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"Kouya Ruten" - Song Translation - Full Version

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Phil Yff

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Dec 6, 2006, 10:58:40 AM12/6/06
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"Kouya Ruten" - 荒野流転 is a song by FictionJunction YUUKA. I’ve translated
the title as "Wasteland Vicissitudes". You can listen to a promotional
video of the full length song at the below URL. The icon in the lower
left gives you the option of playing the video using Windows Media Player
(Lo and Hi quality options) or Real Player. Click on your choice to enjoy:

http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/fj_yuuka/

The song is quite long so I'll leave out the editorial comments.

Kouya Ruten (荒野流転) Wasteland Vicissitudes

月影凍る大地を
転がり踏み分けて行く
滅びと再生の時代が始まる

自由を重く掲げて
道なき道を選んで
真昼より眩しい日没を越えて

夢を語るように時の船は行く
その闇路の向こうに新しい夜明け

僕等はきっと暗闇の腕から生まれてきた
かなわぬ恋をするように
光へと彷徨ってく
どこまでも果てしのないこの道を
帰る術は無い

生き抜くことに戸惑い
死に行く事に怯えて
僕等の呼吸には哀しみが宿る

叫びは孤独に失せて
涙の滴を啜り
誰もが一人きり荒野を流離う

あれは月の夢か 白く光る花
けぶる丘の彼方 煌めき手招く

胸に響く悠久の音楽に耳を澄ませ
風に惑う砂のように
刹那へと消え失せても
どこまでも果てしのないこの道を
荒野の向こうへ

あれは月の夢か

僕等はきっと暗闇の腕から生まれてきた
かなわぬ恋をするように
光へと誘われて
どこまでも果てしのないこの道を
帰る術は無い
彼方へ
_______________________
Across this earth the moonlight has frozen,
Stumbling, I proceed beating a path
As the age of ruin and rebirth begins.

Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,
Where there’s no path, I choose a path
And pass through a radiant sinking sun brighter than high noon.

Like a tale told in a dream, the ship of time sets out.
Beyond this dark passage, there’s a new dawn.

We were certainly born out of the arms of darkness.
As if pursuing a hopeless love
We wander towards the light
Forever, along this never-ending path
Of no return.

At a loss how to live out our lives
Frightened at the prospect of death
Sorrow dwells in our every breath

Our screams vanish in the solitude
Teardrops and muffled sobs
Everyone wanders alone in the wasteland.

Is that the moon’s dream? A glistening white flower
That beckons with its gleam beyond the hill dim in the distance.

I strain my ears to hear the eternal music echoing in my chest
Catching faint notes like sand scattered in the wind
Even if it vanishes in the moment
I’ll follow this endless path as long as it takes to reach
The other side of the wasteland.

Is that perhaps the dream of the moon?

We were certainly born out of the arms of darkness.
As if pursuing a hopeless love
Enticed towards the light
Forever, along this never-ending path
Of no return
Into the distance.
__________________________
Tsukikage kooru daichi wo
Korogari humiwakete yuku
Horobi to saisei no jidai ga hajimaru

Jiyuu wo omoku kakagete
Michinaki michi wo erande
Mahiru yori mabushii nichibotsu wo koete

Yume wo kataru you ni toki no hune wa yuku
Sono yamiji no mukou ni atarashii yoake

Bokura wa kitto kurayami no kaina kara umarete kita
Kanawanu koi wo suru you ni
Hikari e to samayotteku
Doko made mo hateshi no nai kono michi wo
Kaeru sube wa nai

Ikinuku koto ni tomadoi
Shi ni yuku koto ni obiete
Bokura no kokyuu ni wa kanashimi ga yadoru

Sakebi wa kodoku ni usete
Namida no shizuku wo susuri
Dare mo ga hitorikiri kouya wo sasurau

Are wa tsuki no yume ka shiroku hikaru hana
Keburu oka no kanata kirameki temaneku

Mune ni hibiku yuukyuu no ongaku ni mimi wo sumase
Kaze ni madou suna no you ni
Setsuna e to kieusete mo
Doko made mo hateshi no nai kono michi wo
Kouya no mukou e

Are wa tsuki no yume ka

Bokura wa kitto kurayami no kaina kara umarete kita
Kanawanu koi wo suru you ni
Hikari e to izanawarete
Doko made mo hateshi no nai kono michi wo
Kaeru sube wa nai
Kanata e

Phil Yff


B. Ito

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Dec 6, 2006, 1:07:03 PM12/6/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:1pkh8vhvqpw2w$.b5n1bpkwjsr9.dlg@40tude.net...
--------------------------------------------------------------------xxxx-----
Aren't these all wonderful?
I could read very smoothly all your translations comparing
with the Japanese lines.

You must have spent very much time interpreting all these
Japanese with tough phrases.

If I am forced to point out one line I'll pick up the 4th line.

> Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,

If the banner is hoisted, doesn't it stay there?
Don't you have to proceed in the dark upholding the
important banner of freedom?

--------------------------------------------------
B. Ito

Phil Yff

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Dec 6, 2006, 8:12:32 PM12/6/06
to
On Thu, 7 Dec 2006 03:07:03 +0900, B. Ito wrote:


>> the title as "Wasteland Vicissitudes". You can listen to a promotional
>> video of the full length song at the below URL.
>>

>> http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/fj_yuuka/

>> Kouya Ruten (荒野流転) Wasteland Vicissitudes
>>
>> 月影凍る大地を
>> 転がり踏み分けて行く
>> 滅びと再生の時代が始まる
>>
>> 自由を重く掲げて

>> Across this earth the moonlight has frozen,


>> Stumbling, I proceed beating a path
>> As the age of ruin and rebirth begins.
>>
>> Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,

>> Tsukikage kooru daichi wo


>> Korogari humiwakete yuku
>> Horobi to saisei no jidai ga hajimaru
>>
>> Jiyuu wo omoku kakagete

> --------------------------------------------------------------------xxxx-----
> Aren't these all wonderful?
> I could read very smoothly all your translations comparing
> with the Japanese lines.
>
> You must have spent very much time interpreting all these
> Japanese with tough phrases.
>
> If I am forced to point out one line I'll pick up the 4th line.
>
> Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,
>
> If the banner is hoisted, doesn't it stay there?
> Don't you have to proceed in the dark upholding the
> important banner of freedom?
>

The fourth line was one of the difficult lines to translate. The meaning
in Japanese is fairly straightforward, but it is difficult to translate
directly into English.

掲げる is most often used to describe flying or hoisting a flag (or banner).
However, it does not have to refer to a flag or banner. One can easily
say, 自由を掲げる. That is easy to translate into English. "Hold up freedom"
implying holding up freedom as an ideal. The problem comes with the
modifier - 重く. Again, this is a simple word that can easily be translated
into English as "heavily", or "seriously". However, one cannnot combine
"Hold up freedom" with the modifier "heavily" as one can in Japanese.

I thought 重く was an important descriptor and I should not leave it out. It
reinforces the struggle the singer has stumbling beating the path. I chose
to solve the problem by using the metaphor of hoisting the banner of
freedom. This is consistent with one of the connotations of 掲げる. However,
as you rightly point out, once I move from the literal translation of
"holding up freedom" to the metaphorical substitution of "hoisting up the
banner of freedom" I lose some if not all of the meaning of continuing to
hold up freedom as a weighty ideal.

I am open to suggestions. I had considered "Bearing the weighty banner of
freedom" as a possible alternative. However, that ignores much of the
meaning and connotation of 掲げる. "Flying the weighty banner of freedom" or
"Unfurling the weighty banner of freedom" are two other alternatives with
advantages and disadvantages over the alternative I chose. I could say,
"Holding up freedom as a weighty ideal," but that sounds clumsy and loses
the poetic sound of the Japanese.

Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 6, 2006, 8:40:18 PM12/6/06
to
On Wed, 6 Dec 2006 10:58:40 -0500, Phil Yff wrote:

> "Kouya Ruten" - 荒野流転 is a song by FictionJunction YUUKA. I’ve translated
> the title as "Wasteland Vicissitudes". You can listen to a promotional
> video of the full length song at the below URL. The icon in the lower
> left gives you the option of playing the video using Windows Media Player
> (Lo and Hi quality options) or Real Player. Click on your choice to enjoy:
>
> http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/fj_yuuka/
>
> The song is quite long so I'll leave out the editorial comments.
>
> Kouya Ruten (荒野流転) Wasteland Vicissitudes

Putting in the editorial comments that I left out of the original post for
brevity.

The kanji/kana comes directly from the CD's lyric sheet. I did not
transcribe it while listening to it. I wrote the romaji listening to the
CD while reading the lyrics sheet. I provided the romaji for two reasons.
First, for those who might like help making out the words of the song but
have difficulty with the kanji. Second, to provide the phonetics for some
of the unusual kanji readings. There are not that many most of the kanji
are straight-forward. Some exceptions of unusual readings and/or non-joyou
kanji:

腕 - kaina - equivalent to the joyou reading of the kanji, ude
彷徨ってく - samayotte 'ku - wander - samayou is often written in hiragana or as
さ迷う but 彷徨う (samayou) is also an accepted and not uncommon reading.
啜り - susuri - sob, silent crying
流離う - sasurau - wander, rove
誘われて - izanawarete - invited, tempted, enticed, lured. It has some of the
connotations of the joyou reading of sasowarete.

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 7, 2006, 12:05:47 AM12/7/06
to

"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:gi49dpmhcgp2$.1r42dja1ynxkw.dlg@40tude.net...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How about;

"With a mental big banner of freedom,"
"With a backing of big banner of freedom,"
"Backed up by a great banner of freedom,"

I think "Hoisting ......" may sound immobile (stationary) and that
"Holding (up)......." sounds mobile like "Holding (up) something to
do some other thing."

----------------------------------
B. Ito

B. Ito

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Dec 8, 2006, 12:39:43 AM12/8/06
to

"B. Ito" <jg2...@wonder.ocn.ne.jp> wrote in message
news:el87f4$m87$1...@news-wst.ocn.ad.jp...

>
> "Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
> news:gi49dpmhcgp2$.1r42dja1ynxkw.dlg@40tude.net...
>> On Thu, 7 Dec 2006 03:07:03 +0900, B. Ito wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> the title as "Wasteland Vicissitudes". You can listen to a promotional
>>>> video of the full length song at the below URL.
>>>>
>>>> http://www.jvcmusic.co.jp/fj_yuuka/
>>
>>>> Kouya Ruten (荒野流転) Wasteland Vicissitudes
>>>>
>>>> 月影凍る大地を
>>>> 転がり踏み分けて行く
>>>> 滅びと再生の時代が始まる
>>>>
>>>> 自由を重く掲げて
>>
>>>> Across this earth the moonlight has frozen,
>>>> Stumbling, I proceed beating a path
>>>> As the age of ruin and rebirth begins.
>>>>
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I started listening to the music looking at your English translations
at the same time, and the following is my impressions and
comments.

First, it was very difficult to proceed humming starting with
either "Across.........", "Across this ......" or "Across this earth......"

Instead, starting with "The moonlight has frozen ..........." is quite
easy finishing the line with such a shorter phrase like
"...........all this earth."

The "proceed" in the second line is a little longer. A little shorter
word, "charge", can it be an alternative?

The moonlight ha_s frozen_ a_ll this earth
Stum_bling, I charge bea_ting a path
A_s the_ age of ru__in and re_bir_th be_gins.

How do you think?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
B. Ito


>>>> Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,
>>
>>>> Tsukikage kooru daichi wo
>>>> Korogari humiwakete yuku
>>>> Horobi to saisei no jidai ga hajimaru
>>>>
>>>> Jiyuu wo omoku kakagete
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------xxxx-----
>>> Aren't these all wonderful?
>>> I could read very smoothly all your translations comparing
>>> with the Japanese lines.
>>>
>>> You must have spent very much time interpreting all these
>>> Japanese with tough phrases.
>>>
>>> If I am forced to point out one line I'll pick up the 4th line.
>>>
>>> Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,
>>>

[...........]

Phil Yff

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Dec 8, 2006, 1:32:23 PM12/8/06
to
On Fri, 8 Dec 2006 14:39:43 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> I started listening to the music looking at your English translations
> at the same time, and the following is my impressions and
> comments.
>
> First, it was very difficult to proceed humming starting with
> either "Across.........", "Across this ......" or "Across this earth......"
>
> Instead, starting with "The moonlight has frozen ..........." is quite
> easy finishing the line with such a shorter phrase like
> "...........all this earth."
>
> The "proceed" in the second line is a little longer. A little shorter
> word, "charge", can it be an alternative?
>
> The moonlight ha_s frozen_ a_ll this earth
> Stum_bling, I charge bea_ting a path
> A_s the_ age of ru__in and re_bir_th be_gins.
>
> How do you think?

Before I posted the long version of the song, I posted a translation of a
much shorter version that is used as the opening theme in a TV series. I
explained my translation approach:

"In the translation, I’m trying to do a number of things. First and
foremost, it must accurately represent the original. I try to balance the
trade-offs between a literal translation and idiomatic English. Wherever
possible, I have tried to make the line lengths of the translation
equivalent to the original. In a couple of instances, I could not think of
a way of doing so while sticking to my precept of an accurate, idiomatic
translation."

In other words, although I tried to make the line lengths equivalent, this
was my lowest priority. I was trying to capture both the literal meaning
and the poetic nuances in an idiomatic translation. If you are going to
sing it then, of course, the lines must conform to the music and I would
welcome any editing that would make them match up with the music.

Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 8, 2006, 1:38:37 PM12/8/06
to

Would "Holding up the weighty banner of freedom" work?

This would accurately translate 掲げる as in 自由を掲げる - holding up freedom [as
an ideal]. It also translates 重く accurately as weighty (accurately rather
than literally because a literal translation would be heavily or
seriously).

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 8, 2006, 10:55:26 PM12/8/06
to

"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:vmp4bh7jrwkx.s...@40tude.net...

> On Fri, 8 Dec 2006 14:39:43 +0900, B. Ito wrote:
>
>> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> I started listening to the music looking at your English translations
>> at the same time, and the following is my impressions and
>> comments.
>>
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That may partly be one of the problems here this slj.
Due to the providers' connection, the distribution of every post are not
perfect.

Sorry, I don't think I have acknowledged your such preceding short
messages like that.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yes, the total lengths ia firstly important of course and then there is also
another importance in partial lengths too.

In such cases,the last successful possiblity is to reverse the front/back.

There's no problem of reversing in Japanese but in English sometimes
almost impossible without a poetic license.

For example, "I like dogs." can be "Dogs I like.", but "Dogs like I." or
"Like dogs I." and so on couldn't be possible. In Japanese, as you
know, everything seems to be possible.

In Japan, I've seen many English translations that are almost impossible
to sing along. In my case, I want to make translations that are possible
to be sung, even though I am not able to sing them by myself.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
B. Ito

B. Ito

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Dec 8, 2006, 11:08:20 PM12/8/06
to

"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:i4v277nlafeb$.16p4ofmnj5yl0$.dlg@40tude.net...
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry, the "Holding up the weighty banner of freedom" is very hard
to sing, I think.

"Holding up high the banner of freedom." could be possibly sung
instead, I think.

I just tried humming and the second paragraph seem to be possibly
sung as follows:

"Holding up high the banner of free_dom

Where there’s no pa_th, I choo_se a_ pa__th


And pass through a radiant sinking sun brighter than high noon"

The word "radiant" sounds a little redundant.

How about "shining" which may be a little time saving by one mora.

------------------------------------------

B. Ito

          Shining?
I think.


Phil Yff

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Dec 9, 2006, 5:20:13 PM12/9/06
to
On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 12:55:26 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> That may partly be one of the problems here this slj.
> Due to the providers' connection, the distribution of every post are not
> perfect.

Yes, it has to do with how the posts are sent from news server to news
server. It's called the propagation algorithm. Posts for groups like slj
that are not hosted on the majority of news servers may 'expire' before
they are distributed to all news servers.

I check more than one news server. I noticed, for example, that a couple
of Cindy's posts appeared on one news server but not others. This may not
have been a propagation problem. She was using base 64 content transfer
encoding which some new servers with unsophisticated systems admin
erroneously screen out because they mistakenly assume they contain
graphics.

Poor propagation used to be more of a problem in the 90s than it is today.
It was so bad back then, that I used to tell people to cross post to
misc.test. misc.test is a pure test group so any post is on topic. It is
hosted by the vast majority of news servers. When you cross post to
misc.test, it causes your post to propagate much faster and more reliably
than if you post only to slj.

There is a disadvantage. When you post to misc.test, you get feedback
messages by e-mail. There are ways of stopping the test result e-mails but
they have disadvantages of their own. So, unless someone is experiencing a
significant problem, I generally no longer recommend the cross posting
work-around.

Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 9, 2006, 5:53:27 PM12/9/06
to
On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 13:08:20 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Sorry, the "Holding up the weighty banner of freedom" is very hard
> to sing, I think.
>
> "Holding up high the banner of freedom." could be possibly sung
> instead, I think.
>
> I just tried humming and the second paragraph seem to be possibly
> sung as follows:
>
> "Holding up high the banner of free_dom
>
> Where there’s no pa_th, I choo_se a_ pa__th
> And pass through a radiant sinking sun brighter than high noon"
>
>
>
> The word "radiant" sounds a little redundant.
>
> How about "shining" which may be a little time saving by one mora.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------
>
> B. Ito
>
>
>
>           Shining?
> I think.

The main issue for both these cases is the nuance. In the first case,
'holding up high' implies strength and vigor. Yet, the singer is stumbling
and appears to labor while beating a path. I haven't thought of a good
solution though.

The second issue is also complicated. The song says:

真昼より眩しい日没を越えて

Literally this is, "Passing through a more dazzling than mid-day setting
sun."

Of course, that is not idiomatic English. The very compact Japanese
construction is able to give the sense that both the mid-day and the
setting sun are bright.

The English grammatical equivalent is a relative clause - a setting sun
that is more radiant than mid-day. However, the setting sun now loses the
direct modifier that is there in the Japanese thus considerably weakening
the image.

Furthermore, the relative clause, itself, does not sound as emphatic as the
Japanese. My solution was to use two modifiers, one for mid-day and one
for the setting sun. I also felt that high noon was better in this context
than mid-day and sinking sun better conveyed the sense of nichibotsu than
setting sun.

And pass through a radiant sinking sun brighter than high noon.

Out of many alternatives, I chose to translate mabushii as radiant because
it seemed to allow the metaphor to work best. It seemed to me that radiant
was the word that allowed the listeners to visualize for themselves the
nature of the brightness. Words like 'shining', 'dazzling', 'glaring',
'blinding', etc. - all valid translations of mabushii - carry with them
connotations that affect the metaphor. Shining, for example, usually has
positive qualities associated with it. However, the song is a song of
struggle so I didn't want to change the context of the Japanese.

I do have a solution, though. It is to sing the word 'radiant' as if it
had two syllables rather than three. In other words, to pronounce it
quickly like 'ray-dyent'.

Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 9, 2006, 6:13:00 PM12/9/06
to
On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 12:55:26 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

>> In other words, although I tried to make the line lengths equivalent, this
>> was my lowest priority. I was trying to capture both the literal meaning
>> and the poetic nuances in an idiomatic translation. If you are going to
>> sing it then, of course, the lines must conform to the music and I would
>> welcome any editing that would make them match up with the music.

> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, the total lengths ia firstly important of course and then there is also
> another importance in partial lengths too.
>
> In such cases,the last successful possiblity is to reverse the front/back.
>
> There's no problem of reversing in Japanese but in English sometimes
> almost impossible without a poetic license.
>
> For example, "I like dogs." can be "Dogs I like.", but "Dogs like I." or
> "Like dogs I." and so on couldn't be possible. In Japanese, as you
> know, everything seems to be possible.
>
> In Japan, I've seen many English translations that are almost impossible
> to sing along. In my case, I want to make translations that are possible
> to be sung, even though I am not able to sing them by myself.
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I know exactly what you mean. Sometimes, the only way to make a
translation work is to change the sequence of the lines. For example line
1 in the original becomes line 2 in the translation and line 2 in the
original becomes line 1 in the translation. Wherever possible, I try to
avoid that. I prefer to translate line by line. But sometimes it just
cannot be helped.

Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 9, 2006, 6:23:11 PM12/9/06
to
On Sat, 9 Dec 2006 13:08:20 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

After rereading the translation in light of your comments, I thought it
sounded better to translate どこまでも as 'however far' in this sequence:

どこまでも果てしのないこの道を
帰る術は無い

However far, along this never-ending path
Of no return

Before, I had translated it as 'forever'. However, the context here seems
to be more of distance than time. Accordingly, 'however far' seems to be
more appropriate. Also, although I'm no expert, it seems to fit the melody
better.

What do you think?

Phil Yff

The translation thus becomes:

Kouya Ruten (荒野流転) Wasteland Vicissitudes

Across this earth the moonlight has frozen,


Stumbling, I proceed beating a path
As the age of ruin and rebirth begins.

Hoisting the weighty banner of freedom,

Where there's no path, I choose a path
And pass through a radiant sinking sun brighter than high noon.

Like a tale told in a dream, the ship of time sets out.
Beyond this dark passage, there's a new dawn.

We were certainly born out of the arms of darkness.
As if pursuing a hopeless love

We wander towards the light,
However far, along this never-ending path
Of no return.

At a loss how to live out our lives
Frightened at the prospect of death
Sorrow dwells in our every breath

Our screams vanish in the solitude
Teardrops and muffled sobs
Everyone wanders alone in the wasteland.

Is that the moon's dream? A glistening white flower
That beckons with its gleam beyond the hill dim in the distance.

I strain my ears to hear the eternal music echoing in my chest
Catching faint notes like sand scattered in the wind
Even if it vanishes in the moment
I'll follow this endless path as long as it takes to reach
The other side of the wasteland.

Is that perhaps the dream of the moon?

We were certainly born out of the arms of darkness.
As if pursuing a hopeless love

Enticed towards the light,
However far, along this never-ending path

B. Ito

unread,
Dec 10, 2006, 2:49:47 AM12/10/06
to

"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:1eytweevesyya$.1sduf0z5vbws8$.dlg@40tude.net...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Those are poems to be sung.
So with the same feeling, we should proceed singing the lines, also with the
same proper nouns in the same places.

This is because, in my case, I am not able to make out better poems in
English.
-----------------------------------
B. Ito

B. Ito

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Dec 10, 2006, 2:52:48 AM12/10/06
to

"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:y5p5fav4apa.1q...@40tude.net...
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Radiant" is hard but can be sung.
'Ray-dyent' will help very much.

------------------
B. Ito

>
> Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 10, 2006, 3:00:05 AM12/10/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
news:1akvfacqllpxp$.1byy0k1o08xyk$.dlg@40tude.net...
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Doesn't the context just meet when you use 'however' here?

I mean, in case of context itself, "However near the path may be,
we will never return." is in a good context for 'however.', isn't it?
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B. Ito


Phil Yff

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Dec 10, 2006, 2:59:34 PM12/10/06
to

"However far" is a set phrase equivalent to どこまでも. It conveys a poetic
sentiment.

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 10, 2006, 9:00:35 PM12/10/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
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> "However far" is a set phrase ......

Is that so? I've added to my new phrase library.

I've only have in my mind library,

a) However far (it may be), I can rearch there in a day.

b) However near (it may be), you can't reach there in a day.

x However far (it may be), I can't reach there in a day.
x However near (it may be), I can reach there in a day.

---------------------------------
B. Ito

Phil Yff

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Dec 11, 2006, 7:25:24 PM12/11/06
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On Mon, 11 Dec 2006 11:00:35 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

>> "However far" is a set phrase ......
>
> Is that so? I've added to my new phrase library.
>
> I've only have in my mind library,
>
> a) However far (it may be), I can rearch there in a day.
>
> b) However near (it may be), you can't reach there in a day.
>
> x However far (it may be), I can't reach there in a day.
> x However near (it may be), I can reach there in a day.

Cindy introduced me to a set phrase that I've added to my library. I can't
wait to use it. It's more colorful than the English phrase I gave you: (笑)

「ニュースを検便」

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 12, 2006, 4:13:10 AM12/12/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
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In this case you are supposed to read the phrase 'ken-bin', which
will mean 'check your newsgroup.'

--------------------------
B.Ito

>
> Phil Yff

Phil Yff

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Dec 18, 2006, 12:57:25 PM12/18/06
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On Wed, 6 Dec 2006 10:58:40 -0500, Phil Yff wrote:

I made a minor change in the translation of the line:

誰もが一人きり荒野を流離う

The old version was:


Everyone wanders alone in the wasteland.

The new version is:
Everyone wanders all alone in the wasteland.

'All alone' seemed to be a better choice to translate 一人きり than just
'alone.'

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 21, 2006, 10:30:38 PM12/21/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
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"......all alone....." is better, I think.

When we start singing your translations, the very first line,
"Across this earth ....... " is very hard to let it meet the melody,
as I already posted.

"The moonlight ha_s frozen_ a_ll this earth." would better
match the melody.

-------------------------------------
B. Ito


Phil Yff

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Dec 23, 2006, 1:18:47 PM12/23/06
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This way emphasizes 'moonlight' and deemphasizes 'earth'. The point of
emphasis is the frozen earth over which the singer beats a path. It is
this earth that is the 荒野 (wasteland) in the subject of the song. I agree
that starting out with a preposition is much weaker than the strong
Japanese opening: 月影凍る大地を

The main problem is that in Japanese 大地 is a direct object, a grammatical
structure that doesn't transfer into the English. In Japanese, the lines
connect very elegantly. Translating it literally:

The earth, frozen by moonlight (direct object marker)
Stumbling, I proceed beating a path.

月影凍る大地を
転がり踏み分けて行く

Perhaps, one solution is to replace the explicit continuity of the Japanese
(achieved through the direct object marker) with implied continuity as
follows:

The earth is frozen in the moonlight.
Stumbling, I proceed beating a path.

Your thoughts?

Phil Yff

B. Ito

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Dec 24, 2006, 1:36:00 PM12/24/06
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"Phil Yff" <phil...@adelphia.net> wrote in message
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The last two lines, I think, will be easier to sing, though the original
"Across this
earth the moonlihgt has frozen, ......" seemed too hard to sing well.

I will try to sing one example anyway. But will you be patient because such
a song
like this is a new genre and also a completely new song to me.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
B. Ito

Phil Yff

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Dec 26, 2006, 1:58:26 PM12/26/06
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On Mon, 25 Dec 2006 03:36:00 +0900, B. Ito wrote:

[snip]

I'm looking forward to it. Maybe the best time to make adjustments to the
translation is when you're actually singing it.

Phil Yff

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