What is it with the iron ?
Manky badger
there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
MB
slenon
>there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
>MB
There is no "actual science" related to any of Tommy Hennessey's anti-iron
cut and paste activities or semi-literate verbal droolings. There is only
psychosis manifesting in his demonization of iron combined with his
misunderstanding of his own religion dovetailing into his full-blown
paranoid-scizhophrenia playing out before your eyes. Since you happened to
ask the question, it is now your duty to poke him and torment him until they
come to carry him off to EST again. You will have to poke him sharply and
repeatedly. Ask him for credentials. That is always a good place to begin.
--
Stev
Still dancing in the Phil Zone & scattering Garcia ashes
Stev Lenon MT(ASCP) - In healthcare the ultimate bottom line is patients not
profit
Save a cow, eat a PETA member
sle...@tampabay.rr.com
http://web.tampabay.rr.com/stevglo/index.html/slhomepage92kword.htm
doe
>From: "Manky badger" m...@nospam.puritan.freeserve.co.uk
>Date: 12/13/2002 3:33 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <atdn9c$t0d$1...@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk>
>
>I've been trying to find out what the iron related threads are about. Is
>there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
The question .. how does iron relate to tuberculosis was answered .. the rest
was .. it looks like .. trolls ..
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus was a vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Jesus was a vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman
Moses was a mystic! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman/light.html
doe
>From: "slenon" sle...@tampabay.rr.com
>Date: 12/13/2002 3:55 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <_ztK9.377230$fa.73...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
>
>There is no "actual science" related to any of Tommy Hennessey's anti-iron
>cut and paste activities or semi-literate verbal droolings.
What did you say you majored .. in .. ?
Crit Rev Oncol Hematol 2002 Jun;42(3):267-81
Iron chelators as therapeutic agents for the treatment of cancer.
Richardson DR
The Iron Metabolism and Chelation Group, The Heart Research Institute, 145
Missenden Road, Camperdown, 2050, Sydney, NSW, Australia
[Medline record in process]
A wide variety of studies in vitro, in vivo, and in clinical trials have
demonstrated that the chelator currently used to treat iron overload disease,
desferrioxamine, has anti-proliferative effects against both leukemia and
neuroblastoma. However, the efficacy of desferrioxamine is severely limited due
to its poor ability to permeate cell membranes and chelate intracellular iron
pools. These studies have led to the development of other iron chelators that
are far more effective than desferrioxamine. Some of these chelators such as
3-aminopyridine-2-carboxaldehyde thiosemicarbazone (Triapine(R)) have entered
phase I clinical trials, while other chelators such as
2-hydroxy-1-naphthylaldehyde isonicotinoyl hydrazone or tachpyridine require
evaluation in animal models. The high anti-tumor activity observed with these
ligands certainly suggests further development of chelators as anti-cancer
agents is warranted.
PMID: 12050019, UI: 22045182
Manky badger
"slenon" <sle...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:_ztK9.377230$fa.73...@twister.tampabay.rr.com...
> >I've been trying to find out what the iron related threads are about. Is
> >there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
> >MB
>
> There is no "actual science" related to any of Tommy Hennessey's anti-iron
> cut and paste activities or semi-literate verbal droolings. There is only
> psychosis manifesting in his demonization of iron combined with his
> misunderstanding of his own religion dovetailing into his full-blown
> paranoid-scizhophrenia playing out before your eyes. Since you happened
to
> ask the question, it is now your duty to poke him and torment him until
they
> come to carry him off to EST again. You will have to poke him sharply and
> repeatedly. Ask him for credentials. That is always a good place to
begin.
Name calling, then ?
MB
Michael
"Manky badger" <m...@nospam.puritan.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:atdn9c$t0d$1...@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
> I've been trying to find out what the iron related threads are about. Is
> there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
<crowd chants, "pick door number TWO!">
((U))
M
slenon
>MB
If you shell out good time and money to attend an educational event, and
some escapee from a mental facility walks in and attempts to hijack the
meeting, the appropriate response is to call the authorities and have him
removed and returned to which ever facility was careless enough to let him
escape.
In this case, the appropriate response is to complain loudly and frequently
to Tommy's ISP's until they boot him for open statements of anti-Semitism,
Gay bashing, and frequent threats of violence directed toward people who
have the temerity to tell him he is an uneducated, semi-illiterate
psychotic. Many of us make a habit of such complaints in the vain hope that
we can temporarily rid the usegroups of this plague.
Along the way, many of us also try to make sure that even the most unlearned
persons on the usegroups will not take his advice seriously. He has a
history of offering what he considers medical advice to others who might be
swayed by the journal extracts he cuts and pastes but fails to understand.
So when he appears, we hit him. Please feel free to join in and complain to
his ISP.
doe
>Message-id: <pxGK9.381515$fa.75...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
>
>If you shell out good time and money to attend an educational event, and
>some escapee from a mental facility walks in and attempts to hijack the
>meeting,
I started the thread .. noone invited you ..
>to Tommy's ISP's until they boot him for open statements of anti-Semitism,
Yeh .. right ..
Only to Jewish people who attempt to PUSH their Jewish shite in my face ..
>Gay bashing,
Only to limp wrists who .. get in my face ..
>and frequent threats of violence directed toward people who
>have the temerity to tell him he is an uneducated, semi-illiterate
>psychotic.
Only to self-proclaimed psychiatrists ..
> He has a
>history of offering what he considers medical advice to others who might be
>swayed by the journal extracts he cuts and pastes but fails to understand.
Yeah .. right .. reversing cirrhosis , cancer , hepatitis ..
What have YOU 'contributed' .. ?
" Stay away from blood donor clinics .. they make you anemic .."
I was recommending iron deprivation seven years ago when YOUR 'types' were
telling the parents to .. " measure the kid for a casket .."
>
>So when he appears, we hit him. Please feel free to join in and complain to
>his ISP.
I tell you what .. Steve .. keep posting personal attacks and off topic remarks
and we'll just SEE who people begin to complain about .. eh ..
Not everyone is as stupid as you ..
Now .. read .. my .. lips ..
I think you know what I mean .. eh .. Steve ..
Hit .. it ..
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
http://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/439591_1
Cross-Talk Between Iron Metabolism and Diabetes
from Diabetes
Posted 08/29/2002
José Manuel Fernández-Real, Abel López-Bermejo, and Wifredo Ricart
Abstract and Introduction
Abstract
Emerging scientific evidence has disclosed unsuspected influences between iron
metabolism and type 2 diabetes. The relationship is bi-directional—iron
affects glucose metabolism, and glucose metabolism impinges on several iron
metabolic pathways. Oxidative stress and inflammatory cytokines influence these
relationships, amplifying and potentiating the initiated events.
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
<<snip>>
follow-up biopsies confirmed regression of cirrhosis
<<snip>>
Ann Intern Med 2002 May 7;136(9):667-72
Reversibility of cirrhosis in patients cured of thalassemia by bone marrow
transplantation.
Muretto P, Angelucci E, Lucarelli G
Unita Operativa di Anatomia Patologica, Azienda Ospedaliera San Salvatore di
Pesaro, 6110 Pesaro, Italy. p.mu...@ospedalesansalvatore.it
BACKGROUND: Cirrhosis is a well-known complication of thalassemia major. In
this context, it is a consequence of iron overload and hepatitis C virus
infection and generally seems to be irreversible. OBJECTIVE: To determine
whether cirrhosis in thalassemia major can be reversible. DESIGN: Retrospective
study. SETTING: Bone Marrow Transplantation Unit and Pathology Service, Pesaro
Hospital, Pesaro, Italy. PATIENTS: 6 patients who developed liver cirrhosis
before or after their thalassemia was cured by bone marrow transplantation (age
at transplantation, 11 to 25 years). After diagnosis of cirrhosis, the patients
received iron depletion and antiviral therapies. MEASUREMENTS: Each liver
biopsy specimen was coded. A liver pathologist and a member of the
transplantation center with expertise in hepatopathology graded the specimens
by using the Ishak staging and grading systems. Neither knew the patient's
identity or the sequence of biopsy with regard to the time of treatment.
RESULTS: After the patients received iron depletion and antiviral therapies,
liver biopsy specimens showed impressive reduction in liver iron stores. In 4
patients, iron removal was complete. Serum aminotransferase levels decreased in
all patients and normalized in 5; histologic inflammatory activity decreased in
all patients and disappeared in 2. Follow-up biopsies showed regression of
incomplete or definite cirrhosis in all patients; 3 patients had presented with
portal fibrosis without bridging, and the others had portal fibrosis and
portal-to-portal bridging. Several biopsies and the presence of many portal
spaces confirmed the diagnosis of cirrhosis; follow-up biopsies confirmed
regression of cirrhosis. CONCLUSION: In some patients in whom bone marrow
transplantation has cured thalassemia, cirrhosis may be reversible after iron
removal treatment.
PMID: 11992302, UI: 21987737
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
http://www-east.elsevier.com/ajg/issues/9701/ajg5390edi.htm
<<snip>>
The authors concluded that long term maintenance of iron depletion by
therapeutic phlebotomy prevents progression of fibrosis in CHC. They suggest
that chronic iron reduction is a good alternative to interferon in treatment of
CHC / chronic hepatitis C.
<<snip>>
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
<<snip>>
CONCLUSIONS: These results reflect the insulin-sparing effect of iron depletion
and indicate a key role of iron and hyperinsulinemia in the pathogenesis of
NAFLD.
<<snip>>
1: Gastroenterology 2002 Apr;122(4):931-9 Related Articles, Links
Effect of iron depletion in carbohydrate-intolerant patients with clinical
evidence of nonalcoholic fatty liver disease.
Facchini FS, Hua NW, Stoohs RA.
Department of Medicine, University of California San Francisco and San
Francisco General Hospital, San Francisco, California, USA. ffac...@ecnea.org
BACKGROUND & AIMS: Increased body iron, genetic hemochromatosis (GH) mutations,
and nonalcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD) tend to cluster in
carbohydrate-intolerant patients. In an attempt to further clarify the
interrelationships among these conditions, we studied 42
carbohydrate-intolerant patients who were free of the common GH mutations C282Y
and H63D, and had a serum iron saturation lower than 50%. METHODS: We measured
body iron stores, and induced iron depletion to a level of near-iron deficiency
(NID) by quantitative phlebotomy. RESULTS: In the 17 patients with clinical
evidence of NAFLD, we could not demonstrate supranormal levels of body iron
(1.6 +/- 0.2 vs. 1.4 +/- 0.2 g; P = 0.06). However, at NID, there was a 40%-55%
improvement (P = 0.05-0.0001) of both fasting and glucose-stimulated plasma
insulin concentrations, and near-normalization of serum alanine
aminotransferase activity (from 61 +/- 5 to 32 +/- 2 IU/L; P < 0.001).
CONCLUSIONS: These results reflect the insulin-sparing effect of iron depletion
and indicate a key role of iron and hyperinsulinemia in the pathogenesis of
NAFLD.
PMID: 11910345 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
slenon
>I started the thread .. noone invited you ..
May I remind you, pathetic little psychotic, that you are posting to a
public professional newsgroup dedicated to the profession my colleagues and
I practice after long years of prelimary science and biological education
followed by many more years of continuing education. The key word, here,
education; not cutting and pasting articles that have keywords which mesh
with your mania, but which you lack the native intelligence and ability to
understand.
So, if you don't want to be insulted and abused for your unwanted presence,
don't display your ignorance and schizophrenia for all of us to see.
Take your medicines, report for your next EST session and maybe, just maybe,
you'll get a lump of iron magically delivered. But it won't be from any of
us. I doubt anyone from my profession would walk across the room to douse
you with urine if you burst into flames.
doe
>Date: 12/14/2002 11:54 AM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <M7LK9.43952$Db4.1...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
>
>Tommy:
>>I started the thread .. noone invited you ..
>
>May I remind you, pathetic little psychotic, that you are posting to a
>public professional newsgroup dedicated to the profession my colleagues
So .. KEEP IT ON TOPIC .. ya friggin goof ..
NOONE needs to hear how you bow down to Mecca ..
>So, if you don't want to be insulted and abused for your unwanted presence,
>don't display your ignorance and schizophrenia for all of us to see.
I tell you what .. I repeat .. KEEP UP YOUR PERSONAL OFF TOPIC .. attacks ..
You are just a goof .. always will be a goof .. and will most likely die a goof
..
We'll make sure we don't embalm ya ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
news:20021214131144...@mb-ba.aol.com...
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "slenon" sle...@tampabay.rr.com
> >Date: 12/14/2002 6:40 AM Mountain Standard Time
> >Message-id: <pxGK9.381515$fa.75...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
> >
>
> >If you shell out good time and money to attend an educational event, and
> >some escapee from a mental facility walks in and attempts to hijack the
> >meeting,
>
> I started the thread .. noone invited you ..
Idiot.
The existence of a "thread" depends on participation by more than just the
original poster. Open invitation to reply is implied by posting anything
at all to a newsgroup.
> >to Tommy's ISP's until they boot him for open statements of
anti-Semitism,
>
> Yeh .. right ..
> Only to Jewish people who attempt to PUSH their Jewish shite in my face ..
Are you going to stop pushing your "Christian" shite in everyone else's
face?
Until you do, complaining about anyone else's religion or spiritual beliefs
is nothing but hypocritical bigotry.
> >Gay bashing,
>
> Only to limp wrists who .. get in my face ..
What about masculine, virile, heterosexual Christians who get in your face?
> >and frequent threats of violence directed toward people who
> >have the temerity to tell him he is an uneducated, semi-illiterate
> >psychotic.
>
> Only to self-proclaimed psychiatrists ..
Tom, your disordered mind is obvious to professional and amateur alike.
*You* seem to be the only one unable to recognize it.
> > He has a
> >history of offering what he considers medical advice to others who might
be
> >swayed by the journal extracts he cuts and pastes but fails to
understand.
>
> Yeah .. right .. reversing cirrhosis , cancer , hepatitis ..
> What have YOU 'contributed' .. ?
> " Stay away from blood donor clinics .. they make you anemic .."
>
> I was recommending iron deprivation seven years ago when YOUR 'types' were
> telling the parents to .. " measure the kid for a casket .."
"Recommending iron deprivation"??? Don't be so modest, Tom.
I thought you were a beacon of enlightenment, convincing a whole team of
Japanese doctors that they could cure MS with plasmapheresis and guiding
them through just such a cure in a 7-year old child.
> >So when he appears, we hit him. Please feel free to join in and complain
to
> >his ISP.
>
> I tell you what .. Steve .. keep posting personal attacks and off topic
remarks
> and we'll just SEE who people begin to complain about .. eh ..
>
> Not everyone is as stupid as you ..
>
> Now .. read .. my .. lips ..
>
> I think you know what I mean .. eh .. Steve ..
>
> Hit .. it ..
Once *again* you exhibit nothing but hatred, paranoia, bluster, and
dull-witted incomprehension.
When are you ever going to find yourself a decent team of mental health
professionals and ask them for treatment?
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know what you're
talking about. "
- John von Neumann
doe
>The existence of a "thread" depends on participation by more than just the
>original poster. Open invitation to reply is implied by posting anything
>at all to a newsgroup.
ON TOPIC ...ON TOPIC .. is there something you don't .. understand about that
..?
Let's see .. let's try this .. O..N ....T..O..P..I..C ..
Spelled for ya ..
>
>Are you going to stop pushing your "Christian" shite in everyone else's
>face?
Look you little .. puke .. and I think I am insulting puke by contrasting you
to it ..
I don't mention religion in any of my threads ..
You got a problem with my sig .. ?
FY .. eat .. me .. hit .. it .. Fo .. take your friggin pick ..
>
>Until you do, complaining about anyone else's religion or spiritual beliefs
>is nothing but hypocritical bigotry.
See above .. I repeat .. FY .. eat .. me .. hit .. it .. Fo ..
>
>
>> >Gay bashing,
>>
>> Only to limp wrists who .. get in my face ..
>
>What about masculine, virile, heterosexual Christians who get in your face?
I suppose I will have to discuss that with them when I find one ..
doe
>>Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
EXPERIMENTAL BIOLOGY UPDATE: Arthritic kids' iron supplements may hasten joint
deterioration
By Diana Swift
WWASHINGTON, D.C. - The iron supplements that many arthritic children take to
combat concomitant anemia may be hastening the deterioration of their joints,
Houston researchers say.
Led by biologist Roman Shypailo of the Children's Nutrition Research Centre at
Baylor College of Medicine, a Texas team looked at eight children being treated
for juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. The patients, aged five to 15 years,
received an intravenous radioactive tracer dose of iron (0.03 microsievert).
Iron activity in affected joints was monitored on a position/energy-sensitive
gamma counter, while a second machine monitored whole-body iron retention. Iron
deposition was measured two hours post-infusion and again at days seven, 14, 28
and 56.
Anemic
"We found that iron excessively accumulates in arthritic joints and probably
contributes to the chronic damage," said Shypailo. "That puts you between a
rock and a hard place because many of these arthritic kids are anemic and need
iron supplements, which may worsen the disease."
The study found a high level of agreement between the joint data and the
whole-body data, with a greater than 90% retention rate of the infused iron
both in joints and systemically. Furthermore, six of eight patients showed
increased uptake at the affected joints: 165% over the first 30 days compared
with initial uptake at two hours.
The next step, he says, is to see if there is excessive deposition of dietary
iron in arthritic joints.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
------
Mike & Heather Collins
anti -iron blinkers. A lot of the stuff you cut and paste concerns diabetes.
Type 2 diabetes is basically caused by overeating carbohydrates. One way to
avoid this is to eat the kind of diet we subsisted on before agriculture was
introduced - game, fish, fruit, vegetables, pulses, very little grain.
Of course it's very difficult but not impossible to thrive on this diet
without eating meat or fish.
The percentage of vegetarians in the British population - much higher
percentage than the USA or Canada - is falling at present partly because
some vegetarians find it impossible to eat high protein, low carbohydrate
diets without meat or fish.
Another large fraction of your pasted abstracts concern iron in bacteria.
This is merely stating that iron is essential for life in bacteria as well
as mammals.
Finally try reading your own posts. There are many signs of the internet
crank. Some of the relevant thing to avoid if you want to be taken seriously
are: use of capitals for emphasis, repeated punctuation mark (usually
exclamation marks but you have a different obsession), racial and religious
intolerance, believing your own feeble responses are crushing evidence,
deriding the qualifications of others whilst not revealing your own.
--
Mike Collins
UK
God loves carnivores. He demanded animal sacrifice and punished Adam and Eve
for eating fruit.
( No I don't believe this but unlike your sig. it could be supported by
Bible quotes.)
doe
>Date: 12/14/2002 3:43 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <atgbjo$mf0$1...@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>
>
>Why don't you try looking at the world without your vegetarian and
>anti -iron blinkers. A lot of the stuff you cut and paste concerns diabetes.
>Type 2 diabetes is basically caused by overeating carbohydrates.
It is caused by eating carbohydrates which are not assimilated DUE TO the
increased iron levels in the body.
>One way to
>avoid this is to eat the kind of diet we subsisted on before agriculture was
>introduced - game, fish, fruit, vegetables, pulses, very little grain.
ONLY because we cannot assimilate it DUE TO the increased iron from the meat.
>Of course it's very difficult but not impossible to thrive on this diet
>without eating meat or fish.
>The percentage of vegetarians in the British population - much higher
>percentage than the USA or Canada - is falling at present partly because
>some vegetarians find it impossible to eat high protein, low carbohydrate
>diets without meat or fish.
I'm not sure whether or not one has to look very far to get the 27 grams of
protein a person needs. That is one ounce ..
>
>Another large fraction of your pasted abstracts concern iron in bacteria.
>This is merely stating that iron is essential for life in bacteria as well
>as mammals.
And your point is .. ?
Bacteria do not cause disease?
>
>Finally try reading your own posts. There are many signs of the internet
>crank. Some of the relevant thing to avoid if you want to be taken seriously
>are: use of capitals for emphasis, repeated punctuation mark (usually
>exclamation marks but you have a
>different obsession), racial and religious
>intolerance,
You will notice the barbs are only leveled at those who BRING THEIR RELIGIOUS
BELIEFS AND RACIAL AND SEXUAL PREFERENCES into a medical ng.
>believing your own feeble responses are >crushing evidence,
>deriding the qualifications of others whilst not revealing your own.
This is a medical ng .. and I post relevant medical material ..
And you respond with this type of 'observation' ..
YOU are just a rubber necker .. watching from your car at an accident .. and
showing disgust at what you see ..
So .. read .. my .. lips ..
And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER ..
and my proof is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and that .. is ALL THAT
FRIGGIN MATTERS on this medical newsgroup.
So .. and your mother dresses you funny ..
ALWAYS a .. hidden agenda .. eh .. this one must be a 'Bible thumper' .. eh ..
>God loves carnivores. He demanded animal sacrifice and punished Adam and Eve
>for eating fruit.
>( No I don't believe this but unlike your sig. it could be supported by
>Bible quotes.)
Who loves ya.
doe
>>Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
http://www.waste.org/~lanshark/vegan/iron.html
Mike & Heather Collins
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Mike & Heather Collins" mikehe...@oakwellmount.freeserve.co.uk
> >Date: 12/14/2002 3:43 PM Mountain Standard Time
> >Message-id: <atgbjo$mf0$1...@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk>
> >
> >Why don't you try looking at the world without your vegetarian and
> >anti -iron blinkers. A lot of the stuff you cut and paste concerns
diabetes.
> >Type 2 diabetes is basically caused by overeating carbohydrates.
>
> It is caused by eating carbohydrates which are not assimilated DUE TO the
> increased iron levels in the body.
>
You seem to forget that there are vegan and vegetarian type2 diabetics.
> I'm not sure whether or not one has to look very far to get the 27 grams
of
> protein a person needs. That is one ounce ..
>
> >
> >Another large fraction of your pasted abstracts concern iron in bacteria.
> >This is merely stating that iron is essential for life in bacteria as
well
> >as mammals.
>
> And your point is .. ?
> Bacteria do not cause disease?
>
My point is that iron is essential to life. Excess iron is toxic to humans,
so is excess oxygen. But both are essential.
> >Finally try reading your own posts. There are many signs of the internet
> >crank. Some of the relevant thing to avoid if you want to be taken
seriously
> >are: use of capitals for emphasis, repeated punctuation mark (usually
> >exclamation marks but you have a
> >different obsession), racial and religious
> >intolerance,
>
> You will notice the barbs are only leveled at those who BRING THEIR
RELIGIOUS
> BELIEFS AND RACIAL AND SEXUAL PREFERENCES into a medical ng.
>
>
> >believing your own feeble responses are >crushing evidence,
> >deriding the qualifications of others whilst not revealing your own.
>
> This is a medical ng .. and I post relevant medical material ..
>
> And you respond with this type of 'observation' ..
>
> YOU are just a rubber necker .. watching from your car at an accident ..
and
> showing disgust at what you see ..
>
> So .. read .. my .. lips ..
>
> And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER ..
>
> and my proof is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and that .. is ALL THAT
> FRIGGIN MATTERS on this medical newsgroup.
Including schizophrenia? Stev was right, you should keep taking the tablets.
>
> So .. and your mother dresses you funny ..
>
> ALWAYS a .. hidden agenda .. eh .. this one must be a 'Bible thumper' ..
eh ..
>
> >God loves carnivores. He demanded animal sacrifice and punished Adam and
Eve
> >for eating fruit.
> >( No I don't believe this but unlike your sig. it could be supported by
> >Bible quotes.)
Sigh!
--
Mike Collins
UK
Mikech...@oakwellmount.freeserve.co.uk
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
news:20021214180459...@mb-fo.aol.com...
>
>
> and my proof is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and that .. is ALL THAT
> FRIGGIN MATTERS on this medical newsgroup.
If it's all right with you, Tom.. I'm archiving this line to use against you
in the future. Fair warning.
There's only one single item on the entire web which contains both the
phrase "Tom Hennessy" and the phrase "Nobel Prize".
It's a rambling, blithering post that you made in 1996 to an Alzheimer's
Disease mailing list, about Linus Pauling and antioxidants. (see below)
Would you please cite the work that earned you your prize, and tell us when
and in which discipline you were working at such a level of competence, Tom?
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"When I took the stand the court went sort of crazy and my lawyer..
said to me .. 'you DIDN'T lie to the officer outside court DID you..?'
And I said .. 'yes.. because I believe there is a question of
identification.'"
- Tom Hennessy (aka "doe" aka "watchman")
-------------------------------------------
a.. To: alzh...@wubios.wustl.edu
b.. Subject: Re: [ALZ] RE>antioxidants>free radicals aren't all that bad
c.. From: Tom Hennessy <watc...@nucleus.com>
d.. Date: Fri, 5 Jan 1996 12:57:49 -0700 (MST)
e.. cc: bro...@clavicula.mednet.gu.se
f.. In-Reply-To: <CC47...@CCMail.UCSD.Edu>
g.. Reply-To: alzheimer
h.. Sender: owner-a...@wubios.wustl.edu
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
----
> To my knowledge, vitamin E supplementation has NEVER been
> shown to have any beneficial effect in HUMAN neurologic
> disease, other than (rare), true vitamin E deficiency
> higher levels of this anti-oxidant were more likely to have
> metastatic cancer at initial diagnosis.
>
So finally we get it? Linus Pauling was 'poisoning' us all along?
[MAJOR proponent of megadoses of antioxidents]
NOW .. we KNOW.. why HE.. is dead?
Just a 'Nobel Prize Winner'.. who was ... wrong?
Still .. no answer .. to WHY .. so many of our .. 'drugs'.. contain ..
antioxidents?
Filler?
Coincidence?
I beg to differ. In this forum I thought we are trying to 'promote'..
knowledge?
I have checked Medline... and if I could just download.. there would be
more here I tell you.
What I have typed up is as follows :
We now report that exposure of cultivated rat hippocampal neurons to A
beta 1-40 or A beta 25-35 causes a selective reduction in Na+/K(+)-ATPase
activity and cell degeneration.
The antioxident free radical scavengers Vitamin E and propylgaleate
significantly reduced A beta-induced impairment of Na+/K(+)-ATPase activity.
Vitamin E protects nerve cells from Amyloid Beta Protein Activity.
The antioxident and free radical scavenger Vitamin E inhibits ABP induced
cell death.
These results have implications regarding the prevention and
treatment of Alzheimers.
Glutanate toxicity , which destroys Periventricular white matter , could
be prevented by exposure to different free radical scavengers Vitamin E
and idebenone.
Nuff said :)
Who loves ya.
Tom http://www.nucleus.com/watchman
doe
>Date: 12/14/2002 4:49 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <atgg3...@enews4.newsguy.com>
>
>
>"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
>news:20021214180459...@mb-fo.aol.com...
>>
>> And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER ..
>>
>> and my proof is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and that .. is ALL THAT
>> FRIGGIN MATTERS on this medical newsgroup.
>
>If it's all right with you, Tom.. I'm archiving this line to use against you
>in the future. Fair warning.
>
Use it .. ya freak .. 'whatever' way you like ..
>It's a rambling, blithering post that you made in 1996 to an Alzheimer's
>Disease mailing list, about Linus Pauling and antioxidants. (see below)
>
Yeh .. ya idiot .. alzheimers .. EIGHT years ago ..
Tell me iron chelators aren't being used to treat the oxidation in the brain ..
>Would you please cite the work that earned you your prize, and tell us when
>and in which discipline you were working at such a level of competence, Tom?
You just .. 'don't get it' .. do ya ..
My credentials are . . every medical article I post ..
And if THAT doesn't make me a NOBEL PRIZE WINNER .. I don't know what would ..
Reversing cancer .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F .. U ..
Reversing diabetes .. recommended for 40% of type II diabetics . you got
anything to match that ? Then S .. T .. F .. U ..
Reversing cirrhosis .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F .. U ..
You have any credentials .. ?
You bring any medical articles which refute the reversal of all of the above ..
?
THEN S .. T .. F .. U ..
You just make yourself look stupid ..
I can handle it .. you .. might have a hissy-fit ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
>
> >Would you please cite the work that earned you your prize, and tell us
when
> >and in which discipline you were working at such a level of competence,
Tom?
>
> You just .. 'don't get it' .. do ya ..
>
> My credentials are . . every medical article I post ..
>
> And if THAT doesn't make me a NOBEL PRIZE WINNER .. I don't know what
would ..
Ahhh. I see.
You qualify for a Nobel prize by parroting research abstracts you don't even
understand... all without contributing a single original thought of your
own. Is this actually the gist of your claim to the prize?
You don't know how (or why) Nobels are awarded any more than you know how to
conduct research, obviously.
> Reversing cancer .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F .. U
..
>
> Reversing diabetes .. recommended for 40% of type II diabetics . you got
> anything to match that ? Then S .. T .. F .. U ..
>
> Reversing cirrhosis .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F ..
U ..
As a matter of fact, I don't have anything of the sort... and neither do
you.
> You have any credentials .. ?
> You bring any medical articles which refute the reversal of all of the
above ..
> ?
Credentials and scavenged "medical articles" (or whatever name you choose to
give to summary abstracts) are two very different things.
My credentials are simply that I understand what I read and that I have an
excellent crap detector. You have no claim to either of these things, and
everyone who's read your output and thought about it for even a moment knows
it. Your displays of abusive attitude when you're questioned serve only to
make you less and less credible with every word you utter.
I've never written a medical article. Have you?
> THEN S .. T .. F .. U ..
>
> You just make yourself look stupid ..
>
> I can handle it .. you .. might have a hissy-fit ..
Cool as a cuke, Tom. You don't even annoy me. You just interfere with
daily life a little bit by being so persistent with this foolishness.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A
FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER .. and my proof
is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and
that .. is ALL THAT FRIGGIN MATTERS on this
medical newsgroup."
- Tom Hennessy ("doe"), Calgary, Canada. 14 Dec/2002
Message-ID: <0021214180459....@mb-fo.aol.com>
doe
>> Reversing cancer .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F .. U
>..
>>
>> Reversing diabetes .. recommended for 40% of type II diabetics . you got
>> anything to match that ? Then S .. T .. F .. U ..
>>
>> Reversing cirrhosis .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F ..
>U ..
>
>As a matter of fact, I don't have anything of the sort... and neither do
>you.
>
Well .. what part of S.. T .. F .. U .. don't you understand .. ?
Is it the .. S .. the .. T .. the F .. the U .. ?
>> You have any credentials .. ?
>> You bring any medical articles which refute the reversal of all of the
>above ..
I take it by your nonanswer you got NOTHING ..
Then stay off the thread ..
Because simply it is about IRON which you admittingly KNOW FA .. about ..
I'll spell it for ya .. because .. I don't recall ever doing that for ya .. I
.. R .. O .. N ..
Hit it .. I .. KNOW you know what that is .. because I .. HAVE .. spelled it
for ya .. before ..
doe
http://news.excite.com/news/r/010928/18/health-iron
Iron Imbalance in Brain May Cause Migraine
Updated: Fri, Sep 28 6:22 PM EDT
By Will Boggs, MD
NEW YORK (Reuters Health) - Abnormalities in the way the brain's pain
control center handles iron may lead to the development of migraine
attacks and headaches, according to a study by Kansas researchers.
During migraine, a portion of the brain known as the periaqueductal
gray matter (PAG) may fail to "switch on" to prevent pain, Dr. K.
Michael Welch of the University of Kansas Medical Center in Kansas
City told Reuters Health.
"In migraine, a trigger such as stress activates the PAG but it does
not switch on because it is dysfunctional," he explained, "or else
switches on an abnormal part."
The result? "Pain instead of no pain," according to Welch.
His team studied levels of iron in the PAG of patients with either
migraine headaches or recurrent, non-migraine headaches and compared
them to levels in people without headache or migraine.
Changes in iron levels can reflect changes in the way the cells of the
PAG work, the authors pointed out.
According to the report, published in a recent issue of the journal
Headache, iron levels in the PAG were significantly increased in
patients with migraine and those with headache compared to the
headache-free group.
In fact, the researchers pointed out, the longer patients had
experienced headaches, the higher the iron levels in the PAG were,
though iron levels at the beginning of their illness were still
clearly higher than normal.
Increased iron levels may be both a cause of migraine attacks and a
result of repeated headaches, the investigators noted.
"Thus, we believe that the increased (iron levels) in our migraine
groups reflect impaired iron (balance), possibly associated with
(nerve) dysfunction or damage," the authors concluded.
"Perhaps the PAG abnormality is essential to the cause of the headache
in migraine," Welch said. "The gradual deposition of iron increases
dysfunction, and headaches coalesce from episodic to continuous."
How, then, might one minimize the damage from increased iron stores?
Welch advised, "Treat episodes quickly and prevent (attacks) whenever
possible."
SOURCE: Headache 2001;41:629-637.
Email this story | Printer-friendly version
Subject: chelate/aspirin
Med Hypotheses 1998 Mar;50(3):239-51
A chelate theory for the mechanism of action of aspirin-like drugs.
Wang X
Department of Pathology, Cornell University Medical College, New York,
NY 10021, USA. xw...@mail.med.cornell.edu
Two hundred years after the discovery of the pharmaceutical usefulness
of aspirin, it and aspirin-like drugs, a family with an
ever-increasing number of members, are an indispensable part of modern
life. However, the question as to how these drugs work in the body has
remained unsettled. It is postulated here that this group of drugs may
exert their therapeutic (and adverse) effects by chelating various
physiologically important metallic cations in the body. The chelate
theory is supported by the vast majority, if not all, of the
observations on these drugs made in the past.
Publication Types:
* Review
* Review, academic
PMID: 9578329, UI: 98237440
_________________________________________________________________
doe
: J Neurochem 2002 Sep;82(5):1137-47 Related Articles, Links
Iron (III) induces aggregation of hyperphosphorylated tau and its reduction to
iron (II) reverses the aggregation: implications in the formation of
neurofibrillary tangles of Alzheimer's disease.
Yamamoto A, Shin RW, Hasegawa K, Naiki H, Sato H, Yoshimasu F, Kitamoto T.
Department of Neurological Science, Tohoku University School of Medicine,
Sendai, Japan.
Iron as well as aluminum is reported to accumulate in neurons with
neurofibrillary tangles (NFTs) of Alzheimer's disease (AD) brain. Previously we
demonstrated that aluminum (III) shows phosphate-dependent binding with
hyperphosphorylated tau (PHFtau), the major constituent of NFTs, thereby
inducing aggregation of PHFtau. Herein we report that iron (III) can also
induce aggregation of soluble PHFtau. Importantly, for the aggregation of
PHFtau to occur, iron in the oxidized state (III) is essential since iron in
the reduced state (II) lacks such ability. Furthermore, iron (III)-induced
aggregation is reversed by reducing iron (III) to iron (II). Thus the
iron-participating aggregation is mediated not only by tau phosphorylation but
also by the transition of iron between reduced (II) and oxidized (III) states.
Further incubation of insoluble PHFtau aggregates isolated from AD brain with
reducing agents produced liberation of solubilized PHFtau and iron (II),
indicating that PHFtau in association with iron (III) constitutes the insoluble
pool of PHFtau. These results indicate that iron might play a role in the
aggregation of PHFtau leading to the formation of NFTs in AD brain.
PMID: 12358761 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
doe
The World's No.1 Science & Technology News Service
Body odour bugs starved to death
20:00 20 May 02
NewScientist.com news service
Starving the bacteria that cause body odour of the iron they need to grow may
soon arm deodorants with an extra stink-stopping weapon.
Fresh sweat has no odour. But bacteria feed on our excretions, especially in
the warm, damp armpits, and produce malodorous molecules as a byproduct.
Standard underarm deodorants often use alcohol to kill the bacteria, but
usually some bacteria survive and begin growing back.
Manufacturers sometimes add additional anti-bacterials, perfumes and
antiperspirants to try to increase efficacy. But Andrew S Landa and colleagues
at Unilever Research and Development, in Port Sunlight, north-west England, are
trying a new approach - starving the bacteria of iron.
Sweat contains trace amounts of iron, and bacteria need it in order to
multiply. So Landa and colleagues used a chemical called
diethylenetriaminepentaacetic acid (DTPA), which binds iron and keeps the
bacteria from using it.
Because some bacteria can also extract iron from iron-carrying proteins which
are also present in sweat, the researchers also added butylated hydroxytoluene
(BHT), which released the iron from the proteins, and allowed it to be captured
by the DTPA.
Armpit assessors
American Society for Microbiology
According to a paper presented at the American Society for Microbiology meeting
in Salt Lake City on Monday, a deodorant with DTPA and BHT added to alcohol
kept bacteria populations lower after 24 hours than alcohol alone.
It controlled smell better, too, according to "expert assessors" at Unilever.
These people have the unenviable job of applying the new deodorant and a
control to the armpits of volunteers, and then assessing how the armpits
smelled after five and again after 24 hours.
"I think we calculated for 8000 armpits," Landa says. The tests were
double-blind, and again the iron-capturing formulation worked better than just
alcohol.
Landa would not say whether Unilever is planning to market a deodorant that
uses the new agents. But the company has already applied for patents on the
technology in Europe and the US.
Kurt Kleiner
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
Int J Hematol 2002 Oct;76(3):219-28
Iron toxicity and chelation therapy.
Britton RS, Leicester KL, Bacon BR
brit...@slu.edu
[Medline record in process]
Iron is an essential mineral for normal cellular physiology, but an excess can
result in cell injury. Iron in low-molecular-weight forms may play a catalytic
role in the initiation of free radical reactions. The resulting oxyradicals
have the potential to damage cellular lipids, nucleic acids, proteins, and
carbohydrates; the result is wide-ranging impairment in cellular function and
integrity. The rate of free radical production must overwhelm the
cytoprotective defenses of cells before injury occurs. There is substantial
evidence that iron overload in experimental animals can result in oxidative
damage to lipids in vivo, once the concentration of iron exceeds a threshold
level. In the liver, this lipid peroxidation is associated with impairment of
membrane-dependent functions of mitochondria and lysosomes. Iron overload
impairs hepatic mitochondrial respiration primarily through a decrease in
cytochrome C oxidase activity, and hepatocellular calcium homeostasis may be
compromised through damage to mitochondrial and microsomal calcium
sequestration. DNA has also been reported to be a target of iron-induced
damage, and this may have consequences in regard to malignant transformation.
Mitochondrial respiratory enzymes and plasma membrane enzymes such as
sodium-potassium-adenosine triphosphatase (Na(+) + K(+)-ATPase) may be key
targets of damage by non-transferrin-bound iron in cardiac myocytes. Levels of
some antioxidants are decreased during iron overload, a finding suggestive of
ongoing oxidative stress. Reduced cellular levels of ATP, lysosomal fragility,
impaired cellular calcium homeostasis, and damage to DNA all may contribute to
cellular injury in iron overload. Evidence is accumulating that free-radical
production is increased in patients with iron overload. Iron-loaded patients
have elevated plasma levels of thiobarbituric acid reactants and increased
hepatic levels of aldehyde-protein adducts, indicating lipid peroxidation.
Hepatic DNA of iron-loaded patients shows evidence of damage, including
mutations of the tumor suppressor gene p53. Although phlebotomy therapy is
effective in removing excess iron in hereditary hemochromatosis, chelation
therapy is required in the treatment of many patients who have combined
secondary and transfusional iron overload due to disorders in erythropoiesis.
In patients with beta-thalassemia who undergo regular transfusions,
deferoxamine treatment has been shown to be effective in preventing
iron-induced tissue injury and in prolonging life expectancy. The use of the
oral chelator deferiprone remains controversial, and work is continuing on the
development of new orally effective iron chelators.
PMID: 12416732, UI: 22303382
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
Iron Problems May Lead to Parkinson'sMouse Study Shows Direct Link Jan 31
2001 11:24:12Julia McNamee NeenanHealthScout Genetic engineering that knocks
out an iron-regulating protein caused Parkinson-like disabilities in mice,
researchers announced today. The finding is key to understanding development of
brain diseases that affect movement, said senior study investigator Dr. Tracey
A. Rouault, chief of the section on human iron metabolism at the National
Institute of Child Health and Human Development. While scientists had long
observed that patients with these diseases built up iron deposits in the brain,
no one was sure whether the deposits caused the diseases or were a byproduct of
cell death that resulted from the diseases, Rouault said. "We demonstrated that
an inherited iron regulation protein mutation can be the cause of deterioration
of the brain in animals. The mistake in iron metabolism causes physical
degeneration, and the iron accumulation is a sign of that mistake," Rouault
said. The study, published in today's Nature Genetics, used genetically
engineered mice that lacked one of two important regulators of iron, a protein
called IRP2. The mice progressively deteriorated, showing difficulties moving,
and accumulated damaging iron deposits in the brain and elsewhere. The brain
damage in the mice parallels damage observed in Parkinson-like diseases in
humans, particularly Parkinson's Plus, Rouault said. Also called Multiple
System Atrophy (MSA), Parkinson's Plus affects up to 10 percent of the 1.5
million Americans with Parkinson's. Statistics pinpointing the incidence of MSA
are hard to come by because the disease so often is misdiagnosed, said Donna
Gruetzmacher, National Ataxia Foundation executive director. People with the
disease typically lack coordinated movement, while other body areas or systems,
such as blood pressure or sleep patterns, also break down. MSA typically is
diagnosed in middle age, she said. Mice generally live 18 months to a year, but
the mice lacking IRP2 developed problems within six months, Rouault said. "They
had a tremor that could be quite severe. Their gait, or how they walked, was
very uncoordinated. When they fell over, they couldn't right themselves. It
progressed to the point where they couldn't get food or water because movement
was so sacrificed. It really is a profound disease at that moment," Rouault
said. The absence of IRP2 also caused measurable changes in iron levels in the
liver and part of the intestine, the study showed. For instance, liver iron in
the control mice was 947 parts per million at eight months, compared with 1,623
parts per million in the mutated mice. Researchers detected significant amounts
of abnormal iron deposits in the cerebellum and the basal ganglia, both brain
parts involved in movement. And by killing mice at various stages of
development, the researchers saw that the iron deposits preceded brain damage,
Rouault said. "The cell bodies of neurons condensed and lost the appropriate
shape of their structures, and their axons degenerated," Rouault said. So far,
the damage matches what's been seen in humans with Parkinson's Plus, which also
is characterized by tremors and uncoordinated gait, Rouault said. The
researchers are looking into whether the damage is like that seen in people
with Parkinson's itself. The earliest and most extreme damage occurred in mice
missing both copies of IRP2-carrying genes, but those with just one copy of the
mutated gene also showed damage and physiological changes, which might explain
why some didn't show signs of brain disease until much later in life, Rouault
said. Gene therapy is a definite possibility in the future, but for now,
researchers are looking for people with Parkinson-type diseases to study
whether the gene coding for IRP2 has been mutated in some way, Rouault said.
"We think there's a good chance some humans will have mutations in this gene,
and we'd like to find them," Rouault said. SOURCES: Interviews with Tracey A.
Rouault, M.D., chief of the section on human iron metabolism at the National
Institute of Child and Health and Human Development; Donna Gruetzmacher,
executive director, National Ataxia Foundation; February 2001 Nature Genetics
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
>
> >> Reversing cancer .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F ..
U
> >..
> >>
> >> Reversing diabetes .. recommended for 40% of type II diabetics . you
got
> >> anything to match that ? Then S .. T .. F .. U ..
> >>
> >> Reversing cirrhosis .. you got anything to match that? Then S.. T .. F
..
> >> U ..
>
> >As a matter of fact, I don't have anything of the sort... and neither do
> >you.
>
>
> Well .. what part of S.. T .. F .. U .. don't you understand .. ?
>
> Is it the .. S .. the .. T .. the F .. the U .. ?
>
>
> >> You have any credentials .. ?
> >> You bring any medical articles which refute the reversal of all of the
> >> above ..
>
> I take it by your nonanswer you got NOTHING ..
> Then stay off the thread ..
>
> Because simply it is about IRON which you admittingly KNOW FA .. about ..
>
> I'll spell it for ya .. because .. I don't recall ever doing that for ya
.. I
> .. R .. O .. N ..
Congratulations, Tom. You've aced the spelling bee. We can promote you to
the second grade, after all.
You've won the prize for spelling, but I'm afraid you've lost your wits
while you were about it.
I promise to send them home if to you I see them around anywhere.
What was your address again?
slenon
>I tell you what .. I repeat .. KEEP UP YOUR PERSONAL OFF TOPIC .. attacks
..
You must love abuse. You are even begging for it. You might hire someone
who's graduated grammar school to proof these idiot posts you make and
disgrace yourself less often.
So right after you cite the work that won you your supposed Nobel Prize in
some un-named discipline, post the formula that you found in the hidden
Hebrew codes, a language you don't read, that tells how lamb and fish become
vegetables. Then go take your medications, dually diagnosed refugee from
the locked wards.
slenon
>NOONE needs to hear how you bow down to Mecca ..
That is spelled "no one." Try again, when you've mastered third grade
English.
I don't recall mentioning Mecca. That must be something one of the voices
that speaks to you at night, when you're in the scarey dark, told you.
Run, do not walk, to the nearest mental health clinic and let Canada spend
some of its hard earned tax dollars on the medications and in-patient
therapy you do desparately need.
Keep it on topic? Any time you post anything, the topic is automatically
changed to "how delusional is tommy tonight?" I'm quite on target, poster
child for required birth control.
Internadoc
>>news:20021214180459...@mb-fo.aol.com...
> And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER ..
>>>
>>> and my proof is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and that .. is ALL THAT
>>> FRIGGIN MATTERS on this
>My credentials are . . every medical article I post ..
>
>And if THAT doesn't make me a NOBEL PRIZE WINNER .. I don't know what would
>..
Tom
As nicely as I can put it, you are seriously mentally ill.
I have been reading what you "cut and paste" and using Medline and retrieving
abstracts is not what a Nobel Prize is given for. Nor do you have
:"credentials" simply because you have access to a search engine.
You have not reversed cancer, or TB, or cirrhosis or anything else. What you
have done is copy what others HAVE done and studied and mistakenly given
yourself credit for it. And, as others have pointed out, abstracts rarely tell
an entire story of a study. The ones I have read that you have given, more
often than not are contradictory, use verbs such as "suggest" which in many
instances do NOT prove the point you think you are making.
>You have any credentials .. ?
>You bring any medical articles which refute the reversal of all of the above
>..
Credentials are one's OWN works, not simply listing what other's have done.
Bringing medical articles to a newsgroup may point to your medical instability,
but not to anything else.
I understand you are Candadian, thus it should be easy for you to obtain
psychiatric help. You need it.
internadoc
Manky badger
"Manky badger" <m...@nospam.puritan.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in message
news:atdn9c$t0d$1...@newsg1.svr.pol.co.uk...
> I've been trying to find out what the iron related threads are about. Is
> there any actual "science" n tere, or is it just trolls & name calling?
OK - two days ago I asked a question. There's some plagarised science in
there. I think we all must admit that too much iron is bad. But then so is
too much of any food element. Why don't "our friend" pick on something which
is much more of a problem, like carbohydrates causing obesity ?
Or was Jesus a porker, and we can't upset the righteous ?
MB
Dave
the keyword being balance, may cause migranes. It states here that the iron
levels are the reflection of imbalance, which does NOT mean that they should
reduce their iron intake. It is simply proposing a theory as to the cause of
migranes, not evidence of treatment.
Go back to the psych ward
Dave
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
news:20021214215402...@mb-fc.aol.com...
doe
>Why don't "our friend" pick on something which
>is much more of a problem, like carbohydrates causing obesity ?
<<snip>>
Thus, although individuals
at high risk for ASCVD are not Fe-overloaded, they seem to benefit,
metabolically and hemodynamically, from lowering of body Fe to levels commonly
seen in premenopausal females.
<<snip>>
Which means .. " even though these people are NOT 'considered' by US .. to BE
iron overloaded .. it seems when we lower the levels of iron .. there seems to
be a benefit .."
Iron causes the inability to use carbohydrates .. BECAUSE of the ability to
assimilate carbohydrates BY .. lowering of iron in those who we believe are NOT
iron overloaded.
1: Ann N Y Acad Sci 2002 Jun;967:342-51 Related Articles, Links
Effect of iron depletion on cardiovascular risk factors: studies in
carbohydrate-intolerant patients.
Facchini FS, Saylor KL.
Department of Medicine, Division of Nephrology, San Francisco General Hospital
and University of California, 94080-1341, USA. FSTE...@yahoo.com
Controversy surrounds the role of iron (Fe) in atherosclerosis (ASCVD), mainly
due to the inaccuracy of assessing body Fe stores with serum ferritin and
transferrin saturation. Quantitative phlebotomy was used to test whether or not
(a) Fe stores are increased in individuals at high risk for ASCVD and (b) Fe
depletion to near-deficiency (NID) levels is associated with reduction of risk
factors for ASCVD. Thirty-one carbohydrate-intolerant subjects completed the
study. Fe stores were within normal limits (1.5 +/- 0.1 g). At NID, a
significant increase of HDL-cholesterol (p < 0.001) and reductions of blood
pressure (p < 0.001), total and LDL-cholesterol (p < 0.001), triglyceride (p <
0.001), fibrinogen (p < 0.001) and glucose and insulin responses to oral
glucose loading (p < 0.001) were noted, while homocysteine plasma concentration
remained unchanged. These effects were largely reversed by a 6-month period of
Fe repletion with reinstitution of Fe sufficiency. Thus, although individuals
at high risk for ASCVD are not Fe-overloaded, they seem to benefit,
metabolically and hemodynamically, from lowering of body Fe to levels commonly
seen in premenopausal females.
PMID: 12079862 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Manky badger
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Manky badger"
>
> >Why don't "our friend" pick on something which
> >is much more of a problem, like carbohydrates causing obesity ?
> Iron causes the inability to use carbohydrates .. BECAUSE of the ability
to
> assimilate carbohydrates BY .. lowering of iron in those who we believe
are NOT
> iron overloaded.
So - high iron means they can't assimilate carbohydrate.
So - give them haemochromatosis to help them lose weight ?
Must try that.
Only been working in haematology for twenty years - you learn a new thing
every day.
> Who loves ya.
> Tom
Tom - no. My mummy loves me.
> Jesus was a vegetarian!
> http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Am I supposed to be impressed by the reference to Jesus ?
MB
Jesus was a let - down
doe
>From: "Manky badger"
>So - high iron means they can't assimilate carbohydrate.
>So - give them haemochromatosis to help them lose weight ?
>
Medical .. ng ..
I think you want the one down the road a bit ..
alt.IthinkIcrappedmypantsnowIhavenothingleftinmyhead ..
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus was a vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Manky badger
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Manky badger"
>
> >So - high iron means they can't assimilate carbohydrate.
> >So - give them haemochromatosis to help them lose weight ?
> >
>
> Medical .. ng ..
> I think you want the one down the road a bit ..
>
> alt.IthinkIcrappedmypantsnowIhavenothingleftinmyhead ..
Oh come on. Surely that is the gist of what you posted. If I misunderstood,
please put me right.
Others have told me that you don't actually understand what you are
postning, you just cut and paste what you think is relevant, without
understanding a word. Are they corrrect ?
MB
doe
>From: "Manky badger"
>postning, you just cut and paste what you think is relevant, without
>understanding a word. Are they corrrect ?
I condensed it for you ..
Two paragraphs ..
Don't understand it?
The article made you think ADDING iron to the mix is the way to go?
Well .. you are SOL .. then ..
kuhnfucius
himself calleth religion. --- Thomas Hobbes
"slenon" <sle...@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
news:VzTK9.386313$fa.76...@twister.tampabay.rr.com...
kuhnfucius
me and besides Johann Deisenhofer, Robert Huber and Hartmut Michel.
Insight, untested and unsupported, is an insufficient guarantee of truth.
"Michael" <muir...@island.net> wrote in message
news:atgg3...@enews4.newsguy.com...
doe
http://main.pslgroup.com/news/content.nsf/MedicalNews/8525697700573E188525
6C4E0046F137?OpenDocument&id=
DGReview
Iron May Play Role In Endometriosis A DGReview of :"Iron overload in the
peritoneal cavity of women with pelvic endometriosis."
Fertility and Sterility
10/17/2002
By Anne MacLennan
Iron overload has been observed in the cellular and peritoneal fluid
compartments of the peritoneal cavity of women with endometriosis, report
Belgian researchers.
These iron deposits seem to be related to the presence of lesions, suggesting
iron may be involved in the pathogenesis of endometriosis, report Dr A Van
Langendonckt and colleagues from the Universite Catholique de Louvain,
Brussels.
Seventy patients undergoing laparoscopy participated in this prospective study
in the Department of Gynecology of a university hospital. Researchers collected
peritoneal fluid (n = 57), blood samples, and biopsy samples from endometrium
(n = 62) and from endometriotic (n = 33) and normal-appearing peritoneum (n =
53).
Primary outcome was measurement of iron and ferritin in serum and peritoneal
fluid and staining of iron deposits with Prussian blue in tissues.
The researchers found iron and ferritin concentrations were significantly
higher in the peritoneal fluid of patients with endometriosis as compared with
controls during the secretory phase.
Higher rates of ferritin and hemosiderin deposits were seen in the peritoneum
adjacent to red (100 percent), black (57 percent) and white (62 percent)
lesions as compared with normal-appearing peritoneum (25 percent).
Although iron deposits were more frequent during the secretory than the
proliferative phase in healthy peritoneum from control subjects, they were
found throughout the cycle in the vicinity of lesions in endometriosis
patients.
Similar rates of iron deposition were observed in the stroma of black and white
lesions and in eutopic endometrium from the endometriosis patients with
endometriosis.
doe
Genet Test 1998;2(1):85-8
Is the hemochromatosis gene a modifier locus for cystic fibrosis?
Rohlfs EM, Shaheen NJ, Silverman LM
Department of Pathology & Laboratory Medicine, University of North
Carolina, Chapel Hill 27599, USA.
The variable clinical manifestations of cystic fibrosis (CF) suggest
the influence of modifier genes. For example, meconium ileus is
present in approximately 10-15% of neonates with cystic fibrosis;
however, the genetic and, or environmental factors that determine
whether an individual will develop this complication have not been
determined. We propose the HFE gene as a candidate modifier locus for
CF based on (1) the suggestion of an association between the HLA loci
and CF phenotypes; (2) the location of the HFE gene near the HLA loci
and; (3) the similarity between the gastrointestinal manifestations of
hereditary hemochromatosis and CF. We have determined the frequency of
the C282Y and H63D mutations in a group of 89 CF patients who were
homozygous for delta F508 and for whom meconium ileus status was
known. The carrier frequency of C282Y among the CF patients with
meconium ileus was significantly different from that of our unaffected
control group (19.4% versus 7.7%). However, the difference between the
meconium ileus and the nonmeconium ileus groups was not significant
(19.4% versus 10.3%). There was no difference in the frequency of the
H63D among the three groups that were studied. These data are
suggestive of a relationship between the development of meconium ileus
or other gastrointestinal diseases in CF and the HFE gene. Further
study of a larger group of patients is warranted.
PMID: 10464603, UI: 99393869
__________________________________________________________
Manky badger
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> snipped stuff that YOU don't understand.
Let me put it this way.
If you have to use the big words, then you don't understand it.
Don't cut and paste, because other people's articles aren't answering what's
being asked of you.
> Jesus was a vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman
Jesus is dead. Get over it !
MB
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
<<snip>>
A high iron content has been noted in synovial membraines in RA , but the
uptake and storage of iron and its potential relation to imflammation of the
joints has been unknown until now.
<<snip>>
Annals of the Rheumatic Diseases 2002;61:741-744
Iron deposits may damage joint tissue in RA
Our understanding of the role of iron in rheumatoid arthritis (RA) has improved
with a recent study showing where iron accumulates in the synovial membranes
of affected joints. The researchers speculate how iron might build up to toxic
amounts.
Ferritin, both light and heavy subunits , was found in the lining layer and
subintimal zone of the synovium and in synovial macrophages and fibroblasts.
Transferrin receptor appeared only in the lining layer .
Non-specific resistance associated macrophage proteins (Nramp) were also found
. These are proteins that span membranes and transport divalent cations. Nramp
2 occurred in the macrophages and fibroblasts. Nramp 1 was present in
macrophages and neutrophils, in the synovial lining layer and the subintimal
zone, and in infiltrating inflammatory cells, but not in fibroblasts.
The study used synovial membranes from arthroplasties of 20 patients with RA.
Thin sections were stained cytochemically for ferritin, transferrin receptor ,
and Nramp 1 with monoclonal or polyclonal antibodies. Macrophages and
fibroblasts were isolated from collaginase digests of synovial membranes.
Neutrophils were isolated from synovial fluid aspirated routinely from the
joints . These cell types were stained for ferritin and transferrin receptor
immunocytochemically. Nramp 1 and Nramp 2 were identified by reverse
transcriptase polymerase chain reaction.
A high iron content has been noted in synovial membraines in RA , but the
uptake and storage of iron and its potential relation to imflammation of the
joints has been unknown until now.
Who loves ya.
Tom
Jesus was a vegetarian!
http://jesuswasavegetarian.7h.com
Jesus was a vegetarian! http://www.nucleus.com/watchman
doe
>From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
<<snip>>
Tissue iron levels were significantly higher in the NPC tissues compared with
normal tissues
<<snip>>
Arch Otolaryngol Head Neck Surg 2002 Dec;128(12):1396-9
Glutathione S-Transferase pi Expression in Nasopharyngeal Cancer.
Jayasurya A, Yap WM, Tan NG, Tan BK, Bay BH
Department of Anatomy, National University of Singapore, 4 Medical Dr, Blk MD
10, S117 597 Singapore. antb...@nus.edu.sg
[Medline record in process]
BACKGROUND: Glutathione S-transferase pi (GST-pi) is an enzyme that catalyzes
the conjugation of electrophilic substrates and prevents oxidative damage.
Although GST-pi expression has been analyzed in many cancers, the significance
of GST-pi expression in nasopharyngeal cancer (NPC), a tumor with a high
treatment failure rate, is still unclear. OBJECTIVE: To elucidate the
significance of GST-pi expression in NPC. DESIGN: Evaluation of GST-pi
expression in NPC tissue specimens and determination of its relationship with
tissue iron (a pro-oxidant) and clinicopathological factors in NPC. MATERIALS
AND METHODS: Immunohistochemical expression of GST-pi was carried out in 55 NPC
and 4 normal nasopharyngeal tissue sections. Eleven nasopharyngeal biopsy
specimens (4 normal and 7 NPC) were analyzed for tissue iron levels. The
expression of GST-pi in NPC was correlated with corresponding tissue iron
levels. The relationships between GST-pi expression with sex, race, tumor
stage, cervical nodal status, and clinical staging were also analyzed. RESULTS:
Glutathione S-transferase pi immunoreactivity was observed in all NPC sections,
with the percentage of immunopositive cells ranging from 1.0% to 72.0%. Tissue
iron levels were significantly higher in the NPC tissues compared with normal
tissues (P =.001). A direct correlation was observed between GST-pi expression
and total and nuclear iron levels in NPC (P =.01 and P =.047, respectively). A
significant association was also observed between GST-pi expression and
cervical nodal disease (P =.007). CONCLUSIONS: Nasopharyngeal tumor cells may
respond to pro-oxidant conditions by modulating intracellular antioxidant
defense. Glutathione S-transferase pi expression appears to be associated with
lymphogenous metastasis in NPC.
PMID: 12479727, UI: 22368010
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
>
> <<snip>>
> Tissue iron levels were significantly higher in the NPC tissues compared
with
> normal tissues
> <<snip>>
Yes, Tom. We can all read, and you don't need to repeat what you've already
copied once.
Now, can you please expalin what you believe this to mean?
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"And as 'per my qualifications' .. I AM A
FRIGGIN NOBEL PRIZE WINNER .. and my proof
is EVERY MEDICAL DISEASE THERE IS .. and
that .. is ALL THAT FRIGGIN MATTERS on this
medical newsgroup."
- Tom Hennessy ("doe"), Calgary, Canada. 14 Dec/2002
Message-ID: <0021214180459....@mb-fo.aol.com>
> Arch Otolaryngol Head Neck Surg 2002 Dec;128(12):1396-9
doe
>Now, can you please expalin what you believe this to mean?
That is the reason you don't belong on this ng .. stupid ..
Because you don't actually UNDERSTAND a friggin .. thing ..
Now .. FO ..
slenon
Trying to tell us something, tommy? Perhaps you might spell it completely
so that those of us not afflicted with your particular mania can read past
the ".." Or, tommy, are you afraid someone will punish you for spelling bad
words?
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
>
> >Now, can you please expalin what you believe this to mean?
>
> That is the reason you don't belong on this ng .. stupid ..
>
> Because you don't actually UNDERSTAND a friggin .. thing ..
>
> Now .. FO ..
You're missing my point, Tom. I understand it well enough.
However, rather than merely criticizing your choice of an abstract, I asked
you to show us its meaning, so that we might know what it is about its
content and conclusion that makes it of value to you and your theoretical
outlook.
I'm asking you to show your credentials and clarify what it is you're
driving at with this piece, that's all.
No more than that.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"My credentials are . . every medical article I post .."
- Tom Hennessy (aka "doe")
doe
>Date: 12/17/2002 6:45 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <xqQL9.68453$Db4.1...@twister.tampabay.rr.com>
>
>>Because you don't actually UNDERSTAND a >friggin .. thing .. Now .. FO ..
>
>Trying to tell us something, tommy? Perhaps you might spell it completely
>so that those of us not afflicted with your particular mania can read past
>the ".." Or, tommy, are you afraid someone will punish you for spelling bad
>words?
>
Why don't you use em .. ahole .. use em ..
Come on .. you can do it ..
Maybe you can't ..
Momma wouldn't let ya .. eh ..
Oh .. better watch that .. ANOTHER 'racial' reference ..
doe
>You're missing my point, Tom. I understand it well enough.
Left yourself open cowboy ..
Explain it ..
>
>However, rather than merely criticizing your choice of an abstract, I asked
>you to show us its meaning, so that we might know what it is about its
>content and conclusion that makes it of value to you and your theoretical
>outlook.
You don't care what it means .. you just want to come onto my posts ..
Jeez .. gotta watch my words when I speak to you ..
You said .. on the MS / multiple sclerosis list .. radiation doesn't cause
oxidation / free radicals .. SPECIFICALLY on my post.
You don't care whether or not the oxidation IS causing some kid to get MS ..
you just want to come .. jeez .. attack me ..
THAT .. is WHY I .. 'don't like your type' .. boy .. girl .. whatever ..
You got a screw loose and it is bouncing around and if you don't think it
affects you other than JUST being 'compromised' .. you are WRONG ..
You got a mental problem ..
So if you think .. I will even try to explain shit to you .. you are badly
mistaken .. BECAUSE I consider you to have mental problems ..
Let me spell it ..
M..E..N..T..A..L .. .. P..R..O..B..L..E..M..S
You followed me over to the arthritis list and jumped on my arthritis /
rhematoid arthritis post .. and crapped on it ..
You are a sick mf ..and it is a matter of time before it catches up to you ..
Now .. again .. F .. O ..
You sick ..MF ..
Who loves ya.
Tom
>
>I'm asking you to show your credentials and clarify what it is you're
>driving at with this piece, that's all.
Read above .. if you have some idea I think ANYTHING you say 'medically /
scientifically' .. merits ANY consideration .. you didn't understand when I
said it to you before ..
You got FA to offer .. scientifically .. theoretically .. advisorly ..FA ..
You may make some guy very happy someday .. but THAT is it .. dig?
I don't treat you with any respect because you don't deserve it ..
Simple as that ..
You 'care' not one little bit for that kid who has rheumatoid arthritis BECAUSE
.. you stepped on the post ..
You are a freak .. and you are lucky you have lived this long without getting
your ass kicked so bad that your mother wouldn't recognize ya .. dig?
And that .. is .. all .. I .. have .. to say about that ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Michael" muir...@island.net
>
> >You're missing my point, Tom. I understand it well enough.
>
> Left yourself open cowboy ..
>
> Explain it ..
I'll save that for another post, maybe... this one's for explaining myself,
since you've obviously concocted some erroneous and deluded ideas about me.
> You don't care what it means .. you just want to come onto my posts ..
I want others to know that you haven't a clue what you're talking about.
Your posts are veidence enough of that for those of us who can read and
understand them as they stand, but there are others who don't have the
technical background to realize that you're just spouting undigested
material.
> Jeez .. gotta watch my words when I speak to you ..
You certainly do.
> You said .. on the MS / multiple sclerosis list .. radiation doesn't cause
> oxidation / free radicals .. SPECIFICALLY on my post.
I said - in respose to your assertion that "Radon = radiation = oxidation =
rust" - and I quote, "I disagree that radon's radioactive decay is (or
necessarily produces) oxidation," and I defy you now to show me that my
disagreement is wrong. You're not only an idiot, you're an intellectually
dishonest one.
> You don't care whether or not the oxidation IS causing some kid to get MS
..
> you just want to come .. jeez .. attack me ..
It's not as if I don't care, Tom. It's that *you* were being completely
inappropriate in your use of example. I showed you and everyone else who
cares to read that the radiation produced by natural radon levels is totally
insignificant in comparison to the massive and constant bombardment by
particle radiation of human beings in orbit... which, if you have brains
enough to remember it, is the example you gave to explain oxidation caused
by the ions resulting from such bombardment of water molecules
And... *attack* you? Give me a break. You are on constant offense (in
addition to *being* constant offense,) in every forum you attend.
I no more attack you than a bitten person attacks a mosquito.
> THAT .. is WHY I .. 'don't like your type' .. boy .. girl .. whatever ..
> You got a screw loose and it is bouncing around and if you don't think it
> affects you other than JUST being 'compromised' .. you are WRONG ..
Prove it.
> You got a mental problem ..
>
> So if you think .. I will even try to explain shit to you .. you are badly
> mistaken .. BECAUSE I consider you to have mental problems ..
My only mental problem, Tom, is that - try as I might - I cannot understand
your aversion to telling the ttruth about yourself.
You don't understand most of what you post, and you refuse to admit it...
and *that* causes me exasperation, which is certainly mental problem enough
to be cause for wondering why I bother with you... but it's sure no cause
for real concern.
> You followed me over to the arthritis list and jumped on my arthritis /
> rhematoid arthritis post .. and crapped on it ..
I have osteoarthritis in both shoulders, left hip and the right knee... I
don't usually post to those groups because I don't suffer enough to consider
myself in need of "support" for this condition, but I do look there often
for information. When I find you there spewing, I react. You're a menace
and you must be exposed as such.
> You are a sick mf ..and it is a matter of time before it catches up to you
..
You mean *you* (not "it") catching up, like your launching police
investigations of my "stalking you" by asking a friend to look at the empty
lot whose address *you gave to me* and claimed was your home address?
That's a criminal offense, Tom. Canada's Criminal Code says so:
140. (1) Every one commits public mischief who, with intent to
mislead, causes a peace officer to enter on or continue an
investigation by
(a) making a false statement that accuses some other person of having
committed an offence;
(b) doing anything intended to cause some other person to be suspected
of having committed an offence that the other person has not
committed, or to divert suspicion from himself;
(c) reporting that an offence has been committed when it has not been
committed; or
(d) reporting or in any other way making it known or causing it to be
made known that he or some other person has died when he or that other
person has not died.
140(2) Punishment
(2) Every one who commits public mischief
(a) is guilty of an indictable offence and liable to imprisonment for
a term not exceeding five years; or
(b) is guilty of an offence punishable on summary conviction.
R.S., 1985, c. C-46, s. 140; R.S., 1985, c. 27 (1st Supp.), s. 19.
> Now .. again .. F .. O ..
>
> You sick ..MF ..
I don't think so, Tom. You're a cross I've chosen to bear.
Freedom of speech is your right and mine, as long as we stay on the right
side of the law.
Get used to it and learn to use it properly.
--
Michael muir...@island.net
"The illiterate of the future will not be the person who cannot read.
It will be the person who does not know how to learn."
- Alvin Toffler
doe
>Message-id: <atoqg...@enews3.newsguy.com>
>
>
>"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
>news:20021217214806...@mb-cg.aol.com...
>> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
>> >From: "Michael" muir...@island.net
>>
>> >You're missing my point, Tom. I understand it well enough.
>>
>> Left yourself open cowboy ..
>>
>> Explain it ..
>
>I'll save that for another post, maybe.
Maybe .. ?
Really nice .. out .. eh .. "maybe" .. you can't .. you have no brains ..
>.. this one's for explaining myself,
<<snip>>
I don't 'care' about YOU .. dig.. comprendez .. understand?
I repeat you are a SICK MF ..
radiation = oxidation .. and you said it isn't
Even in the face of an include FDA website which specifically said it did ..
and you KEEP ON ARGUING THE FACT.
So .. like I said .. find another ng .. because .. you simply don't belong on a
medical ng .. because .. people come to the ng to find someone who knows AT
LEAST the 'basics' .. and you admittingly .. don't ..
Live with it ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
>
> radiation = oxidation .. and you said it isn't
>
> Even in the face of an include FDA website which specifically said it did
..
> and you KEEP ON ARGUING THE FACT.
It was a NASA website, not an FDA website.
It was specifically about the risks inherent to cosmic radiation exposure in
astronauts.
It said that radiation can create ions that oxidize. That much is
certainly true. (Incidentally, the human body produces vastly more such
ions - free radicals - all on its own than are produced by the levels of
radon exposure common to most of this planet.)
It did not say radiation = oxidation, and you can't weasel any such an
assertion out of it, no matter how hard you try.
> So .. like I said .. find another ng .. because .. you simply don't belong
on a
> medical ng .. because .. people come to the ng to find someone who knows
AT
> LEAST the 'basics' .. and you admittingly .. don't ..
>
> Live with it ..
I live with my abilities and my shortcomings every day... and I'm
comfortable with them.
You would do well to grow more tolerant and accepting of your own instead of
compensating inadequately for them with your insecure and completely
transparent bravado, which aims to insult but falls so wide the mark that it
fails utterly to be at anyone else's expense but your own.
You're not only stupid, you're criminally stupid.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"You can discover what your enemy fears most by
observing the means he uses to frighten you."
- Eric Hoffer, 1902-1983
doe
>Message-id: <atout...@enews2.newsguy.com>
Read my lips .. FY ..
BONE UP and stay the F . away from me ..
http://www.uoregon.edu/~ch111/L27.htm
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
Here's my translation for you, Tom:
"Cancer and GST-pi for Dummies"
------------------------
> Glutathione S-Transferase pi Expression in Nasopharyngeal Cancer.
>
> Jayasurya A, Yap WM, Tan NG, Tan BK, Bay BH
> Department of Anatomy, National University of Singapore, 4 Medical Dr, Blk
MD
> 10, S117 597 Singapore. antb...@nus.edu.sg
>
> [Medline record in process]
>
>
> BACKGROUND: Glutathione S-transferase pi (GST-pi) is an enzyme that
catalyzes
> the conjugation of electrophilic substrates and prevents oxidative damage.
> Although GST-pi expression has been analyzed in many cancers, the
significance
> of GST-pi expression in nasopharyngeal cancer (NPC), a tumor with a high
> treatment failure rate, is still unclear.
There's an enzyme that helps out with (among other things) antioxidant
action through metal chelation. No one knows why it's so prevalent in
certain tumours.
> OBJECTIVE: To elucidate the significance of GST-pi expression in NPC.
We wanted to take a crack at explaining the above unknown.
> DESIGN: Evaluation of GST-pi
> expression in NPC tissue specimens and determination of its relationship
with
> tissue iron (a pro-oxidant) and clinicopathological factors in NPC.
We decided to use iron as a marker of oxidant activity, and to compare its
levels in tumours with levels of GST-pi in the same tumours.
> MATERIALS
> AND METHODS: Immunohistochemical expression of GST-pi was carried out in
55 NPC
> and 4 normal nasopharyngeal tissue sections. Eleven nasopharyngeal biopsy
> specimens (4 normal and 7 NPC) were analyzed for tissue iron levels. The
> expression of GST-pi in NPC was correlated with corresponding tissue iron
> levels. The relationships between GST-pi expression with sex, race, tumor
> stage, cervical nodal status, and clinical staging were also analyzed.
We examined 4 normal tissue samples and 55 tumour samples to get evidence of
how much of this stuff was in these various tissues. We selected only 7 of
the 55 cancer samples for iron analysis, and only an examination of the
entire article can tell you why we did this, (though it's possible that even
that won't tell you, because it we may be that we simply want to hide the
bias we introduced in our data.)
We correlated the levels of these two items, taking into consideration
several significant factors about the people from whom the samples were
taken.
> RESULTS:
> Glutathione S-transferase pi immunoreactivity was observed in all NPC
sections,
> with the percentage of immunopositive cells ranging from 1.0% to 72.0%.
Tissue
> iron levels were significantly higher in the NPC tissues compared with
normal
> tissues (P =.001). A direct correlation was observed between GST-pi
expression
> and total and nuclear iron levels in NPC (P =.01 and P =.047,
respectively). A
> significant association was also observed between GST-pi expression and
> cervical nodal disease (P =.007).
A very low but still significant positive correlation was determined to
exist between the existence of cancer and the amount of GST-pi shown by
immune reaction.
Presence of iron (in unspecified compounds) in cancerous tissue was
significantly elevated most of the time.
Correlation of total iron in cancer cells with GST-pi activity was
statistically significant, but correlation of such activity with iron in the
cells' nuclei was not.
> CONCLUSIONS: Nasopharyngeal tumor cells may
> respond to pro-oxidant conditions by modulating intracellular antioxidant
> defense. Glutathione S-transferase pi expression appears to be associated
with
> lymphogenous metastasis in NPC.
We didn't actually examine anything about iron itself or its activity, so we
don't know anything more about that... but we did learn that, *maybe*,
GST-pi expression is a reaction to the need for intracellular antioxidant
activity, and that *maybe* this is related (in ways we don't even *try* to
explain here,) to spreading of this type of cancer into lymphatic tissue in
the neck. To understand why we concluded this, you must read the whole
article, and you must remember throughout that our conclusions are subject
to possible future proof of fallacy.
---------------------
Satisfied, Tom?
I'm not stupid, I can read just fine, and I understand what I read.
You're stupid, you can't read, and you don't understand the significance of
anything you've posted.
Q.E.D.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are
always so certain of themselves, but wiser people so full of doubts."
- Bertrand Russell
doe
>Message-id: <atp1...@enews2.newsguy.com>
>
>Here's my translation for you, Tom
So you actually think I really gave a flying f what YOUR 'take' on it is ..?
The study found higher levels of IRON in the tumors ..
It wasn't looking for it .. big fing deal .. they found it ..
YOU 'don't like it ' .. BIG FING DEAL ..
Now again .. read my lips .. FO ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Michael" muir...@island.net
> >Date: 12/17/2002 9:51 PM Mountain Standard Time
> >Message-id: <atout...@enews2.newsguy.com>
>
> Read my lips .. FY ..
>
> BONE UP and stay the F . away from me ..
>
> http://www.uoregon.edu/~ch111/L27.htm
Yes, Tom.
I knew all this before I was 7 years old. It's the very long version of
what (in a nutshell) I've already explained to you.
You missed (or maybe you didn't bother searching, for fear you'd find) the
orders of magnitude of difference between naturally-occuring background
radiation due to near-surface atmospheric radon and orbital exposure to
cosmic particle radiation... which is what you pointed to initially.
Bone up yourself, you idiot.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"The pure and simple truth is rarely pure and never simple."
- Oscar Wilde
doe
>You mean *you* (not "it") catching up, like your launching police
>investigations of my "stalking you" by asking a friend to look at the empty
>lot whose address *you gave to me* and claimed was your home address?
Yeah .. cowboy .. I warned ya what REAL MEN do with guys who decide to get a
little too .. proactive .. you sick MF ..
>That's a criminal offense, Tom. Canada's Criminal Code says so:
>
Seeing they haven't come to see ME .. I will take it that they decided you ARE
the sick MF .. I'VE BEEN TELLING YOU YOU ARE .. !
Understand .. ? Comprendez..?
Get proactive some more ..
>I know radon is carcinogenic. . .but does it also act upon the nervous
>system?
And my reply to this simple question was ..
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Radon = radioactivity = oxidation = rust
So it could conceivably rob the body of antioxidants .. which have been shown
to be lower in MS ..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------
And your reply .. minus the personal abusive attack .. and on another post ..
is ..
I disagree that radon's radioactive decay is (or necessarily produces)
oxidation.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------------------------
And NOW you say .. "well there are more free radicals produced in the body by
other substances .." .. or something to that effect ..
And so you admitted you were wrong .. and are unwilling to admit it .. which
makes you FRIGGIN USELESS on a medical ng ..
UNDERSTAND ? COMPRENDEZ .. because .. as I've said before .. people are looking
for answers .. and when they get some SCUMBAG with ulterior motives .. which
are .. the fact I made mention my belief homosexuality is caused by iron /
eating meat .. ATTACKING on a medical ng .. YOU become an ENEMY to these people
..
UNDERSTAND .. COMPRENDEZ and will be treated as such .. you sick MF ..
And as to my 'inability' to kick your ass .. come ahead .. and as I said ..
bring at least four more pals BECAUSE .. . I like to break personal records ..
you sick MF .. and at least THIS time .. come yourself .. eh .. pussy ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Michael" muir...@island.net
> >Date: 12/17/2002 10:30 PM Mountain Standard Time
> >Message-id: <atp1...@enews2.newsguy.com>
> >
>
> >Here's my translation for you, Tom
>
> So you actually think I really gave a flying f what YOUR 'take' on it is
..?
>
> The study found higher levels of IRON in the tumors ..
>
> It wasn't looking for it .. big fing deal .. they found it ..
They *chose* iron as a marker for oxidation activity - which is something
they wanted to correlate with this enzyme they wanted to learn more about...
of *course* they were looking for iron. They just weren't concerning
themselves with what it was actually doing there.
I infer from reading their choice of phrasing that the iron they found was
already bound to something (presumably by the GST-pi mediated catalysis of
one antioxidant activity or another)... but that's a linguistic assumption,
not something directly attributable to the data itself, which hasn't really
anything of substance to say about the iron.
If they'd chosen a different oxidation-activity marker, (say, zinc) they'd
almost certainly have found that there was more of that too.
You really don't get *any* of it, do you?
Twit.
> YOU 'don't like it ' .. BIG FING DEAL ..
Where does it say I don't like it? It's data, and I just report on it, I
don't judge it in a personal sense.
That appears to be *your* department.
> Now again .. read my lips .. FO ..
I'll think on that... but I have to tell you up front that it's not effing
likely.
--
Michael muir...@island.net
"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought
without accepting it."
- Aristotle
doe
>Message-id: <atp66...@enews2.newsguy.com>
>If they'd chosen a different oxidation-activity marker, (say, zinc) they'd
>almost certainly have found that there was more of that too.
Talk the walk ?
Walk the talk?
Give me a cite ..
Or get the F.. off the medical ng ..
Comprendez .. cause nobody needs your 'speculations' ..
Take it over to alt.maybeIthinkbutwhatorgeeeek ..
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >I know radon is carcinogenic. . .but does it also act upon the nervous
> >system?
>
> And my reply to this simple question was ..
> --------------------------------------------------------------------
> Radon = radioactivity = oxidation = rust
>
> So it could conceivably rob the body of antioxidants .. which have been
shown
> to be lower in MS ..
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ---------------
> And your reply .. minus the personal abusive attack .. and on another post
..
> is ..
>
> I disagree that radon's radioactive decay is (or necessarily produces)
> oxidation.
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------------------------------------------
>
> And NOW you say .. "well there are more free radicals produced in the body
by
> other substances .." .. or something to that effect ..
>
> And so you admitted you were wrong .. and are unwilling to admit it ..
which
> makes you FRIGGIN USELESS on a medical ng ..
Excuse me? You don't read the Engrish too big, eh, me boyo?
"I disagree that radon's radioactive decay is (or necessarily produces)
oxidation."
Read and comprehend, if your braincell is up to it, Tom.
Translation in two parts:
1) "I disagree that radon's radioactive decay is oxidation."
Prove that my disagreement with this is in contradiction of the facts.
2) "I disagree that radon's radioactive decay necessarily produces
oxidation".
Since decay is statistical and the impacts of its products on other
matter is random, and since it is the chance interaction of those products
with matter that may create oxidiziding ions, *and* since those oxidizing
ions must find a place for their reactivity to cause harmful effects and not
trivial ones, thus radiation's effect is not necessarily even indirectly
oxidation, let alone damaging oxidation.
> UNDERSTAND ? COMPRENDEZ .. because .. as I've said before .. people are
looking
> for answers .. and when they get some SCUMBAG with ulterior motives ..
which
> are .. the fact I made mention my belief homosexuality is caused by iron /
> eating meat .. ATTACKING on a medical ng .. YOU become an ENEMY to these
people
You don't provide answers. If you had any, you'd answer people's questions
about your "research" instead of telling them in your
little-boy-having-a-hissy voice that you're a Nobel laureate and it's
beneath you to answer the ignorant masses who should be quiet and merely
look upon you from their congenitally determined position of adoration at
your feet.
That's what I strive to point out to people, Tom.
You don't understand your material, and the only reasons you have for
spouting it at all spring not from knowledge but from your own particular
brand of religious delusion.
> And as to my 'inability' to kick your ass .. come ahead .. and as I said
..
> bring at least four more pals BECAUSE .. . I like to break personal
records ..
> you sick MF .. and at least THIS time .. come yourself .. eh .. pussy ..
What... come to the empty lot before they finish the house? Gonna use a
2x4... or maybe a rebar?
What personal record? Do you mean you've kicked the snot out of four people
at once at some time in the past, and you think therefore that I'll need
that many to defend me?
Threats, Tom? Isn't criminal public mischief enough?
--
Michael muir...@island.net
"Any excuse will serve a tyrant."
- Aesop (appr. 550 BC)
doe
>Message-id: <atp7g...@enews2.newsguy.com>
Who give a flying F .. what tune you want to dance to ..
You are an abusive MF .. with an agenda .. and like I said .. keep following me
around the groups .. boy .. and we'll see who'll be using .. Earthlink .. boy
..
Now again .. read my Fing .. lips .. F..O .. and stay the F away from me ..
Who loves ya.
Tom
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: "Michael" muir...@island.net
> >Date: 12/17/2002 11:55 PM Mountain Standard Time
> >Message-id: <atp66...@enews2.newsguy.com>
>
> >If they'd chosen a different oxidation-activity marker, (say, zinc)
they'd
> >almost certainly have found that there was more of that too.
>
> Talk the walk ?
>
> Walk the talk?
>
> Give me a cite ..
Oh, for God's sake.
Fine. Be an idiot then. The abstract below, though it's about brain
injury, backs me up sufficiently, I hope.
If not, I obviously can't read... and I've already demonstrated very clearly
that I can.
This talks to the use of a gene-expressed redox-effector factor as a marker
for superoxide oxidant activity.
One of the superoxides, itself a marker of oxidant activity, is that of
*zinc*. It's a marker for oxidative DNA dmage.
------------------
Oxidative cellular damage and the reduction of APE/Ref-1 expression after
experimental traumatic brain injury.
Neurobiol Dis 2001 Jun;8(3):380-90 (ISSN: 0969-9961)
Lewen A; Sugawara T; Gasche Y; Fujimura M; Chan PH
Department of Neurosurgery, Stanford University School of Medicine,
Stanford, California 94305-5487, USA.
The DNA repair enzyme, apurinic/apyrimidinic endonuclease (or redox effector
factor-1, APE/Ref-1), is involved in base excision repair of
apurinic/apyrimidinic sites after oxidative DNA damage. We investigated the
expression of APE/Ref-1 and its relationship to oxidative stress after
severe traumatic brain injury produced by controlled cortical impact in
normal mice, and in mice over- or underexpressing copper-zinc superoxide
dismutase (SOD1TG and SOD1KO, respectively). Oxygen free radical-mediated
cellular injury was visualized with 8-hydroxyguanine immunoreactivity as a
marker for DNA oxidation, and in situ hydroethidine oxidation as a marker
for superoxide production. After trauma there was a reduced expression of
APE/Ref-1 in the ipsilateral cortex and hippocampus that correlated with the
gene dosage levels of cytosolic superoxide dismutase. The decrease in
APE/Ref-1 expression preceded DNA fragmentation. There was also a close
correlation between APE/Ref-1 protein levels 4 h after trauma and the volume
of the lesion 1 week after injury. Our data have demonstrated that reduction
of APE/Ref-1 protein levels correlates closely with the level of oxidative
stress after traumatic brain injury. We suggest that APE/Ref-1
immunoreactivity is a sensitive marker for oxidative cellular injury.
--------------------
Listen, Tom... I'm sick to death of exposing this lunatic fantasy world of
yours for its fallacies.
Get a clue and learn what you're talking about.
No one would be happier than I to listen to a well-educated and helpful Tom
Hennessy. Really.
As you are, however, you're just a pain in the ass. No more, no less.
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"Euclid taught me that without assumptions there is no proof.
Therefore, in any argument, examine the assumptions."
- H. Eves, "Return to Mathematical Circles."
Michael
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
>
> You are an abusive MF .. with an agenda .. and like I said .. keep
following me
> around the groups .. boy .. and we'll see who'll be using .. Earthlink ..
boy
What the heck has Earthlink to do with anything?
> Now again .. read my Fing .. lips .. F..O .. and stay the F away from me
..
Tom, we're both in Canada, we're both free under our constitution's
guarantees to speak as we please, unless it slanders or threatens or
promotes hatred.
That includes our right to disagree as forcefully as we like on any usenet
usenet forum of our choosing, even though those fora are not "Canadian" in
any real-world sense.
You step way over the line of legality when you threaten me, when you defame
people with racist or homophobic epithets, and when you instigate criminal
investigations knowingly in the absence of a crime.
I won't cry like you did to the police about your words or deeds if they
don't actually affect me, Tom. That's the pussy's way out, to use your own
turn of phrase. If the police come to visit me with the intent to
investigate a crime that has never happened, you can rest assured that your
own investigation and possible prosecution for public mischief will follow.
If they don't... well, then I won't be troubled about one damned thing...
will I?
--
Michael <muir...@island.net>
"Convincing yourself doesn't win an argument."
- Robert Half
slenon
>Come on .. you can do it ..
Because, Tommy, I'm sufficiently literate to tell you how incompetent and
deluded you are, what a laughingstock you are, without resorting to
profanity or obscenity.
Jim Carter
> >Name calling, then ?
> >MB
>
>[snip]
> In this case, the appropriate response is to complain loudly and frequently
> to Tommy's ISP's until they boot him for open statements of anti-Semitism,
> Gay bashing, and frequent threats of violence directed toward people who
> have the temerity to tell him he is an uneducated, semi-illiterate
> psychotic. Many of us make a habit of such complaints in the vain hope that
> we can temporarily rid the usegroups of this plague.
>
His ISP is AOL and AOL cares only about making a buck. Enough people
must complain, and keep on complaining, so that AOL loses a buck on
Tommy in processing the complaints. Forget any chance of corporate
responsibility or morality from AOL because they do not have any. No
matter how much bigotry Tommy shows, AOL will not boot him.
It would help if people currently with AOL dropped them and gave AOL's
condoning of Tommy's anti-semitic activities as the reason for their
leaving. That way, Tommy becomes unprofitable to them. See how fast
they find a reason to drop him then!
Jim Carter
> >Name calling, then ?
> >MB
>
[snip]
> Along the way, many of us also try to make sure that even the most unlearned
> persons on the usegroups will not take his advice seriously.
But, but, but (sorry to sound like an outboard motor)...
Tommy is the most unlearned person on the newsgroup and he believes
his own crap! How do we convince him?
Robert Bronsing
"Jim Carter" <jimc...@gmx.net> schreef in bericht
news:33cf2f1c.02121...@posting.google.com...
You don't. Just like with paranoid schizophrenia, it's virtually impossible
to convince him. But, one can convince readers of the usenet groups to not
believe his drivel and look further for the answers they seek.
--
--
Robert Bronsing
Just love those laser guided bombs
they're really great for righting wrongs
edina
"because many of these arthritic kids are anemic and need iron supplements..."
Don't you have a problem with this, Tom? They're saying that iron is essential. To
the point of giving supplements. I thought you were against iron; yet here you are
posting evidence that it's a dietary requirement.
eds.
"doe" <ironj...@aol.comdoe> wrote in message
news:20021214160311...@mb-fo.aol.com...
> >Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
> >From: ironj...@aol.comdoe (doe)
>
> >>Subject: Re: What is it with the iron ?
>
> EXPERIMENTAL BIOLOGY UPDATE: Arthritic kids' iron supplements may hasten joint
> deterioration
>
> By Diana Swift
>
> WWASHINGTON, D.C. - The iron supplements that many arthritic children take to
> combat concomitant anemia may be hastening the deterioration of their joints,
> Houston researchers say.
>
> Led by biologist Roman Shypailo of the Children's Nutrition Research Centre at
> Baylor College of Medicine, a Texas team looked at eight children being treated
> for juvenile rheumatoid arthritis. The patients, aged five to 15 years,
> received an intravenous radioactive tracer dose of iron (0.03 microsievert).
> Iron activity in affected joints was monitored on a position/energy-sensitive
> gamma counter, while a second machine monitored whole-body iron retention. Iron
> deposition was measured two hours post-infusion and again at days seven, 14, 28
> and 56.
>
> Anemic
> "We found that iron excessively accumulates in arthritic joints and probably
> contributes to the chronic damage," said Shypailo. "That puts you between a
> rock and a hard place because many of these arthritic kids are anemic and need
> iron supplements, which may worsen the disease."
>
> The study found a high level of agreement between the joint data and the
> whole-body data, with a greater than 90% retention rate of the infused iron
> both in joints and systemically. Furthermore, six of eight patients showed
> increased uptake at the affected joints: 165% over the first 30 days compared
> with initial uptake at two hours.
>
> The next step, he says, is to see if there is excessive deposition of dietary
> iron in arthritic joints.
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ------
Michael
downside to keeping these children alive.
Utilitarian bioethics is alive and well.
((U))
M
"edina" <mon...@catlover.com> wrote in message
news:3e027edc$0$11812$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au...
doe
>Date: 12/19/2002 7:22 PM Mountain Standard Time
>Message-id: <3e027edc$0$11812$afc3...@news.optusnet.com.au>
>
>So this particular medical team recognises that iron is essential ..
>"because many of these arthritic kids are anemic and need iron
>supplements..."
>
>Don't you have a problem with this, Tom?
As a matter of fact I do .. no accounting for ignorance.
> They're saying that iron is
>essential. To
>the point of giving supplements. I thought you were against iron; yet here
>you are
>posting evidence that it's a dietary >requirement.
I posted the article in order to show giving the children iron seems to be
contraindicated.
The children are not actually 'iron deficient' but in the throes of 'anemia of
chronic disease' .. and it has been shown in those on kidney dialysis it seems
giving them vitamin C instead of iron has as good as or better effect of
reducing the anemia than giving them iron.
Nephrol Dial Transplant 1998 Nov;13(11):2867-72
A parallel, comparative study of intravenous iron versus intravenous ascorbic
acid for erythropoietin-hyporesponsive anaemia in haemodialysis patients with
iron overload.
Tarng DC, Huang TP
Department of Medicine, Veterans General Hospital, Taipei, Taiwan.
BACKGROUND: Functional iron deficiency may develop and cause erythropoietin
resistance in haemodialysis patients with iron overload. Controversy remains as
to whether intravenous iron medication can improve this hyporesponsiveness due
to decreased iron availability, or whether iron therapy will aggravate
haemosiderosis. Intravenous administration of ascorbic acid has been shown to
effectively circumvent resistant anaemia associated with iron overload in a
small preliminary study. To elucidate further the possible mechanisms of this
resistance, a parallel, comparative study was conducted to compare the effects
of intravenous iron and ascorbate therapies in iron-overloaded haemodialysis
patients. METHODS: Fifty haemodialysis patients with serum ferritin of > 500
microg/l were randomly divided into two protocols. They were further stratified
into controls (Control I, n = 11) and intravenous iron group (IVFE, n = 15) in
protocol I; and into controls (Control II, n = 12) and intravenous ascorbic
acid group (IVAA, n = 12) in protocol II. Controls had a haematocrit of > 30%
and did not receive any adjuvant therapy. IVFE and IVAA patients were
hyporesponsive to erythropoietin and functionally iron deficient. Ferric
saccharate (100 mg dose) was administered intravenously postdialysis on five
consecutive dialysis sessions in the first 2 weeks; and ascorbic acid (300 mg
dose) thrice a week for 8 weeks. Red cell and iron metabolism indices were
examined before and following therapy. RESULTS: Mean values of haematocrit and
transferrin saturation were significantly lower, and erythropoietin dose was
higher in IVFE and IVAA patients compared to controls. Intravenous iron therapy
neither improved erythropoiesis nor reduced erythropoietin dose during 12
weeks. Iron metabolism indices significantly increased at 2 and 6 weeks, but
decreased at 12 weeks returning to the baselines. In contrast, mean haematocrit
significantly increased from 25.8+/-0.5 to 30.6+/-0.6% with a concomitant
reduction of 20% in erythropoietin dose after 8 weeks of ascorbate therapy.
Serum ferritin modestly fell but with no statistical significance. The enhanced
erythropoiesis paralleled a rise in transferrin saturation from 27+/-3 to
48+/-6% and serum iron from 70+/-11 to 107+/-19 microg/dl (P<0.05).
CONCLUSIONS: Short term intravenous iron therapy cannot resolve the issue of
functional iron deficiency in haemodialysis patients with iron overload.
Intravenous administration of ascorbic acid not only facilitates iron release
from storage sites, but also increases iron utilization in the erythron. Our
study draws attention to a potential adjuvant therapy, intravenous ascorbic
acid, to treat erythropoietin-hyporesponsive anaemia in iron-overloaded
patients.
Publication Types:
Clinical trial
Randomized controlled trial
PMID: 9829492, UI: 99044957