Windows 11 coming soon, Windows 10 retiring from 2025

[bruce bowser]

On Friday, June 25, 2021 at 1:30:47 AM UTC-4, bo...@yahoo.co.uk wrote in alt.home.repair:
> When Windows 10 was introduced Microsoft said it would be the final
> Windows version so why not just simply say that it's a major Windows 10
> update, whic it seems to be on the face of it.
>
> I accept that existing computers will have to meet certain minimum
> criterian like a minimum of 64 Gig of storage and 4 Gig of Ram etc to
> run it, but most computers have those minimums anyway.
>
> https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-57598554


Keep in mind that here are three major alternatives to Windows: Mac OS, Linux, and Chrome.

[Ralph Mowery]

In article <5fb6ecb9-3eff-4fee...@googlegroups.com>,
bruce2...@gmail.com says...

>
>
> Keep in mind that here are three major alternatives to Windows: Mac OS, Linux, and Chrome.
>
>

Those are of no help if the programs I want to run have no equivelent
and are only written to run under Windows.

[Michael Trew]

I've heard that TPM will be required for Windows 11, which will brick a
lot of hardware...

https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/what-is-tpm/

Me personally, I'll hold onto my perfect working Windows 7 system that I
built in 2015, and I think I'll try Linux when it becomes less than
functional. I don't have a qualm with Macs, other than I'm not a fan
personally. I wouldn't trust Google/Chrome as far as I could throw it.

[Rob]

By 2025 there probably will not be many of those left...

In business use Windows has become nearly redundant already, as more
and more applications are being moved to the cloud and are being
accessed via an internet browser.

Maybe for personal use and gaming there is still some place for Windows,
although many gaming programs already exist cross-platform.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Sun, 27 Jun 2021 15:53:10 -0400, Michael Trew <mt99...@ymail.com>
wrote:

>I've heard that TPM will be required for Windows 11, which will brick a
>lot of hardware...

TPM 2.0 is required. TPM 1.2 won't work. That means any machine
earlier than 2016 might not run Windoze 11.

I hadn't heard that it bricks hardware. Nothing in the article you
cited below. What's your source for that information?
>
>https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/what-is-tpm/

Some of the other Win 11 requirements are going to be a problem for me
and my customers:
<https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications>
None of my Windoze 10 machines support TPM 2.0.

Rumor has it that the Intel CPU needs to be 8th generation or higher.
I can't really tell from the published list of approved processors:
<https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/minimum/windows-processor-requirements>
So, I get to buy all new hardware for myself and most of my customers.

An internet connection and a Microsoft login/password is required for
Win 11 Home. No clue on Win 11 Pro, or other mutations. That
requirement alone is sufficient for me to stay with Windoze 10 or look
for an alternative.

>Me personally, I'll hold onto my perfect working Windows 7 system that I
>built in 2015, and I think I'll try Linux when it becomes less than
>functional. I don't have a qualm with Macs, other than I'm not a fan
>personally. I wouldn't trust Google/Chrome as far as I could throw it.

I've been slowly moving my home stuff over to Linux Mint Cinnamon.
However, in order to stay in business, I have to use whatever my
customers are using, which means Windoze 10 and possibly 11.

--
Jeff Liebermann je...@cruzio.com
PO Box 272 http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Ben Lomond CA 95005-0272
Skype: JeffLiebermann AE6KS 831-336-2558

[Michael Trew]

On 6/27/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:
> TPM 2.0 is required. TPM 1.2 won't work. That means any machine
> earlier than 2016 might not run Windoze 11.
>
> I hadn't heard that it bricks hardware. Nothing in the article you
> cited below. What's your source for that information?

"Bricked" was a poor choice of wording. What I should have said was
"hardware that isn't TPM 2.0 compatible will be useless with Windows 11
(useless = bricked)

>
> I've been slowly moving my home stuff over to Linux Mint Cinnamon.
> However, in order to stay in business, I have to use whatever my
> customers are using, which means Windoze 10 and possibly 11.

That's a fair point, when running a business, I could understand that.
Myself, I only use if for home/recreational purposes. With how little I
use my computer for, if I really wanted to, I could still use a Windows
XP machine (not that I would). The main issue being that several
websites now might not be compatible with the latest XP supported browser.

[Rob]

Jeff Liebermann <je...@cruzio.com> wrote:
> On Sun, 27 Jun 2021 15:53:10 -0400, Michael Trew <mt99...@ymail.com>
> wrote:
>
>>I've heard that TPM will be required for Windows 11, which will brick a
>>lot of hardware...
>
> TPM 2.0 is required. TPM 1.2 won't work. That means any machine
> earlier than 2016 might not run Windoze 11.
>
> I hadn't heard that it bricks hardware. Nothing in the article you
> cited below. What's your source for that information?
>>
>>https://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/what-is-tpm/
>
> Some of the other Win 11 requirements are going to be a problem for me
> and my customers:
> <https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11-specifications>
> None of my Windoze 10 machines support TPM 2.0.
>
> Rumor has it that the Intel CPU needs to be 8th generation or higher.
> I can't really tell from the published list of approved processors:
> <https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/minimum/windows-processor-requirements>
> So, I get to buy all new hardware for myself and most of my customers.

This is of course the reason that Microsoft has introduced these
requirements, so almost everyone will have to buy new hardware and the
hardware manufacturers are happy.
This also increases Microsoft revenue as new hardware means a new
Windows license, rather than some upgrade from Windows 10 which likely
would be free.

[Rob]

Michael Trew <mt99...@ymail.com> wrote:
> Myself, I only use if for home/recreational purposes. With how little I
> use my computer for, if I really wanted to, I could still use a Windows
> XP machine (not that I would). The main issue being that several
> websites now might not be compatible with the latest XP supported browser.

When you have older hardware and want to use it with a supported
browser, but do not want to fiddle with software yourself, you can
consider installing "CloudReady", the version of ChromeOS for generic
PC hardware (rather than ChromeBooks on which ChromeOS usually runs).

A free version can be downloaded from https://www.neverware.com/

It would run on Windows XP class hardware with sufficient RAM (2GB+).

[Allodoxaphobia]

On 29 Jun 2021 07:36:42 GMT, Rob wrote:
> Michael Trew <mt99...@ymail.com> wrote:
>> Myself, I only use if for home/recreational purposes. With how little I
>> use my computer for, if I really wanted to, I could still use a Windows
>> XP machine (not that I would). The main issue being that several
>> websites now might not be compatible with the latest XP supported browser.

Many, many are not.
The last XP browser update, of any ilk (I.E., Firefox, Chrome, Opera,
etc.), was a few years ago.

> When you have older hardware and want to use it with a supported
> browser, but do not want to fiddle with software yourself, you can
> consider installing "CloudReady", the version of ChromeOS for generic
> PC hardware (rather than ChromeBooks on which ChromeOS usually runs).
>
> A free version can be downloaded from https://www.neverware.com/
>
> It would run on Windows XP class hardware with sufficient RAM (2GB+).

Of course, any discerning computer user would install linux or FreeBSD.
That should work for CPUs down to "W95 Class".

[ohg...@gmail.com]

I have a desktop PC at home I built about 2004 or thereabouts. It's a Pent IV with an Intel MB and XP Pro and all the RAM it can carry.
Never had a blue screen or any kind of issue or crash with it. Now, Firefox crawls and some pages don't load or load incompletely.
I tried installing two different distros Linux, and both were *more* laggy than the XP, so I went back to the XP. For work I have to use one of
my two laptops.

Sadly, it's time to pull the plug on this old friend and my new build will be with Linux, maybe Mint.

[Michael Trew]

On 6/29/2021 11:01 AM, Allodoxaphobia wrote:
> Of course, any discerning computer user would install linux or FreeBSD.
> That should work for CPUs down to "W95 Class".

That would likely be the route I take... I will avoid anything Google as
much as possible. I really need to install it on one of my older
machines to toy with and get used to the interface, so I don't have a
"culture shock" the day that I finally need to switch.

[Michael Trew]

On 6/29/2021 2:02 PM, ohg...@gmail.com wrote:
> I tried installing two different distros Linux, and both were*more* laggy than the XP

Did you try something light like Puppy Linux?

[Rob]

Allodoxaphobia <trepi...@example.net> wrote:
>> When you have older hardware and want to use it with a supported
>> browser, but do not want to fiddle with software yourself, you can
>> consider installing "CloudReady", the version of ChromeOS for generic
>> PC hardware (rather than ChromeBooks on which ChromeOS usually runs).
>>
>> A free version can be downloaded from https://www.neverware.com/
>>
>> It would run on Windows XP class hardware with sufficient RAM (2GB+).
>
> Of course, any discerning computer user would install linux or FreeBSD.
> That should work for CPUs down to "W95 Class".

You can do that, but it would require that you study how to install
and admin that. The beauty of a ChromeBook is that it "just works".

[Three Jeeps]

You may be able to get away with running a Windoz as a guest OS on and VM host OS such as Linux or OSX. If the Windoz app uses any special I/O drivers, it may not work. It is cheap to try it and see.
You can try VirtualBox (free) which I've found works fairly well for almost all of my windoz apps (under both OSX and Linux).
VMWare is a very good commercial product that you could also try...I don't remember if they have a free or trial version.
J

[Lucifer]

Windows 11 is brought to you by Qanon.

[bitrex]

On 6/27/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

I'm watching a Win 10 install fail/lock up right now on a new out of the
box SSD and freshly-made USB install media. Great OS

[ohg...@gmail.com]

No, I did not. I tried Zorin and Mint IIRC. The Linux distros I installed were so much more laggy than XP on this particular machine that I figured even a lighter version would be no improvement. It's the end of the road for this Pent IV.. I kept it this long for sentimental reasons. Never had a blue screen ever. I've had certain programs crash, but was able to shut down and restart the program through Task Manager. Never once had to shut down the computer and reboot.

I'll probably install Zorin on my new build. Right now I'm using my laptop with 7 and it's running fine.

[Lucifer]

On Fri, 9 Jul 2021 00:15:26 -0400, bitrex <us...@example.net> wrote:

>On 6/27/2021 6:04 PM, Jeff Liebermann wrote:

What do you call this 27th month?

>> On Sun, 27 Jun 2021 15:53:10 -0400, Michael Trew <mt99...@ymail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I've heard that TPM will be required for Windows 11, which will brick a
>>> lot of hardware...

You will need an imaginary machine.

>I'm watching a Win 10 install fail/lock up right now on a new out of the
>box SSD and freshly-made USB install media. Great OS

Windows 10 is a great OS that has very modest hardware requirements.
That's why there are no plans to produce Windows 11.

[ohg...@gmail.com]

According to Satan himself (sorry), Windows 11 is slated for fourth quarter '21
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11

[jurb...@gmail.com]

-----
In the meantime I will be uilding an XP PC but on a better board. It is going to be fast. Wil have the 4GB RAM of course, 2 SSDs. Has all the outputs for HDMI, DVI, It will have al kinds of cool software on it that would cost many many thousands for the new version.

Everyone warn of virus and all tis sit, I don't have those problems.

[Jeff Liebermann]

On Fri, 23 Jul 2021 08:57:43 -0700 (PDT), "jurb...@gmail.com"
<jurb...@gmail.com> wrote:

>In the meantime I will be uilding an XP PC but on a better board. It is going to be fast. Wil have the 4GB RAM of course, 2 SSDs.

XP can use more than 4GB RAM if the motherboard supports PAE:
<https://itstillworks.com/how-to-enable-pae-on-a-32-bit-windows-xp-10155.html>
<https://www.betaarchive.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=36597>

An SSD will work on XP, but you will have problems unless you
impliment some scheme to regularly run the "TRIM" command. The TRIM
command or button is usually found in the various SSD managment
software that comes with the SSD (e.g. Samsung Magician). I've had
problems with TRIM when using a fairly new SSD and old software that's
XP compatible.

[Q] What do you get when you put a jet engine in a Volkswagen?
[A] It's still a Volkswagen.

>Has all the outputs for HDMI, DVI, It will have al kinds of cool
>software on it that would cost many many thousands for the new version.

Or, you could get the FOSS or Linux versions for next to nothing.

>Everyone warn of virus and all tis sit, I don't have those problems.

The old viruses are still out there.

[Jeroni Paul]

> In the meantime I will be uilding an XP PC but on a better board. It is going to be fast. Wil have the 4GB RAM of course, 2 SSDs. Has all the outputs for HDMI, DVI, It will have al kinds of cool software on it that would cost many many thousands for the new version.

If it has at least 2 cores, Windows 10 LTSB works great. Note I mean the LTSB version, not the mainstream Home version that comes overloaded of useless apps. I use the LTSB version in old computers like Intel Duo core with 2Gb of RAM and it works great and lets you install up to date software like Edge and Office 2019.

[Andy Burns]

jurb...@gmail.com wrote:

> I will be uilding an XP PC but on a better board. It is going to be fast. Wil have the 4GB RAM of course

Use XP 64bit edition and give it more RAM?