No Asians really respect Chinese culture and history.
leol...@my-deja.com
It is giant mistake to believe Chinese culture and history are all
superior to all other Asian. Bragging Chinese superiority is of
Chinese people normal conversation which turns my stomach all the
time that inside of me I was laughing so much. I didn't want
to insult chinese friend that your culture and history are the
most complete failure of all time. What makes me sick is Chinese
people believe their culture are superior to my culture or all other
asian cultures. I want to say chineses: HELL NO!" Chinese don't
understand that many non-chinese asian dislike Chinese culture and
history. For example, I was talking to a Thai guy the first word
he talked of Chinese is : I DON'T LIKE CHINESE! I don't like Chinese
I don't like Chinese is main slogan for many Asian because of the
all the terrible legacy of bully chinese oppression. My Bhutan freind
told me that China is bully. That's the first word he talked of
Chinese. My Arab friend believes Chinese would invade their nation
one day just like they invaded to thousand of little countries.
For me Chinese issue is a just a ridiculous thing.
If I ever shamed to be Asian and has yellow skin on, it must be
the Chinese.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Joseph Mak
hey man... even though I know you're just an old time, has been troll...
you talk shit about koreans and chinese, and that's about as complex as your
subject matter gets. In a form of self validation, you really have to ask
yourself this, somtime...
do you think we even care?
j-mak
--
n i h i l i s m
enter an alternate paradigm
http://members.home.net/josephmak
icq: 3859389
haozertree
anyones. Comparing cultures is like comparing apples to oranges.
No culture is superior to another one.
What makes me sick is people such as yourself trying to
stir up racial hatred among Asians with your silly and
untrue stereotypes.
Happi Chin
You're blaming an entire people and culture for the policies of a
repressive government without even taking the time to realize that the
current regime isn't the entire people or culture. Chinese people are
also suffering from the actions of the government and Taiwan,
populated by, guess who, Chinese, is under the threat of war. You're
obviously a troll, but I thought that I'd state my piece.
On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 06:11:34 GMT, leol...@my-deja.com wrote:
>In article <38F115A3...@yahoo.com>,
> haozertree <omeg...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> I'm not trying to stir up any of racial thing. I'm just telling
> the experience I have. I've lately talked to Thai, Arab, Indonesian,
> Bhutan, Tibet people. They all expressed the same thing that they
> don't like China. I didn't push these people. They told me their
> people of cultural oppression of Chinese. These people told me
> their historical Chinese oppression. So you can't blame me for
> stir up racial thing. I'm just telling the thing they want to say.
Jim Walsh
wrote:
>Comparing cultures is like comparing apples to oranges.
>No culture is superior to another one.
>What makes me sick is people such as yourself trying to
>stir up racial hatred among Asians with your silly and
>untrue stereotypes.
Agree with all of the above.
Love, Jim
"But the evidence is in line with the well-established,
if little publicised, finding that democracies have far
lower levels of internal violence than non-democracies
This is not really surprising. The non-violent management
of conflict is the very essence of democracy." Kofi Annan
leol...@my-deja.com
I'm not trying to stir up any of racial thing. I'm just telling
the experience I have. I've lately talked to Thai, Arab, Indonesian,
Bhutan, Tibet people. They all expressed the same thing that they
don't like China. I didn't push these people. They told me their
people of cultural oppression of Chinese. These people told me
their historical Chinese oppression. So you can't blame me for
stir up racial thing. I'm just telling the thing they want to say.
> I am Chinese and I certainly don't consider my culture "superior" to
> anyones. Comparing cultures is like comparing apples to oranges.
> No culture is superior to another one.
> What makes me sick is people such as yourself trying to
> stir up racial hatred among Asians with your silly and
> untrue stereotypes.
>
Muse
Happi Chin <ere...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message news:dli5fscj6t39cjrib...@4ax.com...
> I'm not trying to insult you, leolee38, but you're a complete fuck.
> You're blaming an entire people and culture for the policies of a
> repressive government without even taking the time to realize that the
> current regime isn't the entire people or culture. Chinese people are
> also suffering from the actions of the government and Taiwan,
> populated by, guess who, Chinese, is under the threat of war. You're
> obviously a troll, but I thought that I'd state my piece.
proof that scaa can take a nice young man like happi, turn his
guts inside out, and convert him from happi chin to mad chin.
don't let it get to you hap, there are a lot of trolls here,
like richard, soo, and karen.
>
> On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 06:11:34 GMT, leol...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
Happi Chin
My sentiments, stated more calmly, would be that Chinese people are
individuals and blaming an entire people for the acts of its
government is foolish and assumes that the entire people and culture
are 'bad'. This simply is not so. Many Chinese sympathize with the
plight of the Tibetans.
I'd also like to ask, what the heck do the Arabs have against the
Chinese?
On Tue, 11 Apr 2000 07:31:21 GMT, "Muse" <fus...@bellatlantic.net>
wrote:
Muse
Happi Chin <ere...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message news:4hl5fs83od4o855k9...@4ax.com...
> Actually, I regretted posting this right after I sent it.
Don't forget - you can always cancel a post...(usually).
Just ask Soosan, she does it.
>
> My sentiments, stated more calmly, would be that Chinese people are
> individuals and blaming an entire people for the acts of its
> government is foolish and assumes that the entire people and culture
> are 'bad'. This simply is not so. Many Chinese sympathize with the
> plight of the Tibetans.
>
> I'd also like to ask, what the heck do the Arabs have against the
> Chinese?
not sure, but i suspect it probably has something to do with the
chinese government's oppressive policies towards the population
of muslims out in the extreme western parts of China...
william john sowa
Happi Chin <ere...@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>I'd also like to ask, what the heck do the Arabs have against the
>Chinese?
They are selling military secrets to both the Chinese and North Koreans,
so I would say that they don't have too much against Asians.
Nelson Lee
the Chinese to bully him around. Leo, your shame has more to do with your
inferiority than other people's superiority.
Tom Goodman
>
>
>
> It is giant mistake to believe Chinese culture and history are all
> superior to all other Asian.
It's a greater mistake NOT to.
"One of the greatest untold secrets of history is that the 'modern
world' in which we live is a unique synthesis of Chinese and western
ingredients. Possibility more than half of the basic inventions and
discoveries upon which the 'modern world' rests come from China. And
yet few people know this. Why ?"
"It is just as much as a surprise for the Chinese as for westerners to
realize that modern agriculture, modern music, decimal
mathematics,paper money, umbrellas, fishing reels, wheelbarrows,
multi-stage rockets, guns, underwater mines, poison gas, parachutes,
hot-air balloons, manned flights, brandy, whiskey, the game of chess,
printing, and even the essential design of the steam engine, all came
from China."
"Without the importation from China of nautical and navigational
improvements such as ships' rudders, the compass and multiple masts,
the great European Voyages of Discovery could never have been
undertaken. Columbus would not have sailed to America, and the
Europeans would never have established colonial empires."
"Without the importation from China of paper and printing, Europe
would have continued for much longer to copy books by hand. Literacy
would not have become so wide spread."
"Johann Gutenberg didn't invent the movable type. It was invented in
China"
"Issac Newton was not the first one to discover his First Law of
Motion. It was discovered in China."
"These myths and many others are shattered by our discovery of the
true Chinese origins of many of the things all around us, which we
take for granted. Some of our greatest achievements turn out to have
been not achievements at all, but simple borrowing. Yet there is no
reason for us to feel inferior or downcast at the realization that
much of the genius of the mankind's advance was Chinese other than
European. For it is exciting to realize that the East and the West are
not as far apart in the spirit or in fact as most of us have been led,
by appearances, to believe, and that the East and East are already
combined in a synthesis so powerful and so profound that it is
all-pervading."
"Until Europeans adopted the rudder from the Chinese, Western ships
had to make do with steering oars. This meant that long voyages of
discovery by Europeans were impossible. The famous voyages of
Christopher Columbus, Vasco da Gama, and others of their time were
only made possible by the adaptation of Chinese nautical technology.
The oldest western evidence for rudders is found in church carvings of
about 1180. This is within a few years of the first European evidence
for the ship's compass. Rudders and compasses thus seem to have
reached Europe at about the same time, which is hardly surprising,
since they were so closely associated. The rudders enables one to
steer a ship properly, and the compass helped one to decide where to
steer it."
"The Chinese sailed around the Cape of Good Hope in the opposite
direction to that taken by the Europeans and at an earlier time. They
were also first to discover Australia, landing at the site now called
Port Darwin. Chinese trade with Philippines and Indonesia was common;
and
trade with the eastern coast of Africa was so extensive that pieces of
broken Chinese porcelain are to be found scattered all up and down the
beaches of Tanzania and Mozambique, dating back for centuries. The
Chinese also made voyages to the American continents, though it is
questionable whether they were return voyages. "
"Another traditional Chinese invention was the "fenestrated rudder",
which is simply a rudder with holes made in it. The Chinese soon
discovered that while easing the task of turning the rudder through
the water, the holes did not appreciably diminish its steering
function. However, it was not until 1901 that fenstrated rudders were
introduced to the west. Until that time,a coal-fired torpedo boat that
traveling at 30 knots was unable to turn its rudder at speed.
Fenestration made this possible."
"It is no exaggeration to say that the superiority of the British navy
was to large extent due to its readiness to adopt Chinese inventions
more rapidly than other European powers."
"it could probably be safely said that the Chinese were the greatest
sailors in history. For nearly two millennia they had ships and
sailing techniques so far in advance of the rest of the world that
comparisons are embarrassing. When the West finally did catch up with
them, it was only by adapting their inventions one way or the other..
For most of history, Europeans used ships which were drastically
inferior to Chinese ships in every respect imaginable. They had no
rudders, no leeboards, no watertight compartments, single masts, and
square sails,which left them at the mercy of the winds to an extent
which today we would consider ludicrous.This continued to be the case
even into the19th century."
"It is by no means for racing and using lug sails with battens in the
classic manner. A race between two such vessels would be interesting
indeed. The junk is the direct ancestor of the yacht, but may still be
inherently better."
"Another book of 260 AD by K'ang T'ai describes ships with as many as
7 masts, used for sailing to Syria.The use of multiple masts was
rendered easy and natural in Chinese ships owing to the bulkhead
construction of their hulls, which have a whole series of obvious
cross-timbers capable of providing bases for masts."
"When Europeans eventually made their way into China and saw the
Chinese ships, with their many masts and their fore-and-aft rigs, they
were immensely impressed. The first attempt to copy what they saw was
the adoption in Europe of multiple masts on ships, with square sails
on the fore masts but a for-and-aft rig for the mizzen mast at the
rear of the ship."
"After an interval of at least 13 hundred years, Europeans thus
adopted Chinese concepts of rigging. In every way, whether for
navigation, propulsion, of steering, Europeans were dependent upon
Chinese ideas in order to be capable of the Great Voyages of
Discovery. The great colonial powers of the West, the Portuguese,
British, French, and other Empires, were the direct result of the
adoption by Europeans of CHinese technology on the high seas."
"The mechanical clock was invented in China in the 8th century AD. but
still in 1271, Robertus Anglicus in his commentary on the Sphere of
Sacrobosco tells us that in Europe 'artificers are trying to make a
wheel which will pass through one complete revolution for every one of
the Earth's, but they cannot quite perfect their work. If they could,
it would be a really accurate clock,a nd worth more than any astrolabe
or other astronomical instruments for reckoning the hours...'
"By 1310, this had finally been achieved in Europe. And the stimlus
for it seems to have been garbled accounts of Chinese mechanical
clocks which came to the West by way of traders. This was the same
century that brought to Europe the Chinese inventions of gunpowder,
segmental arch bridges, cast iron, and printing."
Excerpted from the book "The Genius of China" written by Robert
Temple, with comments from the late Joseph Needham - he was the
director of The Needham Research Institute, Cambridge University; also
the author of "Science and Civilization in China".
Tom Goodman
>Bragging Chinese superiority is of
> Chinese people normal conversation which turns my stomach all the
> time that inside of me I was laughing so much.
Frankly, I've never heard of any Chinese bragging their superiority
over the others, but I hear lots of white supremacist remarks bragging
how whites are most superior. Sounds like you're one of them white
Nazi trash ? If not, you must be one of those Moslem terrorists.
>I didn't want
> to insult chinese friend that your culture and history are the
> most complete failure of all time.
Chinese culture and history are failure ? At least 1/2 of the world
population eat rice - a Chinese tradition originated from China. USA
and many western nations accepted Chinese acupuncture into their
approved medicine. Canada even goes further approved acupuncture under
its national medical insurance. The textile you're wearing, is a
Chinese invention. And so on....
About history, China is the only ancient civilization existing that's
still going strong today. The Greek, Roman, Mayan, Egyptian, Syrian,
Persian and Mongol empires all gone. India is the only ancient
civilization that was in step with China , but now it's just a slum
trying to survive.
T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
, and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
Come visit my website.
Tom Goodman
>What makes me sick is Chinese
> people believe their culture are superior to my culture or all other
> asian cultures.
What makes me sick is sick people like you make up lies and stir up
racist hatred.
> I want to say chineses: HELL NO!" Chinese don't
> understand that many non-chinese asian dislike Chinese culture and
>history.
Tell me one non-Chinese Asian country that doesn't have rice as
regular diet.
>For example, I was talking to a Thai guy the first word
> he talked of Chinese is : I DON'T LIKE CHINESE!
Anyone has been in Thailand fully know that Chinese people are well
accepted and respected in Thailand. There is almost no cultural or
political difference between the Thai natives and Thai Chinese.
A highly probable reason for Chinese being so welcomed in Thailand can
be traced back to the Chinese rescue of a Thai king.
>I don't like Chinese
> I don't like Chinese is main slogan for many Asian because of the
> all the terrible legacy of bully chinese oppression.
Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
other nations like the way white AmeriKKKans did.
More non-Chinese Asians hate white AmeriKKKans.
Tom Goodman
Moslems' number 1 enemy is AmeriKKKa - the great Satan.
william john sowa
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>
>Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
North Korea ? Tibet ? Spratly Islands ? India ?
Anyway, I agree with you that the Chinese culture powerfully influenced
the rest of the world, and I also claim that Japan and Korea still, today,
retain more-than-obvious amounts of Chinese culture in their cultures.
But, what I disagree with you on is that you think "anything the Chinese
did before and anything the Chinese do now was and is great and
automatically beneficial to the rest of the world." I don't think so,
pal. The Chinese messed up a lot of things, too.
In any event, here is the Unofficial Chinese Space Web Site (which I think
shows off where the Chinese are with the rest of the world, regarding
space exploration):
http://taikonaut.163.net/
http://taikonaut.163.net/
http://taikonaut.163.net/
Blair Sheridan
<Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>On Sun, 09 Apr 2000 16:39:24 GMT, leol...@my-deja.com, wrote:
>
>>Bragging Chinese superiority is of
>> Chinese people normal conversation which turns my stomach all the
>> time that inside of me I was laughing so much.
>
>
>Frankly, I've never heard of any Chinese bragging their superiority
>over the others, but I hear lots of white supremacist remarks bragging
>how whites are most superior. Sounds like you're one of them white
>Nazi trash ? If not, you must be one of those Moslem terrorists.
Good reasoning from GooFFFman.
>
>
>The textile you're wearing, is a
>Chinese invention. And so on....
Untrue -- he was wearing tree bark.
-----------------------------------------
"...and lo, did the anvil drop upon Tom Goodman's head and yea verily was he made a cretin. Thenceforth, ascribeth he to me a love for the Chinese Communists, which I have not, as though the Nazis' 'Gott mit uns' were not enough. Oy vey."
Tom Goodman
john sowa), wrote:
>In article <gn0dfs0nkp3u9jcuj...@4ax.com>,
>Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>>
>>Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
>>other nations...
>
>North Korea ? Tibet ? Spratly Islands ? India ?
Which troops made up of white Europeans invaded Korea and took control
the south of it and attempted to invade north as well ? What happened
after Chinese had helped Koreans kicked the white trash back to the
dividing line ? Chinese let the North Koreans rule, whereas the white
trash still controls the puppet regime in south.
Which Dalai Lama suppressed hundreds of thousands of Tibetans,
enslaved and massacred them ? Who freed the Tibetan slaves from evil
Dalai Lama ?
If white AmeriKKKans ( who actually originated from Europe, not
America) sent troops all the way to Hawaii islands and forced them
into "USA", I can't see why Chinese can't consider Spratly Islands as
part of China ? After all, Spratly Islands have been occupied by
Chinese for thousands of years. It's known that Chinese not only
spread to Spratly Islands, they even went far down south into Java and
Suluwelsi. After all, Chinese were the first to able to sail far.
India ? India admitted it took Chinese lands because British "gave"
them. If China wanted to invade India, it would have carried on and
took over the entire India without any trouble. No, China only took
back what belonged to it, and kept India out.
Tom Goodman
john sowa), wrote:
>Anyway, I agree with you that the Chinese culture powerfully influenced
>the rest of the world, and I also claim that Japan and Korea still, today,
>retain more-than-obvious amounts of Chinese culture in their cultures.
>
Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic inventions
and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place. For
example, space rockets would not be here if gunpowder wasn't invented;
without gunpowder, simple fireworks and rockets couldn't be invented;
without simple rocket technology, space rockets couldn't be invented;
without space rockets, satellites couldn't be placed into space;
without satellites....
Without paper....
Without textile....
Without vaccine....
>But, what I disagree with you on is that you think "anything the Chinese
>did before and anything the Chinese do now was and is great and
>automatically beneficial to the rest of the world." I don't think so,
>pal. The Chinese messed up a lot of things, too.
China was on an up trend until Manchurians took control of China. Qing
Dynasty messed up China real badly. Even after the Qing was
overthrown, at the beginning of "new" China under Dr.Sun, it didn't
improve any because lack of good leadership, technology, finance, and
material support. If not for communist Russia's assistance, "new"
China would have been worse. Then came along the butcher -
AmeriKKKan-backed generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek, who put China into
chaos and returned to feudal state.
There was only one rescue and it was Chinese Communist Party led by
Mao, who defied the worse odds, saved 450 million Chinese and saved
China. Communism saved China and Chinese people. The problem with
communism is that it despises materialism; but humans are greedy and
always "lacking" materials - which communism doesn't support. That's
the reason PRC wasn't rich in materials until recent years when
Chinese people realize they must catch up with materialism to protect
them from foreign attacks.
If we look at the 50 years before PRC formed and the 50 years after,
no matter how worse it was in the last 50 years in China, it was still
far better than the pre-PRC days. China is far better off than
democratic India, I must add.
>
>In any event, here is the Unofficial Chinese Space Web Site (which I think
>shows off where the Chinese are with the rest of the world, regarding
>space exploration):
Communist China has never been really concerned with wasting money to
go to the moon, the same way, it never has any concern for building up
a strong navy. China simply has no interest trying to become the
world's most powerful dictator and bully like AmeriKKKa. Even today,
China has only 20 nuclear ICBM, whereas AmeriKKKa has over 600 !!!
China knows that 20 nuclear ICBM are enough to wipe out USA in the
event if USA attacks China. USA have 600 nuclear ICBM, but so what;
it doesn't take a dynamite just to kill a chicken.
Communist China's persistence of developing herbal medicine formula
and promoting acupuncture in the past 50 years is about to pay off:
the western countries are opening up to Chinese herbal medicine and
acupuncture; these are gradually taking over conventional western
medicine which has been a joke and killer of many innocent lives.
axp
Tom Goodman wrote in message ...
>"It is just as much as a surprise for the Chinese as for westerners to
>realize that modern agriculture,
Wrong. Babylon, Iraq.
>modern music,
What is "modern music"?
>decimal mathematics,
Wrong. Egypt.
>multi-stage rockets
Big firecrackers are much closer to human flatulence than they are to, for
example, the Saturn rocket that took astronauts to the moon. If you are to
give China credit for this, you would more appropriately give it to the
first man who farted.
As for the rest, much of which is questionable anyway, and some of which
relies on an historical record which is not complete, or has inconsistencies
(such as the hushed-up discoveries of the Caucasians remains in Western
China with tools pre-dating much of what has been claimed by Chinese), then
a question arises:
What the heck happened? Why is China among the least technologically
advanced and poorest large countries in the world? Why did their period of
greatness die just about the same time Confucianism and Buddhism took hold
2500 years ago? Makes one wonder.
william john sowa
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>On Fri, 14 Apr 2000 12:36:46 GMT, ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william
>john sowa), wrote:
>
>Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic inventions
>and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
Agree. I can't argue against that historical fact.
>
>>But, what I disagree with you on is that you think "anything the Chinese
>>did before and anything the Chinese do now was and is great and
>>automatically beneficial to the rest of the world." I don't think so,
>>pal. The Chinese messed up a lot of things, too.
>
>China was on an up trend until Manchurians took control of China. Qing
>Dynasty messed up China real badly. Even after the Qing was
>overthrown, at the beginning of "new" China under Dr.Sun, it didn't
>improve any because lack of good leadership, technology, finance, and
>material support. If not for communist Russia's assistance, "new"
>China would have been worse. Then came along the butcher -
>AmeriKKKan-backed generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek, who put China into
>chaos and returned to feudal state.
http://www.hrichina.org/reports/cleanup.html#C&R in practice
http://www.hrichina.org/reports/cleanup.html#C&R in practice
http://www.hrichina.org/reports/cleanup.html#C&R in practice
According to official accounts of the history of C&R, on which the
following history is based, it was first used to send former Guomingdang
troops, "refugees" and the unemployed out of the cities into the
countryside. In 1950, over 1.2 million ex-Guomindang servicemen, over
750,000 refugees in the coastal areas and around 1.1 jobless people in
seven main cities were subject to C&R. The system was also employed to get
rid of "vagrant beggars," with 1.12 million being put into custody and
"educated" in the first few years after 1949.
As the authorities began to revive and build up urban industry, many
peasants started to flow into the cities in search of employment. In 1953,
the central government issued a document entitled, "Directive on
Persuading the Peasants not to Blindly Enter the Cities." This ordered
that peasants who were not employed in the cities should return to their
places of origin. On July 11, 1956, the Internal Affairs Department issued
a directive on how to deal with vagrants which defined the types of
persons who should be classified as vagrants and thus subject to custody
and education, and ordered that such people should be sent back to their
places of origin. In 1956, over 420,000 vagrants were taken into custody
and educated, and 90 "vagrant education farms" had been established to
which more than 26,000 people were sent.
>There was only one rescue and it was Chinese Communist Party led by
>Mao, who defied the worse odds, saved 450 million Chinese and saved
>China. Communism saved China and Chinese people.
>
>If we look at the 50 years before PRC formed and the 50 years after,
>no matter how worse it was in the last 50 years in China, it was still
>far better than the pre-PRC days. China is far better off than
>democratic India, I must add.
>
http://www.hrichina.org/june4-10yr/intro.html
http://www.hrichina.org/june4-10yr/intro.html
http://www.hrichina.org/june4-10yr/intro.html
It has now been ten years since martial law troops, comprising soldiers of
the People's Liberation Army (PLA) and of the People's Armed Police (PAP)
opened fire on the unarmed people of Beijing on June 3, 1989, initiating a
massacre which took lives of young and old all over the city. Yet there
has still been no official accounting for the civilians killed and wounded
and no attempt to investigate what really happened, except in the crudest
political terms.
An official publication issued by the Chinese authorities soon after about
the "riots," The Truth About the Beijing Turmoil, claims that 6,000 troops
had been injured and "scores" were killed. The book says that 3,000
civilians were wounded, and over 200, including 36 university students,
died. These casualties occurred when troops "counter-attacked," it states,
and "some rioters were killed, some onlookers were hit by stray bullets
and some wounded or killed by armed ruffians." How this could have
happened when soldiers only "fired into the air" as it claims is left
unexplained.
More recently commentators have made much of the fact that the leadership
generally now refers to the events of that year as a "political incident"
rather than the more harsh-sounding "counterrevolutionary rebellion." But
the denial of extensive loss of life among ordinary people in the official
version, dubbed "the big lie" by many observers, has not been revised,
even to a small extent. The attempt to impose collective amnesia is
encouraged by a deafening silence on the matter in the domestic media.
>>
>>In any event, here is the Unofficial Chinese Space Web Site (which I think
>>shows off where the Chinese are with the rest of the world, regarding
>>space exploration):
>
>Communist China has never been really concerned with wasting money to
>go to the moon, the same way, it never has any concern for building up
>a strong navy. China simply has no interest trying to become the
>world's most powerful dictator and bully like AmeriKKKa. Even today,
>China has only 20 nuclear ICBM, whereas AmeriKKKa has over 600 !!!
>China knows that 20 nuclear ICBM are enough to wipe out USA in the
>event if USA attacks China. USA have 600 nuclear ICBM, but so what;
>it doesn't take a dynamite just to kill a chicken.
http://www.softwar.net/panama1.html
http://www.softwar.net/panama1.html
http://www.softwar.net/panama1.html
Worldwide, China appears to be progressively positioning itself
commercially and militarily along the key naval choke points
between the Indian Ocean [its bases in Burma]; the South China
Sea [Hong Kong]; the Straits of Malacca [the Spratley Islands
and a growing role in Cambodia]; the central Pacific [a major
land satellite tracking station on Tarawa]; the coast of Hawaii
[a major ocean mining tract]; the Caribbean [Cuba and the
Bahamas]; and now the Panama Canal. China's flagship commercial
shipping fleet, China Ocean Shipping Company [COSCO, is directly
connected to the People's Liberation Army and Chinese communist
government. COSCO ships have served as careers for massive
smuggling operations around the world - including the United
States -- of weapons, drugs and illegal aliens. In addition,
COSCO has been used by the Chinese government to ship missiles -
and components of weapons of mass destruction to rogue nations
such as Pakistan and Iran.
>T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
http://www.kickthepla.org/
http://www.kickthepla.org/
http://www.kickthepla.org/
WELCOME! to the "Kick the PLA Out of the USA" Web site. This site has been
designed to keep you, the American people, informed of the extent of
commercial activities between China's military -- the People's Liberation
Army (PLA) and the People's Armed Police (PAP) and the United States. The
U.S. government has consistently sought to downplay the PLA's and PAP
commercial role in China's growing trade and investment relations with
this country. This site will also keep you up-to-date on Congressional
testimony, "News on the PLA and PAP", and proposed legislation banning
American business with the PLA and PAP. If you would like to help us "Kick
the PLA Out of the USA" there is a link to Congress so that you can e-mail
your member of Congress and Senators a sample letter to retailers, and a
list of possible actions to consider.
ass master 5000
axp <a...@earthlink.com> wrote in message news:8d8jff$ma...@imsp212.netvigator.com...
>
> Tom Goodman wrote in message ...
>
> Big firecrackers are much closer to human flatulence than they are to, for
> example, the Saturn rocket that took astronauts to the moon. If you are to
> give China credit for this, you would more appropriately give it to the
> first man who farted.
lol...tom is such a silly commie
abcd...@my-deja.com
The dictatorship had ruined CHINA.
Tom Goodman
>The dictatorship had ruined CHINA.
That dictatorship was Chiang Kai-shek, the generalissimo backed by
German Nazis and American imperialists. CKS was the loser who later
fled to Taiwan and set up his so-called ROC govt; slaughtered nearly
all the Taiwan's Aboriginines; masscres that were gladly assisted by
Americans.
---------------------------------------------------------
Excerpted from Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia
Chiang Kai shek neglected the land reform needed to improve the lives
of the peasants. Driven from the cities, the Communists concentrated
on organizing the peasants in the countryside. On Nov. 1, 1931, they
proclaimed the establishment of the Chinese Soviet Republic in the
southeastern province of Jiangxi, with Mao Zedong as chairman. Here
the first units of the Chinese Workers' and Peasants' Red Army were
formed. While conducting guerrilla warfare in these regions, the
soldiers carried out an agrarian revolution that was based on Mao's
premise that the best way to win the conflict was to isolate the
cities by gaining control of the countryside and the food supply.
A military man by temperament and training, Chiang sought to eliminate
the Communists by force. He defined his anti-Communist drive as
"internal pacification before resistance to external attack", and he
gave it more importance than opposition to the increasingly aggressive
Japanese. With arms and military advisers from Nazi Germany, Chiang
carried out a series of "extermination campaigns" that killed about a
million people between 1930 to 1934. Chiang's fifth campaign,
involving over half a million troops, almost annihilated the
Communists. Faced with the dilemma of being totally destroyed in
Jiangxi or attempting an almost impossible escape, the Communists
decided to risk the escape. On Oct. 15, 1934, they broke through the
tight KMT siege. Over 100,000 men and women set out on the Long March
of about 6,000 miles (9,600 kilometers) through China's most rugged
terrain to find a new base in the northwest.
In the meantime, the Japanese had made steady inroads into China. The
Mukden Incident of 1931, through which Mukden was occupied by the
Japanese, was initiated by Japanese officers stationed along the South
Manchurian Railway. This was followed by the occupation of Manchuria
and the creation of the puppet state of Manchukuo in 1932. By the
mid-1930s the Japanese had seized Inner Mongolia and parts of
northeastern China and had created the North China Autonomous Region
with no resistance from the Nationalists. Anti-Japanese sentiment
mounted in China, but Chiang ignored it and in 1936 launched yet
another extermination campaign against the Communists in Shaanxi.
Chiang was forced to give up the anti-Communist drive when his troops
mutinied and arrested him as he arrived in Xi'an in December 1936 to
plan strategy. He was released after he agreed to form a united front
with the CCP against the Japanese, who were making steady inroads into
China.
In China, World War II broke out on July 7, 1937, with a seemingly
insignificant little battle between Chinese and Japanese troops near
Peking, called the Marco Polo Bridge Incident. Within a few days, the
Japanese had occupied Peking, and the fighting spread rapidly. The war
in China fell into three stages. The first (1937-1939) was
characterized by the phenomenally rapid Japanese occupation of most of
China's east coast, including such major cities as Shanghai, Nanjing,
and Canton. The Nationalist government moved to the interior,
ultimately to Chongqing in Sichuan, and the Japanese established
puppet governments in Peking in 1937 and in Nanjing in 1940. The
second stage (1939-1943) was a period of waiting, as Chiang blockaded
the Communists in the northwest (despite the united front) and waited
for help from the United States, which had declared war on Japan in
1941.
In the final stage (1944-1945), the United States provided massive
assistance to Nationalist China, but the Chongqing government,
weakened by inflation, impoverishment of the middle class, and low
troop morale was unable to take full advantage of it. Feuds among the
KMT generals and between Chiang and his United States military
adviser, General Joseph Stilwell, further hampered the KMT.
When Japanese defeat became a certainty in the spring of 1945, the
Communists seemed in a better position to take over from the Japanese
garrisons than the KMT, which was far away in the rear of the
formation. A United States airlift of KMT troops enabled them to
occupy many cities, but the countryside stayed with the Communists.
---------------------------------------------------------
leol...@my-deja.com
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 09 Apr 2000 16:39:24 GMT, leol...@my-deja.com, wrote:
>
> > people believe their culture are superior to my culture or all other
> > asian cultures.
>
> What makes me sick is sick people like you make up lies and stir up
> racist hatred.
Hold on! Everything I've said of chinese thing is NOT my invention.
They are the historical perspective based on analysis and research
that support well by fact and figure.
>
> > I want to say chineses: HELL NO!" Chinese don't
> > understand that many non-chinese asian dislike Chinese culture and
> >history.
>
> Tell me one non-Chinese Asian country that doesn't have rice as
> regular diet.
>
Now you stupid chink try to tell me Chinese invented rice as
regular diet. Gimmi a break!!! Rice is regular diet in all over asian
given by Mothernature not by Chink Civilization.
> >For example, I was talking to a Thai guy the first word
> > he talked of Chinese is : I DON'T LIKE CHINESE!
>
> Anyone has been in Thailand fully know that Chinese people are well
> accepted and respected in Thailand. There is almost no cultural or
> political difference between the Thai natives and Thai Chinese.
>
Thai are basically nice peole. They are not like Confucian vietname.
But their hatred of chinese is no different than many indonesians.
> A highly probable reason for Chinese being so welcomed in Thailand can
> be traced back to the Chinese rescue of a Thai king.
>
Bullshit! I've tallk to Vietnamese, Cambodian, Burma, Phlliphino,
Thai, Indonesian. They have one thing common of chinese view:
THEY ALL HATE CHINESE.
> >I don't like Chinese
> > I don't like Chinese is main slogan for many Asian because of the
> > all the terrible legacy of bully chinese oppression.
>
> Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
> other nations like the way white AmeriKKKans did.
>
Actually Chink invasion on many Asian tribe land is no different than
White AMerIKKKan took over Native indian people.
> More non-Chinese Asians hate white AmeriKKKans.
>
Of course, I hate Chinese and white AMeriKKKan. If you don't believe
me, go alt.native and asked native indian logger. They know I spoke
against Chinese oppression on my people and White AMeriKKKan
oppression on Native indians.
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
> Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
> Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
> , and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
> Come visit my website.
>
> http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
Happi Chin
people, you're going to find them. I can't speak for situations in
other countries, but I know people of other Asian races who don't hate
the Chinese as a people. While there may be non-Chinese Asians who do
dislike Chinese people, this doesn't make your asinine assumption that
all or most do since there are also plenty who don't. I have
Vietnamese, Korean, and Japanese friends who are intelligent enough
not to blame the policies of the Chinese government on the entire
race, a concept that is, perhaps, too complex for you to comprehend.
Detrain
to visit the nearest mental institution immediately.
Can't tell the difference between the lovely Chinese people and the
Chinese government, the Chinese government don't oppress people, they
just crushed people (Chinese included) like a crockroacher under the
tank, Or they just execute you and remove all your internal organs for
sales (Chinese only), Or they just sponsored the Khmer rouge to kill
millions of Cambodians (Cambodian Chinese included).
Tom Goodman
> the Chinese government don't oppress people
because Chinese people is the Chinese govt, and the Chinese govt is
the Chinese people. Chinese Communist Party is the world's biggest
political party with over 6.1 million registered members (Guinness
Book World Record ) and a 10% increase of membership every year.
Chinese Communist Party is the best thing ever happened to China.
ass master 5000
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote in message news:aakifsoh2s9tlrqim...@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:00:51 GMT, Detrain <b...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>
> > the Chinese government don't oppress people
>
> because Chinese people is the Chinese govt, and the Chinese govt is
> the Chinese people. Chinese Communist Party is the world's biggest
> political party with over 6.1 million registered members (Guinness
> Book World Record ) and a 10% increase of membership every year.
If you can call that a "party" that is. Besides, they're not exactly hard
core communists these days. Their market reforms and more liberal
attitudes basically fly in the face of what would be considered a strict
communist party philosophy. The party is basically a collection of
drones that follow the principles and ideals of their authoritarian
leadership, which has show an increasing level of acceptance of
market economic principles and experimental socialism.
Detrain
a population of 1 billion plus? genetically, the Chinese govt is the
Chinese people, the question of representing the whole Chinese people
is nil, not even close, the day when Chinese people hold a piece of
voting ticket, check at their favorite candidates, sign their names and
the votes are verified by the Chinese people, then there will be the
greatest thing ever happen to China.
It takes the CPP 80+ years to have 6.1 millions registered memberships
, not very impressive, look! how long it take AOL to sign up 18
millions memberships?
In article <aakifsoh2s9tlrqim...@4ax.com>,
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:00:51 GMT, Detrain <b...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>
> > the Chinese government don't oppress people
>
> because Chinese people is the Chinese govt, and the Chinese govt is
> the Chinese people. Chinese Communist Party is the world's biggest
> political party with over 6.1 million registered members (Guinness
> Book World Record ) and a 10% increase of membership every year.
>
> Chinese Communist Party is the best thing ever happened to China.
>
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
> Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
> Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
> , and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
> Come visit my website.
>
> http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
>
tool
william john sowa <ws...@login.itd.umich.edu> wrote in message
news:yhEJ4.6217$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu...
> In article <gn0dfs0nkp3u9jcuj...@4ax.com>,
> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> >
> >Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
>
> North Korea ? Tibet ? Spratly Islands ? India ?
>
How about cuba, puerto rico, texas, hawai, philliphine etc in the late 1800s
and early 1900s? Whatever happen to the native americans??? can we say
EXTERMINATION. Stupid fucker
Tom Goodman
>It takes the CPP 80+ years to have 6.1 millions registered memberships
>, not very impressive, look! how long it take AOL to sign up 18
>millions memberships?
I mistyped the figure; it should be 61 millions, not 6.1 millions.
This figure may be increased to 62 to 63 millions this year.
The world population is about 6,000 million, but AOL has only 18
million members worldwide; only 1 out of 333.
China's population is 1,300 million. That makes 1 out of 21 Chinese is
a CCP member !!.
It took AOL to send out over a billion of "free trial" cdroms to get
only 18 million subscribers - who are mostly on trial anyway.
CCP never have to send out "free trial" cdroms or subscriptions. In
fact, it's very difficult to be accepted into CCP party.
>
>
>In article <aakifsoh2s9tlrqim...@4ax.com>,
Tom Goodman
>How about cuba, puerto rico, texas, hawai, philliphine etc in the late 1800s
>and early 1900s? Whatever happen to the native americans??? can we say
>EXTERMINATION.
No one killed more people than the total number of at least 500
million victims murdered by "democratic USA". Starting with 30 million
native American Indians, hundreds of millions of Mexicans, Caribbean,
Cubans, Central Americans, South Americans, 10 million Vietnamese,
5million koreans, 2 million Cambodians, 1million Phillipinos, 500,000
Laotians, 1 million Burmese, 3 million Indonesians, 50 million
Chinese, Okinawans, (Japanese), Taiwanese (Formosans), South East
Asians, Iraqis, Serbs, Albanians....
In comparion, USA makes Nazi Germany seemed like Disneyland; Adolf
Hitler seemed like Santa Claus. The world has never seen such an evil
empire that massacred as many people as USA.
Adolf Hitler and his Nazis were evils, but they were mickey mouse in
comparison to what the white AmeriKKKans did in the past few
centuries, especially in this century.
Jimmie Walker
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> No one killed more people than the total number of at least 500
> million victims murdered by "democratic USA".
<remaining lies snipped>
If the USA has killed at least 500 million people, I find it absolutely
astounding that you weren't one of them.
Jimmie Walker
Tom Goodman
wrote:
>In article <oj9kfsk3d9hvhpgn1...@4ax.com>,
> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>
>> No one killed more people than the total number of at least 500
>> million victims murdered by "democratic USA".
>
>If the USA has killed at least 500 million people, I find it absolutely
>astounding that you weren't one of them.
Are you telling us that there wasn't any Jewish Holocaust because
there are Jewish living and telling how German Nazis killed their
people ?
Or are you saying that Adolf Hitler was a nice guy because he didn't
kill all the Jews ?
Jimmie Walker
Tom Goodman <Commenta...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 23:57:30 GMT, Jimmie Walker <jje...@my-deja.com>,
> wrote:
>
> >In article <oj9kfsk3d9hvhpgn1...@4ax.com>,
> > Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> >
> >> No one killed more people than the total number of at least 500
> >> million victims murdered by "democratic USA".
>
> >
> >If the USA has killed at least 500 million people, I find it
> >absolutely
> >astounding that you weren't one of them.
>
> Are you telling us that there wasn't any Jewish Holocaust because
> there are Jewish living and telling how German Nazis killed their
> people ?
>
> Or are you saying that Adolf Hitler was a nice guy because he didn't
> kill all the Jews ?
>
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
The patented "Tom Goodman" technique of putting words in the mouths of
people who refuse to believe his lies.
Where did I say anything about the Holocaust, you moron?
Where did I say anything about Adolf Hitler, you god-damned nitwit?
What the fuck drugs are you on, anyway? You said the U.S. killed 500
million people. The several million killed in Europe through the
Holocaust were not among them. Why are you bringing that up?
My point, which you are too dense to comprehend, is that since you are
so obviously, blatantly, and vocally anti-U.S., it amazes me that the
U.S., which according to you has killed hundreds of millions, has let
you live.
In other words, I would think they'd want you dead.
william john sowa
>
>william john sowa <ws...@login.itd.umich.edu> wrote in message
>news:yhEJ4.6217$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu...
>> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>> >
>> >Chinese oppression ? I've never heard of China sent troops to invade
>> >other nations...
>>
>> North Korea ? Tibet ? Spratly Islands ? India ?
>>
>
>and early 1900s? Whatever happen to the native americans??? can we say
I fail to see your association with USA's history with your attempt to
defend China and your attempt to state that China never invades other
nations? Please elaborate on how this proves that China never invades
other countries or just shut up, because no American will ever hide the
fact that the United States has had sad conflicts in its 200 year history
of development and it is a difficult task to create a free and democratic
society where all nationalities and all races can peacefully coexist and
live in harmony. However, idiots like you and China still hold that
ancient Communist Chinese philosophy, "Before you criticize us, look at
what you are doing." Well, we HAVE looked at what we are doing and some
of it is wrong and we're trying our best to fix it. You and China, on the
other hand, continue on your way, not seeing the problem. At least
Taiwan is a country full of Chinese people who care about human rights and
the individual freedom.
William John Sowa
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 05:00:51 GMT, Detrain <b...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>
> Chinese Communist Party is the best thing ever happened to China.
http://www.hrichina.org/pr/english/000330.htm
http://www.hrichina.org/pr/english/000330.htm
http://www.hrichina.org/pr/english/000330.htm
56th Session of the United Nations Commission on Human Rights
20 March – 28 April 2000
Date: 29 March 2000
Agenda Item 9: Question of human rights and fundamental freedoms in any
part of the world.
Oral Statement delivered by: Mr. Xiao Qiang
Respected Mr. Chair: My name is Xiao Qiang, and I am speaking on behalf
of the Robert F. Kennedy Memorial.
Mr. Chairman,
It is a widely known and well-documented fact that China is presently
committing the most blatant human rights violations since the June 4,
1989, Beijing military crackdown. Given the gross and systematic
pattern of human rights violations in China during the last two years,
particularly since the Chinese government signed the International
Covenant on Civil and Political Rights in October 1998, substantive
unilateral actions from the world’s highest human rights body is
critically needed. China must be held accountable for its human rights
abuses now, in order to preserve the credibility of the United
Nations’ international human rights monitoring mechanisms. This is
why we are here today, urging each member state to support the
resolution on China currently before this Commission.
The Chinese government would have us believe that this resolution is
“confrontational,” and the government has called instead for
“cooperation through dialogue.” But China’s promotion of so-called
“dialogue” is not genuine. In 1989, Chinese students in Beijing
requested a dialogue with their government, but the government rebuffed
their efforts and sent the national army to quell the protests in
Tiananmen Square. China’s attitude has not changed since that time,
as illustrated by the thousands of Chinese human rights defenders
sentenced to long-term imprisonment or sent to reeducation through
labor camps or into forced exile.
The China Democracy Party requested a dialogue with the Chinese
government, and the government answered with a brutal crackdown,
arresting and detaining at least 200 China Democracy Party members
since 1998. Almost all of the key members of the China Democracy
Party, advocates of the rights to freedom of expression and
association, are currently imprisoned and facing some of the longest
prison terms handed down to human rights defenders in the past decade.
The Falun Gong spiritual group has called for a dialogue with the
Chinese government, but the government has responded with massive round-
ups instead. In the past year, tens of thousands of Falun Gong members
have been arrested, detained and administratively sentenced to
reeducation through labor camps merely for exercising their religious
rights and for engaging in peaceful protests.
The wounded and the families of those killed in the June 4, 1989
Beijing massacre have asked for a dialogue with the Chinese government,
but the government has paid no heed. Over a decade later, hundreds of
citizens remain in prison for participating in the peaceful protests
and hundreds more remain in exile. Moreover, the Chinese government
continues to harass and persecute the families of June 4th victims to
this very day, prohibiting them from publicly mourning their loved ones
or from receiving humanitarian assistance from abroad.
Clearly, the Chinese government is not interested in any meaningful
dialogue on its human rights record. Rather, the Chinese government is
using the pretense of dialogue to escape accountability for its
actions. That is why, despite years of paying lip service to
“dialogue,” China continues to commit egregious violations of human
rights, including arbitrary detention, political and religious
imprisonment, torture and ill-treatment of detainees, deprivation of
the rights to freedom of expression and association, widespread failure
to enforce laws protecting the rights of workers and women, suppression
of religious freedom and the use of physical and psychological coercion
in the implementation of the population control policy.
The Chinese government commits these human rights violations with total
impunity. As just one example, Li Peng, who was responsible for the
June 4th massacre, will be representing China at the U.N. Millennium
Assembly this September, without ever having accounted to the Chinese
people or to the international community for his actions.
The Chinese government’s characterization of the resolution as
“confrontational” is equally invalid. On the contrary, the
Commission on Human Rights is mandated to examine the human rights
situation of all countries equally. All member states are responsible
for the fair and impartial enforcement of human rights standards, and
no country should be immune from scrutiny. As a member of the United
Nations bound by its Charter, China has voluntarily accepted the
responsibility to be accountable to the international community on
human rights. Passage of a resolution on China is a vital first step
toward attaining that accountability.
Mr. Chairman, it is the Robert F. Kennedy Memorial’s sincere hope that
all member states will unite to end impunity and promote accountability
by supporting a resolution on China. Such a stand will send a strong
signal that violations of human rights are not acceptable, regardless
of a nation’s history, culture, or rate of economic growth. The
Commission needs to reaffirm the universality of human rights, and this
is what we ask you, as members of the world’s highest human rights
body, to uphold at the 56th Session.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
> Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
> Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
> , and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
> Come visit my website.
>
> http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
http://www.kickthepla.org/
http://www.kickthepla.org/
http://www.kickthepla.org/
WELCOME! to the "Kick the PLA Out of the USA" Web site. This site has
been designed to keep you, the American people, informed of the extent
of commercial activities between China's military -- the People's
Liberation Army (PLA) and the People's Armed Police (PAP) and the
United States. The U.S. government has consistently sought to downplay
the PLA's and PAP commercial role in China's growing trade and
investment relations with this country. This site will also keep you up-
to-date on Congressional testimony, "News on the PLA and PAP", and
proposed legislation banning American business with the PLA and PAP. If
you would like to help us "Kick the PLA Out of the USA" there is a link
to Congress so that you can e-mail your member of Congress and Senators
a sample letter to retailers, and a list of possible actions to
consider.
Tom Goodman
<ws...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>56th Session of the United Nations Commission on Human Rights
>20 March – 28 April 2000
http://www.hookele.com/netwarriors/index-netwarriors.html
http://www.hookele.com/netwarriors/index-netwarriors.html
http://www.hookele.com/netwarriors/index-netwarriors.html
DRAFT DECLARATION ON THE RIGHTS OF INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
SUPPORT JUSTICE FOR INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
December 4, 1998
As you read this, the government of the United States, is
participating in a meeting at the United Nations in Geneva,
Switzerland. At this meeting, the U.S. delegation is taking a public
position that the rights of Native peoples are only individual rights,
threatening the collective existence that Indigenous Peoples have
known since the beginning of time. The U.S. has suggested that the
people of the U.S. do not support the right of Indigenous Peoples to
possess the internally-recognized right to self-determination. We
think that this official position is simply a contemporary version of
the conquest and assimilation U.S. Indian policy of the last century.
We think that the U.S. delegation is both incorrect and morally wrong
in taking these positions, and we are asking for your help.
Please contact the officials below and tell them that:
THE OFFICIAL POLICY OF THE UNITED STATES SHOULD BE THAT INDIGENOUS
PEOPLES MUST BE AFFORDED THE STATUS AND RECOGNITION OF ALL OTHER
PEOPLES IN THE WORLD.
YOU SUPPORT THE INTERNATIONAL RIGHT TO SELF-DETERMINATION FOR ALL
INDIGENOUS PEOPLES.
YOU SUPPORT THE DRAFT UNITED NATIONS DECLARATION ON THE RIGHTS OF
INDIGENOUS PEOPLES AS IT IS CURRENTLY WRITTEN, AND THAT THE UNITED
STATES GOVERNMENT SHOULD SUPPORT IT AS IS.
YOU BELIEVE THAT INTERNATIONAL HUMAN RIGHTS SHOULD EMBRACE BOTH
INDIVIDUAL AND COLLECTIVE RIGHTS, AND THAT THE U.S. SHOULD EXPAND ITS
OFFICIAL POSITION ON HUMAN RIGHTS TO REFLECT THIS.
TREATIES BETWEEN THE U.S. AND INDIGENOUS PEOPLES ARE BINDING
INTERNATIONAL DOCUMENTS THAT SHOULD BE SUBJECT TO INTERPRETATION BY
IMPARTIAL INTERNATIONAL TRIBUNALS.
Please communicate these messages immediately to the officials below,
and send copies of the communication and/or responses to: NETWARRIORS
(netwa...@hookele.com)
President William J. Clinton
(202)456-1111 (ph.)
(202)456-2461 (fax)
pres...@whitehouse.gov
Secretary Madeleine Albright
Secretary of State
(202)647-5939 (fax)
secr...@state.gov
Mr. Harold Koh, Asst.Secretary of State for Human Rights
(202)647-4344 (fax)
secr...@state.gov
U.S.Mission to the UN in Geneva
tel:011-41-22-749-4111
fax:011-41-22-749-4880
This position endorsed by:
American Indian Movement, Indigenous Law Institute, American Friends
Service Committee
A LISTSERVE DEDICATED TO SOLIDARITY & INDIGENOUS PEOPLES
WarriorNET is a listserve discussion group of indigenous peoples and
supporters. It is organized for strategy and analysis on human rights
violations and abuses of indigenous peoples. Its main discussion will
center around forums when Netwarriors is in session.
SUBSCRIBE?
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then SEND
Netwarriors
jsey...@my-deja.com
ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william john sowa) wrote:
> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> >Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic inventions
> >and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
>
> Agree. I can't argue against that historical fact.
>
I can and will. No one can deny credit to China for many early
inventions. But just because China discovered or invented something
does not mean that had they not discovered it, it would have remained
undiscovered. The history of science and technology has numerous
examples of separate independant, nearly simultaneous discoveries or
inventions of the same technology.
John Seymour
jsey...@my-deja.com
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 16 Apr 2000 17:42:57 GMT, Detrain <b...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>
> >It takes the CPP 80+ years to have 6.1 millions registered
memberships
> >, not very impressive, look! how long it take AOL to sign up 18
> >millions memberships?
>
> I mistyped the figure; it should be 61 millions, not 6.1 millions.
> This figure may be increased to 62 to 63 millions this year.
>
> The world population is about 6,000 million, but AOL has only 18
> million members worldwide; only 1 out of 333.
>
> China's population is 1,300 million. That makes 1 out of 21 Chinese is
> a CCP member !!.
>
have? (Only living ones, of course.) Do you think that maybe the fact
that the CCP continues to cling to its monopoly power position
(including through the arrest, imprisonment and execution of political
opponents) has anything to do with the worlds most populous ocuntry
having the largest political party?
The size of the CCP is actually pretty good evidence of the lack of
freedom in China. In countries where people have some modicum of
freedom and liberty, political participation is less extensive, because
they can do something productive with their lives instead.
Have a nice day.
jsey...@my-deja.com
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Mon, 17 Apr 2000 20:18:28 GMT, William John Sowa
> <ws...@my-deja.com>, wrote:
>
> >20 March – 28 April 2000
>
>
> Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
> Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
> , and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
> Come visit my website.
>
> http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
Mr. Goodman, please circulate a copy of your petition to the Chinese
govet regarding the rights of the indigenous peoples of Tibet and
Xinjiang (sp?). Surely they have 'collective rights' too, don't they.
Or does that only apply to people who aren't lucky enough to have a
Marxist regime look after their 'collective rights?'
John Seymour
william john sowa
>In article <mqQJ4.6276$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu>,
> ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william john sowa) wrote:
>> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>> >Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic inventions
>> >and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
>>
>> Agree. I can't argue against that historical fact.
>>
>
>inventions. But just because China discovered or invented something
>does not mean that had they not discovered it, it would have remained
>undiscovered. The history of science and technology has numerous
>examples of separate independant, nearly simultaneous discoveries or
>inventions of the same technology.
Taken in your context, yes. But, the nuance I read from Tom Goodcommie
was that we should be grateful to China for the compass and toilet paper.
I agreed.
Tom Goodman
>In article <mqQJ4.6276$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu>,
> ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william john sowa) wrote:
>> In article <hj7ffsok6vjmfj9uc...@4ax.com>,
>> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>> >Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic inventions
>> >and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
>>
>> Agree. I can't argue against that historical fact.
>>
>
>I can and will. No one can deny credit to China for many early
>inventions. But just because China discovered or invented something
>does not mean that had they not discovered it, it would have remained
>undiscovered. The history of science and technology has numerous
>examples of separate independant, nearly simultaneous discoveries or
>inventions of the same technology.
>
>
It took Europe over 1,000 years to learn some of the many Chinese
inventions. This fact shows Europeans needed Chinese to help them to
open up their mind and begin the industrial revolution.
For instance, many parts of Africa are still very primitive, but its
big cities are modernized with industrialized nations' inventions.
Without inventions and supports from outside, Africans still live like
they did 4,000 years ago. So, your assumption that even if without
Chinese inventions, the world would still come to this stage, is
totally erroneous.
Tom Goodman
john sowa), wrote:
>was that we should be grateful to China for the compass
"The compass does not seem to have reached Europe via the Arabs. There
is no mention of the compass in Arabic writing until approximately
1232, when sailors are described as finding their way by means of
fish-shaped piece of iron rubbed with a magnet. The fish-shape was
typically Chinese. The Europeans and the Arabs thus seem to have
adopted the magnetic compass for sailing at roughly the same time,
through nautical contact with China; but it may be that the Europeans
had the compass some decades before the Arabs. Contemporary texts
support this theory. In his famous book Dream Pool Essays, of about
1086, the medieval Chinese scientist Sahen Kua clearly wrote:
'Magicians rub the point of a needle with the lodestone; then it is
able to point to the south....It may be balanced on the fingernail, or
on the rim of a cup, where it can be made to turn more easily, but
these supports being hard and smooth, it is liable to fall off. It is
best to suspend it by a single cocoon fibre of new silk attached to
the center of a needle by a piece of wax the size of mustard seed -
then , hanging in a windless place, it will always point to the south.
Among some needles there are some which , after being rubbed, point to
the north. I have needles of both kinds by me..' This was written a
full century before the first mention of the magnetic compass in
Europe."
"We also have an explicit account of the use of the magnetic compass
for navigation, dating from before the first European mention. It is
from a book by Chu Yu, son of a former high port official and then
governor of Canton. The book is quaintly called Pingchow Table talk,
and dates from 1117."
"The author Meng Yuan-Lao wrote in his Dreams of the Glories of the
Eastern Capital about 1126: 'During dark of rainy days, and when the
nights are overclouded, sailors rely on the compass. The Mate is in
charge of this.' "
"The compass had in fact existed for centuries before this in China,
but Needham has established that it was only late in its history that
it came to be used for navigation at sea, the most probable period
being between 850 AD and 1050."
"We can trace the Chinese use of the lodestone compass back as far as
the fourth century BC with certainty. The textual mention of it occurs
in the Book of the Devil Valley Master, which dates from that time."
Excerpts from the book "The Genius of China" written by Robert
Temple, with comments from the late Joseph Needham - he was the
director of The Needham Research Institute, Cambridge University, also
the author of "Science and Civilization in China".
Tom Goodman
john sowa), wrote:
>paper.
"When Marco Polo visited China, he was so impressed by paper money
that he wrote a whole chapter about it, describing everything about
its manufacture and circulation."
"When the older methods of paper money issuance became known in the
west, they had a profound influence on western banking. The old
Hamburg Bank and Swedish banking system were set up on Chinese lines.
Thus, some of the fundamental banking system of the western world came
from China directly. the first western paper money was issued in
Sweden in 1661. America followed in 1690, France in 1720 England in
1797, and Germany not until 1806."
Enoch
Marco Polo also wrote that the Kaifung Jews were
in control of the city of Chang-An in China, which
would be analogous to present-day New York.
It means that the Kaifung Jews were in control of
most of the chinese economy at that time. And Chang-An
was THE center of all the romantic chinese novels
these days.
Doo-Hwan Park
a son of the new covenant
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote in message
news:3rdpfs8filhetu3ks...@4ax.com...
Turiyan OG: original Gog Gold
<Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 09 Apr 2000 16:39:24 GMT, leol...@my-deja.com, wrote:
>
>>Bragging Chinese superiority is of
>> Chinese people normal conversation which turns my stomach all the
>> time that inside of me I was laughing so much.
>
>
>Frankly, I've never heard of any Chinese bragging their superiority
>over the others, but I hear lots of white supremacist remarks bragging
Are you asian? (I'm not sure if I remember if you were, are or not.)
Chinese censor themselves around non-asians.
>how whites are most superior. Sounds like you're one of them white
>Nazi trash ? If not, you must be one of those Moslem terrorists.
Dont forget, There's good moslem and bad moslem.... terrorists.
Sheesh.
>>I didn't want
>> to insult chinese friend that your culture and history are the
>> most complete failure of all time.
>
>Chinese culture and history are failure ? At least 1/2 of the world
>population eat rice - a Chinese tradition originated from China. USA
WHITE rice. Full of carbs with not much nutritional value because the
outside was taken off and fed to chickens and pigs for flavoring.
Macrobiotics was INVENTED by japanese. So hah.
>and many western nations accepted Chinese acupuncture into their
>approved medicine. Canada even goes further approved acupuncture under
>its national medical insurance. The textile you're wearing, is a
>Chinese invention. And so on....
Chinese didnt invent accupuncture. There is no traditional chinese
medicine. It was a product of the Ching.
The manchurians were adminstrators for the mongolian dynasty whom most
know utilised silk armor. Well tempered silk fibers are actually
stronger than kevlar and were very effective at stopping arrows from
penetrating the body.
Arrows that did not break the skin were observed to sometimes cause
blunt trauma that resulted in internal injury and perhaps later,
death. What puzzled the persian surgeons was promptly documented
cross referenced with datam from western calendars, and clocks and
anything else.
Blunt trauma that cured/healed injurys and disease, like those of eyes
and liver (from alchohol) that were quite common amonst mongols, were
documented.
Later the Ching combined this with indegenous theorys from different
sources for two main reasons. 1) to create a standardized system that
could be taught as a science. No weird meditation, chanting to dead
ancestors or shamanistic stuff. Thats special training done one on
one for years and with weird/special protocols inappropriate for
classroom study
2) To eliminate any extant variants of thought through domination,
supression, annihilation and the fact that it was just plain more
commercially competetive because it operated outside the chinese
decorum of secrecy.
However, there are/were non-accupuncture systems of healing. Now,
stragely enough, readily recognizable as bullshit. And they use
completly different theorys. Those that werent taoist, where probably
buddhist. If they werent eaither, they were something else. They
probably didnt use clocks, but length of shadow, color of sky, ect, to
determine the cause/effect treatment modality.
The use of needles is fairly recent. And not technically a indicator
of skill. Methods of accupressure using fingers or other objects is
quite older. The fact that these same royal familys forbade chinese
doctors to come within less than 10 feet of them to touch them with
the proverbial 10 foot pole, should tell you something.
The non-invasive methods go back to those strange esoteric shamanistic
methods I mentioned previously.
>About history, China is the only ancient civilization existing that's
>still going strong today. The Greek, Roman, Mayan, Egyptian, Syrian,
>Persian and Mongol empires all gone. India is the only ancient
>civilization that was in step with China , but now it's just a slum
>trying to survive.
>T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
There are people still living in igloo's in the artic, siberia and
other areas. They are technically "mongol" people. There are
turkomon tribesmen still maintaining a seperate identity in iran, ect,
ect.
The same people that calculated the life of one single chinese worth
less than the price of a single donkey.
Booya -- go...@ij.net
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"The eventual decline and fall of nomadic dynasties like the Yuan
and Qing is because their people absorbed the stupid , effeminate ,
evil, arrogant, backstabbing, unpatriotic, and inferior complexed
Han culture." -- Temujin bilikh
Mr. Y
the 13thC a tribe of Chinese aesthetes, the Eng clan, unwilling
to tolerate the barbarism of the conquering Mongols were forced
westward in advance step with the hordes, and, later, facing
oppression by native peoples, finally settled upon an island
just off the far west of the landmass -- appropriately naming
their new home after their clan. In the relative unemcumberance
of this land they surged in inventing all manner of useful
things such as the silk knitting and spinning machines, steel,
steam piston engine, and even....the flush toilet, ploooshh!!
* Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network *
The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free!
Dong-Jun Ha
that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
STUDY HISTORY!
Dong-Jun Ha
In article <8cqbnr$eh3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
leol...@my-deja.com wrote:
>
>
> It is giant mistake to believe Chinese culture and history are all
> superior to all other Asian. Bragging Chinese superiority is of
> Chinese people normal conversation which turns my stomach all the
> time that inside of me I was laughing so much. I didn't want
> to insult chinese friend that your culture and history are the
> most complete failure of all time. What makes me sick is Chinese
> people believe their culture are superior to my culture or all other
> asian cultures. I want to say chineses: HELL NO!" Chinese don't
> understand that many non-chinese asian dislike Chinese culture and
> history. For example, I was talking to a Thai guy the first word
> he talked of Chinese is : I DON'T LIKE CHINESE! I don't like Chinese
> I don't like Chinese is main slogan for many Asian because of the
> all the terrible legacy of bully chinese oppression. My Bhutan
freind
> told me that China is bully. That's the first word he talked of
> Chinese. My Arab friend believes Chinese would invade their nation
> one day just like they invaded to thousand of little countries.
> For me Chinese issue is a just a ridiculous thing.
> If I ever shamed to be Asian and has yellow skin on, it must be
> the Chinese.
>
> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
> Before you buy.
>
--
"If you love yourself, you love everybody else as you do yourself. As
long as you love another person less than you love yourself, you will
not really succeed in loving yourself, but if you love all alike,
including yourself, you will love them as one person and that person is
both God and man. Thus he is a great and righteous person who, loving
himself, loves all others equally" - Meister Eckhart
"To know and yet think we do not know is the highest attainment; not to
know and yet think we do know is a dis
Dong-Jun Ha
know that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
STUDY HISTORY!
Dong-Jun Ha
In article <8cqbnr$eh3$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>,
Walter Lee
I like chinese culture and I think it deserves respect
but I would not call it superior to any other culture.
What sets chinese culture apart from Korean culture is its
age and the size of the chinese society. That does not
diminish korean culture or society - sometimes being
smaller and newer can be an advantage. However, Leo's position
against chinese culture is biased by his own hatred
for anything and anybody chinese so he is unable to treat
others fairly or behave in a rational manner. While he is
entitled to his own opinions - but I find him unconvincing.
Tom Goodman
<doha...@mail.usyd.edu.au>, wrote:
>The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean but I know
>that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
>STUDY HISTORY!
>Dong-Jun Ha
"Korea's performing arts were greatly influenced by those of China,
whose dance, music, and instruments the Koreans adopted. "
"Most Koreans do not belong to an organized religion. The Confucian
ethical system, however, has greatly influenced Korean culture. "
"Despite the longtime cultural influence of China upon Korea and the
use of Chinese as the official written language of Korea until the
late 19th century,..."
"Formal manuscripts did not appear in Korea until the 4th century AD,
when educated Koreans wrote in Chinese. Later, systems were developed
by which Korean words could be written in Chinese ideograms. "
"Hangul, an alphabet suited to the Korean language, was developed at
the direction of King Sejong and introduced in 1446. It was used by
the common people, but educated Koreans continued to write in Chinese.
Hangul did not come into general use until the end of the 19th
century, ..."
"Chinese ideography is still taught, ..."
"Korea's artists have been strongly influenced by the cultures of
neighboring nations. ..."
"From the late 7th century into the Koryo Dynasty many Buddhist temple
complexes--actually small villages--were built. Although their general
features were Chinese, they were adapted to local materials and
landscape by their Korean builders. "
"Under the Yi Dynasty the increasing popularity of Confucianism was
mirrored in the construction of Confucian shrines.."
"Wet-field rice agriculture and the use of metal appear to have been
introduced from China by 300 BC. "
And there were a lot more.
Excerpts from Compton's encyclopedia.
Enoch
The chinese culture was far inferior to the Korean
culture. But some of these sons of dogs moved to Korea,
they tried to spread the chinese disease and contaminate
the Korean culture. Today's Korea is the byproduct of
this Korean culture contaminated by barbaric chinese
culture.
Besides, most of the famous chinese are actually Koreans
in origin.
Doo-Hwan Park
a son of the new covenant
Dong-Jun Ha <doha...@mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote in message
news:8dkh39$kod$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> *The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean but I
> know that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
> STUDY HISTORY!
> Dong-Jun Ha
>
Tom Goodman
wrote:
I agree with you. There are goodness and flaws in every culture and
people; no one is perfect. I've never heard of Chinese scream "Yellow
Power" or "We Chinese are Number One". I often hear whites scream
"White Power" or "We Americans are Number One" etc.
Chinese have been very important in history of mankind. Their
inventions and products influenced the whole world. There isn't
anywhere on earth that you can't see "Made in China" label. For
instance, China is the world's biggest watch maker and exporter.
Austin P. So (Hae-Jin)
Chinese history with a critical eye...
It is embarrassing to hear this from a Korean...
Dong-Jun Ha wrote:
> The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean but I know
> that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
> STUDY HISTORY!
--
---
Austin P. So (Hae Jin)
I.I.S.G.P.
Biotechnology Laboratory
University of British Columbia
E-mail: hae...@netinfo.ubc.ca
http://www.interchange.ubc.ca/haejin/index.html (under construction)
Tom Goodman
<minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>Tom, I'm sure you must be aware of a little-known fact that in
>the 13thC a tribe of Chinese aesthetes, the Eng clan, unwilling
>to tolerate the barbarism of the conquering Mongols were forced
>westward in advance step with the hordes, and, later, facing
>oppression by native peoples, finally settled upon an island
>just off the far west of the landmass -- appropriately naming
>their new home after their clan. In the relative unemcumberance
>of this land they surged in inventing all manner of useful
>things such as the silk knitting and spinning machines,
These had been invented long before. Silk cloth fragments dated 6,000
years were found near yellow river.
> steel,
>steam piston engine, and even....the flush toilet, ploooshh!!
>
"Blast furnaces for cast iron are not known to have existed in
Scandinavia by the late 8th century AD, but many readers will be
amazed to learn that cast iron was not widely available in Europe
before 1380. The Chinese, however, practiced the technique from at
least the 4th century BC."
"The widespread availability of cast iron in ancient China had many
side effects. It led to the innovation of the cast iron plowshare in
agriculture, along with iron hoes and other tools. Iron knives, axes,
chisels, saws and awls all became available. Food could be cooked in
cast iron pots, and even toys were made of cast iron. Cast iron
statuettes of various animals have been found in Han Dynasty tombs
dating between the second centuries BC and AD. Cast iron molds for
implements dating from the second century BC have also been
discovered."
"Some of the ancient Chinese feats of casting iron are so impressive
as to be almost unbelievable, even when the results are before our
eyes. For instance, there is a cast iron pagoda seen in Plate 20. This
fantastic structure can be precisely dated to the years 1105. It is 78
feet high, cast storey by storey. There are several such iron
pagodas."
Picture caption: The largest single piece of cast iron from ancient
China, and still one of the largest such object in the world: the
Great Lion of Tsang-chou in Hopei Province, erected in the year 954 by
the emperor Shih Tsung in commemoration of his campaign against the
Liao Tartars. It weights about 40 tons, and stands 20 feet high and 16
feet long. It is not solid; its thickness varies from 8 inches to only
1 1/2 inches in places. The sections were poured at the same time, but
some of the joints between them are weak. This gigantic object was
made more than four hundred years before any cast iron was to be
available in Europe.
"Since the Chinese were the first to produce cast iron, they were also
first to make steel from cast iron. This was fully under way by the
second century BC at the latest, and eventually led to the invention
of Bessemer steel process in the West in 1856. Henry Bessemer's work
had been anticipated in 1852 by William Kelly, from a small town near
Eddyville, Kentucky. Kelly had brought four Chinese steel experts to
Kentucky in 1845, from whom he had learned the principles of steel
production used in China for over two thousand years previously, and
had made his own developments."
Excerpted from the book "The Genius of China" written by Robert
Temple, with comments from the late Joseph Needham - he was the
director of The Needham Research Institute, Cambridge University, also
the author of "Science and Civilization in China".
The Needham Research Institute
http://www.soas.ac.uk/needham/Home.html
Enoch
I admit I was little upset with your statement.
It is true, chinese culture have influenced the Korean
culture. NO! The chinese were NOT that aggresive to
spread their culture to the Koreans. We took some of theirs
that would benefit the Korean society.
Read some real Korean history.
While I am not so proud as to how Koreans were in the past,
I also don't agree with your arrogance.
Doo-Hwan Park
a son of the new covenant
Enoch <eno...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:okbKpCiq$GA....@news2.sys.netsgo.com...
> Don't be ridiculous, dude.
> The chinese culture was far inferior to the Korean
> culture. But some of these sons of dogs moved to Korea,
> they tried to spread the chinese disease and contaminate
> the Korean culture. Today's Korea is the byproduct of
> this Korean culture contaminated by barbaric chinese
> culture.
>
> Besides, most of the famous chinese are actually Koreans
> in origin.
>
> Doo-Hwan Park
> a son of the new covenant
>
>
> Dong-Jun Ha <doha...@mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote in message
> news:8dkh39$kod$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > *The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean but I
> > know that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know this?
> > STUDY HISTORY!
Mr. Y
The silk spinning machine, silk knitting machine, crucible
steel, steam piston engine, and the flush toilet (among many
other great advancements and innovations) were all inventions
from England. Get it...ENG-land?
P*l*o*o*s*h !!
Mr. Y
archaeologists finding copper wire and claiming that Koreans
invented the telephone, and the Japanese finding glass fragments
and claiming they invented fibre optics communication. And
finally the Chinese, upon finding nothing, claiming they
invented cellular technology.
Huitman Huang
You are toooo sentimental.
Could you mention some evidence to support your great claim : 'most of the
famous chinese are actually Koreans in origin'.
I am curious.
Huitman
Bryan Lunt
the wourld, was invented in China, as well as tea, where would the english
be without tea?, also many phylisophical advancements where made in China,
and I am sure nost of us agre that the reality of the mind is of far more
significance than physical reality, posibly we (the west) should give
some respect where it is due.
Mr. Y
Certainly credit should be given properly, i.e. accurately, for
achievements by the Chinese or any other nation, no questions
about that. But it takes a stellar leap of logic to assert the
following recent claims and corollaries (among others) by Tom
Goodman:
>"Without the importation from China of nautical and
>navigational improvements such as ships' rudders, the compass
>and multiple masts, the great European Voyages of Discovery
>could never have been undertaken. Columbus would not have
>sailed to America, and the Europeans would never have
>established colonial empires."
>"Without the importation from China of paper and printing,
>Europe would have continued for much longer to copy books by
>hand. Literacy would not have become so wide spread."
>"Johann Gutenberg didn't invent the movable type. It was
>invented in China"
>"Issac Newton was not the first one to discover his First Law
>of Motion. It was discovered in China."
and
>Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic
>inventions and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the
>first place. For example, space rockets would not be here if
>gunpowder wasn't invented;
>without gunpowder, simple fireworks and rockets couldn't be
>invented;
>without simple rocket technology, space rockets couldn't be
>invented;
>without space rockets, satellites couldn't be placed into
>space;
>without satellites....
Does the West really owe so much credit (or should I say "debt")
to the Chinese for the sending of men to the moon since they
first invented gunpowder? How a people apply an invention and
furthers it is as important as the discovery itself. And as
another poster pointed out, there are often parallel
developments in history and no one can deny that it is possible
that, say, gunpowder could have been invented later by others.
The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
same period?
Mr. Y
<doha...@mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
>The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean
but I know
>that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know
this?
>STUDY HISTORY!
>Dong-Jun Ha
>
That's a pretty heavy statement. China is "bigger," "more
populous," "older," "has had a more tumultuous history," "has
more influence in Washington," "won more Olympic gold medals"
than Korea, but "superior" is not as easy to say. I don't agree
or disagree with you right now, but on what grounds are you
saying this? Assuming that the (statistically laughable) "80%"
of Korean culture being indebted to the Chinese demonstrates
that the Chinese are "superior" to the Koreans can one argue,
then, that the British are "superior" to the Americans?
Jimmie Walker
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> I've never heard of Chinese scream "Yellow
> Power" or "We Chinese are Number One".
Thanks for the laugh!
Tom Goodman
<huih...@iupui.edu>, wrote:
>Hey Park,
>
>You are toooo sentimental.
>Could you mention some evidence to support your great claim : 'most of the
>famous chinese are actually Koreans in origin'.
>I am curious.
>
>Huitman
>
He made a mistake, he really meant to say "Most Koreans are actually
Chinese in origin."
jsey...@my-deja.com
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:27:24 GMT, jsey...@my-deja.com, wrote:
>
> >In article <mqQJ4.6276$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu>,
> > ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william john sowa) wrote:
> >> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
> >> >Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic
inventions
> >> >and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >I can and will. No one can deny credit to China for many early
> >inventions. But just because China discovered or invented something
> >does not mean that had they not discovered it, it would have remained
> >undiscovered. The history of science and technology has numerous
> >examples of separate independant, nearly simultaneous discoveries or
> >inventions of the same technology.
> >
> >
>
> It took Europe over 1,000 years to learn some of the many Chinese
> inventions. This fact shows Europeans needed Chinese to help them to
> open up their mind and begin the industrial revolution.
>
> For instance, many parts of Africa are still very primitive, but its
> big cities are modernized with industrialized nations' inventions.
> Without inventions and supports from outside, Africans still live like
> they did 4,000 years ago. So, your assumption that even if without
> Chinese inventions, the world would still come to this stage, is
> totally erroneous.
>
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
Interesting point. But, as you point out, the Chinese had these
inventions and technologies over a thousand years ago. Why did the West
bring the industrial revolution to them?
John Seymour
jsey...@my-deja.com
Mr. Y <minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>
> The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
> and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
> significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
> equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
> same period?
>
uh, the Cultural Revolution?
(Was this a trick question?)
Tom Goodman
<minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>Heh heh. Sorry, friend, but you take yourself far too seriously.
>The silk spinning machine, silk knitting machine, crucible
>steel, steam piston engine, and the flush toilet (among many
>other great advancements and innovations) were all inventions
>from England. Get it...ENG-land?
>
Some people still think that China (chinaware) was also invented in
ENG-land. LOL
None of the above mentioned items were invented in ENG-land.
jsey...@my-deja.com
Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>
> I agree with you. There are goodness and flaws in every culture and
> people; no one is perfect. I've never heard of Chinese scream "Yellow
> Power" or "We Chinese are Number One". I often hear whites scream
> "White Power" or "We Americans are Number One" etc.
You gotta start hanging with a better class of people.
Tom Goodman
<minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
>equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
>same period?
Chinese creativity and innovations were suppressed by Manchurians for
a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and set up
ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself emperor
of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang regime, and
Japan invaded China, these worsen China's already bad condition . Then
AmeriKKKans moved in and assisted Chiang regime in continuation of
genocide on Chinese people. There wasn't a moment of peace from the
time of Dr.Sun's death to the fled of Chiang regime to Taiwan.
After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by Chinese
Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally come to
this point : a world super power !!
In the PRC's beginning, there was nothing to work with, no money, no
modern technology or equipments, no foreign support, and the natural
famine that had happened for thousands of years hit China's rapid
growing population.
Now China is the world biggest manufacturer. From being creative but
fell under foreign intruders more than a few centuries ago, China now
concentrates on making money to build up its national defenses rather
than waste time on inventing better chopsticks.
God has been helping PRC along. This nation will be the critical power
to contain the end-time Babylon and the whore - USA.
Praise God !
Blair Sheridan
<Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:33:39 -0700, Mr. Y
><minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>
>>The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>>and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>>significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
>>equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
>>same period?
>
>Chinese creativity and innovations were suppressed by Manchurians for
>a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and set up
>ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
>support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
>generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself emperor
>of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang regime,
As did Stalin.
>After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
>its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by Chinese
>Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally come to
>this point : a world super power !!
The USSR did not withdraw its support in 1949, as you well know. It
continued for at least another 12 years. But obviously you've got no
time for the facts.
>God has been helping PRC along. This nation will be the critical power
>to contain the end-time Babylon and the whore - USA.
>
>Praise God !
>
>
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
>Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
>Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
>, and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
>Come visit my website.
>
>http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
>
>
-----------------------------------------
"...and lo, did the anvil drop upon Tom Goodman's head and
yea verily was he made a cretin. Thenceforth, ascribeth he to
me a love for the Chinese Communists, which I have not, as
though the Nazis' 'Gott mit uns' were not enough. Oy vey."
김좌진
but, Almost all ppl do not like Chinese culture actually.
(i.e. Koreans and Japanese)
Considering your family name "Ha", i assume you're either
Chinese-korean or your Jokbo says your ancestor was
from the China...
Personally, i don't mind if you're Chinese, but, the majority
of Koreans, who live in the Western(American) way, are
eager to pursue Western culture and many of them look
down on anything Chinese...
(here in Korea, "chinese" is more derogatory remark than
"idiot".)
Generally speaking, I can say that the Chinese culture is far
inferior to the other cultures, no question about that.
As for the Korean culture, most Korean culture was derived
from the Ancient Korean kingdoms, NOT goddamn China.
Jim Walsh
<Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>>God has been helping the PRC along.
This is about as silly as it gets. Where was God when Mao started the
Cultural Revolution?
Love, Jim
"But the evidence is in line with the well-established,
if little publicised, finding that democracies have far
lower levels of internal violence than non-democracies
This is not really surprising. The non-violent management
of conflict is the very essence of democracy." Kofi Annan
김좌진
It sounds similiar like "Most Americans are actually African in origin."
Don't even try, you goddamn tomchink bastard. too bad you were
born as CHINEESE.
As for the Korean's origin, it's already well known fact that the ancient
Koreans were from Siberia(Now in Russia) and Mongolia.
Tom Goodman
>In article <6rcpfsgj7s363bq3r...@4ax.com>,
> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:27:24 GMT, jsey...@my-deja.com, wrote:
>>
>> >In article <mqQJ4.6276$D7.1...@news.itd.umich.edu>,
>> > ws...@login.itd.umich.edu (william john sowa) wrote:
>> >> In article <hj7ffsok6vjmfj9uc...@4ax.com>,
>> >> Tom Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>> >> >Many modern technology would not be invented if some basic
>inventions
>> >> >and technologies weren't invented by Chinese in the first place.
>> >>
>> >> Agree. I can't argue against that historical fact.
>> >>
>> >
>> >I can and will. No one can deny credit to China for many early
>> >inventions. But just because China discovered or invented something
>> >does not mean that had they not discovered it, it would have remained
>> >undiscovered. The history of science and technology has numerous
>> >examples of separate independant, nearly simultaneous discoveries or
>> >inventions of the same technology.
>> >
>> >
>>
>> It took Europe over 1,000 years to learn some of the many Chinese
>> inventions. This fact shows Europeans needed Chinese to help them to
>> open up their mind and begin the industrial revolution.
>>
>> For instance, many parts of Africa are still very primitive, but its
>> big cities are modernized with industrialized nations' inventions.
>> Without inventions and supports from outside, Africans still live like
>> they did 4,000 years ago. So, your assumption that even if without
>> Chinese inventions, the world would still come to this stage, is
>> totally erroneous.
>>
>> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>>
>
>Interesting point. But, as you point out, the Chinese had these
>inventions and technologies over a thousand years ago. Why did the West
>bring the industrial revolution to them?
>
Chinese creativity and innovations were suppressed by Manchurians for
a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and set up
ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself emperor
of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang regime, and
Japan invaded China, these worsen China's already bad condition . Then
AmeriKKKans moved in and assisted Chiang regime in continuation of
genocide on Chinese people. There wasn't a moment of peace from the
time of Dr.Sun's death to the fled of Chiang regime to Taiwan.
After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by Chinese
Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally come to
this point : a world super power !!
In the PRC's beginning, there was nothing to work with, no money, no
modern technology or equipments, no foreign support, and the natural
famine that had happened for thousands of years hit China's rapid
growing population.
Now China is the world biggest manufacturer. From being creative but
fell under foreign intruders more than a few centuries ago, China now
concentrates on making money to build up its national defenses rather
than waste time on inventing better chopsticks.
God has been helping PRC along. This nation will be the critical power
김좌진
Tom Goodman 이(가) <4kprfsgbkv3sr0nlr...@4ax.com>
메시지에서 작성하였습니다...<snipped>
Two no-more-using crap: Confucianism and Chinese Art.
I'm a proud Korean but I know that 99% of our culture we
owe to the Western(American) culture. How do I know this?
STUDY HISTORY!
Tom Goodman
>In article <232b1865...@usw-ex0102-084.remarq.com>,
> Mr. Y <minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid> wrote:
>>
>
>> The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>> and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>> significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
>> equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
>> same period?
>>
>
>uh, the Cultural Revolution?
>
>(Was this a trick question?)
CR was actually productive. In order to leap a big forward, one has to
step back, take off the heavy leg-chain, and jump. That was what China
has done. It took China only 50 years to change from nothingness into
a world super power today. India was ahead of China, now China is way
ahead of India.
김좌진
>Power" or "We Chinese are Number One".
And I've never heard of African scream "Black Power" or "We Africans
are Number One!".
>
>Chinese have been very important in history of mankind.
So are Africans.
>Their inventions and products influenced the whole world.
So are Africans and Arabs.
Tom Goodman
<tran...@newsguy.com>, wrote:
>On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:17:08 GMT, Tom Goodman
><Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>
>>On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:33:39 -0700, Mr. Y
>><minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>>
>>>The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>>>and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>>>significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
>>>equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
>>>same period?
>>
>>Chinese creativity and innovations were suppressed by Manchurians for
>>a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and set up
>>ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
>>support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
>>generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself emperor
>>of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang regime,
>
>
>>After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
>>its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by Chinese
>>Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally come to
>>this point : a world super power !!
>
>The USSR did not withdraw its support in 1949, as you well know. It
>continued for at least another 12 years. But obviously you've got no
>time for the facts.
>
Can you read English ? I wrote, "After PRC formed...." I didn't
specify 1949 or other date, did I ?
Tom Goodman
wrote:
>On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:17:08 GMT, Tom Goodman
><Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>
>>>God has been helping the PRC along.
>
>This is about as silly as it gets. Where was God when Mao started the
>Cultural Revolution?
>
The almighty omnipresent God was there; he arranged the Cultural
Revolution. CR was part of God's plan. China would need to go through
CR and arrive at this point. God makes China strong for a very
important reason : to contain AmeriKKKa. Read Revelation.
Tom Goodman
wrote:
>As for the Korean culture,
The historical evidences show that Korean culture is based on Chinese
culture.
Here is some excerpts from Britannica encyclopedia.
http://www.britannica.com/bcom/eb/article/8/0,5716,114848+3,00.html
The Choson (Yi) dynasty
The establishment of a Confucian state
When the dynasty was established, the territory under its control was
named Choson, with the approval of the emperor of China. The Choson
dynasty, with 26 monarchs, ruled from 1392 until the Japanese
annexation of Korea in 1910. Hanyang (now Seoul) was made the capital.
The Confucian ethical system was officially adopted and replaced
Buddhism, which had become corrupt. Many Confucian institutions of
learning were set up. Choson society was dominated by a hereditary
aristocratic class, the yangban (literally, "two orders," meaning
civil and military officials). Members of the yangban devoted
themselves to the study of Neo-Confucian orthodoxy and, through civil
service examinations, held public offices, their sole profession.
Since they controlled all aspects of Choson society and owned most of
the land, the Choson dynasty can be described as a yangban society.
Foreign invasions
The earliest coins found in Korea were Chinese knife coins of the 3rd
century BC. The local production of coins did not begin until the 9th
to 10th century AD, when copies of contemporary Chinese Kai-yuan coins
were made. Coins with local inscriptions, still based on the Chinese
model, were issued from the 12th century.
Korean records state that special costumes for court wear modeled
after those of T'ang China were adopted during the reign of Kim
Ch'unch'u in the 7th century;
The most striking evidence of Chinese influence at this time is to be
seen in the style of the turumagi overcoat worn by noblemen, pictured
in fresco paintings as a voluminous full-length garment made almost
exactly like the p'ao robe of T'ang China.
Among all the dynasties, Chinese and foreign, the long-lived Yi
(Choson) in Korea (1392-1910) was undoubtedly the most thoroughly
Confucianized.
Tom Goodman
wrote:
>As for the Korean culture,
Most Koreans don't have any grudge against Chinese. Only a few, very
few of them are rebellious. Maybe they watched too much AmeriKKKan TV.
A good Korean is one who admits and appresciates Chinese heritage.
Without Chinese cultural infulence there would not be any Korean
culture. It's not to say Korean culture is Chinese culture. Koreans
developed their style of culture based on Chinese culture; Korean
culture has its own style but not a great deal f difference from
Chinese. I respect Koreans and their culture, but I have no respect
for those Koreans who don't respect their ancestery.
"Most Koreans do not belong to an organized religion. The Confucian
ethical system, however, has greatly influenced Korean culture. "
Excerpted from Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia
Blair Sheridan
<Commen...@headquarter.cci> blathered:
>On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 09:41:45 +0500, Blair Sheridan
><tran...@newsguy.com>, wrote:
>
>>On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 03:17:08 GMT, Tom Goodman
>><Comment...@headquarter.com> blathered:
>>
>>>On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:33:39 -0700, Mr. Y
>>><minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>>>
>>>>The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>>>>and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>>>>significant advancements have been authored in the West. What of
>>>>equal consequence has China contributed to the world during that
>>>>same period?
>>>
>>>Chinese creativity and innovations were suppressed by Manchurians for
>>>a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and set up
>>>ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
>>>support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
>>>generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself emperor
>>>of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang regime,
>>
>
>>
>>>After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
>>>its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by Chinese
>>>Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally come to
>>>this point : a world super power !!
>>
>>The USSR did not withdraw its support in 1949, as you well know. It
>>continued for at least another 12 years. But obviously you've got no
>>time for the facts.
>>
>
>Can you read English ? I wrote, "After PRC formed...." I didn't
>specify 1949 or other date, did I ?
Yes, I can. Can you write it?
Why not go ahead and specify the date? Better yet, do the chronology,
starting with the 1950 Treaty of Friendship and Mutual Assistance
between the PRC and USSR. People will be impressed by your erudition.
>>>>After PRC formed, Russia withdrew its assistance. China was totally on
>>>>its own.
An intentional deception, by Mr. Goodman. Such a surprise...
>
>
>
>T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
>Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
>Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
>, and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
>Come visit my website.
>
>http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
ajh...@my-deja.com
For example, Manchurians were under control by Koreans many times.
Koguryu dynasty, Balhye dynasty, early Chosun dynasty controlled
Manchurians and Manchurians also took over China continent many times.
For instance, China's Last empire "chung" was founded by manchurians.
So you can see that world goes round and round. What's important is
present status.
These days it's hard to say that Korea and China has close cultural
exchange. Because of our experience of Japan invasion, we currently
don't like the way Chinese treat Tibets and Tiwanese. Also, going
little backward, China was strong communism country and this made
absolutely bad influence in cultural exchange between the two and
Koreans attitude toward China. During cultural revolution in China,
Chinese themselves destroyed their own culture because of communism.
In article <9tatfs0f86i4pqdg1...@4ax.com>,
Tom Goodman <Commen...@headquarter.cci> wrote:
> On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:23:23 +0900, "김좌진" <ki...@jjang.com>,
> wrote:
>
> >As for the Korean culture,
>
> Most Koreans don't have any grudge against Chinese. Only a few, very
> few of them are rebellious. Maybe they watched too much AmeriKKKan TV.
>
> A good Korean is one who admits and appresciates Chinese heritage.
> Without Chinese cultural infulence there would not be any Korean
> culture. It's not to say Korean culture is Chinese culture. Koreans
> developed their style of culture based on Chinese culture; Korean
> culture has its own style but not a great deal f difference from
> Chinese. I respect Koreans and their culture, but I have no respect
> for those Koreans who don't respect their ancestery.
>
> "Most Koreans do not belong to an organized religion. The Confucian
> ethical system, however, has greatly influenced Korean culture. "
>
> Excerpted from Compton's Interactive Encyclopedia
>
> T*o*m G*o*o*d*m*a*n
>
> Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark, U.S.
> Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
> , and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
> Come visit my website.
>
> http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
Curtis Desjardins
>[snip bullshit]
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls. Don't feed the trolls.
Curtis. (remove "cafe" to reply)
=============================================================================
Alright! I *AM* the Messiah! --- He *IS* the Messiah! --- Now... Fuck Off!
=============================================================================
Mr. Y
>>
>
>> The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on
earth,
>> and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>> significant advancements have been authored in the West. What
of
>> equal consequence has China contributed to the world during
that
>> same period?
>>
>
>
>(Was this a trick question?)
>
>
>
>
Oh yeah, I forgot about that. The Chinese invented culture. ;-)
Sorry about that, Tom.
Mr. Y
Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 12:33:59 -0700, Mr. Y
><minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>
>>Heh heh. Sorry, friend, but you take yourself far too
seriously.
>>The silk spinning machine, silk knitting machine, crucible
>>steel, steam piston engine, and the flush toilet (among many
>>other great advancements and innovations) were all inventions
>>from England. Get it...ENG-land?
>>
>
>Some people still think that China (chinaware) was also
invented in
>ENG-land. LOL
>
>None of the above mentioned items were invented in ENG-land.
>
>
>
>
>Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark,
U.S.
>Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
>, and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
>Come visit my website.
>
>http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
>
>
30,000,000 Chinese who died as a result of the Cultural
Revolution.
Mr. Y
Goodman <Comment...@headquarter.com> wrote:
>On Wed, 19 Apr 2000 14:33:39 -0700, Mr. Y
><minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>
>>The Chinese indeed were once the most advanced people on earth,
>>and I stress "were." In the last 500 years most of mankind's
>>significant advancements have been authored in the West. What
of
>>equal consequence has China contributed to the world during
that
>>same period?
>
Manchurians for
>a few centuries. After Dr.Sun overthrew the Qing Dynasty and
set up
>ROC, China was in a very bad shape but there wasn't any foreign
>support except from communist Russia. As soon as Dr.Sun dies,
>generalissimo Chiang Kai-shek seizes power and makes himself
emperor
>of "new China". Nazi Germany supplied assistance to Chiang
>Japan invaded China, these worsen China's already bad
condition . Then
>AmeriKKKans moved in and assisted Chiang regime in continuation
of
>genocide on Chinese people. There wasn't a moment of peace from
the
>time of Dr.Sun's death to the fled of Chiang regime to Taiwan.
>
totally on
>its own. Miraculously, praise to God, Chinese people led by
Chinese
>Communist Party went through all the tough stages and finally
come to
>this point : a world super power !!
>
money, no
>modern technology or equipments, no foreign support, and the
natural
>famine that had happened for thousands of years hit China's
rapid
>growing population.
>
>Now China is the world biggest manufacturer. From being
creative but
>fell under foreign intruders more than a few centuries ago,
China now
>concentrates on making money to build up its national defenses
rather
>than waste time on inventing better chopsticks.
>
>God has been helping PRC along. This nation will be the
critical power
>to contain the end-time Babylon and the whore - USA.
>
>Praise God !
>
>
>
>Find out about Christian Communism, Bible prophecy, Noah's Ark,
U.S.
>Holocaust, CIA's dark secrets
>, and the evil dalai lama slavemaster.
>Come visit my website.
>
>http://members.xoom.com/TomGoodman/index.htm
>
>
>
>
What's with all these people in these various Asian NG's
constantly complaining about how they were innocent victims of
other nations' transgressions. You got the Vietnamese crying
about being brutalized by the Koreans; the Koreans griping about
being colonized by the Japanese; the Japanese bleeding about the
A-bomb; and Chinese complaining that they are not being given
credit for being the great-grandfathers of nuclear power since
they invented firecrackers.
Well, everyone, look upon your own histories. Except for cases
of natural calamities, the true cause for every collapse
recorded in history is not the invaders themselves but the prior
collapse of internal systems and morals which have weakened the
nation and invite domination by others...
EVEN in the case of the ancient Chinese.
Mr. Y
as well as all other nations owe their cultures and indeed their
very existence to the East Africans since the first
scientifically proven evidence of bi-pedalism occurred there. Bi-
pedalism freed up the hands, which already had developed the
opposable thumb, and afforded the luxury to do all sorts of
great things...like inventing the flush toilet and typing poop
on a keyboard prolifically.
T*G's anticipated reply:
The Chinese invented bi-pedalism. In a manuscript dated to
12,000,000B.C. Emperor Mung Kee invented the human foot and
decreed that walking on all fours or even allowing the hands to
touch the ground to balance oneself would no longer be required
of Chinese subjects. Without this invention the West would not
have been able to rub its eyes and scratch its head in wonder at
the glorious accomplishments of the Chinese.
Huitman Huang
what you did is to prove 'west don't respect Chinese culture and history,
and instead, they do respect korean culture and history'?
one thing is for sure that: chinese culture >> korean culture, got it?
a history teacher Huitman
Tom Goodman
<minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>In article <8dkh0r$kma$1...@nnrp1.deja.com>, Dong-Jun Ha
><doha...@mail.usyd.edu.au> wrote:
>>The fact is: Chinese culture IS superior. I'm a proud Korean
>but I know
>>that 80% of our culture we owe to the Chinese. How do I know
>this?
>>STUDY HISTORY!
>>Dong-Jun Ha
>>
>
>That's a pretty heavy statement. China is "bigger," "more
>populous," "older," "has had a more tumultuous history," "has
>more influence in Washington," "won more Olympic gold medals"
>than Korea, but "superior" is not as easy to say. I don't agree
>or disagree with you right now, but on what grounds are you
>saying this? Assuming that the (statistically laughable) "80%"
>of Korean culture being indebted to the Chinese demonstrates
>that the Chinese are "superior" to the Koreans can one argue,
>then, that the British are "superior" to the Americans?
>
I kind of agree with you there. Every culture is interesting in its
own right. Although Korean culture is heavily based on Chinese
culture, Chinese don't considered themselves superior to others. We
can find Chinese are very interested in others' cultures; Chinese
don't discriminate or stare down on others' culture. For instance,
Hong Kong is elected by UN as world's most international city.
Everywhere in Hong Kong, there are all sorts of restaurants and
residents of different culture. "Banana Leaf Curry House", "Pizza
Hut", "McDonalds", operate along side Chinese food restaurant chains.
not to mention Korean BBQ or Japanese sushi restaurant chains there.
More Chinese than East Indians eat at East Indian restaurants. Hong
Kong has the world's highest number of eatery per capita. The busiest
McDonalds is in Hong Kong. Hong Kong Chinese consume the most France
brandy per capita...
What makes Chinese advance so quickly is they are open to foreign
culture.
Tom Goodman
<minyangny...@hotmail.com.invalid>, wrote:
>Right, and Bone China comes from the ground up remains of the
>30,000,000 Chinese who died as a result of the Cultural
>Revolution.
You are another brainwashed victim of AmeriKKKan propaganda. The 30
million victims were massacred by white AmeriKKKans in North America;
the 30 million victims were Native American Indians. Can you repeat
after me: Native American Indians.
Tom Goodman
<huih...@iupui.edu>, wrote:
>then guy named Mr. Y, we have seen you posted so many stuff here.
>what you did is to prove 'west don't respect Chinese culture and history,
>and instead, they do respect korean culture and history'?
>one thing is for sure that: chinese culture >> korean culture, got it?
"Mr.Y" is just a troll trying to insult Chinese people. He doesn't
care about actual facts.
However, I don't agree with you that Chinese culture is better than
Korean culture. In my opinion, each has its own style, although Korean
culture is no doubt and very obvious it's heavily Chinese based.
It's a waste of time to debate with a few crazy Korean AmeriKKKans who
have been brainwashed by white supremacist and racists. I have been to
Korea many times, I must say that Korean people are friendly towards
Chinese, and that both consider themselves brothers - which they are.
We won't let a few rotten racist punks like "Mr.Y" ruin the long-time
friendship between Korean and Chinese people.
Mr. Y
100...@stutz.iupui.edu>, Huitman Huang
Oh really? Strange, since I've only been here for a few
months and've been fairly sparing with my posts.
Maybe "we" confuse me with Mr. Z as in ZZZZZZ--you're
post bores me.
>what you did is to prove 'west don't respect Chinese
culture and history,
>and instead, they do respect korean culture and
history'?
>one thing is for sure that: chinese culture >> korean
culture, got it?
Yeah, I got it. You're really bad at both reading
comprehension and analytical reasoning and so you
decided to teach history.
>
>a history teacher Huitman
>
At which institution of higher learning would that be?
BTW, so you deny that bi-pedalism first occured in
Africa? *I've* seen *your* posts and this proves once
and for all that you are a racist hater of black
people. YOU ARE A RACIST HATER OF BLACK PEOPLE. :-) have
a great day!
Mr. Y
>You are another brainwashed victim of AmeriKKKan
propaganda. The 30
>million victims were massacred by white AmeriKKKans in
North America;
>the 30 million victims were Native American Indians.
Statistics courtesy of: Leolee38 (a Korean)
Mr. Y
<pugufs82215r8036e...@4ax.com>, Tom
Goodman <Commen...@headquarter.cci> wrote:
>
>"Mr.Y" is just a troll trying to insult Chinese
people. He doesn't
>care about actual facts.
>
>However, I don't agree with you that Chinese culture
is better than
>Korean culture. In my opinion, each has its own style,
although Korean
>culture is no doubt and very obvious it's heavily
Chinese based.
>
have never said anything intended to be derogatory
about the Chinese or any other peoples (nations) in my
life. However, I am putting down TOM GOODMAN. Never
have I been accused of trolling before, but if you think
I'm trolling then do the obvious thing: DON'T RESPOND.
>It's a waste of time to debate with a few crazy Korean
AmeriKKKans who
>have been brainwashed by white supremacist and
racists. I have been to
>Korea many times, I must say that Korean people are
friendly towards
>Chinese, and that both consider themselves brothers -
which they are.
>We won't let a few rotten racist punks like "Mr.Y"
ruin the long-time
>friendship between Korean and Chinese people.
>
Ah, the beauty of the internet...People all over the
world forever able to see what Tom Goodman's really
made of: stupidity, lies, weakness, pettiness, and,
perhaps, naivete.
Frankly, I think I just got to you and you're flustered.
Where are your high-falutin Great China references now
that you have to fight mano-a-mano?
Mr. Y
<9fatfs8r309aactc4...@4ax.com>, Tom
Goodman <Commen...@headquarter.cci> wrote:
>On Thu, 20 Apr 2000 14:23:23 +0900, "김좌진" >
this time is to be
>seen in the style of the turumagi overcoat worn by
noblemen, pictured
>in fresco paintings as a voluminous full-length
garment made almost
>exactly like the p'ao robe of T'ang China.
>
their leaders all wear suits (a derivation of the ENG-
lish hunting coat) I suppose that the Chinese are under
the influence of the British, right?
Mr. Y
Just in case, and for the record: My last post was sent
in mockery of your post to me. I do not believe that you
are a "racist hater of black people." Just be careful
what you accuse people of. That's the only point.