'Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?'

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

Forwarded post from V.

Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

Saturday, March 3, 2012

"A scholar finds compelling evidence for ancient Indian influence on
a global scale."

Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

http://www.viewzone.com/matlock.html

End of forwarded post from V.

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

[The General of the Faceless Anti-Franz Shadow Army]

On 4 mar, 10:29, use...@mantra.com and/or www.mantra.com/jai (Dr. Jai

Maharaj) wrote:
> Forwarded post from V.
>
> Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?
>
> Saturday, March 3, 2012
>
> "A scholar finds compelling evidence for ancient Indian influence on
> a global scale."
>
> Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

No, there isn't. Sanskrit is Indo-European and Hebrew is Semitic. Both
languages have been thoroughly classified and analyzed by the superior
minds of Western linguists.

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 5, 2:22 pm, The General of the Faceless Anti-Franz Shadow Army
<craoibhi...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 4 mar, 10:29, use...@mantra.com and/orwww.mantra.com/jai(Dr. Jai

>
> Maharaj) wrote:
> > Forwarded post from V.
>
> > Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?
>
> > Saturday, March 3, 2012
>
> > "A scholar finds compelling evidence for ancient Indian influence on
> > a global scale."
>
> > Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?
>
> No, there isn't. Sanskrit is Indo-European and Hebrew is Semitic. Both
> languages have been thoroughly classified and analyzed by the superior
> minds of Western linguists.

To hell with them. J-Doc (or his friend V-Dub) would rather believe a
freelance American crank, Gene D. ("I have in my files enough
information to provide a large volume about the ancient Indo-Turkic
(Kuru) Phoenicians' domination of every region on earth. Various names
of God Shiva also existed in every part of this globe.") Matlock, who
draws on a truly oddball Englishman, Godfrey Higgins (1772-1833), who
apparently wrote two fat volumes ("Anacalypsis") proving the Hebrews
came from India. Based, of course, on hundreds of pages of the usual
rubbish.

[Myself Mallu, Yourself?]

It is really funny to see a non-Hindu like Lady Kaka (aka the Muckeraj
with a phony doctorate) go apeshit about everybody and everything having
roots in India and/or Hinduism. I am sure there are equally koooky Jews
who would take the same trash and spin a story that has lost tribes
scattered worldwide, including India. Could someone persuade Lady Kaka
to move (back) to Israel? Maybe she can copy-paste herself over?

--
VB, Ubetjotushy
'ome=shanty

-----
About the Jihadi Loon Squad:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
A jihadi loon is someone like Jade Muckeraj.

"Jade Muckeraj" aka "The Old Cow of Hawaii" <char...@fraudsrus.com>
tries her best to pretend she is a Hindu -- cutting and pasting, and
even doctoring what others post/write about Hindus/Hinduism on the
internet, deliberately pidginizing Sanskrit and providing wrong
translations, inventing brand new books in the Mahabharat (reducing it
to Muckabharat), stalking and abusing people who disagree with her by
hijacking their posts, and then cuts and pastes about Hindu ethics and
moans self-righteously about honesty -- and succeeds spectacularly in
convincing all, except other jihadi loons, that she is not a Hindu.
She is in fact a creepy jihadi loon, who thinks she owns the newsgroup
s.c.indian, and has absolutely no problem slandering anyone. As a
Indian citizen supposedly, she meddles in US political issues, and
advocates civil war in India.

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

About goon 'Myself, Mallu. Yourself?' (V. Bhattathiri)
<KalluM...@gmail.com[ and the goon's flunky and sexual pervert
Dayashankar M. Joshi 'DMJoshi' <jos...@gmail.com[
[Rakesh Tiwari, Satish Kumar write]

About the terrorist Goon Squad:

As everyone knows, a goon is a bully or thug who terrorizes or tries
to do away with opposition.

"Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluM...@gmail.com[
tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah" <us...@this.com[, and issues
*death threats* to people), is priming himself for conditions such as
stroke and heart disease. Others in the Goon Squad include
Dayashankar M. Joshi "DMJoshi" <jos...@gmail.com[ who displays
unquestioning obedience to Goon Squad thugs, and the instigator who
posts as "Bholu" <bh...@hotmail.com[

The Goon Squad currently post most of their abuse through eternal-
september.org and by writing someone else's name or handle in the
"From:" header -- their favorite now is "fana...@gmail.com" (note
the extra "b" and "gmail.com") to make it appear as if the posts are
from "fan...@aol.com", who has been a regular poster for many years.
-Updated on February 2, 2012-

-----

Sexual pervert Dayashankar Joshi

Take proven sexual pervert Dayashankar M. Joshi to see his
psychiatrist

In article <beaa3407-6b54-423d...@m5g2000prh.googlegroups.com[,
Rakesh <rtiwa...@yahoo.com[ posted:
[
[ On Jul 21, 11:55=C2=A0am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[ On Jul 21, 2:01=C2=A0am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[ On Jul 21, 9:33=C2=A0am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[ On Jul 21, 1:28=C2=A0am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[ On Jul 21, 9:24=C2=A0am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[[ On Jul 21, 12:52=C2=A0am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[[[ On Jul 21, 8:44=C2=A0am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote=
[ :
[[
[[[[[[[[ On Jul 21, 12:25=C2=A0am, DMJoshi <dmjos...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[[[[[ On Jul 21, 8:15=C2=A0am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ w=
[ rote:
[[
[[[[[[[[[[ On Jul 20, 10:37=C2=A0pm, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wro=
[ te:
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[ On Jul 20, 6:25=C2=A0pm, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.co=
[ m[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[[ On Jul 20, 6:31=C2=A0am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ =
[ wrote:
[[[[[[[[[[[[[ On Jul 19, 10:33=C2=A0pm, Rakesh <rtiwary...@yahoo.=
[ com[ wrote:
[[[[[[[[[[[[[[ Joshijee, what is you relationship with Harrow's =
[ Saeeda Khan?
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[[[ Not that I remember unless she is your mother.
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[[ His Holeness Dayananda Joshi's memory wasn't notewort=
[ hy even at the
[[[[[[[[[[[[ best of times. Now at 73, it may have become worse un=
[ less His Holeness
[[[[[[[[[[[[ is indulging in subterfuge by feigning forgetfulness.
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[[ Saeeda Khan may have come to know His Holeness Dayash=
[ ankar Joshi
[[[[[[[[[[[[ through Hansaben. Saeeda Khan and Hansa Joshi were bo=
[ th born and
[[[[[[[[[[[[ brought up in East Africa.
[[
[[[[[[[[[[[ How did your mother come to know me?
[[
[[[[[[[[[[ Stop hallucinating. Nobody's mother or sister wants to kn=
[ ow you.
[[
[[[[[[[[[ Yours are dripping sticky on their =E0=A4=AB=E0=A5=81=E0=A4=
[ =A6=E0=A5=8D=E0=A4=A6=E0=A5=80s
[[
[[[[[[[[ You are already 73
[[
[[[[[[[ And yet it is my =E0=A4=B2=E0=A5=8C=E0=A4=A1=E0=A4=BE
[[[[[[[ that is on your mind all your waking hours and
[[[[[[[ in your dreams.
[[
[[[[[[ Get a grip on yourself. Your catheter-ridden penis
[[
[[[[[ How do you know of it if you did not suck it?
[[
[[[[ Your male nurse at Nothwick Park Hospital has been
[[[[ bad-mouthing your catheter-ridden penis.
[[
[[[ You are sucking his =E0=A4=B2=E0=A5=8C=E0=A4=A1=E0=A4=BE as well.
[[
[[ At 73, you do yourself no favor by indulging in such fantasies.
[[ Without a course correction, you are certain to return to earth as a
[[ cockroach in your next life.
[[
[[ If you are not ready for vanaprastha, try reading the Geeta. If you
[[ try sincerely, you might be able to shake your mind off such unholy
[[ dreams.
[[
[[ BTW, does Hansa Joshi know about your posts? Or do you do them behind
[[ Hansaben's back? Be careful. If she ever comes to know of your dirty
[[ posts, she might make you =C2=A0gulp down a bottle of drain cleaner to
[[ cleanse you of filthy dreams.
[[
[
[ This indeed is the real problem for DM Joshi - he is endangering not
[ just his future in th next world but even his present in this world.
[
[
[ Hansa Joshi is unlikely to take kindly to DM Joshi if she finds out
[ what he has been posting behind her back. And, then, yes, Hansaben
[ might very well force drain cleaner into DM Joshi to unclog the filthy
[ dreams bottled inside him.

Take proven sexual pervert Dayashankar M. Joshi to see his psychiatrist

Dayashankar has proven himself to be quite vulgar of mind and
expression. He has also demonstrated that he publishes lies as well
as malicious defamataion based on lies.

One may wish to contact Deep Joshi, Hansaben Joshi, Vikesh Khakhar
and Rashmi Khakhar about making sure that sexual pervert Dayashankar
M. Joshi gets to see his psychiatrist regularly. Perhaps they can
help.

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

[ Subject: Re: His Holeness Dayashankar M. Joshi's addiction and fear
[ of withdrawal pains
[ From: Rakesh <rtiwa...@yahoo.com[
[ Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.indian.gujarati,
[ soc.culture.indian.marathi,soc.culture.indian.delhi,
[ soc.culture.indian.kerala
[ Message-ID: <edef513e-1aa4-4e48-9ce2-
[ 10393e...@g3g2000prf.googlegroups.com[
[ Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2011 14:25:18 -0700 (PDT)
[
[
[ On Jul 19, 12:25 pm, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[ On Jul 17, 12:05 am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[ On 7/18/2011 4:10 AM, DMJoshi wrote:
[[
[[[[ When Bhadve do Bhadwai what do they sell after they have
[[[[ oversold their own holes?
[[
[[[ You are hankering for that for your mother and sisters no doubt.
[[
[[ His Holeness Dayashankar M. Joshi's addiction and fear of withdrawal
[[ pains:
[[
[[ His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi is addicted to fantasies about
[[ committing "Back Hole Balaatkaar" upon fellow netizens, their mothers
[[ and their sisters. He needs psychiatric care. But so afraid is His
[[ Holeness Dayashankar Joshi about withdrawal pains from trying to kick
[[ his addiction that he would rather jump off the Kenton Bridge or gulp
[[ down a bottle of toilet bowl cleaner than seek psychiatric care.
[[
[[ If His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi is not comfortable with his court-
[[ appointed psychiatrist at Cygnet Hospital, he should heed Hansa
[[ Joshi's advice to go to another psychiatrist. Unfortunately, Hansa
[[ Joshi is yet to persuade His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi to pay a visit
[[ to a psychiatrist at the Northwick Park Hospital which has an
[[ excellent psychiatric ward.
[
[ What does Harrow woman Saeeda Khan have to do with DM Joshi? Is she
[ Joshijee's employer? Psychiatrist? Nurse? Landlord ?
[
[ Has Joshijee been day dreaming about "mounting" Saeeda Khan's "back
[ hole" as well?
[
[ Joshijee needs to overcome his fear of withdrawl pain in coping with
[ his mental addiction to "back holes". The sooner he seeks psychiatric
[ help the better.
[
[ Hansa Joshi is to be commended for her efforts to get Joshijee
[ admitted into Northwick Park Hospital. Good psychiatric care would
[ make a big difference to the quality of whaever is left of 73-year
[ Joshijee's life.
[
[ Hansaben has my sympathies. She is in my thoughts and prayers. May
[ her efforts make a difference in Joshijee' remaining life.
[
[ - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
[
[ Subject: Re: His Holeness Dayashankar M. Joshi's addiction and fear
[ of withdrawal pains
[ From: Satish Kumar <sk_...@yahoo.com[
[ Newsgroups: soc.culture.indian,soc.culture.indian.gujarati,
[ soc.culture.indian.marathi,soc.culture.indian.delhi,
[ soc.culture.indian.kerala
[ Message-ID: <88d0e589-e837-4174-88b4-
[ 777dca...@j14g2000prn.googlegroups.com[
[ Date: Tue, 19 Jul 2011 16:33:04 -0700 (PDT)
[
[
[ On Jul 19, 2:25 pm, Rakesh <rtiwary...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[ On Jul 19, 12:25 pm, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[ On Jul 17, 12:05 am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[[ On 7/18/2011 4:10 AM, DMJoshi wrote:
[[
[[[[[ When Bhadve do Bhadwai what do they sell after they have
[[[[[ oversold their own holes?
[[
[[[[ You are hankering for that for your mother and sisters no doubt.
[[
[[[ His Holeness Dayashankar M. Joshi's addiction and fear of withdrawal
[[[ pains:
[[
[[[ His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi is addicted to fantasies about
[[[ committing "Back Hole Balaatkaar" upon fellow netizens, their mothers
[[[ and their sisters. He needs psychiatric care. But so afraid is His
[[[ Holeness Dayashankar Joshi about withdrawal pains from trying to kick
[[[ his addiction that he would rather jump off the Kenton Bridge or gulp
[[[ down a bottle of toilet bowl cleaner than seek psychiatric care.
[[
[[[ If His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi is not comfortable with his court-
[[[ appointed psychiatrist at Cygnet Hospital, he should heed Hansa
[[[ Joshi's advice to go to another psychiatrist. Unfortunately, Hansa
[[[ Joshi is yet to persuade His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi to pay a visit
[[[ to a psychiatrist at the Northwick Park Hospital which has an
[[[ excellent psychiatric ward.
[[
[[ What does Harrow woman Saeeda Khan have to do with DM Joshi? Is she
[[ Joshijee's employer? Psychiatrist? Nurse? Landlord ?
[[
[[ Has Joshijee been day dreaming about "mounting" Saeeda Khan's "back
[[ hole" as well?
[[
[[ Joshijee needs to overcome his fear of withdrawl pain in coping with
[[ his mental addiction to "back holes". The sooner he seeks psychiatric
[[ help the better.
[[
[[ Hansa Joshi is to be commended for her efforts to get Joshijee
[[ admitted into Northwick Park Hospital. Good psychiatric care would
[[ make a big difference to the quality of whaever is left of 73-year
[[ Joshijee's life.
[[
[[ Hansaben has my sympathies. She is in my thoughts and prayers. May
[[ her efforts make a difference in Joshijee' remaining life.
[
[ Saeeda Khan may have come to know His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi
[ through Hansaben. Saeeda Khan and Hansa Joshi were both born and
[ brought up in East Africa. Now Saeeda Khan and Dayashankar Joshi are
[ both in trouble with the law. Here's a post by His Holeness
[ Dayashankar Joshi on Saeeda Lhan:
[
[ On Oct 26 2010, 2:16 am, DMJoshi <dmjos...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[ On Sep 14, 8:10 am, DMJoshi <josh...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[http://www.harrowtimes.co.uk/news/8388381.Not_guilty_plea_in_first_mo...
[[
[[[ Wonder from where on Indian subcontinent her ancestors migrated to
[[[ Tanzania(Tangnika)
[[
[[ She is going to be prosecuted
[[
[[ http://www.harrowtimes.co.uk/news/8473827.Harrow_woman_to_face_trial_...
[[
[[ There was a Gujarati Hindu woman very likey from Harow or Brent who
[[ was jailed for long period for the same crime.
[
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

-----

In article <c3ce4583-1855-4319...@p29g2000pre.googlegroups.com[,
Rakesh <rtiwa...@yahoo.com[ posted:
[
[ On Jul 20, 2:00 am, Satish Kumar <sk_c...@yahoo.com[ wrote:
[[ On Jul 20, 1:47 am, "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?"
[[
[[ <KalluMallu...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[[ On 7/20/2011 1:37 AM, Satish Kumar wrote:
[[
[[[[ On Jul 20, 1:19 am, "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?"
[[[[ <KalluMallu...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[[[[ On 7/18/2011 3:36 PM, Rakesh wrote:
[[
[[[[[[ On Jul 18, 5:04 am, "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?"
[[[[[[ <KalluMallu...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[[[[[[ On 7/18/2011 4:10 AM, DMJoshi wrote:
[[
[[[[[[[[ On Jul 18, 11:59 am, "Myself, Mallu. Yourself?"
[[[[[[[[ <KalluMallu...@gmail.com[ wrote:
[[
[[[[[[[[[ Bhadave ho ya naheen, inki maa-behen se kya taalluq?
[[
[[[[[[[[ When Bhadve do Bhadwai what do they sell after they have
[[[[[[[[ oversold their own holes?
[[
[[[[[[[ Namaaloom.
[[
[[[[[[ crap deleted
[[
[[[[[ Based on this rant of yours, all I can say is "pot-kettle-
[[[[[ black." No one ever compelled you to reply to Joshiji's posts,
[[[[[ esp. if you did not think highly of them in the first place.
[[
[[[[ Tiwary might not care much for your "whiter than pot-kettle"
[[[[ posturing either. But I suspect he might consider sympathizing
[[[[ with you if His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi comments on "back
[[[[ holes" that are closer to you than were in this case..
[[
[[[ Bollocks! I do not give Joshiji the opportunity to make such
[[[ comments to me. You write provocatively, you'll get your
[[[ comeuppance. Spare me the crap.
[[
[[ Not impressed with your rant. Look through His Holeness
[[ Dayashankar Joshi's posts in this thread. If "writing
[[ provocatively" is the excuse, then His Holeness Dayashankar
[[ Joshi has nothing to complain about - he had asked for what
[[ he got from Tiwary.
[[
[[ Tiwary himself has commented on this in previous posts - by
[[ selectively taking exception to posts by His Holeness dayashankar
[[ Joshi's victims, you are either unwittingly or deliberately
[[ encouraging him to make "such comments".
[
[ Precisely.
[
[ Satishjee, I can quite understand why you are unimpressed by Shriman
[ Bhattahiri's show of indignant outrage.
[
[ And, anyway, Shriman Bhattahiri lives in a glass house. His posts are
[ seldom anything other than of the "provocative/patronizing" genre. But
[ that should never be an acceptable excuse for anyone to indulge in
[ fantasies about Shriman Bhattahiri's "back hole" or that of his mother
[ and sisters. I can't quite fathom why Sriman Bhattahiri has taken to
[ upholding His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi's penchant for sodomy-laced
[ vulgar outbursts. Does he hope to get named in Joshijee's will ?!
[
[ Shriman Bhattahiri may have his own reasons to harbor tender feelings
[ for His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi. But he does His Holeness
[ absolutely no good (and only harm) by selectively expressing distaste
[ for posts by His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi's victims. It makes His
[ Holeness conclude that it is cute to "react viscerally" to
[ "provocations" and "patronizing replies" by indulging in vulgar
[ outbursts about sodomizing the "enemy" and his mother and sisters as
[ well. Unwittingly or deliberately, Shriman Bhattahiri is encouraging
[ His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi to continue to indulge in his fantasies
[ about "back holes".
[
[ Shriman Bhattahiri's expression of indignant outrage is at best a case
[ of naivety. At worst, Shriman Bhattahiri is acting agent provocateur
[ egging on His Holeness beyond the "Hole-y Rekha" so that he can enjoy
[ the show from the sideline. With friends like Shriman Bhattahiri, His
[ Holeness Dayashankar Joshi has little hope of recovery from his mental
[ disorder.
[
[ Far better (and kinder) if His Holeness Dayashankar Joshi is told
[ that he should never ever skip sessions with his psychiatrist. Far
[ better (and kinder) to encourage His Holeness to heed Hansa Joshi's
[ entreaties to seek treatment at the psychiatric ward at Northwick Park
[ Hospital if he is really all that unhappy with his court appointed
[ psychiatrist at Cygnet Hospital.
[
[ Shriman Bhattahiri does His Holeness DM Joshi no favor but a great
[ deal of harm by feeding into his illusion that he is cute when he
[ spews "back holes,, mothers and sisters".

Which court appointed a psychiatrist for Dayashankar, why and when?

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

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Since newsgroup posts are being removed
by forgery by one or more net terrorists,
this post may be reposted several times.

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

In article <7f7d6e8f-d6fe-463e...@l14g2000vbe.googlegroups.com>,
The General of the Faceless Anti-Franz Shadow Army <craoi...@gmail.com> posted:
>
> . . .

The URL contained in the original post was deleted by craoi...@gmail.com

The original post is reproduced below:

Forwarded post from V.

Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

Saturday, March 3, 2012

"A scholar finds compelling evidence for ancient Indian influence on
a global scale."

Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

In article <23500286.710.1330978910249.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynlr19>,
fanabba <fan...@aol.com> posted:

> Dhanyavaad for your post !

You are welcome.

> Please sse the book:
>
> Jesus and Moses Are Buried in India, Birthplace of Abraham and the Hebrews
> [Paperback] Gene Matlock (Author)
>
> http://www.amazon.com/Jesus-Buried-Birthplace-Abraham-Hebrews/dp/0595127711/ref=sr_1_3?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1330978869&sr=1-3

Dhanyavaad for the book recommendation!

I posted the following in 1997:

[ Subject: Jesus Lived in Bharat (that is, India)
[ From: Dr. Jai Maharaj
[ Date: March 19, 1997
[
[
[ According to pqp5...@is.nyu.edu (Prasad Popuri)
[ in article <4b5le0$...@babbage.ece.uc.edu>, of 19 Dec 1995:
[ >
[ > Jesus Lived In India Author: Holger Kersten
[ > [...] The tomb of Jesus still exists in Kashmir"
[
[
[ Here are two excerpts from an account published in 1983 by
[ Harvard-educated Andres Takra, a member of the Venezuelan
[ diplomatic corps in Delhi, the founder of the Sociedad Naturista de
[ Venezuela, and director of the Takra Institute:
[
[ "I visited twice the ROZABAL, or 'Burial Ground of the Saint,'
[ allegedly the tomb of Jesus, Issa, Yusu, or Yuza Asaf, as he is
[ called by Muslims . . . located in a miserable sector of Shrinagar.
[ There, inside a dirty, desolate, ruined, unkempt, ugly shrine, an
[ illiterate and dumb guide shows you, next to the tomb, the eloquent,
[ scarred, big imprints of the feet of a man on a black stone smeared
[ with candle wax. It is said Jesus expired here and was subsequently
[ buried with his head facing east (following the Jewish custom) by
[ his faithful disciple Thomas, who had accompanied him since
[ Palestine and who could have gone with him to the Americas. Thomas
[ was stoned to death in Madras, South India, and was buried there
[ [...]
[ ". . . This time we visited the Rozabal, Gulmarg and Yusmarg,
[ or 'Field of Jesus,' [path of Jesus - JM] where Jesus went through
[ when he came from Pakistan shortly after his mother, Mary, had
[ died. . . ."

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> rubbish.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

If not genetic kinship - strong influence between Semitic and IE
cannot be ruled out so easily.

Specific to India:

http://www.amazon.com/Between-Jerusalem-Benares-Comparative-Hinduism/dp/0791417158

Other IE:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_Vennemann

http://grzegorj.w.interia.pl/lingwen/iesem1.html

This one pertains to Arabic, but if true calls into question another
item of evidence for IE "laryngeals".

http://lexiline.blogspot.com/2007/06/laryngeal-theory-lexiline-journal-457.html

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 6, 1:38 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> http://www.amazon.com/Between-Jerusalem-Benares-Comparative-Hinduism/...

This is a book advertised for sale from Amazon, comparing Hinduism and
Judaism. "A Customer" liked it. What on earth do you expect us to
learn from that?

>
> Other IE:
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_Vennemann

Vennemann is a real linguist, proposing evidence for IE-Semitic (or A-
A) contact, with a totally different scenario from Matlock & Co. Not
many people buy it, but at least he knows what he's doing.

> http://grzegorj.w.interia.pl/lingwen/iesem1.html

Sigh. Another enthusiast adding nothing to the lengthy history of
discussion of IE-Semitic similarities.

>
> This one pertains to Arabic, but if true calls into question another
> item of evidence for IE "laryngeals".
>

> http://lexiline.blogspot.com/2007/06/laryngeal-theory-lexiline-journa...

...and another clueless amateur who thinks he's discovered something.

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Mar 5, 9:49 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
> On Mar 6, 1:38 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_Vennemann
>
> Vennemann is a real linguist, proposing evidence for IE-Semitic (or A-
> A) contact, with a totally different scenario from Matlock & Co. Not
> many people buy it, but at least he knows what he's doing.

Phil Baldi and someone reviewed TV's "Vasco-Semitica" or whatever it's
called book from the Latinist point of view -- he sent me the ms. a
long time ago; I think it was for *Lingua*.

They didn't find much credible in it.

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

In article <23500286.710.1330978910249.JavaMail.geo-discussion-forums@ynlr19>,
fanabba <fan...@aol.com> posted:
>
> On Sunday, March 4, 2012 3:29:50 AM UTC-5, Dr. Jai Maharaj wrote:

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti

o o o

About the terrorist Goon Squad:

"Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri) <KalluM...@gmail.com>
tries his best to be a bully -- telling others what and when to post,
where to post and where not to post, deliberately publishing lies
about others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but fails
miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his lap dog Prem
Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah" <us...@this.com>, and issues
*death threats* to people), is priming himself for conditions such as
stroke and heart disease. Others in the Goon Squad include
Dayashankar M. Joshi "DMJoshi" <jos...@gmail.com> who displays
unquestioning obedience to Goon Squad thugs, and the instigator who
posts as "Bholu" <bh...@hotmail.com>

The Goon Squad currently posts most of their abuse through eternal-

[Arindam Banerjee]

Where else could they have come from? Jews and GujJEWs have got along
so intimately, vid our great unca and his BigJew boyfriend forming two
houses of parliament.

Based, of course, on hundreds of pages of the usual

> rubbish.-

Of course, of course.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> ...and another clueless amateur who thinks he's discovered something.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Here's a monumental study of the subject:

http://www.turuz.info/Sozluk/0159-Semitic%20and%20indo-European.%20The%20principal%20etymologies%20with%20observations%20on%20Afro-Asiatic(ingilisce)(541d)(11.164KB).pdf

Also:

http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965

[anal...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 6, 8:41 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> http://www.turuz.info/Sozluk/0159-Semitic%20and%20indo-European.%20Th...
>
> Also:
>
> http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

http://www.jolr.ru/files/(54)jlr2011-5(1-22).pdf

Very current research - makes a compelling case for AA-IE influence
and perhaps Moeller was right after all - to the extent IE had
"laryngeals" they were real laryngeals from AA.

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 8, 1:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> >http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965-Hide quoted text -

>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> http://www.jolr.ru/files/(54)jlr2011-5(1-22).pdf
>
> Very current research - makes a compelling case for AA-IE influence
> and perhaps Moeller was right after all - to the extent IE had
> "laryngeals" they were real laryngeals from AA.

"Makes a compelling case", does it? Can we quote you on that? or did
you copy it from a publisher's/editor's blurb? And would you care to
comment on how this relates to your repeated contention that PIE
laryngeals were an absurdity, if not an obscenity?

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> > >http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965-Hidequoted text -

>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> >http://www.jolr.ru/files/(54)jlr2011-5(1-22).pdf
>
> > Very current research - makes a compelling case for AA-IE influence
> > and perhaps Moeller was right after all - to the extent IE had
> > "laryngeals" they were real laryngeals from AA.
>
> "Makes a compelling case", does it? Can we quote you on that? or did
> you copy it from a publisher's/editor's blurb? And would you care to
> comment on how this relates to your repeated contention that PIE

> laryngeals were an absurdity, if not an obscenity?- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Found this tremendous data source.

http://starling.rinet.ru/index2.php?lan=en

The Anatolian IE evidence seems not to support the structural reasons
IE "Larynegeals" were conjectured in the first place. Anatolian IE
laryngeals are simply there and and this research shows
correspondences of the type AA Laryngeal to related IE words without
it, and in many cases without Anatolian IE attestation.

While Nostratic maybe a pure flight of fancy, the Russians'
comparative research across macrofamilies deserves careful study..

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 9, 2:41 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> > > >http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965-Hide...text -

>
> > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > >http://www.jolr.ru/files/(54)jlr2011-5(1-22).pdf
>
> > > Very current research - makes a compelling case for AA-IE influence
> > > and perhaps Moeller was right after all - to the extent IE had
> > > "laryngeals" they were real laryngeals from AA.
>
> > "Makes a compelling case", does it? Can we quote you on that? or did
> > you copy it from a publisher's/editor's blurb? And would you care to
> > comment on how this relates to your repeated contention that PIE
> > laryngeals were an absurdity, if not an obscenity?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Found this tremendous data source.
>
> http://starling.rinet.ru/index2.php?lan=en
>
> The Anatolian IE evidence seems not to support the structural reasons
> IE "Larynegeals" were conjectured in the first place.

Really? Could you be more specific as to how it fails to support?

Anatolian IE
> laryngeals are simply there and and this research shows
> correspondences of the type AA Laryngeal to related IE words without
> it, and in many cases without Anatolian IE attestation.

So what exactly are you proposing/admitting now? Anatolian laryngeals
are "simply there" (whatever you mean by that)? PIE did not have
laryngeals but a putative Nostratic ancestor did? Or what?

>
> While Nostratic maybe a pure flight of fancy,

If it is, then the Russian stuff you're getting excited about means
nothing at all.

the Russians'
> comparative research across macrofamilies deserves careful study..

I'm sure this opinion will be very gratifying to those who are
following it.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> > > > >http://linguistlist.org/pubs/reviews/get-review.cfm?SubID=165965-Hide...-

>
> > > > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > > >http://www.jolr.ru/files/(54)jlr2011-5(1-22).pdf
>
> > > > Very current research - makes a compelling case for AA-IE influence
> > > > and perhaps Moeller was right after all - to the extent IE had
> > > > "laryngeals" they were real laryngeals from AA.
>
> > > "Makes a compelling case", does it? Can we quote you on that? or did
> > > you copy it from a publisher's/editor's blurb? And would you care to
> > > comment on how this relates to your repeated contention that PIE
> > > laryngeals were an absurdity, if not an obscenity?- Hide quoted text -
>
> > > - Show quoted text -
>
> > Found this tremendous data source.
>
> >http://starling.rinet.ru/index2.php?lan=en
>
> > The Anatolian IE evidence seems not to support the structural reasons
> > IE "Larynegeals" were conjectured in the first place.
>
> Really? Could you be more specific as to how it fails to support?
>
> Anatolian IE
>
> > laryngeals are simply there and and this research shows
> > correspondences of the type AA Laryngeal to related IE words without
> > it, and in many cases without Anatolian IE attestation.
>
> So what exactly are you proposing/admitting now? Anatolian laryngeals
> are "simply there" (whatever you mean by that)? PIE did not have
> laryngeals but a putative Nostratic ancestor did? Or what?
>
>

And according to this gentleman - "Indo-Hittite" is back,

http://starling.rinet.ru/Texts/anatnost.pdf

So can we all go home now?

Brugmann et al. seem to have reconstructed "Narrow Indo European".
How can Hittite, that lacks the widely attested core IE words for
"husband", "wife", "son","daughter", "father", "mother", "brother" and
"sister" (an observation that can never be seen in boilerplate
writings - Kazanas however didn't miss it) shed any light on anything
to do with core IE?

The incomplete delaryngealization of Anatolian IE just a fact that has
no structural implications for core IE - any support it seems to give
to Saussure's fantasies are just coincidence (if you throw a bunch of
'h's at a language - some would land where Saussure would have
expected them and as always no statistical studies exist to eliminate
the possibility that some h's being in the right place are due to
chance).

>
> > While Nostratic maybe a pure flight of fancy,
>
> If it is, then the Russian stuff you're getting excited about means
> nothing at all.
>
> the Russians'
>
> > comparative research across macrofamilies deserves careful study..
>
> I'm sure this opinion will be very gratifying to those who are

> following it.- Hide quoted text -

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Mar 10, 10:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

Presence or absence of specific vocabulary items has nothing
whatsoever to do with demonstrating whether languages are related and
what their family tree is.

> The incomplete delaryngealization of Anatolian IE just a fact that has
> no structural implications for core IE - any support it seems to give
> to Saussure's fantasies are just coincidence (if you throw a bunch of
> 'h's at a language - some would land where Saussure would have
> expected them and as always no statistical studies exist to eliminate
> the possibility that some h's being in the right place are due to
> chance).

Do share with us the psycholinguistic and sociolinguistic mechanisms
by which h's are "thrown" at a language and "land" someplace.

Which statistical methods in lingujistics have you investigated?

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 11, 4:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

What? You still at the playground?

>
> Brugmann et al. seem to have reconstructed "Narrow Indo European".
> How can Hittite, that  lacks the widely attested core IE words for
> "husband", "wife", "son","daughter", "father", "mother", "brother" and
> "sister" (an observation that can never be seen in boilerplate
> writings - Kazanas however didn't miss it) shed any light on anything
> to do with core IE?
>
> The incomplete delaryngealization of Anatolian IE just a fact that has
> no structural implications for core IE - any support it seems to give
> to Saussure's fantasies are just coincidence (if you throw a bunch of
> 'h's at a language - some would land where Saussure would have
> expected them and as always no statistical studies exist to eliminate
> the possibility that some h's being in the right place are due to
> chance).
>

So it's still a mystery what your latest fit of excitement is about.
Hittite laryngeals, you say, are just a random occurrence, with no
relation to PIE, or to Saussure's theory, or to Semitic (those
"uncivilized languages" which have actual laryngeals).
In which case all this Nostratic stuff is of no significance at all.
A year or so ago I thought you were writing a book. Now it's like
you've completely run out of ideas.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 10, 11:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Loooks like Nature (the journal) sets the bar low for linguists:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/nov/27/highereducation.artsandhumanities

[Nathan Sanders]

In article
<88eb47e3-065e-471b...@b18g2000vbz.googlegroups.com>,

"anal...@hotmail.com" <anal...@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Loooks like Nature (the journal) sets the bar low for linguists:
>
> http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/nov/27/highereducation.artsandhumanities

Russell Gray isn't a linguist.

Nathan

--
Department of Linguistics
Swarthmore College
http://sanders.phonologist.org/

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 14, 1:05 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

> http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2003/nov/27/highereducation.artsandhuman...

If you've been paying attention here over the last few years, you'll
have noticed that quite a number of those big-name, high-impact
science journals seem to have low bars (or no bar at all) for
linguistics papers.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> linguistics papers.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Dr, Gray's bio/publications page shows he has solid academic
credentials. Hard to explain why he would publish something like this
and also claim

'Russell’s research has made significant contributions to the fields
of linguistics, animal cognition, philosophy of biology and
behavioural phylogenetics. He pioneered the application of
computational evolutionary methods to questions about linguistic
prehistory. This work has helped solve the 200 year-old debate on the
origin of Indo-European languages, dubbed by Diamond and Bellwood
(2003) as “the most recalcitrant problem in historical linguistics”.'

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 14, 2:28 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

His background is in biological/evolutionary classification.
His job is with a Psychology Department.
As Nathan pointed out, he's not a linguist, and doesn't claim to be,
though he may claim to have made contributions to linguistics.

 Hard to explain why he would publish something like this
> and also claim
>
> 'Russell’s research has made significant contributions to the fields
> of linguistics, animal cognition, philosophy of biology and
> behavioural phylogenetics. He pioneered the application of
> computational evolutionary methods to questions about linguistic
> prehistory. This work has helped solve the 200 year-old debate on the
> origin of Indo-European languages, dubbed by Diamond and Bellwood
> (2003) as “the most recalcitrant problem in historical linguistics”.'

Perhaps it will help the rest of us get up to your speed if you can
explain why this is hard to explain?
And why you are suddenly excited about this blog about a 2003 paper of
Gray's?

[Ruud Harmsen]

"benl...@ihug.co.nz" <benl...@ihug.co.nz> schreef/wrote:

>On Mar 14, 2:28 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>wrote:
>> On Mar 13, 8:53 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > On Mar 14, 1:05 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > wrote:
>>
>> > > On Mar 10, 11:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > On Mar 9, 4:16 am, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > On Mar 9, 2:41 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > > > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > On Mar 7, 10:23 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > On Mar 8, 1:45 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > > > > > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > On Mar 6, 8:41 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > > > > > > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > > On Mar 5, 9:49 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > > > On Mar 6, 1:38 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
>> > > > > > > > > > wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 4, 11:22 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>> > > > > > > > > > > > On Mar 5, 2:22 pm, The General of the Faceless Anti-Franz Shadow Army
>>
>> > > > > > > > > > > > <craoibhi...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > > > > On 4 mar, 10:29, use...@mantra.com and/orwww.mantra.com/jai(Dr. Jai
>>
>> > > > > > > > > > > > > Maharaj) wrote:
>> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Forwarded post from V.

This I will not read.

--
Ruud Harmsen,
http://rudhar.com/new

[Peter T. Daniels]

On Mar 14, 5:01 am, Ruud Harmsen <r...@rudhar.com> wrote:

> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > Maharaj) wrote:
> >> > > > > > > > > > > > > > Forwarded post from V.
>
> This I will not read.

But you'll leave in dozens of lines above to say you won't read it?

[anal...@hotmail.com]

> Gray's?- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

His work has been discussed in some linguistic forum - I forget
which. It looks like he used methods similar to Ringe's (i.e,
sophomoric) - but at least his word list might be of interest. As the
"great white hope" to dethrone Sanskrit - Hittite seems really pitiful
and but for the mistaken notion that it supports Saussure's structural
conjectures the laryngeal fad might not have proliferated to the
extent that it has.

This view from 1969 seems reasonable (inexplicably, JSTOR gives one
free access)

http://cafe.rapidus.net/hwittman/linguistique/1969d-ied.pdf

"we find for
Hittite indices of 1.95 and .42 comparable
to the 1.90 and .46 indices for Modern
Bengali."

He gives

"Vedic 2.56 .08
Classical Sanskrit 2.59 .09"

(the first index is the synthesis index, second one the agglutination
index).

S S Misra has independently found many MIA feattures in Hittite.

It seems to be a creole or hybdrid language spoken by a rump IE
speaking population that moved to Anatolia whose language was
afterwards influenced massively by local non-IE langauges. The
"relaryngealization" swimming against the general IE current was
either accidental (like English sprouting the glottal stop in the last
century or so) or due to local influence.

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 15, 2:59 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

Of course. He's made widely-pubicized claims about linguistic matters.
I still haven't figured out what your point is here.

 It looks like he used methods similar to Ringe's (i.e,
> sophomoric)

In other words, the similarity of his methods to Ringe's consists in
nothing but your ignorant contempt for both.

- but at least his word list might be of interest.

Why? He hasn't discovered any new data.

As the
> "great white hope" to dethrone Sanskrit -

Only in some overheated Indian imaginations.

Hittite seems really pitiful
> and but for the mistaken notion that it supports Saussure's structural
> conjectures the laryngeal fad might not have proliferated to the
> extent that it has.
>
> This view from 1969 seems reasonable (inexplicably, JSTOR gives one
> free access)
>
> http://cafe.rapidus.net/hwittman/linguistique/1969d-ied.pdf
>
> "we find for
> Hittite indices of 1.95 and .42 comparable
> to the 1.90 and .46 indices for Modern
> Bengali."
>
> He gives
>
> "Vedic 2.56 .08
> Classical Sanskrit 2.59 .09"
>
> (the first index is the synthesis index, second one the agglutination
> index).

And what is supposed to be the significance of these figures?

> S S Misra has independently found many MIA feattures in Hittite.

Who? Another of J-Doc's stable of nitwits?

>
> It seems to be a creole or hybdrid language spoken by a rump IE
> speaking population that moved to Anatolia whose language was
> afterwards influenced massively by local non-IE langauges.  The
> "relaryngealization" swimming against the general IE current

Does this mean that you see a general "delaryngealization" current
among other IE languages?

was
> either accidental (like English sprouting the glottal stop in the last
> century or so)

...which was not "accidental" in any imaginable sense of the word.

> or due to local influence.

Interim summary: You still have not got a clue what you are talking
about. You can't even give coherent explanations of what triggers your
periodic fits of excitement.

[António Marques]

benl...@ihug.co.nz wrote (15-03-2012 02:54):
> On Mar 15, 2:59 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com"<analys...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>> As the "great white hope" to dethrone Sanskrit -
>
> Only in some overheated Indian imaginations.

(Sanskrit was somehow in/on a throne?)

> Interim summary: You still have not got a clue what you are talking
> about. You can't even give coherent explanations of what triggers your
> periodic fits of excitement.

Isn't it a hormonal thing?

[Franz Gnaedinger]

Shiva and Jahwe have the same origin. They,
as many other gods including Jupiter and Zeus,
go back to a Magdalenian formula invoking the
weather god

ShA PAD TYR AS CA
DhAG PAD TYR AS CA

ruler ShA able DhAG activity of feet PAD to overcome
in the double sense of rule and give TYR upward AS
sky CA - the able ruler goes ahead and overcomes
in the double sense of rule and give up above in
the sky ... This double formula is a quarry of divine
names. ShA PAD TYR became Jupitter Jupiter Jovis
Giove, originally a weather god in the guise of a bull.
DhAG PAD TYR became Dis Pater, byname of Jupiter.
ShA PAD TYR AS CA Giobe AS CA Giubiasco names
a village on a bend of the river Ticino in southern
Switzerland, where the lovely Italian landscape of
the Lago Maggiore with Ascona and Locarno goes
over into the grim scenery of the Alps, a place where
tradesmen heading for north implored good weather,
while those who came from the north thanked for the
good weather and the luck they had in traversing
the mountains by throwing precious objects into
the river (many have been found, many more are
still buried in the river bed). TYR became emphatic
Middle Helladic Sseyr (Phaistos Disc, Derk Ohlenroth)
Doric Sseus (Wilhelm Larfeld) Homeric Zeus. Also
Zeus was originally a weather god, and also he could
appear as a bull. DhAG became Dios, byname of Zeus.
TYR CA became Turc-. ShA PAD became Shiva, and
TYR CA Durga, an emanation of Shiva's wife. TYR
became the androgynous sun archer TIr of the
Armenain Bronze Age. The variation SA TYR NOS,
mind NOS of the one who overcomes in the double
sense of rule and give TYR from above, in downward
direction SA, became Saturnus Saturn, founder of the
golden age in Latium, mentioned as TYRSANOS on
an Etruscan shard found in the agora of Athens.
TYR AS became *tiwaz and then Tir, Norse god of
justice and war, TYR alone Thor, god of thunder.
TYR in the emphatic Middle Helladic form of Sseyr
has a cognate in the Serri bull of the Hurrians and
Hittites, a weather god. Another cognate is the name
of Mount Seir in the Negev, abode of Jahwe, a storm
god and 'rider of clouds', worshipped as a bull on top
of a hill near Samaria. His name enfolds the long
double formula to ShA CA and DhAG CA, while
ShA DhAG may account for Judaea, (land under
the heavenly) ruler, the able one. DhAG meaning
able, good in the sense of able, is a word of very
many derivatives, among them English day, invoking
the god as "father of day" (Bob Dylan, New Morning).

Shape shifting was part of mythology and is reflected
in variations of the religious formulae. DhAG PAD TYR
became Dis pater, byname of ShA PAD TYR Jupitter
Jupiter Jovis Giove, dyaus pita in Vedic Sanskrit,
and Illyrian Dei-patrous. The Greek version would have
been Dios pataer, however, DhAG Dios was replaced by
TYR Sseyr Sseus Zeus, and the formula became Zeus pataer.
DhAG meaning able, good in the sense of able, and TYR
meaning overcomer, as verb to overcome in the double
sense of rule and give, are part of an older formula
invoking the goddess, DhAG TYR DhAG, wherefrom Greek
thygataer Dios and Sanskrit duhita dive, while the
variation DhAG DhAG TYR became Lithuanian dievo dukte.
The able overcomer who ruled and gave had once been
the goddess but was turned into the daughter of the god,
for example Athene, one of many emanations of the goddess,
became the daughter of Zeus, emerging from his head in
full armour, sign of her ancient power.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 14, 10:54 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>
wrote:

except of course the dictionary sense

"arising from extrinsic causes : incidental, nonessential
2a : occurring unexpectedly or by chance b : happening without intent
or through carelessness and often with unfortunate results"

I believe a general delaryngealization as time progresses (including
in Arabic etc.) is universal in all speech-communties that have gone
on to develop literature and high culture, for the simple reason that
the tongue-root area cannot produce the variety of sounds that can be
produced further forward with the dorsum, middle and tip of the
tongue.

I suspect that the production of radical sounds uses a different area
of the brain than the area that controls fine-motor activity used for
regular sounds.

The English glottal stop seems to have originated from poor speakers
(cockneys) and then diffused all the way up to Royalty. Our good
Dusan has also cited modern day laryngealization of Serbian by Bosnian
Muslim Serbs as a form of identity politics.

But the overall trend is probably universal - especially given the
present day pressure on all languages to either die or become more
like English.

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 17, 2:30 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
wrote:

> On Mar 14, 10:54 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
> > On Mar 15, 2:59 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > Does this mean that you see a general "delaryngealization" current
> > among other IE languages?
>
> > was
>
> > > either accidental (like English sprouting the glottal stop in the last
> > > century or so)
>
> > ...which was not "accidental" in any imaginable sense of the word.
>
> except of course the dictionary sense
>
> "arising from extrinsic causes : incidental, nonessential
> 2a : occurring unexpectedly or by chance b : happening without intent
> or through carelessness and often with unfortunate results"

Which of these senses are you suggesting applies to the glottalization
in English??

>
> I believe a general delaryngealization as time progresses (including
> in Arabic etc.) is universal in all speech-communties that have gone
> on to develop literature and high culture, for the simple reason that
> the tongue-root area cannot produce the variety of sounds that can be
> produced further forward with the dorsum, middle and tip of the
> tongue.

Neither can the lips, but we do not observe a corresponding
progressive delabialization.

> I suspect that the production of  radical sounds uses a different area
> of the brain than the area that controls fine-motor activity used for
> regular sounds.

Assuming that you have suddenly started to refer to laryngeal sounds
as "radical" and non-laryngeals as "regular", you would at least have
a testable hypothesis here -- though even if true it would not prove
your historical claim.

>
> The English glottal stop seems to have originated from poor speakers
> (cockneys) and then diffused all the way up to Royalty.  Our good
> Dusan has also cited modern day laryngealization of Serbian by Bosnian
> Muslim Serbs as a form of identity politics.

And therefore doesn't count as a counterexample to your proposed
trend??

> But the overall trend is probably universal - especially given the
> present day pressure on all languages to either die or become more
> like English.

Really, this makes less sense the more you elaborate it.

You now seem willing to admit that IE languages had laryngeals in the
past, something you vehemently denied in the past. But, you claim,
there is a universal trend to get rid of laryngeals. Except, it seems,
for /h/. And except of course for languages that introduce them, like
English (and others one could name).
And you've still never revealed how long your list of "civilized
languages" is.

[anal...@hotmail.com]

On Mar 16, 11:16 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>

wrote:
> On Mar 17, 2:30 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Mar 14, 10:54 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Mar 15, 2:59 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> > > wrote:
> > > Does this mean that you see a general "delaryngealization" current
> > > among other IE languages?
>
> > > was
>
> > > > either accidental (like English sprouting the glottal stop in the last
> > > > century or so)
>
> > > ...which was not "accidental" in any imaginable sense of the word.
>
> > except of course the dictionary sense
>
> > "arising from extrinsic causes : incidental, nonessential
> > 2a : occurring unexpectedly or by chance b : happening without intent
> > or through carelessness and often with unfortunate results"
>
> Which of these senses are you suggesting applies to the glottalization
> in English??
>

2b sounds like something I might have come up with specifically to
characterize it - amazing to find it in the dictionary.

>
>
> > I believe a general delaryngealization as time progresses (including
> > in Arabic etc.) is universal in all speech-communties that have gone
> > on to develop literature and high culture, for the simple reason that
> > the tongue-root area cannot produce the variety of sounds that can be
> > produced further forward with the dorsum, middle and tip of the
> > tongue.
>
> Neither can the lips, but we do not observe a corresponding
> progressive delabialization.
>

Don't be silly. apart from p,b,f,v - lip rounding gives us u,w,o and
the labials can easily form clusters with resonants. But all radicals
sound like r,g or h and try making clusters with them.

> > I suspect that the production of  radical sounds uses a different area
> > of the brain than the area that controls fine-motor activity used for
> > regular sounds.
>
> Assuming that you have suddenly started to refer to laryngeal sounds
> as "radical" and non-laryngeals as "regular", you would at least have
> a testable hypothesis here -- though even if true it would not prove
> your historical claim.
>
>
>
> > The English glottal stop seems to have originated from poor speakers
> > (cockneys) and then diffused all the way up to Royalty.  Our good
> > Dusan has also cited modern day laryngealization of Serbian by Bosnian
> > Muslim Serbs as a form of identity politics.
>
> And therefore doesn't count as a counterexample to your proposed
> trend??
>
> > But the overall trend is probably universal - especially given the
> > present day pressure on all languages to either die or become more
> > like English.
>
> Really, this makes less sense the more you elaborate it.
>
> You now seem willing to admit that IE languages had laryngeals in the
> past, something you vehemently denied in the past. But, you claim,
> there is a universal trend to get rid of laryngeals. Except, it seems,
> for /h/. And except of course for languages that introduce them, like
> English (and others one could name).
> And you've still never revealed how long your list of "civilized

> languages" is.- Hide quoted text -

>
> - Show quoted text -

Burrow is just about the only writer who doesn't turn into a teenage
girl swooning over a rock star when discussing Hittite and Saussure.

There are two unrelated things going on.

(1) h's in Hittite not present in cognate IE proper.

(2) h's in Hittite where Saussure prediced a "Sonant
Coefficient" (this would be subset of (1)).

Burrow is none too happy as to how much Hittite supports (2).

The problem is that h/no-h also distiguishes IE and AA/Semitic in a
significantly large number of related words. Did some ancestor of IE
proper have these 'h's? - its possible. I would then say that Old
Indian removed them through a language committee type process and
reexported a cleaner PIE. Saussure's structural conjectures remain
conjectures and are totally implausible considering the Indian
evdience as a whole.

[benl...@ihug.co.nz]

On Mar 18, 2:48 am, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>

wrote:
> On Mar 16, 11:16 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>
> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Mar 17, 2:30 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> > wrote:
>
> > > On Mar 14, 10:54 pm, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz>
> > > wrote:
>
> > > > On Mar 15, 2:59 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > > Does this mean that you see a general "delaryngealization" current
> > > > among other IE languages?
>
> > > > was
>
> > > > > either accidental (like English sprouting the glottal stop in the last
> > > > > century or so)
>
> > > > ...which was not "accidental" in any imaginable sense of the word.
>
> > > except of course the dictionary sense
>
> > > "arising from extrinsic causes : incidental, nonessential
> > > 2a : occurring unexpectedly or by chance b : happening without intent
> > > or through carelessness and often with unfortunate results"
>
> > Which of these senses are you suggesting applies to the glottalization
> > in English??
>
> 2b sounds like something I might have come up with specifically to
> characterize it - amazing to find it in the dictionary.

Ah. So this is a technical description within your own personal theory
of sound change, where some sound changes are intentional and others
are "through carelessness", some have "fortunate" and others
"unfortunate" results?

>
> > > I believe a general delaryngealization as time progresses (including
> > > in Arabic etc.) is universal in all speech-communties that have gone
> > > on to develop literature and high culture, for the simple reason that
> > > the tongue-root area cannot produce the variety of sounds that can be
> > > produced further forward with the dorsum, middle and tip of the
> > > tongue.
>
> > Neither can the lips, but we do not observe a corresponding
> > progressive delabialization.
>
> Don't be silly.  apart from p,b,f,v - lip rounding gives us u,w,o

Not independently of other articulators it doesn't. And despite your
caricature, the range of "radical" sounds and effects is just as
great.

and
> the labials can easily form clusters with resonants.  But all radicals
> sound like r,g or h

And all labials sound like ba-ba wa-wa. Really, this is childish.

>and try making clusters with them.

Speakers of languages that actually have them can hear the
differences, and make clusters with them.

Oh yes, we really are back in sci-fi linguistics land.

[ranjit_...@yahoo.com]

On Mar 4, 4:29 am, use...@mantra.com and/or www.mantra.com/jai (Dr.
Jai Maharaj) wrote:
> Is There A Connection Between Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?=
> http://www.viewzone.com/matlock.html

According to the Tower of Babel story, Indians were cursed with
Sanskrit:->
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tower_of_Babel

[and/or www.mantra.com/jai]

Is There A Connection Between
Ancient Indian And Hebrew Language?

A scholar finds compelling evidence for ancient Indian
influence on a global scale.

ViewZone welcomes this highly researched work by scholar,
Gene D. Matlock, which is part of his complete manuscript
showing the global influence of ancient India's culture
and language. We welcome your comments and thoughts.

http://www.viewzone.com/matlock.html

Jai Maharaj, Jyotishi
Om Shanti


o o o

About the terrorist Goon Squad:

"Myself, Mallu. Yourself?" (V. Bhattathiri)
<KalluM...@gmail.com> tries his best to be a bully --
telling others what and when to post, where to post and
where not to post, deliberately publishing lies about
others, stalking and abusing them with hate speech -- but
fails miserably. He is really stressed out, and like his
lap dog Prem Thomas (who currently posts as "P. Rajah"
<us...@this.com>, and issues *death threats* to people),
is priming himself for conditions such as stroke and
heart disease. Others in the Goon Squad include
Dayashankar M. Joshi "DMJoshi" <jos...@gmail.com> who
displays unquestioning obedience to Goon Squad thugs, and
the instigator who posts as "Bholu" <bh...@hotmail.com>

The Goon Squad currently posts most of their abuse
through eternal-september.org and by writing someone
else's name or handle in the "From:" header -- their
favorite now is "fana...@gmail.com" (note the extra "b"
and "gmail.com") to make it appear as if the posts are
from "fan...@aol.com", who has been a regular poster for
many years.
-Updated on February 2, 2012-

[Myself Mallu, Yourself?]

Not all Indians, only 'bhaiyyas.' ;-) That explains why the old cow Lady
Kaka (aka the Muckeraj) can only spout pidgin Sanskrit (probably good
enough for jyotishit ventures).

--
VB, Ubetjotushy
'ome=shanty

-----
About the Jihadi Loon Squad:
---------------------------------------------------------------------
A jihadi loon is someone like Jade Muckeraj.

"Jade Muckeraj" aka "The Old Cow of Hawaii" <char...@fraudsrus.com>
tries her best to pretend she is a Hindu -- cutting and pasting, and
even doctoring what others post/write about Hindus/Hinduism on the
internet, deliberately pidginizing Sanskrit and providing wrong
translations, inventing brand new books in the Mahabharat (reducing it
to Muckabharat), stalking and abusing people who disagree with her by
hijacking their posts, and then cuts and pastes about Hindu ethics and
moans self-righteously about honesty -- and succeeds spectacularly in
convincing all, except other jihadi loons, that she is not a Hindu.
She is in fact a creepy jihadi loon, who thinks she owns the newsgroup
s.c.indian, and has absolutely no problem slandering anyone. As a
Indian citizen supposedly, she meddles in US political issues, and
advocates civil war in India.

[yangg]

***

This is irrelevant.
I'm afraid you just don't understand why laryngeals are posited in the first place.

A.
***

Anatolian IE
> laryngeals are simply there and and this research shows
> correspondences of the type AA Laryngeal to related IE words without
> it, and in many cases without Anatolian IE attestation.
>
> While Nostratic maybe a pure flight of fancy, the Russians'
> comparative research across macrofamilies deserves careful study..

***

Can't you see the sheer absurdity of your sentence?

A.

[yangg]

On Sunday, March 11, 2012 4:45:48 AM UTC+1, anal...@hotmail.com wrote:
> On Mar 9, 4:16 am, "benli...@ihug.co.nz" <benli...@ihug.co.nz> wrote:
> > On Mar 9, 2:41 pm, "analys...@hotmail.com" <analys...@hotmail.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> >

>
> Brugmann et al. seem to have reconstructed "Narrow Indo European".
> How can Hittite, that lacks the widely attested core IE words for
> "husband", "wife", "son","daughter", "father", "mother", "brother" and
> "sister" (an observation that can never be seen in boilerplate
> writings - Kazanas however didn't miss it) shed any light on anything
> to do with core IE?

***

Hittite attaS is "father" and Luwian has daughter kbatra.

A.
***