Browns lose #3
Jeff Nappi
the Browns would win this game but what I was hoping for was some signs
of life from the offense. The Browns did have a very impressive drive on
the ground the first time they had the ball, but Hoard promptly fumbled on
the KC ten, after that it was all down hill. The Browns had TWO block punts
returned for touchdowns, the bad part about this is Carson said they practiced
to prevent this last week! This is bad coaching, period!
Some offensive highlights:
-Bernie throws a beutiful strike to Metcalf that hits him in full stride,
Metcalf scoots 31 yards and promptly fumbles without anyone touching him.
-Both of the Browns blocked punts come from basically the same spot, Van
Waiters watches one guy run by him.
-Mack fumbles when the ball is ripped from his hand with the cast.
-Bernie and Metcalf collide when Bernie trys to hand him the ball, Bernie
levels Metcalf.
-Browns have third down, two to go and run Metcalf off tackle, loss of one,
Browns punt. Why the Browns continue to try this play amazes me.
-It goes on and on folks. This game was a real embarassment for the Browns
organization.
If Bud Carson is a defensive geneous than he has been getting his brain
picked clean. The Browns defense continues to get caught in the wrong
set, they gave up several big plays to KC that resulted in touchdowns.
Bright spots you ask...There are some. The combination of Hoard and Mack
did show some promise at the begining of the game. I like Hoard alot,
he is a tuff runner, he makes yardage when there is none there. The
offensive line has steadly improved its pass blocking, Bernie was sacked
once and seems to be getting more time to throw the ball.
Well the Browns will play Denver at Denver this coming Monday, the Browns
have not won in Denver since 1974. The Browns clearly should not win this
game and considering the dominance Denver has had over the Browns it looks
like loss number four or maybe this means the Browns will win easily?????
Nahhhhhhhh.
BTW: Frank Minifield has taken a physical with the Browns and you should
hear anytime soon that Minifield has come to terms with the Browns.
GO BROWNS........please
Borgeson
bandwidth on the prospects for a Browns win on Monday. The game will be
over by halftime and the result should be about the same as last week.
The Browns will score around 17-20 points tops.
I look at this way. The Browns have quickly hit a low point in the cycle.
The O-line can't be any worse and the coaching staff can't be more
disorganized. They are a year or two away from being a contender
again and this season is a write-off.
My opinion is that if they only spend one season in the dumps, then it's
worth it. If Carson and his staff have a good idea what they want to do
with the team, and the O-line turns out to be what is advertised as a
potentially great unit, then one developmental season is a reasonable price
to pay. However, if Carson has too many cooks, as Bill Walsh suggested
during last Sunday's game, and if the offensive line doesn't develop, then
the Browns will have to undergo yet another coaching change and a few
years of big losses and high draft choices to get back to contending.
As for this season, I think the most we can hope for is 6 wins. Count on it.
Any hope for playoffs is an unrealistic expectation at this point.
brett
Dale Mahoney
You know, it's terribly depressing when you see your favorite team, the one
you have always watched, finally let the brass ring slip by.
(All of you Viking and Rams fans can sympathize)
I don't know if I'll *ever* see the Browns in the Super Bowl.
To wit:
The Browns are a very mediocre team this year. Even great coaching is not
going to help them. The team itself has a lack of overall talent and this
dearth will continue to erode. Over the last five years, no other team in the
AFC, with the possible exception of the Broncos, has had more success than the
Browns, but they couldn't put it all together. As all Browns fans know, 1987
was the high-water mark year. I still believe that the Browns were the best
team in football that year. (Redskins fans and the 2nd quarter of the Super
Bowl notwithstanding.) I also believe that the Browns were dominating over
the Broncos and if Byner doesn't fumble... (ah, the magic "if") What has
happened since then:
Byner -- inexplicably, the most versitile back Cleveland had (rushing,
receiving, blocking) is forced out of Cleveland and they have *not*
come close to replacing him.
Infante -- leaves and heads for success (and more?) at Green Bay and leaves
Cleveland (& Bernie) without an offensive clue. I have not had any
confidence in the offensive production the past three years.
Marty -- is forced out after a season where he lost *all* of his skill
positions (Kosar, Mack, Slaughter) and **STILL** made the playoffs.
Dixon and Minifield -- either retire or are forced out and no replacement
has been found. These guys were the cornerstone of the defense; the
Browns could afford to have no pass rush since the corners were
always covered.
The OL -- was neglected to the point of desperation. I'm sorry folks, OLs
don't often change more than *one* person at a time and to bring back
only one starter from '89 shows me a healthy neglect to the most
vital unit on the field.
Recent Draft Picks -- have not plugged the holes in the offense or
defensive backfield. Lawyer Tillman was a bust and Metcalf, although
I like his running, will never be a full-time halfback. He is simply
to easy to take down. Running back kickoffs and catching all types
of passes from the slot may be the best use of him. But a Mack-Metcalf
backfield fails to complement either.
Now here comes the beef. I have only one person to blame for the Browns
failure -- Art Modell. Modell forced out Schottenheimer in a personality
confict (offensive coor. indeed). If only Modell could get over his
embarrassment from other owners for not making the Super Bowl and keep his
hands out of the daily business of the team, maybe he would have already seen
his desire. The only other satisfaction I will get this year besides watching
Modell explode (to the possible injury of Bud) will be watching a recent
Browns head coach play a team owned by the Browns' namesake (and also fired
by Modell) for the right to go to the Super Bowl. (K.C. and Cincy) I cannot
respect anyone who could so easily fire Paul Brown. It's enough to make me
move to Cincinnati (ooh yuck!!:) )
I'm terribly disappointed with the Browns (more for the last 5 years than
this year), but I'll always be a die-hard fan. Maybe now we'll seen end of the
Dawg pound foolishness (No "top dawg" anymore!)
--
news accounting id
> (talking about why the Browns have gone down hill)
>
> Recent Draft Picks -- have not plugged the holes in the offense or
> defensive backfield. Lawyer Tillman was a bust and Metcalf, although
> I like his running, will never be a full-time halfback. He is simply
> to easy to take down. Running back kickoffs and catching all types
> of passes from the slot may be the best use of him. But a Mack-Metcalf
> backfield fails to complement either.
>
Path: ismdqa!gottlieb
I believe the jury is still out on Tillman. I think Metcalf is great. Of
course he will never be a full time halfback (the backfield of Mack, Hoard
looks promising). However, it is extrememly valuable to have a player that
can turn a game on one play. Also, the high picks for the last two years
(Tillman, Metcalf, and Hoard) are a lot better than the ones from the last
years of Marty (Clifford Charlton and Mike Junkin).
> Now here comes the beef. I have only one person to blame for the Browns
>failure -- Art Modell.
I definitely agree on this point. I don't know how Modell expects the team to
win (and have any kind of an offense) when they keep chaging offensive
coordinators. I think the team was demolished the year Marty left. They lost
Marty, Byner, and Herman Fontenot.
-bob
Jeff Martens
[ ... ]
> Dixon and Minifield -- either retire or are forced out and no replacement
> has been found. These guys were the cornerstone of the defense; the
> Browns could afford to have no pass rush since the corners were
> always covered.
Minnifield and his inflated ego are back with the team.
[ ... ]
> Recent Draft Picks -- have not plugged the holes in the offense or
> defensive backfield. Lawyer Tillman was a bust and Metcalf, although
> I like his running, will never be a full-time halfback. He is simply
> to easy to take down. Running back kickoffs and catching all types
> of passes from the slot may be the best use of him. But a Mack-Metcalf
> backfield fails to complement either.
First, although the Lawyer Tillman trade looked very bad on paper
(from the Browns point of view; being a Packer fan in Brownsland I
thought it was great from day 1, and it's looking even better
nowadays), it's way too early to call Tillman a bust. He's been hurt
each of the past two years, which is bad, but he could still come on
and be a productive player.
Also, I think that rather than saying Metcalf "is too easy to bring
down," I think it would be fairer to say that Metcalf takes himself
down whenever it looks like he might get hit. He'll never be a good
(or even average) halfback. He'd probably make a very dangerous
H-back, or a good smurf-type wideout.
--
-- Jeff (mar...@cis.ohio-state.edu)
Dan Quayle on education: "We're going to have
the best educated American people in the world."
Jeff Nappi
> There's not much good to say, so I won't say much. I won't even waste much
> bandwidth on the prospects for a Browns win on Monday. The game will be
> over by halftime and the result should be about the same as last week.
> The Browns will score around 17-20 points tops.
I agree Brett, the Browns can't even beat Denver when they field a team
that is half-way decent. The Browns have lost seven strait in Denver
and it should be eight strait by Mid-night. HOWEVER, the Browns are
a very dangerous team right now they have absolutly nothing to lose and
nothing going for them so they are about ready to beat the hell out of
someone, maybe not Denver but somebody soon.
>
> As for this season, I think the most we can hope for is 6 wins. Count on it.
> Any hope for playoffs is an unrealistic expectation at this point.
Rumors are flying in Cleveburg that Carson days are numbered, NFL Today
stated that if the Browns lose to Denver big, Carson is gone. One of the
local radio stations said that Carson was going to step down after the
KC game but was talked out of it by his family. If Carson is fired then
Art Modell is the biggest JACKASS to ever run a football team. I think
it is something of a Miracle that the Browns have been one of the better
teams in the NFL for the past six years considering they have not had
any real good draft picks and an revolving door on offensive coordinators.
The Browns have the talent, they need to make some changes but nothing
drastic. The biggest problem right now is Modell's patience, is he
willing to wright this season off and let the coaching staff put this
team back on the track? I think not.
>
> brett
Jeff Nappi
>
>
> Byner -- inexplicably, the most versitile back Cleveland had (rushing,
> receiving, blocking) is forced out of Cleveland and they have *not*
> come close to replacing him.
personal fouls in the playoff game against Houston. Byner cost the Browns one
to many times.
>
> Infante -- leaves and heads for success (and more?) at Green Bay and leaves
> Cleveland (& Bernie) without an offensive clue. I have not had any
Infante was way to talented to be assistant coach.
>
> Marty -- is forced out after a season where he lost *all* of his skill
Both sides are to blame in this one.
>
> Dixon and Minifield -- either retire or are forced out and no replacement
> always covered.
These guys are also getting old, believe me Dixon was not going to start if
he stayed with the Browns. Clayborn was picked up because he still has good
speed something Dixon lacked big time. Minifield acted like a big baby when
his buddy Dixon was cut.
>
> The OL -- was neglected to the point of desperation. I'm sorry folks, OLs
>
Your are right on this one, Modell and Accorsi new they would lose at least
three starting offensive lineman and yet they did absolutly nothing. I agree
that there was not much in the draft but there was some veteran offensive
lineman that they could have used to bring along the rookies , Max Montoya
comes to mind. Why the Browns did not go after him is beyond me.
>
> Now here comes the beef. I have only one person to blame for the Browns
> failure -- Art Modell. Modell forced out Schottenheimer in a personality
Alot of people in Cleveland feel that as long as Art Modell owns the Browns
there will never be a Superbowl ring in Cleveland.
GOD!!! Hang in there it will never get bad enough that you are thinking of
moving to Ciny!!!
Ray Chen
>Also, I think that rather than saying Metcalf "is too easy to bring
>down," I think it would be fairer to say that Metcalf takes himself
>down whenever it looks like he might get hit. He'll never be a good
>(or even average) halfback. He'd probably make a very dangerous
>H-back, or a good smurf-type wideout.
Doubt it:
H-back -- has to block. If Metcalf can't block, he becomes much
less useful in this position.
He'd be a good smurf-type WR until DBs realized that he gets
alligator arms going over the middle. After that, he might
catch balls, but not when it counts.
Byner, on the other hand, is a good H-back. His one drawback
is that he might a bit small/light. In the Skins system, that
doesn't matter because he spends a lot of time at RB. Bavaro
or Jackson would be great H-backs.
Whatever happened to Mike Oliphaunt anyway?
Ray Chen
ch...@cc.gatech.edu
Ray Flanery
Way to go Bronco's, way to Go!!! (heh, heh, heh)
Hey, was that Bernie Kosar out passing the not-so-great Denver
QB? I think so! How's your body feeling Atwater? Did little Kevin
Mack hit you too hard?
Go Browns!!!!!!!!!!!! Ray Flanery Jr.
R.Jayakrishnan
> I agree Brett, the Browns can't even beat Denver when they field a team
> that is half-way decent. The Browns have lost seven strait in Denver
> and it should be eight strait by Mid-night. HOWEVER, the Browns are
> a very dangerous team right now they have absolutly nothing to lose and
> nothing going for them so they are about ready to beat the hell out of
> someone, maybe not Denver but somebody soon.
The Dawgs are still alive and barking. How does 30-29 look ?
But you were right that the Browns are a dangerous team...
>> brett
Jay R. Jayakrishnan jay...@emx.utexas.edu
Go Cowboys (Browns too) ! Go Horns ! Go Rangers !
Theresa Babrauckas
very frustrating also. The special teams still need much work, but thank God
it only cost them 2 points (well, really 3, but Kauric's PAT failure was
because his foot slipped on the wet field).
Needless to say, I'm happy with the game Cleveland played last night. The
Offensive line is shaping up nicely. Bernie had a great night with NO sacks!
So to all you Bernie Bashers out there - think again!!
The last 4 minutes of the game were awesome. The Denver defense couldn't
believe what they were seeing - I almost couldn't believe what I was seeing!
The last TD to Brennan happened SO fast! There were some good plays called.
And the defense after the TD stuffed Elways smile where the sun don't shine.
Everyone of the Browns played with such passion. After Kauric's field goal,
I felt like they had just won the AFC championship and were on their way to
the Superbowl.
To all you doubting Thomas', "It ain't over till it's over."
With the Browns all the way,
Theresa
--
*******************************************************************************
* Theresa L. Babrauckas * NASA Lewis Research Center *
* fst...@csduts1.lerc.nasa.gov * Cleveland, OH 44135 *
*******************************************************************************
Borgeson
didn't think the Browns had a shot on Monday night. The only consolation
is that I wasn't the only one. The Browns obviously played their best
game this season on Monday. No matter how you look at it, a win over Denver
at Mile High is impressive.
Before I jump on the bandwagon, though, I think a truer test of the "new OL"
and the running game will come this Sunday. The Browns generally play
well when they have something on the line or something to prove, as was
the case on Monday night. In addition, Denver's defense is not the greatest,
particularly their pass rush. The Saints will be coming hard and fast
at Bernie on Sunday. The Browns must be able to run on New Orleans if they
have any hope of winning the game. They also must avoid early mistakes.
I didn't see the second half, but I did see the replay of the last drive
on ESPN yesterday evening. It was unbelievable how Kosar was lighting it
up. The catch by Joines was basically the ball game, in my opinion. It
was a high risk play in my opinion, going for the big play on 4th and 2,
to a 3rd string receiver. Joines made a great catch, though, and he was
wide open, too.
As usual, the Browns are keeping their fans on a yo-yo...
brett
Jeff Nappi
> Oh, ye of little faith.
>
> I suppose now every Browns fan in the country will come out of the closet
> singing the praises of Bernie, Brian, Webster, and the newly conformed
> offensive line. How fickle we are. If our team doesn't come out and
> blow people off the field then their season is over. Doesn't it
> seem odd to anyone that the nucleous of this squad is exactly the same
> as that from the previous 2-3 years? Why now do they stink when last year
> everyone was singing their praises? The Browns, like the Steelers were in
> desparate need of confidence. They both received it this week. Only time
> will tell whether this was a fluke. I tend to beleive that they're over
> the hump. They may not make the playoffs because it took them awhile to
> get it together along with a killer schedule but they'll be a contender.
> My, what a difference a day makes!
>
>
>
If you want blind faith loyalty go root for a Collage team. I have been
a Browns fan for many years and the last three weeks they played as bad
as a team could play. Make no mistake the Browns played a hell of a good
game at Mile High, they still made mistakes but they overcame them. The
Browns deserved the criticism they got because they are alot better team
than they were showing, perhaps this criticism woke them up. The Saints
are going to tell us if the game against Denver was just a fluke or the
real comback trail.
GO BROWNS.....