--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Scrum Alliance - transforming the world of work." group.
To post to this group, send email to scruma...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to scrumallianc...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/scrumalliance?hl=en.
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Scrum Alliance - transforming the world of work." group.
To post to this group, send email to scruma...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to scrumallianc...@googlegroups.com.
> - Story points and relative estimation
> - automated testing
> - developers do no testing
Interesting. It might also be interesting to discuss who was impeded
in doing what, how the impediment was discovered or reported, and most
importantly how it was resolved.
The third one is interesting, did a developer say in the standup or
retrospective that he was impeded in his work because he didn't do any
testing, or did someone else, say the SM, decide the team should do
testing, and declare it an impediment?
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Scrum Alliance - transforming the world of work." group.
To post to this group, send email to scruma...@googlegroups.com.
To unsubscribe from this group, send email to scrumallianc...@googlegroups.com.
For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/scrumalliance?hl=en.
> "Developers do no testing"
> it is more related to way of working. the problem was that developers
> didn't assure the quality of their work results. and we got into a
> situation that f.ex. a task is marked as done and developer moves to
> another task. meanwhile tester verifies task he finds obvious bugs and
> ping pong between tester and developer starts. And next day developer
> complains that he had to fix bugs and couldn't finish current task.
This sounds ever so fascinating. In that situation, as a manager, I
would sit down with the team or individuals and explain to them that
their software needs to work, generally the first time: it's a job
requirement. By "job requirement" I mean "you can't work here if you
can't do that."
I'd mention some techniques that can be used to accomplish that and
offer them support in getting trained to be competent. I'd make it
clear that at the moment, they are not developing at a level I'd
call competent.
I'd create some kind of graph that would let the team, and me, see
how many stories were meeting the "works first time" goal, how many
"second time" and so on.
If I were subtle, which arguably I am not, I would just tell them
that the "works first time" statistic is important to me, have them
create the graph and I'd walk by and look at it a lot.
Ron Jeffries
www.XProgramming.com
www.xprogramming.com/blog
Just because XP doesn't talk about how to make fire, should we assume it
requires us to use sticks? -- Richard MacDonald
> I'd mention some techniques that can be used to accomplish that and
> offer them support in getting trained to be competent. I'd make it
> clear that at the moment, they are not developing at a level I'd
> call competent.
> What techniques could you apply?
Automated programmer tests, automated customer tests, test-driven
development, pair programming, code inspection ...
Ron Jeffries
www.XProgramming.com
www.xprogramming.com/blog
Speak the affirmative; emphasize your choice
by utterly ignoring all that you reject. -- Ralph Waldo Emerson
--
and Habit.
--
----------------------------------------------------------------------
* George Dinwiddie * http://blog.gdinwiddie.com
Software Development http://www.idiacomputing.com
Consultant and Coach http://www.agilemaryland.org
----------------------------------------------------------------------
No one openly advocates waterfall anymore. Instead they advocate "Sprint 0", something less than potentially-shippable product increments every Sprint, managers with authority as pseudo-ScrumMasters, team members split between three teams, no commitment to co-location (even temporarily), and all other manner of dysfunction.
Stealth waterfall advocacy usually starts with "In reality..." as if that person's reality at the moment is the only one possible in the future. Stealth waterfall advocacy comes from CSMs, CSPs, and CSTs.
So I think now that the word "Scrum" is popular, it's our job to show people what it really means.
--mj
No one openly advocates waterfall anymore. Instead they advocate "Sprint 0", something less than potentially-shippable product increments every Sprint, managers with authority as pseudo-ScrumMasters, team members split between three teams, no commitment to co-location (even temporarily), and all other manner of dysfunction.
> Are you saying that �Sprint 0� is never a good idea? ...: funding,
> training, product visioning and decomposition, initial team
> building activities, initial product backlog creation � just
> enough to get started, some estimating, initial release planning �
> .... I have done both approaches and prefer doing it before the
> first sprint.
These things need to be done. It's not a Sprint. A Sprint ships
software.
Ron Jeffries
www.XProgramming.com
www.xprogramming.com/blog
The work teaches us. -- Richard Gabriel
-----
Bob Sarni
Certified Scrum Coach (CSC) and Trainer (CST)
________________________
> Agree, that is why I do not like the term Sprint 0. The stuff still needs to be done.
Yes. Must do. Not Sprint. We have spoken. :)
Ron Jeffries
www.XProgramming.com
www.xprogramming.com/blog
Talent determines how fast you get good, not how good you get.
-- Richard Gabriel
Dan Rawsthorne, PhD, CST
Senior Trainer/Coach, CollabNet
draws...@collab.net, 425-269-8628
However if I step out of that role, and pretend I am the scrum master,
or a coach, or the business owner, or a customer or some other stake
holder, or an external observer, I would list the following:
A team of good developers that accept Scrum passively, but aren't
interested in spending development time on thinking about the process
itself.
Not having a scrum master.
The same things getting discussed at the retros every time, and
written down, and nothing changes because changes might effect someone
outside the team, or require management to implement.
The PO whinging because we have the same problems every sprint, but no
attempt is made to solve them.
The scrum guide, being too vague and minimalistic, I see it as a
strength, but the bad side effect is that teams can feel good about
doing everything according to the scrum guide, and wonder why things
doesn't work, and blame scrum. New ideas get shot down because they
aren't in the scrum guide.
A posse of senior developers with the authority to enforce an old
fashioned data centric culture, with excess complexity, and watching
the newer developers with their fresh, valuable ideas slowly reverting
to typists, implementing the 80s designs that the senior devs have
grown comfortable with.
There, now I have gotten this rant out of the way, I can go the the
retrospective this afternoon and report the usual team mantra: "super
sprint, great teamwork, learned lots, and had fun". Negativity kills
you know...
> Are you saying that “Sprint 0” is never a good idea? Personally I do not like the term Sprint 0 but I certainly see benefit is doing some preparation before the first sprint such as: funding, training, product visioning and decomposition, initial team building activities, initial product backlog creation – just enough to get started, some estimating, initial release planning – very very high level, initial risk/issue and dependency review, high level architecture discussions, team room setup, environment setup, test strategy discussion, engineering approach discussions, tool identification and procurement, develop a story to test the system and processes, etc. I am not saying you have to do all of these things before you can get started but
Most of the time I've seen "Sprint 0," it seemed to be an excuse to procrastinate. If we're going to redefine Scrum we should be aware of why we're doing it. For example, modern teams shorten the Sprint from 30 days to 2 weeks because tools and skills are better. Some teams eliminate Sprint Tasks because they have sufficient skills to break PBIs into smaller stories. Some teams find hourly burndown charts lead back to old habits with capacity planning. The dollar in the cup rule is less effective than other techniques, and doesn't work in countries that don't use dollars.
The reasons most people raise for wanting to delay real Sprinting seem to boil down to comfort. By the time I arrive, the first Sprint is typically way overdue. Not every Sprint has to produce huge amounts of business value. Most of the stuff we'd want to get out of a "Sprint 0" is better sorted out after we've garnered some real experience and real feedback. Most of it should be reconsidered once we've primed the pump with some real product development. In trying, and possibly failing, to do a first Sprint, I think we'll learn more than we would doing "Sprint 0" in a vacuum.
But then "never" is a strong word.
--mj
+1, and having a "Sprint 0" only encourages a "Sprint -1." Yes, I've
seen this. It was an attempt to plan all the other sprints, including
the sprint 0 team selection and tool setup, for a fixed-scope
fixed-schedule release. <sigh/> And the management of this effort
thought the successful sprint teams in the same organization were "doing
the easy stuff" because they were reliably delivering business value.
<sigh/>
- George
> I'm not saying that we don't desire working software over other
> results in our sprints, but it's simply not always practical when you
> are trying to innovate in areas such as gameplay, player agency, new
> peripherals, new tech, etc.
Yes. Lots of teams do this. If they are successful at doing
software-scrum and then begin to use Scrum style in other ways,
that's just fine.
For a team to /start out/ that way is very dangerous because they
are quite likely, based on my experience, never to focus in on the
software, instead accepting all kinds of "progress".
We said in the Manifesto:
Our highest priority is to satisfy the customer through early and
continuous delivery of valuable software.
Deliver working software frequently, from a couple of weeks to a
couple of months, with a preference to the shorter timescale.
Working software is the primary measure of progress.
We really meant that. I'm not interested in whether that's "Agile"
or "Scrum". I observe that teams that do not focus on delivering
software never get very good at delivering software. If you need
software, it's important to get good at it. Allowing focus on
something else seems to get in the way.
Again ... if the team rocks at the software bit, and wants to use
Scrum style for other things, I've seen that work. I have not seen
starting with other things turn into a rocking software team.
Ron Jeffries
www.XProgramming.com
www.xprogramming.com/blog
The greatest mistake we make is living in constant fear that we will make one.
-- John Maxwell