Death of Pa Houa Yang
Dan Browning
of Minneapolis? She seems to have been a wonderful girl. She was shot in the
head and dumped in a broken down van and her frozen body was found last
Friday.
I would be interested in speaking with friends of hers, or anyone else who
might be able to explain what happened.
Thank you.
--
Dan Browning
Staff Writer/Editor
Star Tribune
425 Portland Ave.
Minneapolis, MN 55488
612-673-4493
Ntuj Yug
biggest mouths. They love gossips and can never keep secrets, I am sure
someone knows something.
So much sh1t happens in MN,WI,CA. You people stay away from Georgia. If you
have to move away from MN,WI or CA than move to NC.
"Dan Browning" <dan-br...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:QMCdnXc3cOi...@comcast.com...
zhe...@hotmail.com
not be looking for gossip but truth. My condolences to her family.
http://www.startribune.com/stories/462/5197664.html
http://www.kstp.com/article/stories/S5676.html?cat=64
All4One
Ntuj Yug_You have the biggest AHOLE attitude and it's degrading
yourself here! Don't worried about us northerners, we wouldn't infest
you southerners cities or towns. Frankly I wouldn't change WI. for
Gorgia.
Now onto the topic. My condolences to the victim's family. Sadly that
such death is unnecessary and I hope who ever responsible will be
brought to justice. I encourage parents to spent quality time with
thier kids once a week. The more the better. Be invloved in their lives
at school and at home. Encourgae them to have an open mind.
jim
HmoobHlubHmoob
the hmong because of the wisconsin incident.
let's save some space in our prayers and warm thoughts for her and her
family.
zhe...@hotmail.com
you did not say there is a connection, but to suggest a connection is
already wrong. We have to be patient to see what the investigation
(formal and informal) produces. If you read one of the articles, her
father said that she had bad influence or hung with the wrong crowd.
Enough of the Hmong against Whites hysteria and hype. That incident was
about 1 American against 7 other Americans. It was a dispute between
licensed gun-owners and hunters.
Hmong-Lao
Nrog tsev neeg tu siab thiab khuv xim txog lawv ib tug zoo ntxhais.
HL
HmoobHlubHmoob
i am not saying it is. i didn't even suggest. i said i hope it isn't to
not strain the already distorted reality.
granted you might not be from minnesota, but i brought it up because
last week some kkk were distributing flyers in minneapolis promoting
hate against the Hmong.
It may not be apporiate in this post but i will challenge you - Don't
take it personal, this challenge is nothing personal, but the challenge
of ideas, views, and thoughts. I will challenge you - about the hmong
vs. whites or white vs. hmong. you know why? because the hmong have
been play the evil and ignorant one once again. how? minnesota and
wisconsin is giving out trainings to hmong hunters about laws and
regulations. the incident in wisconsin isn't about laws and
regulations! if it's law and regulations, the white hunters violates
just as much or even more if you think of percentage.
hence - a story following the chai vang story a white hunter invaded
and setup his own camp in private land. when comfronted, the white
hunter beat the shit out of the white land owner. we don't hear the
states reaching out to lawless whites.
zhen, just because you think hmong are americans, you really think
racist white people see hmong the same way? you might be labeled
american, but you aint white. the matter of the fact is the government
needed a scapegoat and pointed the gawl damn finger at the hmong as
ignorance and stupids who lacked training. "Oh these little people are
ignorant, train them and leave them alone, and don't listen to
them.they're probably lying about being U.S. secret war veterans." the
real issue is that these white folks are racist. RACISM is the real
issue here. An issue the white don't want to tackle. and hmong are too
afraid, egostical, and selfish to fight on.
Why not give trainings to racism whites about the Hmong and what they
have done for the shameless U.S. government, who betrayed the hmong as
a results 100 thousands of hmong perished from the face of the earth?
why not level the playing field? mr. zhen don't sit on your comfy
little computer chair and try to tell me "Enough of the Hmong against
Whites hysteria and hype."
I am one who promote love and peace, but to hide and run away or ignore
the real racist issue at hand is an cowardly excuse for the white and
the hmong.
If the hmong in minnesota and wisconsin were honest with themselves,
they would reject those damn trainings and call for trainings across
the board to all hunters on laws, regulations, and the marriage between
the Hmong and the US.
Once again don't take it personal, this challenge is about ideas,
views, and thoughts.
zhe...@hotmail.com
I don't have a comfy little computer chair. Up until you made that
statement, I did NOT think your response was personal. I still don't,
since you stated your intentions.
Minus your estimate of the number of Hmong people that perished as a
result of the Secret War and assumption of my comfy little computer
chair, I agree with most of the things you said about the situation and
racism.
I only request that you open your mind to a discussion with me and my
point of view (which you already granted). It is already dangerous and
irresponsible enough that the media and a significant amount of
Caucasians turn the deer hunting incident into one involving a clash of
race and culture. Hmong people fan the fire by "defending" themselves.
We do not need to defend ourselves because we understand 1) the media
wants to sell its news, 2) the people really at fault are the licensing
agencies for deer hunting and gun ownership, and 3) all the individuals
involved in the situation have some degree of guilt. In fact, we should
not admit a "defense" of any sort since our people as a whole has not
committed a crime. Even something as seemingly insignificant as this
matters.
What we should do is to not say the obvious or throw out rhetoric, as
you are doing. We should educate and liberate those who acquiesce to
the biased news headlines. You see, some executive somewhere wanted to
sell his newspaper, and what better way than to splash a story of
massacare and race? If by using the newspaper/media people's mind are
made and influence, then we Hmong must understand this cause/effect
relationship and use the media to get our point of view and side of the
story across.
I am sure that if you were a political leader, you would not come out
and say of this girl's apparent homicide, "I hope this is not connected
to the deer incident." The media will have a field day with that
statement, and more magazines and newspapers will be sold as your
political career fade into the shadows (or social activist career). You
would not say this especially if there is no evidence that would
remotely suggest such an association--which is the case.
But by suggesting a potential link, you create a series of undesired
consequences. What if the girl's death was caused by her own friends?
What if she committed suicide? What if the KKK is enraged by such an
accusation or allegation and manefist their fury and hatred? Moreover,
you perpetuate the mentality of Hmong against Americans/Whites and/or
Americans/Whites against Hmong.
Believe me my friend, there is no Hmong against Americans/Whites. If
there is a Hmong against Americans/Whites, then these are anomalies of
society, they are the exception and not the rule. Only a very small
number of Hmong and Caucasians do posses pure hatred and contempt for
each other. If it was a majority, the Hmong could and would not
survive--I would no longer be able to work for that comfy little chair
you spoke of.
The rule is that Hmong people are with Americans/Whites--so much so,
that we are considered Americans. We are called upon to die for this
country, we are allowed to vote, we are accepted into this country from
being refugees, we speak the national language, etc... Like it or not,
Hmong people are as American as American can be. That is white I call
the idea of Hmong against Whites as hysteria and hype. They take
something that could be, and frame it as desired. They take something
small, and blow it out of proportion.
If we continue to see the deer hunting incident as a clash of race and
culture, then we have put our own necks at the edge of a blade. If some
isolated incident somewhere occurs and we say it's another case (or
might be, or hope not to be) of Hmong against Whites, then this
acknowledges the existence of such an adversarial relationship and
exacerbate the problem. If one ethnic Hmong dies, and we allude to
Hmong against Whites, then when one White person dies, they will in
turn point the blame back at us. This is a dangerous and vicious cycle
that we must not enter and if we find ourselves in, break out of
immediately. That is why I said that to even remotely suggest a
connection between hatred and what could be random acts of violence.
One more thing, I do not think the U.S. government really betrayed the
Hmong people. It may seem so because they backed out of the Vietnam War
and Secret War, but in the long run, they U.S. government really helped
us. They brought us here when they did not have to. Believe me, the
Secret War was a clandenstine war, and they could have covered it up
and not open up those refugee camps. Most authors and scholars admit
that the Secret War was so secret most information on it are still
classified. There is no doubt that this country provides for its
people, which we have become a significant part of, and we have
received our share of the benefits and sacrifices. In every country
Hmong people have ever lived in, including our own, we have loved the
countries and shed rivers of blood to protect their borders and
interests.
NeoHmong
Ua ntej tshaj plaws, thov nrog tsev neeg xeem Yaj hlub lawv tus ntxhais
Paj Huab. Dhau ntawd, thov koj tus me ntxhai Paj Huab tus ntsuj plig
mus dawb mus huv thiab thov kom Paj Huab rov los taw qhia rau tub ceev
xwv tias leej twg yog tus tua nws es kom tub ceev xwm ntes kom tau
tus/cov neeg phem ntawd coj mus loj cuj teev nws lub txim sai sai tom
ntej no xwb.
Tej teeb meem zoo li no yeej tsis xav kom muaj tswm rau yus tsev neeg
Hmoob kiag li. Ib yam li peb twb sib cav sib cav txog ntawm daim video
uas 5 tug me nyuam Hmoob tuag tim hav zoov ntawd lawm. Nod twb tsis
yog nyob tim hav zoov, ua cas tseem muaj tej xwm txheej zoo li no rau
yus tsev Hmoob thiab.
Neohmong
All4One
Just curiousity and nothing personal here. May I as what would you be
writing about? Will it be about her "gang" life and how she was
murdered or her life as the way her father would want the media to
write about? Often than not, medias are not very sensitive to
minorities' murder cases. They [Medias] hardly touches on the good
side of a minority's death and if they did, it will be a one or two
short paragraphs describing the person.
Anyway, I hope you find the resources you're looking for for your
report. I look forward to reading it soon.
jim
All4One
than one or two paragraphs..." :)
to...@witty.com
> --
> Dan Browning
> Staff Writer/Editor
> Star Tribune
> 425 Portland Ave.
> Minneapolis, MN 55488
> 612-673-4493
Dan, I think that a journalist with a little brain shouldn't ask this
type of info in this place.
I found so many tabloid articles by so many unprofessional (unethical)
writers about Hmong in Star Tribune. My respect and expectation fro the
paper are very low, and now you make it worst.
charli...@yahoo.com
I think any Hmong in SCH with your integrity should think twice before
taunting Dan. Dan seems like a genuine non-Hmong staff writer who has
been misled or misinformed that SCH forum produced credible Hmong news.
By now I'm certain even an illiterate Hmong elder knows he can't rely
on trevia news and gossips.
Charlie
to...@witty.com
> should think twice before taunting Dan.
I did, and I response with hesitation.
> Dan seems like a genuine non-Hmong staff writer who has
> been misled or misinformed that SCH forum produced credible Hmong
news.
> By now I'm certain even an illiterate Hmong elder knows he can't rely
> on trevia news and gossips.
Indeed, I noted that, that's why I try to prevent him from further
attack by knock him out first.
HmoobHlubHmoob
perhaps my line about you sitting on your wooden chair was unneeded and
my frustration got the best of me.
As to assume that my statement about hoping the crime WASN'T committed
because of hate - is fair and legitimate. It is to say, i hope it isn't
the case.. i don't understand your argument. There is nothing wrong
with this hope. Because recent history tells us it could be.
Your response was long - the fact remain; white folks needs to educate
the racist whites about the history of the hmong and conduct more
anti-racist, tolarance, and respect training to all. To train hmong
alone on laws and regulations is racist.
Hmong people can't run away from the real issue of racism. It they have
balls, they should fight it and instead of trying to kiss up. Kissing
up only prolong the truth and will reoccurred on our grandchildren.
Quote "If we continue to see the deer hunting incident as a clash of
race and
culture, then we have put our own necks at the edge of a blade. If some
isolated incident somewhere occurs and we say it's another case (or
might be, or hope not to be) of Hmong against Whites, then this
acknowledges the existence of such an adversarial relationship and
exacerbate the problem. If one ethnic Hmong dies, and we allude to
Hmong against Whites, then when one White person dies, they will in
turn point the blame back at us. This is a dangerous and vicious cycle
that we must not enter and if we find ourselves in, break out of
immediately. That is why I said that to even remotely suggest a
connection between hatred and what could be random acts of violence."
But it is. if those dead whites weren't racist, they won't fu*k with
Chia. Chia would of walked off and everything with be okay. but see,
they were racist and they taunted him, which led to their death. So
your above quotes is sad. You are filled with fear. Your speculations
are full of fear. If we are to put our neck on the edge of a blade, so
be it. What is life living as dogs. In fact dogs are treated better
then Hmong people.
Guess what zhen? if there were 17,000 american dog allies starvation
and dying in the jungles of Laos, the u.s. government would have saved
those dogs already.
Hmong people are a bunch of cowards if they think hiding in the shadow
of life long enough then racism will go away. Maybe you're scared
because you live with a bunch of racist whites. maybe ure too wealthy
and don't want to lose your life in the fight for equality and justice,
will let it past to your sons and daughters. Don't worry, those who
have all will lose all.
hmong people have been and are selfish, yet egostical cowards and will
be forever until they choose to stop living for personal gain and begin
living for human dignity.
zhe...@hotmail.com
Well, you seem to have a talent for assuming and jumping to
conclusions. All that you have said are very emotional statements, none
based on facts. You continue to show your misunderstanding of the
situation. What more, you have moved away from the original argument.
If you want to perpetuate the mentality of Hmong against Whites or
vice-versa everytime an incident occurs that happens to involve a Hmong
and a White person, then do so at your own peril. That is your
perogative. But, remember, you are hurting Hmong American and their
image when you play into such an idea.
I find some things very wrong in every one of your paragraphs above.
1. "Because recent history tells us it could be."
Would you mind telling me what recent history? Or is it your
short-sighted view that interprets isolated incident to be those of
hate crimes and racism? If there is a history, then please list the
cases and years.
2. "white folks needs to educate the racist whites about the history of
the hmong and conduct more anti-racist, tolarance, and respect training
to all."
White folks need to educated the racist whites? Keep waiting until you
reach 120 years for this one to occur. White folks will not do what is
your responsibility. Hmong people should educate all people about the
beauty of our culture and history.
3. "Hmong people can't run away from the real issue of racism. It they
have balls, they should fight it and instead of trying to kiss up.
Kissing up only prolong the truth and will reoccurred on our
grandchildren."
You are right, I have heard Hmong people discussing some way to offer
an apology for Chai's behaviour. That is kissing up, and that is wrong.
But Chai's case was not a situation rooted in racisim--racism was a
by-product of the situation. Chai trespassed onto someone's property,
and that caused the incident. You cited an incident where 2 whites were
involved in a similar situation, but yet, no mention of racism was
mentioned. That is because the issue was one of trespass and male
testosterone. Chai's case was exacly so. But the fact that Chai was a
Hmong helped the media paint the situation as one involving racism. The
fact that the media portrayed the situation as racism misled Hmong
people, such as yourself, to believe that indeed it was a racist
incident. Do you see the sequence of events here? Now, you continue to
be enraged and appalled at the idea of Hmong vs Whites or Whites vs
Hmong--which you should be, if this was the case, but it is not, so you
are wasting energy.
4. "So your above quotes is sad. You are filled with fear. Your
speculations are full of fear. If we are to put our neck on the edge of
a blade, so be it. What is life living as dogs. In fact dogs are
treated better then Hmong people."
Fear? I think the only person with fear is you. Above all, you seem to
fear racism, and I do not blame you since you have a personality easily
shattered and disturbed by hatred. Living as a dog? Is that how you see
yourself because of racism? Now, that is something truly sad. Dogs are
treated better then [sic] Hmong people? Maybe you treat your dogs
better than Hmong people, but I treat all people, including my own, as
human beings. Very sad indeed for your world-view.
5. "if there were 17,000 american dog allies starvation and dying in
the jungles of Laos, the u.s. government would have saved those dogs
already."
Please give me a reference for the 17,000 number. I believe you are
talking about the Chao Fa resistance fighters. This topic deserves its
own thread on various issues.
6. "Hmong people are a bunch of cowards if they think hiding in the
shadow of life long enough then racism will go away. Maybe you're
scared because you live with a bunch of racist whites. maybe ure too
wealthy and don't want to lose your life in the fight for equality and
justice, will let it past to your sons and daughters. Don't worry,
those who
have all will lose all."
I assure you, I am neither scared nor wealthy. Moreover, what happened
to your original intentions of hoping for the negation of bad things
against Hmong people? Now you are hoping Hmong posterity will inherit
the current ills of society and lose all that we have come to achieve
so far? I think you should change your name from HmongHlubHmong to
HmongHateHmong. The only prejudice here seems to be your view on Hmong
people.
7. "hmong people have been and are selfish, yet egostical cowards and
will be forever until they choose to stop living for personal gain and
begin living for human dignity."
Maybe this statement is more indicative of you, your family, your
relatives, or the Hmong people you live with. But the fact is, Hmong
people are giving, humble, and very loving people. Did you not pay
attention to my post above about our record of protecting the nation,
land and people we live with? Well, it seems like you respond only to
what you think will make you look better in this discussion. But
perhaps this is who you are, and I respect that.
Have a good day.
HmoobHlubHmoob
Of course some hmong are very giving but it doesn't say we can't bring
out the mentality of the hmong for who they are. i believe that in
order to make change we have to acknowledge and confront our flaws.
Those flaws i believe are the hmong being egostical, selfish, and not
willing to face the issue because they fear the hurt and lost. i
believe hmong and human dignity is first before personal.
i would say that all hunters accidently step into private land all the
time. Do you really think if those whites didn't taunt Chia and or
shoot at him first he'd killed them with such rage? The question here
is racism - why should the hmong teach the whites about racism?
Training hmong hunters only - is already racism. And how could the
hmong teach the whites about racism when we have brothers like you not
admitting to the racism? We are divided already - we can't even agree
on what we are fighting for, because we value ourselves more then human
dignity.
"Because recent history tells us it could be." LOL, i didn't mean to
confused you big brother, i was referring to the hate crimes in
wisconsin" - the killers" writing on trailor homes, the passing of hate
flyers in minnesota, the spray painting of homes in st. paul, and the
hmong whose house got egged in shoreview."
Zhen, you speculate with your statement about my statement " hoping
this isn't a hate crime". You speculate it would be fuel for more hmong
vs. whites. it's speculation. it has spur any hyteria except our
conversation.
Quote "Well, it seems like you respond only to what you think will make
you look better in this discussion. But perhaps this is who you are,
and I respect that. "
There you go another speculation, LOL. Maybe that's you since you
thought of it.
This is my orginal post "This tragic really troubles me. I hope it
That's my original post brother... do you think i want to look good
with that posting? Be honest man - you're the one who reply with all
the speculations of whites vs. hmong hysteria. LOL. - i lower my ego
and admit my wrong about your comfy chair- i'll get a new chair if you
like - no hard feelings. At some point you might want to admit training
only hmong hunters laws and regulations is racist and running away from
the issue.
By the way, i don't need people to tell or acknowledge me if i am good
or bad. I am good and bad all together even if no one is around in the
middle of the woods. FACT is i don't live for people's approval.
let's close this enlightening conversation - i concede. you sincerely
win brother - you are right and i am sincerely wrong. i am living as a
dog and like a dog, because i am a hmong, a people who face racism and
persecution for nearly 5000 years, been betrayed by its american
allies, and is living proof the suffering of man from its potential of
liberty and freedom by its own people. i bet you don't have the guts to
accept winning this debate and not reply to me. i bet you fear by not
replying that you'd be view as the loser.
enjoy your day. we should do lunch sometime and that's a fact.
zhe...@hotmail.com
easily shattered and disturbed by hatred.
Although I disagree with a lot of what you said, I also find myself
agreeing with at least one thing you say on every post. This time, it's
that we close this thread since it has nothing to do with the original
post.
And for the dog in you, here is a bone. :)
rex...@gmail.com
Rex Hamann
Andover, MN