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Hmong Virtual Nation-.. Revisited.
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DownUnder
Feb 1, 2012, 3:01:48 AM2/1/12
to
The concept of Hmong Virtual nation was part of my address to HND
Conference in 2002.
This concept is not my original idea since others had floated the idea
before but I have taken this idea further to make it a TOPIC for the
Hmong to consider (as I have indicated in my little book - The Root &
the fruit- Hmong identity - from Hmong ABC Bookshop).
In SCH, many people have touched on this topic more than once in the
recent past:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.culture.hmong&q=Hmong+virtual+nation&qt_g=Search+this+group
While the Hmong Nationalities Org of Drs Shoua Yang/Xoua Thao has been
launched, but so far we have not see the ACTUAL VISION and Objectives.
But from their recent publicity in the Hmong press, it sounds very
much that they are aiming to create a US-based Hmong Nation within the
USA (as they have NOT engaged people outside the USA - except one
person only).
While we have NOT seen the whole BLuePrint of COHR but we know that
the orgnisation has been Registered as the "Hmong Nationalities
Organization, Inc". It is divided into 4 branches: the executive
branch, the Assembly branch, the Steering Committee branch and the
Endowment branch. The Assembly branch alone is split into some 20
departments with specific tasks..eg .culture and religion ect.. Every
person from the president down to the chair of a department are to be
elected by members and not by appointment.
This is as far as I know so far. (if any one can fill in the detail,
please do do).
Leaving the COHR to its task, I like to invite view on the Hmong
Virtual Nation (HmVN) concept where all the Hmong around the globe are
brought together as a Virtual Nation within the States that the Hmong
are living in. This HmVN is easily set up and put into practice given
the technology that we have today. At the moment, the Hmong are
already a very well structured society under the 5000 years practices
of the Clan, subclans + the many NEW Hmong organisations around the
globe. It is simply a move to bring all the EXISTING STRUCTURES within
the Hmong communities together, under a democratic elected members to
form TWO important Branches of the HmVN : the COUNCIL OF CLANS (which
comprise of the chief from each Clan - cov Nre-Xeem - similar to the
Fijian structure)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Council_of_Chiefs
and an EXECUTIVE BRANCH (like the Government - using the Swiss model)
to oversee the day to day operation of the HmNV.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Switzerland
Virtual Nations are not new entities as many other people have already
setting up their own virtual nationS and working closely with the UN
to be allowed to operate an a legal entitity Nation within the
framework of UN charter...
Comments & opinions are invited..
Dr Pao Saykao
Australia
Conference in 2002.
This concept is not my original idea since others had floated the idea
before but I have taken this idea further to make it a TOPIC for the
Hmong to consider (as I have indicated in my little book - The Root &
the fruit- Hmong identity - from Hmong ABC Bookshop).
In SCH, many people have touched on this topic more than once in the
recent past:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.culture.hmong&q=Hmong+virtual+nation&qt_g=Search+this+group
While the Hmong Nationalities Org of Drs Shoua Yang/Xoua Thao has been
launched, but so far we have not see the ACTUAL VISION and Objectives.
But from their recent publicity in the Hmong press, it sounds very
much that they are aiming to create a US-based Hmong Nation within the
USA (as they have NOT engaged people outside the USA - except one
person only).
While we have NOT seen the whole BLuePrint of COHR but we know that
the orgnisation has been Registered as the "Hmong Nationalities
Organization, Inc". It is divided into 4 branches: the executive
branch, the Assembly branch, the Steering Committee branch and the
Endowment branch. The Assembly branch alone is split into some 20
departments with specific tasks..eg .culture and religion ect.. Every
person from the president down to the chair of a department are to be
elected by members and not by appointment.
This is as far as I know so far. (if any one can fill in the detail,
please do do).
Leaving the COHR to its task, I like to invite view on the Hmong
Virtual Nation (HmVN) concept where all the Hmong around the globe are
brought together as a Virtual Nation within the States that the Hmong
are living in. This HmVN is easily set up and put into practice given
the technology that we have today. At the moment, the Hmong are
already a very well structured society under the 5000 years practices
of the Clan, subclans + the many NEW Hmong organisations around the
globe. It is simply a move to bring all the EXISTING STRUCTURES within
the Hmong communities together, under a democratic elected members to
form TWO important Branches of the HmVN : the COUNCIL OF CLANS (which
comprise of the chief from each Clan - cov Nre-Xeem - similar to the
Fijian structure)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Council_of_Chiefs
and an EXECUTIVE BRANCH (like the Government - using the Swiss model)
to oversee the day to day operation of the HmNV.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Switzerland
Virtual Nations are not new entities as many other people have already
setting up their own virtual nationS and working closely with the UN
to be allowed to operate an a legal entitity Nation within the
framework of UN charter...
Comments & opinions are invited..
Dr Pao Saykao
Australia
DownUnder
Feb 1, 2012, 3:35:03 AM2/1/12
to
Just a PS:
Please REVIEW all the past discussions at the following links:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.culture.hmong&q=Hmong+virtual+nation&qt_g=Search+this+group
before you make any comment. This is to ensure that what is SAID
before is NOTED so we need not repeat the same thing over and over
again...SCH is a goldmine of information and ideas. Review what we
have on the archive of SCH... noted and be understood.. So we can MOVE
on building from there.
du
On Feb 1, 7:01 pm, DownUnder <drpaosay...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The concept of Hmong Virtual nation was part of my address to HND
> Conference in 2002.
> This concept is not my original idea since others had floated the idea
> before but I have taken this idea further to make it a TOPIC for the
> Hmong to consider (as I have indicated in my little book - The Root &
> the fruit- Hmong identity - from Hmong ABC Bookshop).
>
> In SCH, many people have touched on this topic more than once in the
> recent past:http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.cul...
> Fijian structure)http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Council_of_Chiefs
Please REVIEW all the past discussions at the following links:
http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.culture.hmong&q=Hmong+virtual+nation&qt_g=Search+this+group
before you make any comment. This is to ensure that what is SAID
before is NOTED so we need not repeat the same thing over and over
again...SCH is a goldmine of information and ideas. Review what we
have on the archive of SCH... noted and be understood.. So we can MOVE
on building from there.
du
On Feb 1, 7:01 pm, DownUnder <drpaosay...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The concept of Hmong Virtual nation was part of my address to HND
> Conference in 2002.
> This concept is not my original idea since others had floated the idea
> before but I have taken this idea further to make it a TOPIC for the
> Hmong to consider (as I have indicated in my little book - The Root &
> the fruit- Hmong identity - from Hmong ABC Bookshop).
>
> In SCH, many people have touched on this topic more than once in the
> and an EXECUTIVE BRANCH (like the Government - using the Swiss model)
> to oversee the day to day operation of the HmNV.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Switzerland
Hmong-Lao
Feb 1, 2012, 11:20:03 AM2/1/12
to
> Please REVIEW all the past discussions at the following links:http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.cul...
Dr. Pao,
Ua tsaug uas koj rov muab nej tej qub lus tseem ceeb no rov los tham
dua rau peb cov kwv tau nrog hnov. Raws li kuv rov mus nyem nej cov
lus tham pem, nej txhua leej yeej muaj zoo lajlim tswvyim, txhua tus
yeej muaj zoo hom phiaj, thiab lub hom phiaj yeej yog TIB lub xwb, yog
xav kom lub Npe Hmoob no nyob mus ib txhis tsis pub ploj. Kuv nyiam
nej lub niam tswvyim no heev.
Ib nyuag tu siab me me uas Hmoob lub me siab tseem nqaim nqaim li. Kuv
txoj kev xav ib nyuag txawj koj txoj ces koj txawm liam ntsees hais
tias kuv yog liab, koj txoj kev xav txawv zog kuv ces kuv txawm muab
koj lias ntsees hais tias yog nyaj. Tabsis qhov tseeb, wb puav leej
yog cuam. (From Toua Yang's song)
Kuv pom nej tus puav tag txoj kev cia siab rau Hmoob lawm. Tabsis zoo
siab uas tshuav nej coob tus ua tij tseem tsis tau tag kev cia siab
rau Hmoob li; luag txawm muab yus tis ua nyaj ua liab lawm los yus
yeej tseem tuav rawv yus lub npe cuam tsis tso pov tseg. Xav kom cov
uas tau tag txoj kev cia siab lawm, rov txhab txoj kev cia siab kom
pub ntoob li qub. Los peb sib cog txhim kho haiv Hmoob kom nyob nrog
lub ntiaj teb no mus sis muaj hnub ploj.
HL
Ua tsaug uas koj rov muab nej tej qub lus tseem ceeb no rov los tham
dua rau peb cov kwv tau nrog hnov. Raws li kuv rov mus nyem nej cov
lus tham pem, nej txhua leej yeej muaj zoo lajlim tswvyim, txhua tus
yeej muaj zoo hom phiaj, thiab lub hom phiaj yeej yog TIB lub xwb, yog
xav kom lub Npe Hmoob no nyob mus ib txhis tsis pub ploj. Kuv nyiam
nej lub niam tswvyim no heev.
Ib nyuag tu siab me me uas Hmoob lub me siab tseem nqaim nqaim li. Kuv
txoj kev xav ib nyuag txawj koj txoj ces koj txawm liam ntsees hais
tias kuv yog liab, koj txoj kev xav txawv zog kuv ces kuv txawm muab
koj lias ntsees hais tias yog nyaj. Tabsis qhov tseeb, wb puav leej
yog cuam. (From Toua Yang's song)
Kuv pom nej tus puav tag txoj kev cia siab rau Hmoob lawm. Tabsis zoo
siab uas tshuav nej coob tus ua tij tseem tsis tau tag kev cia siab
rau Hmoob li; luag txawm muab yus tis ua nyaj ua liab lawm los yus
yeej tseem tuav rawv yus lub npe cuam tsis tso pov tseg. Xav kom cov
uas tau tag txoj kev cia siab lawm, rov txhab txoj kev cia siab kom
pub ntoob li qub. Los peb sib cog txhim kho haiv Hmoob kom nyob nrog
lub ntiaj teb no mus sis muaj hnub ploj.
HL
tzex...@msn.com
Feb 1, 2012, 11:33:30 AM2/1/12
to
> Please REVIEW all the past discussions at the following links:http://groups.google.com/group/soc.culture.hmong/search?group=soc.cul...
Nyobzoo Dr. Pao,
Hmong moved from nomad to democracy. The democratic system failed in
200s bc. Then clan republic, which is what we practice now, over
turned totality toward the late 1000s. This clan republic system
already failed around 1500s. We have to examine our past.
Restructuring our mind, belief, and practice--cultural evolution is a
must or face extinction.
Tzexa
Hmong moved from nomad to democracy. The democratic system failed in
200s bc. Then clan republic, which is what we practice now, over
turned totality toward the late 1000s. This clan republic system
already failed around 1500s. We have to examine our past.
Restructuring our mind, belief, and practice--cultural evolution is a
must or face extinction.
Tzexa
Yaj Tshaj Koob
Feb 1, 2012, 12:39:50 PM2/1/12
to
Koj cov lus hais tau zoo kawg lawm, yeej xav kom cov txawj ntse muaj
kev kawm sawv los nres Hmoob, tab sis kuv muaj kev poob siab loj heev
rau Hmoob tias ua cas los Hmoob lo lus Hmoob yuav ploj mus, tsuas
tshuav tus Hmoob lub cev tseem nyob xwb. Vim Hmoob tsi muaj av yog
Hmoob li, Hmoob qiv nrog luag nyob luag lub teb chaws thoob ntuj xwb,
zoo no xwb mas tsi muaj hnub uas Hmoob yuav tsi ploj, Hmoob yuav tsum
ploj xwb xwb thiaj tag, rau qhov nyob lub teb chaws twg yuav tau hais
lawv cov lus ntawm lub teb chaws uas yus nrog nyob, yog yus tsi kawm
lawv cov ntawv kom txaus yus yuav nrhiav tsi tau noj nrog luag, yus
kawm kom paub lawv cov dej num kev ua neeg hauv lawv lub teb chaws
kawg kawg kom yus muaj cuab kav ua tau ib tus coj, thaum ntawd yus cov
lus yuav tsi hais lawm, yog lis ces ib tiam yuav poob lus Hmoob zuj
zus mus txog qhov kawg ces lus Hmoob ploj lawm, thaum Hmoob tsi muaj
lus lawm ces txhais tau tias Hmoob tuag tas lawm, tsuas muaj lub cev
nyob hauv qab ntuj tab sis qiv luag lus hais lawm xwb, thaum Hmoob
tuaj mus sib ntsib ces tseem yuav muaj tus txhais lus tib si thiaj to
taub.
Koj ua kwv thiab sawv daws cov kawm ntawv siab thiab cov muaj laj lim
tswv yim ho tuaj tham qhias kuv thiab cov uas tseem tsi tau paub tias
qhov yuav ua kom Hmoob tsi ploj Hmoob tej kev lis kev cai, thiab tej
lus Hmoob no, yuav ua li cas thiaj tsi ploj taus?
Luag lwm tsav neeg mas lawv muaj teb chaws yog lawv lub, tab txawm
lawv mus nyob lwm teb chaws lawv poob lawv cov lus tas lawm los lawv
tseem muaj lawv lub teb chaws tuav lawv cov lus cia tsi ploj, lawv rov
mus kawm tau, ua li nev Hmoob li leej twg yog tus yuav tuav Hmoob cov
lus thiab lub npe Hmoob cia? Ntseeg hais tias cov Hmoob uas tawm mus
nyob sab tawv dawb yog cov uas yuav xub xub ploj cov lus ua ntej, ces
cov lus yuav ploj xaus rau hauv Asia ua qab li ntau caum xyoo. "Neeg
tsi muaj teb chaws mas ploj lus xwb xwb vim lub ntuj tam sim no txawv
lub ntuj yav thaum ub lawm, yuav tsi muaj hav zoov rau Hmoob khiav mus
nkaum pem tej roob txog 1000-100 xyoo lawm, qhov nov yog lub main
point uas Hmoob yuav tau los xav.
YTK
Noogqejqawg
Feb 1, 2012, 3:32:10 PM2/1/12
to
Ua tsaug os, yawm Txawj aw.... Koj txawm hais mex xwb los koj cov lus
raug phiaj zoo heev, kuv xav naj.
nqq
raug phiaj zoo heev, kuv xav naj.
nqq
chia
Feb 1, 2012, 4:21:07 PM2/1/12
to
Nej cov tswvyim zoo siv tau lawm ntag, yog tseem muaj tus yuav los
united peb Hmoob kom peb rov los ua ke tau. Tab sis ua ntej peb yuav
mus tau yuav tau los taug peb Hmoob li keeb kwm kom zoo zoo es muab
tej kev uas Hmoob cov thawjcoj yav tag los tau ua tsuas dub tag lawm
rov ntxhuav kom dawb mas thiaj yuav mus tau. Tab sis nws yooj yim
hais nws tsis yoojyim ntxhuav Hmoob cov thawjcoj rau tiam no kom
pejxeem Hmoob ntseeg kiag li. Kuv raised Hmoob cov thawjcoj thiab
txawj ntse cov bad credits yav tag los tau ua rau Hmoob tag kev cia
siab tsis sib ntseeg xws li:
1) Tiam thaum Lauj Kiab Toom los ua Hmoob tus coj nyob Nplogteb-
Fabkis kom nws mus sau seb ntawd pej xeem Hmoob mas Fabkis kom sau 5
kis, tab sis nws mus sau 10 kis. Qhov no nws noj Hmoob ti txha nkaus
Hmoob thiaj sawv rog Pajcai.
2) Tiam Phasnyas Tub Npis Lis Foom los nws yeej hais nws xeem thiab
coj tsis tau ncaj.
3) Tiam Vaj Pov- Txiav Hmoob nyiaj noj yam tsis ntshai leej twg
kiag. Hais lus nrog raim phom thiab caij tsuj pejxeem Hmoob tuag
nthig.
4) Tiam Vaj Pov nyob Mekas- Vaj Pov thiab nws cov qhabnab txias cov
pej xeem Hmoob noj qab teb thoob qaum teb tej nyiaj noj, dag tias yuav
mus ua tebchaws.
5) Hmoob lub July 4th nyob St. Paul, lawv sau tau nyiaj ntau kawg,
tab sis yeej tsis siv cov nyiaj no los ua ib yam dejnum rau Hmoob.
Lawv muab ua private fund mus nkag lawv hnab tshos tag.
6) Hmoob lub New Year nyob Fresno los ib xyoos twg yeej sau tau nyiaj
ntau kawg, tab sis yeej tsis muab cov nyiaj no los siv rau pejxeem
Hmoob nws muab siv rau nws qhabnab ntawd uas private tag. Thaum kawg
thiaj li tsis sib haum nws thiaj li muaj noj ob lub tsiab peb caug.
Hmoob cov thawjcoj cov bad credits los cause Hmoob txojkev sib ntseeg
thiab sib koom no tawg tag lawm. Niaj hnub no nej pom Hmoob ua tau ib
lub bank nyob qhov twg rau Hmoob es kom Hmoob ntseeg tias lub bank
Hmoob no yuav khaw tau Hmoob tej nyiaj ncaj ncees es Hmoob tau luag
coj Hmoob tej nyiaj tuaj tso rau thiab mas?
Cov tub txawj ntxhais ntse yuav los coj Hmoob mus rau the future mas
yuav tau los build tiag tiag thiab lawv yuav tau clean lawv tus kheej
kom pejxeem Hmoob ntseeg thiab luag pom tias yus yeej clean lawm mas
nws thiaj li yuav mus tau.
Kuv tsuas qhib kev sib tham me ntsis li no nws tseem muaj ntau tab sis
cia kuv tso tseg li no.
MoobLeeg
Feb 2, 2012, 9:10:37 PM2/2/12
to
On Feb 1, 2:01 am, DownUnder <drpaosay...@gmail.com> wrote:
If Hmong wants just a Virtual Nation (Country), then why waste times,
monies and efforts to create one? In the US alone, there are more than
50 Indian Nations such as Apache, Cheerokee, Choctaw, Chippewa,
Navajo, Souix, just to name a few of the more populous ones. They
already have treaties with the US government to be sovereignty (have
their own territories, casino and government). My recommendation is
very simple--go get and choose one of their model (constitution,
bylaws, rules and regulations) see if it can be applied to Hmong or
tailored to fit Hmong and register with US government to see if Hmong
can be granted as a nation within a nation. In my humble opinion...
Chance is that Hmong will be rejected by the US but then we can go to
Jewish and Chinese people and replica their models. Good luck.
TaugRigNtev
If Hmong wants just a Virtual Nation (Country), then why waste times,
monies and efforts to create one? In the US alone, there are more than
50 Indian Nations such as Apache, Cheerokee, Choctaw, Chippewa,
Navajo, Souix, just to name a few of the more populous ones. They
already have treaties with the US government to be sovereignty (have
their own territories, casino and government). My recommendation is
very simple--go get and choose one of their model (constitution,
bylaws, rules and regulations) see if it can be applied to Hmong or
tailored to fit Hmong and register with US government to see if Hmong
can be granted as a nation within a nation. In my humble opinion...
Chance is that Hmong will be rejected by the US but then we can go to
Jewish and Chinese people and replica their models. Good luck.
TaugRigNtev
Tubcajceszoo
Feb 6, 2012, 8:56:50 PM2/6/12
to
Noogqejqawg
Muaj zoo Tswv yim lod tsis ua kom tau ces yog tswv yim dag hmoob xwb
os, Leej twg los yeej hais tau zoo kawg tiam si mus ua ces yog dag
hmoob xwb thiaj ua rau hmoob tsis muaj kev cia siab li lawm.
Tub
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