hey courtie, what happened?

[PeteWasLucky]

You need to drink more

[Court_1]

Berdshit finally grew a pair! Good for him. I didn't even watch most of the match. I tuned in during the third set and was surprised by the scoreline.

I sure hope it is not a Djokovic-Berdshit final because I doubt I will watch that one. But Djokovic will probably win this slam unless Raonic or Nishikori/Wawrinka can do something.

[ahonkan]

On Tuesday, 27 January 2015 11:19:43 UTC+5:30, Court_1 wrote:
> Berdshit finally grew a pair! Good for him. I didn't even watch most of the match. I tuned in during the third set and was surprised by the scoreline.
>
> I sure hope it is not a Djokovic-Berdshit final because I doubt I will watch that one. But Djokovic will probably win this slam unless Raonic or Nishikori/Wawrinka can do something.

Berdych & Djoker are the only two to not have lost a single set yet.
The difference is that one of Berdych's straight-sets demolitions
includes Rafa, an 'automatic' finalist for Courtie/ Whisper & TT.

Berdych has a new coach. I wonder if that's Berdych's secret.

[Gracchus]

On Monday, January 26, 2015 at 9:49:43 PM UTC-8, Court_1 wrote:
> Berdshit finally grew a pair! Good for him. I didn't even watch most of the match. I tuned in during the third set and was surprised by the scoreline.

> I sure hope it is not a Djokovic-Berdshit final because I doubt I will watch that one. But Djokovic will probably win this slam unless Raonic or Nishikori/Wawrinka can do something.

I didn't see any of the match. It was kind of sobering to read the score. I believed someone would crush Rafa like a bug, but didn't think Berdshit would be the one would do it. Not sure what to look forward to now at this AO. Nevertheless, glory glory.

[Fednatic]

NADAL certainly wil NOT win it !

He's playing like SHIT !

His career is DONE !!!

Just wait, no FO and he's outa here !

[Fednatic]

On Mon, 26 Jan 2015 21:56:48 -0800 (PST), ahonkan <aho...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Do NOT count STAN out !

[Pelle Svanslös]

On 27.1.2015 6:49, Court_1 wrote:
> Berdshit finally grew a pair!

Like hell.

IF you have a 100-0 record against someone, then lose a love 0-6 set,
you're playing like shit.

It was to be expected.

--
"Got no time for jibba jabba"

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 12:49:43 AM UTC-5, Court_1 wrote:

> Berdshit finally grew a pair! Good for him.

Not really. His level was too high for Rafa. Watch the match if you can find it. Rafa was unable to stay with Berdych. Berdych was playing well within his abilities. Rafa was red-lining it in the third to stay in the match.

Even if he'd lost the third set breaker, Berdych just had to keep playing within his level. Actually too much for Rafa.

Rafa is now out of the top ten in terms of his level on HC. Will he get it back? Time will tell. But this was Berdych working hard to get to his best level in a long time and Rafa unable to bounce back as he has in the past.

[Court_1]

Well I watched the match live from the beginning of the third set onward and then I watched the highlights of the whole match. Nadal was off for sure. Murray would have dismantled this Nadal too in the next round.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 12:58:40 AM UTC-5, Gracchus wrote:

I believed someone would crush Rafa like a bug, but didn't think Berdshit would be the one would do it.

I watched all of Rafa's matches except the first part of the Smychek (spelling?) match and I was hoping that Rafa might get by Berdych by having a good first set and that putting the doubt into Berdych would be enough. But it was obvious from the get go that Rafa's level wasn't enough to beat Berdych or anybody in the top 10.

Unfortunately I couldn't get 5s on Rafa before this match....I woulda laid off because I couldn't see this form getting him past Murray or Djokovic or even Nishikori.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 3:57:11 AM UTC-5, Fednatic wrote:
>
> Just wait, no FO and he's outa here !

I think he would have retired two years ago if he'd lost the FO.

This year is going to be tough. He's obviously still going to be a force on clay even if he can't win on any other surface. But a loss at the FO this year and he's done.

2013 surprised everybody. But there doesn't look to be anything left in the tank at all except a few big gets and some fist pumps. There's no consistency and no sustained high energy play left.

Rafa meets middle age at 29 and it ain't pretty.

[TT]

27.1.2015, 17:33, horsen...@gmail.com kirjoitti:
> Rafa was red-lining it in the third to stay in the match.

You write more bullshit than Russian newspapers...

Rafa wasn't "red-lining" anything in that match, he was far from his
best even in third set...

[TT]

27.1.2015, 17:45, horsen...@gmail.com kirjoitti:
> But a loss at the FO this year and he's done.

On the contrary... do you truly believe that he'd quit before getting to 10?

[heyg...@gmail.com]

The really worrying thing is he supposedly had platelet rich plasma injected into his spine/back last year. That's not what you do for back spasms or muscle issues as far as I know. If he has a disc issue it's going to be rough going...

[horsen...@gmail.com]

He was playing as well as he can in his current form. Last great HC form he had was USO 2013. Since then, current form is what we're seeing quite a big of.

[grif]

I was hoping for Nadal vs Murray, but Andy would almost certainly have
destroyed that Nadal. Still, that was a powerfully controlled and
patient performance from Tomas. He looked to be playing well within
himself. It's weird to think that Tomic actually took more games from
Berdych than Nadal. Berdych appears to have benefited a lot from hiring
Murray's former coach.

[Court_1]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 2:26:51 PM UTC-5, grif wrote:

> Berdych appears to have benefited a lot from hiring
> Murray's former coach.

Only if he actually goes on to win the title, otherwise, not really.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

I don't think these guys assume anything. Once they lose it and can't get it back then it's time to retire. Nadal is a front-runner, a confidence player. He goes into matches thinking that he must be able to play at a high level to win. If he cannot reach a level he's happy with, I think he'll retire. I don't think he will rationalize and say, "Well, considering I'm coming off of an injury, a quarter-final is OK." I mean he said it in his interview but it was an effort to salvage something positive from this AO. As it turned out, that was the ONLY positive.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 11:31:56 AM UTC-5, heyg...@gmail.com wrote:

> The really worrying thing is he supposedly had platelet rich plasma injected into his spine/back last year. That's not what you do for back spasms or muscle issues as far as I know. If he has a disc issue it's going to be rough going...

This is going to be a year of pain for Rafa, and I don't mean physical pain. When he discovers that the only surface he's competitive on anymore is clay, it's going to be time to do some serious thinking about his future.

He can't scamper around the court like he did 5 years ago or even 2 years ago. That means fast surfaces are out.

We're not talking about form or fitness here. The guy is getting cleanly beaten by shots he used to run for and get. The legs are slower. The serves are slower. How is he going to compete unless he develops an all-out aggressive style? And how is he going to do that with the serve speeds he's clocking these days?

All these things happen to all players as they age. Remember how Chang used to run like a demented squirrel around the court, getting to everything? When he lost a little of that foot speed he was done, toast. That's what's happening to Rafa right now.

[Court_1]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 2:37:37 PM UTC-5, horsen...@gmail.com wrote:

> If he cannot reach a level he's happy with, I think he'll retire. I don't think he will rationalize and say, "Well, considering I'm coming off of an injury, a quarter-final is OK." I mean he said it in his interview but it was an effort to salvage something positive from this AO. As it turned out, that was the ONLY positive.

I agree with you that he will not stick around if he thinks he can no longer win but I don't think we are there yet. He was off for months and made the QF of a hc slam. That is not great for his standards but by normal standards it is very good. Too soon and foolish to write him off.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 2:26:51 PM UTC-5, grif wrote:

It's weird to think that Tomic actually took more games from
> Berdych than Nadal. Berdych appears to have benefited a lot from hiring
> Murray's former coach.

Berdych is playing great ball right now. Nadal's level is poor right now.

[Fednatic]

well it's that or look even more like an asshole trying.

his choice.

[Fednatic]

he should have lost in R1 ! and, almost did. it is NOT too soon to
write him off. The CHEATER is DONE !

[Gracchus]

On Tuesday, January 27, 2015 at 6:45:40 PM UTC-8, Fednatic wrote:
> On Tue, 27 Jan 2015 12:00:25 -0800 (PST), Court_1

> >I agree with you that he will not stick around if he thinks he can no longer win but I don't think we are there yet. He was off for months and made the QF of a hc slam. That is not great for his standards but by normal standards it is very good. Too soon and foolish to write him off.

> he should have lost in R1 ! and, almost did. it is NOT too soon to
> write him off. The CHEATER is DONE !

I believe the French crowd will turn strongly against him this year and it will be beautiful.

[Fednatic]

He was far from his best the entire fucking tournament and will
continue to be from now on. He's DONE !

[Fednatic]

ou that would be fantastic !

give him a hingis x 10 !

[Whisper]

He just gave him too much head start imo. I would have liked to see
Rafa win 3rd set just to see how Berdych performs. I have no doubt he
would have shit the bed & confirmed his mega clown status losing a huge
lead.

[Whisper]

Anybody in top 50 would have won the 1st 2 sets from Rafa in that form.

[Whisper]

Agree. He was however gaining momentum fast. Just gave bs too much start.

[Whisper]

Yeah, obviously he's never going to be as good as he was in 2010 but I
wouldn't write him off just yet. I wouldn't be shocked if eg he won FO
& USO again this yr.

Sure there is an end point where he simply can't win slams anymore, but
I think the sample size is too small to make a definitive assessment.
It's his 1st slam back, & he did reach Q/f end of the day.

4 years ago he was beaten easily in AO Q/f by Ferrer of all people.
He's done ok in slams since then.

[Court_1]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 3:59:22 AM UTC-5, Whisper wrote:

> Yeah, obviously he's never going to be as good as he was in 2010 but I
> wouldn't write him off just yet. I wouldn't be shocked if eg he won FO
> & USO again this yr.
>
> Sure there is an end point where he simply can't win slams anymore, but
> I think the sample size is too small to make a definitive assessment.
> It's his 1st slam back, & he did reach Q/f end of the day.
>
> 4 years ago he was beaten easily in AO Q/f by Ferrer of all people.
> He's done ok in slams since then.

You can't write Nadal off yet. The generation below him can't beat him/Djokovic/Murray/Federer consistently at the slams. They keep knocking on the door but they can't get through it.

Nadal is a guy who needs match wins and confidence. He will go out to S. America and win some Mickey Mouse events and get himself into match shape. There is no way he is done winning slams when he is so close to the slam record. It is not possible for a champion of his caliber. I am 90% sure about it.

Everybody said Federer was done in 2008 and then in 2009 when he lost the AO to Nadal. Then Federer came back to win two slams that year. You can't rule these great players out especially when they have a target to shoot for and they have a younger generation who can't beat them consistently. Djokovic, Murray and Nadal still have better chances at most of the slams than any other players if they remain fit and in good form.

At this AO, the only two players I can see beating Djokovic are possibly Wawrinka or Murray. I don't think Berdshit will beat Djokovic.

[John Liang]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 9:40:59 PM UTC+11, Court_1 wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 3:59:22 AM UTC-5, Whisper wrote:
>
> > Yeah, obviously he's never going to be as good as he was in 2010 but I
> > wouldn't write him off just yet. I wouldn't be shocked if eg he won FO
> > & USO again this yr.
> >
> > Sure there is an end point where he simply can't win slams anymore, but
> > I think the sample size is too small to make a definitive assessment.
> > It's his 1st slam back, & he did reach Q/f end of the day.
> >
> > 4 years ago he was beaten easily in AO Q/f by Ferrer of all people.
> > He's done ok in slams since then.
>
> You can't write Nadal off yet. The generation below him can't beat him/Djokovic/Murray/Federer consistently at the slams. They keep knocking on the door but they can't get through it.
>
> Nadal is a guy who needs match wins and confidence. He will go out to S. America and win some Mickey Mouse events and get himself into match shape. There is no way he is done winning slams when he is so close to the slam record. It is not possible for a champion of his caliber. I am 90% sure about it.

Actually there are two problems with Nadal. Sure he is a great fighter when he is 100% fit and has a chance to win a grand slam. But when he had to play with an injury he often prove more than once in grand slam he was not a great fighter. I am 90% certain he is finished at winning grand slam off clay. He is a champion that needs to be 100% fit to play his best tennis otherwise he has a chump mentality. I am actually going to ask you this question. You said Nadal is going to win two grand slams this year. Can you tell us which two he is going to win ?

>
> Everybody said Federer was done in 2008 and then in 2009 when he lost the AO to Nadal. Then Federer came back to win two slams that year. You can't rule these great players out especially when they have a target to shoot for and they have a younger generation who can't beat them consistently. Djokovic, Murray and Nadal still have better chances at most of the slams than any other players if they remain fit and in good form.

Federer did finish 08 with a win at USO and despite his problem he was knocking on the door in 4 grand slam. Was Nadal of 2014 in the same situation as Federer I don't think so. If he can't defend his FO then he will be in even deeper trouble. The pressure for Nadal to defend FO will be immense and it will be the most critical tournament in his career. If he can't defend the FO then I can see another melt down like the one in 2009 and only this time it will be a career ending defeat.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 3:28:26 AM UTC-5, Whisper wrote:
> > Even if he'd lost the third set breaker, Berdych just had to keep playing within his level. Actually too much for Rafa.
> >
> > Rafa is now out of the top ten in terms of his level on HC. Will he get it back? Time will tell. But this was Berdych working hard to get to his best level in a long time and Rafa unable to bounce back as he has in the past.
> >
>
>
> He just gave him too much head start imo. I would have liked to see
> Rafa win 3rd set just to see how Berdych performs. I have no doubt he
> would have shit the bed & confirmed his mega clown status losing a huge
> lead.

I don't think Berdych was going to lose that match because Nadal was just barely hanging on in that third set, pumping himself up as much as he could just to get it to a tie-break while Berdych was pretty calm. Berdych got a little wobbly closing it out in the breaker but ultimately it was Rafa who made the mistakes in the breaker.

Sometimes the difference in quality is just too much. Even Tomas couldn't choke that one away because he wasn't being pushed at all. All he had to do was play within himself. Rafa was making the mistakes and not forcing Tomas to do anything special.

Murray is going to put Berdych under a lot more pressure. Tomas is going to have to chase done more wide balls and he's going to have to do some effective passing. I say Murray in 4.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 5:40:59 AM UTC-5, Court_1 wrote:

> Nadal is a guy who needs match wins and confidence. He will go out to S. America and win some Mickey Mouse events and get himself into match shape. There is no way he is done winning slams when he is so close to the slam record. It is not possible for a champion of his caliber. I am 90% sure about it.
>
> Everybody said Federer was done in 2008 and then in 2009 when he lost the AO to Nadal. Then Federer came back to win two slams that year.

Federer's a much different kind of cat with a very different set of skills. I just don't see where Nadal can go with his game now that he's just a little bit slower on the court. He doesn't have the serve to go all out aggressive and shorten the points. For sure he can play better on HC than he did the AO but he hasn't really shown any HC form since he won the USO in 2013. That purple patch of great HC form has not been the Nadal standard either. He's been uneven on HC even in his best years.

Many here talk about how close he is to winning a record number of majors but I very much doubt that these guys think that way when they know how difficult it is just to win a single major. Rafa's had so many physical problems and these problems are going to get harder to shake now that he's not so young anymore. I doubt that he's looking beyond the FO at this point.

[horsen...@gmail.com]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 10:59:18 AM UTC-5, John Liang wrote:
>
He is a champion that needs to be 100% fit to play his best tennis otherwise he has a chump mentality.

And even if his many injuries are 50% between his ears, he's still got 10 years on the tour. He's slower. Old injuries don't disappear, wear and tear is real. He didn't bounce back this time like he has before. He stepped on the gas and the body stalled. He's probably going to have to play with some pain from here on in and he's not good with that.

Some guys are like angry bears when they're hurt. They get even more fierce. Rafa isn't this kind of competitor.

[Court_1]

On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 10:59:18 AM UTC-5, John Liang wrote:

> Actually there are two problems with Nadal. Sure he is a great fighter when he is 100% fit and has a chance to win a grand slam. But when he had to play with an injury he often prove more than once in grand slam he was not a great fighter. I am 90% certain he is finished at winning grand slam off clay. He is a champion that needs to be 100% fit to play his best tennis otherwise he has a chump mentality. I am actually going to ask you this question. You said Nadal is going to win two grand slams this year. Can you tell us which two he is going to win ?

> Federer did finish 08 with a win at USO and despite his problem he was knocking on the door in 4 grand slam. Was Nadal of 2014 in the same situation as Federer I don't think so. If he can't defend his FO then he will be in even deeper trouble. The pressure for Nadal to defend FO will be immense and it will be the most critical tournament in his career. If he can't defend the FO then I can see another melt down like the one in 2009 and only this time it will be a career ending defeat.

We have been over this 40 times. I get you think he is done winning slams but I would be surprised if he is. Sure he is slowing down and entering the last phases of his career but he won every slam he played in in 2013 except for W and in 2014 he played three slams making the final of one and winning the other.
That does not seem completely done to me. If we come to the end of 2015 and he has not made any slam finals then I will probably change my opinion. That is when you know a player is truly done--i.e. when he stops making slam finals like Federer did in 2009/10 with the odd one or two after that. But I can't see how Nadal is completely done when: a) the next generation is horrible and b) he has the slam target to chase.

Let's not talk about it any more. I have posted what I think on the topic and you have posted what you think. We will reassess it after the 2015 USO.

[Thomas R. Kettler]

In article <FqidnRVIXO51OVXJ...@westnet.com.au>,

Whisper <beav...@ozemail.com> wrote:

> 4 years ago he was beaten easily in AO Q/f by Ferrer of all people.
> He's done ok in slams since then.

While Nadal leads Ferrer 22-6 overall, Nadal's record versus Ferrer in
slams is only 4-2 with Nadal beating Ferrer at Roland Garros in 2005
(Quarters), 2012 (Semis), 2013 (Final) and 2014 (Quarters) while losing
to him at the US Open in 2007 (Round of 16) and the Aussie Open in 2011
(Quarters).

<http://www.atpworldtour.com/Players/Head-To-Head.aspx?pId=F401&oId=N409>

By comparison, Rafael Nadal leads Andy Murray 15-5 with a 6-2 record in
slams by beating Murray at the Aussie Open in 2007 (round of 16),
Wimbledon in 2008 (Quarters) and 2010 (Semis), US Open in 2008 (Semis)
and 2011 (Semis) and Roland Garros in 2014 (Semis) while losing to him
at the US Open in 2008 (Semis) and Aussie Open in 2010 (Quarters).

<http://www.atpworldtour.com/Players/Head-To-Head.aspx?pId=MC10&oId=N409>

If you consider their slam results against Nadal, Ferrer has done better
than Murray since Ferrer has only lost to Nadal at Roland Garros (not
surprising) while Murray lost to Nadal at every slam.
--
Remove blown from email address to reply.

[TT]

28.1.2015, 21:07, Thomas R. Kettler kirjoitti:
> If you consider their slam results against Nadal, Ferrer has done better
> than Murray since Ferrer has only lost to Nadal at Roland Garros (not
> surprising) while Murray lost to Nadal at every slam.

Never realised that Rafa beat Andy at every slam...

[Fednatic]

NO ! We will assess it after he LOSES the FO because he won't be
playing the USO ! We all know his MO.

[Whisper]

On 29/01/2015 2:59 AM, John Liang wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 9:40:59 PM UTC+11, Court_1 wrote:
>>
>> Everybody said Federer was done in 2008 and then in 2009 when he lost the AO to Nadal. Then Federer came back to win two slams that year. You can't rule these great players out especially when they have a target to shoot for and they have a younger generation who can't beat them consistently. Djokovic, Murray and Nadal still have better chances at most of the slams than any other players if they remain fit and in good form.
>
>
> Federer did finish 08 with a win at USO and despite his problem he was knocking on the door in 4 grand slam. Was Nadal of 2014 in the same situation as Federer I don't think so.

To be fair the comparison year is 2013, & Rafa did win USO that yr.

Federer was pretty much done in slams a year later.

When Roger was the same age Rafa is today, he only had 1 more slam in him.

Will Rafa do better?

[Whisper]

Has to be Murray. He's at his peak & has monkeys off his back. He'll
get a lot of balls back & Berdych has to crack imo.

I'll believe it when I see it from Berdych. The only time I'd expect
him to win a slam is of all the top guys were cleared out & he had a
Bagditis in the final. Then he may win 75 in 5th.

[Fednatic]

On Thu, 29 Jan 2015 15:48:26 +1100, Whisper <beav...@ozemail.com>
wrote:

No. Because his game is totally physical and at his age he can't play
it anymore. Rogers game otoh is NOT physical and he is still capable
of finessing another slam or two even though he is older.

[Whisper]

On 29/01/2015 3:24 AM, horsen...@gmail.com wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 28, 2015 at 5:40:59 AM UTC-5, Court_1 wrote:
>
>> Nadal is a guy who needs match wins and confidence. He will go out to S. America and win some Mickey Mouse events and get himself into match shape. There is no way he is done winning slams when he is so close to the slam record. It is not possible for a champion of his caliber. I am 90% sure about it.
>>
>> Everybody said Federer was done in 2008 and then in 2009 when he lost the AO to Nadal. Then Federer came back to win two slams that year.
>
> Federer's a much different kind of cat with a very different set of skills. I just don't see where Nadal can go with his game now that he's just a little bit slower on the court.

Too bad the comparison yr is 2009 & not 2008 for Federer.

Being a 'different cat' hasn't helped him winning slams past Rafa's age.
He only won 1 more.

[John Liang]

You are wrong. Federer is almost 5 years older than Nadal. Federer won 4 more grand slams after 2008. So he wasn't exactly done in winning slam after 2008.

[Whisper]

er 2013-2008 is 5 yrs.

Try again?