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This is what you get when you leave Democrats in charge for too long
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Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 10:46:18 AM8/20/12
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"Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
eliminate positions.
Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
some critics say.
The horseshoer’s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
blacksmith work … and to perform related work as required." The
description was last updated in 1967."
http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
eliminate positions.
Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
some critics say.
The horseshoer’s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
blacksmith work … and to perform related work as required." The
description was last updated in 1967."
http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 11:15:50 AM8/20/12
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not sitting
around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 12:09:16 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
union member.
> And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
And $27K in benefits which probably means a 6 digit retirement.
Detroit is going bankrupt.
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> >"Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> >city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> >Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> >horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> >eliminate positions.
>
> >Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> >some critics say.
>
> >The horseshoer s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
> >blacksmith work and to perform related work as required." The
> >description was last updated in 1967."
>
> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not sitting
> around waiting for a horse to come in.
He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
> >"Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> >city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> >Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> >horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> >eliminate positions.
>
> >Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> >some critics say.
>
> >The horseshoer s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
> >blacksmith work and to perform related work as required." The
> >description was last updated in 1967."
>
> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not sitting
> around waiting for a horse to come in.
union member.
> And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
Detroit is going bankrupt.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 12:18:34 PM8/20/12
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http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between_blacksmith_&_farrier.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
>> And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
>> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
>
>And $27K in benefits which probably means a 6 digit retirement.
>Detroit is going bankrupt.
Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:8f91f006-b40c-4ee6...@w9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>>
>> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
>> sitting
>> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
>He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
>union member.
Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith work.
>>
>> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>>
>> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
>> sitting
>> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
>He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
>union member.
http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between_blacksmith_&_farrier.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
>> And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
>> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
>
>And $27K in benefits which probably means a 6 digit retirement.
>Detroit is going bankrupt.
packet drop
Aug 20, 2012, 12:26:57 PM8/20/12
to
On 8/20/2012 10:18 AM, Baxter wrote:
> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
Put "ya'll" back in chains, LOLOL!!!
> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 12:41:20 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com...
>
> >"Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> >city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> >Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> >horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> >eliminate positions.
>
> >Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> >some critics say.
>
> >The horseshoer s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
> >blacksmith work and to perform related work as required." The
> >description was last updated in 1967."
>
> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not sitting
> around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
> >"Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> >city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> >Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> >horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> >eliminate positions.
>
> >Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> >some critics say.
>
> >The horseshoer s job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
> >blacksmith work and to perform related work as required." The
> >description was last updated in 1967."
>
> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not sitting
> around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cuts_n_1759716.html
But they'll keep the "horseshoer" because he's not being paid very
much for doing nothing.
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 12:37:11 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 9:18 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:8f91f006-b40c-4ee6...@w9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> sitting
> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
> >union member.
>
> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith work.
>
> http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
>
>
>
> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> sitting
> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
> >union member.
>
> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith work.
>
You are saying that the horseshoer will be taking work away from the
cities unionized iron workers.
You realize that as practical and as Republican as that is, it is not
the reality within the unholy alliance between municipalities and
unions.
I have a friend who got a job a the port of Seattle - his first public
sector job. The first day they told him to "slow down - you don't have
to get your work done."
> >> And at $29,245 he's not getting paid
> >> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
>
> >And $27K in benefits which probably means a 6 digit retirement.
> >Detroit is going bankrupt.
>
> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
was ended. Now Democrats have turned to freeloading and gutting
municipalities leaving a mess for Capitalists to clean up.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 12:53:28 PM8/20/12
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description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
taking work away from anyone.
>You realize that as practical and as Republican as that is, it is not
>the reality within the unholy alliance between municipalities and
>unions.
Balderdash
>I have a friend who got a job a the port of Seattle - his first public
>sector job. The first day they told him to "slow down - you don't have
>to get your work done."
I heard things like that in the Private Sector too. Mostly it's the old guy
trying to sabotage the new guy.
>>
>> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
>
>Slaves are something that Democrats had and thanks to Republicans that
>was ended.
Are you trying to claim that Lincoln would be welcome in today's Republican
party?
> Now Democrats have turned to freeloading and gutting
>municipalities leaving a mess for Capitalists to clean up.
History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:72279b8f-5fb2-4c12...@s7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
On Aug 20, 9:18 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> messagenews:8f91f006-b40c-4ee6-862b->c9c1c8...@w9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in
>> On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>>
>> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
>> >> sitting
>> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>>
>> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
>> >union member.
>>
>> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith
>> work.
>>
>>http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
>
>You are saying that the horseshoer will be taking work away from the
>cities unionized iron workers.
He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his job
>> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>>
>> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
>> >> sitting
>> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>>
>> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
>> >union member.
>>
>> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith
>> work.
>>
>>http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
>
>You are saying that the horseshoer will be taking work away from the
>cities unionized iron workers.
description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
taking work away from anyone.
>You realize that as practical and as Republican as that is, it is not
>the reality within the unholy alliance between municipalities and
>unions.
>I have a friend who got a job a the port of Seattle - his first public
>sector job. The first day they told him to "slow down - you don't have
>to get your work done."
trying to sabotage the new guy.
>>
>> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
>
>Slaves are something that Democrats had and thanks to Republicans that
>was ended.
party?
> Now Democrats have turned to freeloading and gutting
>municipalities leaving a mess for Capitalists to clean up.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 12:57:37 PM8/20/12
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That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else who
can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:bfbddded-e811-4786...@l17g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>>
>But they'll keep the "horseshoer" because he's not being paid very
>much for doing nothing.
What makes you think he's not doing anything? Blacksmithing is part of his
>But they'll keep the "horseshoer" because he's not being paid very
>much for doing nothing.
work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else who
can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 1:49:15 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 9:53 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:72279b8f-5fb2-4c12...@s7g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 20, 9:18 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> >> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in
> >> messagenews:8f91f006-b40c-4ee6-862b->c9c1c8100__BEGIN_MASK_n#9g02mG7!__...__END_MASK_i?a63jfAD$z...@w9g2000yqe.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
> >> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in
> >> On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> >> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> >> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> >> sitting
> >> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
> >> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
> >> >union member.
>
> >> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith
> >> work.
>
> >>http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between...
>
> >> >> >http://www.michigancapitolconfidential.com/17404
>
> >> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> >> sitting
> >> >> around waiting for a horse to come in.
>
> >> >He's *UNION*. Of course they'd let him take away work from another
> >> >union member.
>
> >> Non Sequitur. Whether or not he's union, he's still doing Blacksmith
> >> work.
>
> >>http://www.americanblacksmith.com/blacksmithstable/difference_between...
>
> >You are saying that the horseshoer will be taking work away from the
> >cities unionized iron workers.
>
> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his job
> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
> taking work away from anyone.
That's wahat I'm saying. He's not doing anyone's job. There are 257
> >cities unionized iron workers.
>
> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his job
> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
> taking work away from anyone.
job descriptions at Detroit Sewer and Water. There is nothing for him
to do except shoe horses.
> >You realize that as practical and as Republican as that is, it is not
> >the reality within the unholy alliance between municipalities and
> >unions.
>
> Balderdash
defined unionized rolls of municipal employees and what happens when
one encroaches upon another’s duties. You are either ignorant or
dishonest.
> >I have a friend who got a job a the port of Seattle - his first public
> >sector job. The first day they told him to "slow down - you don't have
> >to get your work done."
>
> I heard things like that in the Private Sector too. Mostly it's the old guy
> trying to sabotage the new guy.
you have to produce more. This is not a factor in unionized public
sector jobs.
> >> Well, we know that you Capitalists do like slave labor.
>
> >Slaves are something that Democrats had and thanks to Republicans that
> >was ended.
>
> Are you trying to claim that Lincoln would be welcome in today's Republican
> party?
America. If given the opportunity could you see Lincoln, a Republican,
being the key-note speaker at this years Democrat Convention? The same
will be true about Reagan in 100 years.
> > Now Democrats have turned to freeloading and gutting
> >municipalities leaving a mess for Capitalists to clean up.
>
> History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
Prove it.
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 1:56:24 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 9:57 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:bfbddded-e811-4786...@l17g2000yqg.googlegroups.com...
> On Aug 20, 8:15 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> sitting
> >> around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting
> >> paid
> >> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
>
> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
> >http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cut...
>
>
>
> >> But there IS plenty of work for a blacksmith to do - that guy is not
> >> sitting
> >> around waiting for a horse to come in. And at $29,245 he's not getting
> >> paid
> >> very well for blacksmithing - good blacksmiths earn 2X or 3X.
>
> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
>
> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
It's the intersection of liberalism and reality. I don't live in
> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
Detroit but I'm glad they are taking steps to fix their problem -
which you will refuse to notice - isn't that they aren't taxing the
people of Detroit too little.
> >But they'll keep the "horseshoer" because he's not being paid very
> >much for doing nothing.
>
> What makes you think he's not doing anything? Blacksmithing is part of his
> work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
iron workers? Does he make swords for the Detroit Sewer and Water
employees? Maybe iron gates? Decorative wall hangings for the employee
lounge?
> What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else who
> can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
going bankrupt and the water and sewer department is overstaffed by
400%.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 1:58:57 PM8/20/12
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in addition to horseshoeing. There's plenty of blacksmith work. Did you
even read any of the links I posted on the subject? A blacksmith does
plenty of non-horse work and many blacksmiths never go anywhere near a
horse.
You don't have any "outrage" issue here - other than the fact his job
description hasn't been updated for decades.
You claim that he has nothing to do and that the "evil" union is making the
city keep him on - neither of your claims is supported by your references.
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5ab0d2b2-aee2-48e3...@y1g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>On Aug 20, 9:53 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his
>> job
>> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
>> taking work away from anyone.
>
>That's wahat I'm saying. He's not doing anyone's job. There are 257
>job descriptions at Detroit Sewer and Water. There is nothing for him
>to do except shoe horses.
Go back and actually read that job description - he has blacksmithing duties
>>
>> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his
>> job
>> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
>> taking work away from anyone.
>
>That's wahat I'm saying. He's not doing anyone's job. There are 257
>job descriptions at Detroit Sewer and Water. There is nothing for him
>to do except shoe horses.
in addition to horseshoeing. There's plenty of blacksmith work. Did you
even read any of the links I posted on the subject? A blacksmith does
plenty of non-horse work and many blacksmiths never go anywhere near a
horse.
You don't have any "outrage" issue here - other than the fact his job
description hasn't been updated for decades.
You claim that he has nothing to do and that the "evil" union is making the
city keep him on - neither of your claims is supported by your references.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 2:34:57 PM8/20/12
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From other sources, we know that Detroit has lost population and their
property values have plummeted.
>>
>> What makes you think he's not doing anything? Blacksmithing is part of
>> his
>> work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
>
>What does he do that isn't already the responsiblity of the city's
>iron workers?
You've not shown that Detroit has any other ironworkers.
>Does he make swords for the Detroit Sewer and Water
>employees? Maybe iron gates? Decorative wall hangings for the employee
>lounge?
Gates, railings, and the like are a very distinct possiblity for Sewer and
Water organizations
>> What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else
>> who
>> can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
>
>He will obviously be cut
You've not shown that.
>because he doesn't do anything
You've definitely not shown that.
> and Detroit is
>going bankrupt and the water and sewer department is overstaffed by
>400%.
So? What does any of that have to do with us in the PWN?
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"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:99dcce6e-db99-4b28...@x8g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>On Aug 20, 9:57 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
>> >http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cut...
>>
>> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
>
>It's the intersection of liberalism and reality. I don't live in
>Detroit but I'm glad they are taking steps to fix their problem -
>which you will refuse to notice - isn't that they aren't taxing the
>people of Detroit too little.
You've shown nothing about the tax level.
>>
>> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
>> >http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cut...
>>
>> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
>
>It's the intersection of liberalism and reality. I don't live in
>Detroit but I'm glad they are taking steps to fix their problem -
>which you will refuse to notice - isn't that they aren't taxing the
>people of Detroit too little.
From other sources, we know that Detroit has lost population and their
property values have plummeted.
>>
>> What makes you think he's not doing anything? Blacksmithing is part of
>> his
>> work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
>
>What does he do that isn't already the responsiblity of the city's
>iron workers?
>Does he make swords for the Detroit Sewer and Water
>employees? Maybe iron gates? Decorative wall hangings for the employee
>lounge?
Water organizations
>> What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else
>> who
>> can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
>
>He will obviously be cut
>because he doesn't do anything
> and Detroit is
>going bankrupt and the water and sewer department is overstaffed by
>400%.
packet drop
Aug 20, 2012, 2:37:01 PM8/20/12
to
On 8/20/2012 12:34 PM, Baxter wrote:
> So? What does any of that have to do with us in the PWN?
You go a dozen replies in to finally pull the regional groups charter card?
> So? What does any of that have to do with us in the PWN?
LOLOL!!!!
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 4:21:43 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 10:58 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:5ab0d2b2-aee2-48e3...@y1g2000yqc.googlegroups.com...
>
> >On Aug 20, 9:53 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
> >> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his
> >> job
> >> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
> >> taking work away from anyone.
>
> >That's wahat I'm saying. He's not doing anyone's job. There are 257
> >job descriptions at Detroit Sewer and Water. There is nothing for him
> >to do except shoe horses.
>
> Go back and actually read that job description - he has blacksmithing duties
Tell me exactly what those are. He's on call if someone's wagon wheel
> >On Aug 20, 9:53 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
> >> He's not doing any horseshoing, but he is doing blacksmith work per his
> >> job
> >> description. Nowhere in the article is there any suggestion that he's
> >> taking work away from anyone.
>
> >That's wahat I'm saying. He's not doing anyone's job. There are 257
> >job descriptions at Detroit Sewer and Water. There is nothing for him
> >to do except shoe horses.
>
> Go back and actually read that job description - he has blacksmithing duties
breaks?
> in addition to horseshoeing. There's plenty of blacksmith work. Did you
> even read any of the links I posted on the subject? A blacksmith does
> plenty of non-horse work and many blacksmiths never go anywhere near a
> horse.
> You don't have any "outrage" issue here - other than the fact his job
> description hasn't been updated for decades.
>
> You claim that he has nothing to do and that the "evil" union is making the
> city keep him on - neither of your claims is supported by your references.
doesn't lose their job. What do you want to bet?
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 4:37:59 PM8/20/12
to
On Aug 20, 11:34 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> "Yer Pal Al" <caddyshack...@gmail.com> wrote in messagenews:99dcce6e-db99-4b28...@x8g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
>
> >On Aug 20, 9:57 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
> >> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
> >> >http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cut...
>
> >> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
>
> >It's the intersection of liberalism and reality. I don't live in
> >Detroit but I'm glad they are taking steps to fix their problem -
> >which you will refuse to notice - isn't that they aren't taxing the
> >people of Detroit too little.
>
> You've shown nothing about the tax level.
I don't have to although another link says the city doubled water
> >On Aug 20, 9:57 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>
> >> >"Detroit Water Department To Cut 81% Of Workers Under New Proposal"
> >> >http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/08/09/detroit-water-department-cut...
>
> >> That should make you right-wingers ecstatic.
>
> >It's the intersection of liberalism and reality. I don't live in
> >Detroit but I'm glad they are taking steps to fix their problem -
> >which you will refuse to notice - isn't that they aren't taxing the
> >people of Detroit too little.
>
> You've shown nothing about the tax level.
rates in the last decade. The conservative solution to budget
shortfalls cut spending like firing unneeded employees. The liberal
solution is to tax more. Are you abandoning the liberal solution in
this case?
> From other sources, we know that Detroit has lost population and their
> property values have plummeted.
between Conservative and Liberal philosophy.
> >> What makes you think he's not doing anything? Blacksmithing is part of
> >> his
> >> work description and blacksmiths do a lot of stuff besides horseshoeing.
>
> >What does he do that isn't already the responsiblity of the city's
> >iron workers?
>
> You've not shown that Detroit has any other ironworkers.
title of the guy who assembles and installs the large iron water
mains? Plumber? Steamfitter? What does it matter? It's not a
"blacksmith" who's hired to shoe horses.
> >Does he make swords for the Detroit Sewer and Water
> >employees? Maybe iron gates? Decorative wall hangings for the employee
> >lounge?
>
> Gates, railings, and the like are a very distinct possiblity for Sewer and
> Water organizations
> >> What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else
> >> who
> >> can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
>
> >He will obviously be cut
>
> You've not shown that.
> >because he doesn't do anything
>
> You've definitely not shown that.
>
> > and Detroit is
> >going bankrupt and the water and sewer department is overstaffed by
> >400%.
>
> So? What does any of that have to do with us in the PWN?
care what happens in 20 years.
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 4:39:35 PM8/20/12
to
lose.
packet drop
Aug 20, 2012, 4:50:44 PM8/20/12
to
tighter and more twisted, lol, fun stuff!
Yer Pal Al
Aug 20, 2012, 5:37:13 PM8/20/12
to
can actually make mistakes. Immediately he runs to the defense and
dies on the hill of union excess in Detroit. He seems to believe he's
auditioning for the job of WH spokesperson not realizing that after he
gave up his balls his voice is annoyingly high even for TV.
packet drop
Aug 20, 2012, 6:00:55 PM8/20/12
to
Priceless, he's the definitive un_Carney class clown.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 6:09:04 PM8/20/12
to
-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
A blacksmith is a person who creates objects from wrought iron or steel by
forging the metal; that is, by using tools to hammer, bend, and cut (compare
to whitesmith). Blacksmiths produce objects such as gates, grilles,
railings, light fixtures, furniture, sculpture, tools, agricultural
implements, decorative and religious items, cooking utensils, and weapons.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
-----------
Do you think none of these would be useful to a water and sewer department?
Ever toured a sewage treatment facility?
>>
>> You claim that he has nothing to do and that the "evil" union is making
>> the
>> city keep him on - neither of your claims is supported by your
>> references.
>
>If he's got so much work to do than he will be one of the 20% that
>doesn't lose their job. What do you want to bet?
I don't know whether he will keep or lose his job - and neither do you. I
do know that his work will still need to be done - either by someone else
employed by the city or by someone outside the city at higher cost.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:a60058e3-737a-4a46...@j2g2000yqf.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
On Aug 20, 10:58 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>> Go back and actually read that job description - he has blacksmithing
>> duties
>
>Tell me exactly what those are. He's on call if someone's wagon wheel
>breaks?
---------
>>
>> Go back and actually read that job description - he has blacksmithing
>> duties
>
>Tell me exactly what those are. He's on call if someone's wagon wheel
>breaks?
A blacksmith is a person who creates objects from wrought iron or steel by
forging the metal; that is, by using tools to hammer, bend, and cut (compare
to whitesmith). Blacksmiths produce objects such as gates, grilles,
railings, light fixtures, furniture, sculpture, tools, agricultural
implements, decorative and religious items, cooking utensils, and weapons.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blacksmith
-----------
Do you think none of these would be useful to a water and sewer department?
Ever toured a sewage treatment facility?
>>
>> You claim that he has nothing to do and that the "evil" union is making
>> the
>> city keep him on - neither of your claims is supported by your
>> references.
>
>If he's got so much work to do than he will be one of the 20% that
>doesn't lose their job. What do you want to bet?
do know that his work will still need to be done - either by someone else
employed by the city or by someone outside the city at higher cost.
Baxter
Aug 20, 2012, 6:16:20 PM8/20/12
to
-
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>The conservative solution to budget
>shortfalls cut spending like firing unneeded employees. The liberal
>solution is to tax more. Are you abandoning the liberal solution in
>this case?
Conservates tell us Taxes are Charity - or aren't you keeping up with the
news?
>>
>> You've not shown that Detroit has any other ironworkers.
>
>There are 257 job descriptions for the Detroit Water Dept. What's the
>title of the guy who assembles and installs the large iron water
>mains? Plumber? Steamfitter? What does it matter? It's not a
>"blacksmith" who's hired to shoe horses.
Kind of hard to say - probably Plumber. Still, Portland has several
Reservoirs that have gatehouses, wrought-iron fences and the like.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:cfc8a68a-4928-4888...@a3g2000yqh.googlegroups.com...
"Yer Pal Al" <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote in message
On Aug 20, 11:34 am, "Baxter" <baxter.spambl...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>> You've shown nothing about the tax level.
>
>I don't have to although another link says the city doubled water
>rates in the last decade.
Water and sewer rates are not taxes - they're Usage Fees.
>>
>> You've shown nothing about the tax level.
>
>I don't have to although another link says the city doubled water
>rates in the last decade.
>The conservative solution to budget
>shortfalls cut spending like firing unneeded employees. The liberal
>solution is to tax more. Are you abandoning the liberal solution in
>this case?
news?
>>
>> You've not shown that Detroit has any other ironworkers.
>
>There are 257 job descriptions for the Detroit Water Dept. What's the
>title of the guy who assembles and installs the large iron water
>mains? Plumber? Steamfitter? What does it matter? It's not a
>"blacksmith" who's hired to shoe horses.
Reservoirs that have gatehouses, wrought-iron fences and the like.
Al
Aug 20, 2012, 6:20:39 PM8/20/12
to
In article
<4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
> blacksmith work Š and to perform related work as required." The
Union goofs.
<4726c6d9-9293-4e98...@qs3g2000pbb.googlegroups.com>,
Yer Pal Al <caddys...@gmail.com> wrote:
> "Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> eliminate positions.
>
> Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> some critics say.
>
> The horseshoerąs job description is "to shoe horses and to do general
> "Despite having no horses, the water and sewerage department for the
> city of Detroit employs a horseshoer.
>
> Yet even with a department so bloated that it has a horseshoer and no
> horses, the local union president said it is "not possible" to
> eliminate positions.
>
> Union rules have turned the department into a government jobs program,
> some critics say.
>
> blacksmith work Š and to perform related work as required." The
Union goofs.
342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'
Aug 21, 2012, 3:45:02 AM8/21/12
to
342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'
Aug 21, 2012, 3:47:24 AM8/21/12
to
On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:53:28 -0700, "Baxter"
<baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
Just look at the last four years...
<baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'
Aug 21, 2012, 3:54:06 AM8/21/12
to
and every manhole cover. If he's fired, the drunks and crackheads
will no longer know where they are when they regain consciousness in
the gutter...
>> What makes you think he won't be cut (especially if there's someone else who
>> can do blacksmithing/ironworking)?
>
>He will obviously be cut because he doesn't do anything and Detroit is
>going bankrupt and the water and sewer department is overstaffed by
>400%.
Sancho Panza
Aug 21, 2012, 10:07:23 AM8/21/12
to
he can't bear the sight of bad news.
Moder@tor
Aug 21, 2012, 10:22:00 AM8/21/12
to
On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 10:07:23 -0400, Sancho Panza <otter...@xhotmail.com>
wrote:
http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/06/02/the-black-and-white-numbers-democrats-are-better-than-republicans/
Let's see if you can.
wrote:
Let's see if you can.
Baxter
Aug 21, 2012, 10:22:24 AM8/21/12
to
-
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
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"342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'"
<Charlie...@whitehouse.gov> wrote in message
news:l7f638tqooqc9c6dp...@4ax.com...
http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2012/jun/09/did-republicans-deliberately-crash-us-economy
http://blogs.detroitnews.com/politics/2012/06/16/sabotaging-the-economy-was-gops-plan-from-day-one/
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/06/gop-economic-sabotage-genesis-of-a-talking-point.php
packet drop
Aug 21, 2012, 10:43:47 AM8/21/12
to
http://old.nationalreview.com/kudlow/kudlow200406100915.asp
Economists were vexed during the 1970s, as unemployment and inflation
rose together to stifle economic growth and all forms of investment. The
Keynesian Phillips-curve paradigm, whereby employment and inflation are
supposed to move in opposite directions, completely broke down. The Ivy
League formula of increasing the money supply to spur growth, and high
taxes to hold back inflation, had failed utterly.
Between the late 1960s and 1980, the U.S. inflation rate rose from 2
percent to 14 percent, while the unemployment rate gradually drifted
higher, from 4 percent to almost 10 percent. It was a period of decline
for the country. Americans were demoralized.
As stagflation became more deeply embedded in the U.S. economy, Soviet
adventurism in Central and South America, Asia, and elsewhere around the
world became more pronounced. The Soviets saw the U.S. cut and run from
Vietnam. Our Cold War adversary saw nothing but weakness emanating from
the U.S.
Ronald Reagan changed all that. From the moment of his swearing-in in
Jan� uary 1981, with his extraordinarily strong character and deep and
abiding faith in God, Reagan acted relentlessly to revive the nation.
More than any modern president, Reagan understood the link between
economic growth at home and American strength overseas. It was the
Gipper�s most brilliant insight. He acted swiftly to show our enemies
that we would produce the necessary economic resources to do whatever it
would take, for however long was necessary, to triumph over the
Communist menace.
Immediately upon assuming office, he reversed the economic policy of the
decline years. He brought down marginal tax rates, restoring the
incentives necessary for economic growth. He gave Federal Reserve
chairman Paul Volcker the strong ground to stand on, allowing him to
harden the value of the dollar and slay inflation.
At bottom, what became known as Reaganomics was a new pro-growth policy
mix of tax incentives at the margin and stable money. But there was
more. The Californian launched a massive military buildup totaling about
$1.5 trillion. He deregulated oil prices, proving the conventional
wisdom wrong as energy became much cheaper. He launched U.S.-Canadian
free trade. He was unyielding in his opposition to the air-traffic
controllers� strike, firing thousands of these government workers and
ending the anti-growth union stranglehold on private industry. He
created individual retirement accounts and 401(k)s, giving birth to the
investor class. He also slashed social spending by reducing domestic
program levels (excluding Social Security and health care) by nearly $50
billion in 1981. That amount would come to about $90 billion today.
By 1986, Reagan�s tax-reform plan left two marginal rates of 28 percent
and 15 percent, a long stone�s throw from the 70 percent top rate he had
inherited. His plan also cut about 2,000 pages from the tax code.
Ideas matter. Results quickly followed for Reagan. Between 1982 and
1989, the economy grew, adjusting for inflation, by 35 percent: more
than 4.5 percent per year. As growth was restored, tax revenues came
flowing in. Income-tax revenues grew by 50 percent during this period
even as tax rates dropped. By 1986, the inflation rate had fallen to 1
percent. By the end of his term, unemployment had dropped to 5.5
percent. Interest rates had plunged. The stock market had soared.
From July 1982 through the end of 1988, the S&P 500 averaged a near 21
percent annual gain. Brand-new industries arose in computing, software,
communications, and the Internet � original endeavors that completely
streamlined and transformed the American economy for the decades to
come. In effect, Reaganomics launched a 20-year boom, the longest
prosperity period in the 20th century.
Reagan critics to this day continue to harp on deficits and debt, rather
than the growth miracle produced by Reaganomics. But they are factually
wrong. Reagan inherited a budget gap of roughly 2.5 percent of the
economy. By the end of his two terms, he left it exactly where he found
it. In between, he restored our economic health and revitalized our
standing around the world.
By the time of his summit meetings with Soviet chairman Gorbachev,
Reagan was able to say calmly and diplomatically that the U.S. could
produce the goods and the Soviets could not. In the next few years, the
Berlin Wall came down and the Soviet Union collapsed.
packet drop
Aug 21, 2012, 10:44:58 AM8/21/12
to
On 8/21/2012 8:22 AM, Baxter wrote:
> The economy has made gains under Obama
BULLSHIT.
> The economy has made gains under Obama
http://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/obama-s-economists-stimulus-has-cost-278000-job_576014.html
When the Obama administration releases a report on the Friday before a
long weekend, it�s clearly not trying to draw attention to the report�s
contents. Sure enough, the �Seventh Quarterly Report� on the economic
impact of the �stimulus,� released on Friday, July 1, provides further
evidence that President Obama�s economic �stimulus� did very little, if
anything, to stimulate the economy, and a whole lot to stimulate the debt.
The report was written by the White House�s Council of Economic
Advisors, a group of three economists who were all handpicked by Obama,
and it chronicles the alleged success of the �stimulus� in adding or
saving jobs. The council reports that, using �mainstream estimates of
economic multipliers for the effects of fiscal stimulus� (which it
describes as a �natural way to estimate the effects of� the
legislation), the �stimulus� has added or saved just under 2.4 million
jobs � whether private or public � at a cost (to date) of $666 billion.
That�s a cost to taxpayers of $278,000 per job.
In other words, the government could simply have cut a $100,000 check to
everyone whose employment was allegedly made possible by the �stimulus,�
and taxpayers would have come out $427 billion ahead.
Furthermore, the council reports that, as of two quarters ago, the
�stimulus� had added or saved just under 2.7 million jobs � or 288,000
more than it has now. In other words, over the past six months, the
economy would have added or saved more jobs without the �stimulus� than
it has with it. In comparison to how things would otherwise have been,
the �stimulus� has been working in reverse over the past six months,
causing the economy to shed jobs.
packet drop
Aug 21, 2012, 11:49:31 AM8/21/12
to
On 8/21/2012 8:22 AM, Moder@tor wrote:
Almost all of my friends are Democrats; all of them voted for Barack
Obama in 2008.
Ask them these days, as I have, if they plan to vote for Obama this
November, and they�ll give you an �Oh shucks� sad smile, look down, look
back up with guilty eyes and say �I�m disappointed.�
Read more:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/time_for_democrats_for_romney_AUZ6cjhzmQwugmwm4pEt6J#ixzz24CDWN1mE
Almost all of my friends are Democrats; all of them voted for Barack
Obama in 2008.
Ask them these days, as I have, if they plan to vote for Obama this
November, and they�ll give you an �Oh shucks� sad smile, look down, look
back up with guilty eyes and say �I�m disappointed.�
Read more:
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/opinion/opedcolumnists/time_for_democrats_for_romney_AUZ6cjhzmQwugmwm4pEt6J#ixzz24CDWN1mE
342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'
Aug 22, 2012, 7:39:08 AM8/22/12
to
6th. She's already stocking up on extra clean PJs.
342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'
Aug 22, 2012, 7:42:03 AM8/22/12
to
On Tue, 21 Aug 2012 07:22:24 -0700, "Baxter"
<baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>-
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>"342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'"
><Charlie...@whitehouse.gov> wrote in message
>news:l7f638tqooqc9c6dp...@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:53:28 -0700, "Baxter"
>> <baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>>>History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
>>
>> Just look at the last four years...
>
>The economy has made gains under Obama in spite of Repug sabotage.
Barky sure kept his promise that we would never see 8% unemployment
<baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>-
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>Free Software - Baxter Codeworks www.baxcode.com
>------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>"342 murdered in Obama's 'organized communities'"
><Charlie...@whitehouse.gov> wrote in message
>news:l7f638tqooqc9c6dp...@4ax.com...
>> On Mon, 20 Aug 2012 09:53:28 -0700, "Baxter"
>> <baxter.s...@baxcode.com> wrote:
>>
>>>History shows that the Economy does better under Dems than Repugs.
>>
>> Just look at the last four years...
>
>The economy has made gains under Obama in spite of Repug sabotage.
under his watch!
0 new messages