What a shame - Abdullah's stupidity!!!!!
Dušan Vukotić
Unbelievable!
Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk-
etymologist!
Below is the excerpt from the so-called "Proto-Indo-European
Etymological Dictionary", the book Abdullah has recently advertised.
______________________________________________________
[...meigh-, also meik-
[...Gk.αμορβος “dark” derived from Alb. mje(r)gule ̈ “ fog, darkness
“ [common Gk. β < gw, p <
kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that from Root mer-2 ; *extended
mer-ek-: “to shimmer,
shine” derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : “to glimmer,
twinkle; mist”...]
Abdulah does not know that his αμορβος is αμαυρόβιος in reality,
which means "living in darkness" (in fact αμαυρός + βίος; αμαυρώνω /
tarnish, blacken/; βίος life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrakčina, mračno,
mrko (dark, darkness, dusk):
____________________________________________________________
Such foolishness could hardly be expect from an average highschool
student!
DV
Dušan Vukotić
If Abdullah were not so uneducated he would understand that even MORON
and MAROON belonged to the MURKY (Serb. MRKI dark or gloomy) sides of
this world. ;-)
DV
phog...@abo.fi
> What a shame!
> Unbelievable!
> Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk-
> etymologist!
Would you please tell us what is actually crap or unbelievable about
it?
Abdullah Konushevci
Stupidity, your name is Dušan.
Mixing Gr adjective amorbos 'dark', where /b/ is from *gW and -os is
simple masculine ending of adjectives, pretending to connect it with
amauros and further with bios, speaks for itself who the hell you are
and what is your level of education on linguistics.
But, I used to be attacked constantly from such outraged or manikos,
if you like it in Greek, person.
Simply, don't wait to answer on your provocations. I am feed-up from
such kind of craziness. So, Hasta la Vista, baby!
Abdullah Konushevci
I am to much educated to understand that dark side of Serbians is
VUKOTIC and others like him. Hasta la Vista, baby!
phog...@abo.fi
Never was a truer word spoken! :D
Dušan Vukotić
>
> - Show quoted text -
Have you had any decent Greek dictionary in you hands? Obviously not!
If you had one you would not talk nonsense! If you read a proper Greek
you would know it was not me who connected Greek αμαυρός and βίος
into the compound αμαυρόβιος (living in darkness);
αμαυρός + βίος = αμαυρόβιος: and αμορβος is just one of the
contracted forms of teh compound αμαυρόβιος (cf. αμορβαιος); there
is no man in the whole world (of an avarage intelligence) who would
not notice that.
Why did you put your prosthetic <R> between brackets - mje(r)gule? Why
did you not follow Demiraj who, without blinking, inserted <R> into
the Albanian word 'mjegull' (fog, mist, haze). If there was a
dialectal form of Albanian mjegull with the sound 'R' without
brackets, why did you not mention it? Where is so-called Proto-
Albanian form mergulƒ? What happened, you do not recognize Demiraj as
an authority in Albanian "science"?
I know, your task is to promote Shqip-Illyrian language and so-called
Illyrian origin of the Albanian people. Nevertheless, you should be
aware it has always been impossible to make something from nothing!
Albanian mjegull is a clear borrowing from Greek ομίχλη (fog, mist):
Greek OMIKHLE - Serbian MAGLA => Albanian MJEGULL.
Do you really believe you can insert a sound wherever you find it
suitable? Are you so stupid to think that you can use your "magic
rubber eraser" as you like? Haven't you noticed, this is a serious
science!; and not your wanton hamlet's fair!
Finally, this ie book is not only Abdulah's shame; it is shame for
George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky who revised and recognized the
internet edition of the "updated" and "modernized" version of Julius
Pokorny’s Indogermanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch. Both of them
are bearing big responsibility for allowing Abdullah to diseminate his
foolishness and blemish the name and work of the great scientist
Julius Pokorny. I advise them (George and Alexander) to re-revise this
book agian and save their own honor and honor of those (probably
Soros) who financed them. Also, I think, George Starostin should think
what his father would say about such a negligence and irresponsible
behavior his son has manifested.
DV
This ie book (Proto-Indo-European Etymological Dictionary) is full of
Abdulah's material and logical flaws and I will point them out (one by
one) in the days to come.
phog...@abo.fi
Dušan Vukotić
> You are a very bad man.
What is the meaning of your words?
Please, explain it.
I have received a few anonymous messages with life-threatening
content.
Any chance that you to know who is trying to frighten with me?
DV
phog...@abo.fi
> On Jul 1, 8:44 pm, phogl...@abo.fi wrote:
>
> > You are a very bad man.
>
> What is the meaning of your words?
> Please, explain it.
You are a very bad man. You consistently insult people without any
discernible reason. That is what very bad men do.
>
> I have received a few anonymous messages with life-threatening
> content.
>
> Any chance that you to know who is trying to frighten with me?
You are a very bad man. People dislike bad men such as you. Among
those who dislike you are probably bad men, too. Some bad men are
obviously so bad that they would write you poison-pen letters. I don't
know who they are. I am a very good man and don't know anything about
the doings of bad men.
Dušan Vukotić
> On Jul 1, 10:32 pm, Dušan Vukotić <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Jul 1, 8:44 pm, phogl...@abo.fi wrote:
>
> > > You are a very bad man.
>
> > What is the meaning of your words?
> > Please, explain it.
>
> You are a very bad man. You consistently insult people without any
> discernible reason. That is what very bad men do.
Find only one example where I insulted anyone without being provoked
from the opposite side first.
DV
mb
> On Jul 1, 8:44 pm, phogl...@abo.fi wrote:
> I have received a few anonymous messages with life-threatening
> content.
As a certifiable paranoiac with extreme nationalist views and claim to
godlike knowledge, in a country of paranoiac nationalists, it is
absolutely no surprise. It would be surprising if you hadn't
> Any chance that you to know who is trying to frighten with me?
Perhaps your neighbors. Watch them carefully for oblique glances and
such signs. Or your costermonger, or the guy at the newsstand. Be
alert.
Dušan Vukotić
> Perhaps your neighbors. Watch them carefully for oblique glances and
> such signs. Or your costermonger, or the guy at the newsstand. Be
> alert.
Thanks for the warning! ;-)
DV
Dušan Vukotić
> What a shame!
> Unbelievable!
> Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk-
> etymologist!
>
> Below is the excerpt from the so-called "Proto-Indo-European
> Etymological Dictionary", the book Abdullah has recently advertised.
> __________________________________________________
>
> [...Gk.αμορβος “dark” derived from Alb. mje(r)gule ̈ “ fog, darkness
> “ [common Gk. β < gw, p <
> kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that from Root mer-2 ; *extended
> mer-ek-: “to shimmer,
> shine” derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : “to glimmer,
> twinkle; mist”...]
>
> Abdulah does not know that his αμορβος is αμαυρόβιος in reality,
> which means "living in darkness" (in fact αμαυρός + βίος; αμαυρώνω /
> tarnish, blacken/; βίος life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrakčina, mračno,
> mrko (dark, darkness, dusk):
> ____________________________________________________
>
> student!
>
> DV
abhro- (*hebhro-) Page-5
Maybe Illyr. VN Α'βροι, Thrac. PN Α'βρο- : Alb. (*Α'βροι) afronj
“bring close, squeeze”,
afër “near” similar to formations of Ltv. blaizit ‘squeeze, clash,
hit” : O.C.S. blizь, blizъ adv. “
nigh, near “ (lit. “ adjacent “).
______________________________________________________
Maybe Illyrian, maybe Martian...
Wrong! Albanian afroj, afer (squeeze, near) and O.C.S. blizь (Serbian
blizu /near, nigh, close to/) have nothing to do with each other,
because they are coming from different basis (afroj from BR-GON and
blizu from BEL-GON).
I wonder what "similar" Abdullah could have found between this two
words. Albanian afroj may be compared with the Serbian words prići
(from prigoniti; come closer) and prionuti (prijanja stick together,
cleave; cf. German Freund, English friend, Serbian prijatelj, prijan,
prika /friend/): once again Serbian prijanja (stick together, cleave)
<=> Albanian afroj/afronj (near, bring close, squeeze)... Of course
there are other cognates like Serbian prezanje/na-prezanje/pregnuće
(pressing), English press (from Latin presso, pressare); Greek βαρησις
(pressure, oppression); Serbian prignati/prigoniti (drive closer) and
the great number of words in other IE languages, which are expressing
the status of reciprocal action with the opposite directions.
DV
DV
phog...@abo.fi
> On Jul 1, 10:23 pm, phogl...@abo.fi wrote:
>
> > On Jul 1, 10:32 pm, Dušan Vukotić <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > On Jul 1, 8:44 pm, phogl...@abo.fi wrote:
>
> > > > You are a very bad man.
>
> > > What is the meaning of your words?
> > > Please, explain it.
>
> > You are a very bad man. You consistently insult people without any
> > discernible reason. That is what very bad men do.
>
> Find only one example where I insulted anyone without being provoked
> from the opposite side first.
For you, the difference between provocation and bona fide disagreement
is not clear. That is one of your hallmarks as a very bad and wicked
man.
Abdullah Konushevci
>
> - Show quoted text -
Cleansing the history through burning earth, a well-know strategy of
Serbian Army, was judged as a crime against humanity. The same could
be seen in your messages, cleansing the history through equation of
Illyrians with Martians. You have no clue about l/r shift in many PIE
roots, so what the hell do you ask from anyone to reply on your
disgusting posts. I will beg moderators of sci.lang to save some level
of decency, for VD and Alexander Lubotsky are two uncomparable
measures.
Konushevci
Richard Wordingham
> I will beg moderators of sci.lang to save some level
of decency, for VD and Alexander Lubotsky are two uncomparable
measures.
What moderators?
The only practical and lawful methods of dealing with DV are silence
(difficult to do) and education (I think the quality of his linguistics is
improving). I suspect that having his gmail.com account closed down for
abusive language and persecution would serve no useful purpose and would be
a wasted effort.
In the meantime, only wit can justify sinking to his level of discourtesy.
Richard.
Dušan Vukotić
On Jul 2, 5:50 am, "Richard Wordingham" <jrw0...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Have I done any discourtesy to you?
I do not remember you were reacting in the same way when Panu Höglund
posted the following message:
______________________________________________________________
http://groups.google.com/group/sci.lang/browse_thread/thread/e3c669dafbab7dff/1745e326a8580d99?lnk=gst&q=rape+daughter&rnum=7#1745e326a8580d99
[...Are there specific Serbian verbs for mass rapes and murders of
Muslim
girls, which seems to be the normal way for a Serbian man to indulge
in his "putenost" and a tradition in Serbia? How many did you rape
and
kill back in the nineties by the way? Are you proud?
> After "democratization" and "westernization", Serbia and other East-
> European countries are full of whores standing alongside the roads
> (Serb. put, puta). ;-)
How much does your daughter cost? One euro, or just fifty cents...]
______________________________________________________________
And the same man (Panu Höglund) is trying to explain everyone what a
bad man Dušan Vukotić is! O tempora, o mores!
As you can see I have been attacked very personally and in the most
hideous way. If I collected all slurs I received on Sci.lang it would
be a very large bundle of "nice" reading.
Only "unacceptable" words I used here were "moron", "idiot",
"dickhead" etc...; and I used similar words only as a self-defense
"weapon"; i.e. if someone had attacked me.
For instance, not so long ago, you were defending Abdullah's right to
attack me on Cybalist, although you new that I was banished from there
and that I was not in a position to defend myself. Did I show any
discourtesy against you concerning that discussion?
Not at all! And you must know it!
A few days ago you asked me a question and I think I answered it to
you as politely as possible. Is it not the truth?
Finally, I know that Lubotsky is a great authority in linguistic
circles and my intention was not to harm anyone (neither him nor G.
Starostin; I respect them both, including Straostin who once offended
me, unprovoked and behind my back); I just wanted to draw their
attention to something I consider as their big (unintentional)
oversight; at the same time, I was trying to protect the important
scientific name (J. Pokorny) from any misuse and charlatanism.
If my observations concerning Abdullah's interpretations in the
revised ie version of the Pokorny’s Indogermanisches Etymologisches
Wörterbuch were wrong, why nobody tried to explain were I was wrong;
instead, the most ferocious accusations started as I really have
offended anyone. There were only three relatively “violent” words I
used in this thread: stupidity, foolishness and crap, and all three of
them I find quite suitable for such an occasion. By the way, these
words are the part of "normal" everyday vocabulary on Sci.lang.
The fact is, whoever wrote to me politely received my answer in the
same manner. So it will be in the future.
DV
Dušan Vukotić
>
> - Show quoted text -
I cannot see what the Serbian army has to do with your linguistic
ignorance; stop complaining to everyone and try to be a grown up man.
What l/r shift, are we talking about Japanese kind of rhotacism?
Are you suggesting that Slavic bliz- turned to be Albanian afroj or it
happened the other way round.
Both of the above assumptions, in connection with l/r shift, are
wrong; maybe you have another (hidden) option on your mind. :-))
Blizu and afroj were born from different basis; are you really unable
to understand it?
DV
Dušan Vukotić
>
> - Show quoted text -
________________________________________________________________
ai-dh-, i-dh-, nasal. i-n-dh- (*heu̯i-ĝh-) Page-26
Maybe Alb. (*aestā-, *vesna, *vièsientá) vjeshta “autumn, harvest
time (long summer)”: Go. asans “harvest time, summer” [common Alb.
prothetic v- before bare initial vowels] hence Vesta “goddess of
hearth and its sacred fire” was an Illyrian goddess, also Alb. vatra
(*vastra) “hearth” with -tre suffix.
________________________________________________________________
If I were following the Abdullah's way of thinking I could say that
Vesta was a Serbian goddess, a reduced form of the Serbian ne-vesta
(bride, not married, unleashed); from the Serbian verb vezati (tie,
bond). If not from Serbian it could be from the English word fasten or
even West.
Abdulalh is somewhere inbetween because he believes that Roman goddess
Vesta (Greek Hestia) was in fact West-Illyrian or, closer, West-
Albanian female deity. Of course, quite logical, if Vesta was the
goddess of hearth (fireplace), it must be connected to some of the
words from the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian vocabulary... and of coruse, the
word 'vatër' imposed itself in a most natural way.
In fact, we are going to take the Albanian vatër (fireplace) in plural
form - 'vatra' -and "spice" it with the <s> infix. What we have
achieved? VASTRA! OK. With the help of the special Albanian
wRRRenching tool, the unnecessary R intRRRuder will be removed and -
VASTA is born! Finally, some fine ablaut-adjustment is needed before
we could see, in all her brilliancy, the Shqip-Illyro-Albanian female
SINGULAR deity - VESTA !!
DV
Dušan Vukotić
Deutsche Übersetzung: “worauf eindringen, treiben, überwältigen,
kränken”
Material: present *(a)i-neu-mi : O.Ind. inóti, ínvati, Imper.
inuhí, participle -inita- (úpenita- “ pushed, cut into “), “
penetrate into something, master “, Av. inaoiti, Inf. aēnaŋhe “
violate, hurt “, ainita (from *an-inita by haplology) “ not violated,
not painedly “ (from ai énas- n. “Crime, sin, misfortune “ = Av.
aēnah- “ act of violence, crime “, in addition m. “ evildoer”?),Av.
intay-” rape, injury; torture “, O.Ind. iná-‘strong; m. master “,
maybe also īti-ḥ f. “plague,need”; Gk. α ἰνός “tremendous”;
maybe Alb. inati “anger; ire; rage; dander; dudgeon;
rampage;down;disappointment;
malice; blood; rancour; rancor; pique; spunk; miff; temper;
must”.maybe here-in- in Goth. faír-ina “guilt, reproach”, O.H.G.
firinōn ‘sin”, O.Ice. firn n. pl. “the
extraordinary” (cf Weisweiler IF. 41, 29 f.), if original meaning (as
in the Heliand) “ act of violence “.
References: WP. I 1, Feist 139/140.
Page(s): 10
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 35
____________________________________________________________________
Albanian word <inat> (anger, grudge, resentment) is the loan word from
Serbian <inat> (defiance, grudge, anger); the basis of this word is
the reduplicated primal basis (Gon); most simply, it can be connected
to the Serbian word 'gonjenje' (driving, chasing) or English
'hunting'. Other cognate of the word 'inat' are the Serbian words
'junak' (hero) and 'junoša' (young man) and English 'young' (cf.
English anger, Greek ankhein squeeze; Latin ango press thight, cause
pain, strangle; Serbian 'uzano/usko' narrow from Serb. 'nagnati' press
together or 'ugoniti' drive in, as if driving the sheep into the
sheepfold); Serb. ganuti "feel the pain").
DV
phog...@abo.fi
> On Jul 2, 1:11 am, Dušan Vukoti <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jun 30, 8:20 pm, Dušan Vukoti <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > What a shame!
> > > Unbelievable!
> > > Similar crap you can hardly find even by the most stupid folk-
> > > etymologist!
>
> > > Below is the excerpt from the so-called "Proto-Indo-European
> > > Etymological Dictionary", the book Abdullah has recently advertised.
> > > __________________________________________________
> > > [...meigh-, also meik-
>
> > > " [common Gk. < gw, p <
> > > kw phonetic mutation]; Alb. proves that from Root mer-2 ; *extended
> > > mer-ek-: "to shimmer,
> > > shine" derived the truncated Root meigh-, also meik- : "to glimmer,
> > > twinkle; mist"...]
>
> > > which means "living in darkness" (in fact + ; /
> > > tarnish, blacken/; life); cf. Serbian mrak, mrak ina, mra no,
> > > mrko (dark, darkness, dusk):
> > > ____________________________________________________
>
> > > Such foolishness could hardly be expect from an average highschool
> > > student!
>
> > > DV
>
> > _____________________________________________________
> > abhro- (*hebhro-) Page-5
>
> > "bring close, squeeze",
> > afër "near" similar to formations of Ltv. blaizit 'squeeze, clash,
> > nigh, near " (lit. " adjacent ").
> > ______________________________________________________
> > Maybe Illyrian, maybe Martian...
>
> > blizu /near, nigh, close to/) have nothing to do with each other,
> > because they are coming from different basis (afroj from BR-GON and
> > blizu from BEL-GON).
>
> > I wonder what "similar" Abdullah could have found between this two
> > (from prigoniti; come closer) and prionuti (prijanja stick together,
> > cleave; cf. German Freund, English friend, Serbian prijatelj, prijan,
> > prika /friend/): once again Serbian prijanja (stick together, cleave)
> > <=> Albanian afroj/afronj (near, bring close, squeeze)... Of course
> > (pressing), English press (from Latin presso, pressare); Greek
> > the great number of words in other IE languages, which are expressing
> > the status of reciprocal action with the opposite directions.
>
> > DV
>
> > DV- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -
>
> Cleansing the history through burning earth, a well-know strategy of
> Serbian Army, was judged as a crime against humanity. The same could
> be seen in your messages, cleansing the history through equation of
> Illyrians with Martians. You have no clue about l/r shift in many PIE
> roots, so what the hell do you ask from anyone to reply on your
> disgusting posts. I will beg moderators of sci.lang to save some level
> of decency, for VD and Alexander Lubotsky are two uncomparable
> measures.
Abdullah, I am afraid sci.lang is not moderated. But as you see,
Dushan is simply a very bad and wicked man.
phog...@abo.fi
I could say that
> Vesta was a Serbian goddess,
Haven't you said it yet?
Abdullah Konushevci
Yes, yes. As Vesta, as inat and other words are form Serbian, but
seems that authors have no clue about Serbian and they show no respect
for DV. What a pity!
If you answer in a hurry what is -neu- in this word, I will start to
believe that your linguistic knowledge is improving. Hurry up! You
have only 2 minutes!
By the way, 'Vesta' and 'inat' are not my invention, even I could
testify that the cult of Virgin is dominant one in Albanian culture,
despite the fact that Alb hy 'god, Jesus', maybe only in Albanian,
shows that Gr huios 'son' take the meaning 'god'. So, so deeply they
are Christians that no other religion could depart them from their
Christianity.
Konushevci
Dušan Vukotić
____________________________________________________________________
aisk-
English meaning: bright, shining
Deutsche Übersetzung: “klar, hell, leuchtend”
Material: AwN.. eiskra “ rage before hot excitement “, Mod.Ice. iskra
also from burning pain. Lith. áiškus, where beside zero grade O.Lith.
iškùs “clear, bright “.
Russ. dial. jáska, demin. jásočka “ bright star “, beside it O.Bulg.
jasno adv. “clear, bright,distinct”, Russ. jásnyj “light, clear,
bright” from *aiskno-; Pol. jaskry, jaskrawy “blinding,dazzling,
brilliant “ from *aiskro-; O.Bulg. iskra “ spark “ etc. from *iskrā.
Maybe zero grade in Alb. (*aiskno-) shkëndijë ‘spark” [common Alb. n >
nd phonetic mutation]. Also Alb. zero grade (*jaskry), shkrinj “melt,
burn”, participle *scrum > shkrumb “ashes” [common Alb. m > mb shift]
loaned in Rom. scrum “ashes”. Russ. dial. jáska, demin. jásočka “
bright star “, besides O.Bulg. jasno adv. “ clear, distinct “, Russ.
jásnyj “ bright, clear “ from *aiskno; Pol. jaskry, jaskrawy “
brilliant, sparkling “ from *aiskro; O.Bulg. iskra ‘spark” etc. from
*iskrā.
Here the FlN Ger. Aisch (Bavaria), Eysch(en) (Luxembourg), nEng. Axe
from Celt. or
Ven.-Illyr. *Aiskā. Maybe Alb. (*aiskā) eshkë “mushroom (when dried
used to kindle the fire)” related to Lat.esca -ae f. “food, victuals,
esp. as bait”,
References: WP. I 2, Trautmann 4, Pokorny UrIllyr. 70, 113, M. Förster
Themse 839.
See also: perhaps originated from *aidh-sk- , or from *ai-sk- in āi-̆
4.
Page(s): 16-17
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 39
___________________________________________________________________
Slavic "iskra" (sparkle) and "jasno" (clear, bright) are not the
offsprings of the same "progenitor"; it means that the root *aisk-
could be the source only of the word 'iskra' (sparkle). What's
happened in reality? Slavic 'jasno' (bright, clear) is the word which
comes from the ancient Bel-Gon basis. 'Jasno' is a reduced form of the
verb 'bljesnuti' (flash; Ger. Blitz) and 'obasjati' (lighten); we can
throw the parallel here between Serbian bljesnuti (flash) => objasniti
(clarify) => jasno (clear, bright) and German blitzen (twinkling) =>
leuchten (shine, flash) => licht (light);
On the other side, Slavic 'iskra' was born from the basis Sur-Hor
(Serb. sagoreti, izgoreti /burn, cremate, burn down/. The Albanian
'shkrinj' (melt, burn) comes from the same Sur-Hor basis (and thanks
God, Abdullah finally put something right), and it is equal to Serbian
'izgaranje' (burning). Abdullah is also right here (although he is
uncertain as usual; his maybe-yes-maybe-no sanctuary!) when saying
that skrumb (char, cinder; not ashes as Abdullah claimed; ash/ashes =
hi/hira in Albanian) and Romanian scrum (ashes) belong to the words of
the same origin as Slavic 'iskra' (sparkle) and 'sagoreti/
izgoreti' (burn).
DV
Dušan Vukotić
>
> - Show quoted text -
Vesta is the name of the Roman goddess and do not try to impute me the
words I never said. If you want to quote me quote me exactly; do not
use Loony's corrupted tactics.
Remember that your Christian ancestors were men of honor and dignity!
This is what I said:
["...If I were following the Abdullah's way of thinking I could say
that
Vesta was a Serbian goddess, a reduced form of the Serbian ne-vesta
(bride, not married, unleashed); from the Serbian verb vezati (tie,
bond). If not from Serbian it could be from the English word fasten or
even West..."]
phog...@abo.fi
> This is what I said:
>
> ["...If I were following the Abdullah's way of thinking I could say
> that
> Vesta was a Serbian goddess, a reduced form of the Serbian ne-vesta
> (bride, not married, unleashed); from the Serbian verb vezati (tie,
> bond). If not from Serbian it could be from the English word fasten or
> even West..."]
That is not Abdullah's logic. That is Dushan's logic. In fact, if you
were seriously stating that, in would be entirely in character, and
nobody would be particularly surprised. Of course you will not admit
this, but then you are a very bad man.
Siridon Wolf
> On 2 heinä, 13:12, Du¨an Vukoti <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I could say that
>
> > Vesta was a Serbian goddess,
>
> Haven't you said it yet?
?!
Dušan Vukotić
aiu-, aiu-
Page(s): 17-18
Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 44
____________________________________________________
Let us compare Serbian adverb 'uvek' (always) and German
'ewig' (eternal). I hope we could agree that notion eternal is
closely
related with "always". In addition, we will see that Serbian word
'vek' has the meanings 'century' (a period of 100 years) and
"age" (lifetime). The other Serbian word, derived from the Bel-Gon
basis, is the adjective 'večno', which has the same meaning as the
above-mentioned German 'ewig' (eternal). Now it became clear that
Serbian 'uvek' is the cognate to German 'ewig'. ;-)
Abdullah is ALWAYS trying to find an Albanian word that could be
suitable for a certain Pokorny's root. And it would be OK if it were
not so compulsively done. In this case Pokorny found the Albanian
word
'eshe, (tanks to Norbert Jokl; Zeitraum, span of time), but I cannot
see how that word could be classified among the other IE words with
the meaning 'always'. Maybe Abdullah could help me to understand this
item better.
As I told many times before, Albanian language was compiled from the
surrounding languages, mostly from Greek, Italian and Serbian without
any rule or system. It is the reason why the Albanian language is so
difficult to decipher. For example. Albanian 'vjeshtë' means autumn
and 'vejushë' is widow. It is hard to say how this words suffered
such
a deep and unusual sound changes. Explanation probably lies in the
fact that Albanian adopted foreign words according to the way they
heard and understood it.
DV
Abdullah Konushevci
> _________________________________________________
> aiu-, aiu-
>
> Page(s): 17-18
> Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 44
> ____________________________________________________
> Let us compare Serbian adverb 'uvek' (always) and German
> 'ewig' (eternal). I hope we could agree that notion eternal is
> closely
> related with "always". In addition, we will see that Serbian word
> 'vek' has the meanings 'century' (a period of 100 years) and
> "age" (lifetime). The other Serbian word, derived from the Bel-Gon
> basis, is the adjective 'večno', which has the same meaning as the
> above-mentioned German 'ewig' (eternal). Now it became clear that
> Serbian 'uvek' is the cognate to German 'ewig'. ;-)
> Abdullah is ALWAYS trying to find an Albanian word that could be
> suitable for a certain Pokorny's root. And it would be OK if it were
> not so compulsively done. In this case Pokorny found the Albanian
> word
> 'eshe, (tanks to Norbert Jokl; Zeitraum, span of time), but I cannot
> see how that word could be classified among the other IE words with
> the meaning 'always'. Maybe Abdullah could help me to understand this
> item better.
No, I don't like to help you in no case, because you are bloody stupid
chauvinist.
> As I told many times before, Albanian language was compiled from the
> surrounding languages, mostly from Greek, Italian and Serbian without
> any rule or system. It is the reason why the Albanian language is so
> difficult to decipher. For example. Albanian 'vjeshtë' means autumn
> and 'vejushë' is widow. It is hard to say how this words suffered
> such
> a deep and unusual sound changes. Explanation probably lies in the
> fact that Albanian adopted foreign words according to the way they
> heard and understood it.
Could anyone on the world point out just an idiom, dialect or language
that exists or survive without having any rule or system. Really
chauvinism is an unhealed sickness.
>
> DV
Richard Wordingham
> On Jul 2, 5:50 am, "Richard Wordingham" <jrw0...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
>> In the meantime, only wit can justify sinking to his level of
>> discourtesy.
>Have I done any discourtesy to you?
Not directly that I recall, but your (DV) insults to others upset me.
> I do not remember you were reacting in the same way when Panu Höglund
posted the following message:...
There were no calls for action then. However, that message did dismay me,
and that is one reason for my comment above.
Richard.
Dušan Vukotić
> "Dušan Vukotić" <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Jul 2, 5:50 am, "Richard Wordingham" <jrw0...@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
> >> In the meantime, only wit can justify sinking to his level of
> >> discourtesy.
> >Have I done any discourtesy to you?
>
> Not directly that I recall,
> but your (DV) insults to others upset me.
What for instance? Just one example. please!? Can you remember any
specific insult I have uttered. Please, exclude words like "stupid",
"moron", "idiot" etc.; the words I have been honored with a hundreds
of times.
> > I do not remember you were reacting in the same way when Panu Höglund
>
> posted the following message:...
>
> There were no calls for action then.
No call for actions? Interesting answer! People of honor, like Heidi
and Helmut Wollmersdorfer, did not wait for call to condamn that
disgraceful behavior; Probabbly, Hoglund's words "dismayed" you.so
much that you remained "speechless"!?
> However, that message did dismay me,
> and that is one reason for my comment above.
What comment? Do you know what are you talking about? Hoglund's
loathsome message was the reason why you commented my "level of
discourtesy"?!
DV
phog...@abo.fi
> On Jul 2, 9:22 pm, Dušan Vukoti <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
> > _________________________________________________
> > aiu-, aiu-
>
> > Page(s): 17-18
> > ____________________________________________________
> > Let us compare Serbian adverb 'uvek' (always) and German
> > 'ewig' (eternal). I hope we could agree that notion eternal is
> > closely
> > related with "always". In addition, we will see that Serbian word
> > 'vek' has the meanings 'century' (a period of 100 years) and
> > "age" (lifetime). The other Serbian word, derived from the Bel-Gon
> > above-mentioned German 'ewig' (eternal). Now it became clear that
> > Serbian 'uvek' is the cognate to German 'ewig'. ;-)
> > Abdullah is ALWAYS trying to find an Albanian word that could be
> > suitable for a certain Pokorny's root. And it would be OK if it were
> > not so compulsively done. In this case Pokorny found the Albanian
> > word
> > 'eshe, (tanks to Norbert Jokl; Zeitraum, span of time), but I cannot
> > see how that word could be classified among the other IE words with
> > the meaning 'always'. Maybe Abdullah could help me to understand this
> > item better.
>
> No, I don't like to help you in no case, because you are bloody stupid
> chauvinist.
Don't use such long and learned words, Abdullah. He won't understand.
Just call him a very bad and wicked man.
To get this thread back to the overall topic: you might be the person
to tell us, what the exact difference is between Tosk and Gheg
languages.
Dušan Vukotić
pūk-1, peuk-
O.Ind. púccha-, -m “tail, member, rod” (kann *pu[k]-sko- sein); after
dem
buschigen Schwanz benannt, seems Goth. faúhō, O.Ice. fōa, O.H.G. foha
“ vixen “ (Gmc.-ōn), besides with masc. -s-: O.E. fox, O.H.G. fuhs
“fox” etc.; Lith. paustìs “Tierhaar”; Russ.-Pol. puch (*peukso-,
poukso-) “Flaumfedern, Daunen, feines wolliges Haar an animals” (outof
it Lith. pũkas “Flaumfeder”), Russ. pušistyj “fleecy, dense,
buschig”, pušnój továr“Pelzwerk”, Cz.-nsorb. o-puš (*puchъ), opyš
“tail”, Russ. opúška, opušina “edge (ofWaldes), hem, Verbrämung”.
Pokorny Page: 849
____________________________________________________
And what to say about Abdullah's scientific approach? Commenting above
Pokorny's root pūk-1, peuk- Abdullah claimed that...
[...Alb. suggests that Root pūk-1, peuk- : (thick-haired, *fox) is a
reduced root of older Lat.volpes “fox”, Gk. alôpêx a fox. Root
ulp-,lup-, lup- : [a kind of carnivore (fox, wolf)...]*.
In this case not only that Abdullah forgot to denote the Albanian word
(or whatever Albanian) that "suggest" something, but he also mixed
wolf and fox with dormouse (small furry-tailed squirrel-like rodent) -
Serbian puh. Although Abdullah can speak Serbian fluently (at school
he has been taught in Serbian) he did not connect the name
'puh' (dormouse) with the Serbian verb puhati/puhnuti (blow) and
adjective na-puhan (inflated, blown up). Logically, dormouse's tail
and body looks like "na-puhano" (inflated) because of its "blown-up"
fur hairs. The Serbian verb 'puhnuti' (blow, inflate) is cognate of
the English blow (both stemmed from Bel-Gon basis) and we can
understand it completely if we compare the meanings of English 'blow'
and Serbian verbs 'puhnuti' (blow) and 'puknuti' (explode).
On the other side is volpe (Latin belua, English wolf), derived from
the reduplicated Bel basis; and it means that 'puh' (dormouse) cannot
be compared with Latin volpe (fox; Greek alopex).
It could be interesting to mention that Serbian word 'lopov' (thief,
burglar; cf. volpe) has been derived from the same reduplicated Bel
basis. Theft and burglary are the main practices of that animal (fox),
including cunningness (Serbian lukav, lukavost) what is returning us
again to the Bel-Gon basis; i.e. to Slavic volk, vlk, Greek lycos)
Slavic volk (volf) is the word from the same source (Bel-Gon) as above
mentioned puh (dormouse).
The final conclusion is unquestionable: root pūk-1, peuk- is not and
cannot be the reduced form of ulp-,lup-, but the fact is that both of
these roots could be derived from the larger basis Bel-Bel-Gon, if we
consider Greek alopex (Serbian lopina, lopuža /thief/)...
Of course, this roots and different IE words for animals like wolf and
fox demand much deeper analyzis, for to be exposed in all possible
details.
DV
____________________________________
*Abdullah's above note is from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-Indo-
European Etymological Dictionary A Revised Edition of Julius Pokorny’s
Indogermanisches Etymologisches Wörterbuch http://dnghu.org/ -
"revised" by George Starostin and Alexander Lubotsky.
phog...@abo.fi
Dušan Vukotić
ulp-, lup- (*suilkW-)
And listen to this stupidity: "Maybe Alb. lopë “cow, (huge consuming
animal; cow eaten by wolves)”, llup “devour”, llapë “tongue” : Lith.
lapenti “to swallow food”. Page 2737; Pokorny 1179
_________________________________________________
Interesting, cow has been named in Albanian 'lopë' and, according to
Abdullah's opinion, it is related to the Latin word lupus (wolf); on
the other side, wolf is called ulk/ujk in Albanian. What a miraculous
Sqip-Illyrian naming; something in style of Polat Kaya, the "famous"
Turkish etymologist whose crankiness Abdullah mentioned recently, when
he attacked me, safely hidden behind Cybalist "moderated" curtain.
I just wander why the Albanians did not name sheep in accordance with
the Latin lupus/volpes; sheep is much more favorite pray for wolf/fox
than cow (particularly a grown up one!). Using such a special word and
sound-change "technology" there is nothing in the world that you
cannot "prove". Associated with two others great scientists, Abdulah
taught Pokorny that his root *lup- was derived from *ulkW- (most
sanative kw => p Indo-Illyrian sound change).
Neither Abdullah nor his two soul-trading mentors were able to
understand that Slavic volk (wolf) and lisica (fox) originated from
the Bel-Gon basis while lupus (wolf) and volpes (fox) sprang from the
reduplicated Bel ur-syllable. There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief,
crook; also lopina, lopuža, lopušina) which is obviously connected to
Latin lupus (wolf) and Greek αλωπεκίς/alopekis (fox) and... in
Serbian, the history of these words is clear.
I was talking many times here about the Bel-Gon basis and words like
English begin and Serbian pogon, waggon, way, voziti, Weg, pulse and
Serbian polazak (start, outset); In case of the noun volk and lisica
the word obilaziti (resort, range, roam); hence obilazak (visit) =>
(b)liska => lisica (fox) => lija; on the other side, Serbian word
'obilaženje' (in sense of visit) can also be uvlačenje (prowling, move
about in a predatory manner; from the sam Bel-Gon basis as
'obilaženje' visiting), uvlaka, volk, vuk (wolf).
In order to understand how interesting the development and history of
a certain words can be, let me mention the Latin word veterinus (from
vehiterinus; veho bear, carry, ride, pass), i.e. vehi-terinus is the
same as Serbian "vučna životinja" (burden-bearing or pulling animal).
Now we are coming back to the above mentioned "begining' and the words
pogon, waggon, way, voziti, Weg, pulse... However, Slavic 'volk' is
not a pulling animal although the Slavic "volk" name has been derived
from the noun 'vlačenje' (vlak, volk, vuk, vučji)...
And, please, do not mix Latin fera with German Tier or maybe with
Slavic 'zver', Swedish 'djur', Sanskrit 'tiryanc' (tiryan), dhúrya
(beast of burden)...
DV
_________________________________________________________
Artur Jachacy
> There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief, crook; also lopina, lopuža,
> lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latin lupus (wolf) and
> Greek αλωπεκίς/alopekis (fox) and... in Serbian, the history of
> these words is clear.
Polish _łupież_ 'dandruff'.
Artur
--
Gridneff: So the point is to get the message across,
without saying in so many words: You stupid fucking morons,
you're learning fucking elf languages!
Pan for Windows (beta) - <http://panbuilds.googlepages.com>
Dušan Vukotić
> Polish _łupież_ 'dandruff'.
Yeah... Interesting!
I am not sure here; probably from ljuska (shell); Serbian ljuspa
(scale, flake of dead epidermis).
Polish verbs obłupać, obłupić, obłupywać, obłuskać; Serbian ljuštiti
(take the shell off, peel); also nouns łupina, łuska (shell), Czech
lastura; Serbian ljuska, ljuštura.
It might be from list (sheet, leaf, blade); Polish liść, listek; From
the same basis as English blade
One of the rare Slavic words whose semantic values I cannot track
easy... ;-)
DV
Paul J Kriha
> On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 18:55:43 +0000, Dušan Vukotić wrote:
>
> > There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief, crook; also lopina, lopuža,
> > lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latin lupus (wolf) and
Obviously.
> > Greek αλωπεκίς/alopekis (fox) and... in Serbian, the history of
> > these words is clear.
>
> Polish _łupież_ 'dandruff'.
łupić, łupię ?
How do you spell "magnifying glas" in Polish? łupa?
Or "to peel"?
pjk
> Artur
Paul J Kriha
news:1184011001....@o61g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
It's not going to stop you now is it?
The dandruff is small, one needs to use a magnifying glass
to observe it. So via Polish the Serbian word was borrowed by
German as "die Lupe", right?. And your Czech "lastura" is
oblupiously from "la stvura", the creature.
Be a liška about it.
pjk
>DV
Artur Jachacy
> "Artur Jachacy" <arturj...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:f6u8ko...@arturj.invalid...
>> On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 18:55:43 +0000, Dušan Vukotić wrote:
>>
>> > There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief, crook; also lopina, lopuža,
>> > lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latin lupus (wolf) and
>
> Obviously.
>
>> > Greek αλωπεκίς/alopekis (fox) and... in Serbian, the history of
>> > these words is clear.
>>
>> Polish _łupież_ 'dandruff'.
>
> łupić, łupię ?
Yeah, then there's the other łupież (pillage, plunder), but it's not
my job to make it easier for Dušan.
> How do you spell "magnifying glas" in Polish? łupa?
Lupa.
> Or "to peel"?
Woken up in the middle of the night I'd say 'obierać'. I assume
you're looking for 'łupić' (again), which is outdated in this sense.
Paul J Kriha
> On Tue, 10 Jul 2007 17:17:11 +1200, Paul J Kriha wrote:
> > "Artur Jachacy" <arturj...@gmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:f6u8ko...@arturj.invalid...
> >> On Mon, 09 Jul 2007 18:55:43 +0000, Dušan Vukotić wrote:
> >>
> >> > There is a Serbian word 'lupež' (thief, crook; also lopina, lopuža,
> >> > lopušina) which is obviously connected to Latin lupus (wolf) and
> >> > these words is clear.
> >>
> >> Polish _łupież_ 'dandruff'.
> >
> > łupić, łupię ?
> Yeah, then there's the other łupież (pillage, plunder), but it's not
> my job to make it easier for Dušan.
>
> > How do you spell "magnifying glas" in Polish? łupa?
> Lupa.
>
> > Or "to peel"?
> Woken up in the middle of the night I'd say 'obierać'. I assume
> you're looking for 'łupić' (again), which is outdated in this sense.
> Artur
From this tiny sample I make a hazardous guess that the
Old Czech "loup-" corresponds to Polish "łup-".
Since the Germanic "Lupe" was borrowed as "lupa" into
both Czech and Polish I guess Cz. "lup-" will (probably)
correspond to P. "lup-".
Is there a Polish cognate of Cz "lupen" (a leaf) or "lupi'nek"?
pjk
Artur Jachacy
Nothing related to leaves. My dictionary tells me 'lupen' is 'liścień'
in Polish. 'Łupień' used to mean 'peel, shell', but the usual form
is 'łupina'.
Paul J Kriha
Okay, thanks, that doesn't work for me then.
Are there any Polish "-lup-" (i.e. not "-łup-") words of Slavic
provenance, i.e. not words like "lupa" which is a likely
borrowing from Gmc?
pjk
Dušan Vukotić
> > Is there a Polish cognate of Cz "lupen" (a leaf) or "lupi'nek"?
>
> Nothing related to leaves. My dictionary tells me 'lupen' is 'liścień'
> in Polish. 'Łupień' used to mean 'peel, shell', but the usual form
> is 'łupina'.
Your dictionary told you everything:
In this case we have similar relation to the one between Slavic volk
and English wolf - Bel-Gon (list, liska, lišć, platek leaf) and Bel-
Bel-Gon (oljupina, lepenka, lupen). Ljuska (shell, husk) comes from
the word blisko, blizak, blizko, blízký (nearby), like Serb. blizanci
(twins dvojke, dvojčata) while lupen and oljupina come from obljubiti,
oblepiti (copulate, stick together).
shell - powłoka, skorupka, wyłuskać, pokrywa
leaf - liść, płatek, listowie
Serbian - oljupina (shell, husk); lepenka (pasteboard) it seems that
English husk is related to Slavic luska/ljuska (shell, husk)
DV
Artur Jachacy
Not really, there's just the onomatopeic 'chlup' (splash) and its
derivatives.
>i.e. not words like "lupa" which is a likely borrowing from Gmc?
French, it seems (loupe).
> pjk
Paul J Kriha
Okay, thanks. A splash? What a lovely false friend.
The Cz 'chlup' is a bristle. 'Chlupaty'' is hairy.
I found the words "onomatopeic 'chlup'" somewhat disturbing. :-)
Furthermore, how can onomatopeic 'splash' not contain any
ž and ň sounds?
As in Cz <žbluňk>? :-)
pjk
> >i.e. not words like "lupa" which is a likely borrowing from Gmc?
>
> French, it seems (loupe).
příliš žluťoučký kůň úpěl ďábelské ódy
Dušan Vukotić
________________________________________________
ades-, ados-It seems Root ades-, ados- : ‘sort of cereal” evolved from
an older root *heĝh- “ a
kind of grain “. This root was suffixed with common -ska formant in
Gmc. branch Gmc. *atisk-
a-, while in Anatolian branch the root was suffixed with common PIE -
tar formant. The
old laryngeal (Centum ḫ- > a-, e- : Satem ḫ- > s- ) was lost except in
Hitt. and Arm. Clearly
Gmc. tongues borrowed the cognate from a reduced Lat. (*hattar-) ador -
is > Gmc. *at-isk-a-.
Finally zero grade in Alb. (< adō̆ris) *dris, drizë “thorny plant”, (<
dris) drithë “grain” where
the Lat. -is ending has been solidified.
The surprise is the phonetic mutation -ĝh- > -d- found only in Av. -
Illyr.- Balt languages*.
___________________________________________________________
Latin ador -is (grain, spelt) and granum -i (grain, seed). First, we
must know that these two Latin words came from the same Hor-Gon basis;
or more exactly, from the Hor-Goon and its inverted Gon-Hor basis (Cf.
Serbian <okretati> turn, rotate, revolve and <koturati> turn, rotate
revolve). Latin granum and Serbian zrno (grain) are a clear-cut
"products" of the "circle" (Serbian krug, Latin cicino, corona). In
Serbian, there are the words <okrug> and <kotar>, both with the
meaning 'district'; equal to Greek <agros> (χώρα) and Latin <regio -
onis> (region). Now, if we compare Serbian word <jedro> (nucleus,
core; from Gon-Hor basis) and Latin <ador> (grain; Gon-Hor basis
aagain) we will be able to comprehend the whole scale of phonetic
changes, which have metamorphosed inverted Hor-Gon basis in
accordance with the demands of different (in this case Latin and
Serbian) IE languages. Above mentioned Serbian <kotar> 'district' is
known in the northern part of Serbia as <atar> 'area' and it sounds
almost the same as Hittite <hattar> 'cereal'. These examples are
showing that the notion of 'circle' (Latin cirkino, Greek kirkos/
krigos, Serbian krug/kotur) has been very inspiring in sense of naming
different things in different IE languages.
Abdullah, as we can see from his above statement, tried again to
introduce his Illyrian confabulation as an undeniable fact.
Unfortunately, Lubotsky and G. Starostin helped him to advertise his
national dream in their newest edition of Pokorny's PIE Dictionary.
Namely, Abdullah is "surprised" by seeing that -ĝh- > -d- phonetic
mutation "could be found only in Av. - Illyr.- Balt languages" (of
course, an invented Illyrian is equal here to the compiled Albanian) .
In reality, Albanian <drithë> (grain) is a disguised loanword from
Serbian <jedro> 'nucleus', 'core' or Greek <σιτηρά> (Lat. ador grain).
On the other side, Albanian <drizë> 'thorny plant' has nothing to do
with the above "cereal" and "grain" words, because it was borrowed
from Greek - <ternax> 'stalk of the cactus' (cf. Serbian trn, English
thorn)
DV
Dušan Vukotić
ad(u)-, ad-ro- (*heĝhero)*
English meaning: water current
Deutsche Übersetzung: “Wasserlauf”
Note: From Root ang (h)ʷ i- : ‘snake, worm” derived Root akʷā- (more
properly ǝkʷā): ēkʷ-: “water, river”; Root eĝhero- : “lake, inner
sea”; Root ad(u)-, ad-ro- : “water current”: Illyr. pannon. VN
᾽Οσεριᾶτες [common Alb.-Illyr.-Balt -ĝh- > -d-, -z- phonetic
mutation]. From Root akʷā- “water, river” nasalized in *akue̯ nt-
(suffixed in -er, -or) derived Root au̯(e)-9, au̯ed-, au̯er- : “to
flow, to wet; water, etc.”
____________________________________________
What is the meaning of Abdullah's "common Alb.-Illyr.-Balt -ĝh- > -
d-, -z- phonetic mutation"? Did he ever hear about the "common" Slavic
kgh/czs palatalization?
What a shame for Lubotsky and G. Starostin: they allowed one
uneducated person to access Pokorny's PIE dictionary; doesn't matter
if it was electronic edition.
Slavic <ozero>, <jezero> lake has its completely transparent etymology
in Slavic languages and I do not understand that someone dares to say
that such a word belong to some confabulated (non-existent) Illyrian.
I already told that Albanian name for lake (liqen) is borrowed from
Romance <lac>, while the words like <vlagët> 'wet' and <baticë> (tide)
are loanwords from Serbian <vlaga> 'wetness' and <potok> 'brook,
stream' (Serbian 'poteći' run of water).
The Albanian words <uje> 'water' and <shi> are specially interesting
because in both words the elision of initial sounds ('v' or 'k') is
clearly visible: Namely, Albanian 'uje' is Slavic <voda>, probably
acquired via Serbian 'piti/pojiti' (drink; Albanian pi, pije => uje;
cf. Alb ujk wolf and Slavic volk/vlk/vuk) while <shi> must be a
shortened form of Serbian <KISHI> 'it's raining'; it means that
Albanians misheard that Serbian word - SHI instead of KI-SHI.
Finally there is Albanian <spërkatje> borrowed from Italian <spruzzo>
or Serbian <isprskati> 'splash'. We can see that there is not a
single word in sense of water that Albanians inherited from their
Caucasian motherland - just loanwords!
In my previous message I wrote about the Serbian words KRUG/KOTUR
(circle) and I explained what happened and how 'kotur' became
'jedro' (nucleus). There is another Serbian word coming from the Gon-
Hor basis - it is 'jezgro' (same meaning as 'jedro'); it shows that
the ancient Gon basis was "laryngealized" and it first sounded as GoHn
(wherefrom German gehen).
Thus we have got GeHn-Hor => Ges-Hor => geshero (like Icelandic
geyser) => jezero (Slavic lake). I would not be suprised if I hear
that Abdullah is explaining words like Latin cezar and German Keiser
with the help of his invented Illyrian and compiled Albanian. These
words are related to the English noun 'hunter'... but about it next
time.
_______________________________
*Abdullah's above note is from the "updated" and "enhanced" Proto-
Indo- European Etymological Dictionary A Revised Edition of Julius
Dušan Vukotić
________________________________________________
Maybe nasalized Alb. (*ań gas) nëkoń j, Gheg angoj́ “groan, sigh,
complain of pain, evil” (*enq-); prove the link between Root agos- :
[fault, guilt, blame, sin (damage, injury, sacrilege, evil)] and Root
enq-, onq- : (to sigh, groan) [see below] Note: It is possible Root
agos- (*hege-): “fault, sin, *blood guilt” is a zero grade of Lat.
sangue “blood”, Alb. gjak “blood” see Root s(u̯)ekʷo-s : ‘sap, pitch,
*blood”.
________________________________________________________
First, Gheg <ankoj/angoj> is a reduced form of the verb <rënkoj>
groan; and this word also lost its initial velar, because <rënkoj> is
borrowed from Serbian <groktanje> (grunting), <graknuti> 'caw, croak'
or from Italian <grugnito> grunt.
This words are a good example that can help us to understand the way
in wich the Albanians were adopting the foreign words: often by
elision of initial consonant and sometimes by removing the whole first
syllable (for instance, Albanian <vlagë> 'humidity' is a loanword from
Serbian <vlaga> 'humidity' and <vlagët> and <lagët> are words with the
meaning 'wet' /Serbian 'vlažan'/; Albanian <udhëtoj> 'travel' from
Serbian <voditi> 'lead', <udhëheq> 'guide' from Serbian <vodič>
'guide'; Albanian <ujk> 'wolf' from Serbian hypocoristic form for wolf
- <vujko> 'wolf' (cf. Serbian surname Vujk-ović); Albanian <grusht>
'fist', 'handfull' from Serbian <pre-gršt> 'handfull' /from gruda,
grozd lump: from KRUG circle/; most interesting seems to be the
Albanian word <shi> 'rain' from Serbian <ki-shi!> 'it rains'; from
'kisnuti' - triplicated Gon syllable, like in Serbian
'nagoniti' (drive, to force); hence also Serb. <sneg> 'snow' and
<snaga> 'power, force'.
There is another Albanian word with the meaning groan, sigh - it is
<kërcitje> which additionally proves that above-mentioned <ankoj> and
<rënkoj> are the shortened forms of the IE words like Serbian
<krečati>, <kriknuti> 'cry.
Albanian <gjakësi> 'murder' is clearly connected to the Albanian word
for blood <gjak> and it shows that this word has nothing to do with
the IE root s(u)okW-o- (Serbian sok juice, juha soup or Latin jus): it
means that Albanian <gjak> is related to other Albanian words: <gjah>
'hunting, prey' and <gjahtar> 'hunter'; the fact is that Albanian
<gjak> was derived from the reduplicated Gon basis, as it happened to
Latin 'jus' or Serbian 'juha' (soup), but the logic here was different
because Albanian <gjak> 'blood' is transparently connected to the
other Albanians words referring to murder <gjakësi>, hunting <gjah>
and <gjahtar> 'hunter'.
Latin sanguis is related to the Serbian word <snaga> 'strength',
'power' and we can see it via additional meanings of sanguis (blood-
relationship, life-blood, strength, vigor); from Sur-Gon-Gon basis;
sur-tong => strong; sur-nonga => snaga; sur-gnuti => Serb. suknuti (a
sudden rapid flow, gush /water, smoke/; cf. Serbian kisnuti (get wet
by rain) <=> suknuti (gush)
Dušan Vukotić
Is it possible that nobody is seeing that Slavic (j)agne (Czech jehně,
Russian ягненок, Bulgarian агне; Serbian jagnje; Latin agnus) is
closely related to the word 'oganj' (fire; Russian огонь, Czech ohen;
Serbian oganj; Latin ignis; Hettite agniš).
I am suprised that all "clever" minds on Sci. lang are not able
(because of stupidity or something else) to understand that Abdullah
(with the help of Lubotsky and G. Starostin) is leading every one here
by the nose.
1) Is there anyone who is able to explain what Abdullah thought when
he said that "Slavic preserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k-
phonetic mutatIon"? Did he mean that Slavic had to be grateful to the
compiled Albanian for its own existence?
2) He is also talking about "common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj" mutation; is
there any phonetic mutation that is not possible in Albanian? Which
one of the Sci. lang wise guys could be able to explain (or
comprehend) Abdullah's gh => gl "common" mutation?
3) Do you really believe that Greek 'amnos' came from 'agnos' via
'abnos'? Please, would you answer this question just to see how many
fools we have on this forum?
4) No body in the world knows nothing about fucking "Illyrian"; the
language that was presumed from a dozen of words that have reached our
time indirectly - through Greek or Latin. Are you people without your
own opinion and sound logic?
DV
___________________________________________________
Page 25
Note: The old laryngeal centum h- > a-, e- : satem h- > s- in PIE;
only Alb. and Umbr. and
Slavic preserved the old laryngeal through Alb. h- > k- phonetic
mutatIon.
Alb.Gheg kinxh, tosk (*egh-) qengj “lamb” : Umbr. habina(f) “ of a
lamb “ : Lat. haedīnus “of
a kid” : O.C.S.: (j)agne “lamb” [common Alb. gh- > gl- > gj- : lith.
gh- > dz- phonetic
mutation].
Gk. (*agnos, abnos) αμνος derived from an earlier *abnos
“lamb” [common Gk. κW > p
gW > b phonetic mutation, later b > mb > m common Illyr.-Gk. phonetic
mutation]
Gk. αμνος m. f., αμνη f. “lamb”;
Lat. agnus, - ī, fem.-a “lamb” (agnīle ‘sheep stable”, lacking suffix
affinity with O.C.S. jagnilo
“ place where the sheep lamb “, a derivative of the verb jagniti “to
lamb"); O.Ir. ūan Welsh
oen, O.Corn. oin, Bret. oan “lamb” (urk. *ognos with -gn- would have
derived from *-gWhn-,
not-*gWn-, in spite of Pedersen KG. I 109-bn-;
o- probably influence from *ouis ‘sheep”); O.E. ēanian, Eng. to yean
“to lamb”, Dutch
oonen ds. (from *aunōn from *auna- = IE *agWhno-); O.C.S. (j)agne
“lamb” (with formants
-et- broadened around popular names of young animals), (j)agnьcь
“lambkins” contain full
gradatIon. Or is placed IE *og(h)no- : to *egW(h)no-?
Through the Gmc. and Celt. presumed voiced-aspirated also would
underlie the basis of
Lat. and Slav. forms, so that Gk. αμνος (at first from *αβνος) remains
the only dependable
indication in voiced-nonaspirated gW. If Umbr. habina(f) “ of a lamb “
could be explained
from intersection from *hedino- = Lat. haedīnus “of a kid” and
*abnīno- = Lat. agninus “of a
lamb; f. as subst., lamb’s flesh”, however, would point Umbr. b to
voiced-nonaspirated. But
maybe it has become gWh in Osc.-Umbr. to b.
Note: Celtic Illyrian concordances: common Illyr. -gW- > -b-, -d- :
Alb. -gW- > -d- phonetic
mutatIon.
lora...@cs.com
> On Jul 2, 12:12 pm, Dušan Vukotić <dusan.vuko...@gmail.com> wrote:
> ________________________________________________________________
> English meaning: to drive, to overwhelm, harm
> Deutsche Übersetzung: “worauf eindringen, treiben, überwältigen,
> kränken”
> Material: present *(a)i-neu-mi : O.Ind. inóti, ínvati, Imper.
> inuhí, participle -inita- (úpenita- “ pushed, cut into “), “
> penetrate into something, master “, Av. inaoiti, Inf. aēnaŋhe “
> violate, hurt “, ainita (from *an-inita by haplology) “ not violated,
> not painedly “ (from ai énas- n. “Crime, sin, misfortune “ = Av.
> aēnah- “ act of violence, crime “, in addition m. “ evildoer”?),Av.
> intay-” rape, injury; torture “, O.Ind. iná-‘strong; m. master “,
> maybe also īti-ḥ f. “plague,need”; Gk. α ἰνός “tremendous”;
> maybe Alb. inati “anger; ire; rage; dander; dudgeon;
> rampage;down;disappointment;
> malice; blood; rancour; rancor; pique; spunk; miff; temper;
> must”.maybe here-in- in Goth. faír-ina “guilt, reproach”, O.H.G.
> firinōn ‘sin”, O.Ice. firn n. pl. “the
> extraordinary” (cf Weisweiler IF. 41, 29 f.), if original meaning (as
> in the Heliand) “ act of violence “.
> References: WP. I 1, Feist 139/140.
> Page(s): 10
> Indo-European Language Association – http ://dnghu.org/ Page 35
> ____________________________________________________________________
>
> Albanian word <inat> (anger, grudge, resentment) is the loan word from
> Serbian <inat> (defiance, grudge, anger); the basis of this word is
> the reduplicated primal basis (Gon);
No, you are incorrect.
> most simply, it can be connected
> to the Serbian word 'gonjenje' (driving, chasing) or English
> 'hunting'.
No, that is incorrect also.
Two entirely different roots are involved.
Your 'gonjenje' has a different origin.
Here is a clue for you:
"Ganymede..
Robert Graves' The Greek Myths offers ganyesthai + medea,
"rejoicing in virility." (But he's wrong too)
"..from Mount Ida in Phrygia, the setting for more than one myth-
element bearing on the early mythic history of Troy. Ganymede was
there, passing the time of exile many heroes undergo in their youth,
by tending a flock of sheep or, alternatively, during the chthonic or
rustic aspect of his education"
Got it?
> Other cognate of the word 'inat' are the Serbian words
> 'junak' (hero) and 'junoša' (young man) and English 'young' (cf.
> English anger,
Wrong, the root for 'anger' or 'injury' is not associated with 'young'
either.
> Greek ankhein squeeze; Latin ango press thight, cause
> pain, strangle; Serbian 'uzano/usko' narrow from Serb. 'nagnati' press
> together or 'ugoniti' drive in, as if driving the sheep into the
> sheepfold); Serb. ganuti "feel the pain").
You got one right out of six. 17%.
Dušan Vukotić
> > Albanian word <inat> (anger, grudge, resentment) is the loan word from
> > Serbian <inat> (defiance, grudge, anger); the basis of this word is
> > the reduplicated primal basis (Gon);
>
> No, you are incorrect.
I cannot be wrong. There are other Serbian words which could
substantiate above assumption: kinjiti, hinjiti (to harass someone;
cf. English annoy and Serbian inat); Serbian hinja (annoying person)
> > most simply, it can be connected
> > to the Serbian word 'gonjenje' (driving, chasing) or English
> > 'hunting'.
>
> No, that is incorrect also.
It is correct!
> Two entirely different roots are involved.
>
> Your 'gonjenje' has a different origin.
The basis is same - reduplicated Gon ur-syllable
> Here is a clue for you:
>
> "Ganymede..
> Robert Graves' The Greek Myths offers ganyesthai + medea,
> "rejoicing in virility." (But he's wrong too)
> "..from Mount Ida in Phrygia, the setting for more than one myth-
> element bearing on the early mythic history of Troy. Ganymede was
> there, passing the time of exile many heroes undergo in their youth,
> by tending a flock of sheep or, alternatively, during the chthonic or
> rustic aspect of his education"
>
> Got it?
I see nothing significant in your citation. Ganymede was Zeus'
cupbearer and the second part of his name obviously came from
'mead' (alcoholic beverage with honey; Greek meli; Serbian med /
honey/); In fact, Ganymede is a compound word of gena- (bring, carry
on, produce) + mead (beverage; Serb. medovina)
It means that Ganymede could be literally translated as "one who
brings the mead (beverage)".
I hope you have got it, have you?
> > Other cognate of the word 'inat' are the Serbian words
> > 'junak' (hero) and 'junoša' (young man) and English 'young' (cf.
> > English anger,
>
> Wrong, the root for 'anger' or 'injury' is not associated with 'young'
> either.
There are Serbian words 'junačiti se' (try to be brave),
'junoša' (young man) and 'joguniti se' what is the same as 'inatiti
se' (object, murmur, resent); cf. Serbian personal name Janko (Young).
All the above words are the "product" of reduplicated Gon basis.
DV
Dušan Vukotić
Sound absurd? Not at all; it actually happened while I was at CSE.
[snip]
SIGINT specialists are honing their skills at monitoring digital
information. SIGINT agencies everywhere are increasingly throwing
their surveillance web over the Internet and other data networks
of interest.
[snip]
Mini-recap:
o The countries sharing intelligence: US, UK, Canada, Australia,
New Zealand
o Massive domestic spying by the NSA, using an Orwellian "1984"
technology to search all communications using computers, including
domestic phone calls, via keyword searches.
o Circumvention of domestic spy laws via friendly "foreign" agents
******************************************************************************
Wow.
How chilling to think the military has set up
a real-life domestic Orwellian spy apparatus.
Used repeatedly for political purposes.
ECHELON has almost no Military purpose left:
Russia is practically part of NATO now.
We must start dismantling ECHELON before it is too late.
6/3/97: Barnes & Noble informs me his book is no longer
available, and that my order is cancelled.
******************************************************************************
BAM-BAM-BAM
Dušan Vukotić
Does it mean that he knows my password and username?
It seems, Google is doing nothing or little to improve the safety of
its services and to prevent the spam.
DV