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OT: custom fab of cases/containers
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Robert Baer
Nov 14, 2012, 2:35:41 AM11/14/12
to
Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
computer mouse.
Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
no smells (pollution of air)?
Multiple steps OK.
** My guess:
What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
"negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
Then what kind of 2-part glop could be sloshed around inside to fully
cover inside and make that implied shell?
Result should be drillable without cracking, and be paintable as well.
desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
computer mouse.
Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
no smells (pollution of air)?
Multiple steps OK.
** My guess:
What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
"negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
Then what kind of 2-part glop could be sloshed around inside to fully
cover inside and make that implied shell?
Result should be drillable without cracking, and be paintable as well.
o pere o
Nov 14, 2012, 6:16:56 AM11/14/12
to
an oily film. Then, just cover your model with clay to get a clay
negative of your piece. Remove (or scrub out) your original one. Then,
paint epoxy resin over it. You can even reinforce it with glass fibers
and it becomes very robust. This smells, but depends on the size of your
model. A mouse-sized object would be ok to at home, but his depends on
your nose :)
You may look up how modelists build stuff more or less this way. They
sometimes make the negative with latex or silicone rubber. This allows
reusing it.
Pere
Nico Coesel
Nov 14, 2012, 6:50:17 AM11/14/12
to
--
Failure does not prove something is impossible, failure simply
indicates you are not using the right tools...
nico@nctdevpuntnl (punt=.)
--------------------------------------------------------------
Tim Williams
Nov 14, 2012, 8:49:39 AM11/14/12
to
You could dip the model in wax. At the right temperature, you can use wax
to build up even layers. Let the wax cool fully. Cut it all the way
around to separate the wax into halves and remove them (assuming you have
a roughly shell-like form now, minding concavities). Carve the wax pieces
until they're in just the right shape. The wax pieces can be molded in
silicone and resin parts made, or more wax parts made for metal casting
(investment / lost wax casting).
Tim
--
Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk.
Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com
"Robert Baer" <rober...@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:nRHos.21708$zu4....@newsfe14.iad...
to build up even layers. Let the wax cool fully. Cut it all the way
around to separate the wax into halves and remove them (assuming you have
a roughly shell-like form now, minding concavities). Carve the wax pieces
until they're in just the right shape. The wax pieces can be molded in
silicone and resin parts made, or more wax parts made for metal casting
(investment / lost wax casting).
Tim
--
Deep Friar: a very philosophical monk.
Website: http://seventransistorlabs.com
"Robert Baer" <rober...@localnet.com> wrote in message
news:nRHos.21708$zu4....@newsfe14.iad...
Bill Gill
Nov 14, 2012, 9:13:18 AM11/14/12
to
then check around. Here in Tulsa, Oklahoma, USA we now have a Fab Lab
that is for this type of thing. They have a 3D printer, a minimill and
what have you that are available for public use. This is becoming
a type of thing that lot of places are starting to implement.
Bill
Spehro Pefhany
Nov 14, 2012, 9:57:33 AM11/14/12
to
a service bureau? Your proposed technique is so last millenium. Google
Sketchup is apparently ok for this purpose (and free), if you don't
have access to something like Solidworks.
John Larkin
Nov 14, 2012, 11:35:22 AM11/14/12
to
sells silicone mold-making stuff, and then resins and cloth fillers.
The silicone mold stuff is fabulous... incredible fine-detail
resolution.
http://www.tapplastics.com/product/mold_making_materials/casting_products
They have videos and stuff.
I love their scrap bin, full of all sizes and shapes and colors of
stuff left over from custom fab jobs. Great for test fixtures, cutting
boards, like that.
--
John Larkin Highland Technology Inc
www.highlandtechnology.com jlarkin at highlandtechnology dot com
Precision electronic instrumentation
Picosecond-resolution Digital Delay and Pulse generators
Custom timing and laser controllers
Photonics and fiberoptic TTL data links
VME analog, thermocouple, LVDT, synchro, tachometer
Multichannel arbitrary waveform generators
Tim Wescott
Nov 14, 2012, 12:37:31 PM11/14/12
to
IIRC it uses a thermoplastic, not a thermoset, but the idea is that you
make a negative mold, squirt in the right amount of hot goo, then tumble
the mold to distribute the goo as it cools. Wall thickness is somewhat
uncontrolled, and you can't have corners that are too sharp, but it may
work for you.
--
My liberal friends think I'm a conservative kook.
My conservative friends think I'm a liberal kook.
Why am I not happy that they have found common ground?
Tim Wescott, Communications, Control, Circuits & Software
http://www.wescottdesign.com
John Larkin
Nov 14, 2012, 12:45:03 PM11/14/12
to
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 11:37:31 -0600, Tim Wescott <t...@seemywebsite.com>
wrote:
Vacuum forming is fun, too. You need a rigid mold, often made of
hardwood. Place a sheet of plastic over the inverted mold, with
negative air pressure in the mold cavity. Heat it all up, and the
plastic sheet is sucked into the mold. Trim the edges. There's a neat
little book somewhere on how to do it yourself.
wrote:
hardwood. Place a sheet of plastic over the inverted mold, with
negative air pressure in the mold cavity. Heat it all up, and the
plastic sheet is sucked into the mold. Trim the edges. There's a neat
little book somewhere on how to do it yourself.
k...@att.bizzz
Nov 14, 2012, 12:52:58 PM11/14/12
to
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 08:13:18 -0600, Bill Gill <bill...@cox.net>
wrote:
I've heard that 3D printers are down to about $500 now. One of the
CAD guys at work was going to buy one and start a side business making
models.
wrote:
CAD guys at work was going to buy one and start a side business making
models.
Nico Coesel
Nov 14, 2012, 4:59:27 PM11/14/12
to
ones usually have several severe problems. So in the end you'll need
to spend somewhere around $3000 for something usefull.
Jon Kirwan
Nov 14, 2012, 5:02:18 PM11/14/12
to
the very simple free add-on that translates it to STL along
with the new ReplicatorG 40 and the Sailfish 4.1 firmware.
(I'm still not entirely certain of the Sketchup add-on's
behavior but it's pretty decent just the same from experience
using it. Also, Sketchup can keep inside interesting
artifacts that result from the process of making something
there that, if not closely attended to, can physically show
up after getting translated to STL.)
The problems may come in the drillability of the result,
depending on how the drill holes line up with the layers,
thickness of perimeter chosen, and so on. But I think for the
most part it should be modestly acceptable.
Jon
Jim Thompson
Nov 14, 2012, 6:10:21 PM11/14/12
to
On Wed, 14 Nov 2012 21:59:27 GMT, ni...@puntnl.niks (Nico Coesel)
wrote:
Nico, Keep me posted on what you ultimately choose. Sounds like a
really fun toy!
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
wrote:
really fun toy!
...Jim Thompson
--
| James E.Thompson, CTO | mens |
| Analog Innovations, Inc. | et |
| Analog/Mixed-Signal ASIC's and Discrete Systems | manus |
| Phoenix, Arizona 85048 Skype: Contacts Only | |
| Voice:(480)460-2350 Fax: Available upon request | Brass Rat |
| E-mail Icon at http://www.analog-innovations.com | 1962 |
I love to cook with wine. Sometimes I even put it in the food.
Bill Gill
Nov 14, 2012, 6:29:43 PM11/14/12
to
do with one. The software to make the designs to run it
is a free download so it sure is tempting.
Bill
Nico Coesel
Nov 14, 2012, 7:35:38 PM11/14/12
to
Jim Thompson <To-Email-Use-Th...@On-My-Web-Site.com>
There is a comprehensive list with 3D printers:
http://www.additive3d.com/3dpr_cht.htm
http://www.additive3d.com/3dpr_cht.htm
Carl Ijames
Nov 14, 2012, 11:35:47 PM11/14/12
to
Vacuum forming would be the best way. Lindsay Publications sells a book of
plans, or lots of small systems on ebay. You put your mandrel (a hard block
covered with felt, for example, with some gas passages drilled here and
there) on a base sheet with lots of holes (think pegboard) mounted on a
sealed box with a valve leading to a big vacuum pump with a heater box a
foot above the base and a frame to hold a plastic sheet (1/16" polystyrene,
for example) against the heater box. Let the plastic soften the right
amount, drop the frame to the pegboard level so the plastic bulges up over
the mandrel, and open the vacuum valve to suck all the air out through the
pegboard and make the plastic conform to your mandrel. Lots of people make
rc car bodies that way so they can go tear them up :-). Best is to carve
the mandrel from wood but if you used clay you could probably freeze it and
get a few formed sheets out of it, and then you can cast one of the sheets
full of something like plaster of paris to get a durable mandrel. Or look
in the phone book for plastics suppliers like Sabic Polymers or Total
Plastics, they often do vacuum forming, bending, cutting, whatever. If you
want to pull a mold go to www.smoothon.com and check out their tutorials,
I've used their shore 40A polyurethane to pull a couple of molds and then
cast them with hard shore 70D polyurethane, also made metal molds and cast a
good bit of fairly stiff shore 80A polyurethane. Good company to deal with,
good products, and good tutorials online.
-----
Regards,
Carl Ijames
"John Larkin" wrote in message
news:70m7a85dj2cipqijj...@4ax.com...
plans, or lots of small systems on ebay. You put your mandrel (a hard block
covered with felt, for example, with some gas passages drilled here and
there) on a base sheet with lots of holes (think pegboard) mounted on a
sealed box with a valve leading to a big vacuum pump with a heater box a
foot above the base and a frame to hold a plastic sheet (1/16" polystyrene,
for example) against the heater box. Let the plastic soften the right
amount, drop the frame to the pegboard level so the plastic bulges up over
the mandrel, and open the vacuum valve to suck all the air out through the
pegboard and make the plastic conform to your mandrel. Lots of people make
rc car bodies that way so they can go tear them up :-). Best is to carve
the mandrel from wood but if you used clay you could probably freeze it and
get a few formed sheets out of it, and then you can cast one of the sheets
full of something like plaster of paris to get a durable mandrel. Or look
in the phone book for plastics suppliers like Sabic Polymers or Total
Plastics, they often do vacuum forming, bending, cutting, whatever. If you
want to pull a mold go to www.smoothon.com and check out their tutorials,
I've used their shore 40A polyurethane to pull a couple of molds and then
cast them with hard shore 70D polyurethane, also made metal molds and cast a
good bit of fairly stiff shore 80A polyurethane. Good company to deal with,
good products, and good tutorials online.
-----
Regards,
Carl Ijames
"John Larkin" wrote in message
news:70m7a85dj2cipqijj...@4ax.com...
Robert Baer
Nov 15, 2012, 3:40:15 AM11/15/12
to
Nico Coesel wrote:
> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>> computer mouse.
>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>> Multiple steps OK.
>> ** My guess:
>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
>> Then what kind of 2-part glop could be sloshed around inside to fully
>> cover inside and make that implied shell?
>> Result should be drillable without cracking, and be paintable as well.
>
> Look for a 3D printer.
>
I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>> computer mouse.
>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>> Multiple steps OK.
>> ** My guess:
>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
>> Then what kind of 2-part glop could be sloshed around inside to fully
>> cover inside and make that implied shell?
>> Result should be drillable without cracking, and be paintable as well.
>
> Look for a 3D printer.
>
it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
And nobody will make one mouse-like item with a 3-D printer for under
(say) $25..
Robert Baer
Nov 15, 2012, 3:52:04 AM11/15/12
to
resource better than most hobby/model stores.
They do not exist here in WA and shipping added to material costs
tend to be a killer (used that scheme on 2 other projects that were
"must do").
Robert Baer
Nov 15, 2012, 3:55:15 AM11/15/12
to
Robert Baer
Nov 15, 2012, 4:09:04 AM11/15/12
to
Carl Ijames wrote:
> Vacuum forming would be the best way. Lindsay Publications sells a book of
> plans, or lots of small systems on ebay. You put your mandrel (a hard block
> covered with felt, for example, with some gas passages drilled here and
> there) on a base sheet with lots of holes (think pegboard) mounted on a
> sealed box with a valve leading to a big vacuum pump with a heater box a
> foot above the base and a frame to hold a plastic sheet (1/16" polystyrene,
> for example) against the heater box. Let the plastic soften the right
> amount, drop the frame to the pegboard level so the plastic bulges up over
> the mandrel, and open the vacuum valve to suck all the air out through the
> pegboard and make the plastic conform to your mandrel. Lots of people make
> rc car bodies that way so they can go tear them up :-). Best is to carve
> the mandrel from wood but if you used clay you could probably freeze it and
> get a few formed sheets out of it, and then you can cast one of the sheets
> full of something like plaster of paris to get a durable mandrel. Or look
> in the phone book for plastics suppliers like Sabic Polymers or Total
> Plastics, they often do vacuum forming, bending, cutting, whatever. If you
> want to pull a mold go to www.smoothon.com and check out their tutorials,
> I've used their shore 40A polyurethane to pull a couple of molds and then
> cast them with hard shore 70D polyurethane, also made metal molds and cast a
> good bit of fairly stiff shore 80A polyurethane. Good company to deal with,
> good products, and good tutorials online.
* Thanks!
> Vacuum forming would be the best way. Lindsay Publications sells a book of
> plans, or lots of small systems on ebay. You put your mandrel (a hard block
> covered with felt, for example, with some gas passages drilled here and
> there) on a base sheet with lots of holes (think pegboard) mounted on a
> sealed box with a valve leading to a big vacuum pump with a heater box a
> foot above the base and a frame to hold a plastic sheet (1/16" polystyrene,
> for example) against the heater box. Let the plastic soften the right
> amount, drop the frame to the pegboard level so the plastic bulges up over
> the mandrel, and open the vacuum valve to suck all the air out through the
> pegboard and make the plastic conform to your mandrel. Lots of people make
> rc car bodies that way so they can go tear them up :-). Best is to carve
> the mandrel from wood but if you used clay you could probably freeze it and
> get a few formed sheets out of it, and then you can cast one of the sheets
> full of something like plaster of paris to get a durable mandrel. Or look
> in the phone book for plastics suppliers like Sabic Polymers or Total
> Plastics, they often do vacuum forming, bending, cutting, whatever. If you
> want to pull a mold go to www.smoothon.com and check out their tutorials,
> I've used their shore 40A polyurethane to pull a couple of molds and then
> cast them with hard shore 70D polyurethane, also made metal molds and cast a
> good bit of fairly stiff shore 80A polyurethane. Good company to deal with,
> good products, and good tutorials online.
Martin Brown
Nov 15, 2012, 4:13:35 AM11/15/12
to
On 15/11/2012 08:40, Robert Baer wrote:
> Nico Coesel wrote:
>> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
>>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>>> computer mouse.
>>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
>>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>>> Multiple steps OK.
>>> ** My guess:
>>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
Simplest reusable would be the hot melt silicone mould making compound
> Nico Coesel wrote:
>> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
>>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>>> computer mouse.
>>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and little /
>>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>>> Multiple steps OK.
>>> ** My guess:
>>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
sold by craft stores. Or rubber latex dip and a clever external support.
The one time cure silicone mould making elastomers already exceed your
budget in the smallest 1kg pack.
http://www.ecfibreglasssupplies.co.uk/p-1749-ecf-20-rtv-silicone-moulding-compound.aspx
>>> Then what kind of 2-part glop could be sloshed around inside to fully
>>> cover inside and make that implied shell?
>>> Result should be drillable without cracking, and be paintable as
>>> well.
>>
>> Look for a 3D printer.
>>
> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
> it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
> And nobody will make one mouse-like item with a 3-D printer for under
> (say) $25..
to end up at $30-50 for a one off.
You might be better off just buying a mouse!
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Martin Brown
Nov 15, 2012, 4:19:58 AM11/15/12
to
On 15/11/2012 09:13, Martin Brown wrote:
> On 15/11/2012 08:40, Robert Baer wrote:
>> Nico Coesel wrote:
>>> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>>>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>>>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8
>>>> thick?
>>>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>>>> computer mouse.
>>>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and
>>>> little /
>>>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>>>> Multiple steps OK.
>>>> ** My guess:
>>>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>>>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
>
> Simplest reusable would be the hot melt silicone mould making compound
> sold by craft stores. Or rubber latex dip and a clever external support.
Couldn't recall the name and then it came to me vinamould.
> On 15/11/2012 08:40, Robert Baer wrote:
>> Nico Coesel wrote:
>>> Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>>>> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>>>> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8
>>>> thick?
>>>> Net result should be something with strength and durability like a
>>>> computer mouse.
>>>> Ideas as how this can be done with fairly simple methods and
>>>> little /
>>>> no smells (pollution of air)?
>>>> Multiple steps OK.
>>>> ** My guess:
>>>> What kind of 2-part rubber compound could be used to make a
>>>> "negative" that would be sturdy enough to peel off that clay original?
>
> Simplest reusable would be the hot melt silicone mould making compound
> sold by craft stores. Or rubber latex dip and a clever external support.
http://www.tomps.com/shop/vinamold-1kg-p-2.html
(cheaper and reusable) Beware when hot!
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Spehro Pefhany
Nov 15, 2012, 7:28:17 AM11/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 00:40:15 -0800, the renowned Robert Baer
<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
>it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
If you're only going to use it once, yes.
<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
>it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
> And nobody will make one mouse-like item with a 3-D printer for under
>(say) $25..
much if you place any value* on your time.
* a postive value wot is significant in terms of the legal minimum
wage, average income per hour, that sort of thing, not "any real
number", you pedants.
Best regards,
Spehro Pefhany
--
"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward"
sp...@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com
Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com
Martin Brown
Nov 15, 2012, 7:42:23 AM11/15/12
to
On 15/11/2012 12:28, Spehro Pefhany wrote:
> On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 00:40:15 -0800, the renowned Robert Baer
> <rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
>> it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
>
> If you're only going to use it once, yes.
>
>> And nobody will make one mouse-like item with a 3-D printer for under
>> (say) $25..
>
> Not true, but I bet the learning curve for the software would be a bit
> much if you place any value* on your time.
>
> * a postive value wot is significant in terms of the legal minimum
> wage, average income per hour, that sort of thing, not "any real
> number", you pedants.
Having said that I would still like to have a play with a 3D printer and
> On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 00:40:15 -0800, the renowned Robert Baer
> <rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that.and
>> it makes no sense to $pend so much for what essentially is a $2 mouse..
>
> If you're only going to use it once, yes.
>
>> And nobody will make one mouse-like item with a 3-D printer for under
>> (say) $25..
>
> Not true, but I bet the learning curve for the software would be a bit
> much if you place any value* on your time.
>
> * a postive value wot is significant in terms of the legal minimum
> wage, average income per hour, that sort of thing, not "any real
> number", you pedants.
might eventually get one as a toy. Learning curve does look a bit steep
if you are not already into CAD mechanical drawing design.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
Frnak McKenney
Nov 15, 2012, 8:16:49 AM11/15/12
to
On Thu, 15 Nov 2012 12:42:23 +0000, Martin Brown <|||newspam|||@nezumi.demon.co.uk> wrote:
[...]
> Having said that I would still like to have a play with a 3D printer and
> might eventually get one as a toy. Learning curve does look a bit steep
> if you are not already into CAD mechanical drawing design.
It's not a $100 item ( yet ), but they're a lot less expensive than
the original SLS machines. Prices these days start at $500:
Solidoodle 3D Printer (2nd Generation)
<http://reviews.cnet.com/3d-printers/solidoodle-3d-printer-2nd/4505-33809_7-35288066.html>
Other options: DIY 3D Printers
http://pinterest.com/finklean/diy-3d-printers/
Hope this helps...
Frank McKenney
--
There are those who moan about 'meaningless ornament'; but the
phrase is surely an oxymoron, for no ornament can be 'meaningless'
-- even if it means something pretty frightful. If the critic wants
to imply 'ornament which is unsuitable or unrelated to its
substrate', that is fair enough; but _all_ ornament must have some
effect. It seems to me that what we want is more, not less
ornament. The truth seems to be that we are frightened to express
ourselves in ornament. We don't know how to handle it, and fear
that we may expose the nakedness of our mean little souls. Medieval
masons did not have that kind of inhibition, and they were probably
psychologically healthier in consequence.
-- J. E. Gordon / "Structures, or Why things don't fall down"
--
Frank McKenney, McKenney Associates
Richmond, Virginia / (804) 320-4887
Munged E-mail: frank uscore mckenney aatt mindspring ddoott com
[...]
> Having said that I would still like to have a play with a 3D printer and
> might eventually get one as a toy. Learning curve does look a bit steep
> if you are not already into CAD mechanical drawing design.
the original SLS machines. Prices these days start at $500:
Solidoodle 3D Printer (2nd Generation)
<http://reviews.cnet.com/3d-printers/solidoodle-3d-printer-2nd/4505-33809_7-35288066.html>
Other options: DIY 3D Printers
http://pinterest.com/finklean/diy-3d-printers/
Hope this helps...
Frank McKenney
--
There are those who moan about 'meaningless ornament'; but the
phrase is surely an oxymoron, for no ornament can be 'meaningless'
-- even if it means something pretty frightful. If the critic wants
to imply 'ornament which is unsuitable or unrelated to its
substrate', that is fair enough; but _all_ ornament must have some
effect. It seems to me that what we want is more, not less
ornament. The truth seems to be that we are frightened to express
ourselves in ornament. We don't know how to handle it, and fear
that we may expose the nakedness of our mean little souls. Medieval
masons did not have that kind of inhibition, and they were probably
psychologically healthier in consequence.
-- J. E. Gordon / "Structures, or Why things don't fall down"
--
Frank McKenney, McKenney Associates
Richmond, Virginia / (804) 320-4887
Munged E-mail: frank uscore mckenney aatt mindspring ddoott com
Owen Roberts
Nov 15, 2012, 9:46:59 AM11/15/12
to
For cheap, simple stuff, try artists supply places for
"Polymer Clay"
Bake it in the oven when shaped.
And then if you want to get sophisticated:
http://www.freemansupply.com/ has some nice two part castasbles, some
with zero shrink or expand.
We use one of the two part 20 minute ones at work. Absolute joy to
work with.
Steve
"Polymer Clay"
Bake it in the oven when shaped.
And then if you want to get sophisticated:
http://www.freemansupply.com/ has some nice two part castasbles, some
with zero shrink or expand.
We use one of the two part 20 minute ones at work. Absolute joy to
work with.
Steve
whit3rd
Nov 15, 2012, 7:32:28 PM11/15/12
to
On Thursday, November 15, 2012 12:40:23 AM UTC-8, Robert Baer wrote:
> Nico Coesel wrote:
>
> > Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> >> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>
> >> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>
> >> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
> Nico Coesel wrote:
>
> > Robert Baer<rober...@localnet.com> wrote:
>
> >
>
> >> Say i take some modeling clay and smoosh it into some kind of
>
> >> desirable shape with reasonably rounded corners and dimples.
>
> >> Now, how can one make a container with that shape, 1/16 to 1/8 thick?
> > Look for a 3D printer.
> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that
Mostly, folk who want a good result CAN afford at least the hourly rent
> I neither have nor can afford the thousands of dollars for that
on such a thing. You could also make a plaster-of-paris mold of your
blob, and put it in the oven with a sheet of acrylic or styrene atop it.
Turn the oven off when the sheet droops into contact with the mold.
Vacuforming is the same thing, but takes more equipment.
You only get a half-shell on each mold, of course. It'll take at least
two molds to build a Mr.PotatoHead clone...
Jon Kirwan
Nov 15, 2012, 11:16:59 PM11/15/12
to
probably give it a try at no charge. It's just ABS after all.
If I recall, you and I aren't far apart, either.
Jon
Jon Kirwan
Nov 15, 2012, 11:30:29 PM11/15/12
to
deal to learn in the process. I highly recommend the process
of finding a kit or building it yourself. You will never be
afraid of opening it, fixing something, or figuring out how
to do something a little better, that way. Getting a
commercialized system with cartridge-enclosed ABS rolls and
so on would be "scary" to consider opening up and screwing
with if something went wrong. Not so, if you put hands on
everything putting it together.
Some things I'm now dealing with: (1) the ABS plastic 'drips'
slightly on its own, when moving from place to place across a
gap where you don't want plastic. When it arrives, the tiny
dot of ABS that leaked sticks there. It's easy to knock off
later, but there it is all the same. (2) dust can attach
itself (static) to the ABS wire, before it descends into the
melt area, bringing dust into the mix. This gets deposited as
part of the product. It's not much, but it suggests working
in a relatively dust-free room. (3) air can get entrained
into the melt region as the wire descends into it and this
yields very tiny bubbles in the thin trace of ABS as it is
laid down.
It's all extremely interesting and each problem you solve
lets you uncover and see new ones to get just that much more
out of your results. It's a refinement process that is also a
joy of learning as you go, too.
Google sketchup can be used for your 3D CAD, there is an
add-on that will translate a drawing into an STL file that
can then be compiled into GCode. You can also use OpenSCAD,
Blender, 3dtin, tinkercad, winds3d, and scupltris.. and still
more. It's a good day to be into this stuff. So much
available.
NIST provides full (hundreds of pages) of documentation on
the GCode standard, plus a 12000 line C program that parses
and processes GCode according to the standard, all for free.
If you've a mind to screw with that, as well. But there are
many open source versions out there for 3d printer drivers,
compilers of STL, and so on, as well. The harder part is
wading through all that, finding out what each does well.
Jon
Mark Zenier
Nov 16, 2012, 4:33:34 PM11/16/12
to
In article <032ps.4191$hO3....@newsfe12.iad>,
Eh, I thought I saw their storefront in the middle of the Amazon Jungle,
(ie. South Lake Union district in Downtown Seattle, Where Amazon's
world headquarters is located).
dig, dig...
710 9th Ave N. 206 389-5900 (or something like that, they're in the
DEX phonebook). Strange location for an industrial supplier, but I
think there are a large number of graphics design geeks and artists
around that neighborhood.
Do not try to go there during rush hour if you're adverse to traffic.
On another note, Circuit Cellar Ink magazine had an article on
just what you're trying to do about a dozen years ago.
Mark Zenier mze...@eskimo.com
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)
(ie. South Lake Union district in Downtown Seattle, Where Amazon's
world headquarters is located).
dig, dig...
710 9th Ave N. 206 389-5900 (or something like that, they're in the
DEX phonebook). Strange location for an industrial supplier, but I
think there are a large number of graphics design geeks and artists
around that neighborhood.
Do not try to go there during rush hour if you're adverse to traffic.
On another note, Circuit Cellar Ink magazine had an article on
just what you're trying to do about a dozen years ago.
Mark Zenier mze...@eskimo.com
Googleproofaddress(account:mzenier provider:eskimo domain:com)
josephkk
Nov 17, 2012, 9:54:39 PM11/17/12
to
josephkk
Nov 17, 2012, 10:07:15 PM11/17/12
to
and perfect for one off lost wax casting. Casting containment material
versus casting material is your next issue.
?-)
Robert Baer
Nov 18, 2012, 12:26:39 AM11/18/12
to
Martin Brown wrote:
>
> The one time cure silicone mould making elastomers already exceed your
> budget in the smallest 1kg pack.
Found something like fiber-reinforced acrylic sheet: WonderFlex.
>
> The one time cure silicone mould making elastomers already exceed your
> budget in the smallest 1kg pack.
There is a major problem with computer mice: nobody gives dimensions,
so it is impossible to find a (a) wider, OR (b) bigger overall, OR (c)
left-handed VS right-handed [or any combo].
Robert Baer
Nov 18, 2012, 12:47:41 AM11/18/12
to
Always thought that OR was the north-most Tap Plastics went; maybe WA
locations are fairly new: Bellevue, Lynnwood and Seattle.
At best, they all are on-day round trip excursions, as (1) i do not
drive, and (2) i am in Lacey ("near" Olympia).
Robert Baer
Nov 18, 2012, 12:59:57 AM11/18/12
to
josephkk wrote:
> machinable wax
What is this BS concerning waxes, anyway?
Everyone that is kind enough to give specs, gives very little.
"Specs" do not include any electrical properties like dielectric
constant, dielectric strength, volume resistivity.
> machinable wax
What is this BS concerning waxes, anyway?
Everyone that is kind enough to give specs, gives very little.
"Specs" do not include any electrical properties like dielectric
constant, dielectric strength, volume resistivity.
Martin Brown
Nov 18, 2012, 8:57:38 AM11/18/12
to
On 18/11/2012 05:59, Robert Baer wrote:
> josephkk wrote:
>> machinable wax
> What is this BS concerning waxes, anyway?
The right sort of wax is easy to make a prototype mould from.
> josephkk wrote:
>> machinable wax
> What is this BS concerning waxes, anyway?
And then you melt the wax out to do lost wax casting - getting a
precision copy of your original piece if it is done right.
> Everyone that is kind enough to give specs, gives very little.
> "Specs" do not include any electrical properties like dielectric
> constant, dielectric strength, volume resistivity.
>
geriatric condensers for antique radio sets. The properties that matter
are that it has a fairly high melting point and it doesn't shatter when
machined. It is ideal for teaching use of a lathe since it is virtually
impossible to damage the lathe no matter what you do wrong and the wax
can be reclaimed to block form by melting and casting many times.
--
Regards,
Martin Brown
TheGlimmerMan
Nov 18, 2012, 10:11:12 AM11/18/12
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 21:47:41 -0800, Robert Baer <rober...@localnet.com>
This is easy. I cannot imagine any city anywhere that doesn't have an
engineering service which has a 3D prototype printing device.
Hell, they are cheap enough that nearly any successful company can
easily afford one as well.
Call some printing services and ask them where you can get prototype 3D
printing done.
engineering service which has a 3D prototype printing device.
Hell, they are cheap enough that nearly any successful company can
easily afford one as well.
Call some printing services and ask them where you can get prototype 3D
printing done.
josephkk
Nov 19, 2012, 5:57:44 AM11/19/12
to
On Sat, 17 Nov 2012 21:59:57 -0800, Robert Baer <rober...@localnet.com>
wrote:
The whole object with wax it to have a convenient modeling material. The
model is then used to create a "mold". Then you cast the final material
in the mold, be it sand, silicone, or polyurethane.
?-)
wrote:
model is then used to create a "mold". Then you cast the final material
in the mold, be it sand, silicone, or polyurethane.
?-)
rickman
Nov 19, 2012, 10:23:44 AM11/19/12
to
and the wax can be removed by heating. I learned this in a college
class of welding and foundry. We used "lost wax" method to cast small
jewelry pieces. I think one student used an insect rather than wax and
it worked quite nicely.
The molds were heated enough to completely burn away the wax or insect.
There has to be a small hole in the casting to let the gasses out
which is also the hole you use to pour the metal/plastic/whatever into
the mold to form the object you want. The only limitation is that the
mold itself is destroyed to remove the casting, so it is a one time deal
for each piece of wax. I suppose if your casting is simple enough you
could saw the mold in two and reuse it.
Rick
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