Ukraine & Moldova - trip report (long)
patri...@gmail.com
would give you all a run-down. Overall both countries are highly
recommended and I can't think why they're not better known as tourist
destinations. There is loads to see, very cheap, friendly people, good
transport infrastructure and enough English spoken to get by, although
you do need to be able to read the Cyrillic script for street names,
etc.
Flew from London to Rzeszow in south-east Poland with Ryanair, then
caught a bus to Przemsyl on the Ukraine/Poland border. Had about four
hours to wait there for the train to Lviv. Przemsyl is quite an
attractive little town, wandered around a bit before coming back to
catch the train. After passing through customs, got herded into a wire
pen with a pack of Ukrainians carrying enormous amounts of luggage.
There was general excitement and a mad and quite dangerous rush for the
train. Getting into Ukraine was fine; the border guards have obviously
had a few training sessions from a government keen to attract tourists,
and were quite chatty and interested in where I was going. When I
mentioned Yalta as one of my destinations, the border guard got all
misty eyed and said, "ah, Yalta! Lovely!" This was a common response
throughout the country whenever Yalta was mentioned...
Ended up getting into Lviv at 10.30pm. The railway station is a
beautiful building, as are all the grand termini in Ukraine - highly
recommended for train buffs. Stayed at the George Hotel, which is
centrally located, plush and cheap. Lviv is a very beautiful city,
although I think the oft-heard "Prague without the tourists" is a bit
of an exaggeration. Stayed a couple of days in Lviv. The Lychakiv
Cemetery is undoubtedly the highlight. Like Highgate or Pere Lachaise,
it's an over-the-top gothic cemetery full of tombs of the great & the
good. Although for myself, I found the war memorial part, full of rows
& rows of crosses dedicated to 20 year old dead soldiers, very moving.
Night train from Lviv to Kiev. I travelled "spalny wagon", which is a
first class sleeper (two people sharing - second class has four
sharing). The provodnitsa (cabin attendant) was welcoming, as indeed
were all the on-train staff throughout my trip; the station staff are
another matter. Kiev I found a bit disappointing. It's a big city,
much like any other big city (think Budapest, Warsaw for comparison).
Some bits very nice but also lots of modern development. And very poor
street signage; you often had to walk quite a way down a street before
finding a building with a plaque on the front saying what street you
were on.
St Sophia's cathedral in Kiev is an obvious attraction, with some
amazing old graves and paintings. The catacombs at Pecherskaya lavra,
the Monastery of Caves, are quite creepy, especially as they are still
used by worshippers so you are surrounded by wailing people kissing the
glass coffins holding the dead saints. The Museum of the Great
Patrotic War is excellent in itself, but its amazing Soviet
architecture is also breathtaking, especially the statue standing atop
it. The Chernobyl Museum is also good, but let down by everything
being in Russian. I didn't see the Museum of Folk Architecture & Rural
Life, which is meant to be brilliant, as I had already been to one in
Lviv.
One of the highlights of the trip, though, bizarre as it may seem, was
the day trip to Pripyat, site of the Chernobyl nuclear explosion in
1986. It's expensive (I paid USD 145) but worth every cent. The site
is totally untouristed, and any health & safety officer would have
multiple heart attacks as you're allowed to wander through buildings
which were deserted overnight and are slowly falling into ruin.
Pripyat was a model Soviet town, and you can really see how much
thought went into it on the part of the authorities; the people who
lived there had a lifestyle far above the average Soviet citizen, with
everything provided there for them. It's quite a haunting experience.
I then headed down to Crimea, breaking my journey in Dneipropetrovsk on
the way. There's nothing really to see in Dniepropetrovsk, but it
makes a good place to stop over and just have a day wandering around
its parks and shops.
Arrived at Simferopol at 6.30am. Another stunning railway terminus;
you can tell it was built knowing that the Tsar would be using it each
year for his holiday at Livadia! Took a bus down to Yalta (the world's
longest trolley-bus route...). Stayed at Hotel Yalta which is another
amazing Soviet creation, although the service has improved markedly
since those times. Yalta is fun, not as crass as Blackpool but not as
refined as Brighton. Full of Russians and Germans on their holidays.
Chekhov's house is well worth seeing. It was purpose-built for him and
there are very knowledgeable English-speaking guides who will talk you
through it.
Took the bus to Livadia (really a suburb of Yalta) and down to the
famous palace, where Churchill, Stalin and Roosevelt met in February
1945 to agree the future of postwar Europe. They've got the famous
picture of the three of them there, but they also have "out-takes" of
them all chatting to each other much more informally, which really
makes them come to life. Livadia Palace is used for weddings as well,
so there were three or four Ukrainian couples taking photos which was
quite amusing.
Next day was Sebastopol and Bakhchisaray. Sebastopol is a seaside town
par excellence. Lovely white buildings, a proper promenade, funfair
etc. It's still a big naval town and you see loads of sailors walking
around, and there are a number of war memorials from the Crimean war on
to WW2. The Islamic sites at Bakhchisaray are architecturally amazing
as well, and you can see a real live harem!
Train to Odessa after that. Odessa is stunning. I would say it's up
there with Tallinn, Krakow and even Paris in terms of Europe's most
attractive cities. Grand old buildings, tree lined streets, the
waterfront and of course the Potemkin Steps all combine to make it a
great city to spend time in. There isn't a huge amount of tourist
sites as such, more a lifestyle place with good restaurants, clubs etc.
The fun started after Odessa as I had to cross into the breakway
republic of Transdniestr. It actually wasn't too painful; had to pay
USD 15 to the border guard for a "visa" and was told by the hotel in
Tiraspol that I'd been ripped off, "but that's how they work here".
Tiraspol was a real shock after Ukraine; the pavements and roads were
crumbling, there were hardly any shops, and those that did exist didn't
have much stock. I did find a fantastic restaurant, though. A very
odd place. The people were rapt to see a foreigner, and I ended up
giving an impromptu English lesson at a cafe as they said that they
were learning English from a Russian, and never got the chance to meet
native speakers. That was quite cool, actually.
On from Tiraspol to Chisinau. Again, the difference between Tiraspol
and Chisinau was stark in terms of general affluence. Chisinau is a
very green city, with big parks and trees everywhere. The Cricova wine
tour is a bit of a rip off; it just takes you along the underground
tunnels for about 15 mins in a van and you don't see any wine
production or anything like that. The Moldovan history museum is
great; it's captioned in Moldovan, Russian & English, and covers all
periods of the country's history. Got the train from Chisinau to
Bucharest and then flew home from there.
As I said at the start, I would highly recommend both countries and am
surprised they're not more widely known. I'm sure they will develop
rapidly and be very different in five years time, so it was good to see
them at this stage.
Padraig Breathnach
>I've just got back from two weeks in Ukraine & Moldova and thought I
>would give you all a run-down. ...
Thanks for that. I enjoyed your report, and have added more to the
ever-increasing list of places I hope to visit.
--
PB
The return address has been MUNGED
My travel writing: http://www.iol.ie/~draoi/
None Yet
> I've just got back from two weeks in Ukraine & Moldova and thought I
> would give you all a run-down. Overall both countries are highly
> recommended and I can't think why they're not better known as tourist
> destinations. There is loads to see, very cheap, friendly people, good
> transport infrastructure and enough English spoken to get by, although
> you do need to be able to read the Cyrillic script for street names,
> etc.
Wow, what a great little run down of Ukraine. I have to say your
letter has inspired me to get off my butt and get my visa together to
go there.
What do you think driving would be like in UA?
Evolutions Sins
May i ask what is your sex and age (range)? Also what did you think of
the night life and what kinds of music was popular?
--
Too new to the group to have a real sig
patri...@gmail.com
None Yet wrote:
> Wow, what a great little run down of Ukraine. I have to say your
> letter has inspired me to get off my butt and get my visa together to
> go there.
>
> What do you think driving would be like in UA?
Don't. Seriously. Just don't. Unless of course you're expert at
overtaking cars that are already overtaking at high speed on hairpin
bends whilst smoking and talking on a mobile phone. The trains are so
good, and local public transport so plentiful (many people simply can't
afford cars, as petrol prices are not far off Western European levels,
so the little local minibuses do a roaring trade) that you just don't
need a car to get anywhere. Even if public transport fails you, taxi
fares are very cheap for the Western visitor.
Not sure where you're from, but EU citizens no longer need visas for
Ukraine. I think Americans and Australians may still need them,
though.
You'll need a Russian phrasebook, but you'll be able to get around most
places with just English. Go for it!
Patrick
patri...@gmail.com
Evolutions Sins wrote:
> May i ask what is your sex and age (range)? Also what did you think of
> the night life and what kinds of music was popular?
I would have thought my sex and age range would be obvious from my
email address <g>. I didn't really do any nightclubbing whilst I was
there, but certainly all cities had a vibrant restaurant/bar/pub scene.
Odessa and Kiev are, I believe, the best places for clubbing, if
that's what you're into. Kharkiv has a large student population (over
100,000 IIRC) so apparently there's good nightlife there as well, but I
didn't go there so have no first-hand knowledge.
Patrick
Evolutions Sins
Thanks for the heads up, i thought maybe that your email was like a
bible reference or something, posting with your real email, that's
brave of you ;).
Is Odessa one of those British "Stag Party" towns (i really feel bad
for none idiot British men as these "stag/hooligan" types have really
painted a bad picture of that demographic, me thinks i will start a
thread on the subject after a group search) like
Tallinn/Prague/Bratislava/etc?
Or in general how touristed out did you feel that Odessa was?
--
To new to the group to have a real sig
Bill Steltzer
Bill Steltzer
Bill Steltzer
patri...@gmail.com wrote:
> The fun started after Odessa as I had to cross into the breakway
> republic of Transdniestr. It actually wasn't too painful; had to pay
> USD 15 to the border guard for a "visa" and was told by the hotel in
> Tiraspol that I'd been ripped off, "but that's how they work here".
You were ripped off. My wife and I crossed into Transdniestra last year
and were ripped off too. But only slightly. We had to pay just one Euro
for our "visa". Paid to the guard at the little wooden desk. The Visa
was a slip of paper with something written on it in pencil.
We're in our mid-70s and maybe the felt that old pensioners didn't have
too much money.
grusl
Padraig Breathnach wrote:
> Thanks for that. I enjoyed your report, and have added more to the
> ever-increasing list of places I hope to visit.
Same here. The list grows longer. The report was excellent and I didn't
find it long at all: concise and fact-filled.
Cheers,
George W. Russell
Bangalore
patri...@gmail.com
Bill Steltzer wrote:
> You were ripped off. My wife and I crossed into Transdniestra last year
> and were ripped off too. But only slightly. We had to pay just one Euro
> for our "visa". Paid to the guard at the little wooden desk. The Visa
> was a slip of paper with something written on it in pencil.
>
> We're in our mid-70s and maybe the felt that old pensioners didn't have
> too much money.
Which way did you go? Apparently the border guards are much more
aggressive if you enter from Ukraine, as I did, than if you enter from
Moldova itself.
Patrick
patri...@gmail.com
Evolutions Sins wrote:
> Thanks for the heads up, i thought maybe that your email was like a
> bible reference or something, posting with your real email, that's
> brave of you ;).
Everything just ends up in Google's very efficient spam filter. I use
Google Groups to access this group so I wasn't sure how to put in an
email address where you had to remove something to reply, anyway.
> Is Odessa one of those British "Stag Party" towns (i really feel bad
> for none idiot British men as these "stag/hooligan" types have really
> painted a bad picture of that demographic, me thinks i will start a
> thread on the subject after a group search) like
> Tallinn/Prague/Bratislava/etc?
No, most certainly not. I didn't hear anyone else speaking English the
whole time I was in Odessa. Although having said that, if I were
Michael O'Leary I would have my locations manager on the carpet to find
out why Ryanair wasn't already flying there as it's got all the right
ingredients for a weekend break location. The only reason I can think
of is that there may not be enough of a demand for Odessa->London
flights to balance out demand for London->Odessa.
> Or in general how touristed out did you feel that Odessa was?
Not at all. The whole country was very under-touristed compared with
Western Europe. Even at the big attractions like Chernobyl or St
Sophia's in Kiev, there were very few people there.
Patrick
Evolutions Sins
> Evolutions Sins wrote:
>
> No, most certainly not. I didn't hear anyone else speaking English
> the whole time I was in Odessa.
>
> > Or in general how touristed out did you feel that Odessa was?
>
> Not at all. The whole country was very under-touristed compared
> with Western Europe. Even at the big attractions like Chernobyl or
> St Sophia's in Kiev, there were very few people there.
>
Wow sounds too good to be true, I hope that I will be able to get my
visa to go there while I am away from my home country.
Does anyone have an idea of how easy it is to get a visa for the
Ukraine in an embassy outside of the USA?
patri...@gmail.com
Evolutions Sins wrote:
> Does anyone have an idea of how easy it is to get a visa for the
> Ukraine in an embassy outside of the USA?
Famous last words, and of course I could be wrong, but I wouldn't think
it would be too difficult. I think Americans may still need an
invitation, which any hotel or tour company will give you, then fill
out the form and off you go to the nearest Ukrainian embassy or
consulate. The Ukrainian government is very keen to encourage tourism
and I was really surprised at how informal the border crossings were;
I've had more trouble going between Lithuania & Latvia, two EU states!
Which country are you going to get your visa in?
Patrick
Evolutions Sins
> Evolutions Sins wrote:
> > Does anyone have an idea of how easy it is to get a visa for the
> > Ukraine in an embassy outside of the USA?
>
> Famous last words, and of course I could be wrong, but I wouldn't
> think it would be too difficult.
>
> [SNIP]
> Which country are you going to get your visa in?
>
I am currently trying to get it in Slovakia. I tried calling what i
thought was the embassy's number but it seemed to be out of order of
some sort. I am going to try and talk to some travel agency around
town to see what they can do.
I might also look on the Internet to see if i can find anything on
specific hotels and travel plans.
patri...@gmail.com
Evolutions Sins wrote:
> I am currently trying to get [a Ukrainian visa] in Slovakia.
Good news. According to these websites, American citizens no longer
need visas for Ukraine.
http://www.infoukes.com/ukremb/consular.shtml
http://www.ukremb.org.uk/eng/cvs/info/visas.html
If you're going to Lviv, you should stay at the George, it's fantastic:
http://www.travel-2-ukraine.com/hotels/hotel.php?hotel=18
Others I stayed at were:
Dnipropetrovsk - Hotel Dnipropetrovsk,
http://www.travel-2-ukraine.com/hotels/hotel.php?hotel=61
Yalta - Hotel Yalta,
http://www.travel-2-ukraine.com/hotels/hotel.php?hotel=41
Odessa - Black Sea Hotel,
http://www.travel-2-ukraine.com/hotels/hotel.php?hotel=29
All recommended. The Hotel Yalta has to be seen to be believed.
Patrick
Bill Steltzer
Interesting. We entered from Moldova. Just made a day trip from
Chisinau and back. Behind the main market in Chisinau are the stands
for the jitneys than run back and forth into the Transdnistra. It took
us just 10 minutes of standing in the little border shack to get into
Transdnistra, including paying that one Euro "visa". But coming back
took us 1/2 hour. My wife and I in the building with the jitney waiting
for us. Glad the other riders were patient! What no one could
understand was that we had been in Moldova the night before. No one
seemed to be able to figure out from our passports that we were
returning back to Moldova. That's why I think that little Visa on a
piece of brown paper with some scribbles on it didn't say much. I'm
sure the Euro went into the guard's pocket.
but I'm the only gay in the village of Llanddewi Brefi
...also enjoyed that.
Pencilled in for next August....
Martin
>> I've just got back from two weeks in Ukraine & Moldova and thought I
>> would give you all a run-down. Overall both countries are highly
>> recommended and I can't think why they're not better known as tourist
>> destinations. There is loads to see, very cheap, friendly people, good
>> transport infrastructure and enough English spoken to get by, although
>> you do need to be able to read the Cyrillic script for street names,
>> etc.
>> As I said at the start, I would highly recommend both countries and am
>> surprised they're not more widely known. I'm sure they will develop
>> rapidly and be very different in five years time, so it was good to see
>> them at this stage.
Excellent report, much appreciated; this is an area of the world that I am
very keen to explore. Out of interest, how much did you plan beforehand and
how much did you go with the flow? I'm particularly interested in hotel and
rail travel availability at short notice.
patri...@gmail.com
Martin wrote:
> Excellent report, much appreciated; this is an area of the world that I am
> very keen to explore. Out of interest, how much did you plan beforehand and
> how much did you go with the flow? I'm particularly interested in hotel and
> rail travel availability at short notice.
I only had two weeks and I wanted to see a lot. And I'm a bit of a
control freak so I did plan everything beforehand.
Regarding railway tickets, I would definitely recommend booking them
beforehand. Railway stations were one area where no one spoke anything
except Ukrainian/Russian, and were also pretty perfunctory in terms of
customer service, so you would need to have at least conversational
Russian to not get really stressed in that situation. I believe that
trains to Crimea are very busy pretty much year-round, but especially
in the summer. Not sure about other routes. Certainly all the trains
I travelled on were pretty full.
I've also heard that the queues in Ukrainian stations to buy tickets
can be fierce (think 3-4 hours). Don't know how true that is as I had
pre-bought, but it's something to bear in mind.
Hotels was another matter. Apart from Crimea, again, all places I
stayed at were far from full, so you probably wouldn't have any
problems getting late availability rooms. I would stres, though, that
Ukraine doesn't have an infrastructure of TICs to book the rooms for
you, so it'd be a matter of going from hotel to hotel to ask about
availability, rates, etc. Most hotels seemed to have English-speaking
staff, but again it could be a stressful experience.
For train tickets I used Bob Sopel travel (www.ukraine.co.uk) who were
excellent. You can book train tickets three months in advance and pick
them up from the company's offices in Kiev or Lviv. They weren't able
to help with the tickets from Odessa to Chisinau, though (as the train
line was not operational) or from Chisinau to Bucharest. Had to buy
that one myself with the help of a Russian phrasebook! Had no trouble
getting a first class sleeper for the next evening's travel.
Hotel bookings I made through www.selectukraine.com. Everything worked
fine, good selection of hotels at reasonable prices.
Patrick
Evolutions Sins
Wow Thanks for all the great links, far and beyond a newsitizen's
daily duty.
But it seems that according to the first link
"""
The Decree establishes that effective July 1, 2005, those American
citizens who enter Ukraine within six months after a previous trip to
Ukraine or transit through its territory with a valid American
passport for travel abroad, may do so without a Ukrainian visa for a
period of up to 90 days.
"""
So, once you are in you can come back, but you have to get that first,
shucks!
patri...@gmail.com
Evolutions Sins wrote:
> But it seems that according to the first link
>
> """
> The Decree establishes that effective July 1, 2005, those American
> citizens who enter Ukraine within six months after a previous trip to
> Ukraine or transit through its territory with a valid American
> passport for travel abroad, may do so without a Ukrainian visa for a
> period of up to 90 days.
> """
>
>
> So, once you are in you can come back, but you have to get that first,
> shucks!
Yes, I didn't really understand that one either! I like to think it's
"Russian English" ;-)
The second one's a bit clearer, though:
"Ukraine sets visa free regime for citizens of the United States of
America starting 1st July 2005, citizens of Canada and Japan starting
1st August 2005, citizens of the European Union countries, Swiss
Confederation and Liechtenstein starting 1st September 2005, citizens
of the Principality of Andorra, Vatican (The Holly See), the
Principality of Monaco, the Republic of Iceland, the Kingdom of Norway,
the Republic of San Marino starting 1st January 2006."
And you guys got visa-free status a whole two months before we did!
Patrick
Evolutions Sins
I think an email to the american embassy is going to be my next move.
*Google be good to me*
Evolutions Sins
Looks like I don't need a visa after all! w00t. Now i got to start
planning. :D
Ulf Kutzner
>>The second one's a bit clearer, though:
>>
>>"Ukraine sets visa free regime for citizens of the United States of
>>America starting 1st July 2005, citizens of Canada and Japan starting
>>1st August 2005, citizens of the European Union countries, Swiss
>>Confederation and Liechtenstein starting 1st September 2005, citizens
>>of the Principality of Andorra, Vatican (The Holly See), the
>>Principality of Monaco, the Republic of Iceland, the Kingdom of Norway,
>>the Republic of San Marino starting 1st January 2006."
>>
>>And you guys got visa-free status a whole two months before we did!
>>
>
>
> Looks like I don't need a visa after all!
http://kiev.usembassy.gov/amcit_travel_ukrentry_eng.html seems to confirm.
Regards, ULF
Evolutions Sins
Now i am looking for a good train, and some destinations.
I am thinking something like, train from Bratislava --> Kiev, but then
i am trying to choose what towns to visit from there i don't want to
always be in big cities. And i don't want to spend too much time on
trains, i will think i would be in Ukraine for about 5 days.