Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American Management?
Stray Dog
On Sat, 4 Oct 2008, phil scott wrote:
> Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT)
> From: phil scott <ph...@philscott.net>
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants
> Subject: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
Answer: a "sea-change" in paradigm. Mental mindsets are NOT geared to
actual, real _business_ but, instead, "Harvard MBA" tweaks, tricks, and
cheats. Many many examples: You can make more money by cheating (eg.
Enron/Andersen, S&L crisis, now: subprime crap), cheating employees (fire
full time and hire 2-3x part timers so you don't have to pay fringe
benefits, do like Walmart and have everyone "on call" to work as the
crowds show up, all kinda pressure on underlings),
Another trick: trick packaging (eg. at the hardware store, put three
screws in a bubble package so it forces a guy to buy two packages to get
four screws which is more likely). All kinds of tricks like this.
Ever hear of check float and float management? Same trick. Have a look at
your recent bank disclosure on how they can charge you money for all that
stuff you used to get for free?
> It may be this... occurring in just the last half a generation or so
> in the US and much of developed Europe... the practice of industrial
> beef farming, in pens, feeding grains instead of the natural grass
> feed.
Aquaculture is even worse: fish butcher shops in my neighborhood tell me
real fresh fish is clean and aquaculture fish are loaded with bacterial
contamination. Also, we're getting 80% of our US-consumed fish now as
imports. Chesapeak Bay is essentially dead; century ago it was world's
most productive estuary. Greedy-selfish commercial point source
contamination has killed the Bay and the lobbying prevents cleanup laws.
>
> It seems that free range *grass fed beef produces meat dominated by
> omega 3 fatty acids, those are soluble and do not clogg ones brain and
> ass with huge globbs of fat... that is because the highly acid stomach
> that processes *grain in a cow becomes *acid when fed grain, that
> results in non soluble fat production, and almost a total dirth of
> omega 3 fat production.
It is possible to get organic beef, but it will cost you. And, its in
short supply, they say.
> (for fully accurate information you can search this breaking news on
> google).
For information all over the spectrum, go to google. For closer to the
truth, read the epidemiology books that track diseases, etc., accross all
countries in the world. In the USA, we are quite sick (bulemia, anorexia,
teen suicide, nervous disorders and psychoses, obesity, tooth decay up
again, diabetes up, ADHD and A-ADHD, etc). Plenty of spoiled brats, too.
> Now we have salmon, very high in Omega 3 fatty acids being raised in
> pens, and fed *grain... Eliminating a high percentage of their natural
> Omega 3's. The beef and salmon are also fed hormones so they gain
> weight faster. .. you get those same hormones when you eat the meat
> causing you to gain weight also... that is accumulate fat, and much
> of that occuldes blood flow to the brain (varies in individuals for a
> wide range of reasons)
You are forgetting all about our over-medicated society: practically
everyone is "on" something, illicit or not, or alcohol, and hormones used
to fatten up beef, and antibiotics used to keep cow intestinal flora down
so it further fattens the cow, are all up. You can't go anywhere in the
environment, soil, well water, sewage, and get away from the hormones.
We've basically contaminated the planet.
> This is a superb way to become both fat and stupid at warp speed
> apparently...
There are studies that show that watching too much TV will do the same
thing. Couch potatoes don't get excercise, and let the program material do
their thinking.
Are you a keyboard potatoe?
>
> you don't see this combination in china or india... mostly those are
> too poor to afford feed lot cattle... their students noted for high
> accademic performance is no surprise.
Actually, there is substantial malnutrition in Asia and lots of data to
show that this hurts the brain, too.
> countries like Japan wigh diets high in wild ocean fish also don't
> demonstrate this combination of problems.
There are dumb people in Japan, too. If the kids don't get high enough
grades when they graduate, they commit suicide. Lots of that still going
on.
> In the US we have concentrated on what makes a person look like hell,
> the big fat ass problem. ... not brain function, we have not even
> seen that as an issue......clogging the larger organs, arteries, veins
> and capilaries that carry blood to the brain, depriving the neurons of
> oxygen at the cellular level...oxygen needed to operate.
Read a book, stimulate the little gray cells.
Also, please notice that you can't get a computer virus into a book, can't
get hacked, can't get spyware, rootkits, or keystroke loggers.
Throw away your computer. I'll be glad to give you my mailing address and
we can correspond with letters.
> fat blubbery asses, and actual stupidity ensue.
Ever notice that CEOs are overweight? Brokers, too? They eat lots of
fillet Mignon, too, caviar, three martini lunches, etc. Tax writeoff, you
and I pay for it.
> **
> Reversal is attained by eating free range grass fed beef. chicken and
> wild ocean fish, esp salmon... fresh green salads and fruit. Hormone
> free dairy products, and much less grain than usual... and working out
> 30 minutes a day...
We would do even better if we could grow branches off our shoulders, have
green leaves sprout, and then we could photosynthesize our food, just like
plants, and then we could expoxy cement our lips together and that would
keep us from getting into wars.
> in about 3 months the results will be near miraculous, and after a
> year or two you may notice a marked resurgence of intelligence...
They say that only about one in seven persons who decide to get off
smoking cigarettes is successful.
> in my case for instance, I'm an engineer,
I'm a retired scientist with...
> 40 years in the business,
Same number of years...
> designing and building complex controls systems, very complex wiring
> and controls algorithms... this used to be more than a complete
> challenge for me,
Wrote and received grants ($1 mil), 40 publications in peer-reviewed
journals, 25 book chapers, editor or co-editor on 11 books, awards,
and degrees, and invited speaker at conferences, including international.
NRC scientific exchange trip to Soviet Union in 1989, three security
clearances in the military, etc. FCC licensed ham radio operator. Can also
speak a little Russian.
and I had to painstakingly draw out a wiring
> diagram, worry over it for days, then build it, wire for
> wire..rotely.... because I was unable to keep the entire system and
> logic in my mind and just wire it from that range of insights.
Discovery and characterization of scientific phenomena, use of low-light
level video micrography, built a lot of my own instruments, programmed a
computer to do a product of a factorial infinite series, Legendre
polynomial infinite series, and a trig function infinite series. and, the
result did not converge to a limit, either.
At the end of US Army basic training, shot "Sharpshooter" one up from Lee
Harvey Oswald's "Marksman." FYI, top award is "Expert". Oswald wasn't
alone in assassinating JFK.
> For the last few years, even as I am older ( 67 now) I build these
> systems off of my logic diagrams, drawn in seconds. Then I do all the
> wiring out of my head, no diagrams.. thats not common at any age.
I read a lot of history books trying to figure out why the human race
exists. My tentative hypothesis is that the human race is a defective
lifeform on this planet. Yeah, I know, its not good news. But, it relates
to a famous line by Walt Kelly: "We have met the enemy and he is us." But,
at least 100 years before that, another famous guy said about the same
thing. If you want me to look it up, let me know.
> .when its done, I produce a diagram so others can follow if they need
> to trouble shoot or add to it later.... my brain is simply not bathed
> in grease any longer.
Mine is. In Russia, the brains are bathed in vodka. Pretty good
chessplayers, too.
> (other issues include an amyloid purge, you can find my articles on
> that by google search .... my name as author, no news group, and word
> in subject 'amyloid'. 'or amyloids'.)
My wife brought a book home on hamburger joints all over the country,
including a DVD of video interviews of cooks, customers, etc., all eating,
all their lives, the biggest, fatteningest, greasyest, unhealthyist
hambergurs I've ever seen, and some of the customers were 90 years old,
looked normal, were happy, and had been eating these burgers all their
lives and plan to continue eating them till they die.
I am not making this up.
Years ago, she and I agonized about food and health, etc., and we noticed
that the healthyist meats all tasted like crap and made us sick and all
the unhealthyist meats (high fat) all tasted great and made us feel good
and gave a 'glow' in the tummy after we pigged out. So, for years now, we
switched back to the unhealthy meats and we all have big smiles here and
feel good, and we have a life.
Do I sound dumb?
Pardon me, just "rattling your cage."
> Phil scott
>
Rod Speed
> phil scott wrote
>> Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American Management?
> Answer: a "sea-change" in paradigm.
Nope, there has always been plenty of gross cow like ignorance in American management.
> Mental mindsets are NOT geared to actual, real _business_ but, instead, "Harvard MBA" tweaks, tricks, and cheats.
Corse there was never ever any of that in the past. The term 'snake oil' was pure fantasy, eh ?
> Many many examples: You can make more money by cheating
> (eg. Enron/Andersen, S&L crisis, now: subprime crap), cheating
> employees (fire full time and hire 2-3x part timers so you don't have
> to pay fringe benefits, do like Walmart and have everyone "on call"
> to work as the crowds show up, all kinda pressure on underlings),
Corse there was never ever any of that stuff in the past, eh ?
No robber barons etc ?
> Another trick: trick packaging (eg. at the hardware store, put three
> screws in a bubble package so it forces a guy to buy two packages to get four screws which is more likely). All kinds
> of tricks like this.
Corse there was never ever any of that stuff in the past, eh ?
> Ever hear of check float and float management? Same trick. Have a look at your recent bank disclosure on how they can
> charge you money for all that stuff you used to get for free?
No one is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to use operations that operate like that.
If someone is doing that, call the cops.
>> It may be this... occurring in just the last half a generation or so
>> in the US and much of developed Europe... the practice of industrial
>> beef farming, in pens, feeding grains instead of the natural grass feed.
> Aquaculture is even worse: fish butcher shops in my neighborhood tell
> me real fresh fish is clean and aquaculture fish are loaded with
> bacterial contamination. Also, we're getting 80% of our US-consumed
> fish now as imports. Chesapeak Bay is essentially dead; century ago
> it was world's most productive estuary. Greedy-selfish commercial
> point source contamination has killed the Bay and the lobbying
> prevents cleanup laws.
Corse we never say any extinctions in the past, eh ?
>> It seems that free range *grass fed beef produces meat dominated by
>> omega 3 fatty acids, those are soluble and do not clogg ones brain
>> and ass with huge globbs of fat... that is because the highly acid
>> stomach that processes *grain in a cow becomes *acid when fed grain,
>> that results in non soluble fat production, and almost a total dirth
>> of omega 3 fat production.
> It is possible to get organic beef, but it will cost you. And, its in short supply, they say.
And wont make any difference to your health.
>> (for fully accurate information you can search this breaking news on google).
> For information all over the spectrum, go to google. For closer to the
> truth, read the epidemiology books that track diseases, etc., accross
> all countries in the world. In the USA, we are quite sick (bulemia,
> anorexia, teen suicide, nervous disorders and psychoses, obesity,
> tooth decay up again, diabetes up, ADHD and A-ADHD, etc).
Hell of a lot more healthy than we used to be before they worked out
how to fix most infectious disease by vaccination and worked out how
to fix some of the worse dietary caused health problems too.
> Plenty of spoiled brats, too.
Corse there was never ever any of that in the past, eh ?
No lynch mobs either.
>> Now we have salmon, very high in Omega 3 fatty acids being raised in
>> pens, and fed *grain... Eliminating a high percentage of their
>> natural Omega 3's. The beef and salmon are also fed hormones so
>> they gain weight faster. .. you get those same hormones when you eat
>> the meat causing you to gain weight also... that is accumulate fat,
>> and much of that occuldes blood flow to the brain (varies in
>> individuals for a wide range of reasons)
> You are forgetting all about our over-medicated society: practically
> everyone is "on" something, illicit or not, or alcohol, and hormones
> used to fatten up beef, and antibiotics used to keep cow intestinal
> flora down so it further fattens the cow, are all up. You can't go
> anywhere in the environment, soil, well water, sewage, and get away from the hormones.
That last is a pig ignorant lie.
> We've basically contaminated the planet.
Corse there was never ever any of that stuff in the past, eh ?
>> This is a superb way to become both fat and stupid at warp speed apparently...
> There are studies that show that watching too much TV will do the same thing. Couch potatoes don't get excercise, and
> let the program material do their thinking.
> Are you a keyboard potatoe?
Are you a book potato ?
>> you don't see this combination in china or india... mostly those are
>> too poor to afford feed lot cattle... their students noted for high
>> accademic performance is no surprise.
> Actually, there is substantial malnutrition in Asia and lots of data
> to show that this hurts the brain, too.
>> countries like Japan wigh diets high in wild ocean fish also don't
>> demonstrate this combination of problems.
> There are dumb people in Japan, too. If the kids don't get high enough
> grades when they graduate, they commit suicide. Lots of that still going on.
>> In the US we have concentrated on what makes a person look like hell,
>> the big fat ass problem. ... not brain function, we have not even
>> seen that as an issue......clogging the larger organs, arteries,
>> veins and capilaries that carry blood to the brain, depriving the
>> neurons of oxygen at the cellular level...oxygen needed to operate.
> Read a book, stimulate the little gray cells.
> Also, please notice that you can't get a computer virus into a book,
> can't get hacked, can't get spyware, rootkits, or keystroke loggers.
> Throw away your computer. I'll be glad to give you my mailing address and we can correspond with letters.
Only if you promise to use a quill pen.
>> fat blubbery asses, and actual stupidity ensue.
> Ever notice that CEOs are overweight? Brokers, too?
Ever notice that most americans are >
> They eat lots of fillet Mignon, too, caviar, three martini lunches, etc. Tax writeoff, you and I pay for it.
I dont.
>> Reversal is attained by eating free range grass fed beef. chicken and wild ocean fish, esp salmon... fresh green
>> salads and fruit. Hormone free dairy products, and much less grain than usual... and working out 30 minutes a day...
And dont forget to whip yourself hourly.
> We would do even better if we could grow branches off our shoulders,
> have green leaves sprout, and then we could photosynthesize our food,
> just like plants, and then we could expoxy cement our lips together
> and that would keep us from getting into wars.
>> in about 3 months the results will be near miraculous,
Pure fantasy.
>> and after a year or two you may notice a marked resurgence of intelligence...
It clearly hasnt helped you any.
> Same number of years...
Yeah, yeah, the CIA used him as a pawn.
>> For the last few years, even as I am older ( 67 now) I build these
>> systems off of my logic diagrams, drawn in seconds. Then I do all
>> the wiring out of my head, no diagrams.. thats not common at any age.
> I read a lot of history books trying to figure out why the human race exists. My tentative hypothesis is that the
> human race is a defective lifeform on this planet.
Its actually by far the most successful outside insects.
And no insects managed to produce the industrial revolution etc.
> Yeah, I know, its not good news. But, it relates to a famous line by Walt Kelly: "We have met the enemy and he is us."
> But, at least 100 years before that, another famous guy said about the same thing. If you want me to look it up, let
> me know.
Dont bother, its too silly to matter.
>> .when its done, I produce a diagram so others can follow if they need to trouble shoot or add to it later.... my
>> brain is simply not bathed in grease any longer.
> Mine is. In Russia, the brains are bathed in vodka. Pretty good chessplayers, too.
>> (other issues include an amyloid purge, you can find my articles on
>> that by google search .... my name as author, no news group, and
>> word in subject 'amyloid'. 'or amyloids'.)
> My wife brought a book home on hamburger joints all over the country,
> including a DVD of video interviews of cooks, customers, etc., all
> eating, all their lives, the biggest, fatteningest, greasyest,
> unhealthyist hambergurs I've ever seen, and some of the customers
> were 90 years old, looked normal, were happy, and had been eating
> these burgers all their lives and plan to continue eating them till they die.
> I am not making this up.
> Years ago, she and I agonized about food and health, etc., and we
> noticed that the healthyist meats all tasted like crap and made us
> sick and all the unhealthyist meats (high fat) all tasted great and
> made us feel good and gave a 'glow' in the tummy after we pigged out.
> So, for years now, we switched back to the unhealthy meats and we all
> have big smiles here and feel good, and we have a life.
> Do I sound dumb?
Pass.
Stray Dog
See Rod Speed's responses, at the end of this post, to which it is time to
repost the "Rod Speed FAQ" which was authored by someone other than me...
------------------------------
The "Rod Speed FAQ" read it below or at the URL for yourself.....
- - - - - - - - -
http://newsgroups.derkeiler.com/Archive/Alt/alt.internet.wireless/2006-07/ms
g00462.html
- - - - - - - - - -
After its recent emergence in the thread "How to calculate increase
of home wireless router range?", readers of this group may find
this useful. [based on a post in comp.sys.ibm.pc.hardware.storage]
Who or What is Rod Speed?
Rod Speed is an entirely modern phenomenon. Essentially, Rod
Speed is an insecure and worthless individual who has discovered
he can enhance his own self-esteem in his own eyes by playing "the
big, hard man" on the InterNet.
Rod is believed to be from Australia.
Rod certainly posts a lot. Why is that?
It relates back to the point about boosting his own self esteem by
what amounts to effectively having a wank in public. Rod's
personality, as exemplified by his posts, means he is practically
unemployable which means he sits around at home all day festering
away and getting worse and worse. This means he posts more and
more try and boost the old failing self esteem. Being unemployed
also means he as a lot of time on his hands to post in he first
place.
But maybe Rod really is a very clever and knowledgable person?
Clever? His posts wouldn't support that theory. As far as being
knowledgable, well, Rod has posted to various aus newsgroups
including invest, comms, and politics. He has posted to all as a
self professed "expert" and flames any and all who disagree with
him. Logically, here's no way any single individual could be
more than a jack of all trades across such a wide spread of
subject matter.
But maybe Rod really is an expert in some areas?
Possibly. However, his "bedside manner" prevents him from being
taken seriously by most normal people. Also, he has damaged his
credibility in areas where he might know what he's on about by
shooting his self in the foot in areas where he does not. For
example, in the case of subject matter such as politics, even a
view held by Albert Einstein cannot be little more than an
opinion and to vociferously denigrate an opposing opinion is
simply small mindedness and bigotry, the kind of which Einstein
himself fought against his whole life.
What is Rod Speed's main modus operandi?
Simple! He shoots off a half brained opinion in response to any
other post and touts that opinion as fact. When challenged, he
responds with vociferous and rabid denigration. He has an
instantly recognisable set of schoolboy put downs limited pretty
much to the following: "Pathetic, Puerile, Little Boy, try
harder, trivial, more lies, gutless wonder, wanker, etc etc".
The fact that Rod has been unable to come up with any new insults
says a lot about his outlook and intelligence.
But why do so many people respond to Rod in turn?
It has to do with effrontery and a lack of logic. Most people
who post have some basis of reason for what they write and when
Rod retorts with his usual denigration and derision they respond
emotionally rather than logically. It's like a teacher in a
class room who has a misbehaving pupil. The teacher challenges
the pupil to explain himself and the student responds with "***
off, Big Nose!" Even thought the teacher has a fairly normal
proboscis, he gets a dent in his self-esteem and might resort to
an emotional repsonse like "yeah? well your *** wouldn't fill a
pop rivet, punk", which merely invites some oneupmanship from the
naughty pupil. Of course, the teacher should not have justified
the initial comment with a response, especially in front of the
class. The correct response was "please report to the
headmaster's office right NOW!"
What is a "RodBot"?
Some respondents in aus.invest built a "virtual Rod" which was
indiscernable from the "real" Rod. Net users could enter an
opinion or even a fact and the RoDBot would tell them they were
pathetic lying schoolboys who should be able to do better or some
equally pithy Rod Speedism.
Are you saying that Rod Speed is a Troll?
You got it!
What is the best way to handle Rod Speed?
KillFile!
.
//////////////////////////////////
On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Rod Speed wrote:
> Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 09:42:59 +1100
> From: Rod Speed <rod.sp...@gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
Rod Speed
Stray Dog <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> desperately attempted to bullshit
its way out of its predicament and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
Stray Dog
On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Rod Speed wrote:
> Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 16:06:36 +1100
> From: Rod Speed <rod.sp...@gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
"Rod Speed" desperately attempted
to bullshit its way out of its predicament and
fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
Also, as an additional bonus, please see below...
Rod Speed
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, Rod Speed wrote:
> Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 10:36:33 +1100
> From: Rod Speed <rod.sp...@gmail.com>
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
> Some gutless fuckwit desperately cowering behind the entirely appropriate
> Stray Dog <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> desperately attempted to bullshit
> its way out of its predicament and fooled absolutely no one at all, as always.
The above sentence is technically in serious error. The subject of the
sentence is the "gutless fuckwit" who is "cowering behind....Stray Dog"
but that gutless fuckwit is not the author of the post. Rather, it is
Stray Dog and and the author of the sentence "Some gutless...." is
misperceiving reality, which, therefore, shows that Rod Speed has
succesfully fooled himself. As always.
I don't think he has fooled anyone else.
Vid...@tcq.net
> On Sat, 4 Oct 2008, phil scott wrote:
> > Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT)
its called free market fundamentalism, and it was championed by
milton freidman. there was absolutely no foundations to any of his
wild assumptions on how markets act, and react.
Stray Dog
On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, Vid...@tcq.net wrote:
> Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 17:26:28 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Vid...@tcq.net
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
deleted
>>
>> Do I sound dumb?
>>
>> Pardon me, just "rattling your cage."
>>
>>> Phil scott
>
> its called free market fundamentalism,
Most of the history books, at relevant points, simply acknowledged the
existence of "nobles" (otherwise rich and didn't do any real work in
exchange for income).
and it was championed by
> milton freidman.
Way way before Freidman was born, there were plenty of robber-barrons.
And, plenty of robber-barron processes. But, in the past, it took guns,
wars, etc., whereas today, you can pull off all kinds of crap with just a
computer and hookups to other computers and a few guys who know what to do
and what kinds of games to play (sneaky-tricky-cheaty crap).
there was absolutely no foundations to any of his
> wild assumptions on how markets act, and react.
He sure fooled a hell of a lot of people. Most of the rest were glad that
he "legitimated" the existence of "the rich."
Vid...@tcq.net
> > Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> > sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> > Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> > Management?
>
> deleted
>
>
>
> >> Do I sound dumb?
>
> >> Pardon me, just "rattling your cage."
>
> >>> Phil scott
>
> > its called free market fundamentalism,
>
> Most of the history books, at relevant points, simply acknowledged the
> existence of "nobles" (otherwise rich and didn't do any real work in
> exchange for income).
>
correct, but, free markets were around before teddy r. started to
take them on. and that is what the financial aristocracy pines for.
the period before teddy r.
> and it was championed by
>
> > milton freidman.
>
> Way way before Freidman was born, there were plenty of robber-barrons.
> And, plenty of robber-barron processes. But, in the past, it took guns,
> wars, etc., whereas today, you can pull off all kinds of crap with just a
> computer and hookups to other computers and a few guys who know what to do
> and what kinds of games to play (sneaky-tricky-cheaty crap).
>
correct, but free markets were done away with after 1932. hayek and
friedman were taken off of the streets, and cleaned up, and financed
by the financial aristocracy that wished to go back to the robber
baron era, that was free of government fetters.
> there was absolutely no foundations to any of his
>
> > wild assumptions on how markets act, and react.
>
> He sure fooled a hell of a lot of people. Most of the rest were glad that
> he "legitimated" the existence of "the rich."
yep, he talked people into feeding and caring for parasites.
Rod Speed
phil scott
> On Sat, 4 Oct 2008, phil scott wrote:
> > Date: Sat, 4 Oct 2008 14:13:26 -0700 (PDT)
>
> - Show quoted text -
Dog... you have me way out classed in both the accomplishments and
range categories.. remarkable achievements you have there. For
myself, it seems to be relative, what I have been able to do against
the odds etc..and learning what is at the root of these messes.. Ive
found that fascinating, and rewarding as Ive turned so many aspects of
my own life around along those lines.
re reading books... I agree entirely... and your reviews are
priceless, but im still working, and hussling business etc and
learning .. its quicker and easier for me to get what I can by google
research.
additionally, one of my smarter friends corrected me on the omega 3
issue.. its not the dominant issue and I agree...it is high blood
sugar driven by refined carbohydrates ... glycation, plaques in the
brain causing perhaps a majority of the problem... the combination
though is a killer... both came in the same time frames.
I too had seen some overr 90 ladies smoking cigarettes, drinking cokes
and eating greasy hamburgers in clearwater florida one time...
perhaps though at their age they grew up on grain fed and rough
carbohydrates so had that advantage...todays kids getting diabetes at
age 15 and fat as hell are projected to have much shorter lives than
their parents... the kids grew up on the bad food...
Phil scott
Stray Dog
On Sun, 5 Oct 2008, phil scott wrote:
> Date: Sun, 5 Oct 2008 20:59:49 -0700 (PDT)
> From: phil scott <ph...@philscott.net>
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
And, yet, the more I read, the more I recognize how much I don't know.
> remarkable achievements you have there. For
> myself, it seems to be relative, what I have been able to do against
> the odds etc..and learning what is at the root of these messes.. Ive
> found that fascinating, and rewarding as Ive turned so many aspects of
> my own life around along those lines.
My own thoughts and feelings about things have evolved greatly in the last
decade as I read what other guys wrote down for posterity. It is very
humbling.
> re reading books... I agree entirely... and your reviews are
> priceless, but im still working, and hussling business etc and
> learning .. its quicker and easier for me to get what I can by google
> research.
Fine with me. We all sniff out what we are looking for, however we want.
Sometimes google is good, but there is nothing like reading a specialized
book on a topic for depth, breadth, perspective, and interpretation, and
invaluable reference lists of sources. Hundreds of pages. You go at your
own pace. Then, if you want, you can choose between sound bite and
nanothought explanations when you meet someone on the street and want a
conversation, or you can, if you want, say something like "Well, its
really a lot more complicated and a lot of things were going on and a lot
of people involved."
> additionally, one of my smarter friends corrected me on the omega 3
> issue.. its not the dominant issue and I agree...it is high blood
> sugar driven by refined carbohydrates ... glycation, plaques in the
> brain causing perhaps a majority of the problem... the combination
> though is a killer... both came in the same time frames.
Cause and effect is more debatable than most people realize. Tobacco
causes cancer, right? But, you can find people 90 years old still smoking
pack a day cigarettes and you can find people dying of lung cancer in
their 20s-30s and they never smoked a cigarette in their lives and no or
little second hand smoke, either.
Cause and effect: a better relationship is the light switch in your living
room and light from the light fixture. You don't need statistics to figure
that out.
> I too had seen some overr 90 ladies smoking cigarettes, drinking cokes
> and eating greasy hamburgers in clearwater florida one time...
> perhaps though at their age they grew up on grain fed and rough
> carbohydrates so had that advantage...todays kids getting diabetes at
> age 15 and fat as hell are projected to have much shorter lives than
> their parents... the kids grew up on the bad food...
Well, anyone will tell you we (in developed countries) are living longer
these days compared to 50 years ago, but have a look at how junk food
fills up 1/5 of the aisles at your local grocery store, eh?
Psychological problems (anorexia, bulemia) are also killers, too, and not
at all related to junk food. Kids are getting diabetes since they are
exposed to coke machines all day in schools. When I was a kid there was no
such thing as coke machines in schools. But the soda pop corporations only
see profit as a goal, and school administrators only see budget cuts (and
replacement by subsidies from soda corporations) as solutions to budget
cuts.
Get my drift?
> Phil scott
>
>
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, retro...@comcast.net wrote:
> Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 09:04:28 -0700
> From: retro...@comcast.net
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
> On Mon, 6 Oct 2008 14:28:39 +0000, Stray Dog
> <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
>> And, yet, the more I read, the more I recognize how much I don't know.
>
>
> The sign of a wise man.
>
Hi RetroG,
Thank you, and may you continue to be successful at deciphering data,
passing on all those URL references that you take the time to share with
us, as at least some of us search for truth, justice, knowledge, and
wisdom (or, something like that).
P.S. One pretty good (see footnote) economist (Kenneth Boulding) once said
(couple decades ago?) that he would like, someday, to do research to
determine to what degree ignorance is bliss (or something like that).
footnote -- at least based on what of whatever he wrote that I read (if
you get my drift).
Vid...@tcq.net
you know we are screwed when you can lipstick on a pig, and call it a
asset. one wonders how much worthless paper corporate america is
holding? and how much has any real value. as we unwind this mess, we
will see many household names disappear who had a vault full of paper,
but no value to back them up.
Rod Speed
> phil scott wrote
> Cause and effect is more debatable than most people realize.
Nope, some are just too stupid to be able to grasp what risk is about.
An increased risk with a particular approach like smoking is NOT the
same thing as an absolute certainty that all smokers will get lung cancer.
> Tobacco causes cancer, right?
Yep.
> But, you can find people 90 years old still smoking pack a day cigarettes
No one with a clue ever claimed that smoking is absolutely guaranteed to give you lung cancer.
> and you can find people dying of lung cancer in their 20s-30s and they never
> smoked a cigarette in their lives and no or little second hand smoke, either.
No one with a clue ever claimed that smoking is the only cause of lung cancer.
> Cause and effect: a better relationship is the light switch in your living room
> and light from the light fixture. You don't need statistics to figure that out.
Even with that example, you dont always see the light come on when you flick
the switch, most obviously when the bulb has died or there is no mains power.
>> I too had seen some overr 90 ladies smoking cigarettes, drinking
>> cokes and eating greasy hamburgers in clearwater florida one time...
>> perhaps though at their age they grew up on grain fed and rough
>> carbohydrates so had that advantage...todays kids getting diabetes at
>> age 15 and fat as hell are projected to have much shorter lives than
>> their parents... the kids grew up on the bad food...
They also grew up watching a lot more TV than they grandparents did. So what ?
> Well, anyone will tell you we (in developed countries) are living
> longer these days compared to 50 years ago, but have a look at how
> junk food fills up 1/5 of the aisles at your local grocery store, eh?
Yep. And what matters is consumption per person has gone thru the roof too.
> Psychological problems (anorexia, bulemia) are also killers, too,
At nothing like the rate their grandparents used to be killed by infectious disease.
> and not at all related to junk food.
None are in fact.
> Kids are getting diabetes since they are exposed to coke machines all day in schools.
Its got nothing to do with coke machines in schools.
> When I was a kid there was no such thing as coke machines in schools.
And plenty of kids died of infectious disease.
> But the soda pop corporations only see profit as a goal, and school
> administrators only see budget cuts (and replacement by subsidies
> from soda corporations) as solutions to budget cuts.
> Get my drift?
Yep, that you're just another mindless ranter that doesnt have a clue about the basics.
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, retro...@comcast.net wrote:
> Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 11:40:29 -0700
> From: retro...@comcast.net
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
> On Mon, 6 Oct 2008 18:20:17 +0000, Stray Dog
> <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
>> P.S. One pretty good (see footnote) economist (Kenneth Boulding) once said
>> (couple decades ago?) that he would like, someday, to do research to
>> determine to what degree ignorance is bliss (or something like that).
>
> It's been done:
>
> Stumbling On Happiness, by Gilbert. I think Galt or Cargill
> recommended it.
Yeah, I heard about it.
Very important read. Among other things it explains
> those deniers who are waking up today to find the world coming down
> around their ears (or still actively denying - it's amazing there are
> still a few of those out there!) .
I'm actually fascinated by how "built-in" psychological limitations in the
biological brain cause us, individually or collectively, to do goofy
things (everything from wars to making statements like "The Titanic is
Unsinkable"). And, while it is easy to blame Hitler for WW II, lots of
people fail to appreciate the significance that most of the German people
just "followed orders" and looked the other way when shit was happening.
Same thing with WMD in Iraq. When I first heard it, I would have bet all
the money I had that they were not going to find any. Couple years later
and, sure enough, they never found any.
It outlines a lot of the games
> people paly to fool themselves.
How about that old one: "Games People Play" by Eric Berne? And, he had
another book after that "More Games People Play" but it wasn't as good as
the first one.
Then, for another _great_ look in the mirror, someday read Mark Twain's
book "Letters from the Earth."
> I wish today I was ignorant. I got calls today from friends oblivious
> to what's happening. They think they don't own stocks and it doesn't
> matter to them. I wish I could get a bit of that bliss. This is a
> scary time.
I visited a bunch of relatives two weekends back. Lots of well to do
people. One (of the few I respect) asked me: "Is my money safe?" And, I
started by explaining that if the claims against the FDIC insurance pool
are bigger than the pool, then someone is going to have to pull rabbits
outta the hat. And, that before that they try to merge a failed bank with
a stronger bank. But, that is the simple, short version of the situation.
The damsel I know at our bank said that two fridays ago they ran out of
money to give people making withdrawals. At one of the local coffee shops
I overheard two people, separately, tell the cashier they were taking
money out of their accounts.
The complicated, long version is: the world economy is a big damned kludge
and, yeah, if it ever unwound in a big way, then there's gonna be big
big trouble in River City.
> I'm locke don the PC watching the train wreck. Is it going to take 10
> years or 20 to clean this up? And other such thoughts go through my
> mind.
Train wreck? Better than the Titanic hitting that iceberg? Ever read how
long a human being can remain alive in water at temperatures of about 40
degrees F? IIRC, we're talking about 5-10 minutes, +/-. Hell of a way to
die.
Thoughts? My dad lived through that period. Told me about it: Jobs were
impossible to find. If you went to the bank to get some money out of your
account, they'd give you five cents on the dollar.
What, back in 1980s, in Argentina they were up to 18% unemployment and
they had civil unrest for weeks.
This morning's WSJ headlines: "Historic Bailout Passes As Economy Slips
Futher." Also, payrolls down 159,000 in Sept, "the fastest pace in five
years." Then, bottom of the page: "Is the rescue plan socialism? The far
left says, 'no way comrad'" All about Seth Dellinger, a socialist workers
party candidate for congress. FYA (=For Your Amusement).
Page B1, top: "Smaller Hedge Funds Struggle As Money Pipeline Dries Up."
Etc., etc.
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, Vid...@tcq.net wrote:
> Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 11:42:48 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Vid...@tcq.net
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
> On Oct 4, 5:15 pm, Stray Dog <sdog2...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
>
> you know we are screwed when you can lipstick on a pig, and call it a
> asset. one wonders how much worthless paper corporate america is
> holding?
The paper will always be there, but whether it will be worthless or
valuable depends not on truth but hype and herd instinct.
and how much has any real value. as we unwind this mess, we
> will see many household names disappear who had a vault full of paper,
> but no value to back them up.
The worse situation is if US assets crater to a penny on the dollar, then
China comes along and just buys up the whole fucking country and we become
a puppet of China. eh?
Rod Speed
> On Mon, 6 Oct 2008 18:20:17 +0000, Stray Dog
> <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
>> P.S. One pretty good (see footnote) economist (Kenneth Boulding)
>> once said (couple decades ago?) that he would like, someday, to do
>> research to determine to what degree ignorance is bliss (or
>> something like that).
>
>
> Stumbling On Happiness, by Gilbert. I think Galt or Cargill
> those deniers who are waking up today to find the world coming down
> around their ears (or still actively denying - it's amazing there are
> people paly to fool themselves.
>
> to what's happening. They think they don't own stocks and it doesn't
> matter to them. I wish I could get a bit of that bliss. This is a
> scary time.
> I'm locked on the PC watching the train wreck.
Your problem.
> Is it going to take 10 years or 20 to clean this up?
Unlikely now that even the fools in Congress managed to grasp that there is a problem.
> And other such thoughts go through my mind.
Not a shred of evidence that you have a viable mind.
Rod Speed
The same stupid claim was previously made about Japan. It turned out that the US
economy was a hell of a lot stronger than the Jap one was when it came to the crunch.
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, retro...@comcast.net wrote:
> Date: Mon, 06 Oct 2008 13:27:32 -0700
> From: retro...@comcast.net
> Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> Management?
>
> On Mon, 6 Oct 2008 19:56:17 +0000, Stray Dog
> <sdog...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
>>
>>> I'm locke don the PC watching the train wreck. Is it going to take 10
>>> years or 20 to clean this up? And other such thoughts go through my
>>> mind.
>>
>> Train wreck? Better than the Titanic hitting that iceberg? Ever read how
>> long a human being can remain alive in water at temperatures of about 40
>> degrees F? IIRC, we're talking about 5-10 minutes, +/-. Hell of a way to
>> die.
>>
>> Thoughts? My dad lived through that period. Told me about it: Jobs were
>> impossible to find. If you went to the bank to get some money out of your
>> account, they'd give you five cents on the dollar.
>
> My dad grew up on farms in that period. There was always food anyway.
My dad spent quite a bit of time on a farm, too. When I was a kid (1950s),
visiting my grandfather's farm was a treat, even though it meant using an
outhouse, well-water (we all drank from the same dipper in the kitchen,
no indoor plumbing), wood stove in kitchen (first one to get up in the
morning gets the fire started), wood stove in the LR. No heat anywhere
else in the house. Mice in the walls.
>> What, back in 1980s, in Argentina they were up to 18% unemployment and
>> they had civil unrest for weeks.
>
> Argentina's a very interesting story. Cooperatives in Buenos Aires
> took over the closed factories. The owners walked away, the workers
> said screw this, we know how to make this stuff and continued.
Hah! I love it, I love it.
They
> set up sales teams and before long coops were supplying each other and
> working with each other. It was cooperatives splitting profits but
> competing as capitalists for sales. Instead of letting the hard times
> lead to societal disintegration, lots of motivated people pulled them
> together.
Very interesting.
> If you get he chance see this movie:
> http://www.thetake.org/
>
> Also Argentina Hope in Hard Times:
> http://www.bullfrogfilms.com/catalog/arg.html
Saved to my URL file.
>
> We may need to learn from these.
Another article I saw a few days ago about how Toyota is starting to
outsell Detroit brands in China. Seems like the Chinese are able to
understand Toyota not only gets better gas milage but has a much higher
reliability track record. When will Detroit rip-off executives get their
shit together?
////////////////////////
Vid...@tcq.net
> > Newsgroups: alt.computer.consultants, alt.politics.economics,
> > sci.research.careers, sci.econ
> > Subject: Re: Whats behind the gross cow like ignorance we see in American
> > Management?
>
> > On Oct 4, 5:15 pm, Stray Dog <sdog2...@sdf.lonestar.org> wrote:
>
> > you know we are screwed when you can lipstick on a pig, and call it a
> > asset. one wonders how much worthless paper corporate america is
> > holding?
>
> The paper will always be there, but whether it will be worthless or
> valuable depends not on truth but hype and herd instinct.
>
you are correct, there always will be paper, chits, credits, who
knows what. but if you look at today's paper, if you peel away the
layers, the paper is backed by paper, which is backed by more paper,
which is backed by even more paper, and so on.
in the past before enron accounting became the norm, paper was backed
by something tangible, like a factory, which produced value. or a
company that serviced the factory. or commercial property that
serviced the workers in the factory, etc.
> and how much has any real value. as we unwind this mess, we
>
> > will see many household names disappear who had a vault full of paper,
> > but no value to back them up.
>
> The worse situation is if US assets crater to a penny on the dollar, then
> China comes along and just buys up the whole fucking country and we become
> a puppet of China. eh?
could be, you never know. and its why they maybe hanging on to their
treasuries. because that is all they maybe worth, buying up american
assets for pennies on the dollar. cash will be king, paper assets will
be toilet paper.
Stray Dog
On Mon, 6 Oct 2008, Vid...@tcq.net wrote:
> Date: Mon, 6 Oct 2008 17:42:30 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Vid...@tcq.net
See below....
>
>> and how much has any real value. as we unwind this mess, we
>>
>>> will see many household names disappear who had a vault full of paper,
>>> but no value to back them up.
>>
>> The worse situation is if US assets crater to a penny on the dollar, then
>> China comes along and just buys up the whole fucking country and we become
>> a puppet of China. eh?
>
> could be, you never know. and its why they maybe hanging on to their
> treasuries. because that is all they maybe worth, buying up american
> assets for pennies on the dollar. cash will be king, paper assets will
> be toilet paper.
Yes, some paper is worth more than other papers, depending on
circumstances.
Oh...by the way. Don't get too close to alexy....he will drink your blood.
Also, you get two vampire marks on your neck. You probably won't get
infected since you sound like you might have some natural immunity to
vampireism (akin to parasitism).
On a side note: see the vampire movies: Blade, Blade-Trinity, and Blade
II. Blade-Trinity has the cute chick who does spectacular-beautiful
archery (bow & arrow) work to help kill the king vampire. Archery = old
world craftsmanship.
Do you know about vulture capitalists? They eat their young. Stay away
from them, too.
The lottery ticket game? You're more likely to make money if you sell them
than if you buy them. If you get my drift.