Why are tournaments not self-observed?
Frank
have players from teams with byes observe games.
I've heard a few excuses like "they need to prepare for their next
game", "they're tired", 'they'll be distracted", etc. but those don't
really cut it compared to the benefits.
Benefits would be that every game has two observers, more players
would have respect for how hard the job is because they're doing it,
the rules and standards would become more homogenized, the pool of
qualified observers would grow and more players would understand the
rules. Plus you wouldn't have to use tournament money to hire
observers, you could spend it on hookers instead.
But the best would be that the cream rises to the top. In other
words, by the quarters, semis and finals of a tournament, through a
referral/rating process, the best observers from the weekend would end
up working the games that matter most.
ulticritic
i think this is just too progressive of a concept for the upa to
grasp.......or too overwhelimg........too somthing. and people have
this strange idea that if the upa isnt on board with it or the ones
instituting it then its just not gonna get done, or wothy of persuing,
or whatever.. where at the same time its the upa admin that is
historically REactive to trends set by independents I believe its
curently mike, jason and the boys at the uoa that are blazing the
trail in the "cooperative observer concept" for the upa.
jacob
pretty interesting idea, actually. it would give players an incentive
to really know the rules, and in theory, would decrease the number of
bullshit calls since accountability translates not only to play on the
field, but also how you judge the game. a few thoughts.
- would tournament schedules have to change? you'd have to give player/
observers enough time to physically and mentally prepare for their
next game, and games that go to the hard cap would require the
observers to be focused on observing the game. not being able to warm
up with your team robs you of a chance to physically and mentally
prepare to play your game.
i suppose it could be understood that bye teams will have to warm up
for their next game without some players, but i think that's a legit
concern.
- how do all these players get certified? would reggie have to take
the UOA on the road to get every team in every section to have enough
certified observers on each team to observe a tournament?
- how do you account for objectivity. regional rivals would be
observing each others' games. fairness in calls would always be in
question.
still, an interesting idea.
Reggie Fanelli
> the UOA on the road to get every team in every section to have enough
> certified observers on each team to observe a tournament?
---they wouldn't HAVE to be certified......especially to BEGIN with.
The UOA could go on the road...or every team could come to one of our
events and give it a try...if WE give it a try.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
> - how do you account for objectivity. regional rivals would be
> observing each others' games. fairness in calls would always be in
> question.
---how do you EVER account for objectivity????
spirit of the game.......????
Frank
There's a couple of directions I could go with this argument. 1)
being an observer will actually increase your readiness rather than
decrease it. You'll be mentally sharp and instead of sitting around
for an hour getting stiff, you'll be moving around keeping warm. 2)
also, with roster limits at 27, you'd think that you'd be able to make
team sacrifices that over all benefited the group at large.
> i suppose it could be understood that bye teams will have to warm up
> for their next game without some players, but i think that's a legit
> concern.
Not sure about this but if you consider the risk/reward or the costs/
benefits, I think the advantages here far outweigh the negatives.
> - how do all these players get certified?
FUCK certification and FUCK the UPA. Excuse my french. The UPA
certified me as a referee 30 years ago the first time I stepped on the
field. If players can't perform the role of observers than how the
hell was SOTG ever going to work?
> would reggie have to take
> the UOA on the road to get every team in every section to have enough
> certified observers on each team to observe a tournament?
Mike, make a video. Players around the world; learn by doing. Just
get out there and see what its like. Being an observer/player at a
tournament is community service work. Volunteer a few hours of your
own time to help out with the bigger picture.
> - how do you account for objectivity. regional rivals would be
> observing each others' games. fairness in calls would always be in
> question.
And that would be different from the current system how? Like I said,
the system auto-balances.
We have real refs in Dischoops and the one thing that stands out
immediately is the difference between a good ref and a bad ref. The
cream rises to the top and the best observers will be the most
impartial.
>
> still, an interesting idea.
thanks.
ulticritic
>
> still, an interesting idea
but, like frank said, not original. when i was in college the lax
club team had a "coop" system where teams would hve to supply players
to ref on their buys, and they had to get certified too. i believe
they might have even got paid ($75 per game maybe). they had
tighter , single elim formats though (fewer overall games). and in
the mid eighties some guys on our team played some competitive beach
vollyball and they reffed on their buys too. The td would pre
shcedule who reffed when......and they played a shit ton of games in
their formats.
so as progressive as the things are mike is doing they could have
instituted these standards from the get go. I think its killer that
this opportunity has waited for mike to come around and sieze it, he
is definitely deserving of being a figurehead in the area of the
evolution of officials in ultimate. still seems like the changes are
sublte enough that they could have been initiated 10, 20, even 40
years ago.