AP Calc reading 2010

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john_perry_usm

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Jan 21, 2010, 10:50:59 AM1/21/10
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Hi all

I'm going to the AP Calc reading in June. I had wondered if that might
be a good place to give a talk about Sage: lots of university & high
school teachers of Calculus who might be interested in it. I'd have to
get permission from ETS to give a talk, but they might allow an
informal one. Two questions:

Has anyone done this before?

Is anyone else going to the AP reading?

Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about approaching ETS on
the topic, or (if they approve) how to talk about it?

regards
john perry

William Stein

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Jan 21, 2010, 11:14:52 AM1/21/10
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On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 7:50 AM, john_perry_usm <john....@usm.edu> wrote:
> Hi all
>
> I'm going to the AP Calc reading in June. I had wondered if that might
> be a good place to give a talk about Sage: lots of university & high
> school teachers of Calculus who might be interested in it. I'd have to
> get permission from ETS to give a talk, but they might allow an
> informal one. Two questions:
>
> Has anyone done this before?
>
> Is anyone else going to the AP reading?

What is "AP reading"?

>
> Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about approaching ETS on
> the topic, or (if they approve) how to talk about it?
>
> regards
> john perry
>

> --
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>
>

--
William Stein
Associate Professor of Mathematics
University of Washington
http://wstein.org

john_perry_usm

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Jan 21, 2010, 11:17:39 AM1/21/10
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The annual AP Calculus exam. ETS brings in hundreds of Calculus
teachers from high school & college to a city (Kansas City MO this
year) to grade the "essay response" portion. They call that a
"reading". Kind of like a Tarot reading, but somewhat less
precise. ;-)

Does that help?

john

On Jan 21, 10:14 am, William Stein <wst...@gmail.com> wrote:


> On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 7:50 AM, john_perry_usm <john.pe...@usm.edu> wrote:
> > Hi all
>
> > I'm going to the AP Calc reading in June. I had wondered if that might
> > be a good place to give a talk about Sage: lots of university & high
> > school teachers of Calculus who might be interested in it. I'd have to
> > get permission from ETS to give a talk, but they might allow an
> > informal one. Two questions:
>
> > Has anyone done this before?
>
> > Is anyone else going to the AP reading?
>
> What is "AP reading"?
>
>
>
>
>
> > Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about approaching ETS on
> > the topic, or (if they approve) how to talk about it?
>
> > regards
> > john perry
>
> > --
> > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "sage-edu" group.
> > To post to this group, send email to sage...@googlegroups.com.
> > To unsubscribe from this group, send email to sage-edu+u...@googlegroups.com.

> > For more options, visit this group athttp://groups.google.com/group/sage-edu?hl=en.

William Stein

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Jan 21, 2010, 11:19:07 AM1/21/10
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On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 8:17 AM, john_perry_usm <john....@usm.edu> wrote:
> The annual AP Calculus exam. ETS brings in hundreds of Calculus
> teachers from high school & college to a city (Kansas City MO this
> year) to grade the "essay response" portion. They call that a
> "reading". Kind of like a Tarot reading, but somewhat less
> precise. ;-)
>
> Does that help?

Yes. So the audience for your talk would be mainly high school and
college teachers.

> For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/sage-edu?hl=en.

David Joyner

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Jan 21, 2010, 11:36:01 AM1/21/10
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On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 10:50 AM, john_perry_usm <john....@usm.edu> wrote:
> Hi all
>
> I'm going to the AP Calc reading in June. I had wondered if that might
> be a good place to give a talk about Sage: lots of university & high
> school teachers of Calculus who might be interested in it. I'd have to
> get permission from ETS to give a talk, but they might allow an
> informal one.

...

>
> Does anyone have any comments or suggestions about approaching ETS on
> the topic, or (if they approve) how to talk about it?
>


I assume you have a contact at the ETS you can email. I guess you
could ask them if
they have internet there and if so, you could, for the purpose of
accurate and clear
grading of the exams, ask if you would be allowed to briefly demo mention Sage.
Simnce Sage is a great way to quickly check a computation or plot a function
online and share that with others, it might help the ``reading''
process. You could
offer to generously show others how they could do that by explaining
how sagenb.org
works and show them simple Sage syntax in the case of a few SAT problems.

john_perry_usm

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Jan 21, 2010, 11:58:49 AM1/21/10
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Maybe I gave the wrong impression: the crack about the Tarot reading
was merely a joke. ETS goes to incredible efforts to make sure the
reading is very precise and everyone grades the same way.

I don't want to convince ETS to use sage as part of the reading; I
hadn't contemplated that at all. I was wondering more about this as an
opportunity to let more people know about Sage as an educational tool
in the classroom, instead of expensive, closed-source tools.

regards
john perry

David Joyner

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Jan 21, 2010, 12:03:03 PM1/21/10
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On Thu, Jan 21, 2010 at 11:58 AM, john_perry_usm <john....@usm.edu> wrote:
> Maybe I gave the wrong impression: the crack about the Tarot reading
> was merely a joke. ETS goes to incredible efforts to make sure the
> reading is very precise and everyone grades the same way.
>


Okay, I clearly don't know how those reading/grading sessions work.
I assumed that there might be some ambiguity in grading an essay portion.


> I don't want to convince ETS to use sage as part of the reading; I
> hadn't contemplated that at all. I was wondering more about this as an
> opportunity to let more people know about Sage as an educational tool
> in the classroom, instead of expensive, closed-source tools.
>


Okay. In that case, I have no idea. I'm not sure why they would
want to officially anyone to talk about Sage, but I have no idea
how those things go anyway

michel paul

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Jan 21, 2010, 12:59:25 PM1/21/10
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I won't be going, but my department chair will be.

It would be great for her to hear about the issues of closed vs. open source from someone knowledgeable.  She's tired of hearing from me.  : ) 

So I do hope you get to talk about this.  It's a message secondary education really needs to hear. 

- Michel



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--
"Computer science is the new mathematics."

-- Dr. Christos Papadimitriou

kcrisman

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Jan 21, 2010, 3:16:35 PM1/21/10
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> opportunity to let more people know about Sage as an educational tool
> in the classroom, instead of expensive, closed-source tools.

I think you might as well ask. You can point out that the MAA is
funding summer workshops on both Sage and Geogebra this summer. In
fact, if you know your way around Geogebra and one or two other
things, you might get a better reception making it about open source
solutions in general (maybe show typical things one can do, including
interacts and Geogebra applet export) rather than seeming to advocate
one solution in general. Good luck!

- kcrisman

Rob Beezer

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Jan 21, 2010, 6:19:55 PM1/21/10
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On Jan 21, 7:50 am, john_perry_usm <john.pe...@usm.edu> wrote:
> Has anyone done this before?

I have graded before, but not given a talk.

> Is anyone else going to the AP reading?

I did this about 10 years ago. My recollections are that it was very
prestigious for the high school teachers that were selected to grade.
They are likely to be some of the best out there. I also recall there
being some talks in the evenings that were pitched as professional
development opportunities. Someone with more, and more recent,
experience can correct me, but I think some of the high school
teachers received some sort of credit for attending these talks.

So if that is the situation, then I think an introduction to Sage
would be a great talk for this audience.

Rob

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 21, 2010, 6:57:08 PM1/21/10
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>>
So if that is the situation, then I think an introduction to Sage
would be a great talk for this audience.
<<

Wow, cool, this is a great idea. Now I want to be a grader just to
attend meetings like this!

...otherwise, they couldn't pay me enough to be an AP grader.

HTH,
A. Jorge Garcia
http://calcpage.tripod.com

Teacher & Professor
Applied Mathematics, Physics & Computer Science
Baldwin Senior High School & Nassau Community College

Rob

--

john_perry_usm

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Jan 22, 2010, 4:22:15 PM1/22/10
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Replies to various, in no particular order:

> I also recall there
> being some talks in the evenings that were pitched as professional
> development opportunities.

I hadn't thought of that; I was looking at it more as an informal talk
to let people know about this alternative. A couple of years ago,
maybe three, they had David Bressoud (past president of MAA) talk
about AP Calculus & college Calculus.

> You can point out that the MAA is
> funding summer workshops on both Sage and Geogebra this summer.
> In fact, if you know your way around Geogebra and one or two other
> things, you might get a better reception making it about open source
> solutions in general (maybe show typical things one can do, including
> interacts and Geogebra applet export) rather than seeming to
> advocate one solution in general. Good luck!

I haven't even *looked* at Geogebra before, and I don't know if I'll
have a chance to get properly acquainted with it. I shouldn't give a
talk on a piece of technology unless I use it pretty regularly in my
work, otherwise Bad Things Happen (TM). If someone else were attending
the reading and knew Geogebra, we could do a dual talk, but right now
I can't swear to it, so I can't approach them with that in mind.

> Wow, cool, this is a great idea.  Now I want to be a grader just to
> attend meetings like this!
>
> ...otherwise, they couldn't pay me enough to be an AP grader.

I like the pay okay. Beats nothing, anyway. ;-) A bit exhausting for a
week's work though.

john

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 24, 2010, 3:07:07 PM1/24/10
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See how you like my new youtubes from last week's classes regarding
L'Hopital's Rule, ArcSin(x), ArcCos(x), ArcTan(x) & Integration by
Parts:
http://www.youtube.com/calcpage2009

Take a look at these materials for college algebra, harvard precalc,
harvard calculus I, harvard calculus II and AP Calculus on ebay:
http://shop.ebay.com/items/_ti_active

David Joyner

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Jan 24, 2010, 3:57:26 PM1/24/10
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Which of these videos and/or materials involve Sage?
I saw nothing Sage-related in what you are advertising,
but maybe I'm missing something.

MišoLietavec

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Jan 24, 2010, 4:08:48 PM1/24/10
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In my opinion, A. Jorge Garcia is using this list too often as place for advertising.

2010/1/24 David Joyner <wdjo...@gmail.com>

Which of these videos and/or materials involve Sage?
I saw nothing Sage-related in what you are advertising,
but maybe I'm missing something.

On Sun, Jan 24, 2010 at 3:07 PM,  <calc...@aol.com> wrote:
> See how you like my new youtubes from last week's classes regarding
> L'Hopital's Rule, ArcSin(x), ArcCos(x), ArcTan(x) & Integration by Parts:
> http://www.youtube.com/calcpage2009
>
> Take a look at these materials for college algebra, harvard precalc, harvard
> calculus I, harvard calculus II and AP Calculus on ebay:
> http://shop.ebay.com/items/_ti_active

-----------------------------
Michal Kaukic
University of Zilina
Slovakia

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 24, 2010, 5:16:05 PM1/24/10
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OOPs, sorry, that's the problem with youtube. I keep forgetting that
its only a 10 minute sample of class. I've been trying to use SAGE
more in class, but the students still need to use a TI Graphing
Calculator for the AP exam, so I tend to use SAGE at the end of class.

I'll make sure to post info about my videos and blogs only when they
involve SAGE specifically.

Sorry,

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 25, 2010, 6:24:38 PM1/25/10
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Please visit my website:
http://calcpage.tripod.com
and click the link near the top of my home page for my blog: SHADOWFAX
Cluster Rant!

I hope you enjoy my latest article:
SAGE & SHADOWFAX: Taking the show on the road! (up coming conferences
and art shows)

David Joyner

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Jan 25, 2010, 6:35:19 PM1/25/10
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On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 6:24 PM, <calc...@aol.com> wrote:
> Please visit my website:
> http://calcpage.tripod.com
> and click the link near the top of my home page for my blog: SHADOWFAX
> Cluster Rant!
>
> I hope you enjoy my latest article:
> SAGE & SHADOWFAX: Taking the show on the road! (up coming conferences and
> art shows)

I don't see anything Sage-related other than you mention that you will
talk about
Sage at a conference. Then there are ads for artwork you sell at zazzle.com
and your youtube videos, etc, which seem to not be Sage-related.

Am I missing something?

>
> HTH,
> A. Jorge Garcia
> http://calcpage.tripod.com
>
> Teacher & Professor
> Applied Mathematics, Physics & Computer Science
> Baldwin Senior High School & Nassau Community College
>

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 25, 2010, 6:46:14 PM1/25/10
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I thought you all would be interested in SAGE promotion. Who knows,
maybe someone on the list may want to attend.

What ads are you referring to? I got rid of all that after there was a
complaint yesterday.

TIA,

David Joyner

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Jan 25, 2010, 7:03:36 PM1/25/10
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On Mon, Jan 25, 2010 at 6:46 PM, <calc...@aol.com> wrote:
> I thought you all would be interested in SAGE promotion.  Who knows, maybe
> someone on the list may want to attend.


The more Sage promotion the better, especially at the HS level.
I just was sorry to see that there were no details. There are a lot of
links there and
I thought I might have missed something.


>
> What ads are you referring to?  I got rid of all that after there was a
> complaint yesterday.
>

http://www.zazzle.com/cistheta2008,
http://cistheta2007.deviantart.com,
http://www.youtube.com/cistheta2007


> TIA,
> A. Jorge Garcia
> http://calcpage.tripod.com
>
> Teacher & Professor
> Applied Mathematics, Physics & Computer Science
> Baldwin Senior High School & Nassau Community College
>
>
>

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 25, 2010, 8:39:11 PM1/25/10
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Oh, OK, well those links are to all my other websites. All my sites
point to eachother, that's just the way I organize them. Maybe I'll
add some more details. Thanx for the input!

5hanx,

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 25, 2010, 9:34:49 PM1/25/10
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OK, I added some more detail to the blog regarding my SAGE
presentation. See how you like it!

HTH,

calc...@aol.com

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Jan 31, 2010, 8:53:38 PM1/31/10
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Just wondering is the dSage project has been deprecated?

I don't see it listed in the online reference manual anymore:
http://www.sagemath.org/doc/reference/networking.html

I do see it listed here: http://www.sagemath.org/tour-research.html

The only mention of parallel processing is with parallel python here:
http://www.sagemath.org/doc/numerical_sage/parallel_computation.html

I'm curious if anyone is using SAGE for parallel processing and how?

Message has been deleted

Dan Drake

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Jan 31, 2010, 9:30:05 PM1/31/10
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On Sun, 31 Jan 2010 at 08:53PM -0500, calc...@aol.com wrote:
> Just wondering is the dSage project has been deprecated?
>
> I don't see it listed in the online reference manual anymore:
> http://www.sagemath.org/doc/reference/networking.html
>
> I do see it listed here: http://www.sagemath.org/tour-research.html
>
> The only mention of parallel processing is with parallel python
> here:
> http://www.sagemath.org/doc/numerical_sage/parallel_computation.html
>
> I'm curious if anyone is using SAGE for parallel processing and how?

dsage has been removed as a standard spkg. I don't think it was being
maintained at all. If you are simply doing parallel processing (running
multiple processes on a single computer), then the @parallel decorator
should work for you. If you are doing truly distributed computing, then
(I think) you can still install the dsage spkg.

Dan

--
--- Dan Drake
----- http://mathsci.kaist.ac.kr/~drake
-------

signature.asc

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 1, 2010, 5:00:22 PM2/1/10
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Oh, OK, so to use dSage I need to install an spkg locally.

HTH,

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 1, 2010, 5:04:47 PM2/1/10
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Wow, we can use paraellel python, aka pp, in Sage? That's good to
know, I will definitely be looking into this! BTW, how does the
@parallel decorator work? Is this part of pp?
Message has been deleted
Message has been deleted

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 1, 2010, 7:01:41 PM2/1/10
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OK, let me get this straight - if I download SAGE binaries (or source
files to compile) to install locally on my linux boxes on my LAN, I can
use parallel python to run a cluster? In other words, is pp included
when installing SAGE locally?

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 1, 2010, 8:31:43 PM2/1/10
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I was about to download the latest SAGE live CD when I noticed that
there's only one version of the ISO. Here's a few questions about the
current ISO:

Last time I burned the CD there was a 32bit and a 64bit version (4.1?).
It looks like this one is based on SAGE 4.2, but I would like to know
if its 32bit or 64bit. What version is this one?

Does the new CD still use the fluxbox desktop?

The CD is based on a linux distro, is it Debian?

TIA,

emil

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Feb 3, 2010, 9:43:11 AM2/3/10
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I downloaded the current SAGE live CD a week ago. It is based on
Ubuntu.

I recently compiled sage for puppy linux. and had the idea to build a
Live CD based on this distro.
The reason: puppy linux base distro is just 110 MB, including a
complete set of applications. This makes it an ideal base distro for a
big package like Sage.

I have a working prototype which includes amongs others: Abiword,
Gnumeric, Geany-IDE, Pdf viewer, Web Browser&emailclient, Mpaint,
Inkscape light, Video player etc ..). Additional there are lots of
hardware drivers and system tools like Gparted. This makes it rather
easy to set up. There are installation wizards with a lot of options,
e.g. installation on a USB drive.

And of course it includes Sage, Latex (with Lyx editor), octave,
gnuplot, wine and the complete sage documentation.

I think this could be really usefull in giving talks about sage and
using it in teaching.

I am currently trying to figure out how java support is implemented to
Sage. Can it somehow be accessed from outside the package? The reason
is: I want the CD be as usefull as possible, for a 700 MB CD I have
just 8 MB left, not enough to add a Java Package to my Puppy Base
install (or maybe I have to decide to skip wine).

I also want to add some flashy demos (graphics, etc..) and examples
how to use sage, maybe more for beginners at the undergraduate level.

I could post a download link for my current prototype if anybody is
willing to test it.

Kind regards
emil

currently puppy linux Live CD is just 32 Bit
You could also send me a private mail to emil.w...@gmail.com

On Feb 2, 2:31 am, calcp...@aol.com wrote:
> I was about to download the latest SAGE live CD when I noticed that
> there's only one version of the ISO. Here's a few questions about the
> current ISO:
>
> Last time I burned the CD there was a 32bit and a 64bit version (4.1?).
> It looks like this one is based on SAGE 4.2, but I would like to know
> if its 32bit or 64bit. What version is this one?
>
> Does the new CD still use the fluxbox desktop?
>
> The CD is based on a linux distro, is it Debian?
>
> TIA,

> A. Jorge Garciahttp://calcpage.tripod.com

Message has been deleted

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 3, 2010, 6:25:36 PM2/3/10
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Oh, that's interesting! Is it easy to make a bootable ISO in puppy
linux? Also, you say you have SAGE and octave? isn't that redundant?
Don't get me wrong, I have used octave for years and love it but I was
under the impression that scyPy is included with SAGE and is very
similar to octave, no?

HTH,
A. Jorge Garcia

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 3, 2010, 6:51:14 PM2/3/10
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Your puppy linux SAGE CD sounds very interesting.

Yes, I found out that the SAGE CD is based on UBUNTU 9.04 (as stated
during boot up) and is a 32 bit version (as it works on my old 32 bit
linux box).

Anyone know if there's a 64 bit version of the SAGE liveCD in the works?

Thanx,
A. Jorge Garcia

calc...@aol.com

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Feb 3, 2010, 9:18:08 PM2/3/10
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I just saw on Planet SAGE an example using the @parallel decorator.
This sounds very interesting, but is it only for SMP, ie multi core, or
can it be extended to work over a cluster?

It looks to me that using openMPI and mpi4Py is very complex. How
"easy" is it to use parallel python over a cluster? I suppose it works
by default on multi core. Is parallel python invoked when using
@parallel?

BTW, the more I play with SAGE, the more interesting it gets! Thanx to
all the SAGE developers for all your hard work! Now, I have to do some
work. I'm familiar with object oriented programming from c++ and java.
I need to figure out all this new python lingo: lists, tuples,
dictionaries, decorators, ..., seesh! Also, I use a lot of octave
code, so I need to figure out how to use numPy, sciPy and pyLab
instead. Is octave all that different?

TIA,

emil

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Feb 4, 2010, 1:53:55 AM2/4/10
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I am no expert in sage, I started just 2 weeks ago. What I understood
is that there are some functionalities, e.g. in the area of numerical
solution of ODE systems, where octave has its advantages. There is
the interface from withhin sage, but the code itself wassn't included
in the package. The main reason for this decision was, that Octave is
considerably harder to build from source than sage (ease of build was
one of main goals for sage).
Please correct me if I am wrong here.

Puppy Linux uses overlayed squashed file systems systematically,
therefore it is easy to put packages together with low memory
consumption:
It should also be easy to burn a Live CD snapshot, I just struggle
with those scripts to get it right. I'll try to post a download in the
evening (middle europe).

regards
emil

Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas

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Feb 4, 2010, 3:04:49 AM2/4/10
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Hi,

On 03/02/10 11:20, emil wrote:
> I downloaded the current Live CD a week ago. It is based on Ubuntu.
> Sage runs perfect, but functionality beside this is limited.
>
> I recently compiled Sage for Puppy Linux. This is a very small but
> very complete Linux Distribution.
> It has Office Applications, Webbrowser/emailclient, Geany-IDE,
> Multimediasupport and Lots of Utilities (e.g. Gparted). I try to
> proove that it makes a good base distro for big packages like sage.
>
> I have a prototype of a Sage Live CD working (692 MB). It includes
>
> Sage
> Sage documentation
> Latex (with Lyx editor)
> octave
> gnuplot
> jsmath fonts
> wine
>
> and all applications and programs of the standard Puppy Linux
> distribution. I think this could be a nice
> tool for education/teaching and generally help to distribute sage.
> Puppy Linux has despite the small size a very complete set off
> hardware drivers and easy to use setup and install utilities (e.g.
> install Sage Live CD to USB stick).
>
> Currently I try to figure out how sage uses Java and if it is possible
> to access this from outside of Sage.
> Same goes for the ipython environment. For a 700 MB CD I currently
> have 8 MB space left.
> I would also like to include some flashy Sage demos (possibly with
> good graphics).
>
> I could upload my prototype to a filehost, if you are interested in
> testing it?
>
> regards,
> emil
>
>
>

Nice to know of your work. Some time ago I was working in something
similar (a customized Linux distro for education with Sage and other
tools inside) and release betas based on Debian and Arch Linux. At some
point I thought on using Puppy also, but the advantages of a minimalist
package management system like Arch's pacman and the community's
dynamics keeps me on Arch (would be really nice to have pacman support
on Puppy). After releasing several LiveCDs I went to the route of using
VirtualBox to run the CD Image installed on a virtual hard disk image,
so students can use all the programs on the environment like scientific
text editors (TeXmacs, LyX, etc), Sage via the browser, shell or the
more friendly interface using TeXmacs (which was the best combination
for writing and calculating homeworks) and without the need to reboot
the system.

That went fine if you deal with all the glitches of the distro itself
and virtualization, but at some point I think that making, virtualizing
and running a complete distro with a huge CAS system, to write and
calculate the math that we deal with in the class was overkilling.
Trying to keep small, smart and connected was the twist of this
semester. So I'm now using MathPiper + Cyn.in + MyPaint/Touchscreen and
seems a good combination. At some point I would like that MathPiper can
be connected with Sage starting with Sage-Small (Source Python
Distribution) and even I foresee combinations with jython or qt-jambi.
We will see.

So my recommendation is: try to put also Java + MathPiper in your
distro. That would make bridges with other people without running the
same platform that you provide, just using java over whatever they want.
And just for curiosity, what about giving puppy support for the package
manager of Arch?

Cheers,

Offray

emil

unread,
Feb 4, 2010, 10:28:43 AM2/4/10
to sage-edu
Right at the moment it is a design issue and a matter of space. I want
to keep the whole bundle below 700 MB, so that it fits on a CD.

Probably I should ask this at the dev forum, but I think some kind of
Java is already contained in Sage. It would be nice to know if this
can be used to run
MathPiper (I found out about MathPiper just resently, but I used
Geogebra in classroom).

It could be possible if I skip Latex Support for Sage. Latex with Lyx
editor is 170 MB. If I also skip wine (which is not that big loss) I
could free 185 MB.
Then it would maybe be possible to include Mathpiper and a Latexfree
Sage (and Octave+Gnuplot). Maybe if I use squash file also the puppy
dev system (C++, C, Fortran ...) would fit into it.

The 2 Options are:
a) Sage with Latex and Lyx
b) Sage without Latex, but Java + Mathpiper (have to test it first)

Maybe someone has an oppinion about that? It seems that maybe on
University it would be nice if people get acquainted with Latex, in
Highschool situations Mathpiper is defenitly an better option.
Currently I do this just as a hobby, but I will not have much free
time in the coming months, so I want to fix this during the next 2 or
3 weeks.

About implementing a package system in Puppy - this is a bit over my
head, currently the puppy community follows Barry Kauler (the original
creater of Puppy) in a direction, where it is possible to build the
whole Puppy System on any other distribution (Wood Build system).
There are Betas for a Debian based Puppy and an Ubuntu based Puppy(deb
files), but I think there is also something about Arch in the pipe (it
should be possible then to use all corresponding packages of the
"main" distro).

I try to get my current build online then you can have a look.
regards emil


On Feb 4, 9:04 am, Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas

Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas

unread,
Feb 5, 2010, 1:03:34 PM2/5/10
to sage...@googlegroups.com
Hi,

On 04/02/10 10:28, emil wrote:

[...]


> The 2 Options are:
> a) Sage with Latex and Lyx
> b) Sage without Latex, but Java + Mathpiper (have to test it first)
>
> Maybe someone has an oppinion about that? It seems that maybe on
> University it would be nice if people get acquainted with Latex, in
> Highschool situations Mathpiper is defenitly an better option.
> Currently I do this just as a hobby, but I will not have much free
> time in the coming months, so I want to fix this during the next 2 or
> 3 weeks.
>

[...]

I'm teaching to freshmen and definitely MathPiper is a better option
because it is easier to install and get it running by them selves in low
end machines. So it depends on the population that is going to use the
CD. If they are starting with wit I would go to option b) trying to make
some bridges between MathPiper and Sage.


> About implementing a package system in Puppy - this is a bit over my
> head, currently the puppy community follows Barry Kauler (the original
> creater of Puppy) in a direction, where it is possible to build the
> whole Puppy System on any other distribution (Wood Build system).
> There are Betas for a Debian based Puppy and an Ubuntu based Puppy(deb
> files), but I think there is also something about Arch in the pipe (it
> should be possible then to use all corresponding packages of the
> "main" distro).
>
> I try to get my current build online then you can have a look.
> regards emil
>
>

Ok. I will do. Thanks for the information about Wood Build System. Seems
pretty interesting.

Cheers,

Offray


emil

unread,
Feb 6, 2010, 11:12:10 AM2/6/10
to sage-edu
Hi,

i am still working on a version of my Live CD, it turned out to be
harder than expected to get my version on the CD.
Sorry I made a typo in my last post - it is not the "Wood" build
system but the "WOOF" build system.

A Link: http://puppylinux.org/wikka/Woof

regards
Emil


On Feb 5, 7:03 pm, Offray Vladimir Luna Cárdenas

emil

unread,
Feb 12, 2010, 6:04:35 PM2/12/10
to sage-edu
I promised to release a live CD some time ago,
well it needed longer than expected -but here is the alpha release
(698 MB):

DOWNLOAD: http://www.filehosting.at/file/details/111993/SageLive_Full.iso

It includes:
Sage & Sage Documentation
& Latex & Lyx Editor
& Octave, Gnuplot
& Applications (Abiword, Gnumeric, Browser, Email, Composer, Mpaint,
Inkscape light, Gxine ...)
& System tools (Gparted, Grub ... )

It should offer a lightweight but fully equiped Linux Desktop.
There should be good hardware and hardware localisation (keyboard)
support + lot of wizards to support installation and configuration.

Beside Using it as Live CD it is possible to make:
-----------------------------------------------------------
USB Install (to boot from USB, 1GB USB Stick required)
Frugal HD installs (beside another "main" Linux install)
Frugal install to Windows Partition (using UNetbootin)
Full HD installs (needs an exclusive Linux Partition)

Requirements:
tested with 2.4 Ghz , 1GB RAM

RECOMENDED:
memory 2 GB, + Linux Swap Partition

MINIMUM Requirements:
not known yet, but tested with 1GB - needs LINUX Swap Partition or
swap file configuration!

Installation:
- Download the iso and burn it to a CD or a DVD (use the "Burn Iso"
option - e.g. CDBurnerXP under Windows).

- Reboot from CD.

- After first configuration steps (Screen, keyboard ..) REBOOT! - You
will be asked to create a Savefile somewhere on you harddisks (please
do not start Sage right now if low on Ram, create a Savefile - i.e.
swapspace first).

- Although this savefile will give you basic swapspace, it is
recommended to have a Linux swappartition. You can use Gparted to
create such a partition.

- If you dont want to mess with partitions you can create swapfiles, I
am in the process to create better documentation, but right at the
moment to give basic commands:
for Linuxpartitions (ext2, ext3):
use the following commands in a terminal (needs 2GB free space):
-1) dd if/dev/zero of=/mnt/home/pupswap.swp bs=1024 count=2048k
2) mkswap /mnt/home/pupswap.swp
3) swapon /mnt/home/pupswap.swp

For Windows (NTFS) partitions use (also for 2 GB swapfile):
reboot to windows, start the "Dos Window" commandline (cmd) and type
1) fsutil file createnew C:\pupswap.swp 2048000000
reboot the SageLiveCD klick on you NTFS drive Icon (lower left corner
of screen), open a terminal there (right klick in Filemanager, Window,
Terminal here)
2) mkswap pupswap.swp
3) swapon pupswap.swp

Linux Swappartitions and Swapfiles with the name pupswap.swp in the
same directory than your Savefile (usually in the /mnt/home/
directory) will be automatically detected and used.

COMMENTS: I am not completely satisfied at the moment, the systems
runs fine and there is incredible function in very little Disk space.
But on lower spec machines you have to take some manual steps about
your memory, i.e. it is not out of the box, 1. boot and it runs
smoothly.
To deal with that I probably have to alter startup and shutdown
scripts. I would greatly appreciate any testing and any comments.

Emil

emil

unread,
Feb 12, 2010, 6:17:53 PM2/12/10
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I forgot,

the password for the sage notebook is "sagemaster"
at first startup it will take some seconds and you will have to prees
the "try again" button of the browser.
emil


emil

unread,
Feb 16, 2010, 4:39:30 PM2/16/10
to sage-edu
Hi,

I solved my memory issues. I have a Beta version of my Live CD ready
to download from
http://www.filehosting.org/file/details/113543/SageLivePupv02.iso
685 MB md5sum: 359f63129d4f3993bd890e4029b4d98f

I tested it with 1 GB RAM on a 1.6 Ghz box. It is quite responsive.

Compared to the Ubuntu based Live CD version it offers a full set of
applications + Sage Documentation & Tutorial.
This possible because of the small base size of the Puppy Linux
Distribution.

I also wrote some included HTML Doc for the 1. steps. With the build
in wizards it should be easily possible to
create different kinds of installs beside CD (USB, frugal or full
install on hard disk, I also tested UNetbootin install to Windows
Partition).

I would be happy if somebody could test it and likes it.

Servus,
emil

emil

unread,
Feb 22, 2010, 6:20:07 AM2/22/10
to sage-edu

The current beta released is already mirrored on the additional sage
servers
http://www.sagemath.org/download-livecd.html

Some minor bugs were found so far, there is a thread at sage-support
about it,
with fixes. I plan to the a rework and would be happy about additional
feedback.
Maybe some students could be motivated?

kind regards
emil


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