finishing poplar
Rob Mason
nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
sanding sealer?
Thanks
Rob
rmas...@cellularsouth.com
hht...@swbell.net
applied a sanding sealer. Poplar tends to have a tight grain. It takes
a stain well -- a light mahogany stain looks great on poplar. Then I
follow this up with polyurathane. That should be enough. BUT; as
always with advice, the more the better. Wait until you see what others
in the newsgroup think before you finishing your work. Happy
Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
Lyndell Scott
will accomplish the same purpose. Since poplar does not splotch, you can
apply the stain to the raw wood. Poplar can easily simulate cherry if you
use the right stain.
Rickster
you're worried, you could use a gel stain.
Rob Mason paused whittling long enough to say...
> I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
> nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
> apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
> sanding sealer?
>
> Thanks
> Rob
> rmas...@cellularsouth.com
--
-Rick
========
rmcquay
mindspring.com
CWard96624
>I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
>nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
>apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
>sanding sealer?
>
>Thanks
>Rob
>rmas...@cellularsouth.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Sanding sealer is SOFT so you can sand down raised grain EASILY-If ya seal with
HARD poly that makes it harder to sand grain...........
Peter J. Thomas
> > I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
> > nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
> > apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
> > sanding sealer?
Poplar if light sensitive. Before staining you might want to try leaving in the
sun for a day, turning every so often. It will darken a little to a nice
color. If you then don't like it, you can proceed to stain.
Peter Thomas
John T. Horner
>> nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should
I
>> apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
>> sanding sealer?
>>
I've done a number of pieces in poplar and I agree with what the others have
told you.
Sanding sealer isn't necessary, especially if you are using oil based
finishes. If you do use it, only do one coat with the sanding sealer. In
the waterborne finish world, sanding sealer is basically the normal finish
with stearate soaps mixed in. The soaps make it softer and provide a
lubricating action to make sanding easier ... it is also a less durable
coating.
By the way, I highly recommend the book "Understanding Wood Finishing" by
Bob Flexner. For the cost of one quart of poly this book provides more no
nonsense information and advice than you will ever need. You can get it and
read reviews at
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0875967345/qid=909409889/sr=1-2/002-4
629391-6062438
Also, do try the sunlight darkening method of coloring poplar. The green
heartwood turns a lovely brown upon exposure to sunlight. More exposure,
darker brown. The sapwood tans slightly, but the change is less pronounced
than the heartwood.
John
tpe...@efws.com
don't you try finishing the scrap first using the several methods you asked
about. I say this because you didn't mention what kind of sealeror stain.
In article <710prh$28c$1...@news.telapex.com>,
"Rob Mason" <rmas...@cellularsouth.com> wrote:
> I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
> nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
> apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
> sanding sealer?
>
> Thanks
> Rob
> rmas...@cellularsouth.com
>
>
-----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==----------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own
spoke...@my-dejanews.com
> Also, do try the sunlight darkening method of coloring poplar. The green
> heartwood turns a lovely brown upon exposure to sunlight.
I'll echo this from practical experince...
SWMBO commisioned a small poplar table for the entryway in our house.
Thanksgiving morning (an hour before guests were to arrive) I set the finished
base down and placed a peice of poplar on top of it, (figuring I'd finish it
later, ei. bevel the underside and slap some milkpaint on it.)
A year later the green hearwood had mellowed to a nice chocolate brown and
really looks pretty nice running through the center of the top.
--
Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati
FYI,
The top is STILL not even attached to the base,
and it's almost 2 years later ;-)
Conan The Librarian
In article <712aiv$m40$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>,
spoke...@my-dejanews.com writes:
> In article <711us6$t8q$1...@bulb.garlic.com>,
>
>> Also, do try the sunlight darkening method of coloring poplar. The green
>> heartwood turns a lovely brown upon exposure to sunlight.
>
>
> I'll echo this from practical experince...
>
> SWMBO commisioned a small poplar table for the entryway in our house.
>
> Thanksgiving morning (an hour before guests were to arrive) I set the finished
> base down and placed a peice of poplar on top of it, (figuring I'd finish it
> later, ei. bevel the underside and slap some milkpaint on it.)
> A year later the green hearwood had mellowed to a nice chocolate brown and
> really looks pretty nice running through the center of the top.
To add another datapoint in the affirmative: I just finished
a rolling tool cabinet made out of poplar, and the heartwood has
turned a nice cocoa color. Since two pieces I joined together
for one of the sides of the carcase had some sapwood (which I
matched at the joint), it now has a nice light stripe running
down the center of the board. It's quite attractive ... in a
skunk-like sort of way. :-)
(BTW, I have found that you don't even have to put the
piece in direct sunlight -- indirect light is all this wood
has ever been subjected to.)
As for the staining question: I have had mixed results with
that. I made a little case for SWMBO's dangly earrings that I
patterned after one we had seen in a local antique place, and
she wanted the finish duplicated on her piece. It was a dark
mahogany finish, and I did some test pieces first.
I tried it various ways -- with a spitcoat of shellac, with
one of those "conditioners", and without anything at all.
The piece I used shellac on took the stain noticeably more
evenly (at least to SWMBO and my eyes).
Of course, YMMV.
Chuck Vance
Andy
blond shellac, a 0000 steel wool rubdown, then a coat of furniture wax.
I've tried various oil based stains but I didn't care for the results.
Water based stains are a complete and total waste of time (on any wood.
Who uses that crappy stuff anyway?).
Vern Wanzong
Generally, poplar is usually considered a paint-grade product because of
it's tight grain that won't show if properly prepared, and in my humble
opinion, is a little too soft for use in structural applications
(furniture, tables, etc.)
A natural Maple might have been a better choice of wood for that project
because, like poplar, it would have the tan and brown streaking that was
evidently desired, and it would also take a stain better.
Vern
spoke...@my-dejanews.com wrote in article
<712aiv$m40$1...@nnrp1.dejanews.com>...
> In article <711us6$t8q$1...@bulb.garlic.com>,
>
> > Also, do try the sunlight darkening method of coloring poplar. The
green
> > heartwood turns a lovely brown upon exposure to sunlight.
>
>
> I'll echo this from practical experince...
>
> SWMBO commisioned a small poplar table for the entryway in our house.
>
> Thanksgiving morning (an hour before guests were to arrive) I set the
finished
> base down and placed a peice of poplar on top of it, (figuring I'd finish
it
> later, ei. bevel the underside and slap some milkpaint on it.)
> A year later the green hearwood had mellowed to a nice chocolate brown
and
> really looks pretty nice running through the center of the top.
>
>
>
>
>
Kevin Singleton
all the time, and I find that it stains well enough, especially with dyes.
I've used pigment stains, as well, but with inconsistent results, due to the
tight grain.
To answer the questions, though, if you will dye the wood, as opposed to
staining with pigment, you can generally achieve the look you want, with
very little risk to the project. A sanding sealer will inhibit penetration
and adhesion of any stain, and should be thoroughly tested on scrap before
taking any chances with your project.
Good luck.
Kevin
Vern Wanzong wrote in message <01be0241$92901b00$f2e690d1@home>...
Gene Vance
> Water based stains are a complete and total waste of time (on any
> wood.
> Who uses that crappy stuff anyway?).
I assume you are talking about the cheap water base products found at
HD. Water based dyes are my favorite stain, and are used by serious
woodworkers all over.
Gene Vance
Paul T. Radovanic
>I've been making small items out of poplar and my favorite finish is
>blond shellac, a 0000 steel wool rubdown, then a coat of furniture wax.
Excellent finish. One of my favorites.
>I've tried various oil based stains but I didn't care for the results.
>Water based stains are a complete and total waste of time (on any wood.
>Who uses that crappy stuff anyway?).
Hey! Try some water-based honey/amber dye on poplar sometime. It
looks great!
Harrumph!
Paul Rad
Andy
Water based "dyes", not stains. Hmmm. I haven't tried water based dyes
yet. Next trip to the "real" woodworking store I'll wander back to the
finish stuff and purchase a couple to try out.
Thanks.
Andy
Gene Vance wrote:
>
> Andy wrote:
>
> > Water based stains are a complete and total waste of time (on any
> > wood.
> > Who uses that crappy stuff anyway?).
>
Andy Birko
Andy wrote in message <36364E03...@aol.com>...
>I've been making small items out of poplar and my favorite finish is
>blond shellac, a 0000 steel wool rubdown, then a coat of furniture wax.
>
>>
>> I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
>> nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should
I
>> apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
>> sanding sealer?
I make a lot of stuff from poplar as well. I've been using a combination
stain/poly and have been having a rough time getting an even finish. My next
try is going to be either sanding sealer first, or the blond shellac idea.
-Andy
B Kaley
that was made of poplar. Due to the natural variance in poplar color (from
moss green to medium brown) I left the wood natural and finished it with two
coats of poly with 0000 steel wool between coats. I was not real happy with
the feel of the writing surface...kind of gravelly. One coat of paste wax
and the surface is now very slick and the grain seems to be much more
visible.
Tim Daneliuk
>
> I just finished building a nightstand out of poplar. It turned out very
> nice, but I don't want to ruin it when I stain. My question is: should I
> apply a coat of sanding sealer, then stain, then poly, or just skip the
> sanding sealer?
>
> Rob
> rmas...@cellularsouth.com
I've read the many comments here and thought I'd stick my 2 cents worth in
having built a number of pieces in poplar in the last year. Here is my
finishing regime:
1) Use Random Orbital Palm Sander w/220 grit paper to sand the entire piece
down.
2) Use clean, lint-free cloth soaked in water and wipe the entire piece down
until it is nice and damp. Once the piece dries, the grain will have popped
up nicely.
3) Use the Random Orbital to resand the entire piece w/320 grit paper.
4) Wipe (don't brush) stain of choice on. Pay particular attention to
corners and edges which need more. I personally am fond of a Whitewash color
over Poplar.
5) Once stain is dry, wipe on two coats (about 45 minutes apart) of a
water-based Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for 12 hours or so.
6) Wet sand (very lightly) w/400 grit.
7) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
12 hours or so.
8) Wet sand (very lightly) w/600 grit.
9) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
12 hours or so.
10) Wet sand (very lightly) w/1000 grit.
11) Wipe final coat of finish on.
12) Rub out finish w/Scotchbrite type material.
13) Wipe on wax of choice and buff out with a sheepskin pad on a car buffer.
If you want the thing to really shine, wait a month and rub out the finish
with auto buffing compound.
--
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Tim Daneliuk
tun...@tundraware.com
VoiceMail/FAX 847.827.1706
hht...@swbell.net
work into MY finishes! Wow! Excellent post. I'd love to see some of
your work. It sounds fantastic. Happy Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
Tim Daneliuk
>
> Yes, Tim, that'll do it. Whooooo, and people say that I put a lot of
> work into MY finishes! Wow! Excellent post. I'd love to see some of
> your work. It sounds fantastic. Happy Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
>
Well, I do cheat some. For purposes of example I was very conservative.
In actual practice, I rarely wait more than 4-6 hours between sanding
and recoating. Depending on the temperature (I work in my garage), I sometimes
wait only 2-3 hours between coats.
The real point of this is to wet the piece first to pop the grain. Sometimes
you gotta do this several times to get things nice and smooth for that
"glass" furniture finish. This avoids the need for a sanding sealer and
is much quicker because a damp (not wet) piece of wood will dry in about
15 minutes.
I have made several tables this way as well as a traveling cigar humidor
I "accidentally" made out of poplar one weekend while I was aligning my
router table and table saw.
For the tool hounds among you: I am pretty much a rookie at this "Fine
Woodworking" stuff, though I've done a fair bit of rough carpentry/interior
finish work. IMHO, the finishing regime is probably the single most important
part of the job. I use rather pedestrian tools (see below) but get decent
results because of the time I spend finishing. Tools:
- Direct Drive Craftsman (Gasp!) 10" TS
- Woodworker II thin-kerf blade with damping washer
- Router table built into TS as replacement for right TS wing - DW621 router
- Incra Jig set up so it easily clamps to either end of the TS/rtr table.
This gives me both a high-precision fence for the TS as well as a router
fence capable of all kinds of clever joinery.
John W. Shear
>
>
> ... stuff deleted ...
>
> 4) Wipe (don't brush) stain of choice on. Pay particular attention to
> corners and edges which need more. I personally am fond of a Whitewash color
> over Poplar.
>
> 5) Once stain is dry, wipe on two coats (about 45 minutes apart) of a
> water-based Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for 12 hours or so.
>
> 6) Wet sand (very lightly) w/400 grit.
>
> 7) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
> 12 hours or so.
I'm just curious why wiping is better than brushing your stain and
poly on. Where do you get good lint-free cloths? It's obviously
not old t-shirts.
--
John Shear
hht...@swbell.net
I know I do. I also try to maintain a bare-minimum point beyond which I
do not venture. No matter how excellent the woodworking the finish will
make or break the piece. Considering the post that we get on this
subject, I'd say that most of the newsgroup agrees on that point. I
usually try for perfection but settle for something far short of that
mark. How far short depends on how much time I can allow for the finish
work.
I notice that you did not mention owning a planer or jointer. I'm
curious. Did you forget to list these items or do you not have them?
My curiosity stems from the fact that I possess neither, and yet I still
manage to turn out ambitious work. I was going to build a thickness
sander, but never managed to find the time to assemble the parts and
fiddle with making the thing work. I may yet. I may not. I hate
buying or building a piece of equipment before I really feel that "can't
live without one for another heatbeat" need. I haven't felt that way
yet. Happy Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
> > > 4) Wipe (don't brush) stain of choice on. Pay particular attention to
> > > corners and edges which need more. I personally am fond of a Whitewash color
> > > over Poplar.
> > >
> > > 5) Once stain is dry, wipe on two coats (about 45 minutes apart) of a
> > > water-based Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for 12 hours or so.
> > >
> > > 6) Wet sand (very lightly) w/400 grit.
> > >
> > > 7) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
> > > 12 hours or so.
> > >
> > > 8) Wet sand (very lightly) w/600 grit.
> > >
> > > 9) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
> > > 12 hours or so.
> > >
Kevin Singleton
I'll butt in here, and say that wiping stain is my preference, as well. I
can control the color more easily, because I can quickly wipe up any drips
or spills, and blend the color with the rest of the piece. Also, it is
easier to apply the stain evenly, as I wipe both across and with the grain.
I've found that poplar absorbs stain readily, and it is sometimes difficult
to avoid staining to a much darker color than intended. Also, I prefer dyes
on poplar, as the (somewhat limited) grain pattern is obscured to a lesser
degree.
I do not wipe water-based polyurethane, though it is possible. I find that
water-based finishes are thin enough when sprayed, and take far too long to
build when wiped. I only wipe the first (sealer) coat of oil-based
varnishes, spraying the build and final coats. Wiping leaves a film finish
very thin, and I find that I get uneven builds when wiping. Perhaps I just
suck at it.
I would like to mention, however, that, before applying a water-based
polyurethane finish, and even before applying a water-based stain, I find
that I have more success "sponging" the wood with water to raise the grain,
and then sanding off any little "whiskers" that are raised by the water.
This step may have been in the "stuff deleted" portion of the previous post.
This technique will help to avoid raising the grain when applying the
finish, and trapping the "whiskers" in the film of polyurethane, which
requires considerably more effort to smooth. Otherwise, the directions
below are tried and true, and should allow you to achieve the look you're
after. Wet sand with wet-or-dry paper, using water as a lubricant, give the
piece a month or so to fully cure, and rub out with ground pumice and/or
rottenstone.
Good luck.
Kevin
John W. Shear wrote in message <363E2C24...@sgi.com>...
>Tim Daneliuk wrote:
>>
>>
>> ... stuff deleted ...
>>
>> 4) Wipe (don't brush) stain of choice on. Pay particular attention to
>> corners and edges which need more. I personally am fond of a Whitewash
color
>> over Poplar.
>>
>> 5) Once stain is dry, wipe on two coats (about 45 minutes apart) of a
>> water-based Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for 12 hours or so.
>>
>> 6) Wet sand (very lightly) w/400 grit.
>>
>> 7) Wipe on another coat of the Poly Acrylic finish. Allow this to dry for
>> 12 hours or so.
>
Tim Daneliuk
>
> Most of us take short cuts, Tim, when the ol' deadline sneaks up on us!
> I know I do. I also try to maintain a bare-minimum point beyond which I
> do not venture. No matter how excellent the woodworking the finish will
> make or break the piece. Considering the post that we get on this
> subject, I'd say that most of the newsgroup agrees on that point. I
> usually try for perfection but settle for something far short of that
> mark. How far short depends on how much time I can allow for the finish
> work.
>
> I notice that you did not mention owning a planer or jointer. I'm
> curious. Did you forget to list these items or do you not have them?
> My curiosity stems from the fact that I possess neither, and yet I still
> manage to turn out ambitious work. I was going to build a thickness
> sander, but never managed to find the time to assemble the parts and
> fiddle with making the thing work. I may yet. I may not. I hate
> buying or building a piece of equipment before I really feel that "can't
> live without one for another heatbeat" need. I haven't felt that way
> yet. Happy Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
>
I use neither planer nor jointer. No planer I can afford will accept glueups
wide enough to do what I want. My local hardwood store has a very nice
3' wide sander that takes care of everything I need for under $20 per event.
I do not need a jointer because the Forest WW II blade cuts so cleanly that
I can directly joint facing edges cut on that blade.
hht...@swbell.net
read expensive -- blade and managed to get a jointer quality edge from a
table saw cut. I thought that I had somehow done magic! For the price
of a blade, I saved the cost of a jointer -- really neat. I may
eventually, however, break down and wheedle SWMBO for a low end planer.
Depends on how tired I get of doing things via alternate means. Happy
Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
P.S. Some kind folk recently advised me not to leave everything tagging
along after my replies, but to cut off the original writing except for a
morsel just long enough to give other people a sense of what was
discussed. I'm still relatively new at newsgroup postings, and so I
thought I would share that information with the rest of the new posters
:-> Happy Woodworking -- Ronnie Henry
Tim Daneliuk wrote:
<snip>>
> I use neither planer nor jointer. No planer I can afford will accept glueups
> wide enough to do what I want. My local hardwood store has a very nice
> 3' wide sander that takes care of everything I need for under $20 per event.
> I do not need a jointer because the Forest WW II blade cuts so cleanly that
> I can directly joint facing edges cut on that blade. <snip>