What price for democracy !!.. A view from a prominent Taiwanese
baldeagle
speaker at a forum organised by a Chinese newspaper. Some of his
comments are translated and reproduced below:
-- Democracy may be a very good thing...but there is a severe price to
be paid.
-- Popular politics could only bear bitter fruits. Chen did not
start being bad. He turned bad after 2003..Taiwan politics(democracy)
was then in shambles.
-- The start of irresponsible speech (freedom of speech) began from
magazines..it spread to the press and TV. In Taiwan, the stronger the
language, the more popular it is. In the end, nobody can tell who is
right and who is wrong...what is right and what is wrong.
-- Leadership is no longer about leading...it is about pandering to
popular and loudest views. Mr. Chen was a master at it. There was no
moral integrity.
-- Good leaders were concerned about the suffering of the people. Mr
Lee TH and Chen SB did not seem to feel anything for the people. They
did not care if the people were hit by flood, typhoon or earthquake.
Instead, they were concerned about issues that they could make them
popular and make good money.
-- Under democracy, Taiwanese are left to fend for themselves. So life
was hard..many with low income have hardly enough to eat....thousands
are jobless. Why?
" You are not competitive enough, you deserve it" This was the
explanation given by Chen for their hard life. No help for the poor.
(In Singapore, the poor suffer the same hard life and our leaders
are equally UNCARING...no help for the poor Singaporean).
-- In Taiwan, politics become perverted and the norms of judgement
become perverted,
The US have only praises for Taiwan for adopting this liberal
democracy. The USA want to shaft such uncaring democracy down the
throat of Asian countries.
mohor-yen
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:9471fe86-e6d4-4e95...@v1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
ltlee1
Excellent observations from a Taiwan insider.
truth
Public transport in Taiwan is better than those in Singapore.
The people in Taiwan are more humane and friendly than
Singaporeans.
These are the observations of Singaporeans who have lived
in Taiwan.
Have you lived in Taiwan ?
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:9471fe86-e6d4-4e95...@v1g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
ltlee1
> The poor in Taiwan are better off than the poor in Singapore.
> Public transport in Taiwan is better than those in Singapore.
> The people in Taiwan are more humane and friendly than
> Singaporeans.
> These are the observations of Singaporeans who have lived
> in Taiwan.
> Have you lived in Taiwan ?
The observations offered by the Taiwanese is what he and many have
expected of western democracy and the reality of western demcracy. If
you have lived in both societies for prolonged period and you feel
that western demcoracy explains the differences between Taiwan and
Singapore you have mentioned above, please elaborate.
>
> "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
> > throat of Asian countries.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -
baldeagle
> The poor in Taiwan are better off than the poor in Singapore.
> Public transport in Taiwan is better than those in Singapore.
> The people in Taiwan are more humane and friendly than
> Singaporeans.
> These are the observations of Singaporeans who have lived
> in Taiwan.
> Have you lived in Taiwan ?
>
What are you trying to puke ?
A prominent Taiwanese observations and his take on
American liberal democracy in Taiwan and how it
failed Taiwan. ...its politics was in shambles,....
"free speech" led to confusion in morality...leaders
who failed to lead....leaders who became UNCARING...
and finally to perversion in politics.
As an outsider, are you saying liberal democracy
work in Taiwan..
If so, tell us your findings.
truth
and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
than dictatorial Singapore.
I don't have to mention that life in Taiwan is anytime better
than life in communist China.
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:1e60f8ed-8657-4c23...@x36g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
truth
who have lived and worked in Taiwan. Do these
observations support a democratic system of government
or a dictatorial form of government, I leave it to the reader
to judge.
What is there to explain. These are experiences and
observations by people who have lived in both Singapore
and Taiwan over a period of years.
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:f9fabd47-625b-406e...@o40g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
Lpro...@aol.com
> I am telling you that from the perspective of the poor and
> and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
> than dictatorial Singapore.
> I don't have to mention that life in Taiwan is anytime better
> than life in communist China.
>
Why are over 1 million Taiwanese living with their family in China ?
ltlee1
> I am telling you that from the perspective of the poor and
> and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
> than dictatorial Singapore.
Funny kind of reasoning.
I can also tell you that from the perspective of the poor and man on
the street in America, life is better for drug dealers than non-drug
dealers. What does it prove? Drug dealing is good?
> I don't have to mention that life in Taiwan is anytime better
> than life in communist China.
>
> > If so, tell us your findings.- Hide quoted text -
baldeagle
>
> I am telling you that from the perspective of the poor and
> and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
>
and totally subjective...in fact, it is utter garbage.
You failed to answer my question... have you proof that
US liberal democracy works well in Taiwan...
I can only conclude that the views given by the Taiwanese
at the Forum in Singapore is factual and true...US liberal
democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
Lpro...@aol.com
Don't even talk about Taiwan. What about United States. How is it that
a very develop country with highly educated people ended up directly
electing the worst President in history. A President that has now
bankcrupt the country, made enemy with 1 billion muslims, now picking
a fight with Russia, screw up the Iraq war, $4 gas price, ignore the
enviroment, gives tax break to oil company to make 11 billion. United
States now has the most unpopular President, the most unpopular
congress in history. Today the President blame congress, the congresss
blame the President.
Can some democracy advocate explain this mess ?
ltlee1
> These are perpectives of those Singaporeans
> who have lived and worked in Taiwan. Do these
> observations support a democratic system of government
> or a dictatorial form of government, I leave it to the reader
> to judge.
> What is there to explain. These are experiences and
> observations by people who have lived in both Singapore
> and Taiwan over a period of years.
The question is how to explain the observations. Coincidental or
causational? Does the form government determine the life of the poor?
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
baldeagle
> On Jul 18, 9:39 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> > These are perpectives of those Singaporeans
> > who have lived and worked in Taiwan. Do these
> > observations support a democratic system of government
> > or a dictatorial form of government, I leave it to the reader
> > to judge.
> > What is there to explain. These are experiences and
> > observations by people who have lived in both Singapore
> > and Taiwan over a period of years.
>
> The question is how to explain the observations. Coincidental or
> causational? Does the form government determine the life of the poor?
>
Don't waste time with this idiot. He puke nonsense from
Australia...not know actual conditions of the poor in
Taiwan or Singapore.
He avoided the pertinent question...did liberal democracy
work well in Taiwan? His silent spoke volumes...
truth
the Chinese Communist Regime is well know on these ngs.
I am just posting what I have been told. If these observations
and first hand experiences are indeed widespread, then
the Taiwanese democratic form of government even
with their unwilderness is providing for a better and happier
quality of life to the man in the street, than the orderly and
more statistically successful authoritarian Singapore
system.
To me what matters more is not the beautiful and glorifying
economic statistics but the real life on the streets of the
country.
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:c9408af8-bb35-4cb9...@k36g2000pri.googlegroups.com...
truth
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:85b456be-5566-4853...@q28g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
truth
To exploit the Communist Chinese people, the resources
and the lax environmental standards to enrich themselves.
Of course some Taiwanese are starting second and third
families in Communist China where the women are more
than willing to become mistresses to these rich people.
<Lpro...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:0dbb1ae0-332a-4db3...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
truth
knowing that u r nothing more than a communist
chinese stooge.
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:934c1048-c488-4b4a...@s21g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
skygod
you should compare also the perpectives of those under PRC.
if not, you will give netter the impression that YMB34xx-a-year is the
best amongst all politicial system.
truth 嚙踝蕭嚙踝蕭:
-- Posted on news://freenews.netfront.net - Complaints to ne...@netfront.net --
truth
working in Taiwan, it seems to work for the man in the
street. That they are more friendly and have a better
quality of life is indication that they are happy.
I am not sure that u as a middle class person is happy in
Singapore.
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:3a9628f8-ac29-4641...@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
skygod
sounds so sharp !!!
does this idiot know the actual conditions of the poor in PRC mainland ???
did he do less in avoding such pertinent question ????
baldeagle 提到:
truth
Communist China ?
<Lpro...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:7a105158-1364-4317...@d19g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
baldeagle
> From the observations and experiences of Singaporeans
> working in Taiwan, it seems to work for the man in the
> street. That they are more friendly and have a better
> quality of life is indication that they are happy.
> I am not sure that u as a middle class person is happy in
> Singapore.
>
>
> news:3a9628f8-ac29-4641...@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Jul 18, 9:35 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> >> I am telling you that from the perspective of the poor and
> >> and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
>
> > Your views from outside Taiwan and Singapore are bias
> > and totally subjective...in fact, it is utter garbage.
>
> > You failed to answer my question... have you proof that
> > US liberal democracy works well in Taiwan...
> > I can only conclude that the views given by the Taiwanese
> > at the Forum in Singapore is factual and true...US liberal
> > democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
Talk about your OWN views and your OWN observations in
Australia.
You are NOT qualified to talk on behalf of those living in Taiwan
and Singapore.
We know better than you, what is happening in Singapore.
We have heard from a prominent Taiwanese and
his view on Taiwan from his first hand experience. He say that
ltlee1
> Your static position of being a dogmatic supporter of
> the Chinese Communist Regime is well know on these ngs.
I don't have a static position on anything. Rather, I exercise
iindependent judgement all the time.
> I am just posting what I have been told. If these observations
> and first hand experiences are indeed widespread, then
> the Taiwanese democratic form of government even
> with their unwilderness is providing for a better and happier
> quality of life to the man in the street, than the orderly and
> more statistically successful authoritarian Singapore
> system.
Sounds like you are retreating from your position. What you at first
posted as factual is now second hand information. And the big "IF".
Concludion: You don't have snything solid to support your wish that
"the Taiwanese democratic form of government even with their
unwilderness is providing for a better and happier
quality of life to the man in the street, than the orderly and more
statistically successful authoritarian Singapore
system."
Thank you for making that clear.
> To me what matters more is not the beautiful and glorifying
> economic statistics but the real life on the streets of the
> country.
Come on. You don't really know the real life on the streets of
Taiwain. Do you?
ltlee1
> To be blunt, I don't give a shit to your observation
> knowing that u r nothing more than a communist
> chinese stooge.
Internet discussion is discussion based on fact and logic. You can
assume who I am and I can assume who you are. But all such assumptions
are irrelevant. The only question is whether one's observation is
factual and objective and whether one's reasoning is sound or not.
Else you are wasting your time.
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
.
Singapore and is now hiding somewhere in Perth
away from the Assusie Gov. He belongs to a class
known as Criminally Insane.
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:3cd981b4-0be7-49d8...@d19g2000prm.googlegroups.com...
ltlee1
> So u admit defeat.
Funny attitude.
>
> "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
> > work well in Taiwan? His silent spoke volumes...- Hide quoted text -
bmo...@nyx.net
"Excellent" for those not familiar with LT's deceit, means "agrees
with my agenda".
LT has never been to Taiwan but he loves to bash it. And we all know
why. You're not fooling anyone, snake.
bmo...@nyx.net
> On Jul 18, 11:08 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> > To be blunt, I don't give a shit to your observation
> > knowing that u r nothing more than a communist
> > chinese stooge.
>
> Internet discussion is discussion based on fact and logic.
Then start doing it.
> You can
> assume who I am and I can assume who you are. But all such assumptions
> are irrelevant. The only question is whether one's observation is
> factual and objective and whether one's reasoning is sound or not.
> Else you are wasting your time.
LT, you don't have a leg to stand on. You've been spewing garbage and
illogic here for years. Whenever it is pointed out to you, you spew
more garbage and deceit. And then you repeat yourself. You're doing a
really shitty job, LT. It's true, wanker. But I'll let you get back to
whatever idiocy you're currently up to...
bmo...@nyx.net
> To be blunt, I don't give a shit to your observation
> knowing that u r nothing more than a communist
> chinese stooge.
LT rarely makes sense and just cares about his agenda.
bmo...@nyx.net
Given your track record, I don't think you know what is going in your
own addled mind, let alone anywhere outside that piece of work...
> We have heard from a prominent Taiwanese and
> his view on Taiwan from his first hand experience. He say that
> US liberal democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
Ever been to Taiwan, beagle?
You're such a hoot.
bmo...@nyx.net
> Are Americans now having a better quality of life than
> Communist China ?
One of the most telling things about s.c.c. is that many of the people
who love to bash everything American are mainland Chinese like LT Lee
who have long ago forsaken China to live in the US. That's far more
telling than all of their dumb words. They can say what they like but
it carries no weight while they sip their lattes and bash the US via
free wifi.
>
> <Lproud...@aol.com> wrote in message
baldeagle
I've lived in Taiwan for many months...this is beside
the point.
The point is ....a prominent Taiwanese told a public
forum held in Singapore that liberal democracy FAILED
in Taiwan. Other Taiwanese at the forum agreed with
his views.
Can you proof that what he said was not true..
If you can, show us proof that liberal democracy work
WELL in Taiwan.
>
> You're such a hoot.
Garbage from garbage man.
bmo...@nyx.net
You are like LT in the respect that you like to find opinions that
agree with you and then treat them as gospel. Opinions are like
assholes - not to say that you are an opinion ;-)
Taiwan, like everywhere, has its problems. But "failed" is too strong
a word. You and LT are on some obsessive kick to show that rule by the
people is a failure. There are great things about living in a
democracy like the US or Taiwan, just living life, every day. I don't
think you have a clue as to that. Some things are too intangible for
you to grasp. You are blind to a lot of things right in front of your
face. You haven't the slightest idea.
And BTW, you are often a real dick in the way you make your "points".
That's why I give you so much shit and you deserve it. No joke.
baldeagle
>
> > I've lived in Taiwan for many months...this is beside
> > the point.
> > The point is ....a prominent Taiwanese told a public
> > forum held in Singapore that liberal democracy FAILED
> > in Taiwan. Other Taiwanese at the forum agreed with
> > his views.
>
> > Can you proof that what he said was not true..
> > If you can, show us proof that liberal democracy work
> > WELL in Taiwan.
>
> You are like LT in the respect that you like to find opinions that
> agree with you and then treat them as gospel. Opinions are like
> assholes - not to say that you are an opinion ;-)
Is this your analytical rational argument ???
It is your typical garbage.
> Taiwan, like everywhere, has its problems. But "failed" is too strong
> a word. You and LT are on some obsessive kick to show that rule by the
> people is a failure. There are great things about living in a
> democracy like the US or Taiwan, just living life, every day.
This is proof that democracy works well in Taiwan ????
This is rational and logical ????
It is your typical garbage.
I don't
> think you have a clue as to that. Some things are too intangible for
> you to grasp. You are blind to a lot of things right in front of your
> face.
Am I blind or your are totally full of your self...toooo
brainless to know better than the garbage you are
indoctrinated with by US spin doctors.
Judging from the garbage puked by you...we
know the answer.
>
> And BTW, you are often a real dick in the way you make your "points".
> That's why I give you so much shit and you deserve it. No joke.
More garbage from a garbage man.
If you can, show us that the prominent Taiwanese was wrong
to tell Singaporean and Taiwanese that liberal democracy
failed in Taiwan.
Show us US flawed democracy worked in Taiwan.
Show us that you are not a garbage man with a
brain full of garbage.
ltlee1
For those who are interested. The speech can be found from the
following:
http://www.zaobao.com/special/face2face/pages1/face2face080713.shtml
In contrast to western press which invariably described Taiwan's
democracy in rosy color, NanFang Shou provided a reality check. For
those who read Taiwan news regularly. Not much is new. Nevertheless,
it is an excellent summary on what had been wrong about Taiwan
demcoracy and the heavy price many citizens had paid.
Lpro...@aol.com
> Communist China ?
>
Obviously .... no explaination.
> <Lproud...@aol.com> wrote in message
> Can some democracy advocate explain this mess ?- Hide quoted text -
Lpro...@aol.com
> That is obvious.
> To exploit the Communist Chinese people, the resources
> and the lax environmental standards to enrich themselves.
> Of course some Taiwanese are starting second and third
> families in Communist China where the women are more
> than willing to become mistresses to these rich people.
>
Or to escape the gangsters, the poor quality education, the rundown
disorganised and dirty boring Taipeh, the rude Taxi and suicide
scooters and of course to escape the terrible screaming, shoe
throwing, hair pulling, Taiwanese women.
Taiwan is going down the drain economically. Heck even the college age
students are rushing to get into the mainland.
You have no idea how much money has already left Taiwan for China.
Taiwan will be bankcrupt in no time. You have to kowtow to China for
proping up Taiwan.
> <Lproud...@aol.com> wrote in message
baldeagle
> On Jul 18, 8:12 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> > Are Americans now having a better quality of life than
> > Communist China ?
>
> Obviously .... no explaination.
>
The debate is... whether liberal democracy work well
in Taiwan. According to a prominent Taiwanese,
Democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
An idiot say that Amercian enjoy better quality of
life than the Chinese ..a totally irrelevant statement
in this debate.
Is the comparison between quality of life betwewn
the USA and China...a proof that democracy worked
well in Taiwan ????
You are obviously as muddle-minded as the "idiot."
skygod
no matter how poor taiwanese are, they are much better than those
mainlanders, squeezed hard by your master CCP/PRC.
ltlee1 提到:
truth
> On Jul 18, 11:10 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>> From the observations and experiences of Singaporeans
>> working in Taiwan, it seems to work for the man in the
>> street. That they are more friendly and have a better
>> quality of life is indication that they are happy.
>> I am not sure that u as a middle class person is happy in
>> Singapore.
>>
>> "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>>
>> news:3a9628f8-ac29-4641...@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
>>
>> > On Jul 18, 9:35 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> I am telling you that from the perspective of the poor and
>> >> and man on the street, life is better in democratic Taiwan
>>
>> > Your views from outside Taiwan and Singapore are bias
>> > and totally subjective...in fact, it is utter garbage.
>>
>> > You failed to answer my question... have you proof that
>> > US liberal democracy works well in Taiwan...
>> > I can only conclude that the views given by the Taiwanese
>> > at the Forum in Singapore is factual and true...US liberal
>> > democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
>
> Talk about your OWN views and your OWN observations in
> Australia.
Why do u want my view on Australia when this thread is
about Taiwans.
Anyway I know u hate Australia so much. There is little point
in discussing Australia with you.
> You are NOT qualified to talk on behalf of those living in Taiwan
> and Singapore.
When was the last time you visited Taiwan ?
I have shown to you so often that I know much more about
Singapore than a Malaysian like you living in Singapore.
> We know better than you, what is happening in Singapore.
My foot. You don't even know that there are one room
rental flats in Singapore. When I told you about this u
find it so difficult to believe. Now u know better. There are so
many poor living in these cramped and dark flats living on candle lights.
> We have heard from a prominent Taiwanese and
> his view on Taiwan from his first hand experience. He say that
> US liberal democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
That is only his point of view. It need not be the right one nor
is it the only point of view on this matter. The sooner you realise
that there are always conflicting points of view in this world
on any matter, the better it is for you. Your efforts to influence
others to your point of views are pathetic.
If the USA is so bad as you believed why did you study
there and even bothered to obtained their PR ?
To me you suffers from inferiority complex in the presence of the
white man and thus used the internet to vent your frustrations.
No matter what the weaknesses of the American Political
systems, the relative peace and progress of the world owes
much to American global leadership.
If the American system is bad, why are they still the most
competitive economy in the world ? Why are they the only
remaining global power ?
truth
I have pointed to you ordinary Singaporeans experiences
of living and working in Taiwan. They claimed that the people
are generally happier than Singaporeans.
You just refuse to accept evidences which are contrary to
your confused mind.
truth
You take the opinion of one person to be the
gospel truth.
Grow up and learn.
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:65b01e4a-0869-42ab...@h17g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
truth
You are too blindly pro China for any meaningful discussion.
China may have come a long way since 1978 when they started
to open up and adopt Western Capitalist economic systems but
it has got a long way to go and there will be plenty of obstacles
along the way.
It is laughable to claim that China at the present is superior to
America.
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:eb2648a5-bbf3-41c8...@l28g2000prd.googlegroups.com...
ltlee1
> Not from you.
> You are too blindly pro China for any meaningful discussion.
> China may have come a long way since 1978 when they started
> to open up and adopt Western Capitalist economic systems but
> it has got a long way to go and there will be plenty of obstacles
> along the way.
> It is laughable to claim that China at the present is superior to
> America.
You are putting words into my mouth. When did I claim "China at
present is superior to America"? Care you back up your assertion?
baldeagle
emocracy FAILED in Taiwan.
>
> > Talk about your OWN views and your OWN observations in
> > Australia.
>
> Why do u want my view on Australia when this thread is
> about Taiwans.
>
Because you don't know about Singapore and Taiwan.
baldeagle
You don't know about Singapore.
Cannot prove flawed US democracy work well in Taiwan???
What a useless advocate !!!!
Ha ha ha
baldeagle
> You r really pathetic.
>
Saying it for yourself!
bmo...@nyx.net
> > And BTW, you are often a real dick in the way you make your "points".
> > That's why I give you so much shit and you deserve it. No joke.
>
> More garbage from a garbage man.
No, no joke. Your style is really that of a dickhead. That's why so
many people don't like you.
> If you can, show us that the prominent Taiwanese was wrong
> to tell Singaporean and Taiwanese that liberal democracy
> failed in Taiwan.
How about you show that he was right. You always demand others "prove"
things that really are just a matter of opinion. But you never "prove"
anything. You just talk like an asshole.
> Show us US flawed democracy worked in Taiwan.
>
> Show us that you are not a garbage man with a
> brain full of garbage.
Who's "us"? You and LT Lee? What a fucking joke. Everyone who reads
this NG knows that you post cock nearly all the time. Your head is too
far up your ass to be "shown" anything.
bmo...@nyx.net
> On Jul 19, 9:57 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> > Not from you.
> > You are too blindly pro China for any meaningful discussion.
> > China may have come a long way since 1978 when they started
> > to open up and adopt Western Capitalist economic systems but
> > it has got a long way to go and there will be plenty of obstacles
> > along the way.
> > It is laughable to claim that China at the present is superior to
> > America.
>
> You are putting words into my mouth. When did I claim "China at
> present is superior to America"? Care you back up your assertion?
It's obvious from your posts, even though you deny it.
bmo...@nyx.net
> You r really pathetic.
> You take the opinion of one person to be the
> gospel truth.
It's because he wants it to be true, so he accepts it. If he doesn't
want it to be true, he doesn't accept it. It's a very childlike
behavior.
> Grow up and learn.
Indeed.
> "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>
> news:65b01e4a-0869-42ab...@h17g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Jul 19, 9:40 am, Lproud...@aol.com wrote:
> >> On Jul 18, 8:12 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
> >> > Are Americans now having a better quality of life than
> >> > Communist China ?
>
> >> Obviously .... no explaination.
>
> > The debate is... whether liberal democracy work well
> > in Taiwan. According to a prominent Taiwanese,
> > Democracy FAILED in Taiwan.
>
> > An idiot say that Amercian enjoy better quality of
> > life than the Chinese ..a totally irrelevant statement
> > in this debate.
>
> > Is the comparison between quality of life betwewn
> > the USA and China...a proof that democracy worked
> > well in Taiwan ????
>
> > You are obviously as muddle-minded as the "idiot."- Hide quoted text -
mohor-yen
"ltlee1" <ltl...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:f9fabd47-625b-406e...@o40g2000prn.googlegroups.com...
On Jul 18, 8:39 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> The poor in Taiwan are better off than the poor in Singapore.
> Public transport in Taiwan is better than those in Singapore.
> The people in Taiwan are more humane and friendly than
> Singaporeans.
> These are the observations of Singaporeans who have lived
> in Taiwan.
> Have you lived in Taiwan ?
The observations offered by the Taiwanese is what he and many have
expected of western democracy and the reality of western demcracy. If
you have lived in both societies for prolonged period and you feel
that western demcoracy explains the differences between Taiwan and
Singapore you have mentioned above, please elaborate.
baldeagle
Garbage from a garbage man
baldeagle
garbage from a garbage man
abia...@my-deja.com
was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
http://udn.com/NEWS/NATIONAL/NAT1/4434160.shtml
Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
On Jul 18, 3:42 am, baldeagle <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote:
baldeagle
wrote:
> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
from brainless idiots
truth
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:eb81d8d1-d2dc-40bb...@u6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
truth
As a Malaysian migrant living in Singapore, your understanding of
the Singapore political scene is shallow. You still have lots to learn
from me.
If liberal democracy is not working in Taiwan, how is it possible for
the poor in Taiwan to be better off than the poor in Singapore.
How is it possible that the man in the street are happier than those
in Singapore ?
Are the Taiwanese not better off now than when they were under
the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek and his cronies ?
truth
of him ?
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
truth
He lies to the young malay girls just to get free
fucks from them.
Another pathetic and childish behaviour.
<bmo...@nyx.net> wrote in message
news:fc79d101-9bcc-4124...@34g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
abia...@my-deja.com
only those who are interested in Taiwan politics would have heard of
him. If you read Taiwan's China Times or renown New Journalist
magazine regularly, you should have read his articles on Taiwan
politics.
On Jul 21, 1:02 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> If Nan Fangshou is so great, why so few people has heard
> of him ?
>
> "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>
> news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
> > On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> > wrote:
> >> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> >> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> >> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> > He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> > community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> > forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> > But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> > elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
>
> > Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> > from brainless idiots- Hide quoted text -
abia...@my-deja.com
president of Taiwan? Not LTH, not CSB. It's dictator CCK.
> the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek and his cronies ?- Hide quoted text -
truth
I am more interested in the experiences of the man in
the street.
I have no doubt that liberal democarcies are better
for Taiwan than the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek.
The people and politicians in Taiwan are learning the
ropes of liberal democratic politics. Give them some
time to mature. I have no doubt that the present
system in Taiwan will be better than a communist
system of government. The liberal democratic system
may not be perfect in Taiwan but at least it is working.
Remember, the people of Taiwan has the choice as
to who govern them. This is most important.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:95cf595a-39d7-4695...@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
abia...@my-deja.com
politics. Former president Chen Shui-bian got only 18% approval rate
before his departure. And only 24% of Taiwan people think Taiwan
parliament is working properly. Last 8 years, 21 cabinet members have
been indicted for corruption, Chen Shui-bian, his wife, his son-in-
law, son-in-law's father all have been indicted for corruptions. And
fights between ruling party DPP and opposition party KMT were so
fiercely little has been accomplished in last 8 years, during that
period of time, Taiwan had negative economic growth which never
happened before in 50 years!!!
The new KMT government's approval rate also dropped to 34% in 2
months. So what else do you think it is better than before? Right,
Taiwan people have more freedom to express themselves, but Taiwan
media has also more freedom to BS and people can no longer tell what's
wrong and what's right. And that's what Nan Fanshou was talking
about!!! Go to Taiwan and watch TV to see what politicans are BS
about!!!
Or read the following to see current Taiwan politics, what a mess!
http://udn.com/NEWS/NATIONAL/NAT1/4434160.shtml
On Jul 21, 2:16 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> I am not interested in what these so call experts say.
> I am more interested in the experiences of the man in
> the street.
> I have no doubt that liberal democarcies are better
> for Taiwan than the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek.
> The people and politicians in Taiwan are learning the
> ropes of liberal democratic politics. Give them some
> time to mature. I have no doubt that the present
> system in Taiwan will be better than a communist
> system of government. The liberal democratic system
> may not be perfect in Taiwan but at least it is working.
> Remember, the people of Taiwan has the choice as
> to who govern them. This is most important.
>
> <abianc...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:95cf595a-39d7-4695...@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Nan Fangshou is quite famous in Taiwan. Of course, outside Taiwan,
> only those who are interested in Taiwan politics would have heard of
> him. If you read Taiwan's China Times or renown New Journalist
> magazine regularly, you should have read his articles on Taiwan
> politics.
>
> On Jul 21, 1:02 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > If Nan Fangshou is so great, why so few people has heard
> > of him ?
>
> > "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>
> >news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> > >> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> > >> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> > > He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> > > community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> > > forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> > > But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> > > elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
>
> > > Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> > > from brainless idiots- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
mohor-yen
or you choose to listen only those you want to listen like you do here.
"truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote in message
news:dRVgk.21388$IK1....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
mohor-yen
or you choose to listen only those you want to listen like you do here.
"truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote in message
news:dRVgk.21388$IK1....@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
abia...@my-deja.com
has died almost 4 decades now. His son CCK, another dictator inherited
CKS' presidency and has been regarded as the best president of Taiwan
that Taiwan people ever had. Sure, dictatorship has its own flaws but
same for democracy so dont tell us that democracy is a must for every
nation, it often do not work properly particularly for developing
nations. Even idiot George W Bush got elected TWICE, you tell us
what's wrong with democracy!!!
On Jul 21, 2:16 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> I am not interested in what these so call experts say.
> I am more interested in the experiences of the man in
> the street.
> I have no doubt that liberal democarcies are better
> for Taiwan than the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek.
> The people and politicians in Taiwan are learning the
> ropes of liberal democratic politics. Give them some
> time to mature. I have no doubt that the present
> system in Taiwan will be better than a communist
> system of government. The liberal democratic system
> may not be perfect in Taiwan but at least it is working.
> Remember, the people of Taiwan has the choice as
> to who govern them. This is most important.
>
> <abianc...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:95cf595a-39d7-4695...@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Nan Fangshou is quite famous in Taiwan. Of course, outside Taiwan,
> only those who are interested in Taiwan politics would have heard of
> him. If you read Taiwan's China Times or renown New Journalist
> magazine regularly, you should have read his articles on Taiwan
> politics.
>
> On Jul 21, 1:02 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > If Nan Fangshou is so great, why so few people has heard
> > of him ?
>
> > "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>
> >news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> > >> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> > >> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> > > He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> > > community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> > > forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> > > But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> > > elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
>
> > > Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> > > from brainless idiots- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
abia...@my-deja.com
democracy could not even get rid of caste system, what India needs is
a strong man, capbale leader to force "upper class" and "lower class"
screw each other for a century so caste system will disappear!
In 1980, India's GDP is way ahead of China, today, China is ahead of
India. So dictatorship can be good or bad, it works in China and
Singapore right now, Same for democracy, can be good or bad! So there
is no definite answer which one is good or bad. It depends! Like DXP
said, as long as it catches the mouse it does not matter if it is a
black cat or white cat. I hope you guys can be flexible to think if
his word is correct!!!
For developing nations, I think good dictatorship works better, it
provides efficency! Also, if you guys think democracy is a must, then
why Corporate America do not adopt it. Most of CEOs are handpicked by
current CEO or via exceutive search firms, because shareholders simply
are not capable of choosing good CEO. I dont even think ordinary
Americans are capable of electing their president either, tell us how
many Americans really understand complicated things like national
budget, foreign policy... etc?
On Jul 21, 2:16 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> I am not interested in what these so call experts say.
> I am more interested in the experiences of the man in
> the street.
> I have no doubt that liberal democarcies are better
> for Taiwan than the dictatorship of Chiang Kai Sek.
> The people and politicians in Taiwan are learning the
> ropes of liberal democratic politics. Give them some
> time to mature. I have no doubt that the present
> system in Taiwan will be better than a communist
> system of government. The liberal democratic system
> may not be perfect in Taiwan but at least it is working.
> Remember, the people of Taiwan has the choice as
> to who govern them. This is most important.
>
> <abianc...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
>
> news:95cf595a-39d7-4695...@w7g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
> Nan Fangshou is quite famous in Taiwan. Of course, outside Taiwan,
> only those who are interested in Taiwan politics would have heard of
> him. If you read Taiwan's China Times or renown New Journalist
> magazine regularly, you should have read his articles on Taiwan
> politics.
>
> On Jul 21, 1:02 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > If Nan Fangshou is so great, why so few people has heard
> > of him ?
>
> > "baldeagle" <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
>
> >news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
> > > On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> > >> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> > >> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> > > He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> > > community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> > > forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> > > But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> > > elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
>
> > > Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> > > from brainless idiots- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
baldeagle
Democracy worked well or failed in Taiwan ..This is
the discussion.
If you cannot focus and cannot contribute to the discussion
intelligently,....
please go somewhere else... do what you can do within your
intelligence limitation..
You are making a fool of yourself here.
baldeagle
> If Nan Fangshou is so great, why so few people has heard
> of him ?
>
>
> news:ac08a29b-63ba-4caa...@v21g2000pro.googlegroups.com...
>
> > On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> > wrote:
> >> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> >> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> >> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> > He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> > community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> > forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> > But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> > elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
>
> > Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> > from brainless idiots
He said, democracy FAILED in Taiwan and
supported his views with evidence.
Where he is great or not ... it was not your decision...
The newspaper invited him (not you), so they
must know that his views is of value to us in Singapore.
If you can, prove that he is wrong..with evidence
to support your arguments.
Can you?
rebmetpes
Another psycho liar !
truth 写道:
J.Venning
> Then you should ask Taiwan people what they think about current Taiwan
> politics. Former president Chen Shui-bian got only 18% approval rate
> before his departure. And only 24% of Taiwan people think Taiwan
> parliament is working properly. Last 8 years, 21 cabinet members have
> been indicted for corruption, Chen Shui-bian, his wife, his son-in-
> law, son-in-law's father all have been indicted for corruptions. And
> fights between ruling party DPP and opposition party KMT were so
> fiercely little has been accomplished in last 8 years, during that
> period of time, Taiwan had negative economic growth which never
> happened before in 50 years!!!
> The new KMT government's approval rate also dropped to 34% in 2
> months. So what else do you think it is better than before? Right,
> Taiwan people have more freedom to express themselves, but Taiwan
> media has also more freedom to BS and people can no longer tell what's
> wrong and what's right. And that's what Nan Fanshou was talking
> about!!! Go to Taiwan and watch TV to see what politicans are BS
> about!!!
> http://udn.com/NEWS/NATIONAL/NAT1/4434160.shtml
>
This is the situation into which that old faggot Walsh troll wanted to
plunge China. Anyone who says that China *must* have a "democratic
government" doesn't know China and the Chinese people, but hates China and
wants to destroy China by creating chaos through "democracy". China must
NEVER adopt the Western style of Democracy - not now, not ever ! China must
develop her own form of government, suitable for the Chinese people, through
the improvement of education and living standards - without the interference
from foreigners.
J.
truth
handling the dissonance I have been giving to your
postings.
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:813fe0c1-f0fe-457d...@q5g2000prf.googlegroups.com...
truth
Are they to measure the qualify of life, the decisiveness of
the president or what ?
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:46e76e21-81b7-495a...@k37g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
truth
They had voted CSB for a second term.
What this shows to me is that the Taiwanese
people have the right to kick out those politicians
who they don't like. This is as it should be.
In Singapore, many people don't even have a
chance to vote.
Why are the Taiwanese media so critical of
Singapore ?
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:c489f8cd-4b20-47de...@k30g2000hse.googlegroups.com...
truth
did in Iraq ?
Not all dictatorships are bad. A benevolent dictator actually
is a good system of government as history has shown. However
the danger with dictatorship is that you can never know which
kind of dictator you are getting and it is very difficult to change
a dictator. Similarly not all democratically elected Presidents
are good. Some are better than others. However in a democratically
elected Presidency, the people have the chance to change a
lousy President.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:c238d437-d07a-4114...@j22g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
truth
dictatorships are bad. A benevolent dictator is a good
system of government. However, there is no way to
ensure that a dictator is a benevolent dictator and a
dictator once in power is very difficult to remove.
Not all democratically elected governments are good.
Some of them are lousy. But the good thing with
democracy is that this system allows the people to
replace a lousy government without major upheavals.
History has shown that dictators only fall after major
upheavals. In democracy there is peaceful change of
government. In dictatorship, this is not possible.
The current method of measuring progress in society
thru GDP is not a good one. Per capital GDP is not
a good reflection of the quality of life and happiness
of the people.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:996facbf-02e5-4d75...@e39g2000hsf.googlegroups.com...
truth
good. However democracy provides the people a peaceful
way to change a bad government hopefully for a better one.
If there is a way to put a benevolent dictator in power, I will
support such a system. As it is there is no such system.
Dictatorship by its nature does not provide for a peaceful
change in government. Which is better - taking chances with
a dictator and the possibility of upheaval if he turns out to
be bad or a democratically elected form of government with
opportunity of peaceful change should the elected government
turn out to be bad ?
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:5b1f2712-d621-4360...@j1g2000prb.googlegroups.com...
abia...@my-deja.com
(since DXP) and Singapore are lucky to have pretty good dictatorship
but sadly, Zimbabwe got a bad one and could not even get rid of it.
Taiwan is the only Chinese society that has democracy but quality is
not good. I think Taiwan should not have adoptd American democracy,
its people simply are not ready for it, they should do it step by
step.
On Jul 21, 11:17 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> As posted in my earlier reply to u, I agree that not all
> dictatorships are bad. A benevolent dictator is a good
> system of government. However, there is no way to
> ensure that a dictator is a benevolent dictator and a
> dictator once in power is very difficult to remove.
> Not all democratically elected governments are good.
> Some of them are lousy. But the good thing with
> democracy is that this system allows the people to
> replace a lousy government without major upheavals.
> History has shown that dictators only fall after major
> upheavals. In democracy there is peaceful change of
> government. In dictatorship, this is not possible.
> The current method of measuring progress in society
> thru GDP is not a good one. Per capital GDP is not
> a good reflection of the quality of life and happiness
> of the people.
>
abia...@my-deja.com
finishes this term even his approval rate has dropped to 18% (today's
news). If we want to adopt democracy, I dont think American democracy
is a good model, even better educated (on average) American people
still dont know how to elect their president, tell me how many people
really understand complicated issues like national budget, foreign
policy...etc in order to cast the ballots intelligently? I think
cabinet system is better, let people choose their representatives and
let winning party choose prime minister for the people.
On Jul 21, 11:08 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> So now you bash democracy over what George W Bush
> did in Iraq ?
> Not all dictatorships are bad. A benevolent dictator actually
> is a good system of government as history has shown. However
> the danger with dictatorship is that you can never know which
> kind of dictator you are getting and it is very difficult to change
> a dictator. Similarly not all democratically elected Presidents
> are good. Some are better than others. However in a democratically
> elected Presidency, the people have the chance to change a
> lousy President.
>
abia...@my-deja.com
CSB was like George W Bush, we could not even get rid of him until he
finished his term two months ago. It showed average Taiwanese still
dont know how to choose leaders wisely. So what's the solution, Mr.
Democracy? :-)
On Jul 21, 11:02 am, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> So the Tawanese has voted for a new President.
> They had voted CSB for a second term.
> What this shows to me is that the Taiwanese
> people have the right to kick out those politicians
> who they don't like. This is as it should be.
> In Singapore, many people don't even have a
> chance to vote.
> Why are the Taiwanese media so critical of
> Singapore ?
>
bmo...@nyx.net
> On Jul 20, 6:08 pm, "abianc...@my-deja.com" <abianc...@my-deja.com>
> wrote:
>
> > Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> > was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
> > Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
>
> He was invited by the Singapore Chinese journalist
> community to Singapore to speak on Taiwan ...at a
> forum organised by a Chinese Newspaper.
>
> But to an idiot in Perth, and one white monkey
> elsewhere, he is just another liar like them.
So in addition to all your other character flaws, you're a racist,
too?
> Of course, their opinion should be treated as just lies
> from brainless idiots
Actually, birdbrain, until you change your dickhead style no one will
be treating your words as anything more than shit-spewing. It's up to
you to try to change that... if you can.
bmo...@nyx.net
wrote:
> Yep, read the following news (in Chinese), that's what Nan Fangshou
> was talking about Taiwan politics, what a mess!
>
>
> Nan Fangshou is one of most famous political critic in Taiwan.
Is he controversial in Taiwan? Or do most people in Taiwan consider
him to be speaking the truth?
Also, do you know if any of his writings are translated into English?
> On Jul 18, 3:42 am, baldeagle <botakea...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote:
>
>
>
> > Nan Fangshou, a prominent Taiwanese was in Singapore recently as a
> > speaker at a forum organised by a Chinese newspaper. Some of his
> > comments are translated and reproduced below:
>
> > -- Democracy may be a very good thing...but there is a severe price to
> > be paid.
>
> > -- Popular politics could only bear bitter fruits. Chen did not
> > start being bad. He turned bad after 2003..Taiwan politics(democracy)
> > was then in shambles.
>
> > -- The start of irresponsible speech (freedom of speech) began from
> > magazines..it spread to the press and TV. In Taiwan, the stronger the
> > language, the more popular it is. In the end, nobody can tell who is
> > right and who is wrong...what is right and what is wrong.
>
> > -- Leadership is no longer about leading...it is about pandering to
> > popular and loudest views. Mr. Chen was a master at it. There was no
> > moral integrity.
>
> > -- Good leaders were concerned about the suffering of the people. Mr
> > Lee TH and Chen SB did not seem to feel anything for the people. They
> > did not care if the people were hit by flood, typhoon or earthquake.
> > Instead, they were concerned about issues that they could make them
> > popular and make good money.
>
> > -- Under democracy, Taiwanese are left to fend for themselves. So life
> > was hard..many with low income have hardly enough to eat....thousands
> > are jobless. Why?
> > " You are not competitive enough, you deserve it" This was the
> > explanation given by Chen for their hard life. No help for the poor.
> > (In Singapore, the poor suffer the same hard life and our leaders
> > are equally UNCARING...no help for the poor Singaporean).
>
> > -- In Taiwan, politics become perverted and the norms of judgement
> > become perverted,
>
> > The US have only praises for Taiwan for adopting this liberal
> > democracy. The USA want to shaft such uncaring democracy down the
> > throat of Asian countries.- Hide quoted text -
abia...@my-deja.com
on Taiwan politics, I dont think any of his articles have been
translated into English.
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
rebmetpes
election after the second term, NOT kick out by the Taiwanese !
truth 写道:
baldeagle
>
> Not all democratically elected government turn out to be
> good.
>
Do you agree, that democracy failed in Taiwan?
If you do, then there is no argument.
In fact, most developing nations found democracy to
be the reasons for their failures..
Leaders are more interested to be popular in order to
stay in power...often they implement policies to get
votes..or to create opportunities for corruption.
They failed to do what is best for their countries.
This is the fatal flaws in liberal democracy...of the
many failures in developing nations.
truth
Was there any major upheaval when he was replaced ?
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:a50ab45c-f52a-4e4a...@m45g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
truth
only super power left. How is it that they are number one in
so many things. They are still the leader in space. American
companies are still the leader in many fields. Their universities
are still tops.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:960ba978-74db-450a...@d77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
truth
ready form complete and total liberal American
democracy.
Singapore's benevolent dictatorship has turned into
a monster. He is so intoxicated with power and glory
that he has forgotten about the plight of the man in the
street. He is more interested in preserving his legacy
and name in history than in the present welfare and
standard of living of Singaporeans.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:904d82aa-51c5-4516...@f36g2000hsa.googlegroups.com...
truth
that the Taiwanese are still happy with their lives,
are indications that democracy has not failed the
Taiwanese. It could be better managed with a
less than absolute liberal American democratic
system but it is not a failure.
A system only fails when the society collapse and
the people suffer. The Taiwanese situation is
far away from that.
"baldeagle" <botak...@yahoo.com.sg> wrote in message
news:7769a423-5980-4d0d...@h17g2000prg.googlegroups.com...
baldeagle
garbage from a garbage man.
truth
It allows those with better ideas and capabilities
to rise up to serve the people.
<abia...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:2f3a64c4-fef8-43ca...@25g2000hsx.googlegroups.com...
abia...@my-deja.com
super power...
Speaking USA, sure, it's a great country, free entrepreneurial spirit
which few nation can compete, but dont forget what USA went through,
slavery, native American genocide, racial segregation (just abolished
half century ago)...without those, there is no today's USA. Any nation
was that evil, hmm... Nazi Germany was one. So dont over-credit USA.
There is dark side of USA and bright side of USA.
Oh dont forget Americans are heavy debt now due to huge trade deficit
that's why US dollar has sinked so fast, will USA maintain super power
forever? Hard to say!
On Jul 21, 11:03 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> If the American system is bad, how is it that they are now the
> only super power left. How is it that they are number one in
> so many things. They are still the leader in space. American
> companies are still the leader in many fields. Their universities
> are still tops.
>
baldeagle
>
> That there is a peaceful change in government,
>
>
Change of government or change of leaders ???
Has Taiwan change to a dictatorship or has
the leader, changed from Chen to Ma ?
If it is only a personnel change, then leaders in
Beijing are changed all the time, peacefully.
Nothing to crow about.
> > Do you agree, that democracy failed in Taiwan?
> > If you do, then there is no argument.
>
You still have not said ..whether or not democracy
has failed in Taiwan.
We are waiting.
abia...@my-deja.com
"little dragon" from #3 position after 8 years (Korea is ahead of
Taiwan now). Last 8 years, Taiwan had negative economic growth which
never happened in last 50 years. That's the price we paid for
democracy. And we dont know if we have chosen a good president
(President Ma) either. Of course, we can contrinue to try until we hit
a jackpot. So Mr. Democracy, what's the solution?
On Jul 21, 11:02 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> Well you have replaced him now.
> Was there any major upheaval when he was replaced ?
>
abia...@my-deja.com
one of most clean and efficent governments in the world. Agree or
disagree?
On Jul 21, 11:07 pm, "truth" <tr...@universe.com> wrote:
> You may have a point that the Taiwanese are not
> ready form complete and total liberal American
> democracy.
> Singapore's benevolent dictatorship has turned into
> a monster. He is so intoxicated with power and glory
> that he has forgotten about the plight of the man in the
> street. He is more interested in preserving his legacy
> and name in history than in the present welfare and
> standard of living of Singaporeans.
>
OD
> Yes we replaced him after 8 years. But Taiwan has become the last
> "little dragon" from #3 position after 8 years (Korea is ahead of
> Taiwan now).
In what sense? GDP? No that can't be it, since Taiwan was already behind
Korea when CSB came to power? Per capita GDP? No that can't be it since
Taiwan was ahead of Korea when CSB came to power and still is ahead Korea 8
years later.
> Last 8 years, Taiwan had negative economic growth
Surely you are not trying to say that Taiwans economy shrank for 8 years?
> which
> never happened in last 50 years.
One year of negative growth. Care to explain why Hong Kong and Singapore
also had negative growth that year? Democracy? Bad leadership?
> That's the price we paid for
> democracy.
By "we" you mean "they" since you live in the US.
> And we dont know if we have chosen a good president
> (President Ma) either. Of course, we can contrinue to try until we hit
> a jackpot. So Mr. Democracy, what's the solution?
What's your solution? A KMT dictatorship that would have brought Lien Chen
to power and eventually Ma anyway? It would have fattened your grandpa's
KMT corruption bank account so I guess you would have loved it.
abia...@my-deja.com
fell behind S Korea two years ago!!!
And I have Taiwan Resident ID, I can vote, you can't so "we" does not
include idiots like you.
On Jul 22, 11:00 am, "OD" <Ya...@yahoo.com> wrote:
OD
> Stupid idiot, Taiwan was ahead of S Korea when CSB came to power but
> fell behind S Korea two years ago!!!
In what? Not GDP. So what are you talking about?
> And I have Taiwan Resident ID, I can vote, you can't so "we" does not
> include idiots like you.
So you 'paid your price for democracy' in the US becuase you get to vote in
Taiwan? You just make up whatever crap you feel like, don't you? What
price did you pay for Taiwan democracy while living in the US? Let's hear
it.
abia...@my-deja.com
two years ago, stupid!!!
And I still pay taxes to Taiwan government due to family business and
real estates in Taiwan.
Oh dont forget to visit your corrupt CSB, his wife, his son-in-law,
son-in-law's father in jail soon!!!