what some us marines think of bush war in iraq
Renowl
IRAQ WAR ENTHUSIASM QUESTIONED BY MANY AROUND CAMP PENDLETON
By Laura Kurtzman
Mercury News
OCEANSIDE - Leo Diaz, a young Marine from Texas based here at Camp Pendleton,
went to Iraq full of faith in the president who sent him. Today, he is burdened
by the horror of what he saw and shocked at what he calls President Bush's
``frat boy'' mentality in starting the war.
``I show up. I'm proud. I'm looking forward to do my part,'' said Diaz, 22,
whose father, uncle and grandfather served in the military. ``Turns out, we
find no weapons of mass destruction. People hurt, killed.''
Diaz voted for Bush in 2000. But now he plans to vote for Democrat John Kerry
for president.
Interviews with a dozen people, not all of them voters, in the communities near
Camp Pendleton found opinion was still in favor of the war, 2-to-1. But many,
like Diaz, express deep doubts about the reason Bush waged it and about the
president himself.
Diaz spoke on a day when the grisly news from Iraq hung heavily over Camp
Pendleton, which sent 14,000 Marines to Iraq in recent weeks. Nine Americans --
four civilian contractors and five soldiers -- were killed Wednesday in and
around Al-Fallujah, a stronghold of support for former Iraqi leader Saddam
Hussein that the Marines patrol. Also, news arrived Wednesday that another
Pendleton alum, Lance Cpl. William Wiscowiche, 20, of Victorville died in Iraq
in hostile fire.
Nearly everyone in these parts has a relative, a friend, a customer who has
gone to Iraq. Most do not talk about the war much. When asked about it, they
tend to speak in the grave tones of people for whom the conflict is as real as
their next-door neighbor.
Democrats were harsh in their criticism of the president. Republicans and
independents were more muted. Many sought ways to assuage their doubts about
the war in Iraq with assurances that it was worth the sacrifice to get rid of a
terrible dictator.
``I think we did the world a favor,'' said Jim Francis, 61, whose son is an
officer in the Marines on his second tour of duty in Iraq. Yet Francis, an
independent voter, holds the president responsible for the faulty intelligence
that Iraq possessed weapons of mass destruction.
``As far as Bush goes, I know I wouldn't vote for him again.''
Polls taken over the past year have shown that support for the war has declined
as the conflict has dragged on and casualties have mounted. But public opinion
has been volatile. It went up with Saddam's capture and down with the statement
by former chief weapons inspector David Kay that Iraq had no weapons of mass
destruction.
Not optimistic
At a tattoo shop on Oceanside Boulevard, owner Jason Betz remains a steadfast
supporter of the war, although he does not plan to vote. Betz has done a brisk
business in Bible verses and USMC tattoos for Marines since the war started. He
hates to hear of casualties. But he says the argument about weapons of mass
destruction is missing the point.
``Who cares if they didn't find weapons of mass destruction?'' Betz said.
``He'' -- Saddam Hussein -- ``killed people massively.'' But Betz is not
optimistic about helping the Iraqis.
``They don't want us there,'' he said. ``How are we going to change a
country?''
Across the street, Ernesto Flores, 21, was preparing to cut a man's hair.
Flores said Bush had gone on a tangent in starting the war in Iraq. ``Bush is
too much of a bully. He goes in there too quickly, instead of taking his
time,'' said Flores, a Democrat. ``Osama bin Laden was the one that took care
of the twin towers.''
Flores said that when Marines come for a haircut, they don't say much about
Iraq, beyond how hot it is and how happy they are to be home. But sometimes
they mention friends who were killed.
Still supportive
At Crozier's Flowers in nearby Vista, Nannell Miller, 62 and a Republican, has
arranged flowers for some of the local funerals. But it has not shaken her
support for the president, who she thinks is being blamed unfairly.
``I don't think it's a simple solution,'' she said. ``I hate war, and I'm sorry
so many are being killed. The whole thing is just horrible. I don't know what
anyone else could do.''
Her delivery man, Jack Miles, a 67-year-old Republican, recalled hearing
President Clinton's officials say they feared that Iraq possessed banned
weapons, ``and yet we go in there and don't find weapons of mass destruction,
and it's all Bush's fault.''
But for Diaz, the Marine, the war most assuredly is Bush's fault -- not that he
thinks it was all bad.
``I feel we did some good being over there,'' he said, waiting to get the
finishing touches on a new tattoo.
But the memories also burn of what he could not do. Diaz was part of a security
unit that followed the invading forces to An-Nasiriyah in southern Iraq. He
remembered how old Iraqi men pressed close to the barbed wire of his camp to
pray for the Americans, only to find Marines pointing weapons at them under
orders from their commanders.
He recalled the shame of eating a hot meal, while hungry Iraqis watched.
``We couldn't give away water; we couldn't give them our MREs,'' he said,
referring to the packaged meals known as Meals Ready to Eat. ``It hurt me,
because I saw the children -- beautiful children -- running around, no
clothes.''
What he remembers most, though, is the horror of picking up dead bodies and
body parts.
``I can honestly say, my little workshop, we came back, none of us were the
same.''
Congenital Kano
"Renowl" <ren...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20040403013459...@mb-m10.aol.com...
> Doubts surface even in heartland of Marine Corps
> Interviews with a dozen people, not all of them voters, in the communities
near
> Camp Pendleton found opinion was still in favor of the war, 2-to-1. But
many,
> like Diaz, express deep doubts about the reason Bush waged it and about
the
> president himself.
OK. They interviewed 12 people. They report a 2-1 positive. That means
(absent rounding), that they got 8 positive responses and 4 negative.
One has to wonder ... did they keep asking until they found someone to
articulate the position quoted here? Were the first 8 pro? And they said,
"We gotta keep interviewing!"
In America, when anything gets a 66% approval, we call it a landslide. They
highlight the doubts. There will always be doubters. If, at this stage,
66% are for it, then that's pretty amazing.
See, you just can't help yourself. You gotta keep posting. Why not take it
to a hate Bush group, or a Republican group if you want abuse, and stop
posting American politics here? You keep slapping me, I will slap back.
You stop slapping me, we can conjugate verbs with Chris.
Hope springs eternal Pig
Congenital Kano
Um, BTW, Rennie, the article mentions *one* Marine...
But that requires comprehension skills Pig
LeeBat
>See, you just can't help yourself. You gotta keep posting. Why not take it
>to a hate Bush group, or a Republican group if you want abuse, and stop
>posting American politics here? You keep slapping me, I will slap back.
>You stop slapping me, we can conjugate verbs with Chris.
>
>Hope springs eternal Pig
He can't stop his foot.
LeeBat
whatever happened to Klein?
dj k
>
> IRAQ WAR ENTHUSIASM QUESTIONED BY MANY AROUND CAMP PENDLETON
>
> By Laura Kurtzman
>
> Mercury News
>
>
what puzzles me is this.............usa wll spend USD 8 BIG ONES in
afghanistan
and a few more biggies in iraq and about..........no beer, no wimmen, no
brutality
BUSH spends LESS THAN $ 2 MILLION in Philippines.............including $
750,000 for TEAM
AGILE and roughly $ 200,000 for overseeing may election
i'd say to bush ' spend $ 8 big ones in manila' and we'll make your military
very
happy
BEER, WIMMEN, AND SOME ELEMENT OF TORTURE, BRUTALITY,
CRUCIFIXON, PLUS BC DOPE