.
>
> Talking of those who ditched the Marathas (led by peshwas)
> Lets
> talk about the refusal of Sikhs and Rajputs
> to fight the Afghans with the Marathas. The Sikhs and Rajputs were scared of
> the Maratha strength and refused to cooperate. Talk about "Fuddu"
> Sakastani-brotherhood now.
Hey, Saka blood is thicker than kirar moot no matter how much
you dance in it. Sikhs and the Maratha army were allies and
kicked Abdali from Punjab during 1730s. All Sakas - Sikhs,
Jats and Rajputs - were then ready to nail the Moguls in Delhi
but the idiotic Brahmin Peshwa formed an alliance with the Moguls
and protected the Muslim Mogul Ruler and his empire from Saka
wrath.
The Moguls then screwed the Marathas by switching to Abdali
and his Afghans leading to defeat of Maratha army and killing
of +100,000 of brave and fearless Maratha warriors. Another
incompetent and foolish Bahman Rao was made their field general
who wouldnt listen to the Maratha Commanders.
Sikhs and Jats then had to face the Afghans onslaught alone but
destroyed them and the Moguls by 1765. If the brainless Peshwa
had not become a Mogul stooge in 1730s and joined Jats, Sikhs and
Rajputs instead of trying to divide them, no 1761 Agra and maybe no
English! No current 50 year Bhiya-Kirar Raj either.
>
> In fact the opportunist Sikhs fought the Afghans after they had
> been almost vanquished by the Marathas.
Thats another spicy kirar fairy tale. Maratha tribes due to stupidity
and betrayal of their Brahmin usurpers were crushed by the combined
Afghan-Mogul-Rajput alliance under Abdali in 1761. They had a revival
when the authentic Maratha chiefs rebuilt their strength but them the
British and Poorbia mercenaries from Bengal/Bhiyaland were on them
like flies and destroyed them again during 1810-20s.
So the Sikhs (under Bagel Singh, Ranjit Singh, etc.) and Jats (under
Jawahir Singh, Suraj Mal, etc.) were facing a VICTORIOUS and
powerful Afghan-Mogul alliance thanks to the fraud usurper
Brahmin Peshwa - who was never acknowledged by most Maratha chiefs
and tribes as legitimate! But he and his Bahman nest was stuck in
their court and capital, playing them off with intrigues, jealousies and
assasinations. The son of Mahavir Shahu was even murdered by the
Brahmins so the usurper could take over the court.
>
> > of (RSS's hated) Muslim Mogul Emporers between 1730-1760 until Moguls
> > decided to betray them to Afghans who crushed the entire Maratha
> > Army in 1761.
> >
> > The foolishness of the Brahmin usurper Peshwas in betraying the
> > Maratha tribes and forming an alliance with the Moguls (who had
> > killed Shivaji and his successors in the most cruel fashion) cost
>
> Where are you pulling these gems from ? Now take that hand out of your pants
> and wash it before stroking your keyboard ...... You are simply amusing
> Gandasa ji.
>
> > the Maratha tribes over 100,000 Kshatriyas in 2 days and lead to
> > their collapse.
> >
> > After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
> > control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
>
> After Peshwas, there was no single power to unite Marathas and like
> all Indians they fell prey to the British tricks.
The non-Brahmin Maratha Army was chased by the British and their
Bhiya allies for 2 years before being crushed in 1810s. They had
been rebuilt by their tribal chiefs after 1761. After the Peshwa's
alliance with Moguls (1730-60), and other mischiefs, Rajputs, Jats
and did not trust the Peshwa. He was seen as a Mogul side-kick
and back-stabber.
>
> > and power until Bhiyas/Bengalis helped the British chase and kill
> > the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s. This is how Marathas got
> > stuck in Fudusthan after getting independence from the Mogul-Rajput
> > hindusthani empire (50% of Mogul army/administration/officers were
> > HINDUS from Rajputanna).
>
> Tha Marathas are the fiercely loyal,brave soldiers and patriots of India
Yes, the Marathas tribes were the brave heros of the Maratha Nation but
their court had been usurped by selfish, disloyal and supremacist Bahmans
who viewed Marathas as dispensible "shudras", didnt care a damn for them
or their traditions, and formed an alliance with their enemy - the Moguls.
Fudu, there was no "India" - British were CREATING IT by collecting the
independent Maratha nation, Jat nation and Punjab under THEIR RULE!
Shivaji to Shuhu fought to get out of the imperial Hindusthani yoke
of Moguls - Peshwas were allies of the same empire until Moguls
betrayed them for the re-powered Afghans in 1761.
Historyless Kirars always trying to STEAL and APPROPRIATE the history
of others with fraud terminology, semantics and claims (Ghori's 12th
century "Hindu", "Hindusthan"; 19th century "India"; claiming palm
readers and massaleh-wallahs, who never fought a battle, were
"Highest Castes", "Kshatriyas", etc.).
>
> >
> > Lesson: Low caste Brahmins have always been fit only to lead monkey
armies,
>
> Low caste Brahmins ! Aren't Whites are a minority in US.
What do you call traditional beggers and palm readers who
depended on generosity and gifts of their masters, landowners
and rulers? Ask any western political or social scientist!
> All Germans are black. Horses can fly and you can probably lay eggs!
Bahmans can well make pigs fly in their fantasies much less horses.
But dasya Brahmins are definately of dravidian origin despite all the
colonial white complexes! Germans need to re-read the RigVeda
from Punjab and Gita from historically separate Gangasthan.
Even their plagerized gangetic GITA forbids them from Land of Vedic
Aryans - Saptha Sindhva - and has dravidian god Krishna trying to
kill Vedic god Indra! Then, there is the simple EYE TEST,
nasal indexes, and DNA studies.
Gandasa
Kishore Joshi
> kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
>> >
>> > The Marathas tribes (considered sudras by dasya Brahmins)
>>
>> Are you fucking nuts ?
>
>Kishori-bhiya dont go nuts, we are having a factual discussion
>on history.
>
>> Marathas were Kshatriyas sub-divided into the "96-clans".
>
>Maratha tribes who created the Maratha Federation are of
>Saka origin and are connected to the Satrap and Yadava Sakas
>(300BC) who settled the Gujarat/Southern Rajasthan region
>from the Bolan pass. Saka settlements, cities, coins and
>inscriptions have been found at Ujjain, Kaithwar and Vidharba
>(northern Maharasthra - same region of Maratha tribes). They
>were later pushed southward and eastward by Huns from Bolan
>pass during 5th century AD. They retained their traditional
>"noble" Saka occupations of soldiering, agriculture and herding
>till the time of Mahavir Shivaji. Even the Maratha language
>is close to Brij and Punjabi than southern, central or eastern
>languages.
>
Who's denying the Saka origins of Marathas. FYI the Yadavs of UP
are also considered of the same origin (so much so for you fuddu
UP-ite hatred)
Gandasa ji please provide references for your allegations
against Marathi Brahmins calling Marathas as "Shudras". If you can come
up, you are one up if not, I will consider your assertions as
flights of fantacies.
>Brahmin usurpers always considered Marathas to be "low caste
>shudras" even though they were fed by them - always biting the
>hand which feeds them like a thankless dog. Go ask MahaviraSaka
>Bal Thackery, who used to be a good Maratha in his younger days.
And who do you think is Thakare being controlled by : Brahmins, Are
you kidding again ? DO you have any proof, any close Brahmin ally
or Pundit he listens to ????
Thakare is a self proclaimed leader of Marathas who have traditionally
harboured dislike and hatred for the Moghuls much like their peshwa
brothers.
FYI do you know who was the spritual guru of Shiavji???
It was Ramdaas Maharaj, a Brahmin, although I don't think he ever
called himself so, being the saint that he was. The Brahmins and
marathas of Maharashtra have always had deep resentment of the Mleencha
Moghuls.
>Unfortunately, he also lost his head - both of them - to bhiya-kirar
>fantasies and laundias exported from Gangasthan by RSS, Dasya samaj,
>Hindu-maha-Saba, other bania/bahman dream organizations.
>
>But dont worry, he wants to kick the bhiyas out and join
>the Saka Federation of Independent States. In fact, we want to
>make him the first of rotationg Saka Presidents with title:
>MahaViraSaka.
>
>The Saka federation will run from Mumbai to western Tibet
And heil Hitler to you !
>
>The next 2 year terms will rotate between MahaviraSaka
>equal army representation.
>
>> Which dasya Brahmin are you consulting nowadays.
>> You need to have your head examined
>>
>> > booted Moguls out of their Saka lands (Shivaji to Shahu).
>> > Peshwa Brahmins USURPED their court and were a complete
>> > disaster. These Peshwa traitors and backstabbers then became allies
>>
>> GAND-A-SA JI
>>
>> Your feeble attempt at recreating the lost history of Sakastan
>> is too sorry to even qualify as bed time saka kid stories.
>
>RECREATE from hardcore coins, inscriptions, texts as opposed to
>monkey tales of Bahmans.
>
>>
>> Talking of those who ditched the Marathas (led by peshwas)
>> Lets
>> talk about the refusal of Sikhs and Rajputs
>> to fight the Afghans with the Marathas. The Sikhs and Rajputs were scared of
>> the Maratha strength and refused to cooperate. Talk about "Fuddu"
>> Sakastani-brotherhood now.
>
>Hey, Saka blood is thicker than kirar moot no matter how much
>you dance in it. Sikhs and the Maratha army were allies and
>kicked Abdali from Punjab during 1730s. All Sakas - Sikhs,
The why didn't the Sikhs and Rajputs support Marathas in 3rd battle of Panipat.
Were they too busy eating Sarso-ka-saag and Makke-de-roti, a Saka
delicacy ???
>Jats and Rajputs - were then ready to nail the Moguls in Delhi
>but the idiotic Brahmin Peshwa formed an alliance with the Moguls
>and protected the Muslim Mogul Ruler and his empire from Saka
>wrath.
What the hell are you babbling about ???
The Peshwas never conspired with Moghuls.... Never..
Can you provide references ?? I doubt though ....
You know the reasons why Rajputs never joined Peshwas ???
Peshwas would not let the rowdy Rajputs to loot Delhi afterwards...
The Sikhs well, they played sound politics and let the
two mighty powers destroy each other...
Since the Sikhs neither liked the Moghuls nor would they
accept the Maratha ruler on Delhi's throne...
>
>The Moguls then screwed the Marathas by switching to Abdali
>and his Afghans leading to defeat of Maratha army and killing
>
>Sikhs and Jats then had to face the Afghans onslaught alone but
>destroyed them and the Moguls by 1765. If the brainless Peshwa
>had not become a Mogul stooge in 1730s and joined Jats, Sikhs and
>Rajputs instead of trying to divide them, no 1761 Agra and maybe no
>English! No current 50 year Bhiya-Kirar Raj either.
>
>>
>> In fact the opportunist Sikhs fought the Afghans after they had
>> been almost vanquished by the Marathas.
>
>Thats another spicy kirar fairy tale. Maratha tribes due to stupidity
>and betrayal of their Brahmin usurpers were crushed by the combined
>Afghan-Mogul-Rajput alliance under Abdali in 1761. They had a revival
You know why they lost???
Read real history and not Saka sagas that you seem to wpin from nowhere....
THe reason is that the Afghans cut the Maratha's supply lines just like the
Marathas cut the Afghan lines.....
Foolishly the Marathas, ventured to fight without a game plan and lost...
>when the authentic Maratha chiefs rebuilt their strength but them the
>British and Poorbia mercenaries from Bengal/Bhiyaland were on them
>like flies and destroyed them again during 1810-20s.
>
>So the Sikhs (under Bagel Singh, Ranjit Singh, etc.) and Jats (under
>Jawahir Singh, Suraj Mal, etc.) were facing a VICTORIOUS and
>powerful Afghan-Mogul alliance thanks to the fraud usurper
>Brahmin Peshwa - who was never acknowledged by most Maratha chiefs
Any proof ??? Or did you find this inscribed in the 4rth century coins ???
>and tribes as legitimate! But he and his Bahman nest was stuck in
>their court and capital, playing them off with intrigues, jealousies and
>assasinations. The son of Mahavir Shahu was even murdered by the
>Brahmins so the usurper could take over the court.
>
>>
>> > of (RSS's hated) Muslim Mogul Emporers between 1730-1760 until Moguls
>> > decided to betray them to Afghans who crushed the entire Maratha
>> > Army in 1761.
>> >
>> > The foolishness of the Brahmin usurper Peshwas in betraying the
>> > Maratha tribes and forming an alliance with the Moguls (who had
>> > killed Shivaji and his successors in the most cruel fashion) cost
Do you even know how Shivaji died ????
I am curious as to the sources of your conspiracy charges ???
Can you provide evidence of any Peshwa foul play ??
>>
>> Where are you pulling these gems from ? Now take that hand out of your pants
>> and wash it before stroking your keyboard ...... You are simply amusing
>> Gandasa ji.
>>
>> > the Maratha tribes over 100,000 Kshatriyas in 2 days and lead to
>> > their collapse.
>> >
>> > After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
>> > control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
>>
>> After Peshwas, there was no single power to unite Marathas and like
>> all Indians they fell prey to the British tricks.
>
>The non-Brahmin Maratha Army was chased by the British and their
>Bhiya allies for 2 years before being crushed in 1810s. They had
>been rebuilt by their tribal chiefs after 1761. After the Peshwa's
>alliance with Moguls (1730-60), and other mischiefs, Rajputs, Jats
>and did not trust the Peshwa. He was seen as a Mogul side-kick
>and back-stabber.
Provide proof of allegations !
Well if brahmans were beggers how come the sane Sakas uphold them so
high as to actually consult them all the time !!!
Another kill file material ???
>
>> All Germans are black. Horses can fly and you can probably lay eggs!
>
>Bahmans can well make pigs fly in their fantasies much less horses.
>But dasya Brahmins are definately of dravidian origin despite all the
>colonial white complexes! Germans need to re-read the RigVeda
>from Punjab and Gita from historically separate Gangasthan.
>
>Even their plagerized gangetic GITA forbids them from Land of Vedic
Provide evidence in Gita, give me CHapter #, Verse #......
>Aryans - Saptha Sindhva - and has dravidian god Krishna trying to
Just a question ! Are you related to Chaudhary Nijjhar Singh-ji ???
The Jat-Mussalman-Pir-Christ-of the living soul in the body
of Parmatma-Sadguru Nanak Dev-ji /???
You two belong together...
>kill Vedic god Indra! Then, there is the simple EYE TEST,
>nasal indexes, and DNA studies.
>
>Gandasa
>
>-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
>http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
gan...@my-dejanews.com
kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> Gandasa ji please provide references for your allegations
> against Marathi Brahmins calling Marathas as "Shudras". If you can come
> up, you are one up if not, I will consider your assertions as
> flights of fantacies.
Go ask Bal Thackery or any REAL Maratha in Mumbai!
>
> >Brahmin usurpers always considered Marathas to be "low caste
> >shudras" even though they were fed by them - always biting the
> >hand which feeds them like a thankless dog. Go ask MahaviraSaka
> >Bal Thackery, who used to be a good Maratha in his younger days.
>
> And who do you think is Thakare being controlled by : Brahmins, Are
> you kidding again ? DO you have any proof, any close Brahmin ally
> or Pundit he listens to ????
Controlled by indoctrination in Bhiya-Brahmin historical fraud
disseminated by RSS!
>
> Thakare is a self proclaimed leader of Marathas who have traditionally
> harboured dislike and hatred for the Moghuls much like their peshwa
> brothers.
Peshwa brothers from Malabar! Sakas prior to 10th century AD were
Buddhists and followed Saka religion (SUN worhip) and had their
own priests called Magas. They never practised the Brahmanical
Chatur-varna caste ideology. That is why all Saka rulers are hated
by Brahmins in their revionist books.
>
> FYI do you know who was the spritual guru of Shiavji???
> It was Ramdaas Maharaj, a Brahmin, although I don't think he ever
> called himself so, being the saint that he was. The Brahmins and
> marathas of Maharashtra have always had deep resentment of the Mleencha
> Moghuls.
Is there anyone 4% Brahmin palm readers dont have a "deep resentment"
for: Sakas - Jats, Gujars, Yadavs, Khatris, Marathas, Rajputs;
Muslims; Christians; Dalits; shudras; . . . . (i.e. whole of humanity).
>
> >Unfortunately, he also lost his head - both of them - to bhiya-kirar
> >fantasies and laundias exported from Gangasthan by RSS, Dasya samaj,
> >Hindu-maha-Saba, other bania/bahman dream organizations.
> >
> >But dont worry, he wants to kick the bhiyas out and join
> >the Saka Federation of Independent States. In fact, we want to
> >make him the first of rotationg Saka Presidents with title:
> >MahaViraSaka.
> >
> >The Saka federation will run from Mumbai to western Tibet
> The Peshwas never conspired with Moghuls.... Never..
> Can you provide references ?? I doubt though ....
You need to visit a library. The following are well
known and established facts:
1) The Brahmin Peshwa killed the 5 year old son of MahaVir Shahu with
poison to usurp the Maratha court and throne.
2) Brahmin usurpers always considered Marathas tribes to be dispensible
"low caste shudras" who could be exploited for their casteist
and supremacist ambitions and whims.
3) Foolish and disloyal Brahmin Peshwas (1730-60) then formed an alliance
with the Mogul Emporer AlamgirII and protected the Mogul Ruler and
his empire from Saka wrath when Jats, Sikhs and Rajputs
wanted to attack and end the Mogul empire.
4) The Moguls then screwed the Peshwa by switching to Abdali
and his re-powered Afghans in 1760, leading to defeat of Maratha
army and killing of +100,000 of brave Maratha warriors in 2 days.
5) The Marathas, who outnumberd the Pathans-Mogul army, were defeated
due to the incompetent and foolish Brahmin Rao made their
field general. He wouldnt listen to the experienced Maratha
Commanders and made planning and tactical blunders allowing
Afghans to cut his supply lines and starve them out.
6) Sikhs and Jats then had to face the Afghans and Moguls onslaught
alone but destroyed them and the Moguls by 1765. It is a
Brahmanist myth that Sikhs and Jats benefitted from Maratha victory
over Afghans.
There was NO VICTORY to help - in fact they were crushed due to
mistakes/policies of their foolish Brahmin Peshwas who even did
not trust the Maratha Chiefs/Army and put them under charge
of stupid Brahmin political appointees.
>
> You know the reasons why Rajputs never joined Peshwas ???
After the Peshwa's alliance with Moguls (1730-60), Rajputs, Jats and
Sikhs did not trust the Peshwa. He was seen as a Mogul side-kick,
ally and back-stabber. None of them had any desire to help a former
Mogul ally!
> Peshwas would not let the rowdy Rajputs to loot Delhi afterwards...
Why was the Brahmin Peshwa so concerned about "rowdy Rajputs"
looting the the Mogul Capital! Why not join in? These were the
same guys who cruelly tortured and killed half the Maratha founders
- none of them Brahmins but Sakas!
>
> The Sikhs well, they played sound politics and let the
> two mighty powers destroy each other...
Again the Marathas under the Peshwa were DEFEATED by Pathans/Moguls!
So the Sikhs (under Bagel Singh, Ranjit Singh, etc.) and Jats (under
Jawahir Singh, Suraj Mal, etc.) were facing a VICTORIOUS and
powerful Afghan-Mogul alliance thanks to the fraud usurper
Brahmin Peshwa - who was never acknowledged by most Maratha chiefs
and tribes as legitimate! But he and his Bahman nest was stuck in
their court and capital, playing them off with intrigues, jealousies and
assasinations. The son of Mahavir Shahu was even murdered by the
Brahmins so the usurper could take over the court.
>
> Since the Sikhs neither liked the Moghuls nor would they
> accept the Maratha ruler on Delhi's throne...
First, he had to take the throne - but the Peshwa was a Mogul
stooge supporting the Emporer Alamgir! He didnt trust his own
Maratha Chiefs and commanders and sought insurance for his
illegitimate usurper rule through Mogul-Muslim support and
alliance!!!
But even the Moguls fucked him and his 30 year haram-khori with
the Moguls by betraying him to Abdali and Afghans in 1761.
It is sad that it was the brave (non-Brahmin) Maratha warriors who
paid the price for his disloyalty, foolishess and treachery!
Kishore Joshi
>In article <7569iu$b...@Bayou.UH.EDU>,
> kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
>
>> Gandasa ji please provide references for your allegations
>> against Marathi Brahmins calling Marathas as "Shudras". If you can come
>> up, you are one up if not, I will consider your assertions as
>> flights of fantacies.
>
>Go ask Bal Thackery or any REAL Maratha in Mumbai!
Ain't that the dumbest thing you said !
How typical of these typical bad-mouthing Desis (Oops, Saka-Kaka)
when asked for proof all I get is Bull shit. Well goes to say a lot about
your evidence and your basis of judgement.....
>
>>
>> >Brahmin usurpers always considered Marathas to be "low caste
>> >shudras" even though they were fed by them - always biting the
>> >hand which feeds them like a thankless dog. Go ask MahaviraSaka
>> >Bal Thackery, who used to be a good Maratha in his younger days.
>>
>> And who do you think is Thakare being controlled by : Brahmins, Are
>> you kidding again ? DO you have any proof, any close Brahmin ally
>> or Pundit he listens to ????
>
>Controlled by indoctrination in Bhiya-Brahmin historical fraud
>disseminated by RSS!
You idiot, I am asking for proof not some more hot-headed
fiery accusations !!!
Proof, Proof, articles, studies, papers, newspapers, any
valid literary evidence is all I ask............
>
>>
>> Thakare is a self proclaimed leader of Marathas who have traditionally
>> harboured dislike and hatred for the Moghuls much like their peshwa
>> brothers.
>
>Peshwa brothers from Malabar! Sakas prior to 10th century AD were
>Buddhists and followed Saka religion (SUN worhip) and had their
>own priests called Magas. They never practised the Brahmanical
>Chatur-varna caste ideology. That is why all Saka rulers are hated
>by Brahmins in their revionist books.
Again the same idiotic babble. You moron any proof ?????
Don't just sit in front of your computer and type bytes and bytes
of gibberish. Cover up with proof
Show me the proof, not blanket accusations.....
>
>>
>> FYI do you know who was the spritual guru of Shiavji???
>> It was Ramdaas Maharaj, a Brahmin, although I don't think he ever
>> called himself so, being the saint that he was. The Brahmins and
>> marathas of Maharashtra have always had deep resentment of the Mleencha
>> Moghuls.
>
>Is there anyone 4% Brahmin palm readers dont have a "deep resentment"
Have you found any 4% Brahmin palm reader so far ???
If you mean to say that does any Brahmin not have "DEEP RESENTMENT"
Well, moi, M'sieu.
>for: Sakas - Jats, Gujars, Yadavs, Khatris, Marathas, Rajputs;
>Muslims; Christians; Dalits; shudras; . . . . (i.e. whole of humanity).
>
>>
>> >Unfortunately, he also lost his head - both of them - to bhiya-kirar
>> >fantasies and laundias exported from Gangasthan by RSS, Dasya samaj,
>> >Hindu-maha-Saba, other bania/bahman dream organizations.
>> >
>> >But dont worry, he wants to kick the bhiyas out and join
>> >the Saka Federation of Independent States. In fact, we want to
>> >make him the first of rotationg Saka Presidents with title:
>> >MahaViraSaka.
>> >
>> >The Saka federation will run from Mumbai to western Tibet
>
>> The Peshwas never conspired with Moghuls.... Never..
>> Can you provide references ?? I doubt though ....
>
>You need to visit a library. The following are well
You are a numb-skull. Give me the name of a book, a paper, article,
a reference......
You are getting to be like Ch. Nijjhar-ji and that idiot Sikhambo
You all should play cards together, visit zoo and socialize....
>known and established facts:
Established where ?????
Mo
>, leading to defeat of Maratha
army and killing of +100,000 of brave Maratha warriors in
2 days<
True , but the Afghans were so badly scarred that they
retreated from India and never came back and the Marathas
then captured Attock in NWFP.
Before this war the Sikhs had suffered one defeat and one
holocaust after another at the hands of the Mughals and
Afghans. After the Marathas made the Mughal emperor a
prisoner in Delhi , the Sikhs their ALLIES got relief and
started building their short lived empire until the Brits
came and trounced them ..
gan...@my-dejanews.com
kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> In article <7592bd$p$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, <gan...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
> >In article <7569iu$b...@Bayou.UH.EDU>,
> > kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> >
> >> Gandasa ji please provide references for your allegations
> >> against Marathi Brahmins calling Marathas as "Shudras". If you can come
> >> up, you are one up if not, I will consider your assertions as
> >> flights of fantacies.
> >
> >Go ask Bal Thackery or any REAL Maratha in Mumbai!
>
> Ain't that the dumbest thing you said !
> How typical of these typical bad-mouthing Desis (Oops, Saka-Kaka)
> when asked for proof all I get is Bull shit. Well goes to say a lot about
> your evidence and your basis of judgement.....
You dumb, lying, deceitful and cowardly kirar .... showing his
true colors by lying though his teeth.
It is much easier to convince a kirar brain that monkeys with tails
lit burnt lanka! And then this fraud wants references, papers, books.
Bahman post-11th century books dont even tell us on which
planet, millenium and solar system Brahmins were training monkey
armies, performing animal to human head surgery, flying udan-khatolas,
. . . and this fart wants a reference on Maratha tribes being
considered "shudras" by dasya-Bahmans!
> Proof, Proof, articles, studies, papers, newspapers, any
> valid literary evidence is all I ask............
> >
> Show me the proof, not blanket accusations.....
>
You pathetic kirar, here ARE some references . . . doubt it will
help.
Hari Ram Gupta, History of Sikhs, 1992 [p. 144, II]: In 1758, the Peshwa
"made an aggreement with Emporer Alamgir II and Prime Minister Imad-ul-mulk
to recover the lost province from the occupation of Ahmad Shah Abdali and
return it to the Moguls and in the ensuing engagements the Sikh and Maratha
forces successfully evicted Abdali."
H.R. Gupta further writes "Raghunath Rao possessed no statesmanship at all.
While leaving Punjab he should have realized that the Sikhs were a powerful
and warlike community. He should have formed some sort of an alliance with
them . . . they would have readily agreed to be comrades of the Marathas in
expelling the Afghans from Indian soil. . . . (he) gave little consideration
to Rajput Princes of Rajasthan, Jat Rajas of Bharatpur and Sikh Sardars of
Punjab. . . . Had the Marathas leagued themselves on an equal footing with
these elements Indian society, there would have been no battle of Panipat in
1761 and no Ghallughara in 1762".
J.D. Cunningham, History of Sikhs, 1849 [p. 153] writes "They (Marathas)
became free, but knew not how to remain independent, and they allowed a
crafty Brahman to turn their aspirations to his own profit, and to found a
dynasty of ‘Peshwas’ on the achievements of unlettered Sudras".
Kushwant Singh, History of Sikhs, p. 151: "In the autumn of 1759 Ahmend Shah
Abdali mustered a large army of sixty thousand Afghans to crush the Marathas
and assume control over the north. After a year and quarter of positioning,
the Marathas and Afghans clashed on the field at Panipat on January 14, 1761.
The battle was virtually lost by the Marathas before the actual fighting
began. The pushilanimous Sadashiv Rao Bhao entrenched himself in the town
and remained inactive form months. Abdali cut off the Marathas’ supplies
and compelled them to fight on empty stomachs".
Here is another references on the Saka Mauryas and Dharan-Guptas
dynasties in which gangetic Bahman shastras call their Saka Rulers
"sudras" centuries later in revisionist writings:
The Puranas do not even refer to the largest imperial dynasties of the north
such as the Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Dharan Guptas (320 AD - 515) as
"Kshatriyas". Regarding the Mauryas,
Dehiya, B.S., Jats: the Ancient Rulers, 1980, [p.147] states "Another
indication of the foreign origin (Saka) of these people is . . . The Vishnu
Purana calls them (Gupta rulers) Sudras. The Markandeya Purana brands the
Mauryas as Asura. The Yuga Purana called them `utterly irreligious, though
posing as religious'. The Mudra Rakshasa calls these people as mlechas and
Chandragupta himself is called 'Kulahina', an upstart of unknown family".
Kishore Joshi
>In article <759cqt$m...@Bayou.UH.EDU>,
> kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
>> In article <7592bd$p$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>, <gan...@my-dejanews.com> wrote:
>> >In article <7569iu$b...@Bayou.UH.EDU>,
>> > kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
>> >
>> >> Gandasa ji please provide references for your allegations
>> >> against Marathi Brahmins calling Marathas as "Shudras". If you can come
>> >> up, you are one up if not, I will consider your assertions as
>> >> flights of fantacies.
>> >
>> >Go ask Bal Thackery or any REAL Maratha in Mumbai!
>>
>> Ain't that the dumbest thing you said !
>> How typical of these typical bad-mouthing Desis (Oops, Saka-Kaka)
>> when asked for proof all I get is Bull shit. Well goes to say a lot about
>> your evidence and your basis of judgement.....
>
>true colors by lying though his teeth.
>
>It is much easier to convince a kirar brain that monkeys with tails
>lit burnt lanka! And then this fraud wants references, papers, books.
>
>Bahman post-11th century books dont even tell us on which
>planet, millenium and solar system Brahmins were training monkey
>armies, performing animal to human head surgery, flying udan-khatolas,
>. . . and this fart wants a reference on Maratha tribes being
>considered "shudras" by dasya-Bahmans!
What are you trying to say ???
You are becoming more and more illogical.
Anyways, your hot headed dim-witted responses are ignored;
Here are some
Non-Sikh references to Peshwa bravery.
J. Grant Duff says in "History of the Marathas":
"Bred a soldier as well as a statesman, Bajeerao united the enterprise, vogour,
and hardihood of a Maratha chief with the polished manners, the sagacity,
and address which frequently distinguish the Brahmins of the Concan.
Fully acquainted with the financial schemes of his father, he selected that
part of the plan Calculated to direct the predatory hordes of Maharashtra in a
common effort. In this respect, the genious of Bajeerao enlarged the schemes
which his father devised;
it may be truly said- he had both- the head to plan and the hand to execute."
Sir R. Temple says in "Oriental Experiences":
"Bajirao was hardly to be surpassed as a rider and was ever forward in action,
eager to expose himself under fire if the affair was arduous. He was inured to
fatigue and prided himself on enduring the same hardships as his soldiers and
sharing their scanty fare. He was moved by an ardour for success in national
undertakings by a patriotic confidence in the Hindu cause as against its old
enemies, the Muhammadans and its new rivals, the Europeans then rising above
the political horizon. He lived to see the Maratha spread over the Indian
continent from the Arabian sea to the Bay of Bengal. He died as he lived in
camp under canvas among his men and he is remembered among the Marathas as the
fighting Peshwa, as the incarnation of Hindu energy."
Jadunath Sarkar says in his forward to "Peshwa Bajirao I and Maratha Expansion":
"Bajirao was a heaven born cavalry leader. In the long and distinguished galaxy
of Peshwas, Bajirao Ballal was unequalled for the daring and originality of his
genius and the volume and value of his achievements. He was truely a carlylean
Hero as king- or rather as Man of action.' If Sir Robert Walpole created the
unchallengeable position of the Prime Minister in the unwritten constitution of
England, Bajirao created the same institution in the Maratha Raj at exactly the
same time."
Surendra Nath Sen says in "The Military System of the Marathas":
"The lover of Mastani knew well how to appeal to the religious sentiments of his
co-religionists, although he could scarcely be considered an orthodox Brahman.
.. Shivaji had given the Marathas a common cry, and none appreciated the potency
of that cry clearly than Peshwa Bajirao. Shivaji's military reforms he would
not or could not revive, but he stood forth, as Shivaji had done, as champion of
Hinduism. People of Central and Northern India saw in him a new deliverer."
>
>> Proof, Proof, articles, studies, papers, newspapers, any
>> valid literary evidence is all I ask............
>> Show me the proof, not blanket accusations.....
>You pathetic kirar, here ARE some references . . . doubt it will
>help.
You pathetic Sardar, you are now relying on the History of Sikhs
written by a Bania, Why the sudden trust in the very people
whose blood you despise, you zoo exhibit !
>
>Hari Ram Gupta, History of Sikhs, 1992 [p. 144, II]: In 1758, the Peshwa
>"made an aggreement with Emporer Alamgir II and Prime Minister Imad-ul-mulk
>to recover the lost province from the occupation of Ahmad Shah Abdali and
>return it to the Moguls and in the ensuing engagements the Sikh and Maratha
>forces successfully evicted Abdali."
>
>H.R. Gupta further writes "Raghunath Rao possessed no statesmanship at all.
>While leaving Punjab he should have realized that the Sikhs were a powerful
>and warlike community. He should have formed some sort of an alliance with
>them . . . they would have readily agreed to be comrades of the Marathas in
>expelling the Afghans from Indian soil. . . . (he) gave little consideration
>to Rajput Princes of Rajasthan, Jat Rajas of Bharatpur and Sikh Sardars of
>Punjab. . . . Had the Marathas leagued themselves on an equal footing with
>these elements Indian society, there would have been no battle of Panipat in
>1761 and no Ghallughara in 1762".
>
>J.D. Cunningham, History of Sikhs, 1849 [p. 153] writes "They (Marathas)
>became free, but knew not how to remain independent, and they allowed a
>crafty Brahman to turn their aspirations to his own profit, and to found a
>dynasty of ‘Peshwas’ on the achievements of unlettered Sudras".
How does the equation SHurra=Marathas apply here ????
And moreover remember this is
a Gora alluding to Marathas as Shudras, Gand-a-Sa ji , not a Brahmin .
>
>Kushwant Singh, History of Sikhs, p. 151: "In the autumn of 1759 Ahmend Shah
>Abdali mustered a large army of sixty thousand Afghans to crush the Marathas
>and assume control over the north. After a year and quarter of positioning,
>the Marathas and Afghans clashed on the field at Panipat on January 14, 1761.
>The battle was virtually lost by the Marathas before the actual fighting
>began. The pushilanimous Sadashiv Rao Bhao entrenched himself in the town
>and remained inactive form months. Abdali cut off the Marathas’ supplies
>and compelled them to fight on empty stomachs".
The above reference says nothing about Peshwa alliance with Moghuls or
about any of the other allegations you make. Stop posting irrelevant
references.
>
>Here is another references on the Saka Mauryas and Dharan-Guptas
>dynasties in which gangetic Bahman shastras call their Saka Rulers
>"sudras" centuries later in revisionist writings:
>
>The Puranas do not even refer to the largest imperial dynasties of the north
Do you know when the Puranas were written ?????
>such as the Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Dharan Guptas (320 AD - 515) as
>"Kshatriyas". Regarding the Mauryas,
>
>Dehiya, B.S., Jats: the Ancient Rulers, 1980, [p.147] states "Another
>indication of the foreign origin (Saka) of these people is . . . The Vishnu
>Purana calls them (Gupta rulers) Sudras. The Markandeya Purana brands the
>Mauryas as Asura. The Yuga Purana called them `utterly irreligious, though
>posing as religious'. The Mudra Rakshasa calls these people as mlechas and
>Chandragupta himself is called 'Kulahina', an upstart of unknown family".
That's because he was conceived of an ordinary maid in the King's palace.
You idiot post some valid references .......
gan...@my-dejanews.com
kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> >The Puranas do not even refer to the largest imperial dynasties of the north
>
> Do you know when the Puranas were written ?????
The current version date to 11th century AD - most are
plagerized, distorted, dasuized versions of earlier Saka Buddhist texts
(e.g. RgVeda, Ramayana, Mahabharta, etc.). All written in
devnagri text invented by gangu bahmans in ANCIENT 11th century AD.
No Brahmin temple/ruin in northern southasia predates 10th century AD.
>
> >such as the Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Dharan Guptas (320 AD - 515) as
> >"Kshatriyas". Regarding the Mauryas,
> >
> >Dehiya, B.S., Jats: the Ancient Rulers, 1980, [p.147] states "Another
> >indication of the foreign origin (Saka) of these people is . . . The Vishnu
> >Purana calls them (Gupta rulers) Sudras. The Markandeya Purana brands the
> >Mauryas as Asura. The Yuga Purana called them `utterly irreligious, though
> >posing as religious'. The Mudra Rakshasa calls these people as mlechas and
> >Chandragupta himself is called 'Kulahina', an upstart of unknown family".
>
> That's because he was conceived of an ordinary maid in the King's palace.
Another Kirar spicy fantasy; coins, inscriptions and Puranas
themselves show they were Saka dynasties expanding from northwest
Sakasthana. The Mauryas came from northern Sakasthan; Dharan-Guptas
from Mathura region. Kushana Sakas had 3 capitals: Peshawar
and Mathura and Jats ruled gangu-Brahmins in the east from there.
After the Guptas, Tibetans and Nepali ruled in Gangasthan until
Afghans and Moguls came.
Historical Fraud #3: "Brahmins made Kshatriyas"; "Mauryas and Guptas were
Brahmanas" !
Another central claim of neo-Brahmanist historical dogma is that Kshatriyas
(rulers) were created by Brahmins who loyally served their masters!
Moreover, in mainstream Indian history books written by Brahmanist
historians, the two largest imperial dynasties of southasia history - the
Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Guptas (320 AD - 515) - are claimed to be
Brahmanas and (Ghori’s) "Hindu" kings!.
Reality and Facts:
1) In typical Puranic myths, the "bad Kshatriyas" who refused Brahmin
codes and religious authority and did not respect them are claimed to have
been "annihilated" by Brahmanas who took birth as Kshatriya Devtas! For
example, Parsurama, the battle-axed Brahmana Rama, "destroyed all the
Kshatriyas" not once but "21times"! In reference to this incident, D.D.
Kosambi [p. 212] says "This is merely over compensation in poetic imagination
for the reverse phenomenon, the slaughter of the ancestors of Brahmins by the
warriors". Moreover, in their own revisionist and fantastical Puranic tale,
Parsurama had to bow before Rama and Laxman - Kshatriyas of Ayodhya - and
surrendered his arms.
2) In the northwest subcontinent, the Brahmanists have almost never
formed the ruling class over any known period of history. The recorded
rulers over 3500 years of known history have been drawn from the followings
groups and their descendants: British, Sikhs/Jats/Gujars/Rajputs, Afghans,
Moguls, Sakas (Scythians), Bactrian Greeks and Vedics. The Kshatriya (ruling
class, administrators and soldiers) during all periods and in all regions of
the world have come to power through conquest by their sword and military
prowess despite Brahmanical canards about "creating Kshatriyas". To gain the
favor and employment from chieftans rising to power, the ready witted priests
concocted fanciful tales of divine origin from solar and lunar lineages and
imaginary Brahmanical gods.
3) There have always been two types of ruling classes (Kshatriyas) in
southasia: i) those who patronized the Brahmin priesthood and
ii) those who felt no need or desire to do so and patronized other religions
(e.g. Vedic religion, Saka religion, Buddhism, Islam, Sufism, Sikhism,
Christianity). In dateless and placeless revisionist Brahmanical texts
(written centuries later when Brahmins gained larger influence; eg. post-9th
century Shankarcharya revival), the latter are dubbed "mlechas", "sudra", and
"low castes kings", etc. while the former are glorified with fantastical
tales and showered with the blessings of their devtas. The second type form
most of the known and verifiable Kshatriyas and ruling orders in the history
of southasia - all in the case of the northwest!
4) The Puranas do not even refer to the largest imperial dynasties of
the north such as the Mauryas (324 - 232 BC) and Dharan Guptas (320 AD -
515) as "Kshatriyas". Regarding the Mauryas, Dehiya [p.147] states "Another
indication of the foreign origin (Saka) of these people is . . . The Vishnu
Purana calls them (Gupta rulers) Sudras. The Markandeya Purana brands the
Mauryas as Asura. The Yuga Purana called them `utterly irreligious, though
posing as religious'. The Mudra Rakshasa calls these people as mlechas and
Chandragupta himself is called 'Kulahina', an upstart of unknown family".
Mauryan coins have the symbol of the sun, a branch, a humped bull and
mountain (Dehiya, p.155). All these are pre-eminently Scythian MassaGetae
icons who were Sun worshippers with the high mount symbolizing earth and the
irregular curving lines alongside it symbolizes water. The tree branch is a
symbol of productivity of the earth - agriculture and soldiering were the
traditional "noble" occupation of Sakas. The historians of Darius record
that when he attempted to attack the Scythian MassaGetae (an old-Iranian
culture of central asia) along the Black sea in the 5th century BC, the Saka
kings swore by the sun god and refused to surrender "earth and water".
D.B. Spooner who evacuated Pataliputra was struck by his findings and writes
in his article "The Zoroastrian Period of Indian History" as follows: "For
Chandragupta' s times, the evidences are more numerous and more detailed, and
indicate a following of Persian customs all along the line - in public works,
in ceremonial, in penal institutions, everything".
5) Regarding the Guptas, Dehiya [p.181] states "The coins of
SamudraGupta, Chandragupta I, Kacha, Chandragupta II Vikramaditya,
Kumaragupta I, Skandagupta, etc. all have the central asian long coat and
trousers and boots and long swords. This is the most significant fact
proving that the Guptas were in fact central asian Jats (a Saka tribe;
derived from “Getae”) . . . ".
P. L. Gupta writes "The most common gold coins of the Guptas appear to be the
direct descendants of the gold coins of the later Kushans . . .". He adds
that the standing pose of the Gupta kings at the altar is almost identical to
that of the Kushan kings, as is their dress - Kushan long coats and trousers
(uchkin, salwar/kameez). The Kushana or Kasvan tribe of the Sakas had rule
over Sakasthan (northwest) in the period from 1st century to 4rd century AD.
The early Gupta coins are significantly called "dinar" and their weight is
the same as those of westerly Kushana coins. Moreover, Alberuni (an Arab who
traveled to southasia in A.D. 1030) learnt that "the Guptas were powerful but
bad and the locals (in the gangetic region) celebrated the end of their rule
by starting a new era" (Dehiya, p. 190). This again supports the Scythian
origin of the Guptas: the end of the Saka empire in the eastern subcontinent
was a cause of celebration to the gangetic Brahmins.
6) The term "Gupta" is a misnamed version of "Jarta" found in early
texts and inscriptions by modern pro-Brahmanist historians (e.g. Majumdar,
Belvelkar, Satavalekar). "Jarta" is the sanskritized form of "Jat" as other
Saka tribal names "Gujar" become "Gurjara" and Munda become Marunda. Gupta
is derived from "Goptri" meaning "military governor" as in the inscription of
Skandagupta (Dehiya, p 176). It was not a surname or clan name but a title.
Chandragomin, a gramarian of 6th century AD, wrote "Ajay Jarto Hunan" or "the
invincible Jartas defeated the Hunas". Dehiya [p. 22] further writes "The
Jain author Vardhamana mentions Sakas and Jartas in 1139-40 AD (Ganaratana
Mahodadhi, Kasika, 201). Chandragomin, therefore makes no mistake at all
when he states that the invincible Jats defeated the Hunas. Yasodharman
(Virk) as well as the so-called Guptas were Jats . . . even though the Hunas
were themselves late-comer Jats. The clan name of Toramana and Mahirgula,
viz Jauvla, is still available among Indian Jats who are now called Jauhl.
Majumdar and Belvelkar have to revise their revision. Their is no need to
change the word Jat (Jarta) into Gupta. The original is quite correct and
was mentioned by a contemporary writer".
7) A contemporary inscription at Mandasor (558 AD) supports
Chandragomin's account that under the command of Yashodharman Virk, "the Jats
not only defeated the Huns but also exterminated them" (Puniya, 178). This
is futher confirmed by Archarya Gopita, a Jain scholar of the 12th century
AD, according to whom "Huns were defeated by the Jats". Similarly, the
Artharva Veda says that god Rudra is the king of a people called
"Garta-Sada": "Gartasadam Jananam Rajanam". Many modern Brahmanist
"historians" like Satavalekar, after numerous contortions (Dehiya, p. 310),
translate "Garta" as being equivalent to a cave (Guha) !
The coin, inscriptional, archeological and literary evidence from
Jain/Puranic/Persian/Buddhist/Chinese sources clearly demonstrate the
non-Brahmanical and non-gangetic origins of the Mauryas (Maur clan) and
Guptas (Dharan clan). Both are proved to be Saka imperial dynasties which
expanded their empire into the eastern subcontinent from their home base in
northwest "Sakasthana". Jat/Gujar clans and villages named "Maur" and
"Dharan" exist even today in Punjab, Haryana, Bihar and western MP.
Selected Historical References on Sakas and Northwest Sakasthana
(See Dhillon (1994) for catalogue of over 400 references)
Banerjea, J.N. (1987), The Scythians and Parthians in India, in a
Comprehensive History of India, edited by K.A.N. Sastri, Vol. 2,
Peoples Publishing House, New Delhi, India, 1987, pp 186-309, pp
830-838.
Bingley, A.H. (1978), History, Caste & Culture of the Jats and Gujars, Ess
Ess Publications, New Delhi, India (first published in 1899).
Cunningham, A. (1971), Coins of the Indo-Scythians, Sakas, and Kushanas,
Reprinted by Indological Book House, Varanasi, India (first published
1888).
Dahiya, B.S. (1980), Jats: The Ancient Rulers, Sterling Publishers Pvt.
Ltd., New Delhi, India.
Dhillon, B.S. (1994), History and Study of the Jats, Beta Publishers
Inc., Ottawa, Canada
Eggmont, P.H.L. (1970), Alexander's Campaign in Ghandhara and Ptolemy's List
of Indo-Scythian Towns, Orientalis Lavaniensia Periodica I, pp 63-123.
Gupta, P.L. (1988), Coins, National Book Trust, New Delhi, India, pp51-52.
Hewitt, J.F. (1894), The Ruling Races of Prehistorical Times in India,
South-Western Asia, and Southern Europe, Archibald Constable & Co. ,
London, pp. 481-487.
Herodotus (B.C. 490-425): The Histories, translated by de Selincourt,
Penguin Books, New York, 1988.
Ibbetson Denzil (1916), Punjab Castes: Races, Castes and the Tribes
of the People of Punjab, Cosmo Publications, New Delhi (1981).
Jats, The New Encylopaedia Britannica, Vol. Encyclopedia Britannica, Inc.,
Chicago, pp. 510.
Kosambi, D.D. (1953), The Study of Indian Tradition, Indica, Silver Jubilee
Issue.
Pradhan, M.C. (1966), The Political System of the Jats of Northern India,
Oxford University Press, London.
Ptolemy (90-168 A.D.), Geography of Claudius Ptolemy, translated and edited
by E.L. Stevenson, The New York Public Library, New York, 1932.
Pawar, H.S. (1993), The Jats: their Origin, Antiquity and Migrations,
Manthan Publications, Rohtak, India
McCrindle, J.W. (1987), Ancient India as Described in Classical Literature,
reprinted by Eastern Book House, Patna, India, pp 164-165 (first
published 1901).
McGovern, W.N. (1939), The early Empires of Central Asia, he University of
North Carolina Press, Chapel Hill, North Carolina, pp 419-21.
Rolle, R. (1989), The World of the Scythians, University of California
Press, Berkeley.
Sara, I. (1978), The Scythian Origin of the Jat-SIkh (Part 1 & 2), The Sikh
Review, pp. 15-27, pp. 214-233.
Smith, V. A. (1903), The Kushana or Indo-Scythian Period in Indian History
(165 B.C.-320 A.D.), Journal of the Royal Asiatic Society of Great
Britain and Ireland, pp. 1-64.
Tod, J.(1972), Annals and Antiquities of Rajasthan, Vol. 1, Routledge &
Kegan Paul Ltd., London, pp. 623(first published in 1829).
gan...@my-dejanews.com
kjo...@Bayou.UH.EDU (Kishore Joshi) wrote:
> You pathetic Sardar, you are now relying on the History of Sikhs
> written by a Bania, Why the sudden trust in the very people
> whose blood you despise, you zoo exhibit !
Here even your fellow Bania historian is saying "Peshwa was no statesman".
Trust him. The other was a British historian - J.D. Cunningham -
who was a political officer appointed to the Jat Empire of Bharatpur
(early 18th century) and then to Lahore (1840s). He saw the reduction
of the Marathas, Jats and the Sikhs by the British and their Poorbia
Hindu allies FIRST HAND. And wrote all his observations in a 1849 book!!!
He was fired by the British Govt. for being so forthright and for
criticising British policies against Jats and Sikhs.
I dont have any trust in any harami monkey loving bania or Bahman
- no matter how "educated" he thinks he is. They are all shit to the
core - and they know it too. I would put more trust in the integrity
and humanity of a Chamar over a Kirar lala - any time.
Fact is, these 7% kirars have no history and rulers but carry a mother
load of supremacist fantasies and are always monkeying around with the
history of others, especially Sakas and Punjabi Vedics. A couple of
exceptions one finds turn out to be treacherous namak-harami Bahman
usurpers who betrayed their lords to inherit non-Bahman empires
built by Sakas. E.g. killing Mahavir Shahu's 5 YEAR OLD son to set up an
illegitimate Peshwai in 1730; the Bahman Dahir who usurped a Jat-Saka
(Jasrat) dynasty in a region of Sindh (8th century).
In the entire western subcontinent, these 2 are the only recorded Bahman
dynasties out of 3500 years - and both were treacherous upurpers,
traitors, and namak-harams.
Within a couple of decades they even misgoverned, pillaged and drove
these Saka kingdoms into the sewer: e.g. Maratha debacle at Panipat, 1761; and
current hopeless and gutter state of former 1947 British Indian Empire.
Despite all the charades, the following well known and established facts
about the Maratha-Saka revival in the 17-18th century still stand:
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
Mo
I>1) The Brahmin Peshwa killed the 5 year old son of MahaVir
Shahu with
poison to usurp the Maratha court and throne.<
The Sandhiwali Sikh leader chopped off the head of Sher
Singh's five year old son in 1843
Will soon post an excerpt of Kushwant Singh's book..
Yash
> >
> >
> > After this disaster,the legitimate Maratha Tribal chiefs re-took
> > control and were quite successful in rebuilding the Maratha nation
> > the entire Maratha army between 1810-20s. This is how Marathas got
> > stuck in Fudusthan after getting independence from the Mogul-Rajput
> > hindusthani empire (50% of Mogul army/administration/officers were
> > HINDUS from Rajputanna).
> >
> > them become your political masters.