Jones wants Collins!
Johnboy
Maybe Roy Jones has finally come to his senses. He is talking about
getting Steve Collins out of retirement, and also fighting
Michalczweski. I like Jones a lot, but he needs to wake up and realize
that no one is going to call him great just because his skills shine.
Jones may be the best puond for pound, and his competition may pale by
comparison, but he still has to do the dirty job of beating that
competition to get recognition.
Anyway, here is the story:
DUBLIN, Ireland (Oct 8, 1997 - 16:05 EDT) -- WBC light-heavyweight
champion Roy Jones Jr. wants to fight Ireland's
Steve Collins, who announced his surprise retirement last week.
Collins, the former WBO super-middleweight champ, said he regretted
never having fought the American champion.
Jones' spokesman and publicist, Greg Fritz, said Wednesday the fight can
still happen.
"Roy has wanted to fight Steve for some time and if the money is right
he will," Fritz said. "He wants Steve to come out of
retirement to fight him."
Fritz said Jones would have to get $5 million for the fight.
"We are prepared to come to Dublin, Belfast, Boston, wherever he wants
to fight," Fritz said. "At this moment, I'm just waiting
for his call. The fight can be made."
In the meantime, Fritz said, negotiations are underway for Jones to
fight Germany's WBO light-heavyweight champion Dariusz
Michalczewski.
Johnboy
pliesenberg
Johnboy (Joh...@zzapp.org) wrote:
: Maybe Roy Jones has finally come to his senses. He is talking about
: getting Steve Collins out of retirement, and also fighting
: Michalczweski. I like Jones a lot, but he needs to wake up and realize
: that no one is going to call him great just because his skills shine.
: Jones may be the best puond for pound, and his competition may pale by
: comparison, but he still has to do the dirty job of beating that
: competition to get recognition.
Collins, in his prime, was totally outboxed by, among others,
an ageing Mike McCallum. It's no disgrace, but it comes to
show that it's not the type of opponent that'd turn Jones
into a legend. Jones has allowed some golden opportunites
to walk the walk pass him by - not fighting Benn when the
latter was clamoring for a bout was unforgivable, and stupid
considering Benn was quite beatable. Not fighting Eubank
when the latter was at his prime was also another wasted
opportunity. Now the division is attritioned, and sudenly
he notices he needs opponents...
...paul
Johnboy
Alejandro Olague (Alejandro Olague) wrote:>
>
> ...Which is a bunch of bullsh*t. A Collins fight is NOT worth enough
> for Jones to get 5 million. He's and his people are blowing smoke up
> people's asses. NOW that Collins is in retirement he says that he
> wants to fight him, but only if he gets 5 million. How about talking
> about these fight when the guys are active and not demanding
> outrageous sums of money which he can't command and probably can't be
> met?
I agree. Jones, best PfP in the world, is wrapped up with this "Show me
the money" metality. He simply doesn't see that it takes hard work to
get the bucks he is asking for. Most major basketball stars with major
salaries go out and face off with the best. Oscar De La Hoya fights
mostly big fights, as does Evander Holyfield. Jones has fought enough
big fights that people who see a lot of HBO boxing know who is is. He
still has a ways to go before he can, with a little personality, make
himself into a major star. Until that day, no bu money for Roy Jones JR,
no matter how good he is.
Of course, the obvious (but not simple) answer to all of this is to
unify the titles in one division. It worked for Hagler.
Johnboy
John T. Spillane
Subject:
Re: Jones wants Collins!
Date:
Thu, 9 Oct 1997 16:14:27 +0100
From:
"Gearoid O'Sullivan" <gea...@shannon.ucd.ie>
To:
JUAN <jspi...@lucent.com>
Johnno post this up as a reply to pliesenberg's mail..
As far as I know Collins fought Mike McCallum in the
late eighties when McCallum was in his prime. The fight
went the distance, Collins lost on the decision and McCallum
said after he'd never fight Collins again. Then only recently
an ageing (9 years later) McCallum fought Jones (best P4P) and
went the distance. Collins came into his prime when he beat
Eubank twice by bullying him around the ring using his strength
and not allowing Eubank to settle into his rhythm. Then Benn came
out of retirement and lost twice to Collins first due to a twisted
ankle and the second time when he didn't come out of his corner
coz he was exhausted and beaten by the sixth round.
Collins has two things going for him, his physical strength and
his mental strength. Nobody scares him. He's never been stopped
and only been on the canvas twice in two fights which he went on
to win. Jones would be taking a big risk on his best P4P title and
best all time boxer status by fighting Collins. So instead of
saying no to a fight just ask for $5 million to save some face and
keep fooling the public... In my book that makes him a phoney
and a chickenshit. Anyway Collins has two court cases against
the Petronellibrothers and Barry Hearn this week which if he loses
could see him back sooner than expected..
Beast of Bourbon
On Wed, 08 Oct 1997 20:41:43 -0400, Johnboy reported:
>"Roy has wanted to fight Steve for some time and if the money is right
>he will," Fritz said. "He wants Steve to come out of
>retirement to fight him."
>
>Fritz said Jones would have to get $5 million for the fight.
>
>"We are prepared to come to Dublin, Belfast, Boston, wherever he wants
>to fight," Fritz said. "At this moment, I'm just waiting
>for his call. The fight can be made."
YES!! DO IT!!
plies...@bix.com
In article <343E02...@lucent.com>,
"John T. Spillane" <jspi...@lucent.com>
& "Gearoid O'Sullivan" <gea...@shannon.ucd.ie> wrote:
> As far as I know Collins fought Mike McCallum in the
> late eighties when McCallum was in his prime.
McCallum and Collins fought in 1990. It is a matter of perception, but
McCallum had a lot of bouts under his belt already, and I do think he was
already past his (awesome) prime. He'd been beaten by Sumbu Kalambay (no
disgrace, Kalambay at his best was a *very* fine boxer) and not looked
too hot against Herol Graham. Still, Collins looked utterly hopeless
against McCallum. It was a *very* one-sided fight.
> ... The fight
> went the distance, Collins lost on the decision and McCallum
> said after he'd never fight Collins again.
I doubt *that*. It's not like Collins gave him a very hard time, and for
the right money, McCallum is known to take on anybody. It's outrageous to
claim McCallum has ducked any other fighter. You sure could make your
point more convincingly. If you tell me Jones os so avoid fighting
someone... OK. But McCallum avoiding another fighter? No %$#@! way,
sorry.
> Then only recently
> an ageing (9 years later) McCallum fought Jones (best P4P) and
> went the distance. Collins came into his prime when he beat
> Eubank twice by bullying him around the ring using his strength
> and not allowing Eubank to settle into his rhythm.
Eubank, after the Watson tragedy, never had much of a rhythm. He'd been
an awkward fighter to begin with, and had many close shaves against very
mediocre opposition, looking far less than formidable. Eubank was highly
beatable by any active, halfway skilled fighter at that stage in his
career. And Collins didn't look "the stronger" of the two. he got shaken
a few times, and relied on boxing and piling up points.
As to the McCallum against Jones fight - well, it says nothing. McCallum
is way past his prime these days. The fact he's still competitive at top
level only speaks volumes about today's lack of depth in the middle to
light heavy divisions.
> Then Benn came
> out of retirement and lost twice to Collins first due to a twisted
> ankle and the second time when he didn't come out of his corner
> coz he was exhausted and beaten by the sixth round.
Benn has always been one to win one big and lose the next three ones with
mediocre performances. Benn had been looking rather worn out, too.
> Collins has two things going for him, his physical strength and
> his mental strength. Nobody scares him.
He's still mechanical in his approach. I think he'd give a decent effort
against Jones, but doesn't have the punch to win Jones' respect, nor the
skills and speed to win rounds. I'd pick Jones by a shutdown decision.
>.. Jones would be taking a big risk on his best P4P title and
> best all time boxer status by fighting Collins.
What? Jones best all time boxer? That's a ridiculous claim. In any case,
the only risk Jones has taken in his career was fighting Toney. I don't
think fighting Collins would be much of a risk, but at least it'd be a
step up from the average competition level he's provided us with.
>... In my book that makes him a phoney
> and a chickenshit.
To me, Jones is simply pissing away his talent and milking his HBO
contract without achieving anything memorable.
...paul
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
C.W.
plies...@bix.com wrote:
>snippped<
> To me, Jones is simply pissing away his talent and milking his HBO
> contract without achieving anything memorable.
>
> ...paul
>
I'd be interested to know who you would ideally want Jones' next five
opponents to be.
Is he going to be effective at heavyweight ?
Is he going to fight at heavyweight at all ?
Personally, I'll believe it when I see it.
--
C.W.
Jonesy
> his mental strength. Nobody scares him.
Except Joe Calzaghe maybe:)
H
John T. Spillane
Subject: boxing Date: Tue, 14 Oct 1997 12:37:34 +0100 From:
"Gearoid O'Sullivan" <gea...@shannon.ucd.ie> To: JUAN
<jspi...@lucent.com>
Johnno, post this up as a reply to pliesenberg's reply.. try and
get the word wrapping right this time.. cheers
Hi paul, I didn't see the McCallum (bit young) fight but from what I
heard in the aftermath and recently as well, McCallum had said it
was the hardest fight he had and wouldn't fight him again. Maybe
McCallum was just complimenting Collins on a tough fight but that's
what I heard.(It was a good while ago so I can't remember exact
details) Collins started his pro. career in the states and fought
his way up until he earned the title shot at McCallum, winning some
WBC? American Middleweight belt (?)at on thge way. His style that
I've seen recently (over the last few years) is very ragged. In
both Eubank fights Eubank looked more composed while Collins
shuffled around, lunged in at every opportunity throwing punches,
man-handling him and grabbing him then to stop him working on the
inside and to wear him down as they struggled. Eubank looked more
comfortable but lost. I know McCallum won but maybe it looked more
comfortable than it was. As I said in the last posting Collins has
never been stopped. Eubank hurt him in the first fight though. He
doesn't have a knockout punch it's his overwhelming pressure his
strength endurance and heart that wins him fights. When he keeps
coming at you for 12 rounds you know you've been in a fight. As for
Watson I think Eubank had recovered from that incident by the second
Collins fight and there was so much hate there, Eubank was out to
really hurt Collins. Eubank's trainer (I can't remember his name)
said that that was the hardest Eubank had trained for any fight. In
the fight by the ninth round or tenth the trainer was giving him
advice and Eubank says in a shocked way -"He keeps coming at me".
He couldn't believe Collins' endurance and strength. A lot of
people in this NG rate Jones highly as one of the best P4P and
someone has Collins as 4th in the most overrated boxer list. I'd
put it the other way round. Jones IMO is overrated but until the
fight happen we won't know. If Jones seriously wants to fight
Collins he'll have to stop hiding behind a $5 mill purse and get
realistic. Asking for $5 mill is the same as saying no he won't
fight him in my book. Collins only fights at his best against the
best and he has improved a lot over the last few years, so even
though I think Jones would be the favourite in that fight I think if
Collins prepared right he'd have a good chance of winning.
By the way I heard on the radio this morning that the WBO still
consider Collins the s. mid. champ. They have given him 120 days
to defend against Calzaghe. The door's still open for him. Barry
Hearn is suing him this week in Dublin also so if he loses all his
money he won't think twice about coming back since the petronelli
brothers are also suing him. As for Eubank, if you saw the fight on
Saturday night you'd only have respect for the guy. Eubank who had
to try and drop about a stone (14lbs) and try and get fit in 10 days
after being out of the ring for 2 years, against Calzaghe who has
been campaigning for the last few years at that weight. He kept
coming with all he had all the way to the end and the punches he
took show his granite chin. Calzaghe looked worse after the fight.
Eubank would make a great light heavy if he put his mind to it..
gearoid
John T. Spillane
Subject:
Re: Steve Collins
Date:
Tue, 14 Oct 1997 13:26:05 +0100
From:
"Gearoid O'Suilleabhain" <Gea...@faraday.ucd.ie>
Organization:
University College Dublin
CC:
jspi...@lucent.com
Newsgroups:
rec.sport.boxing
References:
1
Younge WA wrote:
>
> Very overrated. He beat Eubanks and Benn at a stage in their careers when
> they couldn't beat snow off a rope. He won the title from Chris Pyatt who
> beat a 200 year old Sambu Kalambay, and defended it against either blown
> up lightweights or old men in the twilight of their careers. The first
> live contender and he ran a mile. He wanted Roy Jones for the money, but
> wouldn't have lasted three rounds.
???
He beat most contenders this side of the Atlantic. He beat Eubank twice
who was unbeaten at the time and has been chasing some sort of
unification fight for the last few years but Jones ducked him and is
still doing it by asking for $5 mill for a fight.. Benn lost to Sugar
Boy who lost to Nardiello who lost to Reid who won't fight him yet. He
wanted to fight the big champions to show what he is made of. He could
spend the next few years fighting nobodies for the money if he wanted -
instead of show me the money it's show me the champions but they don't
want him. He's not rated because the big guns won't fight him. If Jones
stops running we'll see how good both of them are.
gearoid