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Re: Do cars with plastic bodies, like the Saturn, give bad radio reception?
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micky
Jul 23, 2021, 8:47:43 PM7/23/21
to
In alt.home.repair, on Fri, 23 Jul 2021 12:30:09 -0400, Clare Snyder
<cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote:
>On Fri, 23 Jul 2021 04:33:43 -0400, micky <NONONO...@fmguy.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Do cars with plastic bodies, like the Saturn, give bad radio reception?
> What would prompt that question? What properties of Plastic, or the
>behavior of radio waves????
Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
>If you are thinking of "ground planes" for the antenna, provisions for
>that are easily designed into plastic vehicles, just like on airplanes
>- but ground planes are most important for transmitting. Yes, a ground
>plane WILL improve reception, but automotive radio antenna are seldom
>anywhere CLOSE to "optimized" so the lack of a ground plane would make
>an almost inperceptible difference to reception.
<cl...@snyder.on.ca> wrote:
>On Fri, 23 Jul 2021 04:33:43 -0400, micky <NONONO...@fmguy.com>
>wrote:
>
>>Do cars with plastic bodies, like the Saturn, give bad radio reception?
> What would prompt that question? What properties of Plastic, or the
>behavior of radio waves????
Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
>If you are thinking of "ground planes" for the antenna, provisions for
>that are easily designed into plastic vehicles, just like on airplanes
>- but ground planes are most important for transmitting. Yes, a ground
>plane WILL improve reception, but automotive radio antenna are seldom
>anywhere CLOSE to "optimized" so the lack of a ground plane would make
>an almost inperceptible difference to reception.
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 12:13:18 AM7/24/21
to
On 7/23/2021 8:47 PM, micky wrote:
> Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
> than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
Typically better reception in the car, yes, but that all depends on the
> Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
> than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
antenna set up. You can have a very good antenna at home, but one with
a fault in a car. I've owned both. I'd like to build an AM loop in my
attic to get better AM reception at some point.
I am very into AM radio, especially long-distance AM stations at night.
I've owned cars where they seem to put no thought into the AM radio
band, and it shows (sounds). Dad had a Chevy Trailblazer (2006?) where
you could always hear the transmission or something interfering with the
AM reception.
Phil Allison
Jul 24, 2021, 1:03:01 AM7/24/21
to
micky wrote:
===========
This tends to work better than a small, ferrite loopstik - partly because the car antenna is normally *outdoors*.
Also, it is common for car radios to have a tuned RF stage prior to the frequency converter and IF.
So three tuned circuits instead of the usual two.
FYI they normally used inductance tuning.
.... Phil
===========
>
> Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
> than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
>
** Car radios rely on a tuned, vertical whip antenna that has a modest ground plane - the car body.
> Actually, it's that car radios have always given me better reception
> than house radios have. Is it the antenna, the ground plane? What?
>
This tends to work better than a small, ferrite loopstik - partly because the car antenna is normally *outdoors*.
Also, it is common for car radios to have a tuned RF stage prior to the frequency converter and IF.
So three tuned circuits instead of the usual two.
FYI they normally used inductance tuning.
.... Phil
micky
Jul 24, 2021, 10:06:27 AM7/24/21
to
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 24 Jul 2021 00:13:18 -0400, Michael Trew
Wow.
The '72 Buick and then the '84 Chrysler and 88 Chrysler would get
perfectly here in Baltimore WRC, 980AM, in Washington, DC, a station no
indoor radio, even the fancy receiver, would get at all. (I've only
lost interest in that station because it changed format.)
And for decades, one car radio after another, (maybe the Buick,) Chryler
and Toyota, would get WAMU, 88.5FM, (American University in DC),
perfectly, when only one inside radio would get it. Even now a much
different Toyota radio gets WAMU usually perfectly, when the one inside
radio no longer does as well. (For a while I was reporting to the WAMU
engineer when reception was good or bad, and he got it good, but months
later, it got weak again sometimes. (And like I say, that's the one
radio that gets it at all.)
At one point a friend gave me a nice wood "box" designed to hold a car
radio, an antenna, and a DC adapter, just for the sake of using a car
radio indoors, but at the same time he told me that it didnt' work for
him (which is why he was giving it to me). So it seems like the
difference is the metal body on cars, all but a few cars.
The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
warn people what is missing.
The '72 Buick and then the '84 Chrysler and 88 Chrysler would get
perfectly here in Baltimore WRC, 980AM, in Washington, DC, a station no
indoor radio, even the fancy receiver, would get at all. (I've only
lost interest in that station because it changed format.)
And for decades, one car radio after another, (maybe the Buick,) Chryler
and Toyota, would get WAMU, 88.5FM, (American University in DC),
perfectly, when only one inside radio would get it. Even now a much
different Toyota radio gets WAMU usually perfectly, when the one inside
radio no longer does as well. (For a while I was reporting to the WAMU
engineer when reception was good or bad, and he got it good, but months
later, it got weak again sometimes. (And like I say, that's the one
radio that gets it at all.)
At one point a friend gave me a nice wood "box" designed to hold a car
radio, an antenna, and a DC adapter, just for the sake of using a car
radio indoors, but at the same time he told me that it didnt' work for
him (which is why he was giving it to me). So it seems like the
difference is the metal body on cars, all but a few cars.
The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
warn people what is missing.
Ralph Mowery
Jul 24, 2021, 10:21:11 AM7/24/21
to
In article <q76ofg9e48u9nb1k4...@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07
@fmguy.com says...
much metal in them , especially the aluminum siding and foil reflecting
insulation that the radio signals have a hard time getting in to the
house.
@fmguy.com says...
>
> And for decades, one car radio after another, (maybe the Buick,) Chryler
> and Toyota, would get WAMU, 88.5FM, (American University in DC),
> perfectly, when only one inside radio would get it. Even now a much
> different Toyota radio gets WAMU usually perfectly, when the one inside
> radio no longer does as well. (For a while I was reporting to the WAMU
> engineer when reception was good or bad, and he got it good, but months
> later, it got weak again sometimes. (And like I say, that's the one
> radio that gets it at all.)
>
One other thing about the radio in the house is that some homes have so
> And for decades, one car radio after another, (maybe the Buick,) Chryler
> and Toyota, would get WAMU, 88.5FM, (American University in DC),
> perfectly, when only one inside radio would get it. Even now a much
> different Toyota radio gets WAMU usually perfectly, when the one inside
> radio no longer does as well. (For a while I was reporting to the WAMU
> engineer when reception was good or bad, and he got it good, but months
> later, it got weak again sometimes. (And like I say, that's the one
> radio that gets it at all.)
>
much metal in them , especially the aluminum siding and foil reflecting
insulation that the radio signals have a hard time getting in to the
house.
Ralph Mowery
Jul 24, 2021, 10:26:42 AM7/24/21
to
> The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
> make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
> cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
> pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
> is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
> provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
> warn people what is missing.
>
>
For AM radios in cars, the ground plane effect is almost nill. There is
> make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
> cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
> pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
> is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
> provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
> warn people what is missing.
>
>
some capacitance coupling from the frame to the gound, but that plays
very little in the AM band. The FM antennas are often built in the
windshelds and the metal of the car does not com into play there either
to ammount to anything.
To be much of a ground plane at the AM band you would need a plate of
around 100 feet, 200 feet would be better. Just look at how tall the AM
transmitter antennas are. Those antennas have about 120 wires as long
as the antenna is tall burried in the ground.
Frank
Jul 24, 2021, 10:41:17 AM7/24/21
to
https://courses.lumenlearning.com/boundless-physics/chapter/the-electromagnetic-spectrum/
Shorter wavelengths penetrate better.
micky
Jul 24, 2021, 11:12:00 AM7/24/21
to
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 24 Jul 2021 10:21:07 -0400, Ralph Mowery
I have T1-11 siding, not alumininum As to foil clad insulation, I
don't think so. I've been in the walls a little bit when I put a
floodlight in the outside bedroom wall. House built in '79, not cheap
but not the most expensive either. Plus there is a 6-foot wide window
facing DC from the bedroom, where many of the radios have been, with
aluminum window frames but the frames are not very big.
don't think so. I've been in the walls a little bit when I put a
floodlight in the outside bedroom wall. House built in '79, not cheap
but not the most expensive either. Plus there is a 6-foot wide window
facing DC from the bedroom, where many of the radios have been, with
aluminum window frames but the frames are not very big.
micky
Jul 24, 2021, 11:16:57 AM7/24/21
to
In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 24 Jul 2021 10:26:38 -0400, Ralph Mowery
can't remember which.
car? Especially FM. In the past year, reception for WAMU, 88.5 and
C-Span, 90.1, seems to have gone downhill.
<rmow...@charter.net> wrote:
>In article <q76ofg9e48u9nb1k4...@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07
>@fmguy.com says...
>>
>> The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
>> make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
>> cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
>> pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
>> is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
>> provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
>> warn people what is missing.
>>
>>
>
>For AM radios in cars, the ground plane effect is almost nill. There is
>some capacitance coupling from the frame to the gound, but that plays
>very little in the AM band. The FM antennas are often built in the
>windshelds and the metal of the car does not com into play there either
>to ammount to anything.
Only one car had the antenna in the windshield. A long time ago, I
>In article <q76ofg9e48u9nb1k4...@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07
>@fmguy.com says...
>>
>> The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
>> make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
>> cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
>> pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
>> is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
>> provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
>> warn people what is missing.
>>
>>
>
>For AM radios in cars, the ground plane effect is almost nill. There is
>some capacitance coupling from the frame to the gound, but that plays
>very little in the AM band. The FM antennas are often built in the
>windshelds and the metal of the car does not com into play there either
>to ammount to anything.
can't remember which.
>
>To be much of a ground plane at the AM band you would need a plate of
>around 100 feet, 200 feet would be better. Just look at how tall the AM
>transmitter antennas are. Those antennas have about 120 wires as long
>as the antenna is tall burried in the ground.
So what can I do to get reception inside as good as what I get in the
>To be much of a ground plane at the AM band you would need a plate of
>around 100 feet, 200 feet would be better. Just look at how tall the AM
>transmitter antennas are. Those antennas have about 120 wires as long
>as the antenna is tall burried in the ground.
car? Especially FM. In the past year, reception for WAMU, 88.5 and
C-Span, 90.1, seems to have gone downhill.
Jeff Liebermann
Jul 24, 2021, 11:38:58 AM7/24/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 10:06:23 -0400, micky <NONONO...@fmguy.com>
wrote:
>The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
>make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
>cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
>pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
>is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
>provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
>warn people what is missing.
I beg to differ. Nobody seems to have mentioned the bane of all MF
(medium frequency) reception, RF noise. A metal ground plane (car
body) does a tolerable job of isolating the AM antenna from the noise
generating ignition, black boxes, and gizmos. With a plastic body,
the antenna will pickup more noise from the engine.
The typical car antenna is sometimes located as far away from the
noisy engine as possible and connected to the AM receiver with RG-62/u
93 ohm low-capacitance coaxial cable. There is an adjustable
capacitor between the antenna and the receiver input capacitance to
resonate the antenna system. The coax cable capacitance and the
receiver input capacitance act as a voltage divider. The more coax
cable capacitance to ground, the less signal and noise arrive at the
receiver. Choose your coax cable type and length carefully.
You can have a really sensitive AM receiver, and still not be able to
hear much. The threshold of sensitivity is atmospheric and man-made
noise.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_noise>
Note the graph. At 1MHz, the RF noise (mostly from thunderstorms) is
huge.
<https://map.blitzortung.org/#3.91/39.62/-91.39>
RF noise from neon signs, motors, sparking of any kind, etc just makes
it worse. If you simply build a bigger antenna, or add an RF
amplifier, you increase both the desired signal and the noise
proportionally. If a receiver and antenna produce some SNR (signal to
noise ratio), and I add more antenna gain, or more RF amplification,
the resultant SNR will be the same. In other words, a bigger antenna
or a "signal booster" don't buy you anything. The trick is to somehow
improve the SNR, which is not easy. See various articles on the
PA0RDT mini-whip antenna for clues:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=pa0rdt+mini+whip>
Car AM radios tend to have the minimum sensitivity and RF front end
gain needed to function in a strong signal environment. They're not
made for digging signals out of the noise. That's NOT because AM car
radios are made to be inexpensive. It's because the receiver is
sitting next to a very noisy car engine. Were it designed to be as
sensitive as an LF or HF receiver, all you would hear is engine noise.
Try it. Build yourself a BCB (broadcast band) RF amplifier and attach
it to your car radio antenna input. In most cases, you'll hear your
engine, pump motors, and atmospherics quite well, but the distant AM
stations will still be buried under the noise.
I don't have any suggestions to improve your mobile AM reception.
Well, maybe the obvious suggestion to do what you can to eliminate,
move, shield, or isolate sources of RF noise. If weak AM signals
magically appear when you turn off the engine, the source of the noise
is obvious. The problem is that you might do a wonderful job of noise
reduction on your car, such as buy a diesel, but that does nothing if
you're stuck in traffic and surrounded by other noisy vehicles. Notice
that the ultimate noise generator, the all electric car, usually does
not come with an AM radio. For example, Tesla will sell you an
optional overpriced infotainment package that includes AM:
<https://electrek.co/2020/10/28/tesla-brings-back-radio-infotainment-retrofit/>
Vendors used to sell rubber grounding straps, that discharge any
static buildup on the car body. That should get rid of some noise.
However, I believe carbon doped car tires have largely eliminated the
need for those straps.
So, to answer your question, yes a plastic body gives lousy AM
reception if your engine belches lots of RF noise and your receiver is
reasonably sensitive. If your receiver is stone deaf, it doesn't
matter.
Good luck.
--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
wrote:
>The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
>make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
>cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
>pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
>is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
>provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
>warn people what is missing.
(medium frequency) reception, RF noise. A metal ground plane (car
body) does a tolerable job of isolating the AM antenna from the noise
generating ignition, black boxes, and gizmos. With a plastic body,
the antenna will pickup more noise from the engine.
The typical car antenna is sometimes located as far away from the
noisy engine as possible and connected to the AM receiver with RG-62/u
93 ohm low-capacitance coaxial cable. There is an adjustable
capacitor between the antenna and the receiver input capacitance to
resonate the antenna system. The coax cable capacitance and the
receiver input capacitance act as a voltage divider. The more coax
cable capacitance to ground, the less signal and noise arrive at the
receiver. Choose your coax cable type and length carefully.
You can have a really sensitive AM receiver, and still not be able to
hear much. The threshold of sensitivity is atmospheric and man-made
noise.
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atmospheric_noise>
Note the graph. At 1MHz, the RF noise (mostly from thunderstorms) is
huge.
<https://map.blitzortung.org/#3.91/39.62/-91.39>
RF noise from neon signs, motors, sparking of any kind, etc just makes
it worse. If you simply build a bigger antenna, or add an RF
amplifier, you increase both the desired signal and the noise
proportionally. If a receiver and antenna produce some SNR (signal to
noise ratio), and I add more antenna gain, or more RF amplification,
the resultant SNR will be the same. In other words, a bigger antenna
or a "signal booster" don't buy you anything. The trick is to somehow
improve the SNR, which is not easy. See various articles on the
PA0RDT mini-whip antenna for clues:
<https://www.google.com/search?q=pa0rdt+mini+whip>
Car AM radios tend to have the minimum sensitivity and RF front end
gain needed to function in a strong signal environment. They're not
made for digging signals out of the noise. That's NOT because AM car
radios are made to be inexpensive. It's because the receiver is
sitting next to a very noisy car engine. Were it designed to be as
sensitive as an LF or HF receiver, all you would hear is engine noise.
Try it. Build yourself a BCB (broadcast band) RF amplifier and attach
it to your car radio antenna input. In most cases, you'll hear your
engine, pump motors, and atmospherics quite well, but the distant AM
stations will still be buried under the noise.
I don't have any suggestions to improve your mobile AM reception.
Well, maybe the obvious suggestion to do what you can to eliminate,
move, shield, or isolate sources of RF noise. If weak AM signals
magically appear when you turn off the engine, the source of the noise
is obvious. The problem is that you might do a wonderful job of noise
reduction on your car, such as buy a diesel, but that does nothing if
you're stuck in traffic and surrounded by other noisy vehicles. Notice
that the ultimate noise generator, the all electric car, usually does
not come with an AM radio. For example, Tesla will sell you an
optional overpriced infotainment package that includes AM:
<https://electrek.co/2020/10/28/tesla-brings-back-radio-infotainment-retrofit/>
Vendors used to sell rubber grounding straps, that discharge any
static buildup on the car body. That should get rid of some noise.
However, I believe carbon doped car tires have largely eliminated the
need for those straps.
So, to answer your question, yes a plastic body gives lousy AM
reception if your engine belches lots of RF noise and your receiver is
reasonably sensitive. If your receiver is stone deaf, it doesn't
matter.
Good luck.
--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558
Ralph Mowery
Jul 24, 2021, 11:57:18 AM7/24/21
to
In article <lebofg5ovck64gg67...@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07
@fmguy.com says...
@fmguy.com says...
>
> So what can I do to get reception inside as good as what I get in the
> car? Especially FM. In the past year, reception for WAMU, 88.5 and
> C-Span, 90.1, seems to have gone downhill.
>
>
For in the house put up an outside antenna and feed it with coax cable.
> So what can I do to get reception inside as good as what I get in the
> car? Especially FM. In the past year, reception for WAMU, 88.5 and
> C-Span, 90.1, seems to have gone downhill.
>
>
rbowman
Jul 24, 2021, 1:09:10 PM7/24/21
to
I built a variation of this theme and it worked well. At the time I was
living about 20 miles from the Mexican border and the highly directional
nature of loop antennas let me null out the Mexican power houses.
This is a simpler version that doesn't require building a frame:
https://ccrane.com/How-To-Make-a-Simple-Powerful-AM-Loop-Antenna-For-Free/
http://earmark.net/gesr/loop/
That one is more technical. I didn't look through all the links but onr
method was to use ribbon cable. When you solder the ends you offset the
conductors and solder them to the one next to it so you're forming one
long conductor.
rbowman
Jul 24, 2021, 1:11:49 PM7/24/21
to
Peter W.
Jul 24, 2021, 1:32:24 PM7/24/21
to
Mpffff....
Car radios are optimized for cars. Cars are tiny, noisy, poorly laid out devices operating in a noisy environment where the primary expectation is good reception. So, the radio designers ignore such niceties as S/N ratios, separation, bandwidth, and so forth for capture. As such, a car radio will receive reliably under conditions that would have a home tuner in full-mute. And were you to take that car tuner and connect it to your home system - assuming the system is reasonably good - you would be horrified at the results.
Horses for courses.
Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA
Car radios are optimized for cars. Cars are tiny, noisy, poorly laid out devices operating in a noisy environment where the primary expectation is good reception. So, the radio designers ignore such niceties as S/N ratios, separation, bandwidth, and so forth for capture. As such, a car radio will receive reliably under conditions that would have a home tuner in full-mute. And were you to take that car tuner and connect it to your home system - assuming the system is reasonably good - you would be horrified at the results.
Horses for courses.
Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA
Peeler
Jul 24, 2021, 2:53:34 PM7/24/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:11:42 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> And for the best outcome, build in a swamp.
You just HAVE to open your endlessly driveling gob! LOL
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> And for the best outcome, build in a swamp.
Peeler
Jul 24, 2021, 2:55:05 PM7/24/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:09:02 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
"A variation of this theme", eh, you ridiculous verbose bigmouth? LMAO
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> I built a variation of this theme.
"A variation of this theme", eh, you ridiculous verbose bigmouth? LMAO
Rod Speed
Jul 24, 2021, 3:46:32 PM7/24/21
to
rbowman <bow...@montana.com> wrote
> Ralph Mowery wrote
>> NONONO...@fmguy.com wrote
But that’s for the transmitter, it isn't the best way to do an AM receiver.
> Ralph Mowery wrote
>> NONONO...@fmguy.com wrote
Peeler
Jul 24, 2021, 3:53:09 PM7/24/21
to
On Sun, 25 Jul 2021 05:46:25 +1000, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:
<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Xeno to trolling senile Rodent:
"You're a sad old man Rod, truly sad."
MID: <id04c3...@mid.individual.net>
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:
<FLUSH the trolling senile asshole's latest trollshit unread>
--
Xeno to trolling senile Rodent:
"You're a sad old man Rod, truly sad."
MID: <id04c3...@mid.individual.net>
bruce bowser
Jul 24, 2021, 5:49:08 PM7/24/21
to
Peter W.
Jul 24, 2021, 7:10:44 PM7/24/21
to
> That's odd. If you go to the NASA space museums, you see that the early 1970's satellites have all of this gold and copper looking foil around the satellite's lower regions. I thought that helped with transceiver communications.
Heat.
Phil Allison
Jul 24, 2021, 8:24:56 PM7/24/21
to
rbowman wrote:
==============
** LOL
I have been using a 5 turn frame antenna *just* like that since the late 70s !!
My * tube AM tuner* has a transformer balanced input for use with a loop.
Like the Carver TX-11b, it also has 15kHz audio bandwidth and low THD at 95% mod plus a switchable, sharp notch at 9kHz.
But the maker ( here in Sydney) did not suggest using a frame antenna in the handbook, nor had one been tried when I asked.
His method was to run a fixed, single turn loop around a window.
The frame is better as you can orient it to maximise the signal or null an unwanted one.
... Phil
==============
>
> http://socalradiowaves.com/columns/am_antenna.html
>
> I built a variation of this theme and it worked well.
--------------------------------------------------------------
> http://socalradiowaves.com/columns/am_antenna.html
>
> I built a variation of this theme and it worked well.
** LOL
I have been using a 5 turn frame antenna *just* like that since the late 70s !!
My * tube AM tuner* has a transformer balanced input for use with a loop.
Like the Carver TX-11b, it also has 15kHz audio bandwidth and low THD at 95% mod plus a switchable, sharp notch at 9kHz.
But the maker ( here in Sydney) did not suggest using a frame antenna in the handbook, nor had one been tried when I asked.
His method was to run a fixed, single turn loop around a window.
The frame is better as you can orient it to maximise the signal or null an unwanted one.
... Phil
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 9:25:07 PM7/24/21
to
parts from a 1976 also (including the VIN and title). It's hard to say
which year had that windshield; maybe both.
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 9:31:27 PM7/24/21
to
helpful.
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 9:33:52 PM7/24/21
to
put it out of place in my attic, if I can make a run downstairs easily
enough.
If I were to make the other antenna, do you think I could use my home's
breaker box grounding rod for the antenna, or might there be electrical
interference from the circuits and appliances in my home?
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 9:37:55 PM7/24/21
to
Unfortunately, the fuse in the fusebox is good, but the radio does
nothing when turned on. It appears that all of the wires are in place,
including to the one dash speaker, but the only think I can see it do
when I turn it on is slightly dim the dome light when switched on -
absolutely no audio.
I bet if it were working, being designed solely for AM transmission, it
would pick up stations quite well. It's solid state... I might have to
tear into it at some point. The preset station buttons still seem to
work as intended.
Trevor Wilson
Jul 24, 2021, 10:11:43 PM7/24/21
to
Phil Allison
Jul 24, 2021, 10:33:50 PM7/24/21
to
Trevor Wilson wrote:
================
> **Audiosound?
** How'd you guess?
Yes, the famous AM100 valve tuner.
BTW mine has a few mods now.
1. 4 pin mic plug and socket for the frame antenna.
2. Op-amp ( TL071) buffer for the output with voltage doubler +/- 8VDC supply off the 6.3v heater run.
3. Out level control on the rear panel with 6.3mm jack socket.
4. Hum loop eliminator in the AC safety ground.
5. New ceramic valve sockets.
It needs a new EM84 "magic eye" indicator - but they are darn expensive.
The Carver tuner is interesting:
http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/tx-11b.htm
Sound sample from the AM part:
http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/kfsd.wav
..... Phil
================
** How'd you guess?
Yes, the famous AM100 valve tuner.
BTW mine has a few mods now.
1. 4 pin mic plug and socket for the frame antenna.
2. Op-amp ( TL071) buffer for the output with voltage doubler +/- 8VDC supply off the 6.3v heater run.
3. Out level control on the rear panel with 6.3mm jack socket.
4. Hum loop eliminator in the AC safety ground.
5. New ceramic valve sockets.
It needs a new EM84 "magic eye" indicator - but they are darn expensive.
The Carver tuner is interesting:
http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/tx-11b.htm
Sound sample from the AM part:
http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/kfsd.wav
..... Phil
rbowman
Jul 24, 2021, 11:13:06 PM7/24/21
to
they are. DX Magazine was good but it was produced by one man who died
in 2017. Arnie Coro had a 'DXers Unlimited' show on Radio Habana but I
think that's been off the air for several years too.
The sad truth is many of the knowledgeable radio people are aging out.
Even the international broadcasters that kept the airwaves interesting
30 years ago have went to the internet. At its peak Deutsche Welle had
15 500 KW transmitters. I don't think any are active now.
I've spent some time in Arizona south of Gila Bend. In the evenings I
enjoyed the AM oldies station in Oklahoma City. Mornings I could get
news and music from California. Curiosity about the whys and wherefores
got me into ham radio.
Michael Trew
Jul 24, 2021, 11:21:30 PM7/24/21
to
tune through distant AM stations that I could pull in from eastern Ohio.
One of my favorites to listen to is still 650 WSM in Nashville. Kind
of an odd hobby for a pre-teen/teenager growing up in the internet era
(I'm 26 now for reference), but I've always enjoyed it.
Jeff Liebermann
Jul 24, 2021, 11:56:52 PM7/24/21
to
ugly green pressure suit affairs, that looked awful in press photos
and videos. So, NASA hired fashion designers Rudi Gernreich and later
Pierre Cardin to design something futuristic and more in line with
science fiction. The result was the silver lamé space suits.
<https://static1.squarespace.com/static/57c4ce9d1b631b5c58eb6a71/t/589686ed20099e1b6fb66664/1486259962410/Spacesuit+pamphlet.pdf>
Jeff Liebermann
Jul 25, 2021, 12:08:59 AM7/25/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:11:42 -0600, rbowman <bow...@montana.com>
wrote:
>And for the best outcome, build in a swamp.
Done. Locally, KSCO's antennas are located in Corcoran Lagoon (Santa
Cruz, California):
<https://i.redd.it/d90te63rl5171.jpg>
The excellent salt/brackish water grounding is responsible for KSCO's
very strong signal and large coverage area.
<http://ksco.com>
wrote:
>And for the best outcome, build in a swamp.
Cruz, California):
<https://i.redd.it/d90te63rl5171.jpg>
The excellent salt/brackish water grounding is responsible for KSCO's
very strong signal and large coverage area.
<http://ksco.com>
Trevor Wilson
Jul 25, 2021, 12:44:23 AM7/25/21
to
On 25/07/2021 12:33 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
> Trevor Wilson wrote:
> ================
> Phil Allison wrote:
>>> rbowman wrote:
>>> ==============
>>>>
>>>> http://socalradiowaves.com/columns/am_antenna.html
>>>>
>>>> I built a variation of this theme and it worked well.
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>> ** LOL
>>>
>>> I have been using a 5 turn frame antenna *just* like that since the late 70s !!
>>>
>>> My * tube AM tuner* has a transformer balanced input for use with a loop.
>>> Like the Carver TX-11b, it also has 15kHz audio bandwidth and low THD at 95% mod plus a switchable, sharp notch at 9kHz.
>>>
>>> But the maker ( here in Sydney) did not suggest using a frame antenna in the handbook, nor had one been tried when I asked.
>>> His method was to run a fixed, single turn loop around a window.
>>>
>>> The frame is better as you can orient it to maximise the signal or null an unwanted one.
>>>
>
>>>
>> **Audiosound?
>
>
> ** How'd you guess?
**'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
> Trevor Wilson wrote:
> ================
> Phil Allison wrote:
>>> rbowman wrote:
>>> ==============
>>>>
>>>> http://socalradiowaves.com/columns/am_antenna.html
>>>>
>>>> I built a variation of this theme and it worked well.
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------------------
>>> ** LOL
>>>
>>> I have been using a 5 turn frame antenna *just* like that since the late 70s !!
>>>
>>> My * tube AM tuner* has a transformer balanced input for use with a loop.
>>> Like the Carver TX-11b, it also has 15kHz audio bandwidth and low THD at 95% mod plus a switchable, sharp notch at 9kHz.
>>>
>>> But the maker ( here in Sydney) did not suggest using a frame antenna in the handbook, nor had one been tried when I asked.
>>> His method was to run a fixed, single turn loop around a window.
>>>
>>> The frame is better as you can orient it to maximise the signal or null an unwanted one.
>>>
>
>>>
>> **Audiosound?
>
>
> ** How'd you guess?
(well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
expensive) and used to delight in demonstrating them to unsuspecting
customers who thought they were listening to an FM transmission. Very
impressive things. No wonder every radio station used one for off-air
monitoring.
>
> Yes, the famous AM100 valve tuner.
>
> BTW mine has a few mods now.
>
> 1. 4 pin mic plug and socket for the frame antenna.
> 2. Op-amp ( TL071) buffer for the output with voltage doubler +/- 8VDC supply off the 6.3v heater run.
> 3. Out level control on the rear panel with 6.3mm jack socket.
> 4. Hum loop eliminator in the AC safety ground.
> 5. New ceramic valve sockets.
>
> It needs a new EM84 "magic eye" indicator - but they are darn expensive.
>
>
> The Carver tuner is interesting:
>
> http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/tx-11b.htm
>
> Sound sample from the AM part:
>
> http://ham-radio.com/k6sti/kfsd.wav
built a really nice valved, TRF tuner, using an 'infinite impedance'
detector. It was from a Kiwi radio magazine from the 1950s. It was so
nice, I once called up the radio station (prolly 2SM back then) and
asked them to change the stylus on their 'B' turntable, because it was
obvious that the stylus was worn/chipped. Geez it sounded nice.
Phil Allison
Jul 25, 2021, 1:04:15 AM7/25/21
to
Trevor Wilson wrote:
================
Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
The SS version came out later.
..... Phil
================
>>
> >> **Audiosound?
> >
> >
> > ** How'd you guess?
>
> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
> expensive)
>
** The AM100 valve model was about A$125 in 1974.
> >> **Audiosound?
> >
> >
> > ** How'd you guess?
>
> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
> expensive)
>
Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
The SS version came out later.
..... Phil
Trevor Wilson
Jul 25, 2021, 1:24:47 AM7/25/21
to
in 1985-ish. For about $300.00 one could buy a quite decent, all
digital, Japanese AM/FM tuner. Of course, the AM section was utter shit.
I suspect the reason why Aussie AM tuners reached a pinnacle of quality
was in no small part due the late adoption of FM in this country.
rbowman
Jul 25, 2021, 1:43:26 AM7/25/21
to
On 07/24/2021 09:21 PM, Michael Trew wrote:
> I never got into HAM radio, maybe one day. I used to sit at night and
> tune through distant AM stations that I could pull in from eastern Ohio.
> One of my favorites to listen to is still 650 WSM in Nashville. Kind
> of an odd hobby for a pre-teen/teenager growing up in the internet era
> (I'm 26 now for reference), but I've always enjoyed it.
I grew up in upstate New York and in the early mornings WOWO in Fort
> I never got into HAM radio, maybe one day. I used to sit at night and
> tune through distant AM stations that I could pull in from eastern Ohio.
> One of my favorites to listen to is still 650 WSM in Nashville. Kind
> of an odd hobby for a pre-teen/teenager growing up in the internet era
> (I'm 26 now for reference), but I've always enjoyed it.
Wayne came in loud and clear with their reports on hog belly futures.
They were a 50000 watt clear channel at the time. Inner City
Broadcasting bought the station for the express purpose of cutting it
down to 10000 watts. WLIB, in NYC, is a black-owned station that is also
on 1190 AM. With WOWO dialed down, WLIB could go to 24 hour operation.
One of those twists of fate I worked in Fort Wayne years later and flew
out of Smith Field, a small airport north of town. Climbing out to the
southwest you'd pass WOWO's antenna. It was sort of spooky looking over
and seeing an antenna
Phil Allison
Jul 25, 2021, 2:02:50 AM7/25/21
to
On Sunday, July 25, 2021 at 3:24:47 PM UTC+10, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 25/07/2021 3:04 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
> > Trevor Wilson wrote:
> > ================
> >>>
> >>>> **Audiosound?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ** How'd you guess?
> >>
> >> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
> >> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
> >> expensive)
> >>
> >
> > ** The AM100 valve model was about A$125 in 1974.
> >
> > Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
> > The SS version came out later.
> >
> **My recollection is that the SS tuner (AM only) sold for around $500.00
> in 1985-ish.
** Probably correct.
> On 25/07/2021 3:04 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
> > Trevor Wilson wrote:
> > ================
> >>>
> >>>> **Audiosound?
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> ** How'd you guess?
> >>
> >> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
> >> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
> >> expensive)
> >>
> >
> > ** The AM100 valve model was about A$125 in 1974.
> >
> > Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
> > The SS version came out later.
> >
> **My recollection is that the SS tuner (AM only) sold for around $500.00
> in 1985-ish.
The AM100 was sold at a tiny profit mainly direct to existing Audiosound customers.
Dealers were rarely involved.
Only competition back then was the " Wright Audio Developments" SS tuner.
As you know, I worked for Allen Wright too and while there modded a few tuners so the notch filter was at 9 kHz.
At that time he was building an upgraded model, full of ICs and featuring an LED digital frequency readout.
Till Ian Pogson of EA magazine stole the whole design.
FYI:
Took one of Allen's new models ( the AWE Tuner) home one night and did A-Bs with my Audiosound.
Though generally similar, the AM100 had a big edge in audio bandwidth on the ABC stations.
Like his earlier tuner, the new one also had no bypass switch for the notch filter.
> For about $300.00 one could buy a quite decent, all
> digital, Japanese AM/FM tuner. Of course, the AM section was utter shit.
> I suspect the reason why Aussie AM tuners reached a pinnacle of quality
> was in no small part due the late adoption of FM in this country.
( far fewer stations and much further apart compared to the US and Europe)
..... Phil
Trevor Wilson
Jul 25, 2021, 2:44:45 AM7/25/21
to
On 25/07/2021 4:02 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
> On Sunday, July 25, 2021 at 3:24:47 PM UTC+10, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 25/07/2021 3:04 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> ================
>>>>>
>>>>>> **Audiosound?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ** How'd you guess?
>>>>
>>>> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
>>>> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
>>>> expensive)
>>>>
>>>
>>> ** The AM100 valve model was about A$125 in 1974.
>>>
>>> Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
>>> The SS version came out later.
>>>
>> **My recollection is that the SS tuner (AM only) sold for around $500.00
>> in 1985-ish.
>
> ** Probably correct.
> The AM100 was sold at a tiny profit mainly direct to existing Audiosound customers.
> Dealers were rarely involved.
> Only competition back then was the " Wright Audio Developments" SS tuner.
> As you know, I worked for Allen Wright too and while there modded a few tuners so the notch filter was at 9 kHz.
> At that time he was building an upgraded model, full of ICs and featuring an LED digital frequency readout.
> Till Ian Pogson of EA magazine stole the whole design.
**I have one of Allen's original ones here. I tried to pull it apart,
> On Sunday, July 25, 2021 at 3:24:47 PM UTC+10, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 25/07/2021 3:04 pm, Phil Allison wrote:
>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> ================
>>>>>
>>>>>> **Audiosound?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ** How'd you guess?
>>>>
>>>> **'Cause his AM tuners were fabulous. I sold his SS AM tuners in my shop
>>>> (well, in truth, only a minuscule number, because they were very
>>>> expensive)
>>>>
>>>
>>> ** The AM100 valve model was about A$125 in 1974.
>>>
>>> Got mine at a discount cos I was working for Woollarah Hi-Fi at the time.
>>> The SS version came out later.
>>>
>> **My recollection is that the SS tuner (AM only) sold for around $500.00
>> in 1985-ish.
>
> ** Probably correct.
> The AM100 was sold at a tiny profit mainly direct to existing Audiosound customers.
> Dealers were rarely involved.
> Only competition back then was the " Wright Audio Developments" SS tuner.
> As you know, I worked for Allen Wright too and while there modded a few tuners so the notch filter was at 9 kHz.
> At that time he was building an upgraded model, full of ICs and featuring an LED digital frequency readout.
> Till Ian Pogson of EA magazine stole the whole design.
but I can't figure out how it comes apart. Glued?
>
> FYI:
>
> Took one of Allen's new models ( the AWE Tuner) home one night and did A-Bs with my Audiosound.
> Though generally similar, the AM100 had a big edge in audio bandwidth on the ABC stations.
> Like his earlier tuner, the new one also had no bypass switch for the notch filter.
>
>
>> For about $300.00 one could buy a quite decent, all
>> digital, Japanese AM/FM tuner. Of course, the AM section was utter shit.
>
> ** Dull and woolly sounding - you mean ?
https://www.hifiengine.com/manual_library/sansui/tu-x1.shtml
The internals were more like a proper communication receiver than a
domestic one. Impressive beast.
>
>> I suspect the reason why Aussie AM tuners reached a pinnacle of quality
>> was in no small part due the late adoption of FM in this country.
>
> ** Plus the fact that Aussie AM broadcast radio was far superior to other countries in sound quality.
>
> ( far fewer stations and much further apart compared to the US and Europe)
interference.
Phil Allison
Jul 25, 2021, 4:05:39 AM7/25/21
to
Trevor Wilson wrote:
=================
Maybe some fool has glued the top on your example.
Intriguing fact is that is it full of Australian made ( ATxxx numbers) silicon transistors plus one FET.
Aegis RF transformers, Roblan AM tuning gang and 6:1 reduction drive.
http://www.borrett.id.au/interests/av-system.htm
See 1/3 down the page.
..... Phil
=================
>
> **I have one of Allen's original ones here. I tried to pull it apart,
> but I can't figure out how it comes apart. Glued?
>
** I never had any problem opening one.
> **I have one of Allen's original ones here. I tried to pull it apart,
> but I can't figure out how it comes apart. Glued?
>
Maybe some fool has glued the top on your example.
Intriguing fact is that is it full of Australian made ( ATxxx numbers) silicon transistors plus one FET.
Aegis RF transformers, Roblan AM tuning gang and 6:1 reduction drive.
http://www.borrett.id.au/interests/av-system.htm
See 1/3 down the page.
..... Phil
Peeler
Jul 25, 2021, 4:43:28 AM7/25/21
to
his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
Peeler
Jul 25, 2021, 4:54:53 AM7/25/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 21:12:57 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> It should work. There are several DX sites but I don't know how useful
> they are. DX Magazine was good but it was produced by one man who
Oh, fuck, the senile gossip is at it, again... <tsk>
> they are. DX Magazine was good but it was produced by one man who
Peeler
Jul 25, 2021, 4:55:43 AM7/25/21
to
On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 23:43:17 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> I grew up in upstate New
Oh, no! Senile blabbermouth is at it again. LOL
Buck Fiden
Jul 25, 2021, 6:53:17 AM7/25/21
to
One day I waved at a guy doing maintenance near the top of the tower. He waved back...or maybe gave me the finger, I'm not sure.
Allodoxaphobia
Jul 25, 2021, 12:09:48 PM7/25/21
to
... probably not to humanity all-in-all.
Peter W.
Jul 25, 2021, 12:17:45 PM7/25/21
to
Oh. I dunno....
Perhaps a little competition for the Drongo from Down Under? No where near as polished, of course.
Perhaps a little competition for the Drongo from Down Under? No where near as polished, of course.
Peeler
Jul 25, 2021, 12:40:02 PM7/25/21
to
On 25 Jul 2021 16:09:44 GMT, Allodoxaphobia, another ridiculous senile twit,
blathered:
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery"
>>language and his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> And, you add _nothing_ of value to sci.electronics.repair ...
I most certainly do, senile twit! I'm the only one to point out the sick
(and senile) shit that's going on in these groups!
> ... probably not to humanity all-in-all.
To "humanity"??? LMAO Fucking stupid blithering senile idiots everywhere on
Usenet today! LOL
blathered:
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery"
>>language and his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> And, you add _nothing_ of value to sci.electronics.repair ...
(and senile) shit that's going on in these groups!
> ... probably not to humanity all-in-all.
Usenet today! LOL
rbowman
Jul 25, 2021, 12:40:35 PM7/25/21
to
me -- somebody had to climb that tower. Flying around in a Tomahawk, no
problem, thinking about hanging off the tower, sympathetic acrophobia.
Peeler
Jul 25, 2021, 1:09:44 PM7/25/21
to
On Sun, 25 Jul 2021 10:40:27 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly driveling,
senile bigmouth?
troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
> There was nobody doing maintenance but that was the thought that chilled
> me -- somebody had to climb that tower. Flying around in a Tomahawk, no
> problem, thinking about hanging off the tower, sympathetic acrophobia.
LOL! You just LOVE to hear yourself talking, don't you, you abnormal verbose
> me -- somebody had to climb that tower. Flying around in a Tomahawk, no
> problem, thinking about hanging off the tower, sympathetic acrophobia.
senile bigmouth?
Michael Trew
Jul 25, 2021, 7:27:09 PM7/25/21
to
some smaller station go 24 hours... that seems like one step forward and
two steps back.
Trevor Wilson
Jul 25, 2021, 7:55:26 PM7/25/21
to
shot at pulling it apart.
Phil Allison
Jul 25, 2021, 8:55:30 PM7/25/21
to
Drawn by Allen Wright himself, pen and ruler job, from circa 1972.
Copy of a copy but legible enough.
All part numbers and values shown.
The AT transistors were made by Anodeon in Melbourne.
Be easiest for me to mail it to you.
.... Phil
Trevor Wilson
Jul 25, 2021, 9:00:29 PM7/25/21
to
curiosity. Address is
PO Box 125
Oyster Bay 2225
Thanks
I'll poke around and see if I have a spare EM84.
amdx
Jul 25, 2021, 9:14:38 PM7/25/21
to
here. Please leave.
Mikek
--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
Michael Trew
Jul 25, 2021, 11:14:33 PM7/25/21
to
On 7/25/2021 9:14 PM, amdx wrote:
> On 7/25/2021 3:42 AM, Peeler wrote:
>> On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 21:31:30 -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
>>
>>> On 7/24/2021 2:54 PM, Peeler wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:09:02 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly
>>>> driveling,
>>>> troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I built a variation of this theme.
>>>> "A variation of this theme", eh, you ridiculous verbose bigmouth? LMAO
>>> My God, are you annoying. Just shut the hell up. I found his post very
>>> helpful.
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery" language
>> and
>> his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
> here. Please leave.
>
> Mikek
>
>
+1
> On 7/25/2021 3:42 AM, Peeler wrote:
>> On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 21:31:30 -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
>>
>>> On 7/24/2021 2:54 PM, Peeler wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:09:02 -0600, lowbrowwoman, the endlessly
>>>> driveling,
>>>> troll-feeding, senile idiot, blabbered again:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> I built a variation of this theme.
>>>> "A variation of this theme", eh, you ridiculous verbose bigmouth? LMAO
>>> My God, are you annoying. Just shut the hell up. I found his post very
>>> helpful.
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery" language
>> and
>> his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
> here. Please leave.
>
> Mikek
>
>
Peeler
Jul 26, 2021, 3:55:38 AM7/26/21
to
On Sun, 25 Jul 2021 20:14:32 -0500, amdx, another senile shithead,
blathered:
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery" language and
>> his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
> here. Please leave.
>
> Mikek
Well, senile asshole, MORE than 90% of the "posters" on this group ARE
senile (i.e. they are, by their own admittance, way over 70 and 80) who keep
living out their senility (i.e. their absolutely idiotic endless blathering
about any off topic sick shit in this group). I just won't take any advice
from senile assholes like these! Capisci?
blathered:
>> Well, I find his feeding of the trolls, his idiotic "flowery" language and
>> his endless gossiping very annoying, senile twit!
>
> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
> here. Please leave.
>
> Mikek
senile (i.e. they are, by their own admittance, way over 70 and 80) who keep
living out their senility (i.e. their absolutely idiotic endless blathering
about any off topic sick shit in this group). I just won't take any advice
from senile assholes like these! Capisci?
Peeler
Jul 26, 2021, 3:56:10 AM7/26/21
to
On Sun, 25 Jul 2021 23:14:29 -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
>> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
>> here. Please leave.
>>
>> Mikek
>>
>>
>
> +1
LOL Pathetic bunch of senile idiots, really!
>> I feel very confident 90% of this group would think YOU are the problem
>> here. Please leave.
>>
>> Mikek
>>
>>
>
> +1
Peter W.
Jul 26, 2021, 11:12:32 AM7/26/21
to
Guys & Gals:
Peeler is a waste of air/water/space with neither the 'gift' for invective nor the technical experience of our resident Tourette's Syndrome participant, Mr. Allison. One wonders if Peeler's dam had any offspring that lived, or whether a dam was even involved. Let it fester. It is utterly powerless.
Peeler is a waste of air/water/space with neither the 'gift' for invective nor the technical experience of our resident Tourette's Syndrome participant, Mr. Allison. One wonders if Peeler's dam had any offspring that lived, or whether a dam was even involved. Let it fester. It is utterly powerless.
Tekkie©
Jul 26, 2021, 2:30:14 PM7/26/21
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On Sat, 24 Jul 2021 11:16:54 -0400, micky posted for all of us to digest...
>
> In alt.home.repair, on Sat, 24 Jul 2021 10:26:38 -0400, Ralph Mowery
> <rmow...@charter.net> wrote:
>
> >In article <q76ofg9e48u9nb1k4...@4ax.com>, NONONOmisc07
> >@fmguy.com says...
> >>
> >> The urls people have posted here (before electronics.repair was added)
> >> make clear that the ground plane in the car makes a difference, and that
> >> cars without one need a special antenna cable, but a) they're mostly
> >> pushed for CB radios, b) it's not at all clear that the special antenna
> >> is as good c) when shopping for an antenna, any with ground plane
> >> provision probably make note of it, but those without do not, afaik,
> >> warn people what is missing.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >For AM radios in cars, the ground plane effect is almost nill. There is
> >some capacitance coupling from the frame to the gound, but that plays
> >very little in the AM band. The FM antennas are often built in the
> >windshelds and the metal of the car does not com into play there either
> >to ammount to anything.
>
> Only one car had the antenna in the windshield. A long time ago, I
> can't remember which.
> >
> >To be much of a ground plane at the AM band you would need a plate of
> >around 100 feet, 200 feet would be better. Just look at how tall the AM
> >transmitter antennas are. Those antennas have about 120 wires as long
> >as the antenna is tall burried in the ground.
>
> So what can I do to get reception inside as good as what I get in the
> car? Especially FM. In the past year, reception for WAMU, 88.5 and
> C-Span, 90.1, seems to have gone downhill.
Could be because of Sunspot cycle 25
--
Tekkie
Michael Trew
Jul 26, 2021, 3:57:46 PM7/26/21
to
direction... I'm 26 years old. I bet that you are older than my
parents. Look in a mirror, nutcase.
Peeler
Jul 26, 2021, 4:50:29 PM7/26/21
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On Mon, 26 Jul 2021 15:57:43 -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
>> LOL Pathetic bunch of senile idiots, really!
>
> That's kind of funny that you are directing a "senile" comment in my
> direction... I'm 26 years old. I bet that you are older than my
> parents. Look in a mirror, nutcase.
What IS funny is that you ARE obviously as dumb as the senile twits who
>> LOL Pathetic bunch of senile idiots, really!
>
> That's kind of funny that you are directing a "senile" comment in my
> direction... I'm 26 years old. I bet that you are older than my
> parents. Look in a mirror, nutcase.
infest ahr and that you are siding with! LOL
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