Leaving urethane behind a few months...
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
I have started tour skating, the kind people do on frozen waterways,
like in Sweden. It is fantastic!!! I really love it, it feels just like
inlines to me. The same easiness and economy of movement, freedom and
travelling range. The only difference is the lower temperature and the
amount of clothes one has to wear and bring along.
Anyway, I have found something to keep me sane during the winter months
here in Norway, snow not being my favorite through the winter months.
But I love ice on rivers, lakes and fjords now!
I did a trip today, my first trip on a river, and that was a blast.
Really a lot of fun, exciting, the sound of the ice, the nature around
and under the ice... I could have spent hours with a camera on the ice,
there were just so many lovely motives. The river went from open water
to a foot of ice along the bank to 15 cm thick smooth, clear ice further
down river where it was wider. A great trip.
We were just three people who took an early afternoon off to go skating.
Here's a pic of two of us on the ice, I'm the guy in the blue jacket:
<http://www.skiforeningen.no/cgi/newimgshow.cgi?nr=3781&cur=-med>
Anybody else here tour skate/nordic skate?
Checked now, it's called nordic skating, but we don't call it that here
in the Nordic countries! :-) Nice page here:
http://www.nordicskater.com/blades.html
I have Skyllermarks Blue, a Swedish type with NNN BC bindings that fit
ski boots, it gives a clap-like mechanism. Just clip on and off one
goes! I can even heel brake, although I haven't gotten around to using
my outside edges on them yet. :-)
br Franklin
-happily tired tonight...
LSMike
Ken Roberts
that the terrain is way more interesting: uphills, downhills, curves, trees.
And snow has many interesting varieties. And often you do it in places
nearby other fun gliding things like downhill-skiing and snowboarding.
Around where I live, we get to do ski-skating in very pretty places, like
where I've been skating in the past week:
Mohonk: http://roberts-1.com/hvski/xc/mohonk/v
Minnewaska: http://roberts-1.com/minnewaska/ski/photos
If I lived in a different place like Sweden, where I tried an ice skate tour
on the Runn lake near Falun, I might prefer ice. But my basic problem with
spending lots of time on ice is that it's flat.
Ken
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
> Around where I live, we get to do ski-skating in very pretty places, like
> where I've been skating in the past week:
> Mohonk: http://roberts-1.com/hvski/xc/mohonk/v
> Minnewaska: http://roberts-1.com/minnewaska/ski/photos
Fantastic mountains/rocks you have there! Too few photos, I could have
looked at a few more... :-)
> spending lots of time on ice is that it's flat.
Ah, I like flat, you see. Maybe I'll find it boring after a few seasons.
I've never gotten the hang of skiing, even though I live in Norway.
Inlines and skates sort of clicked at once...
br Franklin
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap wrote:
> I did a trip today, my first trip on a river, and that was a blast.
We were not the only people to think it was a blast. Someone thought
"Blasted kids trapped on the ice again!" and dailed 911...
So now we know why the fire brigade/rescue divers truck showed up with
blue lights flashing and siren howling and that stopped by the river!
They also sent the chopper ambulance to look at us, it circled twice
over our heads. The first time I waved, but afterwards I thought that it
maybe wasn't such a good idea... :-)
We have been told to call 911 and warn them the next time we go
skating... :-)
br Franklin
-911 is 112 here in Norway
David Dermott
>
> I have started tour skating, the kind people do on frozen waterways,
> like in Sweden. It is fantastic!!! I really love it, it feels just like
> inlines to me.
> ...
> We were just three people who took an early afternoon off to go skating.
> Here's a pic of two of us on the ice, I'm the guy in the blue jacket:
>
> <http://www.skiforeningen.no/cgi/newimgshow.cgi?nr=3781&cur=-med>
>
> Anybody else here tour skate/nordic skate?
>
> Checked now, it's called nordic skating, but we don't call it that here
> in the Nordic countries! :-) Nice page here:
>
> http://www.nordicskater.com/blades.html
>
I don't inline skate, but I have started Swedish style skating
and love it, although I'm still not very good at it.
Only had one good ice day this winter so far. Pictures
from Gaspereau Lake, Nova Scotia, Jan 16:
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/jan_16_05.html
Most of this day we were actually on "sparks", but the skating
was good too.
I have the Almgrens/Lundhags skates with NNN boots and bindings.
Pictures and links at:
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/ski/skating.html
BTW I have been to Norway and Sweden several times . Jeg kan
lese Norsk/Svensk.
--
David Dermott , Wolfville Ridge, Nova Scotia, Canada
email: der...@ns.sympatico.ca
WWW pages: http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
Hvordan går det? Det var flotte bilder og en fin historieside om
sparkstøttingen! Jeg har sett på alle bildene, jeg tror jeg skal sende
lenken til de jeg kjenner. Fine bilder om isen, den ser veldig slett ut
på en del bilder.
Jeg tror vi har brevvekslet før, om Amundsen, ikke sant?
vennlig hilsen Franklin
:-)
David Dermott
> Hei David!
>
Hei Franklin,
> Hvordan går det? Det var flotte bilder og en fin historieside om
> sparkstøttingen! Jeg har sett på alle bildene, jeg tror jeg skal sende
> lenken til de jeg kjenner. Fine bilder om isen, den ser veldig slett ut
> på en del bilder.
>
> Jeg tror vi har brevvekslet før, om Amundsen, ikke sant?
Possibly. I am fan of Roald Amundsen. I have both a Norwegian
reprint of his book "Sydpolen" and the English translation "The South
Pole", plus Roland Huntford's Amundsen biography. I also posted some
questions to some Norway newsgroups in 1999 about a bicycle tour that
the Amundsen brothers took in 1899 from Norway to Spain.
MVH
David Dermott
>
> I have started tour skating, the kind people do on frozen waterways,
> like in Sweden. It is fantastic!!!
> ...
>
> Checked now, it's called nordic skating, but we don't call it that here
> in the Nordic countries! :-) Nice page here:
>
> http://www.nordicskater.com/blades.html
I think Jamie Hess might have coined the term "Nordic Skating".
It's a bit shorter than the Swedish term
"långfärdsskridskoåkning" :-) (LFS)
See also Skyllermarks English pages:
http://www.skyllermarks.com/english/about.htm
Franklin (and others who can read Scandinavian languages) might enjoy
this Norwegian article about a Norwegian "exile" living in snowless
Stockholm, who discovers ice skating:
http://bt.no/utskrift.jhtml?articleID=244294
It seems that this winter, with a snow shortage, LFS is
becoming more popular in Norway. I see several photos
of skating on the Skiforeningen site, including the
photo Franklin mentions:
http://www.skiforeningen.no/cgi/newimgshow.cgi?nr=3781
A good Swedish forum for discussing ice skating is:
http://www.utsidan.se/vb_forum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=12
and their ice reports forum:
http://www.utsidan.se/vb_forum/forumdisplay.php?forumid=34
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
David Dermott wrote:
> I think Jamie Hess might have coined the term "Nordic Skating".
But have you checked the 2005 Powerslide catalogue? There nordic skating
is used with pictures depicting offroad inlines and poles. Is it a
generic enough term to describe any skating-like locomotion with
additional poles?
> Franklin (and others who can read Scandinavian languages) might enjoy
> this Norwegian article about a Norwegian "exile" living in snowless
> Stockholm, who discovers ice skating:
Use the "Tilbake" link to get some small pics. The group of three
depicts Swedish Olle who has a ritual of going to the ice edge and
dipping his head in the water before each skate... :-)
> It seems that this winter, with a snow shortage, LFS is
> becoming more popular in Norway. I see several photos
There was an article in Aftenposten, one of our large daily papers,
about skating on the lakes two weeks ago. The group now interested have
apparently been skating about 3-4-5 years, but they are really skiers. A
lot of Swedes live in Oslo, I guess they have probably always been a
fringe lot, skating on lakes all the time. There is a Norwegian
tradition of skating on lakes though, so everybody knows about it. It's
often mom&dad&kids on a lake with hocky/figure/long track skates.
Two long track skaters went through the ice last week. The Swede I
skated with yesterday talked about how apalled he was over Norwegian
flippancy on the ice. No safety equipment etc. But then again Swedes
have a reputation for being careful I hear. To their defence is that
they have had organized skating for over a hundred years.
Even I have gone through, but just to my knees, on a river route. Silly
really, I took the same route with the Swede and he called it quits long
before the Norwegian group I was with earlier.
I hear also that there is a big difference between the ice we skate on
here in Oslo and in Stockholm. We are skating on fresh water ice, whilst
they skate on sea water ice. There is supposedly much more variation in
sea ice.
Ah well, the Norwegians will flame me because they say we are THE ice
skating nation, and the Swedes will flame me for saying they are not
THAT careful... :-)
To my defence I will say that I am an African that never saw snow before
I was a teenager. And that there probably is a reason why Norwegians
beat the Swedes to the Poles (was there ever a race?), and why the
Swedes have the safest cars (Norway had a Troll car in 1950-something
and have an ugly City Think now in preproduction).
:-)
br Franklin
-I'll have to move to Denmark now...
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
> Use the "Tilbake" link to get some small pics. The group of three
I just ul'ed my pics of this weekend, they can be found at
http://www.eekhout.net . The 2005 pics are all taken on fresh water ice,
on Bogstad lake or on the Nit river.
The tour rapports and a few other pics are at
http://groups.msn.com/vallerullere , but since MSN has a 3 MB cap here
in Norway I keep my own pics on my website.
br Franklin
FNGuy
news:hhUJd.492$Mw3.156@amstwist00:
I knew you would enjoy this alternative sooner or later.
> We were not the only people to think it was a blast. Someone thought
> "Blasted kids trapped on the ice again!" and dailed 911...
>
> So now we know why the fire brigade/rescue divers truck showed up with
> blue lights flashing and siren howling and that stopped by the river!
I can see why--that's a LOT of thin ice and OPEN WATER on the way down the
river! I guess you/your friends have learned how to "read" the ice. You
would not last long in water that cold if over 2 meters deep. =:0 Do you
carry ropes to pull each other out if that happens?
> They also sent the chopper ambulance to look at us, it circled twice
> over our heads. The first time I waved, but afterwards I thought that it
> maybe wasn't such a good idea... :-)
>
> We have been told to call 911 and warn them the next time we go
> skating... :-)
Yeah, if the helo starts lowering the basket, you could get in trouble. ;')
Some jurisdictions/agencies in the USA have started FINING ($$) outdoorsman
who have to be rescued, when such rescues are the result of folks
disobeying rangers, ignoring 'Trail Closed' signs, or doing outright stupid
stuff.
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
FNGuy wrote:
> I knew you would enjoy this alternative sooner or later.
Mmm, how did you know? :-)
I take you skate too then? Where?
> I can see why--that's a LOT of thin ice and OPEN WATER on the way down the
> river! I guess you/your friends have learned how to "read" the ice. You
> would not last long in water that cold if over 2 meters deep. =:0 Do you
> carry ropes to pull each other out if that happens?
The people I was with were very adventurous, I had a feeling of being
Amundsen or Nansen on my first trip into the icey wilderness! :-)
I have a safety rope, ice claws, whistle, ski poles, change of clothes
loosely packed in plastic bags in a rucksack, thermos and food. The most
important safety aspect is supposedly to have minimum one skater left on
the ice with a rope.
They say 50% of the time one will not be able to get oneself out of the
water. Laces freeze, fingers freeze, etc... :-(
My next safety aquisition is to change out the ski poles with special
ice poles. They are heavier and have a conical tip specially suited to
checking the ice, but are not that easy to propell oneself with. I also
need a strap between my legs to hold the rucksack down for when I take a
swim.
> Some jurisdictions/agencies in the USA have started FINING ($$) outdoorsman
> who have to be rescued, when such rescues are the result of folks
> disobeying rangers, ignoring 'Trail Closed' signs, or doing outright stupid
> stuff.
The only people here they fine are the base jumpers in Trollstigen I
think. Even if they land safely!
But I guess people are more careless now, more removed from nature.
Equipment helps stave off the wilderness aspect, so then one doesn't
have to be so careful. Which means one takes more chances. I see some
parents are very good at taking their kids out in nature, but say in my
son's class there is not maybe more that a handful of kids that hike
reguarly.
br Franklin
-cityslicker now...
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
skate on the ice, feels almost the same on the right foot, set down on
the outsidish edge, a glide, a fall and push, feels very much alike. I
don't quite remember from inlines (4 months since last time), but it's
like there is a hump I have to cross going from outsidish to flat to inside.
Now if only my left foot would shape up and find the outer edge! :-)
Anyway, some pics:
http://www.eekhout.net/skate/2005/2005-02-06%20Steinsfjorden/index.html
Mmm, I should really check for an appropriate ice group to post too...
br Franklin
-doing a Hedrick... (inlines to ice!)
David Dermott
> Well, did another 5 hours on the ice on Sunday. I'm starting to inline
> ...
> Anyway, some pics:
>
> http://www.eekhout.net/skate/2005/2005-02-06%20Steinsfjorden/index.html
>
> Mmm, I should really check for an appropriate ice group to post too...
>
Unfortunately, there is no appropriate ice group here! Or I haven't
found one. r.s.s.ice.recreational is mostly figure skating.
The Swedish forums on Utsidan.se are probably the best choices. It would
be more appropriate to post in Norwegian than English, although they
tolerate my English postings :-)
It is a simple and free procedure to register with Utsidan
http://www.utsidan.se/medlem/index.htm
There are also forums on Isplanket but I haven't tried joining them:
http://www.isplanket.com
Our ice is now covered with 10 to 30 cm of snow but we had a great time
XC skiing on Gaspereau Lake today in brilliant sunshine.
BTW, The Stockholm Outdoor Alliance ice group has a new URL
for their photo albums on skating tours (that's why I wasn't
seeing any new photos for the last few months)
http://www.alliansen.net/greger/index.php
--
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
David Dermott wrote:
> Unfortunately, there is no appropriate ice group here! Or I haven't
> found one. r.s.s.ice.recreational is mostly figure skating.
Yeah, I looked, r.s.s.i.recreational & r.s.s.figure, rec is full of
figure skating too. I suppose the "pros" are in figure and all the other
people figure skating in rec. Well, we can't let them dominate the rec
group now, can we!
I'll have a look at the Swedish groups, thanks.
I was rather sorry afterwards that I didn't take better pics of the
spark, I thought you might like seeing it. Normal spark, not that old,
but his kicking plate under his boot was oldish. Aluminium plate with
three studs and and very old straps, it could be just the straps that
were old. Another I saw at a distance used one under each foot; there
was father and som crossing the ice out to an island, with two dogs too.
He was out fishing from a hole in the ice, but he also put out a net
under the ice by using a diving board (I think it's called that, not
sure). He lets it go in one hole in the ice, yanks the attached string a
bit and after a while it ends up at the other hole 25 m away... :-)
br Franklin
David Dermott
> Hi David,
>
> I was rather sorry afterwards that I didn't take better pics of the
> spark, I thought you might like seeing it. Normal spark, not that old,
> but his kicking plate under his boot was oldish. Aluminium plate with
> three studs and and very old straps, it could be just the straps that
> were old. Another I saw at a distance used one under each foot; there
> was father and som crossing the ice out to an island, with two dogs too.
>
I see the photos (IM001115,IM001117) of the spark now. Thanks, they
look great. (Last night my internet connection was even slower than usual
so I couldn't load the photos)
It looks like home-made "crampons" ("crampon" is actually a French word)
I think it's "isbrodd" in Norwegian/Swedish. One really needs
crampons to spark or even walk on smooth ice like that. I even use crampons
over my ski boots when walking to the skating (or skiing) surface.
The worst falls in skating or skiing actually happen when walking
in the parking lot with ski boots.
I use the ICERS:
http://www.icers.nb.ca/
or
http://www.32north.com/
RED CREEK in Sweden makes special ice-walkers especially for
NNN and SNS ski boots. I haven't seen them, i just read about them
on Utsidan:
http://web.redcreek.se/shop/category.asp?catcode=4
http://www.skistart.com/images/artiklar/CR70020.jpg
I got another message from Jamie Hess's mailing list. On Sunday
he led a group of 30 nordic skaters (a North American record!)
across Lake Champlain ( I think it is the 6th biggest lake in USA)
from Vermont to New York state.
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
Well, I am dead tired after about 50 km skating this weekend, about 7 km
were against a good northernly wind, the local airport wind info shows
about 10 m/s.
The great thing about the wind is that it's fun to coast along on one
skate, the bad is getting back! :-)
Another great thing is that it forces one to skate properly. It's easy
to skate and use poles to push oneself along, but just skating takes a
bit of effort and attention to correct form. Excellent training!
The two latest entries at http://www.eekhout.net show my trips this
weekend. Some low-res video clips too, from my backup camera.
Enjoy!
br Franklin
Oslo, Norway
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
Finished 50+ km on ice today, tired as h...
Pics here:
<http://www.eekhout.net/skate/2005/2005-02-19%20Kroederen/index.html>
Lovely ice most of the time, real black ice. A few slopes too, where the
ice had pushed itself up. I only tried a couple of the smaller ones,
skating up the slope, crossing the broken ridge, and gliding down the
other side. I never thought that was possible! :-)
Anyway, enjoy!
br Franklin
xsfred
"David Dermott" <der...@nOsPAM.sympatico.ca> a écrit dans le message de
news: Pine.LNX.4.44.05022...@localhost.localdomain...
> On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, xsfred wrote:
>
> Then there is the problem of holding the poles in one hand, a camera in
> the other, trying to aim the camera for a good action shot... pole drags
> on ice in front of skate ... OUCH ! :-)
>
> Pictures of my ice weekend:
> http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/feb_19_05.html
>
Looks like great fun over uncountable distances.
Is it actually easier to pull the sled than carrying an equivalent backpack
?
XSFred
xsfred
"Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap" <usenets...@hotpop.com> a écrit dans le
message de news: NSORd.2719$Mw3.2529@amstwist00...
> Hi all,
>
> Finished 50+ km on ice today, tired as h...
>
> Pics here:
>
> <http://www.eekhout.net/skate/2005/2005-02-19%20Kroederen/index.html>
>
What is the use of the ski poles ?
XSFred
David Dermott
>
> "Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap" <usenets...@hotpop.com> a écrit dans le
> message de news: NSORd.2719$Mw3.2529@amstwist00...
> > Finished 50+ km on ice today, tired as h...
> >
> > Pics here:
> >
> > <http://www.eekhout.net/skate/2005/2005-02-19%20Kroederen/index.html>
> >
> Very interesting.
>
> What is the use of the ski poles ?
>
Franklin seems to share the same ideas about poles that I do.
The poles have several uses.
Traditionally, Swedish skaters carried one "ispik" or ice-pike,
probably called that because it resembles the "pike" or spear used by
foot soldiers in ancient times. It might have had originated from a
hunting spear in the ice-fishing and seal-hunting culture of the Baltic
Sea. The ice-pike is used to test the strength of the ice. Later,
skaters carried a second pole, usually just a regular ski pole. Useful
for leaping over ridges etc. Lately, companies are making matched pairs
of "ispik", used for both testing ice and propulsion.
There are pictures and explanation on this site:
http://www.skyllermarks.com/english/accessories.htm
From reading Swedish skating literature regarding the use of poles
for propulsion, there seems to be 2 schools. The old-timers say that one
should not use poles as "crutches". The "newbies", like me, who come
from a skiing background, use them as XC-skiers do while skiing - the
"double-poling" technique.
I find double-poling very useful for:
1/ crossing sections of bumpy ice where regular stroking is dangerous
2/ fighting against a head wind, towing a sled, etc.
3/ as a change of muscle use, good for an "upper body" workout
For really fast skating, say in a tail wind, poles actually slow one
down. It is difficult to pole fast enough at high speed, and the poles
hinder one from getting into the aerodynamic position used by elite
speedskaters. (I don't have that problem :-)
Then there is the problem of holding the poles in one hand, a camera in
the other, trying to aim the camera for a good action shot... pole drags
on ice in front of skate ... OUCH ! :-)
Pictures of my ice weekend:
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/feb_19_05.html
Franklin's UsenetSpamTrap
xsfred wrote:
> What is the use of the ski poles ?
Supposed to help when the wind is against you, climbing out on to ice
from land (it's often cracked/slippery/angled downwards), to test the
ice (special poles, not ordinary ski poles, for stabbing at the ice),
more stable while crossing cracks, going faster, helping to get out of
the water, getting in the way and tripping you up... :-)
I started out with poles as everybody else has them, and they are good
against the wind and for an alternative propulsion mode, but I find it
more and more easy to just skate. I've only been ice skating 7-8 times
now, but more and more of my inlines technique is coming through as I
find the edges on ice. I think if I was a really good skater I wouldn't
really need them, other than for ice testing.
In a light wind it felt better to bend the knees more and skate, in the
heavy wind it was nice to alternate. It's a different way of skating,
with poles one can be sloppy and still go forward quite fast for a
while. I get tired in different places with the one or the other it seems.
Re inlines, here in the city it is not that often one sees inliners with
poles, whilst outside Oslo it's more or the norm. Different skating
cultures.
br Franklin
David Dermott
>
> "David Dermott" <der...@nOsPAM.sympatico.ca> a écrit dans le message de
> news: Pine.LNX.4.44.05022...@localhost.localdomain...
> > On Mon, 21 Feb 2005, xsfred wrote:
> >
> > Pictures of my ice weekend:
> > http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/feb_19_05.html
> >
> Looks like great fun over uncountable distances.
> Is it actually easier to pull the sled than carrying an equivalent backpack
> ?
Yes and no! For a simple "day-trip" on skates with a light load,
carrying a backpack is less complicated. It is very easy to pull the sled,
but there are problems with tow lines etc.
The why and how of using the kicksled at:
http://www3.ns.sympatico.ca/dermott/ski/spark.html
The kicksled is not the ideal vehicle to tow behind a skater. The
centre of gravity is too high and it tends to "fish-tail", slide back and
forth. A better vehicle would be a ice-pulka, lower and more
stable. There was a multi-week Dutch/Swedish skating expedition on the ice
of Lake Baikal in Russia a few years ago. They pulled rather heavy pulkas.
We often combine both kicksled and skates on one tour. We rode the
kicksleds up the lake and found out that the ice was smooth enough for
skating the whole way. So on the return trip, we (or just Lesley this
time) skated. The only practical way to skate back and bring the kicksled
was to tow it.
I did another short tour on Monday, checking out ice surface on a
section of Avon River (still water above a dam). I kicksledded up river
4 km, discovered that the ice was smooth, so returned to start, parked
the sled in a safe place, then skated the route.
Hmm, <xsf...@neuf.fr>, français, n'est pas?
Kicksled = "trottinette sur glace/neige", "luge finlandais" or
something like that.
exemple:
http://www.velofutura.com/kickbikes/kickspark.htm
There is a French (Canadian) article about Nordic skates at:
http://www.geopleinair.com/destinations/suiteT.lasso?id=20041126155740