Showin a box SVN

[papyromancer]

Hi everyone,

I'm really liking show in a box these days. I've just started hacking
away at it for my own projects at http://thecode.munaught.net/ (if
you're interested what the project is, go to http://thecode.us ). We
plan on using Show in a Box and the PledgeDrive plugin.

I chatted a little bit with Jay earlier today, and he told me that y'all
are in the process of setting up an SVN repository for show in a box.

If there's any way I can help out with this let me know...I have a
really good understanding of how to incorporate external project
references in svn in ways that preserve the licenses of the individual
libraries (I'm a rails junky) even though my PHP skills are, at best,
minimal.

--Drew

[Jay dedman]

> I'm really liking show in a box these days. I've just started hacking
> away at it for my own projects at http://thecode.munaught.net/ (if
> you're interested what the project is, go to http://thecode.us ). We
> plan on using Show in a Box and the PledgeDrive plugin.

this is my Drew.
he's from the old days of Ourmedia.
welcome.

> I chatted a little bit with Jay earlier today, and he told me that y'all
> are in the process of setting up an SVN repository for show in a box.

i wasnt sure if we were going to have a palce where we build the SIAB
install folder.
verdi? anyone?
we should keep it all out in the opne so anyone (like Drew) can contribute.

> If there's any way I can help out with this let me know...I have a
> really good understanding of how to incorporate external project
> references in svn in ways that preserve the licenses of the individual
> libraries (I'm a rails junky) even though my PHP skills are, at best,
> minimal.

Jay

--
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917 371 6790
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RSS: http://tinyurl.com/yqgdt9

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

Hello,

On 9/19/07, papyromancer <papyro...@gmail.com> wrote:

[...]

I chatted a little bit with Jay earlier today, and he told me that y'all
are in the process of setting up an SVN repository for show in a box.

There actually already is one for the VideoPress part of Show in a Box.  You can see the web-based interface to it here...

http://websvn.newtube.org/


See ya

--
    Charles Iliya Krempeaux, B.Sc. <http://ChangeLog.ca/>


                 Vlog Razor... Vlogging News
                    http://vlograzor.com/

[Enric]

On 9/19/07, Charles Iliya Krempeaux <superc...@gmail.com> wrote:

Hello,

On 9/19/07, papyromancer <papyro...@gmail.com > wrote:

[...]

I chatted a little bit with Jay earlier today, and he told me that y'all
are in the process of setting up an SVN repository for show in a box.

There actually already is one for the VideoPress part of Show in a Box.  You can see the web-based interface to it here...

http://websvn.newtube.org/

And here's the one to vPIP:

http://svn.wp-plugins.org/vpip-videos-playing-in-place/trunk/

  -- Enric
 

[Jen Simmons]

What's a SVN repository??

I've got The Box right now -- i've been keeper of the latest
itteration + it's on my local computer (and backed-up onto my server
in a sandbox) (and notated on the wiki so we can recreate it)

What's the developer way to do it???

jen

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

Hey Jen,

SVN is short for Subversion.  Subversion is a name of a software system that is geared towards developers and software engineers.

It's main use it to help manage "code".  To keep track of changes and history of code changes.  To be able to coordinate code changes made in different "places".  And to help organize teams of developers and software engineers.


See ya

[Jay dedman]

> What's a SVN repository??
> I've got The Box right now -- i've been keeper of the latest
> itteration + it's on my local computer (and backed-up onto my server
> in a sandbox) (and notated on the wiki so we can recreate it)
> What's the developer way to do it???

is a SVN just for the plugins?
right now, we've got this page to document the changes to the K2 theme:
http://showinabox.pbwiki.com/Modifications

Ultimately, it would be nice to have ot all visible so anyone could
come in and contribute.
make a new theme.
etc

jay

[Cheryl Colan]

Yeah, I don't even know what "SVN" stands for. And right now, if it
makes a few more hours work for me, I can't handle it.

BUT, it would be great to have Drew's help. We really do need help
with licensing issues. See "Licensing" on this page:
http://showinabox.pbwiki.com/Hackathon

I don't know about anyone else but my biggest concern is finding out
whether any of the plugins we want to include are not GPL licensed,
and what to do about it if they are. And to get the issue of vPIP
documented/nailed down ... is it a different distribution inside
Show-In-A-Box, or isn't it, and if it is, exactly what do we have to
do?

I was right there with everyone else in the room at the hackathon ...
whenever someone said "we need to research licensing" everybody got
super focused on whatever we were working on. I don't want to deal
with that part because my eyes glaze over when I try to read the
licensing stuff. So Drew, if you want to help with that, I for one am
jumping up and down for joy.

Cheryl

On 9/19/07, Jen Simmons <jensimm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>

--
I vlog: hummingcrow.com
I make: whatwefound.blogspot.com
I teach: node101phoenix.org

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

Having anyone contribute is different from giving everyone "write ability" in the SVN repository.

Right now... if someone makes a change to vPIP... they send that change to Enric... he takes a look at it... makes sure it is OK... and then puts it into the vPIP code.

The same goes for VideoPress (if anyone besides me decides to contribute to it).

This is the best way to handle these kinds of projects.

You need one person who is "in charge" of that code... and checks things over before anything goes in.

Without that... you'll end up with bad results.  (You need a person "in charge" of the code to manage it.)


See ya

[Enric]

SVN or subversion is an open source versioning tool on a server, http://subversion.tigris.org/.  As you write different versions of your work, you put it in subversion.  It keeps track of the entries and differences.  You can check out an older version, recent version, compare versions, etc.  Sort of like a wiki.  You usually use client software on your computer to get and send updates to subversion server like  tortoisesvn  on windows and http://tortoisesvn.tigris.org/.  For the Mac, I don't know what's good.  People seem to like svnX, http://www.lachoseinteractive.net/en/community/subversion/svnx/features/ , and Versions looks like nice on the site, http://www.versionsapp.com/, but haven't tried them.

  -- Enric

On 9/19/07, Jen Simmons <jensimm...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

VideoPress is all GPL'ed.

[Enric]

vPIP is LGPL.

  -- Enric

On 9/19/07, Charles Iliya Krempeaux <superc...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

To start off... if you want to contribute... I'd say... get a copy of the latest code.

Make your changes.  Once you're done.... TEST your changes.  (And TEST TEST TEST some more :-)  Seriously though... TEST the thing.)

Send the changes to the list.  (You can do this in the form a diff.... or just chunks of code.)

And that's basically it.

If you're not sure what any of that means... just ask!


See ya

On 9/19/07, Charles Iliya Krempeaux <superc...@gmail.com> wrote:

--
    Charles Iliya Krempeaux, B.Sc. < http://ChangeLog.ca/>

                 Vlog Razor... Vlogging News
                    http://vlograzor.com/

--
    Charles Iliya Krempeaux, B.Sc. <http://ChangeLog.ca/>

[Jay dedman]

On 9/19/07, Charles Iliya Krempeaux <superc...@gmail.com> wrote:

> Having anyone contribute is different from giving everyone "write ability"
> in the SVN repository.
> Right now... if someone makes a change to vPIP... they send that change to
> Enric... he takes a look at it... makes sure it is OK... and then puts it
> into the vPIP code.
> The same goes for VideoPress (if anyone besides me decides to contribute to
> it).
> This is the best way to handle these kinds of projects.
> You need one person who is "in charge" of that code... and checks things
> over before anything goes in.
> Without that... you'll end up with bad results. (You need a person "in
> charge" of the code to manage it.)

cool...then we have all that for the plugins.
(markus could make a SVN for the Pledge Drive plugin)

but for the mod of the K2 theme that jen, Verdi, and Cheryl are
working on...I assume we handle it differently? if someone wants to
make a theme for SIAB, we want them to start with the same theme we
have.

Jay

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

Unless Jen, Verdi, and Cheryl are comfortable using a tool like SVN
(which I have a feeling they are not), I'd say they should stay away
from it.

They probably won't find it helpful.

On 9/19/07, Jay dedman <jay.d...@gmail.com> wrote:
>

--
Charles Iliya Krempeaux, B.Sc. <http://ChangeLog.ca/>

[papyromancer]

Ok, so

Wordpress is GPL 2
http://codex.wordpress.org/Using_Subversion

K2 is GPL 2
http://code.google.com/p/kaytwo/

VideoPress is GPL 2
http://websvn.newtube.org/

vPIP is LGPL 2.1
http://svn.wp-plugins.org/vpip-videos-playing-in-place/trunk/

Is it alright if I go on and make a subversion repository on google code
called showinabox. For now it seems like the plugins are all in place
in their own repositories, but it'll help me keep up with current code
from all the projects that SIAB uses...maybe it'll help future
developers too. If I can get it all working, perhaps we can convince
the projects to make show in a box branches within their own
repositories if we have to modify their code.

Can you guys fill me in on approximate revision numbers that show in a
box is currently tied to, and which plugins are modified from their
original copies?

--Drew

[Markus Sandy]

papyromancer wrote:

hey Drew

good to see you here

we can definitely use the SVN help (being a Drupal guy, I'm still using
CVS but would prefer SVN which I've used just a little with my minimal
rails experience)

regards,
markus

[ryanne hodson]

i see that vpip is LGPL which does not fully jive with GPL, no?
and it's LGPL because of enric's flash player
so if we used the jw player, vpip would be full GPL, right?

just checkin'

-ry

Ok, so

Wordpress is GPL 2
http://codex.wordpress.org/Using_Subversion

K2 is GPL 2
http://code.google.com/p/kaytwo/

VideoPress is GPL 2
http://websvn.newtube.org/

vPIP is LGPL 2.1
http://svn.wp-plugins.org/vpip-videos-playing-in-place/trunk/

--
Me ----> http://RyanEdit.com
Twitter------>http://twitter.com/Ryanne
Documenting Green ---->http://RyanIsHungry.com
Educate ----> http://FreeVlog.org
iChat/AIM ----> VideoRodeo

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

The GPL and LGPL are designed to work together.  (They both come from the FSF -- http://fsf.org/ )

There's no problem with vPIP being release under the LGPL.

[papyromancer]

LGPL can be included in GPL programs, but not the other way around
(without posting patches of code changes to the GPL'd program).

It looks like all the licensing is in order. So if no one has any
objection to setting up an SVN on Google Code in the next 18 hours or
so, I'll get to work on that tomorrow evening (CDT). Let me know if I
need to extend that window. I'd hate to step on anyone's toes by
snagging the showinabox identifier on Google Code.

I think it should just be a project for me to work on right now. I know
all of you are working very hard on a new version of SIAB right now.
And I don't want to interrupt the workflow y'all have in place. But I
think that I can get it setup in a way that once you release your next
version, I'll be able to duplicate the release process in SVN and then,
if the developers like the google code system, we can then discuss using
it as a way to integrate the disparate development environments we
currently have.

--Drew

[Enric]

GPL is compatible with less restrictive license including LGPL.  See:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GNU_General_Public_License#Compatibility_and_multi-licensing

I'm not sure you can change a license that the owner has given.  Or if you do, you become responsible for that code in that version -- it branches.  Is that correct Charles, Drew?

  -- Enric

On 9/19/07, ryanne hodson <ryanne...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

AFAIK... any LGPL'ed software can be turned into GPL'ed software.  (It's in the license somewhere.)

[Enric]

You're correct,

http://www.gnu.org/licenses/lgpl-2.1.html
=============================
"3. You may opt to apply the terms of the ordinary GNU General Public License instead of this License to a given copy of the Library. To do this, you must alter all the notices that refer to this License, so that they refer to the ordinary GNU General Public License, version 2, instead of to this License. (If a newer version than version 2 of the ordinary GNU General Public License has appeared, then you can specify that version instead if you wish.) Do not make any other change in these notices.

Once this change is made in a given copy, it is irreversible for that copy, so the ordinary GNU General Public License applies to all subsequent copies and derivative works made from that copy."

If you remove cineViewer.swf and related files (cineViewer.xml, jeroen folder and vanilla folder), then relicense and put GPL notices that version of vPIP (a different release) would be GPL.  This is a separate vPIP product.

  -- Enric

On 9/19/07, Charles Iliya Krempeaux <superc...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Charles Iliya Krempeaux]

Hmmm... I was looking over Google Code's ToS, and...

From http://code.google.com/tos.html ...

9. MODIFICATIONS TO SERVICE

Google reserves the right at any time and from time to time to modify or discontinue, temporarily or permanently, Google services (or any part thereof) with or without notice. You agree that Google shall not be liable to you or to any third party for any modification, suspension or discontinuance of Google services.

It's got an open ended ToS.  So they could change it to anything they wanted... and kind of pull a SourceForge.

Also...

Users outside of the United States agree to comply with their own local rules regarding online conduct and acceptable content, including laws regulating the export of data to and from the United States or your country of residence.

Does that mean I'm agreeing to be bound by the DMCA.  Because I wouldn't be cool with that.  (I'm a Canadian and not an American.  And so far we don't have this kind of censorship law.)

Also...

5. EXPORT CONTROLS

When posting Content to the Google Code website (http://code.google.com) or when sharing Content obtained from this website with others, you agree that you are solely responsible for complying with U.S. export control regulations, including the Export Administration Regulations ("EAR"), and all other applicable export and import laws and regulations. These regulations require that all postings of open source encryption code be simultaneously reported by email to the U.S. government. You are responsible for submitting this email report to the U.S. government in accordance with procedures described in: http://www.bis.doc.gov/encryption/PubAvailEncSourceCodeNofify.html and Section 740.13(e) of the EAR.

Users residing in countries on the United States Office of Foreign Assets Control sanction list, including Cuba, Iran, Libya, North Korea, Sudan and Syria, may not post or access Content available through the Google Code website.

This is also concerning to me.  I don't want to have to be forced into obeying USA export laws.

And...

Choice of Law and Forum. The Terms and the relationship between you and Google shall be governed by the laws of the State of California without regard to its conflict of law provisions. You and Google agree to submit to the personal and exclusive jurisdiction of the courts located within the county of Santa Clara, California.

I'm not cool with this either.  I don't want to be bound by any American law.  (I'm Canadian not American.)


If we really want a central shared SVN repository... why not put something up ourselves... say on the showinabox.tv domain.  (I've already done it one newtube.org.)


See ya

On 9/19/07, papyromancer < papyro...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Jen Simmons]

this sounds good to me...

whose account is showinthebox.tv on? which server? shall we think about being digg-proof? 

jen

[Jay dedman]

> whose account is showinthebox.tv on? which server? shall we think about
> being digg-proof?

its on verdi's server.
haha youre really getting ready for the deluge!
im a little afraid of setting expectations too high when we "launch".

i think itll be a real grassroots effort with video creators slowly
finidng out about us...and using SIAB. The new site and tutorials will
really help bring in new people.

Then hopefully designers and coders will contribute back into the
project so there are more choices and cool stuff.

[Jen Simmons]

Well....
I've ben wrestling for three days with my server. It keeps going down
by itself :( -- so I've got server solutions on the brain.

AND the smashing magazine seems to get all it's posts dugg....

anyway.

j

[Enric]

I've changed all my scripts to the X11 license which is compatible with GNU GPL,

http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/license-list.html

Download vPIP at:

http://vpip.org/downloads/vPIP1.12/wp/vPIP.zip

and the vPIP Feeds widget and script at:

http://vpip.org/downloads/vPIP1.12/wp/widgets.zip

The installation instructions are at:

http://wiki.vpip.org/index.php?title=Wordpress_Install

which is also where the above links are.

Explanation:  The LGPL license on vPIP source code seems to cause some confusion.  It's original purpose at GNU was to link copyrighted libraries with GPL libraries.  It's not encouraged by GNU to be used.  My purpose in using LGPL was to include anyone who wants to use vPIP without restrictions.  The GPL license requires the source code to be available and takes away the software writers choice on negotiating the availability of source code regardless of the sofware clients needs.  GNU recommends using the X11 license as "a simple, permissive non-copyleft free software license, compatible with the GNU GPL."  So I've switched all the scripts to the X11 license.  You may still remove copyrighted code and binaries from vPIP like the cineViewer (flash video player), but then you become responsible for that release of the code.

  -- Enric

On 9/19/07, papyromancer <papyro...@gmail.com> wrote:

[Michael Verdi]

Show In A Box is on my server - it's a shared hosting account. If we
can install SVN and it will be helpful and release us from the
restrictions of the google repository than let's go for it. As for
digg proof - I was dug once without any problems (video was hosted on
blip) and Ryanne got linked on the Blogger Buzz blog which brought in
more traffic than digg and we didn't have a problem either.

- Verdi

--
http://michaelverdi.com
http://freevlog.org
http://nscape.tv

[ryanne hodson]

yeah we're digg proof!
esp with blip on our sides....