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August the 17th deadline for $1000 challenge
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James Barton
Apr 17, 2012, 5:59:40 PM4/17/12
to
Hi everyone,
I appreciate that a cipher cannot be classed as secure if it's
strength is based on a concealed algorithm.
So I present this cipher only as a curiosity. It is, I believe based
on an unusual technique which, who knows, maybe of some interest to
cryptology down the line. Perhaps there is a concept here that can be
integrated into a more professional framework in the future. I will
probably reveal the method to anyone interested after the 17th of
August but will keep it hidden for now so as not to spoil the
challenge.
VirtueScience Cipher 2:
animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
mammal, Dog, vertebrate, Dragonfly, Cats, Fish, badger, wolf, birds,
crows, ants, worms, duck, creature, birds, mallard, Vertebrate,
mammal, lion, Cats, Apple, Oak, sycamore, trout, eel, organism, fish,
moray, Tiger, leopard, fish, cat, Eel, starfish, panther, Owl,
chicken, plant, duck, dog, Fish, eel, carp, halibut, pike, fish,
Salmon, perch, Organism, fish, Cod, eel, ants, Insects, fly, oak,
mammal, badger, sloth, lizard, frog, Tortoise, lizard, Wolf, reptile,
Organism, Chameleons, lizard, gecko, lizard, Reptile, Fox, Beagle,
organism, mammal, Dogs, Mammals, rodent, wolf, Squirrels, mammal,
rodents, panda, oak, tree, beech, oaks, Pear, apple, Orange, lemon,
Elm, Trees, deciduous, Vegetation, birch, Birch, tiger, trees, cats,
leopard, panther, Oak, Cheetah, vertebrate, reptile, organism,
crocodile, Chameleon, alligator, Frog, turtle, organism, Vertebrates,
lizard, Reptile, lizard, Gecko, owl, bird, vertebrate, bird, penguin,
robin, eagle, hawk, thrush, hummingbird, birds, raven, crow,
invertebrate, invertebrate, Beetle, Insect, worm, Organism, Insects,
butterflies, rose, aphid, ladybird, Tulip, Lilac, vegetation, Acacia,
cabbage, caterpillar, radish, moths, insect, wasp, invertebrates,
ants, leeches, camels, deer, sheep, mammal, rabbit, organism, Hare,
Vertebrate, mammal, Rabbit, hamster, Snake, scorpion, invertebrate,
organism, Beetle, Ladybird, worm, insect, moth, termites, vertebrate,
fox, mammal, wolf, Organisms, jackal, Bear, mammals, seal, Elephant,
badger, mice, rats, albatross, mole, buffalo, mammals, rodent, Cow,
Squirrel, woodlouse, Vertebrate, sheep, Mammals, Camel, bat, beetle,
Condor, Tree, organisms, Vegetation, birch, willow, rabbit, rodents,
vole, beaver, squirrel, Mouse, rat, Vertebrates, mice, badger, Sloth,
shrew, giraffe, ostrich, rhinoceros, mammals, giraffe, vertebrates,
bats, mammal, hippopotamus, sloth, moss, vegetation, organism,
Perennial, Rose, Fox, Bear, monkey, spider, arachnid, vertebrate,
scorpions, mite, Spiders, organism, arachnid, Birds, vertebrates,
bird, parrot, nightingale, Tiger, Monkey, pig, wolf, newt, Salamander,
frog, Whale
I will paypal $1000 to the first person who can decipher the plaintext
from the above ciphertext. Solutions must be presented before the
deadline August the 17th 2012 after which the challenge will be
withdrawn.
The ciphertext was prepared by hand and can be deciphered by hand with
no computer needed. The plaintext is in english. It may contain the
letters a-z, spaces and fullstops.
Best Wishes,
James Barton
I appreciate that a cipher cannot be classed as secure if it's
strength is based on a concealed algorithm.
So I present this cipher only as a curiosity. It is, I believe based
on an unusual technique which, who knows, maybe of some interest to
cryptology down the line. Perhaps there is a concept here that can be
integrated into a more professional framework in the future. I will
probably reveal the method to anyone interested after the 17th of
August but will keep it hidden for now so as not to spoil the
challenge.
VirtueScience Cipher 2:
animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
mammal, Dog, vertebrate, Dragonfly, Cats, Fish, badger, wolf, birds,
crows, ants, worms, duck, creature, birds, mallard, Vertebrate,
mammal, lion, Cats, Apple, Oak, sycamore, trout, eel, organism, fish,
moray, Tiger, leopard, fish, cat, Eel, starfish, panther, Owl,
chicken, plant, duck, dog, Fish, eel, carp, halibut, pike, fish,
Salmon, perch, Organism, fish, Cod, eel, ants, Insects, fly, oak,
mammal, badger, sloth, lizard, frog, Tortoise, lizard, Wolf, reptile,
Organism, Chameleons, lizard, gecko, lizard, Reptile, Fox, Beagle,
organism, mammal, Dogs, Mammals, rodent, wolf, Squirrels, mammal,
rodents, panda, oak, tree, beech, oaks, Pear, apple, Orange, lemon,
Elm, Trees, deciduous, Vegetation, birch, Birch, tiger, trees, cats,
leopard, panther, Oak, Cheetah, vertebrate, reptile, organism,
crocodile, Chameleon, alligator, Frog, turtle, organism, Vertebrates,
lizard, Reptile, lizard, Gecko, owl, bird, vertebrate, bird, penguin,
robin, eagle, hawk, thrush, hummingbird, birds, raven, crow,
invertebrate, invertebrate, Beetle, Insect, worm, Organism, Insects,
butterflies, rose, aphid, ladybird, Tulip, Lilac, vegetation, Acacia,
cabbage, caterpillar, radish, moths, insect, wasp, invertebrates,
ants, leeches, camels, deer, sheep, mammal, rabbit, organism, Hare,
Vertebrate, mammal, Rabbit, hamster, Snake, scorpion, invertebrate,
organism, Beetle, Ladybird, worm, insect, moth, termites, vertebrate,
fox, mammal, wolf, Organisms, jackal, Bear, mammals, seal, Elephant,
badger, mice, rats, albatross, mole, buffalo, mammals, rodent, Cow,
Squirrel, woodlouse, Vertebrate, sheep, Mammals, Camel, bat, beetle,
Condor, Tree, organisms, Vegetation, birch, willow, rabbit, rodents,
vole, beaver, squirrel, Mouse, rat, Vertebrates, mice, badger, Sloth,
shrew, giraffe, ostrich, rhinoceros, mammals, giraffe, vertebrates,
bats, mammal, hippopotamus, sloth, moss, vegetation, organism,
Perennial, Rose, Fox, Bear, monkey, spider, arachnid, vertebrate,
scorpions, mite, Spiders, organism, arachnid, Birds, vertebrates,
bird, parrot, nightingale, Tiger, Monkey, pig, wolf, newt, Salamander,
frog, Whale
I will paypal $1000 to the first person who can decipher the plaintext
from the above ciphertext. Solutions must be presented before the
deadline August the 17th 2012 after which the challenge will be
withdrawn.
The ciphertext was prepared by hand and can be deciphered by hand with
no computer needed. The plaintext is in english. It may contain the
letters a-z, spaces and fullstops.
Best Wishes,
James Barton
Phoenix
Apr 18, 2012, 6:45:48 PM4/18/12
to
On 17 Abr, 21:59, James Barton <jamesbart...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>I will probably reveal the method to anyone interested after the 17th of
August but will keep it hidden for now so as not to spoil the
challenge.
Have you heard the Kerckhoffs's principle.
>I will probably reveal the method to anyone interested after the 17th of
August but will keep it hidden for now so as not to spoil the
challenge.
Ribeiro Alvo
bert
Apr 19, 2012, 9:28:03 AM4/19/12
to
On Wednesday, April 18, 2012 11:45:48 PM UTC+1, Phoenix wrote:
> On 17 Abr, 21:59, James Barton <jamesbart...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> I will [keep the method] hidden for now
> On 17 Abr, 21:59, James Barton <jamesbart...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> so as not to spoil the> challenge.
>
> Have you heard the Kerckhoffs's principle.
Yes, he has. You seem to have overlooked:
>
> Have you heard the Kerckhoffs's principle.
> I appreciate that a cipher cannot be classed as secure
> if it's strength is based on a concealed algorithm.
>
and that all he seems to have overlooked
is his ungrammatical apostrophe in "it's".
--
Phoenix
Apr 19, 2012, 10:07:48 AM4/19/12
to
On 19 Abr, 14:28, bert <bert.hutchi...@btinternet.com> wrote:
>.... You seem to have overlooked:
No, I have not.
I think the challenge to be interesting, must respect the principles
outlined above, and therefore, show the method.
Not doing so, it risks not being credible, and probably unsafe.
>.... You seem to have overlooked:
No, I have not.
I think the challenge to be interesting, must respect the principles
outlined above, and therefore, show the method.
Not doing so, it risks not being credible, and probably unsafe.
James Barton
Apr 19, 2012, 3:48:29 PM4/19/12
to
I see Kerckhoffs's principle as essential for military class and
commercial type encryption. I would say that in cryptology as a whole
there may be some cases where the security of a hidden algorithm is
enough or the only way in particular circumstances. History offers
various examples of this.
As stated, my cipher above is only offered as a curiosity and I
decided to add a $1000 prize as this was mentioned in the sci.crypt
FAQ. I think that a cipher can still be interesting if the algorithm
is unknown. For example was the algorithm of Kryptos explicitly given?
To clarify: the algorithm used to create my cryptogram is not secure
enough in itself as it is relying on being concealed for it's
strength. However the idea it is based on may be useful for open
algorithms. I am interested to find out at this stage how easily this
cypher can be broken even if the method of encryption is hidden.
Bert, you have me worried about my grammar and spelling now :)
xxein
Apr 21, 2012, 11:10:38 PM4/21/12
to
time. Don't even worry about it. But once the cipher has been
decrypted, however, your algorithm is blown.
So what you need here is to let everyone know what the code is. But
you can still have secure and private messages.
How? You tell them how it works. It is self keying with each
message. If you get the first one under the radar, you are secure
from there on. How again? You pass future parameter variables of the
program for each message back and forth. 5 will get you over a
trillion variations. Keep an account of each one. But you only need
to keep the latest for each different contact person to continue. So
will your recipient.
lur...@gmail.com
Apr 22, 2012, 6:58:57 AM4/22/12
to
Han
Hang in there James! It's your game; you make the rules. Having dealt with the cry babies before who consider themselves above facing the unknown, let them know that forever the goal has been not only to solve known ciphers but to deduce if the ploy was just obscure or completely unknown.
alanfo...@cabanova.com
Apr 22, 2012, 7:46:07 AM4/22/12
to
Cryptanalysis Notes
The names of animals using capital letters can use rules to map to a hidden message. For example:
animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
mammal, Dog, vertebrate, Dragonfly, Cats, Fish, badger, wolf, birds,
The rules are easy to memorize.
Speculation:
The number of words before a capital is counted. :421012 10 048100
Those numbers are mapped to characters for the secret message.
The names of animals using capital letters can use rules to map to a hidden message. For example:
animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
mammal, Dog, vertebrate, Dragonfly, Cats, Fish, badger, wolf, birds,
Speculation:
The number of words before a capital is counted. :421012 10 048100
Those numbers are mapped to characters for the secret message.
James Barton
Apr 22, 2012, 5:01:05 PM4/22/12
to
Hi xxien,
Yes, I am interested in sharing the method of encryption as that is
the best way to test the idea out properly plus I will need assistance
to help translate the idea into a real working system. However i will
definitely not be sharing the method until after the 17th of August
2012 otherwise I would probably end up being $1000 down due to the
ongoing challenge. Of course if someone can break the code before the
17th then the method will be out in the open sooner.
Apart from putting the method into the public domain my other options
are to simply mothball the project and leave the cryptogram as an
unsolved puzzle. Alternatively there is a possibility that I will
share the method privately with a suitable individial or organization.
Cheers, for the info regarding over 5 trillion variations etc. I am
not sure how this will work out for my cipher. How is that figure
calculated?
Hi lurens,
Thanks for the support, it is much appreciated. I do have some
sympathy for those calling for open methods etc. For any cipher system
that is spread around and widely used then it is likely that the
algorithm will get into enemy hands and so in such cases it is
essental that the system is not reliant on secrecy. However as you
pointed out the obscure and the unknown have to be faced sometimes and
I am sure that there are cryptanalytic techniques designed for
cracking codes even when the algorithm is not known. I am interested
to see if any of these techniques can crack my cipher then later on I
will probably be happy to share the basic algorithm which may result
in a professional algorithm developing in collaboration with others.
Seems like a fair compromise. Anyway my position is that I accept the
value of open algorithms but I will not be revealing mine whilst the
competion is ongoing for obvious reasons :) For all the value of
openness I am sure that a military would not deliberately share their
code system with their enemy. A system must not 'rely' on secrecy of
method but that is very different from saying that secrecy cannot be
useful.
Hi Alan,
Thanks for having a go at the cryptogram. I do not want to feel
obliged into confirming or denying various theories whilst the
competion is ongoing. However in this case I will share that it is not
how you say, although it is an interesting idea. You are welcome to
ask questions about the cipher and if it seems fair I will probably
answer them.
Cheers,
James
Yes, I am interested in sharing the method of encryption as that is
the best way to test the idea out properly plus I will need assistance
to help translate the idea into a real working system. However i will
definitely not be sharing the method until after the 17th of August
2012 otherwise I would probably end up being $1000 down due to the
ongoing challenge. Of course if someone can break the code before the
17th then the method will be out in the open sooner.
Apart from putting the method into the public domain my other options
are to simply mothball the project and leave the cryptogram as an
unsolved puzzle. Alternatively there is a possibility that I will
share the method privately with a suitable individial or organization.
Cheers, for the info regarding over 5 trillion variations etc. I am
not sure how this will work out for my cipher. How is that figure
calculated?
Hi lurens,
Thanks for the support, it is much appreciated. I do have some
sympathy for those calling for open methods etc. For any cipher system
that is spread around and widely used then it is likely that the
algorithm will get into enemy hands and so in such cases it is
essental that the system is not reliant on secrecy. However as you
pointed out the obscure and the unknown have to be faced sometimes and
I am sure that there are cryptanalytic techniques designed for
cracking codes even when the algorithm is not known. I am interested
to see if any of these techniques can crack my cipher then later on I
will probably be happy to share the basic algorithm which may result
in a professional algorithm developing in collaboration with others.
Seems like a fair compromise. Anyway my position is that I accept the
value of open algorithms but I will not be revealing mine whilst the
competion is ongoing for obvious reasons :) For all the value of
openness I am sure that a military would not deliberately share their
code system with their enemy. A system must not 'rely' on secrecy of
method but that is very different from saying that secrecy cannot be
useful.
Hi Alan,
Thanks for having a go at the cryptogram. I do not want to feel
obliged into confirming or denying various theories whilst the
competion is ongoing. However in this case I will share that it is not
how you say, although it is an interesting idea. You are welcome to
ask questions about the cipher and if it seems fair I will probably
answer them.
Cheers,
James
xxein
Apr 22, 2012, 10:26:51 PM4/22/12
to
On Apr 22, 5:01 pm, James Barton <jamesjbart...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi xxien,
>
> Yes, I am interested in sharing the method of encryption as that is
> the best way to test the idea out properly plus I will need assistance
> to help translate the idea into a real working system. However i will
> definitely not be sharing the method until after the 17th of August
> 2012 otherwise I would probably end up being $1000 down due to the
> ongoing challenge. Of course if someone can break the code before the
> 17th then the method will be out in the open sooner.
>
> Apart from putting the method into the public domain my other options
> are to simply mothball the project and leave the cryptogram as an
> unsolved puzzle. Alternatively there is a possibility that I will
> share the method privately with a suitable individial or organization.
>
> Cheers, for the info regarding over 5 trillion variations etc. I am
> not sure how this will work out for my cipher. How is that figure
> calculated?
>
xxein: I did not say 5 trillion. I said that 5 adjustable parameters
> Hi xxien,
>
> Yes, I am interested in sharing the method of encryption as that is
> the best way to test the idea out properly plus I will need assistance
> to help translate the idea into a real working system. However i will
> definitely not be sharing the method until after the 17th of August
> 2012 otherwise I would probably end up being $1000 down due to the
> ongoing challenge. Of course if someone can break the code before the
> 17th then the method will be out in the open sooner.
>
> Apart from putting the method into the public domain my other options
> are to simply mothball the project and leave the cryptogram as an
> unsolved puzzle. Alternatively there is a possibility that I will
> share the method privately with a suitable individial or organization.
>
> Cheers, for the info regarding over 5 trillion variations etc. I am
> not sure how this will work out for my cipher. How is that figure
> calculated?
>
could produce a little over a trillion. 1099511627776. 256^5.
James Barton
Apr 23, 2012, 2:33:36 AM4/23/12
to
Yes, I am with you now, cheers. Your description of the process has
been helpful and I have been having a think about which parameters
within my system can be adjusted and how etc. What I am still not
clear on is regarding the range of each parameter. It seems that the
overall number of variations is dependent not just on the number of
parameters but also the range of each paremeter. You seem to have it
set at 256 for each parameter? Are there theoretical or practical
limits for the range of a parameter within these kind of systems?
If there are any algorithms that you could give me as examples that
would be very helpful. How many parameters do these professional
systems adjust and what ranges?
Best Wishes,
James
FireXware
Apr 23, 2012, 11:00:26 PM4/23/12
to
On 04/17/2012 03:59 PM, James Barton wrote:
> animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
> Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
> birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
> poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
Quick guess: The upper case letters have no meaning and are there only
> animal, mammal, rodent, mouse, Rat, animal, mammal, Rodent, cat, Fish,
> Dog, crow, Mammals, hamster, rodent, Tiger, fish, trout, bird, tiger,
> birds, owls, nightingale, dog, snake, mouse, Rat, Tiger, mammal, dog,
> poodle, rat, Fish, pike, mammal, wolf, fish, perch, pike, trout,
to confuse us. The real data is encoded with the 4 possible types of
transitions:
1. A set to its subset.
2. A subset to a set of which it is a subset.
If neither (1) nor (2),
3. Two sets that are subsets of the same set.
4. Two sets that are not subsets of the same set.
More data could be encoded per pair by: Given two sets, for each one,
how many levels "up" do you need to go until they are both subsets of
the same set (i.e. like least common multiple). I doubt this is the case
though, since it is a useless complication.
James Barton
Apr 25, 2012, 5:41:28 PM4/25/12
to
Thanks for sharing some interesting speculations on the VirtueScience
2 cipher. I cannot honestly say that they are fully accurate but I do
think that you are on the right track.
Here is the relevant page on my personal site:
http://www.virtuescience.com/cryptography.html
VirtueScience Cipher 1 is also displayed there. That code has already
been cracked by a colleague but the solution is not in the public
domain. There is no longer a prize attached to that cipher but
cracking it may offer some insights to VirtueScience Cipher 2 even
though it is based on different principles.
I will give another clue for the challenge cipher: the first letter in
the plaintext is "a".
Best Wishes,
James
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