They really ought to let women play baseball ...
Tonawanda Kardex
tom_sa...@yahoo.com
wrote:
> Softball is a silly spr0t.
I don't know ... but I'm wondering if a baseball pitcher would try
throwing underhand with no stress on the arm and the whip that they
get as a result. Could you imagine a pitcher being able to throw 9
innings with no stress on the arm instead of these guys who can only
last 2-3 innings?
uncd...@gmail.com
Latino women, in particular, bring a depth of experience to the game
that would enable them to render a more valiant effort than their
white male counterparts. Doubly so if they are dykes.
J. Hugh Sullivan
<tonawan...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Softball is a silly spr0t.
Your statement certainly proves two things...
1. You never pitched in a fast pitch league
2. You never batted against a good female pitcher in fast pitch.
A 67 mph pitch is roughly the equivalent of a 90+ mph fastball in
baseball.
When I played softball everything was a fast ball (I usually pitched).
Now the ball goes up, down and sideways. The last year I played I
batted almost .500; I couldn't bat .250 against even female pitchers
today. On second thought, considering my age, I probably couldn't even
get a foul tip.
Hugh
Tonawanda Kardex
> On Fri, 29 May 2009 20:24:14 -0700 (PDT), Tonawanda Kardex
>
> >Softball is a silly spr0t.
>
> Your statement certainly proves two things...
> 1. You never pitched in a fast pitch league
> 2. You never batted against a good female pitcher in fast pitch.
>
> A 67 mph pitch is roughly the equivalent of a 90+ mph fastball in
> baseball.
>
> When I played softball everything was a fast ball (I usually pitched).
> Now the ball goes up, down and sideways. The last year I played I
> batted almost .500; I couldn't bat .250 against even female pitchers
> today. On second thought, considering my age, I probably couldn't even
> get a foul tip.
Softball is dangerous, because of the shorter distances and the speeds
you note -- not to mention the continued use of aluminum bats.
unklbob
wrote:
I know that your poast is mostly bate, but the two games are
significantly different, mainly because 1) girls focus better than
boys earlier and learn better strategies/techniques earlier than
boys. A game with 9-10 yo girls is exciting, while a boys game can be
excruciating. 2) The quickness of the game require split second
reactions--girls are taught to come up throwing after fielding a ball
in one quick motion. You'll see pickoffs and tagouts at the plate
routinely, while such plays in the boy's game are a rarity. 3) The
quickness of the game requires that all the players are aware of
pitching strategy, and the likelyhood that a pitch will be hit to a
certain part of the field. Of course baseball players do the same,
but that skill comes much later to the boys, since baseball pitchers
are less likely to locate pitches at a young age than softball
players. 4) Boys are limited for the most part to 2 to 4 pitches
until they are old enough to start the breaking stuff. Girls as young
as 10 can learn screwballs, curveballs, and about four kinds of
changeups of various speeds.
By the time they hit college, the average female player is better at
her sport than the average male is at his.
Tonawanda Kardex
Perhaps, and it wasn't bait.
I have friends who play semi-pro women's softball, and it's dangerous.
J. Hugh Sullivan
Almost any sport is dangerous. I broke my ankle 4 times and none were
from contact.
The speeds can't compare with males. I batted several times against
Eddie Feignor (The King and his Court) and against a pitcher who won a
number of games in National Championships. You can see the ball when a
girl pitches!
I never used an aluminum bat so I have no feel for that.
"To each his own" but I enjoy watching girl's softball at the college
level. The UCLA pitcher in the last Olympics and Cat Osterman were
really good. UTinny had a good one, too.
Hugh
Anthony Summers
> >Softball is dangerous, because of the shorter distances and the speeds
> >you note -- not to mention the continued use of aluminum bats.
>
> Almost any sport is dangerous. I broke my ankle 4 times and none were
> from contact.
Back-pedaling after you referred to another competitor with a racist
slur doesn't count as a sports injury, Hugh.
--
A. Summers || summerstorm0007-->at<--yahoo.com
jimbr...@yahoo.com
EWE RACIST BASSTURD.
Oh, wait...ne'er mind.
J. Hugh Sullivan
<summers...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>On Sun, 31 May 2009 15:45:42 GMT, J. Hugh Sullivan wrote...
>
>> >Softball is dangerous, because of the shorter distances and the speeds
>> >you note -- not to mention the continued use of aluminum bats.
>>
>> Almost any sport is dangerous. I broke my ankle 4 times and none were
>> from contact.
>
>Back-pedaling after you referred to another competitor with a racist
>slur doesn't count as a sports injury, Hugh.
The only way you would be a sport is if you were circumsized with
pinking shears.
Hugh
tom_sa...@yahoo.com
> The speeds can't compare with males. I batted several times against
> Eddie Feignor (The King and his Court) and against a pitcher who won a
> number of games in National Championships. You can see the ball when a
> girl pitches!
>
Where do you see the ball? Some girls have a significant backswing,
but by daughter does not. So I'm curious from where you are seeing
the ball.
J. Hugh Sullivan
I have not played for years but when I played regularly I would pick
it up when it left the hand.
Remember, too, that there was essentially one pitch at the time and
all deliveries were about the same. Today's herky-jerk motion would
seem to be tougher to me.
There is also a difference between a practiced athlete and a natural
athlete. Of course a natural has to practice but he loses a lot if he
tries to "do it by the book".
Hugh
tom_sa...@yahoo.com
> I have not played for years but when I played regularly I would pick
> it up when it left the hand.
>
Wouldn't that be the same for Feignor?
At one time, I believed that the backswing "gave away" a pitch, but
that doesn't seem to be the case. I've seen the high-level college
girls do it too.
> Remember, too, that there was essentially one pitch at the time and
> all deliveries were about the same. Today's herky-jerk motion would
> seem to be tougher to me.
TMML. I have a hard time catching my daughter, but it has nothing to
do with her motion and everything to do with the combination of speed
and wildness. Over the head, off the shin, far-left, far-right.
She's too close for me sometimes. :-)
>
> There is also a difference between a practiced athlete and a natural
> athlete. Of course a natural has to practice but he loses a lot if he
> tries to "do it by the book".
>
In watching the CWS, there are all kinds of motions, but most can
bring it 68MPH or so. That's fast from ~40 feet or so.
> Hugh
J. Hugh Sullivan
>On Jun 1, 9:41 am, Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
>> I have not played for years but when I played regularly I would pick
>> it up when it left the hand.
>>
>
>Wouldn't that be the same for Feignor?
I faced Feignor probably 50 years ago. He pitched from the rubber and
from second base. He could make the ball move. But he was only in town
one night. I suspect he threw well over 70 mph.
>
>At one time, I believed that the backswing "gave away" a pitch, but
>that doesn't seem to be the case. I've seen the high-level college
>girls do it too.
>
>> Remember, too, that there was essentially one pitch at the time and
>> all deliveries were about the same. Today's herky-jerk motion would
>> seem to be tougher to me.
>
>TMML. I have a hard time catching my daughter, but it has nothing to
>do with her motion and everything to do with the combination of speed
>and wildness. Over the head, off the shin, far-left, far-right.
>She's too close for me sometimes. :-)
I was wild high and low - my release point was erratic. I never threw
anything but fast balls, always with the same motion. My speed carried
me except when facing a top team.
>In watching the CWS, there are all kinds of motions, but most can
>bring it 68MPH or so. That's fast from ~40 feet or so.
Seems like I recall a few years ago that one of the best female
pitchers faced some pro baseball players. As I recall they seemed to
have a tougher time with her than in the pros. But the ball is coming
from a different angle and moving differently.
I refused to play slow pitch when that was the going jesse.
Hugh
Gozer the Traveler
Eddie Feigner on line one...
--
TO
That Don Guy
> Tonawanda Kardex wrote:
>> Softball is a silly spr0t.
>
>Eddie Feigner on line one...
Besides - where CAN'T women play baseball?
(In California high schools, for example, a girl who is good enough to
make the team is allowed to play, since there is no organized "girls'
baseball". (On the other hand, girls are not allowed to play boys'
basketball if the school has a girls' team.))
-- Don
___________________________________________________________
There are no solutions, only clarifications of the problems
Thomas R. Kettler
That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
in Baseball." She'd talk to MLB players (such as A-Rod or Barry Bondes)
and throw pitches to them from the standard softball pitchers' mound.
She could throw up to 70 mph (although Cat Osterman, Lisa Fernandez and
Lisa Ishikawa were likely better pitchers) and would routinely strikeout
the MLB players.
Note: in fairness, most softball pitchers would not be allowed to pitch
the way they do in MLB since they typically do not stop during their
windup. If a MLB pitcher did this, he'd be called for a balk if anyone
was on base as a discernaible stop is required.
--
Remove blown from email address to reply.
tom_sa...@yahoo.com
> That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
> in Baseball."
I saw her on a sports science show. They had a minor league pitcher
who could throw 95 or so and her. The first test was to throw at a
pressure sensor from standard distances. He threw and they got a
reading on his fastball. She threw and smashed the plate.
>
> Note: in fairness, most softball pitchers would not be allowed to pitch
> the way they do in MLB since they typically do not stop during their
> windup. If a MLB pitcher did this, he'd be called for a balk if anyone
> was on base as a discernaible stop is required.
There are a bunch of differences, not only the continual movement, but
picking the ball up at a different spot is much different, the ball
movement as a result is much different and there is no "stretch"
motion for the softball pitchers. And the fact that a softball
pitcher can go for 300+ pitches in a weekend without any comparable
stress that a baseball pitcher feels.
J. Hugh Sullivan
<tket...@blownfuse.net> wrote:
>In article <4a242327...@newsgroups.bellsouth.net>,
> Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
>> Seems like I recall a few years ago that one of the best female
>> pitchers faced some pro baseball players. As I recall they seemed to
>> have a tougher time with her than in the pros. But the ball is coming
>> from a different angle and moving differently.
>
>That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
>in Baseball." She'd talk to MLB players (such as A-Rod or Barry Bondes)
>and throw pitches to them from the standard softball pitchers' mound.
>She could throw up to 70 mph (although Cat Osterman, Lisa Fernandez and
>Lisa Ishikawa were likely better pitchers) and would routinely strikeout
>the MLB players.
Thank you for reminding me of Finch and Fernandez. The latter was
probably the best. Is she still pitching?
Hugh
Thomas R. Kettler
Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
> On Tue, 02 Jun 2009 21:47:57 -0400, "Thomas R. Kettler"
> <tket...@blownfuse.net> wrote:
>
> >In article <4a242327...@newsgroups.bellsouth.net>,
> > Ea...@bellsouth.net (J. Hugh Sullivan) wrote:
>
> >> Seems like I recall a few years ago that one of the best female
> >> pitchers faced some pro baseball players. As I recall they seemed to
> >> have a tougher time with her than in the pros. But the ball is coming
> >> from a different angle and moving differently.
> >
> >That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
> >in Baseball." She'd talk to MLB players (such as A-Rod or Barry Bondes)
> >and throw pitches to them from the standard softball pitchers' mound.
> >She could throw up to 70 mph (although Cat Osterman, Lisa Fernandez and
> >Lisa Ishikawa were likely better pitchers) and would routinely strikeout
> >the MLB players.
>
> Thank you for reminding me of Finch and Fernandez. The latter was
> probably the best. Is she still pitching?
Here is Lisa Fernandez' website: <http://www.lisafernandez16.com/>
Thomas R. Kettler
<285477e3-5a88-45e2...@e20g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>,
"tom_sa...@yahoo.com" <tom_sa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> On Jun 2, 9:47 pm, "Thomas R. Kettler" <tkett...@blownfuse.net> wrote:
> > That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
> > in Baseball."
>
> I saw her on a sports science show. They had a minor league pitcher
> who could throw 95 or so and her. The first test was to throw at a
> pressure sensor from standard distances. He threw and they got a
> reading on his fastball. She threw and smashed the plate.
>
I'm not surprised. However, on page 10 of Jayson Stark's book, "The
Stark Truth: The Most Overrated and Underrated Players in Baseball
History", it says that Bob Feller wiped out a camera filming him
pitching from 60'6" while a motorcycle also went by at 86 mph. They
estimated the pitch to go at 104 mph.
> >
> > Note: in fairness, most softball pitchers would not be allowed to pitch
> > the way they do in MLB since they typically do not stop during their
> > windup. If a MLB pitcher did this, he'd be called for a balk if anyone
> > was on base as a discernaible stop is required.
>
> There are a bunch of differences, not only the continual movement, but
> picking the ball up at a different spot is much different, the ball
> movement as a result is much different and there is no "stretch"
> motion for the softball pitchers. And the fact that a softball
> pitcher can go for 300+ pitches in a weekend without any comparable
> stress that a baseball pitcher feels.
The underhanded motion of pitching induces far less stress on the arm.
Eddie Feigner is proof of that.
J. Hugh Sullivan
<tket...@blownfuse.net> wrote:
>In article
><285477e3-5a88-45e2...@e20g2000vbc.googlegroups.com>,
> "tom_sa...@yahoo.com" <tom_sa...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> On Jun 2, 9:47 pm, "Thomas R. Kettler" <tkett...@blownfuse.net> wrote:
>> > That would have been Jennie Finch when she was involved with "This Week
>> > in Baseball."
>>
>> I saw her on a sports science show. They had a minor league pitcher
>> who could throw 95 or so and her. The first test was to throw at a
>> pressure sensor from standard distances. He threw and they got a
>> reading on his fastball. She threw and smashed the plate.
>>
>I'm not surprised. However, on page 10 of Jayson Stark's book, "The
>Stark Truth: The Most Overrated and Underrated Players in Baseball
>History", it says that Bob Feller wiped out a camera filming him
>pitching from 60'6" while a motorcycle also went by at 86 mph. They
>estimated the pitch to go at 104 mph.
That sounds a bit high to me for Feller. He pitched for Great Lakes in
1945 while he was in the Navy - I saw him several times. As I recall
he was about 101 mph but not with a radar gun.
Thanks for the Lisa url - I thought she was coaching for UCLA but
apparently not.
Hugh
Edward M. Kennedy
> That sounds a bit high to me for Feller. He pitched for Great Lakes in
> 1945 while he was in the Navy - I saw him several times. As I recall
> he was about 101 mph but not with a radar gun.
You should print that out and recycle it. As if you could
eyeball something like that...
--Tedward
J. Hugh Sullivan
wrote:
There were a number of pros on the field playing for G'Lakes. Walker
Cooper was catching and I think he was the one who said it. It might
have been one of the visiting team members - Cubs or Phillies (the
Connie Mack group).
Hugh