do you know science?

[RichD]

I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.

So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
"well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
"yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
"you suck it in, obviously!"
"This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
outside air pressure pushes it?"
"No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"

They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
dense, air pressure can't push that!

Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..

It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.

Try it on your friends and business associates -

--
Rich

[Frank]

I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy

Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.

I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
had a basic science course.

[anticlockwise]

On 5/24/2013 6:21 PM, Frank wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 4:50 PM, RichD wrote:
>> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
>> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.
>>
>> So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
>> "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
>> "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
>> "you suck it in, obviously!"
>> "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
>> outside air pressure pushes it?"
>> "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>>
>> They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
>> atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
>> that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
>> dense, air pressure can't push that!
>>
>> Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>>
>> It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
>> if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.
>>
>> Try it on your friends and business associates -
>>
>> --
>> Rich
>>
>
> I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy

Sorry, that doesn't even begin to address the real issue. Here's a
web page that does:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect

Even the functionally literate are often unskilled and unaware of it.
These newsgroups are well known for that sort.

> Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
> scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.

Dream on.

> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
> made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
> had a basic science course.

For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
far more important than the hard sciences. In fact they've come to
believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That vile
evil grows as silently as any cancer.

[DecadentLinuxUserNumeroUno]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 19:44:32 -0500, anticlockwise
<anticl...@antilock.org> wrote:

>These newsgroups are well known for that sort.

We can start with you, and your abjectly ignorant Zimmerman Complex
Disorder, which you just made a perfect display of.

[John Larkin]

Different people have different talents. Maybe Joe Sixpack (as you
contemptuously refer to him) can frame a window or track a deer or
steer a sailboat a lot better than you can. My wife can't manage
mechanical or electrical or thermal things very well (I do all the
frying) but she's a brilliant speech pathologist who can do things
that I can't do. She's just wired different.

I bet you didn't figure out the straw suction thing yourself.

Do you design electronics?


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser drivers and controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

[benj]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 19:21:56 -0400, Frank wrote:

> I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy
>
> Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
> scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.

Sure just look here at all the people who call everyone else "morons" but
when cornered can't handle a simple high school science problem.

> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
> made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
> had a basic science course.

As well you should be concerned given that the schools are substituting
politics and political propaganda for science. I'm sure you know that
"education majors" are the bottom of the barrel in any college in spite
of all the media adulation over how wonderful and dedicated and giving
they all are. No greater admiration and praise in the media is ever found
except when speaking of themselves!

And physical science has always been a major mystery to school teachers
and no wonder. Do they take physics like all the other majors have to?
Nay. They get to take "physics appreciation" which is physics with all
the math stripped out so some of them can pass! I remember when I was a
kid in school wading through our stupid science book learning the names
of flower parts and frog organs. I couldn't wait to get to the back of
that book where the physical science stuff was. Well too bad! When we
finally got there the teacher just skipped it all! At the time I didn't
realize it was because none were competent to understand or teach it. I
learned that later.

So maybe there are Nobel prize winners in your town and maybe they are
even civic minded enough to help with a few science classes. Well,
fergeddaboutit. They are not ALLOWED to teach science because they aren't
"qualified". They haven't been trained on HOW to teach and jumped through
the bureaucratic hoops. But what if some government bureaucrat does his
"duty" by showing up to thump the AGW bible and extol the benefits of
ending civilization as we know it with a huge energy (euphemistically
called "carbon") tax, well, no qualifications needed for brainwashing and
indoctrination of children.

So you might as well get it though your head now, your granddaughter is
NEVER going to get a "science course" in a public school unless it's some
huge big city school. And even then it's a throw of the dice.

And why not? The problem is YOU! Pervert school administrators abuse
children, scare them to death, and ruin their lives over nonsense like
pointing a chicken leg and saying "bang" or eating a pop tart into a gun
shape. They haul them off in handcuffs to meet Bubba in jail and give
them records that make sure they spend their lives flipping burgers. And
yet nobody speaks up for the children. Nobody says these perverts need to
be not only FIRED but also sued and lose their houses RIGHT NOW! Nobody
and that includes YOU ever says a peep.

So until you stand up at a school board meeting and DEMAND thats these
perverts be fired, then just shut up like a good little sheeple.

[1treePetrifiedForestLane]

formally, it really doesn't matter, whether you
use negative or positive pressure; anyway,
Pascal uncovered the limit of a stage
of a suction pump. 32 feet at sealevel.

[Uncle Steve]

This problem is everywhere. Most people live seem to live in a
fantasy-world in which their unknown unknowns are of precisely zero
importance, and therefore obviously cannot affect their competence,
reasoning, or decision-making ability in any way whatsoever. The
problem is masked somewhat by the phenomenon of Orwellian stopthink,
and also by the mutual reinforcement of memes and values within
insular populations.

Pop culture has a lot to answer for.


Regards,

Uncle Steve

--
There should be a special word in the English language to identify
people who create problems and then turn around and offer up their own
tailor-made bogus non-solutions designed to completely avoid the root
causes of the situation under consideration. 'Traitor' might be a
good choice, but lacks the requisite specificity. One of the problems
with contemporary English is it lacks many such words that would
otherwise categorically identify certain kinds of person, place, or
thing -- making it difficult or impossible to think analytically about
such objects. These shortcomings of the English lexicon are
representative of Orwellian linguistics at work in the real world.

[bil...@microsoft.com]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 13:50:35 -0700 (PDT), RichD
<r_dela...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
>to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.

next time you decide to post be sure to check your basic physics of
airpressure

>
>So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
>"well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
>"yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
>"you suck it in, obviously!"
>"This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
> outside air pressure pushes it?"
>"No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"

Actually you completely wrong about the straw thing. Yes it is the 14
or so pounds of air pressure that presses down on the liquid into the
glass and then up the straw because the airpressure is removed from
the straw.

>
>They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
>atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
>that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
>dense, air pressure can't push that!

actually it explains it very well. I can drain an entire swimming pool
with to suction at all

>
>Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..

again no you are wrong. the vacum removes the air pressure from one
place thus creating the vortices and creating the "suction" from the
change in pressure

>
>It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
>if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.
>
>Try it on your friends and business associates -

IF I wwere you I would not try this on anyone because someone
somewhere is going to make you look like a complete idiot as I just
did.
Secondly he lkes his stereotyped term of joe sixpack which is also a
bad use of the english language, when he should have said john q
public or even john doe. Just because he chooses to be an alcoholic or
whatnot and drinks his 6 pack every day doesnt mean everyone does. I
may drink a 6 pack once a year.

and in case he wants to say well maybe he means soda that is still a
stereotype cause I dont like soda either.

[Vladimir Vassilevsky]

On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:

On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
>> On 5/24/2013 4:50 PM, RichD wrote:
>>> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,

>>> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some herey

So, you know about air pressure and lots of other things. That possibly
makes your wage higher, but did it make your life happier?

> For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
> far more important than the hard sciences.

For the past ~5000 years governments need loyal people more then skilled
people. Indoctrination is and always was #1 task of education.

> In fact they've come to
> believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
> fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That vile
> evil grows as silently as any cancer.

What are you protesting against?

VLV

[bil...@microsoft.com]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 13:50:35 -0700 (PDT), RichD
<r_dela...@yahoo.com> wrote:

>It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
>if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.

What the hell is that? that is like me saying that you are breaking
the first law. The first law of idiots should not speak unless spoken
to.
or how about the first law of posting what you know not what you think
you know. (also called the idiots law)
maybe the idiots law of idiot dynamics which states that if an idiot
is out there that thinks he is intelligent then he will surely post
something to usenet that makes no sense whatsoever.
then there is the second law of pieholes.
idiots should shut thier freakin pie holes.

[Vladimir Vassilevsky]

On 5/24/2013 8:04 PM, John Larkin wrote:

> Different people have different talents. Maybe Joe Sixpack (as you
> contemptuously refer to him) can frame a window or track a deer or
> steer a sailboat a lot better than you can. My wife can't manage
> mechanical or electrical or thermal things very well (I do all the
> frying) but she's a brilliant speech pathologist who can do things
> that I can't do. She's just wired different.

A lot has to do with person. Good people quickly asquire entirely
different skills.

> I bet you didn't figure out the straw suction thing yourself.
> Do you design electronics?

Oh, there is no problem with designing electronics or riding elephants.
Problems usually happen when elephant rider designs electronics.
It works better other way around.


VLV

[anticlockwise]

On 5/24/2013 10:45 PM, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:

> > For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
> > far more important than the hard sciences.
>
> For the past ~5000 years governments need loyal people more then skilled
> people. Indoctrination is and always was #1 task of education.

That depends on who was paying for the education.

> > In fact they've come to
> > believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
> > fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That vile
> > evil grows as silently as any cancer.
>
> What are you protesting against?

I made some statements of fact. Where did the "protest" question
come from?

[VWWall]

Here's one for you...

How does the sap get to the top of trees taller than about thirty two
feet (the height of a column of "sap" supported by normal atmospheric
pressure)? Does something "suck" it up? :-)

--
Virg Wall, P.E.

[benj]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 21:51:25 -0700, VWWall wrote:

> Here's one for you...
>
> How does the sap get to the top of trees taller than about thirty two
> feet (the height of a column of "sap" supported by normal atmospheric
> pressure)? Does something "suck" it up? :-)

Yeah trees have to "suck it up" these days!

This is a question I bet few here know the answer to let alone how sap is
pumped ANY vertical distance let alone more than 32 feet. Hint. It's
electrical.

[Robert Baer]

Advantage(s) of electric cars: they plainly increase air and thermal
pollution (a) requires more coal to be burned for the extra electrical
power guzzled (b) adds extra energy wasting step to move that hunk of iron.

[bil...@microsoft.com]

man you guys are so full of shit. the squirrls take the acorns and
hide them in the tree. as they get stacked up and go down the weight
of the acorns pushes the sap up. Gosh I thought everyone knew that

[benj]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 22:06:49 -0800, Robert Baer wrote:

> Frank wrote:

>> Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
>> scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.
>>
>> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
>> made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
>> had a basic science course.

Obviously "GREEN" illiteracy is the highest of all!

Advantage(s) of electric cars: they plainly increase air and thermal
> pollution (a) requires more coal to be burned for the extra electrical
> power guzzled (b) adds extra energy wasting step to move that hunk of
> iron.

Advantage of electric cars is that they move CO2 production from
individual autos (harder to measure and tax) to several central CO2
belching locations making taxation much easier to compute.

It makes no difference if that produces more CO2 than the other way or if
burning coal belches out heavy metals and all manner of other dire
pollutions because the goal isn't clean air but trillions of dollars. Get
the picture?

[Robert Baer]

The process is called "capillary", wich all by itself has that
theoretical limit.
Remember, bees theoretically cannot fly.

[benj]

On Sat, 25 May 2013 10:48:43 -0800, Robert Baer wrote:

> benj wrote:
>> On Fri, 24 May 2013 21:51:25 -0700, VWWall wrote:
>>
>>> Here's one for you...
>>>
>>> How does the sap get to the top of trees taller than about thirty two
>>> feet (the height of a column of "sap" supported by normal atmospheric
>>> pressure)? Does something "suck" it up? :-)
>>
>> Yeah trees have to "suck it up" these days!


>> This is a question I bet few here know the answer to let alone how sap
>> is pumped ANY vertical distance let alone more than 32 feet. Hint. It's
>> electrical.

> The process is called "capillary", which all by itself has that

> theoretical limit.
> Remember, bees theoretically cannot fly.

Actually capillarity is only a small part of the picture. The basic tree
question, however has a very simple answer not dependent upon pumping
methodology.

Actually it's "bumble bees" not "bees" and that simply shows that theory
that doesn't agree with reality is bullshit. Math is NOT more real than
reality.

Where are all those mensa brains? They know everything. How does sap get
up those trees?

[outsider]

On 5/25/2013 12:54 PM, benj wrote:

> Where are all those mensa brains? They know everything.

They knew enough to "get outa town" so they picked up their
toys and left to go play in a private kindergarten.

> How does sap get up those trees?

The sap puts on climbing gear and up s/he goes. Even a child
can do it!

http://tinyurl.com/oe8kdkt

[Frank]

Could be a whole new thread. There are scientists, particularly in
academia, that push the green thing without factoring in the unintended
consequences.

Nice thing about spending most of my career in industry was having to
know all of the consequences of manufacturing a new invention. Profit
was the bottom line and you had to consider everything including cost of
producing a clean product and its environmental effect. If there was no
good bottom line, you would not make the product.

The political scientists running everything these days should stick to
politics. They sure ain't scientists.

[bil...@microsoft.com]

I already told you the squirrls do it but if you would prefer another
explanation then see
http://www.massmaple.org/sap.php

[Spehro Pefhany]

Why do people often say "Remember,", then spout something that's not
quite right?

http://www.snopes.com/science/bumblebees.asp




Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
sp...@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com

[benj]

Mensa just ain't what it used to be!

[benj]

"The exact mechanism for the production of the pressure is not completely
understood, although several hypotheses have been advanced. None of these
seem to fit all the requirements for explaining the sap flow."

Well, that sure fits with the level of science education today. Who needs
science when "plausible" explanations will do?

[Mahipal]

On May 24, 11:20 pm, Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Fri, May 24, 2013 at 07:44:32PM -0500, anticlockwise wrote:
> > On 5/24/2013 6:21 PM, Frank wrote:
> > >On 5/24/2013 4:50 PM, RichD wrote:
> > >>I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> > >>to delve their beliefs about basic science.  I've posted some here.
>
> > >>So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
> > >>"well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
> > >>"yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
> > >>"you suck it in, obviously!"
> > >>"This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
> > >>   outside air pressure pushes it?"
> > >>"No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>
> > >>They don't get it.  They sort of understand respiration -
> > >>atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
> > >>that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
> > >>dense, air pressure can't push that!

Venturi Tube fluid mechanics...

> > >>Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>
> > >>It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
> > >>if you can't  imagine something, it can't be true.

I cannot imagine having read that true law.

> > >>Try it on your friends and business associates -
>
> > >>--
> > >>Rich
>
> > >I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>
> > >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy
>
> > Sorry, that doesn't even begin to address the real issue. Here's a
> > web page that does:
>
> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
>
> > Even the functionally literate are often unskilled and unaware of it.
> > These newsgroups are well known for that sort.

No one can even spell Usenet let alone pronounce it. So, not well
known at all.

> > >Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
> > >scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.
>
> > Dream on.
>
> > >I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
> > >made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
> > >had a basic science course.

Interesting dilemma you have there with your grandkids. Any advice?

> > For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
> > far more important than the hard sciences. In fact they've come to
> > believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
> > fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That vile
> > evil grows as silently as any cancer.

"I fight Stupidity and Stupidity always wins." John Cougar Mellencamp
born October 7, 1951 and he might have used the string "Authority" in
the audio realm.

> This problem is everywhere.  Most people live seem to live in a
> fantasy-world in which their unknown unknowns are of precisely zero
> importance, and therefore obviously cannot affect their competence,
> reasoning, or decision-making ability in any way whatsoever.  The
> problem is masked somewhat by the phenomenon of Orwellian stopthink,
> and also by the mutual reinforcement of memes and values within
> insular populations.
>
> Pop culture has a lot to answer for.
>
> Regards,
>
> Uncle Steve
>
> --
> There should be a special word in the English language to identify
> people who create problems and then turn around and offer up their own
> tailor-made bogus non-solutions designed to completely avoid the root
> causes of the situation under consideration.  'Traitor' might be a
> good choice, but lacks the requisite specificity.  One of the problems
> with contemporary English is it lacks many such words that would
> otherwise categorically identify certain kinds of person, place, or
> thing -- making it difficult or impossible to think analytically about
> such objects.  These shortcomings of the English lexicon are
> representative of Orwellian linguistics at work in the real world.

What is the longest word or the longest human name in Gaelic?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maple_syrup since "The Sap also rises"
but only in feet, never in meters, and only this high.

-- Mahipal

[Zerkon]

On Fri, 24 May 2013 13:50:35 -0700, RichD wrote:

> the machine PULLS the air..

.. electricity runs and cars drive.

[Vladimir Vassilevsky]

On 5/24/2013 11:15 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 10:45 PM, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>> On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
>
>> > For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
>> > far more important than the hard sciences.
>>
>> For the past ~5000 years governments need loyal people more then skilled
>> people. Indoctrination is and always was #1 task of education.
>
> That depends on who was paying for the education.

It doesn't.

>> > In fact they've come to
>> > believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
>> > fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That
>> vile
>> > evil grows as silently as any cancer.
>>
>> What are you protesting against?
>
> I made some statements of fact. Where did the "protest" question
> come from?

What about "fake", "evil", "vile", "cancer" ?

[anticlockwise]

On 5/26/2013 12:42 PM, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 11:15 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
>> On 5/24/2013 10:45 PM, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
>>> On 5/24/2013 7:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
>>
>>> > For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be
>>> > far more important than the hard sciences.
>>>
>>> For the past ~5000 years governments need loyal people more then skilled
>>> people. Indoctrination is and always was #1 task of education.
>>
>> That depends on who was paying for the education.
>
> It doesn't.

This clearly demonstrates that you spout without knowledge.

http://www.women-philosophers.com/Teachers-of-Socrates.html

JA Wheeler, is is sometimes said, was a latter day Pythia. For many
of his students, the discovery of a question meant engagement in
a quest for the rest of their lives.

>>> > In fact they've come to
>>> > believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
>>> > fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That
>>> vile
>>> > evil grows as silently as any cancer.
>>>
>>> What are you protesting against?
>>
>> I made some statements of fact. Where did the "protest" question
>> come from?
>
> What about "fake", "evil", "vile", "cancer" ?

Tell us, please, when does observation become protest?

[P E Schoen]

"anticlockwise" wrote in message news:kntjes$coj$1...@dont-email.me...

> On 5/26/2013 12:42 PM, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:

>> What about "fake", "evil", "vile", "cancer" ?

> Tell us, please, when does observation become protest?

"Fake" is an interpretation of an observation that needs to be verified by
impartial evidence.

"Evil" and "vile" are subjective judgments based on learned criteria and
emotional reaction, and not on scientific fact.

"Cancer" is a specific medical term which has become a metaphor for
something that grows rapidly and is harmful to the body, but again that is
subjective when applied to other phenomena, such as the "Tea Party Movement"
or the "Green Movement" or militant religion.

When you use these terms to describe and attack what you do not agree with,
they become protest more than observation.

Paul

[Greegor]

On May 24, 6:21 pm, Frank <frankdotlogu...@comcast.net> wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 4:50 PM, RichD wrote:
>
>
> > I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> > to delve their beliefs about basic science.  I've posted some here.
>
> > So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
> > "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
> > "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
> > "you suck it in, obviously!"
> > "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
> >    outside air pressure pushes it?"
> > "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>
> > They don't get it.  They sort of understand respiration -
> > atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
> > that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
> > dense, air pressure can't push that!
>

> > Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>
> > It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
> > if you can't  imagine something, it can't be true.
>

> > Try it on your friends and business associates -
>
> > --
> > Rich

> I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy
>

> Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
> scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.
>

> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
> made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
> had a basic science course.

School teachers tend to be extremely
left wing politically and many have no
ethical concerns about projecting those
liberal views on children.

While preaching the inclusion of all others,
they forget to consider the views of others
not conforming to the liberal mantra.

They're all for free speech as long as
it's not contrary to theirs.

Typically views different from theirs are
seen as hateful and coming from "hate groups".

But they're just fine with white hatred
taught to minorities or even confused
whites into self hatred.

A kid wearing a Romney or Rand Paul
shirt can be picked on or even kicked
out of class. Obama shirts are AOK though.

Some school teachers get so much into
considering the opinions of opponents
that they urged US kids to try to see conflict
from the Middle Eastern perspective.

They haven't done that much for US conservative views.

School teachers are heavily unionized.

University professors tend to be even
more extreme left, despite a few who
express right wing views.

[Vladimir Vassilevsky]

On 5/26/2013 5:09 PM, Greegor wrote:

> School teachers tend to be extremely
> left wing politically and many have no
> ethical concerns about projecting those
> liberal views on children.

> University professors tend to be even
> more extreme left, despite a few who
> express right wing views.

Political beliefs of individuals are strongly influenced by what is on
their dinner plate and where it comes from.

> Some school teachers get so much into
> considering the opinions of opponents
> that they urged US kids to try to see conflict
> from the Middle Eastern perspective.

May be you could explain that from any perspective.
I can't see much sense.

VLV

[P E Schoen]

"Vladimir Vassilevsky" wrote in message
news:ds6dnYcVUpuSAD_M...@giganews.com...

This is a technique used by criminal profilers to "get into the minds" of
sociopaths (as uncomfortable and revolting as that might be", in order to
understand their motives from their perspective and be better able to guess
their subsequent actions and hopefully apprehend them before further damage
is done. There is some credible basis to the insults perceived by Middle
Easterners and religious extremists. Although it does not justify their
terrorism and killing of innocent people, their thought processes are so
skewed that they consider themselves martyrs along with anyone else of their
ilk who may become collateral damage.

Paul

[U.S. Senator Marco Rubio (R-FL)]

The May 25 - 2013 Edition Of weezer919.com Has Been Published ......
http://weezer919.com/ ......

Please Take A Few Moments To Visit This Website ......

Please Read This Website ......

Please Email This Website To Your Friends ......

-----------------------------------------

If You Know How To Build Websites ......

Please Copy And Re-Publish This Website ......

You Can Call It "Your Website" ......

I Do Not Care ......

All I Want Is A Voice ......

-----------------------------------------

Yesterday ...... On May 25, 2013 ...... Almost One Thousand People
Visited weezer919.com ......

!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!! THANK YOU !!!!!!!!!

-----------------------------------------

If You Are Re-Publishing My Website ...... I THANK YOU ...... EVEN
MORE !!!!!!!!! ......

-----------------------------------------

I Am Currently Working On The New Edition Of weezer919.com ......

-----------------------------------------

I Will Not Publish It Until It Is Better Than The Last One ......

You Have My Word ......

-----------------------------------------

I Have Made Some Folks Angry With The Publication Of This
Website ......

-----------------------------------------

If You Read All Six Pages Of weezer919.com ......

You Can See That My Only Goal Of Publishing This Website ......

Is To Find A Job That Pays Enough To Live On ......

----------------------------------------

No More ...... No Less ......

----------------------------------------

As Soon As Someone Hires Me ......

The Website Goes Down ......

-----------------------------------------

We Can End This Standoff ......

Anytime You Choose To ......

-----------------------------------------

The Ball Is In Your Court ......

------------------------------------------

I'm Talking To You ...... Michael Dell ......

I'm Talking To You ...... Apple Computers ......

------------------------------------------

As Soon As You Stop FUCKING AROUND ......

AND HIRE ME ......

------------------------------------------

The Website Comes Down ......

------------------------------------------

You Have My Word

[outsider]

My observation is your protest? OK.

[Arindam Banerjee]

On May 27, 11:49 am, "P E Schoen" <p...@peschoen.com> wrote:
> "Vladimir Vassilevsky"  wrote in message
>
> news:ds6dnYcVUpuSAD_M...@giganews.com...
>
> > On 5/26/2013 5:09 PM, Greegor wrote:
> >> Some school teachers get so much into
> >> considering the opinions of opponents
> >> that they urged US kids to try to see conflict
> >> from the Middle Eastern perspective.
> > May be you could explain that from any perspective.
> > I can't see much sense.
>
> This is a technique used by criminal profilers to "get into the minds" of
> sociopaths (as uncomfortable and revolting as that might be", in order to
> understand their motives from their perspective and be better able to guess
> their subsequent actions and hopefully apprehend them before further damage
> is done.

The first part is acting, and the second part is hoping for far too
much.

There is some credible basis to the insults perceived by Middle
> Easterners and religious extremists.

Such as having their jobs and nations destroyed, houses blown up,
friends and relatives killed, no future at all that they can find,
etc. by unasked-for invasions?

Although it does not justify their
> terrorism and killing of innocent people,

Of course not. Only organised and powerful democratic governments
controlled by oil power and boosted by amoral media have this sole
right. All others better toe the line, for health and safety reasons.

> their thought processes are so
> skewed that they consider themselves martyrs along with anyone else of their
> ilk who may become collateral damage.

Some satisfaction is evidently what they may still expect, to go that
way. It is not as if these terrorists invented and overwhelmingly
executed the notion of "collateral damage".

Cheers,
Arindam Banerjee
>
> Paul

[Arindam Banerjee]

On May 26, 4:56 am, benj <b...@iwaynet.net> wrote:
> On Sat, 25 May 2013 13:35:15 -0500, bilgat wrote:

> > On Sat, 25 May 2013 17:54:30 GMT, benj <b...@iwaynet.net> wrote:
> >>Where are all those mensa brains?  They know everything. How does sap
> >>get up those trees?
>
> > I already told you the squirrls do it but if you would prefer another

> > explanation then seehttp://www.massmaple.org/sap.php

>
> "The exact mechanism for the production of the pressure is not completely
> understood, although several hypotheses have been advanced. None of these
> seem to fit all the requirements for explaining the sap flow."
>
> Well, that sure fits with the level of science education today. Who needs
> science when "plausible" explanations will do?

Wow, thanks for this example! This may help me in my thesis relating
to the arresting of excited armatures of a particular kind of linear
electric motor.
Cheers,
Arindam Banerjee

[David Eather]

SNIP

> The Ball Is In Your Court ......
>
> ------------------------------------------
>
> I'm Talking To You ...... Michael Dell ......
>
> I'm Talking To You ...... Apple Computers ......
>
> ------------------------------------------
>
> As Soon As You Stop FUCKING AROUND ......
>
> AND HIRE ME ......
>
> ------------------------------------------
>
> The Website Comes Down ......
>
> ------------------------------------------
>
> You Have My Word

Wow, A US senator is using the "F" word AND asking for a job? That link
must be malicious!

[RichD]

On May 24, Uncle Steve <stevet...@gmail.com> wrote:
> There should be a special word in the English language to
> identify people who create problems and then turn around
> and offer up their own tailor-made bogus non-solutions
> designed to completely avoid the root causes of the situation
> under consideration.

I once had a boss who said: "Three types in this
world - the ones who create the shit, the ones
who clean up the shit, and those who just stir it around."

--
Rich

[John Walliker]

On May 25, 6:47 pm, benj <b...@iwaynet.net> wrote:

> Advantage of electric cars is that they move CO2 production from
> individual autos (harder to measure and tax) to several central CO2
> belching locations making taxation much easier to compute.
>

It doesn't seem difficult to tax the emissions of individual autos.
Just tax the fuel. After all, the amount of CO2 emitted by burning a
liter of fuel is already accurately known by the suppliers.
In fact, most governments already tax fuel, so the "problem" has
already been solved.

John

[Jos Horikx]

On 24.05.2013 10:50 PM, RichD wrote:
> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.
>
> So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
> "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
> "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
> "you suck it in, obviously!"
> "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
> outside air pressure pushes it?"
> "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>
> They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
> atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
> that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
> dense, air pressure can't push that!
>
> Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>
> It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
> if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.
>
> Try it on your friends and business associates -

What exactly is the problem?

You can _demonstrate_ it using Toricelli's (water)barometer.

--
JH

[Frank]

On 5/24/2013 8:44 PM, anticlockwise wrote:
> On 5/24/2013 6:21 PM, Frank wrote:

>> On 5/24/2013 4:50 PM, RichD wrote:
>>> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
>>> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.
>>>
>>> So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
>>> "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
>>> "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
>>> "you suck it in, obviously!"
>>> "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
>>> outside air pressure pushes it?"
>>> "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>>>
>>> They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
>>> atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
>>> that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
>>> dense, air pressure can't push that!
>>>
>>> Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>>>
>>> It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
>>> if you can't imagine something, it can't be true.
>>>
>>> Try it on your friends and business associates -
>>>

>>> --
>>> Rich
>>>
>>
>> I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>>
>> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy
>

> Sorry, that doesn't even begin to address the real issue. Here's a
> web page that does:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning%E2%80%93Kruger_effect
>
> Even the functionally literate are often unskilled and unaware of it.
> These newsgroups are well known for that sort.
>

>> Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
>> scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.
>

> Dream on.

>
>> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
>> made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
>> had a basic science course.
>

> For the past ~50 years educators have thought social sciences to be

> far more important than the hard sciences. In fact they've come to

> believe that because you can fake the former, you can just as easily
> fake the latter. And you can see it in postings here as well. That vile
> evil grows as silently as any cancer.
>

Look at this list of easiest to obtain college degrees:

http://xfinity.comcast.net/blogs/lifestyle/2013/05/24/10-easiest-college-degrees/?cid=hero_media

#10 is most disturbing.

[Tim Wescott]

Your slanted observations using emotionally laden negative terms is my
protest.

Be honest, please.

--
My liberal friends think I'm a conservative kook.
My conservative friends think I'm a liberal kook.
Why am I not happy that they have found common ground?

Tim Wescott, Communications, Control, Circuits & Software
http://www.wescottdesign.com

[benj]

Glad you solved the problem. $15 per gallon gasoline should be on the way
any day now.

[benj]

Come on. Education majors study science. All of them are forced to take
"physics appreciation" courses!

[John Fields]

---
For those of us who work from home and use DARPA's internet to
communicate, the price of gasoline is irrelevant.

--
JF

[benj]

Bet you don't own a TV either...

Personally I think there is consensus that internet usage is a main cause
of anthropogenic global warming. Wormley and myself being two of the
prime warmers.

[John Larkin]

The big generator of CO2 is the rise of billions of people out of
poverty. They want heat, light, refrigerators, schools, irrigation,
farm machinery, and ultimately cars and airplane tickets. Whether that
causes global warming, and whether that's good or bad, are another
issue.

Driving I80 across central California yesterday, the gas guzzlers were
amazing. Monster trucks and RVs were pulling monster trailers full of
power boats, motorcycles, ATVs, and jet skis, often more than one.
Imagine a billion Chinese doing that, too.

What sort of MPGs do you get in a power boat with a Yamaha 225
outboard? The damned outboard motor alone costs $17K.


--

John Larkin Highland Technology, Inc

jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
http://www.highlandtechnology.com

Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom laser drivers and controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro acquisition and simulation

[Sam Wormley]

On 5/28/13 3:00 PM, John Larkin wrote:
> Driving I80 across central California yesterday, the gas guzzlers were
> amazing. Monster trucks and RVs were pulling monster trailers full of
> power boats, motorcycles, ATVs, and jet skis, often more than one.
> Imagine a billion Chinese doing that, too.

Speaking of Driving I80
> http://edu-observatory.org/wormley/I80Iowa.mp3

[Absolutely Vertical]

On 5/28/2013 6:43 AM, Jos Horikx wrote:
> On 24.05.2013 10:50 PM, RichD wrote:
>> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
>> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.
>>
>> So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
>> "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
>> "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
>> "you suck it in, obviously!"
>> "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
>> outside air pressure pushes it?"
>> "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>>
>> They don't get it. They sort of understand respiration -
>> atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
>> that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
>> dense, air pressure can't push that!

14.7 pounds of pressure can't push up 5 teaspoons of water up a straw?

sure it can.

try sucking water up a straw on an airtight container with no air on the
interior.

[benj]

On Tue, 28 May 2013 13:00:59 -0700, John Larkin wrote:

>>Bet you don't own a TV either...
>>
>>Personally I think there is consensus that internet usage is a main
>>cause of anthropogenic global warming. Wormley and myself being two of
>>the prime warmers.
>
>
> The big generator of CO2 is the rise of billions of people out of
> poverty. They want heat, light, refrigerators, schools, irrigation, farm
> machinery, and ultimately cars and airplane tickets. Whether that causes
> global warming, and whether that's good or bad, are another issue.
>
> Driving I80 across central California yesterday, the gas guzzlers were
> amazing. Monster trucks and RVs were pulling monster trailers full of
> power boats, motorcycles, ATVs, and jet skis, often more than one.
> Imagine a billion Chinese doing that, too.
>
> What sort of MPGs do you get in a power boat with a Yamaha 225 outboard?
> The damned outboard motor alone costs $17K.

From what I've seen evidence is that changing fuel usage is exceptionally
difficult unless lower priced alternatives are provided which do not
change what you are driving. Huge gasoline price spikes really don't
change much consumption. People just pay it and keep on driving. So much
for that "carbon tax" idea.

I used to have a huge 500 cu in Cadillac. Got 11 MPG. When I sold it and
bought a baby Cadillac that got 30 MPG, my fuel bill didn't change a bit!
Why? Because in the old days I'd crawl into the car and before I left I'd
always ask myself: "Is this trip REALLY necessary?" and if it wasn't I'd
crawl out and go back in the house. With the economy car I'd just go
anywhere I'd damn well please. Bottom line, money at pump didn't change a
bit. Only real differences come from trips you MUST make like to work
and back. And in that case no matter what fuel costs you HAVE to pay it!

But you are correct. The idea of everyone in China (and India) trying to
live like Americans is more scary than anything the Worm has ever cut and
pasted. It's not working out so well even for Americans.

Eventually barring a big planned disaster to trim world populations,
EVERYONE will have to start asking themselves: Is this trip REALLY
necessary?

[P E Schoen]

"John Larkin" wrote in message
news:ki2aq8p4tv36015od...@4ax.com...

> The big generator of CO2 is the rise of billions of people out of
> poverty. They want heat, light, refrigerators, schools, irrigation,
> farm machinery, and ultimately cars and airplane tickets. Whether that
> causes global warming, and whether that's good or bad, are another
> issue.

> Driving I80 across central California yesterday, the gas guzzlers were
> amazing. Monster trucks and RVs were pulling monster trailers full of
> power boats, motorcycles, ATVs, and jet skis, often more than one.
> Imagine a billion Chinese doing that, too.

> What sort of MPGs do you get in a power boat with a Yamaha 225
> outboard? The damned outboard motor alone costs $17K.

Actually I have noticed that the daily temperatures in Washington, DC, and
also our state capital, Annapolis, are consistently much warmer than in
Baltimore and the surrounding suburbs. This is particularly true when
congress and the legislature is in session. Therefore I conclude that global
warming is caused by the hot air spewed by politicians. Bing, bang, bong!

We should tax the hell out of gasoline and diesel fuel, reflecting the true
cost of extraction, refining, delivery, and environmental damage. This
should include the costs of the wars in the Middle East, and the total costs
of clean-up of oils spills and explosions. We really need something like a
$2 to $5 tax on fuels, and not the piddling 10 cents or so per gallon that
people are crying about.

Most people do not really need to be physically present at their places of
work, and their jobs could be done just as well by using the internet. And
it may even be argued that their jobs are largely unnecessary and could be
performed by automated machinery and robots. Employment is becoming obsolete
and people should accept a lifestyle where leisure time is much more than
work time, with 3 or 4 day work weeks and month-long vacations.

Many of our leisure activities use (waste) much more energy than necessary.
Rail transportation is much more efficient and it reduces traffic on the
roads and resultant log-jams, frustration, road rage, and "accidents" caused
by fatigue and aggressive and angry driving. And the phenomenon of
adrenaline rush and enjoyment of violent sports and electronic games are
disturbing symptoms of a lack of appreciation for relaxation and calm
connection to our natural world. We are also losing the concepts of manners,
politeness, cooperation, and face-to-face communication, which leads to
isolation, misunderstanding, and hatred.

Paul

[hanson]

"P E Schoen" <pa...@peschoen.com> wrote:
<snipped usless AWG related mpg issues>
We are also losing the concepts of manners [1],
politeness [2], cooperation [3], and face-to-face
communication [4] which leads to isolation,
misunderstanding, and hatred.
Paul
>
hanson wrote:
That only seems to you to be that way, Paul,
because YOU and the rest of the complainers
here are or are getting to be OLD farts who
have lost [1], [2], [3] & [4]. That is not "schön".
But it is the natural order of things.
Live with it and laugh about it... hahahahanson

[Tom Potter]

"Frank" <frankdo...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:ko25gc$ghr$1...@dont-email.me...

Face the faces,
institutionalized "education" in ALL fields
is over done and counter-productive.

One can learn more by on the job training
and by attending trade shows and seminars,
than they can by wasting four or more years
paying, or having the taxpayers pay for them,
to be conditioned to parrot conventional wisdom
and support the "system".

The top ten percent of high school graduates
could better educate reading, riting, and rithmetic
than unionized, public school teachers on the taxpayer dole,

and trade show and company seminars
and on the job training is most effective and efficient
in educating advanced and state of the art subjects.

Observe that most great advances in technology
that lead to a new and better world
come from high school and college dropouts.

People should be taught and encouraged to
USE what they know at each point in time,

rather than to accumulate more and more
useless information
that wastes their time, money and minds,
and dies with them.

Education has become
the accumulation of "conventional wisdom"
and "mental masterbation"
rather than a way to learn how to create
and be a productive member of society.

A mind is a terrible thing to waste.

--
Tom Potter

http://the-cloud-machine.tk
http://tiny.im/390k

[John Larkin]

On Tue, 28 May 2013 17:54:19 -0400, "P E Schoen" <pa...@peschoen.com>
wrote:

>"John Larkin" wrote in message
>news:ki2aq8p4tv36015od...@4ax.com...
>
>> The big generator of CO2 is the rise of billions of people out of
>> poverty. They want heat, light, refrigerators, schools, irrigation,
>> farm machinery, and ultimately cars and airplane tickets. Whether that
>> causes global warming, and whether that's good or bad, are another
>> issue.
>
>> Driving I80 across central California yesterday, the gas guzzlers were
>> amazing. Monster trucks and RVs were pulling monster trailers full of
>> power boats, motorcycles, ATVs, and jet skis, often more than one.
>> Imagine a billion Chinese doing that, too.
>
>> What sort of MPGs do you get in a power boat with a Yamaha 225
>> outboard? The damned outboard motor alone costs $17K.
>
>Actually I have noticed that the daily temperatures in Washington, DC, and
>also our state capital, Annapolis, are consistently much warmer than in
>Baltimore and the surrounding suburbs. This is particularly true when
>congress and the legislature is in session. Therefore I conclude that global
>warming is caused by the hot air spewed by politicians. Bing, bang, bong!
>
>We should tax the hell out of gasoline and diesel fuel, reflecting the true
>cost of extraction, refining, delivery, and environmental damage. This
>should include the costs of the wars in the Middle East, and the total costs
>of clean-up of oils spills and explosions. We really need something like a
>$2 to $5 tax on fuels, and not the piddling 10 cents or so per gallon that
>people are crying about.

That's silly. The costs are already being paid.

>
>Most people do not really need to be physically present at their places of
>work, and their jobs could be done just as well by using the internet. And
>it may even be argued that their jobs are largely unnecessary and could be
>performed by automated machinery and robots. Employment is becoming obsolete
>and people should accept a lifestyle where leisure time is much more than
>work time, with 3 or 4 day work weeks and month-long vacations.

Yes!! They can buy huge RVs and power boats and barbeque pits, and get
on airplanes to exotic port cities where they board cruise ships. Not
working uses more energy than working.

>
>Many of our leisure activities use (waste) much more energy than necessary.
>Rail transportation is much more efficient and it reduces traffic on the
>roads and resultant log-jams, frustration, road rage, and "accidents" caused
>by fatigue and aggressive and angry driving. And the phenomenon of
>adrenaline rush and enjoyment of violent sports and electronic games are
>disturbing symptoms of a lack of appreciation for relaxation and calm
>connection to our natural world. We are also losing the concepts of manners,
>politeness, cooperation, and face-to-face communication, which leads to
>isolation, misunderstanding, and hatred.

Working from home will help that?

[George Herold]

On May 28, 7:26 pm, John Larkin <jlar...@highlandtechnology.com>
wrote:
> On Tue, 28 May 2013 17:54:19 -0400, "P E Schoen" <p...@peschoen.com>

I've always thought there should be a gas tax. Maybe a buck or so...
(I supported Anderson for Prez. back in '80.)
I also think we need to make nuclear power cheaper.
Maybe some standard design?

George H.

>
>
> >Most people do not really need to be physically present at their places of
> >work, and their jobs could be done just as well by using the internet. And
> >it may even be argued that their jobs are largely unnecessary and could be
> >performed by automated machinery and robots. Employment is becoming obsolete
> >and people should accept a lifestyle where leisure time is much more than
> >work time, with 3 or 4 day work weeks and month-long vacations.
>
> Yes!! They can buy huge RVs and power boats and barbeque pits, and get
> on airplanes to exotic port cities where they board cruise ships. Not
> working uses more energy than working.
>
>
>
> >Many of our leisure activities use (waste) much more energy than necessary.
> >Rail transportation is much more efficient and it reduces traffic on the
> >roads and resultant log-jams, frustration, road rage, and "accidents" caused
> >by fatigue and aggressive and angry driving. And the phenomenon of
> >adrenaline rush and enjoyment of violent sports and electronic games are
> >disturbing symptoms of a lack of appreciation for relaxation and calm
> >connection to our natural world. We are also losing the concepts of manners,
> >politeness, cooperation, and face-to-face communication, which leads to
> >isolation, misunderstanding, and hatred.
>
> Working from home will help that?
>
> --
>
> John Larkin         Highland Technology, Inc
>

> jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot comhttp://www.highlandtechnology.com

>
> Precision electronic instrumentation
> Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
> Custom laser drivers and controllers
> Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links

> VME thermocouple, LVDT, synchro   acquisition and simulation- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

[John Larkin]

Fracking solves the energy problem for some hundreds of years. Methane
is cheap, clean, easy to transport, and it's mostly hydrogen. There's
lots of oil down there, too.

[Immortalist]

On May 24, 1:50 pm, RichD <r_delaney2...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> to delve their beliefs about basic science.  I've posted some here.
>
> So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
> "well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"
> "yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"
> "you suck it in, obviously!"
> "This sucking thing - is that like a pressure differential,
>   outside air pressure pushes it?"
> "No, air pressure isn't enough, you have tio PULL it!"
>
> They don't get it.  They sort of understand respiration -
> atmospheric pressure pushes air into your lungs - but
> that clearly doesn't explain the straw; water is too
> dense, air pressure can't push that!
>
> Similarly with a vacuum cleaner, the machine PULLS the air..
>
> It's an example of the First Law, the Law of Mind Boggle:
> if you can't  imagine something, it can't be true.
>
> Try it on your friends and business associates -
>
> --
> Rich

folk psychology - The common-sense conceptual framework that we, as
human beings, employ to understand, predict, and explain the behavior
of other humans and higher animals.

``... the rough-hewn set of concepts, generalizations, and rules of
thumb we all standardly use in explaining and predicting human
behavior''

``[folk psychology] is a theory whose generalizations connect mental
states to other mental states, to perceptions and to actions''

P S Churchland (1986)

Folk psychology is the psychological theory implicit in our everyday
ascriptions of beliefs (e.g. "he thinks that Bush is wise"), desires
(e.g. "he wants that piece of cake"), fears (e.g. "she's afraid of
terrorists"), hopes (e.g. "she hopes that he's on time today") etc.

People have developed this very useful and oftentimes strikingly
successful tool for predicting the behavior of other humans as well as
that of some "higher" animals (e.g. "usually, when you think that your
actions have been inappropriate, you try to figure out some way of
dealing with the situation that doesn't exacerbate the problem" or
"usually, when the dog thinks that there's someone at the door, it
starts barking").

Folk theories, i.e. theories that are based on common, everyday
experiences, but not subjected to rigorous experimental techniques,
underlie many (likely, all) of our actions. For instance, a fairly
sophisticated folk physics (the theory of the behavior of middle-
sized, common objects, such as tables, chairs and bowling balls) is
essential to our everyday interactions with the surrounding
environment. (Just think of all the assumptions you make about the
clothing you're currently wearing, e.g. that's it's not going to melt,
that it stays at a certain temperature range in standard conditions,
that it won't protect you from missiles, etc.) Similarly, folk
psychology is the basis for (all?) our social actions and judgements
about the psychology of others. It encompasses all of the assumptions
we make about the correlations between people's behavior, mental
states, and surrounding conditions.

Folk physics has been, to a large extent, discredited and shown to be
thoroughly inadequate in providing robust explanations of various
physical phenomena. This, of course, raises the question of how folk
psychology would fare in this respect.

Philosophers of mind take various attitudes toward the possibility of
vindicating/extending folk psychology by allowing its theoretical
terms (e.g. 'belief' 'desire' etc.) to play a role in serious
scientific theorizing. Among the advocates of such a possibility,
Jerry Fodor is surely the most notorious. For a locus classicus of the
defense of this view see his 1987 book "Psychosemantics". The other
extreme is exemplified by eliminative materialists, such as Paul and
Patricia Churchland and Stephen Stich. Stich's book, "From Folk
Psychology to Cognitive Science: The Case Against Belief" has received
much attention in this regard.

http://www.fact-index.com/f/fo/folk_psychology.html

Folk Psychology as a Theory

Many philosophers and cognitive scientists claim that our everyday or
"folk" understanding of mental states constitutes a theory of mind.
That theory is widely called "folk psychology" (sometimes
"commonsense" psychology). The terms in which folk psychology is
couched are the familiar ones of "belief" and "desire", "hunger",
"pain" and so forth. According to many theorists, folk psychology
plays a central role in our capacity to predict and explain the
behavior of ourselves and others. However, the nature and status of
folk psychology remains controversial.

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/folkpsych-theory/

Folk Psychology as Mental Simulation

The simulation (or, "mental simulation") theory maintains that human
beings are able to use the resources of their own minds to simulate
the psychological causes of the behavior of others, typically by
making decisions within a "pretend" context. The theory is usually,
though not always, taken to present a serious challenge to the
assumption that a theory underlies everyday human competence in
predicting and explaining behavior, including the capacity to ascribe
mental states to others. Unlike earlier controversies concerning the
role of empathetic understanding and historical reenactment in the
human sciences, the current debate between the simulation theory and
the "theory" theory appeals to empirical findings, particularly
experimental results concerning children's development of
psychological competence. These are detailed in what follows.

http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/folkpsych-simulation/

[benj]

On Tue, 28 May 2013 17:54:19 -0400, P E Schoen wrote:

<snip and ignore ancient Congress "hot air" joke. Yawn>

> We should tax the hell out of gasoline and diesel fuel, reflecting the
> true cost of extraction, refining, delivery, and environmental damage.
> This should include the costs of the wars in the Middle East, and the
> total costs of clean-up of oils spills and explosions. We really need
> something like a $2 to $5 tax on fuels, and not the piddling 10 cents or
> so per gallon that people are crying about.

Why is it that anyone born without a brain ends up as some socialist
spokesman or a "journalist" which is the same thing? Current fuel taxes
are about 55 cents and the rising fuel prices covers the cost of wars,
spills etc. Just WHO do you think pays for that shit? Idiot.

> Most people do not really need to be physically present at their places
> of work, and their jobs could be done just as well by using the
> internet. And it may even be argued that their jobs are largely
> unnecessary and could be performed by automated machinery and robots.
> Employment is becoming obsolete and people should accept a lifestyle
> where leisure time is much more than work time, with 3 or 4 day work
> weeks and month-long vacations.

More socialist fantasy heard 1000 times. So you think freedom should be a
thing of the past? Well lots of people agree with you. How about we slam
you in prison? You can do your job just fine from there. Not that I'm a
fan of work or anything, if you cut work weeks then you'll have to cut
your expectations to match. But then since everyone will be in prison
camps they won't need much anyway.

> Many of our leisure activities use (waste) much more energy than
> necessary. Rail transportation is much more efficient and it reduces
> traffic on the roads and resultant log-jams, frustration, road rage, and
> "accidents" caused by fatigue and aggressive and angry driving.

"Light rail" that communist daydream! Just wonderful. Just make everyone
go when and where you tell them to! And if you don't want them to go just
just shut down the train! You have such a fantasy world imagining
yourself as king, that you completely missed the FREEDOM that the
automobile gives people...or is that the idea...to take it away!

> And the
> phenomenon of adrenaline rush and enjoyment of violent sports and
> electronic games are disturbing symptoms of a lack of appreciation for
> relaxation and calm connection to our natural world. We are also losing
> the concepts of manners,
> politeness, cooperation, and face-to-face communication, which leads to
> isolation, misunderstanding, and hatred.

Paul like all members of the retarded left wing born brainless, you have
absolutely NO idea about any practical things in life. You are a total
moron. You could use some time on the "line" in some violent sports
yourself. Maybe it would pound some sense into that empty skull of yours?
So your idea is to put everyone in prison camps, working 3 days a week on
the INTERNET to "save" the world and then spend the other 4 days bitching
about nobody is polite anymore because they have no face to face
communications?

Thinking isn't something you do, is it? You make Treeb, Wormley or HVAC
look clever! No offense.

PS. In case you didn't get the memo, your "envy of the world" the USSR
crashed and burned some time ago under the weight of YOUR idiotic system
of government. Today only North Korea, Cuba and Democrats still think its
a workable system. And we aren't too sure about Cuba...

[benj]

On Tue, 28 May 2013 17:51:51 -0700, George Herold wrote:

> I've always thought there should be a gas tax. Maybe a buck or so...
> (I supported Anderson for Prez. back in '80.)
> I also think we need to make nuclear power cheaper.
> Maybe some standard design?

You mean in addition to the current half a buck? Since those in power can
set the price of gas at anything they like it's equivalent to a tax.

So how much did the rise from $2 to $4 curb fossil fuel use? Hint: none.

Sure nukes are great and a "standard design" is great too. Of course
that's what we have now. A "standard design" configured to produce
plutonium for bombs which is obviously far more important than public
safety. Think anyone will give that up soon?

[1treePetrifiedForestLane]

there is no soi-dissant fossilized fuel;
it is just a trade name from the biz,
based upon no plate tectonics etc.

there are many better designs than light-water-cooled,
some are modular.

all of the "waste" can be reproceesed for energy.

as for the putative dangers of radiation,
"hormesis."

[benj]

On Tue, 28 May 2013 19:40:47 -0700, 1treePetrifiedForestLane wrote:

> there is no soi-dissant fossilized fuel;
> it is just a trade name from the biz,
> based upon no plate tectonics etc.

soi-disant only has one "s" genius.

> there are many better designs than light-water-cooled,
> some are modular.

But they don't make bombs. That makes them not "better". You have to say
"better for what"!

> all of the "waste" can be reproceesed for energy.

Sure, but with no bomb grade material, reduction of dangerous radioactive
poisonous waste is a minus.

> as for the putative dangers of radiation,
> "hormesis."

Sure radiation is "good for you". Now where have I heard that before? Oh
yeah. It was our government telling us that crap! Given the Van Allen
belt "they" created with illegal nuclear testing, lets hope the Earth
responds to hormesis!

Actually the word, is "alchemy". Already progress in Russia.

[1treePetrifiedForestLane]

the Hanford Breeeder Reactor program was shut down
for environmentalist reasons; they didn't even care
about the possibility of getting plutonium
from the huge porportion of the ore that is not used
in lightwater reactors, the U-238, foolishly known
as "depleted uranium."

depleted uranium is completely harmless,
it's half-life is so long; at least, if you don't inhale or
ingest it; you'd get kidney failure, just like
with inhaling molybdenum.

yes, normal background radiation is a)
much more than that from ractors, and b)
very healthful, we know from the huge longitudinal studies.

hormesis, hormesis, hormesis!

[Greegor]

On May 26, 8:49 pm, "P E Schoen" <p...@peschoen.com> wrote:
> "Vladimir Vassilevsky"  wrote in message
>
> news:ds6dnYcVUpuSAD_M...@giganews.com...
>
> > On 5/26/2013 5:09 PM, Greegor wrote:
> >> Some school teachers get so much into
> >> considering the opinions of opponents
> >> that they urged US kids to try to see conflict
> >> from the Middle Eastern perspective.

> > May be you could explain that from any perspective.
> > I can't see much sense.
>
> This is a technique used by criminal profilers to "get into the minds" of
> sociopaths (as uncomfortable and revolting as that might be", in order to
> understand their motives from their perspective and be better able to guess
> their subsequent actions and hopefully apprehend them before further damage
> is done. There is some credible basis to the insults perceived by Middle
> Easterners and religious extremists. Although it does not justify their
> terrorism and killing of innocent people, their thought processes are so
> skewed that they consider themselves martyrs along with anyone else of their
> ilk who may become collateral damage.
>
> Paul

Public high school kids?

[Clifford Heath]

On 25/05/13 06:50, RichD wrote:
> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.

I like these two teasers for those who claim scientific literacy:

If the earth rotates only once per day, why are there two tides per day?

If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating in a lake, does the
lake's water level go up, down, or stay the same?

--
Clifford Heath

[Michael A. Terrell]

benj wrote:
>
> Paul like all members of the retarded left wing born brainless, you have
> absolutely NO idea about any practical things in life. You are a total
> moron. You could use some time on the "line" in some violent sports
> yourself. Maybe it would pound some sense into that empty skull of yours?
> So your idea is to put everyone in prison camps, working 3 days a week on
> the INTERNET to "save" the world and then spend the other 4 days bitching
> about nobody is polite anymore because they have no face to face
> communications?
>
> Thinking isn't something you do, is it? You make Treeb, Wormley or HVAC
> look clever! No offense.
>
> PS. In case you didn't get the memo, your "envy of the world" the USSR
> crashed and burned some time ago under the weight of YOUR idiotic system
> of government. Today only North Korea, Cuba and Democrats still think its
> a workable system. And we aren't too sure about Cuba...

Now you know why so many people kill filed him.

[Vladimir Vassilevsky]

On 5/29/2013 9:43 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:

> If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating in a lake, does the
> lake's water level go up, down, or stay the same?

How about piece of ice thrown overboard and then melt in water?
How about piece of salt thrown overboard and then dissolved in water?

[Clifford Heath]

On 25/05/13 06:50, RichD wrote:
> I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> to delve their beliefs about basic science. I've posted some here.

I like these two teasers for those who claim scientific literacy:

If the earth rotates only once per day, why are there two tides per day?

If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating in a lake, does the
lake's water level go up, down, or stay the same?

--
Clifford Heath

[benj]

<sticks fingers in ears>
La, La, LA, La, La, LA, La, La, LA,
I CAN"T HEAR YOU!

Truth hurts, doesn't it?

[bil...@microsoft.com]

That would depend is said thrower in the boat?

[Clifford Heath]

On 30/05/13 13:22, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:
> On 5/29/2013 9:43 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
>> If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating in a lake, does the
>> lake's water level go up, down, or stay the same?
> How about piece of ice thrown overboard and then melt in water?

That one's not hard.

> How about piece of salt thrown overboard and then dissolved in water?

Oooh, nice one.

I've no knowledge what effect dissolution has on the density of the
water, but I could look it up. I assume it becomes more dense, but by
what amount, I don't know that that is simple, and probably won't be the
same for all salts as they change from granular to ionic form, depending
on the ion size, shape and polarity. For example, I bet the answer is
different (in magnitude, if not in sign) for NaCl vs NaClO4.

Care to expound?

[Clifford Heath]

On 30/05/13 13:22, Vladimir Vassilevsky wrote:

> On 5/29/2013 9:43 PM, Clifford Heath wrote:
>> If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating in a lake, does the
>> lake's water level go up, down, or stay the same?
> How about piece of ice thrown overboard and then melt in water?

That one's not hard.

> How about piece of salt thrown overboard and then dissolved in water?

[bil...@microsoft.com]

well the question was not on density although the density would
increase. the question was would the water level go up. and the answer
to that is yes of course it would you are increeasing the mass. it
doesnt matter ifg it disolves or not you are still in creasi8ng the
mass.

[P E Schoen]

"benj" wrote in message news:UDApt.70876$pU6....@newsfe10.iad...

> <sticks fingers in ears>
> La, La, LA, La, La, LA, La, La, LA,
> I CAN"T HEAR YOU!

> Truth hurts, doesn't it?

Exactly. None so blind as one who will not hear, and it seems that you are a
prime example, although unlike Mike Terrell you apparently still read my
posts. This is why there is such dysfunction in government, from the
ever-more-far-right who "know they are right" even though their numbers are
dwindling and those that remain become increasingly deluded by listening
only to their own ilk.

I proposed some reasonable points, while you countered with some really
far-out paranoid delusions that characterize the mush-4-brains right whinger
Klan. You and their ilk subscribe to some sort of fantasy that it is the
right of free people in a free society to exploit commonly held resources
and cause harm to others, for their own short-term financial gain, personal
pleasure, and need to exert their "power" over others less fortunate or
simply more gentle and respectful to others and the environment.

Paul

[benj]

Rainbows and Unicorns! La la la! Your "envy of the world" scheme is a
PROVEN failure. PROVEN! Nobody even pretends it will work anymore. And
oddly (or not so oddly when it comes to lefty fantasy) you accuse me of
the very things you do yourself.

You simply are living in imaginary land without a clue as to what
actually can work and what cannot. As blind leading blind if anyone is so
ill advised as to take your fantasy seriously you ALL will end up in the
ditch, but that's OK because you are "sensitive" and "caring" and will
show your sympathy for the people you just led to their doom. Great.

You can join Sam, in the "our ignorance will destroy the world" club. The
destruction of civilization is nothing to be proud of and most certainly
will NOT help any others who are "less fortunate".

[P E Schoen]

"benj" wrote in message news:IFTpt.51406$KM4....@newsfe25.iad...

I don't even know how you can twist my words and spew such garbage as this
in response. You are obviously very angry and possibly sociopathetic (or
even truly sociopathic - which afflicts about 2% of the population and is
characterized by having no conscience and a totally selfish world view). You
should seriously seek help, although it is fairly well known that such
individuals are just "wired wrong" and do not respond to treatment. Sadly,
you probably have enough cunning to avoid actual criminal behavior and just
make life miserable for those who are under your sphere of influence.

You pounce upon any perceived inconvenience or challenge to your selfish and
egotistical mindset, calling foul an entire bouquet of flowers because you
found one that did not smell as sweet as your fantasy demands. I will repeat
my assertions to highlight your inappropriate and skewed reactions to what I
consider reasonable points of discussion, and hardly related in any real

sense to your confused and angry rhetoric. Here's what I said:

"We should tax the hell out of gasoline and diesel fuel, reflecting the true
cost of extraction, refining, delivery, and environmental damage. This
should include the costs of the wars in the Middle East, and the total costs
of clean-up of oils spills and explosions. We really need something like a
$2 to $5 tax on fuels, and not the piddling 10 cents or so per gallon that
people are crying about."

This is the norm in most other parts of the world and people are living
quite comfortably without the irresponsible waste of fossil fuels and the
harmful pollution caused by such unnecessary behavior.

"Most people do not really need to be physically present at their places of
work, and their jobs could be done just as well by using the internet. And
it may even be argued that their jobs are largely unnecessary and could be
performed by automated machinery and robots. Employment is becoming obsolete
and people should accept a lifestyle where leisure time is much more than
work time, with 3 or 4 day work weeks and month-long vacations."

So, do you really enjoy the cut-throat rat-race and stressful commutes and
long hours of work just to make a lot of money and spend it on frivolous
materialistic things and conspicuous consumption? Are you happy and at peace
with the world, and yourself? I think not...

"Many of our leisure activities use (waste) much more energy than necessary.
Rail transportation is much more efficient and it reduces traffic on the
roads and resultant log-jams, frustration, road rage, and "accidents" caused

by fatigue and aggressive and angry driving. And the phenomenon of

adrenaline rush and enjoyment of violent sports and electronic games are
disturbing symptoms of a lack of appreciation for relaxation and calm
connection to our natural world. We are also losing the concepts of manners,
politeness, cooperation, and face-to-face communication, which leads to
isolation, misunderstanding, and hatred."

So, what, exactly, do you find threatening or unpleasant in my observations
and suggestions? Are you so angry that you get vicarious pleasure from blood
sports and gory video games? Are you abusive toward animals, children,
women, and anyone "weaker" than you are? How is your sleep, and general
health? Can you relax, meditate, pray, or engage in polite discussion with
people who have views different from yours? Or do you attend hate rallies
and fuel your self-destructive anger with displays of threats and violence?
I sure don't want to be any part of your world.

Paul

[RichD]

On Friday, 2013 4:21:56 PM UTC-7, Frank wrote:
> I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter
> the evils of man made global warming or advantages
> of electric cars before she has even had a basic science course.

Book recommendation: "The Armchair Economist"
The best econ book ever written.
There's a chapter, "Why I'm not an environmentalist"
which will gratify you -

--
Rich

[RichD]

On May 28 benj wrote:
> >For those of us who work from home and use
> >DARPA's internet to communicate, the price of
> >gasoline is irrelevant.
>
> Personally I think there is consensus that
> internet usage is a main cause
> of anthropogenic global warming.

The big server farms - Google, Amazon, Netflix -
now consume 10% of electricity in USA. Isn't
that amazing?


--
Rich

[RichD]

On May 29Clifford Heath wrote:
> > I have these little quiz problems, intended for
> > Joe Sixpack, to delve their beliefs about basic
> > science. I've posted some here.
>
> I like these two teasers for those who claim
> scientific literacy:
> If the earth rotates only once per day, why are
> there two tides per day?

That's good, but hard; better yet, people can't
even explain ONE tide. That is, it ain't due
to the moon pulling the sea -

> If bricks are thrown overboard from a boat floating
> in a lake, does the lake's water level go up,
> down, or stay the same?

This can be tested, with a bath tub, plastic
bowl, and marbles. A nice home experiment,
if you have kids -

--
Rich

[Mahipal]

On Friday, May 24, 2013 9:45:52 PM UTC-4, benj wrote:
> On Fri, 24 May 2013 19:21:56 -0400, Frank wrote:
>
>
>
> > I like to compare with functional illiteracy which can be 20% in the US:
>
> >
>
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Functional_illiteracy
>
> >
>
> > Not sure what term would apply to knowledge of science but would think
>
> > scientific illiteracy would be considerably higher.
>
>
>
> Sure just look here at all the people who call everyone else "morons" but
>
> when cornered can't handle a simple high school science problem.

>
>
>
> > I get concerned when teachers teach my granddaughter the evils of man
>
> > made global warming or advantages of electric cars before she has even
>
> > had a basic science course.
>
>
>

> As well you should be concerned given that the schools are substituting
>
> politics and political propaganda for science. I'm sure you know that
>
> "education majors" are the bottom of the barrel in any college in spite
>
> of all the media adulation over how wonderful and dedicated and giving
>
> they all are. No greater admiration and praise in the media is ever found
>
> except when speaking of themselves!
>
>
>
> And physical science has always been a major mystery to school teachers
>
> and no wonder. Do they take physics like all the other majors have to?
>
> Nay. They get to take "physics appreciation" which is physics with all
>
> the math stripped out so some of them can pass! I remember when I was a
>
> kid in school wading through our stupid science book learning the names
>
> of flower parts and frog organs. I couldn't wait to get to the back of
>
> that book where the physical science stuff was. Well too bad! When we
>
> finally got there the teacher just skipped it all! At the time I didn't
>
> realize it was because none were competent to understand or teach it. I
>
> learned that later.
>
>
>
> So maybe there are Nobel prize winners in your town and maybe they are
>
> even civic minded enough to help with a few science classes. Well,
>
> fergeddaboutit. They are not ALLOWED to teach science because they aren't
>
> "qualified". They haven't been trained on HOW to teach and jumped through
>
> the bureaucratic hoops. But what if some government bureaucrat does his
>
> "duty" by showing up to thump the AGW bible and extol the benefits of
>
> ending civilization as we know it with a huge energy (euphemistically
>
> called "carbon") tax, well, no qualifications needed for brainwashing and
>
> indoctrination of children.
>
>
>
> So you might as well get it though your head now, your granddaughter is
>
> NEVER going to get a "science course" in a public school unless it's some
>
> huge big city school. And even then it's a throw of the dice.
>
>
>
> And why not? The problem is YOU! Pervert school administrators abuse
>
> children, scare them to death, and ruin their lives over nonsense like
>
> pointing a chicken leg and saying "bang" or eating a pop tart into a gun
>
> shape. They haul them off in handcuffs to meet Bubba in jail and give
>
> them records that make sure they spend their lives flipping burgers. And
>
> yet nobody speaks up for the children. Nobody says these perverts need to
>
> be not only FIRED but also sued and lose their houses RIGHT NOW! Nobody
>
> and that includes YOU ever says a peep.
>
>
>
> So until you stand up at a school board meeting and DEMAND thats these
>
> perverts be fired, then just shut up like a good little sheeple.

Great post! Love fergeddaboutit! I owe you a drink Ben.

-- Mahipal

[RichD]

On May 24 John Larkin wrote:
> >I have these little quiz problems, intended for
> >Joe Sixpack, to delve their beliefs about basic science.

> >So, "drinking through a straw, how does that work?"
> >"well, you suck in the liquid, duh!"

> >"yeah, but what makes the liquid go up the straw?"

>
> >It's an example of the First Law, the Law of
> >Mind Boggle: if you can't imagine something,
> >it can't be true.
>

> Different people have different talents. Maybe
> Joe Sixpack (as you contemptuously refer to him)
> can frame a window or track a deer or steer a
> sailboat a lot better than you can.

Of course.

But still, it's a question of interest, and some import:
what does the public know of the universe wherein
they reside?

There are wide social and political ramifications.
And beyond that, philosophical issues; what does it
mean to be human, what's the purpose, etc?

I mean, most folks show minimal curiosity re nature
and her rules. Even concerning their own bodies, they're
uncurious, except when something malfunctions; "I don't
know anatomy, I didn't go to medical school!"

This attitude is alien to me. To be human, for me,
means developing the uniquely human talents, both
mind and body. "Be all that you can be" as the old
army advert goes - but if you're blind to the wonder
that surrounds us, you're the frog who spends his
entire life at the bottom of a well -

Some might argue that the purpose of life is to
find happiness, whatever gets you through the night.
I dunno, a pig in a sty might be happy, but he isn't human -

> I bet you didn't figure out the straw suction thing
> yourself.

You lose.

> Do you design electronics?

Maybe.
Do you often ask non-sequiturial questions?


--
Rich

[RichD]

On May 24, John Larkin wrote:
> >I have these little quiz problems, intended for Joe Sixpack,
> >to delve their beliefs about basic science.
>

> I bet you didn't figure out the straw suction thing yourself.

Another one occurred to me:

Shoot a bullet straight up. The earth spins at 1000
mph (at the equator) (adjust for latitude). Where
does the bullet land?

Someone might remark about air resistance effects.
ok, 2 questions then: with atmosphere, and in vacuum.

I haven't tried it yet.

--
Rich