Vote to get a rower past a cyclist and a wrestler to the World Championships in Bled
Rebecca Caroe
worlds... but as a non-Olympic event she needs money to pay her own
way there.
She has succeeded in getting herself onto the BMW USA "Performance
Team" challenge website where they will provide $5000 for the winning
athlete. BUT it's a public poll - you can vote multiple times...
http://content.bmwusa.com/microsite/OlympicVideos/teamusa.html
Please help her by sharing the link around your club and email group
lists
brianc
wrote:
I know they are having money problems in the US but you would think
they could afford to fund their athletes to go to the World
Championships.
I voted, does anyone know when the votes are counted?
Mike De Petris
Must build up a site to rise founds =)
Jonathan Wright
"Mike De Petris" wrote in message
news:30e5251d-762f-46fe...@glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com...
Hey, and nobody helping me having a good boat at the world coastal champs?
Must build up a site to rise founds =)
Hey Mike. Come to the Öresund Coastal rowing championships in Helsingborg,
Sweden next July & I'll guarantee you a get a great boat and (almost
certainly) some good racing.
Speak to Peter Berg at the World coastal champs about it!
/Jonathan
Mike De Petris
thank you very much, it's three years I meet Peter at coastal worlds, and it would be great to do the trip!
AJ
Ursula is a lovely girl and well worth everyone's support. I met her
in Banyoles a few years ago when I was down there with LEH and she was
training there prior to racing in Europe. Lightweights in general have
a tough time getting the attention that is devoted more readily to the
heavies but I would imagine that being a lightweight in the American
programme would require a particular level of dedication. So to quote
that noted do-gooder Al Capone 'Vote early and vote often'.
Tinus
My Karma is disturbed that his voting will only help one person and
disadvantages two persons. I am not going to watch videos from the other
two.
Why do these things always have to be like a poll? Couldn't they set it
up like 'whoever gets more than x number of clicks wins a prize'? I vote
for sponsoring to be like that.
sully
I agree, Tinus. This is troublesome. The US elite program is sadly
dysfunctional, and
the biggest problem is simply money. Masters' Nat'ls are happening
in Okla City
right now, you'll see old slow farts like me there with millions of
dollars in spending money
for shiny new shells, top of the line hotels, air travel, fine
wining and dining.
In the meantime, a year ago I helped a few elite men over the winter
with their training
in sculling, and they put together in a pair to race at the Speed
Orders in Princeton.
These guys were Stanford grads with the potential to make a lot of
money in real jobs,
smart guys, and absolute athletic studs. They had the presence and
look of pro athletes
that could be making millions on a pro team, or could go out and work
in Silicon Valley
and make a fortune by the time they turn 30. They scraped together
money from
parents to travel, and from working part time (good jobs but part
time), and even then
they had to scrounge for a pair to race in at Princeton, I believe it
was a 6 year old Wintech
from Yale. They got moved four times in a year and a half to
uncertain rowing futures,
chasing wherever the nat'l program, coach, and other athletes were
supposed to train
and have found it very difficult to see where their long term path to
success is.
No I didn't get paid for coaching them for that 4 month period, but I
get offers all the time
from Masters' people who want individual lessons, get them ready to
go butt-slow over 1k.
My response was, "no I don't have time to coach you or any other
masters, but would welcome
you paying me to coach our US Olympic team candidates".
I would take that money and chip it in to their travel anyway, I don't
need the money.
If I sound bitter, I am... :^)
The Graves bros trained on their own in Newport the last year. It's
possible they got some help
from the Newport foundation, I'm not sure, but they won trials, are
going to Bled, with very
little support from the US rowing community. Bless them but their
road was difficult in ways
that had nothing to do with simply the training and racing.
Ursula Grobler might be the single best rowing talent in the US, and
perhaps the best chance the US
has for a gold in rowing outside the women's eight. She's gotten
some great help here and there, Rebecca
has been doing good, but has been bounced like a pinball, been
scrutinized to the Nth degree, criticized,
and exploited. If she were making a pile of money like pro athletes,
then some of this scrutiny might
be warranted, but she's scraping the bottom like every other elite.
The poor ppl at the local club that have to deal with me. A guy told
me he had $5k to spend on a new
single. "what should I buy?".
"you should buy a $2500 Maas 27 and give the other $2500 to the US
Rowing Foundation toward the nat'l team
effort".
Then I shrug. I suppose he could raise $10k, buy a used Empacher for
$5k, and give $5k to NRF. That would be cool.
When I coached out of Newport years back, there were just beginning
to be some guys who had singles that wanted
to keep them in the rather limited one bay boathouse. My rules were
simple. You can have a spot, give us a little
money but I'm going to give your boat to use by an athlete who has
nat'l team aspirations that cannot afford his own boat.
I'll pick the guy, there'll only be one, and these are the hours
where he will row it, and he can negotiate with your schedule
for additional hours. We insured the boat, and my boatman fixed
all dings no matter who dunnit.
Most boat owners liked that arrangement and accepted it, Not sure if
I'd find many takers these days if I did that again.
Sort of a commie act, I guess.
</rant>
I want to append the rant with the following. I know some masters
are offended deeply by my attitude,
clubbers in redwood city see my attitude as 'elitist' and get bothered
by some of my advice on boat
purchases,
I've seen it here. I should point out that I teach hundreds and
hundreds of new scullers, adults and kids to scull
at two different clubs. In the past three weeks I've introduced a
dozen adults to sculling, treated them with
the same respect I treat elites, taught them all the same things, the
exact same approach and discipline to
boat handling on and off the water I expect of a competitive elite.
My attitude is peculiar, but is definitely not elitist. I've spent
too much time with raw, old, out of shape, unconfident,
uncoordinated non-athletes who really want to learn to scull, and
learn to scull correctly for me to
accept that criticism.
A. Dumas
I love you, man.
James HS
You are not so unique in this attitude! - At my rowing club we
recognise that having sufficient 'masters' (we still cal them vets) in
the club pyramid is what keeps us afloat financially. The contribute
the most money and get the worst boats (almost all new boats being
bought for the 'squads').
However, we also recognise that masters rowing is the fastest growing
section of the rowing community,a nd we welcome their money and
stability as allowing us to bring lots of new (poor) rowers into the
sport.
However, we are then a feeder club as the leave us to go into clubs
with British Rowing funding, which we do not want, because everything
is then done for them to the exclusion of all others, and that leads
to a fairly stagnant club.
They stay longer, contribute stability and money to the club - so we
love them, but we are clear about using this advantage to sponsor
'athletes'!
Henry Law
> sully wrote:
>> I agree, Tinus. This is troublesome.>
We all do; thank you for putting it in writing.
--
Henry Law Manchester, England
boatie
I love your suggestions about ways for clubs to help aspiring young
athletes.
May I quote you in a Rowperfect blog post?
R
boatie
> However, we are then a feeder club as the leave us to go into clubs
> with British Rowing funding, which we do not want, because everything
> is then done for them to the exclusion of all others, and that leads
> to a fairly stagnant club.
>
very interested in your statement above (as I no longer live in UK).
why does taking the 'silvers shilling' from British Rowing mean a club
has to realign its priorities towards one group and exclude others?
Can you quote examples?
Alistair
I would love Sully more if he had a proper news writing thing.
Seriously, it's chockablock full of weird line spacing and returns and
stuff. Sully, your stuff has always been like this. I used to think that
was how to be cool, how surfer-dudes write, I thought I was the one
unable to embrace the west-coast mojo of the free-love equivalent of
free-grammar. Legibility is so, like, square.
But now I'm old and grumpy and reckon Sully's computer is some
typewriter relic stripped from the navigator's seat of a Catalina he
found rusting somewhere and that you have to slam the carriage back when
the bell goes ping. Anyway it's 100% fubar on Thunderbird.
sully
I'll take that criticism square in the head.
I'm using google and I type and hit hard CRs which
in my response looks formatted really well.
Once the post gets posted, the longer lines like this get wrapped
automatically,
Then the pretty poetic formatting
I wrote with is gone to hell.. If I
remember to write either really short
lines or write w/ no returns, everything
would be fine.
So yes, Alistair, you are correct, I'm
an old fuddy duddy, not a cool surfer
dood.
:^)
James HS
Well there are several examples around us on the tideway where the
clubs have been wagged by the BR tail and diverted their resources
into becoming good at that 'monoculture' to the detriment of their
'social' scene.
While this may not seem a loss, to go from a club that has regular
social events, to one that cannot get 50 members to attend ('athletes'
tend to see the club as where they 'work' not party) means that they
have cancelled their social calendar.
As most clubs run on a voluntary basis, the social calendar is
important to keeping that element of the club alive - I don't mean
just drinking, but the rewards of ex squad members coming back into
the club as coaches or just keeping their knowledge cirtulating and
passing it on.
It is as much a perception as a reality - when or club signed up to
the Project Oarsome and develoed a large Juniors section it meand that
there were approximately 20% of members consuming nearly 45% of the
club's resources, and visibly the most difficult group to justify as
they tended to leave the club in a bit of a state.
When any one group within a club starts to grow and demand resources
the skew can change the culture of the club and lead to the implosion
of other groups.
We are trying to work the system so that the membership income from
the largest groups are used to pump prome the other groups,
recognising that cycles tend to happen in each of these squads.
Then the social events (we are lucky to be able to sell out on events
holding 120+ members and partners - sometimes 3 in a row separated by
only a few weeks) then hold the club together and reward the
membership.
James
Richard
I disagree with a few points I think:
1. I doubt Ursula is the single finest rowing talent in the US. Yes,
she has a good erg score but her results on the international scene to
date haven't compared with others... And of course the L1x isn't a
priority event.
2. I thought Xeno was spending a lot of time in Newport working with
the Graves? And remember, Xeno also trained there "alone" when he was
preparing for the Olympics too, if I recall correctly?
3. As to the master's not being worth it, being slow, well... so
what? This whole sport is about pushing yourself hard to the limits
mentally and physically and trying to improve. Because someone is
blessed with better genetics and younger age, so are able to go
faster, why does that mean others are less worthy? Are high schoolers
in basketball less worthy of support and encouragement because they
will never be able to play at the college or professional level?
Just some thoughts...
Helen Sanders
>
> 3. As to the master's not being worth it, being slow, well... so
> what? This whole sport is about pushing yourself hard to the limits
> mentally and physically and trying to improve. Because someone is
> blessed with better genetics and younger age, so are able to go
> faster, why does that mean others are less worthy? Are high schoolers
> in basketball less worthy of support and encouragement because they
> will never be able to play at the college or professional level?
>
> Just some thoughts...
I think it part of the reason why I prefer heads to regattas
sully
I specifically used the word "talent". talent may or may not be
realized.
She has a lot of room for improvement in rowing from what little
film I've seen, but she's got the physiology, and the toughness
and heart.
>
> 2. I thought Xeno was spending a lot of time in Newport working with
> the Graves? And remember, Xeno also trained there "alone" when he was
> preparing for the Olympics too, if I recall correctly?
a few years ago.
BTW, Xeno is an interesting contrast.
Xeno won the Olys in '96. He was fully funded by Swiss
and had coach come to Newport to work with him in the
run up to 2000.
>
> 3. As to the master's not being worth it, being slow, well... so
> what? This whole sport is about pushing yourself hard to the limits
> mentally and physically and trying to improve. Because someone is
> blessed with better genetics and younger age, so are able to go
> faster, why does that mean others are less worthy? Are high schoolers
> in basketball less worthy of support and encouragement because they
> will never be able to play at the college or professional level?
good questions.
It's not a question of worthiness. It's a question of
contribution. If you've read my contributions to this
thread, there are few who are more willing and
have put in the effort to teach older adults to row.
What are those limits?. For elites, it's the physical limits
of how much one can possibly train and progress,
and balancing the work loads so that they perform
at their lifetime peak and don't burn up.
For masters, it's fitting the work in around the job,
the family, and the vacation.
Jill Gardner
don't just "fit it in around ... the family & vacation", but put
training as a top priority. It's no less difficult for masters to
find the right balance. They have to worry about overtraining &
struggle to find the right balance between intense workouts and
recovery that let's them progress. This is a challenge at any age.
> What are those limits?. For elites, it's the physical limits
> of how much one can possibly train and progress,
> and balancing the work loads so that they perform
> at their lifetime peak and don't burn up.
>
> For masters, it's fitting the work in around the job,
> the family, and the vacation.
Perhaps you were in OKC with a shiny new shell ... but I think that's
a distorted view of the masters population! A lot of us struggle to
be able to afford these regattas. A vast number of masters are not
staying at top-of-the-line hotels, but at Best Westerns, some
distance from the venue. It might be a financial struggle to go to
these regattas, but we do that because we make rowing and training a
priority.
sully
> I know a number of masters who take their training very seriously, who
> don't just "fit it in around ... the family & vacation", but put
> training as a top priority. It's no less difficult for masters to
> find the right balance. They have to worry about overtraining &
> struggle to find the right balance between intense workouts and
> recovery that let's them progress. This is a challenge at any age.
everybody that rows.
There are no Masters rowers in the PNW
doing the year round training volumes that
Ursula Grobler and the other seattle lightweight
women are doing.
The masters men I know there that win all the
races train at a small percentage of the volumes
that they did when they were elites.
I'm sure there's an exception here or there, I
know quite a few older people who do a lot of training:
triathlons, ultra-running, swimmers, rowers, and
combinations. I know some ex-nat'l teamers who
exercise with fairly high volumes, not a single
one of them trains with the intensity and focus that
they did when they were elites.
Here's a question for you. You have $1000 that you
want to allocate to athletes that want to travel to
compete at a World Championship regatta.
You have two applicants for your grant. One is a
55 yr old Masters athlete who is very likely to medal
in a couple events. The other applicant is Ursula
who hopes to make the final in the lightweight double
at worlds.
How do you allocate your $1000 and why?
>
> > What are those limits?. For elites, it's the physical limits
> > of how much one can possibly train and progress,
> > and balancing the work loads so that they perform
> > at their lifetime peak and don't burn up.
>
> > For masters, it's fitting the work in around the job,
> > the family, and the vacation.
>
> Perhaps you were in OKC with a shiny new shell ... but I think that's
> a distorted view of the masters population! A lot of us struggle to
> be able to afford these regattas. A vast number of masters are not
> staying at top-of-the-line hotels, but at Best Westerns, some
> distance from the venue. It might be a financial struggle to go to
> these regattas, but we do that because we make rowing and training a
> priority.
I don't race in Masters races. At the RC club I generally pick the
least popular club single to row in, the one that is the most beat
up, and pick out a very old pair of macon sculls.
Most ppl like the nicer newer boats, I don't blame them.
At the Clear Lake club all of the boats are old rescued/repaired
shells often discarded from other clubs. That club doesn't have a
lot of expertise yet in rowing, they are slowly learning, so I
rotate
my rowing thru a different single every time to make sure it's in good
repair.
I have no doubt that there are a lot of people who are pinching
pennies
among masters rowers. At our RC club, there are quite a few people
who've stopped rowing as they're short of money, feel the club
and coaching fees are a luxury they can do without for a bit.
This doesn't change the fact that OKC hotels were sold out, and that
rowers who raced at the World Trials and/or NSRs could have easily
browsed through the inventory of boats at the Masters championships
and found better/newer boats than they were racing in.
How many people at OKC regatta train between 16-25 hrs weekly
for 11 months a year? Take a guess. I think there were
something like
1500 competitors there.
Pretty much everyone at trials did.