Hey Bill Booth... Loose the Beard!!
Marty Hahnfeld
First, Bill Booth was well spoken and eloquent on TV the other night.
But, imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard. Really Bill,
if you want to be a figurehead for skydiving.. great, you are obviously up
to the task! But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means being
professional sounding and professional looking. Not, hey look at me... I'm
in ZZ Top!
My guess is your average non-skydiver looks at Bill and never hears a word
he says, they just go "look at this guy, oh a skydiver? just look at him, he
must be nuts... just like all of them!"
Later,
Marty Hahnfeld
NCB-14
Fastsftail
>imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
>20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard
bill booth doesn' t need to cut his beard for you or anybody else. what else
does he need to do to be credible, as if the three ring system, the original
throw out on the original piggy back (that wasn't just a chest mount stacked
on top of a main container), and tandem weren't enough.
>Really Bill,
>if you want to be a figurehead for skydiving..
when did he ever say he wanted to be a figurehead for skydiving
.>Not, hey look at me... I'm
>in ZZ Top!
now if he could only play guitar
rick nelson
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
>
> First, Bill Booth was well spoken and eloquent on TV the other night.
>
> But, imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
> 20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard. Really Bill,
> if you want to be a figurehead for skydiving.. great, you are obviously up
> to the task! But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
> exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
> audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means being
> in ZZ Top!
>
> he says, they just go "look at this guy, oh a skydiver? just look at him, he
> must be nuts... just like all of them!"
>
> Later,
> Marty Hahnfeld
> NCB-14
GAFL,
rick
SteveHigdn
Wow.... Marty! Slow down there, buddy. Take a few minutes, or hours, before
you hit that "send" button next time.
Or.... post a pic of yourself, so everyone can take a shot!
BSBD
Steve
QWeaver
Hey I hate to say it but I have to agree with Marty, and for all the wrong
reasons. I sat there watching this well spoken and composed rep. of skydiving
and my focus keep getting interrupted by the image that I knew the vast
majority of viewers were seeing. I'm a high school teacher and I see highly
talented kids with multi-colored hair and it dosn't faze me. But we tend to
discredit an adult much more quickly based on appearance.
Quinton
Maclean
and i suppose Einstein had that G.Q. look you seem so impressed with ?????
Crusty
Marty Hahnfeld <mar...@interaccess.com> wrote,
> <SNIP>
> ...... But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
> exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
> audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means
being
> professional sounding and professional looking. <snip>
>
>
>
Hammerwork
Marty-, Marty, Marty the day that we hace to knuckle under to conforming to the
persecptions that we THINK some people have of us is the day we start to hang
up our collective gear. This sport and indeed this country are all about being
who you want to be and the people you can reach with whatever message you have
are the ones that are enlightened or motivated enough to hear you. I honestly
don't think that Bill was jumping up and down saying "pick me, pick me" for
that interview. They scouted around for someone who had jumped in similar
ewnvironments before and could be considered an expert to put on the air and I
personally think he did us all proud in the short time he had and the limited
scope of the converstaion. The day we all have to look like Mr. Needles to gain
credibility is the day we loose something as a society. The people who can't
see past Bill's beard are not going to be reached by us anyway. Probably looks
pretty wierd in freefall too, is that bad also?
Randle Bain
Marty's argument was polite and well reasoned. It pointed out that
looks do count when making a presentation to the media. Should Bill
capitulate and assume a form to please the masses? No. Hell no.
In a media world full of Barbie and Kens, Bill goes his own way.
Polite, articulate, and professional Bill made a positive impression for
those willing to listen to words, not sound bites. To those who would
blow him off because of a beard, well I don't want that kind of person
in skydiving anyway.
I like the assorted mix of people at most drop zones. They tend to be
accepting, open, and friendly. Some would probably fit the "ideal"
image for which you argue. This too is fine. But they choose their
style, just as Bill chooses his.
My only bitch is that I can't grow a beard like that.
IRA Pilot
I don't know if I'd recognize him without it.(just kidding!) I respect your
point of view, but feel that you are being overly critical. The man is so "well
spoken and eloquent" (as you put it) that I don't think his appearance
matters.
Al Anderson
QWeaver wrote:
>... I sat there watching this well spoken and composed rep. of skydiving
> and my focus keep getting interrupted by the image that I knew the vast
> discredit an adult much more quickly based on appearance.
At least you recognize and admit to this prejudice in yourself. Knowing
that should make it easier to set aside your initial judgments based on
appearance and focus on content so as to make more informed decisions.
As for the image you "knew the vast majority of viewers were seeing",
that's quite a leap. Because you view it that way the majority does?
Because we notice something as different doesn't necessarily mean we all
obsess on it.
I find myself jumping to conclusions based on someone's appearance.
Human nature. When I realize I've done that I stop and re-evalute the
words or actions of the person and base my actions/reactions on those.
--
-al- ~(:-{>-[==<
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Reality continues to ruin my life."
"Calvin & Hobbes
"Ow, not there!"
Rita
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
>
> First, Bill Booth was well spoken and eloquent on TV the other night.
> But, imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
> 20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard.
> ... But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
> exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
> audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means being
> professional sounding and professional looking. Not, hey look at me... I'm
> in ZZ Top!
Ahhhhh, this is the second post today I'm probably going to regret.
I, for one, absolutely love Bill's beard. In fact, I'll be honest, it turns
me on! :)
Many years ago, back in summer of '95 to be exact, I did my first skydive ...
a tandem. I arrive at this small back country dz with my folks and a friend
for moral support. We are ushered into a classroom to watch the "lawyers
dance" video. I'm sitting in the front row of this classroom, my folks are
behind me. The video starts and one of the first people we see is Bill Booth
and his awesome beard. From behind me I hear my father bellow "Good lord
almighty, it's the second coming of Christ! Look at the beard on that guy!"
I hardly hear dad, though ... I'm totally mezmerized watching Bill's beard go
up and down while he talked. I found it ... well, downright, SEXY!!!!! In
fact, I asked my tm if I could take the video home with me, but he told me
no. :(
Blue ones,
--rita
P.S. I think you mean "Lose" the Beard ... not "Loose." :)
Thomas Kerler
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
> My guess is your average non-skydiver looks at Bill and never hears a word
> he says, they just go "look at this guy, oh a skydiver? just look at him, he
> must be nuts... just like all of them!"
you probably right. I bet a lot said "dayum, that boy loks jus lak that Castro
batuurd"
But Billy doesn't have to shave off all of it. I guess a lot viewers would find
it acceptable
if he can left a little square piece of beard right below his nose.
--
BSBD, Thomas Kerler, TDD #6, Whip(p)ersnapper #10000 & 1/8th
mailto:ker...@math.ohio-state.edu
http://www.math.ohio-state.edu/~kerler/BSBD/club.html
"there's nothing wrong with going nowhere, babe,
but we should be going nowhere _fast_" (lyrics:Jim Steinman)
Cheeri O's
Thought i'd seen every possible post but this one tops them all!
This Marty guy is a skydiver???????
Never thought i'd ever see a skydiver this conformist! Simply amazing!
I just can’t believe it! Talk about an appearance complex!
That’s what’s great about this world...its people like Bill Booth and Einstein who
aren’t/weren’t conformist! For without them you wouldn’t have a
rig on your back!!!!
Try this one:
My guess is your average non-skydiver looks at George Bush and hears every word
he says, they just go "look at this guy, oh a President? just look at him, he
must be honest... just like all of them!"
Like appearance adds to your credibility!
Are you sure your a skydiver?
jimOreilly
Charlie Orchard
As I look at the subject line of this thread I can not help but point out
that Bill Booth already keeps his beard quite "loose". ;-)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Charlie Orchard and Pez, the motorcycling Maltese
corc...@chs.cusd.claremont.edu
My and Pez' homepage- http://key.cyberg8t.com:80/corchard/
Smalldog Listserv- http://www.cusd.claremont.edu/~corchard/smalldog.html
"It's mohawk night...you could get in if you had a mohawk."
Bouncer in "After Hours"
rick nelson
Rita wrote:
> P.S. I think you mean "Lose" the Beard ... not "Loose." :)
No, Marty's right. Bill's beard looks too tight. I think Marty meant
"loosen".
rick
D. D. Bartley
Cheeri O's wrote in message <66unhl$suv$1...@news.fsu.edu>...
:This Marty guy is a skydiver???????
Yep and I was his jumpmaster.
:Never thought i'd ever see a skydiver this conformist! Simply amazing!
:I just can’t believe it! Talk about an appearance complex!
Well, times are changing "Cheeri O's".
:That’s what’s great about this world...its people like Bill Booth and
Einstein who
:aren’t/weren’t conformist! For without them you wouldn’t have a
:rig on your back!!!!
I certainly might not have a 3 ring release without Bill but I'm not so sure
what Einstein did for the sport.
All kidding aside which is what I'm doing (except for the part about being
Marty's jumpmaster, I really was) I really wouldn't know Bill without his
beard. I met him around 12 years ago and I think he would look silly
without it.
D.D.
p.s. Marty hang in there.
Maclean
then we're a bunch of idiots ... oh wait, the 'we' meant you high school
teachers... then you're a bunch of idiots.......Crusty
QWeaver <qwe...@aol.com> wrote in I'm a high school teacher and I see
highly
> <snip>
> talented kids with multi-colored hair and it dosn't faze me. But we tend
to
> discredit an adult much more quickly based on appearance.
> Quinton
>
Larry Pennington
Marty:
Just have to ask you to do one small thing... Can you say POP!! Good
now that you have your head out of your ass you can think.
Sandy Wambach
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
> First, Bill Booth was well spoken and eloquent on TV the other night.
>
> But, imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
> 20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard. Really Bill,
> if you want to be a figurehead for skydiving.. great, you are obviously up
> to the task! But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
> exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
> audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means being
> professional sounding and professional looking. Not, hey look at me... I'm
> in ZZ Top!
>
> Marty Hahnfeld
> NCB-14
Hey Marty! Read my lips......
BILL BOOTH IS A BABE!
Sandy
EFSpete
Before Bill makes his appearances I think he should braid it and put smoldering
strips of cloth in it, in the Edward Teach style. That would put the fear of
god in those reporters and keep them off gaurd.....
Paul Koning
Thomas Kerler wrote:
>
> you probably right. I bet a lot said "dayum, that boy loks jus lak that Castro
> batuurd"
Naw. That Castro batuurd is probably green with envy, his isn't
anywhere
near as good.
I've had people compare me with BB because of my beard. Don't I wish.
His beard and his skydiving expertise are both massively better than
mine.
Meanwhile...
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
>
> First, Bill Booth was well spoken and eloquent on TV the other night.
> But, imagine how much more credible he would be without the "I robbed a bank
> 20 years ago and I don't want anybody to recognize me" beard.
I wonder what field this joker is in. In high tech where I work,
things are just the reverse: many of the top brains have major beards,
and people know it. (If John Postel were a skydiver, he'd look a lot
like BB with gray hair...)
paul
Pete Yadlowsky
> But being the focal point for something which undergoes public
> exposure and scrutiny means you have to appeal to as much of your viewing
> audience as possible when gicen the opportunity to present. This means being
> professional sounding and professional looking.
Fortunately, this kind of superficial nonsense seems to be fading from
the workplace and, consequently, from public opinion. I think most
people recognize and respect genuine professionalism no matter what it's
wearing.
> My guess is your average non-skydiver looks at Bill and never hears a word
> he says, they just go "look at this guy, oh a skydiver? just look at him, he
> must be nuts... just like all of them!"
My guess is that an unusual appearance actually heightens interest in
what the speaker has to say, even if only briefly. If during that window
of curiousity the speaker manages to present himself as a competent
professional and not some incoherent screwball, so much the better for
eroding unfortunate social myths and stereotypes.
--
Pete Yadlowsky | Linux...because a PC
Information Technology and Communications | is a terrible thing
University of Virginia | to waste.
http://boffo.itc.virginia.edu/~pmy/ |
AIRDIVR
This has to be the most pathetic thread that this n.g. has ever seen. Bill
Booth was not the "focal point for something which undergoes public scrutiny",
in case anyone has forgotten, it was the three people who bounced on the South
Pole ...
Are you suggesting that before we bounce we better shave??
Elaine
D-7863
Thomas Kerler
Paul Koning wrote:
> Naw. That Castro batuurd is probably green with envy, his isn't
> anywhere near as good.
awrigh then, but he shooa loks like that moppett communist (Jack Hannsonn
or somepin luk that, me thinks he's also from Pueta Rikko)
If ya don beleeve me lok at the picture i found on the internet:
http://www.henson.com/muppets/Sweetums_s.jpg
> I've had people compare me with BB because of my beard.
Yo ugly foo'
Marty Hahnfeld
Cool, I expected most of these responses, so in typical r.s. style I will
respond and see what other overly emotional responses I can inspire.
However, at the end of the day I am entitled to my opinion and that is all I
was sharing, I am not trying to take a love it, or shove it attitude on
this. So... here we go.
fastsftail wrote:
bill booth doesn' t need to cut his beard for you or anybody else. what else
does he need to do to be credible, as if the three ring system, the original
throw out on the original piggy back (that wasn't just a chest mount
stacked
on top of a main container), and tandem weren't enough.
>> Nobody gives a shit about the 3-ring or tandem inventions when he is on
TV talking about why 3 sorry soles bounced at the south pole. These highly
technical inventions are not likely to get him much credibility with the
largely non-skydiving public he is addressing, these people do not even know
what these things are. Remember, when we put somebody on TV we are trying to
protect the sport. Bill did an excellent verbal job of this, I am simply
stating an assumption that based on his appearance to the average
non-skydiver who does not know who the hell Bill Booth is or what he has
done that some % of these people will have a hard time taking him too
seriously. Remember this is Prime Time network TV, not some closed-circuit
skydiver only channel. This is your mom and dad, my mom and dad, and the
rest of America.
Al Anderson wrote:
I find myself jumping to conclusions based on someone's appearance.
Human nature. When I realize I've done that I stop and re-evaluate the
words or actions of the person and base my actions/reactions on those.
>>Agreed, and we can all hope people have this attitude (and the
intelligence to have this attitude). BUT, we *are* dealing with quick video
and sound bytes here. Nobody is going to give Bill Booth a 2 hour special
where the viewers can take a deep look at how credible he actually is.
Instead, the skydiving community gets a quick 5 minute chance to speak its
position. Why take chances on prejudices which may exist, go with the safe
formula (i.e. the most conservative looking *and* well spoken representative
you can find).
Charlie Orchard was the first to point out this mistake:
As I look at the subject line of this thread I can not help but point out
that Bill Booth already keeps his beard quite "loose". ;-)
>>Yes, that would be lose the beard.... duh!
Maclean wrote:
and i suppose Einstein had that G.Q. look you seem so impressed with ?????
>>I don't remember Einstein being on the tube with Gumbal, do you? This is
about as relevant a comparison as skydiving to basket-weaving, different
time, different place, different dude. The theory of relativity is also
slightly more relevant than the 3-ring in the grand scheme of things. Nice
try.
Hammerwork wrote:
The people who can't see past Bill's beard are not going to be reached by us
anyway. Probably looks
pretty weird in freefall too, is that bad also?
>>You seem very sure of this, maybe you know something I don't. My whole
post is centered around *not* being so sure about the statement you made
above. I *am* pretty certain though that you are correct in his beard being
pretty damn amusing in freefall.
Cherri O's wrote:
This Marty guy is a skydiver???????
Never thought I'd ever see a skydiver this conformist! Simply amazing!
I just can’t believe it! Talk about an appearance complex!
>>Yes I Skydive, You have now seen it. Believe it.
>>No complex here, just observation that when I see other sports being
represented in public in light of a tragedy this task is usually taken-on by
a safe, conservative, and professional individual which will start as close
to neutral as possible. Probably a hired PR mouthpiece in most cases, maybe
a good use of some of those USPA funds we all chip in every year.
DD Bartley wrote:
Yep and I was his jumpmaster.
>>True!! (she quit shortly after teaching me...)
Larry Pennington wrote:
Just have to ask you to do one small thing... Can you say POP!! Good
now that you have your head out of your ass you can think.
>>I would venture to guess, that most would agree, my post(s) has involved a
fair amount more thought than yours... dick.
Rita wrote:
I, for one, absolutely love Bill's beard. In fact, I'll be honest, it turns
me on! :)
>>Ever since I read this, I have not shaved since.... look for me at a DZ
near you in about 12 years.
>>Actually, this brings up my last point. Within skydiving, Bill Booth is a
cool, well respected guy who has added ample amounts to the safety of the
sport. My comment is not really attacking him as much as it is the sport
which continues to represent itself to the media in an unsatisfactory manner
in my opinion. If Bill wants to hang at the DZ and grow his beard to the
ground, cool... But my USPA paying, skydiving ass says, if we want to
continue to enjoy the *lack* of public attention, interference, and scrutiny
this sport *really* enjoys, we better get our act together when it comes to
dealing with the public.
Later.
Marty
NovaTTT
EFS Pete said:
>
>Before Bill makes his appearances I think he should braid it and put
>smoldering
>strips of cloth in it, in the Edward Teach style.
Touchè, Pete. I've been following this thread waiting for someone to say
something interesting. Personally, I think Bill should wear his beard shorter,
but that's my _opinion_. Do I want to see him trim, cut or shave it? Hell
no!! I would, however, like to see him with smoldering cloth braided into his
beard. I'm still laughing.
Bill is an excellent spokesman for the sport, and his genius has benefitted
all of us. My hats off to you, Bill, and my old jumpsuit is offered to use as
strips to braid into your wonderful, unique beard.
More power to you.
Timothy
Existing is not living; don't throw away the thrill of living for the comfort
of existence.
Triple T D17887
NCB135
Fast Fred
Pathetic. Absolutely pathetic. When have skydivers really cared about
public image, and why the hell should we? The few members of the
"public" that bother to think about skydiving and skydivers at all
firmly believe that we are all insane.
Bill Booth lose his beard? If he reads this crap, he must be laughing
his ass off at the asininity of such a preposterous, pathetic
suggestion. I know I am.
Thomas Kerler
EFSpete wrote:
> Before Bill makes his appearances I think he should braid it and put smoldering
> strips of cloth in it, in the Edward Teach style. That would put the fear of
> god in those reporters and keep them off gaurd.....
... and he sould wash it too !!!!!!
Just look at this picture of Bill Booth during opening that i found:
http://www.math.ohio-state.edu/~kerler/BSBD/Booth.gif
The hair of his beard is sooo sticky it doesn't even blow up in the wind!!!!!
James Whitaker
By the way, I printed out the first nights comments on "the beard" and hand
delivered them to Bill Booth.
He had heard about the thread and was amused while reading them.
Jim
rick nelson
DMSteven wrote:
>
> I'm sure he'll keep it short enough to avoid a main or reserve/beard
> entaglement. :-)
>
> Dennis
> AFF JM97
True story: ZZ Top keep theirs trimmed to avoid beard/E-string
entanglement.
It's a Texas thang.
bsbd.....a-haw-haw-haw (spin guitars)
rick
GW Galloway
Sandy Wambach wrote:
> Hey Marty! Read my lips......
> BILL BOOTH IS A BABE!
Check out Poynter's Manual (third edition) page 221 in the upper right
corner of the page (sorry, Bill!) I remember when this picture was taken
back in the mid-70s. Bill had cut off his beard for some reason, but
when I saw him about 6 weeks later, his magnificent beard was already
back in full splendor!! I was amazed.
Deland in the 70's.... How many people here remember those days?
--
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
"If you can pack all of those parachutes, then you can fold your own
shirts and make up your own bed"! [What Mom told me when I was still
living at home at age 23, absolutely obsessed with skydiving] c.1972
George Galloway <g...@precision.net> http://precision.aerodynamics.com
Precision Aerodynamics 423-949-4688 Parachute Industry Assn V Pres
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
DMSteven
Marty Hahnfeld
EFSpete wrote in message <19971215132...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
>Before Bill makes his appearances I think he should braid it and put
smoldering
>strips of cloth in it, in the Edward Teach style. That would put the fear
of
>god in those reporters and keep them off gaurd.....
This is the funniest damn thing I think I have ever read!
Anybody who gives me shit for starting this thread can now kiss my ass,
without it we would never have gotten this reply... I laugh every time I
visualize this...
Marty
Marty Hahnfeld
James Whitaker wrote in message <6775eu$cs5$1...@newsfep1.sprintmail.com>...
>By the way, I printed out the first nights comments on "the beard" and hand
>delivered them to Bill Booth.
>He had heard about the thread and was amused while reading them.
Cool. Tell Bill hello and thanks for the sweet V3's I own, nice rigs.
Robert Haig
In article <19971217013...@ladder01.news.aol.com>,
DMSteven <dmst...@aol.com> wrote:
>I'm sure he'll keep it short enough to avoid a main or reserve/beard
>entaglement. :-)
>
Curious, where do you think he keeps his reserve beard?
--
Rob
NovaTTT
Thomas Kerler writes: >Just look at this picture of Bill Booth during opening
This is the best damned photo of Bill Booth that I've ever seen. It really
captures his essence, and his love of skydiving is obvious. So he has a need
for a little washing...who doesn't after a day on the dz?? ;-)
Marty is right. The 'smouldering cloth' comment, and this, make the thread
not only tolerable, but pretty f*****g funny as well!!!!
ocon...@slr.orl.lmco.com
In article <677f00$6...@camel20.mindspring.com>,
"gg"@[NOSPAM]precision.net wrote:
[snip]
> Deland in the 70's.... How many people here remember those days?
I'm afraid it may be like David Crosby's comment about the '60's.
If you remember them, you weren't there.
Kevin O'Connell
-------------------==== Posted via Deja News ====-----------------------
http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Post to Usenet
DMSteven
Probably neatly packed under his main beard!
Dennis
AFF JM97
Kingobase
You can't fool any of us Bill. I know you are really Santa Claus desguised as
a skydiver. I know cause just yesterday I sat on your lap at the mall. Lose
your beard, and you lose your power...don't do it Bill. KOB
>I don't know if I'd recognize him without it.(just kidding!) I respect your
>point of view, but feel that you are being overly critical. The man is so
>"well
>spoken and eloquent" (as you put it) that I don't think his appearance
>matters.
>
>
Gwyn Boehringer
Kingobase <king...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19971217141...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
>
>
> You can't fool any of us Bill. I know you are really Santa Claus
desguised as
> a skydiver. I know cause just yesterday I sat on your lap at the mall.
Lose
> your beard, and you lose your power...don't do it Bill. KOB
Santa's one of us? Can I have a Cypres for Christmas, Bill, huh, can I
can I can I!!! I've been a good (wink wink) little girl, I'll even sit on
your lap!
Gwyn
Rita
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
> Anybody who gives me shit for starting this thread can now kiss my ass,
> without it we would never have gotten this reply... I laugh every time I
> visualize this...
Kiss your ass, huh? Jeez, aren't you going to at least show me what it looks
like first? :)
Blue ones,
--rita
Rita
Kingobase wrote:
>
> You can't fool any of us Bill. I know you are really Santa Claus desguised as
> a skydiver. I know cause just yesterday I sat on your lap at the mall. Lose
> your beard, and you lose your power...don't do it Bill. KOB
Santa Claus, huh? Well, you know what I'd like for Christmas, Santa? A
tandem ride with the true master! Wow ... imagine that beard tickling the
back of your neck all the way through freefall? Ummmmm, think I'll log off
and go fantasize now! :)
Blue ones,
--rita
CRWMike
You can't miss it--it's sitting right on his shoulders ;^)
--
Blue Skies,
Michael
D-6139, I/JM(Retired)
"Here's tae us; wha's like us ?
Gey few, and they're a' deid."
rick nelson
CRWMike wrote:
>
> Rita wrote:
> >
> > Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
> >
> > > Anybody who gives me shit for starting this thread can now kiss my ass,
> > > without it we would never have gotten this reply... I laugh every time I
> > > visualize this...
> >
> > Kiss your ass, huh? Jeez, aren't you going to at least show me what it looks
> > like first? :)
>
> You can't miss it--it's sitting right on his shoulders ;^)
>
rick
Jeanie
Marty,
Hello! I find your statement and your reasoning extremely ubsurd!
Bill is one of the most well GROOMED skydivers I have ever seen, in
addition to being well spoken.
I've seen many an instructer, unshaven, lacking basic hygene skills,
representing many DZ's.
How many "good looking" skydivers do you know that can't even complete a
sentence, or use "fuck" in every other phrase. Would you want them
speaking on your behalf just because they look good? Bill spoke in terms
that whuffos easily followed. Anyone watching the program with even a
speck of intelligence would recognize an educated man regardless of the
beard.
Yes, if we were all Ken and Barbie maybe we would be more accepted in
society. This isn't a glamor magazine it's real life, with all the
colors that keep it interesting.
jeanie
Marty Hahnfeld
Fast Fred wrote in message <349620...@bellsouth.NOSPAM.net>...
Marty Hahnfeld wrote:
>>When have skydivers really cared about public image, and why the hell
should we?
Talk about pathetic, use your brain!
The answer is, we shouldn't care, if we don't mind renewing our licenses
with the FAA instead of USPA one of these days. If we don't represent
ourselves to the public both professionally and competently somebody is
going to make sure we are "reformed" and that the "insanity" stops. Like it
or not, we *need* to care what the public thinks of the sport.
Remember, we are in an age where an over zelous media often takes things
into their own hands, they call them "investigations" "reports" "crusades"
and they aim to reform things which *they* feel are unsafe, unregulated, and
generally out of control. They will hound government agencies, cameras
running, and ask questions like "are you going to let this continue?" "what
are you doing about this?" "are you going to continue to let people die?"
and before you know it..... regulation of our incredibly free and unpolluted
sport.
Seems alot easier to me, to be proactive, by presenting to the media (read:
the public) in the most professional manner possible. Remember, three people
die, it is NEWS which the public wants to know about! It is out
responsibility to make sure we state our case and continue to reinforce the
positive aspects (read: safety and fun) of the sport.
Later. Marty (still laughing about the smoldering strips of cloth...)
Marty Hahnfeld
CRWMike wrote in message <34982A...@Bellsouth.net>...
>
>You can't miss it--it's sitting right on his shoulders ;^)
Another friggin' genius.... excellent creative work on the lil' smiley face,
very proud of you!!
Later. Marty
CRWMike
Hey brother. Just poking a little fun at you. I do disagree with your
point of view that one of the most experienced and respected skydivers
in the world should alter his appearance to please...who?
But it's no big deal--relax.
Maclean
ya got me ...
A. Einstein was gone before T.V. news media became ENTERTAINMENT ... or you
probably would have seen Babwa W. trying to get him to cry over the
orphaned particles in a chain reaction..
B. most skydivers probably should be weaving baskets in protected
environments
C. nothing, including GOD, is more relevant than your 3-ring at 1500 ft
under a ball of shit..
Crusty AKA MacLean
Marty Hahnfeld <mar...@interaccess.com> wrote in article
<672k6k$i09$1...@nntp3.interaccess.com>...
> Cool, I expected most of these responses, so in typical r.s. style I will
> respond and see what other overly emotional responses I can inspire.
>
snip
enough.
DMSteven
C. nothing, including GOD, is more relevant than your 3-ring at 1500 ft
under a ball of shit..
Crusty AKA MacLean
_____________________________________________________-
....accually, that's when God could/should become real relevant.
Dennis
AF JM97
JJSKYCAM
ZZ top is a cool band
Fastsftail
>. Remember, when we put somebody on TV we are trying to
>protect the sport
so marty.....you re saying that puting bill booth and his beard on primetime tv
somehow threatens the sport?
to "protect" us all, i think you should call bill at the relative workshop and
tell him that, for the good of the sport, he has no business showing his
bearded face on tv. then get back to us and tell us how the conversation went.
why talk around the man when you can call him up and confront him directly.
right marty?
here' s another angle:
john q public see' s bill booth and is impressed by his keen insight into the
sport and well spoken manner and determines that it is possible for a man with
a beard to be credible.
loosen up baby, both skydiving and the public will survive bill booth.
Rita
Jeez, would you mind conferencing me in on that call? I'd really enjoy
hearing this conversation!
Seriously, I get this crap all the time at work. I should wear the "power
suits" and carry a briefcase so that I could "look the part" and maybe move
up the corporate ladder faster. I should join this organization and do
such and such because it would make a better impression on the folks in
higher management.
To me that always seemed 90% bunk. If you know your job and can present
yourself as knowledgeable and forthright, people will accept you and listen
to what you have to say. And for those who won't, that's their loss.
Bill Booth makes a knowledgeable spokesperson for the sport. When he
speaks, that knowledge comes across quite clearly. True, the beard may
make a shocking initial impression, but that certainly doesn't detract from
the message he is trying to portray. I doubt John Q. Public is going to
think less of the sport simply because Bill Booth likes long beards.
Rather, I think if John Q. Public allows himself to listen to what Bill has
to say, he's going to learn something about the sport.
Keep your beard, Bill! I, for one, like it! :) By, the way, do you do
tandems? :)
Blue ones,
--rita
Fastsftail <fasts...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19971225190...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
CRWMike
Rita wrote:
>
> Keep your beard, Bill! I, for one, like it! :) By, the way, do you do
> tandems? :)
Does Bill Booth do tandems?!?!?!?
BWAHAHAHAHAHA!
Rita
Now wait a minute, Michael. That's a reasonable question, isn't it? :)
... I mean, I know he designed the tandem system, but is he an active
tandem master?
But, boy, if he is ... I'd love to jump him ... I mean with him ... :)
Blue ones,
--rita
CRWMike <CRW...@Bellsouth.net> wrote in article
<34A31E...@Bellsouth.net>...
CRWMike
Rita wrote:
>
> Now wait a minute, Michael. That's a reasonable question, isn't it? :)
> ... I mean, I know he designed the tandem system, but is he an active
> tandem master?
>
> But, boy, if he is ... I'd love to jump him ... I mean with him ... :)
>
> Blue ones,
>
> --rita
Certainly. My apologies.
Rita
But, you didn't answer the question ... does he do tandems? If so, where?
:)
Big blue ones, and merry, merry Christmas!
--rita
CRWMike <CRW...@Bellsouth.net> wrote in article
<34A359...@Bellsouth.net>...
> Rita wrote:
> >
> > Now wait a minute, Michael. That's a reasonable question, isn't it? :)
> > ... I mean, I know he designed the tandem system, but is he an active
> > tandem master?
> > But, boy, if he is ... I'd love to jump him ... I mean with him ... :)
> Certainly. My apologies.
H.renting
I'm just curious:
Although the Tandem system (i think the idea of two people jumping
togethare is ment here?) is very good for $$ and the PR of the sport why
was it invented? because of these reasons?
Where and when was invented and how did the "god's" and other members of
the skydivers community respond at first?
If I am not mistaken the current solo system comes from the tandem system
is this correct?
Thank you and
Happy Newyear
Paul C. Renting
Skydivers know why the birds sing...
They don't have to pack every fucking time they land!!!
TJN135ST
hey marty shut the hell up i would imagine bill took alot of time to grow that
beard . any way i dont think he should have to change the way he looks just to
look good to a bunch of whuffos
Kleggo
H.renting <ren...@xs4all.nl> wrote in article
<01bd1237$28ec06a0$LocalHost@renting>...
>
> I'm just curious:
>
> Although the Tandem system (i think the idea of two people jumping
> togethare is ment here?) is very good for $$ and the PR of the sport why
^^^
was it invented? because of these reasons?
you've answered your own question. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
> Where and when was invented and how did the "god's" and other members of
> the skydivers community respond at first?
many of us that do not derive income from tandems consider them an unwanted
amusement-park-ride annoyance.
their most useful purpose??????? dz solvency.
>
> If I am not mistaken the current solo system comes from the tandem system
> is this correct?
huh?
kleggo
Kleggo
Fastsftail <fasts...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19971225190...@ladder02.news.aol.com>...
> >. Remember, when we put somebody on TV we are trying to
> >
[snip]
>
> loosen up baby, both skydiving and the public will survive bill booth.
and many of us will, (and do), survive because of the technology that bb
has brought to
our world.
kleggo
bil...@qualcomm.com
In article <01bd1237$28ec06a0$LocalHost@renting>,
"H.renting" <ren...@xs4all.nl> wrote:
> Although the Tandem system (i think the idea of two people jumping
> togethare is ment here?) is very good for $$ and the PR of the sport why
> was it invented? because of these reasons?
as stated in the FAA waiver, tandem is an experimental student training
system. the "training" part is often overlooked by modern tandem
masters, and instead it's mainly a thrill ride. but the original intent
was a new avenue for student training.
> If I am not mistaken the current solo system comes from the tandem system
> is this correct?
i think you may have heard very early solo skydiving rigs referred to
as "tandems." one of the first rigs from jump shack, for example, was
the SST (super swoop tandem, i believe.) early rig manufacturers used
the term "piggyback" or "tandem" to refer to having both the reserve and
the main parachute on the back of the rig, instead of the "conventional"
system where the main was on the back, the reserve was on the front.
however, modern dual-harness, dual-parachute systems were developed
well after the first piggyback systems. they just reused the name.
-bill von
Sandy Wambach
bil...@qualcomm.com wrote:
> i think you may have heard very early solo skydiving rigs referred to
> as "tandems." one of the first rigs from jump shack, for example, was
> the SST (super swoop tandem, i believe.) early rig manufacturers used
> the term "piggyback" or "tandem" to refer to having both the reserve and
> the main parachute on the back of the rig, instead of the "conventional"
> system where the main was on the back, the reserve was on the front.
>
> however, modern dual-harness, dual-parachute systems were developed
> well after the first piggyback systems. they just reused the name.
>
Oh Bill,
You just joined the "geezer" club...... I should know... I'm a member, as
well...... :-)
Sandy Wambach
D-7606
(Remember when a "conventional" rig meant something that today's new jumpers
would hardly find "conventional...?"
Rita
Kleggo wrote:
> many of us that do not derive income from tandems consider them an unwanted
> amusement-park-ride annoyance.
Now, now, Kleggo ... that's not nice! Why on earth would a tandem pair be
annoying for you? Are they interfering with your fun? My lord, if tandem is
the only way for someone to experience the joy of this sport, what's the
problem with it? Do you realize how many skydivers enter the sport each year
directly as a result of an awesome tandem experience ... many of whom
probably would never have considered taking the full training originally?
Come on ... lighten up. :)
> their most useful purpose??????? dz solvency.
Buys those nice things you like at the dz, though, huh? Fun stuff like nice
planes, first rate pilots, a comfortable place to pack in ... imagine what
you would probably have to pay for a jump ticket if all those annoying tandem
students weren't footing the bill for you! :)
And look at all the people tandem has provided a decent living for ... tm's
look reasonably well fed ... video flyers seem to be spending most of their
summer weekends in the air ... the food concession on the dz is usually
bustling ... pilots are happy flying all those loads ... licensed skydivers
are getting lots of 'tude, so they're happy ... so, what's your problem with
tandem?
> > They don't have to pack every fucking time they land!!!
Isn't that nice! And, not only do tandem students not have to pack, but we
don't even have to lug all that shit back into the hanger! We've got a big
strapping tm to take care of that "heavy stuff" for us ... we just take a
leisurely stroll across the lz while we listen to the birds sing and enjoy
the sunshine! :)
God, that was the hardest thing to get used to again with this S/L program
I've been trying to slowly get through in these cold winter months ... I had
forgotten just how heavy all that shit was! I really got spoiled over this
past summer doing the tandems! I do my first landing and am standing there
(after I got up off my ass, that is) waiting for someone to meet me and help
carry all this stuff ... then it dawns on me ... shit! I've got a long
trudge back ... and I'll sure as hell be lugging my own gear! Oh, well ...
so is life, I guess! :)
Seriously ... I think tandem has done a lot to advance the sport ... at the
very least, it certainly hasn't hurt it. And tandem has made the sport
accessible to many people who would otherwise not get the opportunity to
participate, either because of physical limitations or other difficulties. I
know that without having this training method to avail myself of, I would
have had to give up the sport well over a year ago. I simply had no aptitude
for it and was failing at AFF miserably. I had reached a point where I was
simply unsafe in the air.
So next time you see one of those annoying tandem "amusement ride" passengers
... consider the fact that they are entitled to at least a little piece of
the fun that someone of your level gets to experience everyday ... and then
think of the fact that, perhaps for them, this is just a one-time experience.
At least you will get to enjoy the sport many times over ... and that is due,
at least partially, to their financial subsidy of the sport.
Blue skies,
--rita
Robert Haig
In article <34A844...@philly.infi.net>,
Rita <kr...@philly.infi.net> wrote:
>Kleggo wrote:
>
>> many of us that do not derive income from tandems consider them an unwanted
>> amusement-park-ride annoyance.
>
>Now, now, Kleggo ... that's not nice! Why on earth would a tandem pair be
>annoying for you? Are they interfering with your fun? My lord, if tandem is
>the only way for someone to experience the joy of this sport, what's the
>problem with it?
The problem comes when DZO's drive off the experienced jumpers so that
their precious tandems don't have to wait on us. The problem comes when a
load (yes, a full load) of experienced jumpers sits on the ground, looking at
the plane (not running, waiting on the tandems) for 20min while manifest
follows DZO orders to not bump the tandems.
>And look at all the people tandem has provided a decent living for ... tm's
>look reasonably well fed ... video flyers seem to be spending most of their
>summer weekends in the air ... the food concession on the dz is usually
>bustling ... pilots are happy flying all those loads ... licensed skydivers
>are getting lots of 'tude, so they're happy ... so, what's your problem with
>tandem?
yea for the vidiots who can make a living shooting tandems. God forbid they
get skilled enough to shoot something more challenging. (not to say that
shooting a tandem isn't challenging the first 1 or 2 times you do it)
The food consession (if the food is decent) is bustling... (read: too fscking
busy for me to eat, pack & make the next load, unless I get bumpped by the
tandems... ok, there, now I can eat.) and tell us... does "'tude' refer to
the altitude we get from the planes, or the attitude we get from the fscking
one-time-wonders that think they are god.
conversation overheard in front of manifest:
one-time-wonder: (coming back from tandem) YEAH!! That Rocks!!
OTW's Girlfriend: Was it fun?
OTW: It kicked serious ASS!!! That Rocked!!
rigger: (drinking beer on the table with us after last load)
Buy a no-fear t-shirt.
I think I laughed so hard beer came out my nose.
>
>> > They don't have to pack every fucking time they land!!!
>
>Isn't that nice! And, not only do tandem students not have to pack, but we
>don't even have to lug all that shit back into the hanger! We've got a big
>strapping tm to take care of that "heavy stuff" for us ... we just take a
>leisurely stroll across the lz while we listen to the birds sing and enjoy
>the sunshine! :)
You can be an experienced jumper and not pack, just pay someone.
(ref. K & B thread)
I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not know
how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I don't
know who signed their licence app.
>Seriously ... I think tandem has done a lot to advance the sport ... at the
>very least, it certainly hasn't hurt it. And tandem has made the sport
>accessible to many people who would otherwise not get the opportunity to
>participate, either because of physical limitations or other difficulties. I
>know that without having this training method to avail myself of, I would
>have had to give up the sport well over a year ago. I simply had no aptitude
>for it and was failing at AFF miserably. I had reached a point where I was
>simply unsafe in the air.
I'm not saying tandem is a bad thing.
All things in moderation...
>So next time you see one of those annoying tandem "amusement ride" passengers
>... consider the fact that they are entitled to at least a little piece of
>the fun that someone of your level gets to experience everyday ... and then
>think of the fact that, perhaps for them, this is just a one-time experience.
great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the fsck off
the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real skydivers, then let
them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
--
Rob
Rita
I'm having a ball with this thread! Just the thing I needed to chase away
the wintertime blues! :)
Robert Haig <rh...@austin.ibm.com> wrote in article
<689tr0$27c0$1...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>...
> The problem comes when DZO's drive off the experienced jumpers so that
> their precious tandems don't have to wait on us. The problem comes when
a
> load (yes, a full load) of experienced jumpers sits on the ground,
looking at
> the plane (not running, waiting on the tandems) for 20min while manifest
> follows DZO orders to not bump the tandems.
I won't argue one bit with you here. That truly sucks. I guess I've just
never experienced that. I've done just about all of my tandems at Skydive
Cross Keys, and I have never, ever seen an experienced skydiver sit on the
ground because of tandem traffic. I think they divey up the planeloads
between licensed and "student" traffic there ... and only put a maximum
number of tandems/AFFs on a load. In fact, on several occasions, I had to
wait because I was too friggin stupid to call ahead and let them know I was
coming. But, hey, I didn't mind ... it gave me the opportunity to sit out
on the back deck and check out all the nice bods! :)
> yea for the vidiots who can make a living shooting tandems. God forbid
they
> get skilled enough to shoot something more challenging. (not to say that
> shooting a tandem isn't challenging the first 1 or 2 times you do it)
Shooting my videos was always challenging ... not to mention entertaining
for the "vidiot!" :)
My first AFF, I had a conversation that went something like this:
"Hi, I'll be shooting your video today!"
"Oh, you drew the booby prize, huh? You been doing this for a while?"
"Yep."
< Look of desperation on my face > "Look man ... please ... this is my
first AFF dive ... people are going to expect to see this tape. I'm gonna
have no choice but to show it to them. Right now I have no idea what the
f*ck I'm trying to do here ... but I need to look good doing it ... can you
try to help me out?"
Believe me, he had to be good ... I actually had people thinking I did
great on that dive!
It was my first Level I flunk!
> The food consession (if the food is decent) is bustling... (read: too
fscking
> busy for me to eat, pack & make the next load, unless I get bumpped by
the
> tandems... ok, there, now I can eat.)
Well, to be perfectly honest ... we prefer it when you guys don't get a
chance to eat ... then we don't have to worry about smelling your farts all
the way to 'tude! :)
> and tell us... does "'tude' refer to
> the altitude we get from the planes, or the attitude we get from the
fscking
> one-time-wonders that think they are god.
Yeah, but come on now ... try to remember back to a time ... long, long ago
... when you were that "one-time wonder." Didn't you feel like you owned
the world and everybody in it too? Give them a break! They just had the
experience of their lives ... and they want to tell everyone about this new
discovery they've made! Surely you can cut them just a little slack?
> I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not know
> how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I don't
> know who signed their licence app.
Ummmm, no one at any of the dz's I've been to would have signed them off,
of that I'm pretty sure. And, seriously, not knowing how to pack could be
a real liability for an experienced jumper ... what do you do on the
weekend the packers are busy? Sit on the ground?
I know that I, for one, wouldn't want to be signed off for a license
application without having satisfactorily demonstrated that particular
skill. I probably wouldn't enjoy the process, but packing seems to me to
be something that every serious skydiver should at least have some working
knowledge of, even if there are occasions when he would rather just pay
someone to take care of that for him.
> I'm not saying tandem is a bad thing.
> All things in moderation...
Is ten tandems moderation, in your humble opinion? :)
> great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the fsck
off
> the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real skydivers, then
let
> them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
Fine. But then perhaps you should make the effort to get to know some of
them and invite them to do just that! You might be pleasantly surprised at
all the beer that suddenly begins flowing after sunset, as all these eager
newbies contribute their case and then sit down to join you around the camp
fire. And think of all the fun you'll have too! You'll have a whole new
set of people to listen to your tired old bullshit stories! :)
Blue ones,
--rita
Gwyn Boehringer
Robert Haig <rh...@austin.ibm.com> wrote in article
<689tr0$27c0$1...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>...
>
> The problem comes when DZO's drive off the experienced jumpers so that
> their precious tandems don't have to wait on us. The problem comes when
a
> load (yes, a full load) of experienced jumpers sits on the ground,
looking at
> the plane (not running, waiting on the tandems) for 20min while manifest
> follows DZO orders to not bump the tandems.
Yes, that would tick me off too. Can you find another DZ to go to?
> and tell us... does "'tude' refer to
> the altitude we get from the planes, or the attitude we get from the
fscking
> one-time-wonders that think they are god.
> conversation overheard in front of manifest:
> one-time-wonder: (coming back from tandem) YEAH!! That Rocks!!
> OTW's Girlfriend: Was it fun?
> OTW: It kicked serious ASS!!! That Rocked!!
> rigger: (drinking beer on the table with us after last load)
> Buy a no-fear t-shirt.
I love being on loads with tandems, I prefer them over my definition of the
stereotypical "skygod" any day. They keep the fun in the sport for me and
remind me of how it felt when I first started jumping. I need to be
reminded of this feeling, as I keep debating on whether or not to quit the
sport entirely. I don't think they are one-time wonders, they just
experienced what may be the most exciting thing they have ever done in
their lives and they are showing this excitement. Now if they got down on
the ground, yawned, and said "no biggie, I could do this in my sleep," I
would probably think they were just waiting until they could get in private
and pee their pants.
> >> > They don't have to pack every fucking time they land!!!
Who cares? Pay someone to pack yours if you want, tandems pay upwards of
$150 and this is part of the price. When I first started jumping, I
believed packing your own canopy was just part of being a skydiver. I
wanted to learn how to so I could be one step closer to actually being a
skydiver. Now when I started pro-packing my brand new Sabre, I did enlist
the help of quite a few people. But now that I know how to, I never have
anyone else pack it. Partially because $5 a pack job could be put towards
another jump! But I don't give a rip if someone else always pays to have
someone else pack for them. Why should I care?
> I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not know
> how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I don't
> know who signed their licence app.
Is this common on all DZs? I have only started to travel to new DZs within
the past season, and I have been paying attention to how each one operates
just to see what is common at all DZs, and what isn't. 50 jumps and can't
pack doesn't seem right to me. Maybe it depends on whether they are SL or
AFF jumps.
> great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the fsck
off
> the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real skydivers, then
let
> them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
Most tandems that only want that one jump for bragging rights leave right
after they land. They got what they came for, now they can go home and
tell their friends. However, those who may be interested in learning more
need to be made to feel welcome first if they are to stay, watch, and
listen. I judge DZs by the general attitude or atmosphere of the place.
If it seems warm and friendly, I will stay. If it seems hostile, I will
leave.
I can't understand why some skydivers feel so threatened by tandems
(unless, the DZ continues to bump experienced people like you
indicated...this should be taken out on the DZ, not the tandems). Tandems
have never got in my way on a load, never held up a load for a dirt dive
which should have been over 10 minutes earlier, never harassed me on the
plane, never walk on my rig while I am packing, etc. In other words, they
don't bother me!
Gwyn
bil...@qualcomm.com
In article <689tr0$27c0$1...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>,
rh...@austin.ibm.com (Robert Haig) wrote:
> yea for the vidiots who can make a living shooting tandems. God forbid they
> get skilled enough to shoot something more challenging.
hm! i think shooting tandems is pretty challenging. they slip and
slide like crazy (unlike 4-way) their fall rate is all over the place
(unlike 4-way) and if you're not careful on exit you just might get your
cameras torn off by the drouge (unlike 4-way.) you can get away with
crappy video more easily, since the tandem student has likely never seen
a skydiving video before. but they are tougher to do well, i think, than
your typical 4-way video.
> great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the fsck off
> the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real skydivers, then let
> them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
why? tandem passengers are fun when they hang around the DZ. they're
generally pretty happy, are a good source of amusement, and can quite
easily be talked into buying beer - a good thing. have we gotten so
snobby that we can't hang out with anyone but experienced jumpers?
H.renting
Rita <kr...@philly.infi.net> schreef in artikel
<01bd14fd$015570e0$9696...@pnioper.phillypapers>...
> I'm having a ball with this thread! Just the thing I needed to chase
away
> the wintertime blues! :)
>
> Robert Haig <rh...@austin.ibm.com> wrote in article
> <689tr0$27c0$1...@ausnews.austin.ibm.com>...
Never saw thsi article..strange..maybe it will appear someday for me...
<snip>
>
> > The food consession (if the food is decent) is bustling... (read: too
> fscking
> > busy for me to eat, pack & make the next load, unless I get bumpped by
> the
> > tandems... ok, there, now I can eat.)
>
> Well, to be perfectly honest ... we prefer it when you guys don't get a
> chance to eat ... then we don't have to worry about smelling your farts
all
> the way to 'tude! :)
Tell me if i am way off the subject here..but what i do hate is the
following : If i am going to jump i am a little bit nervous nothing much
but something...but this is the fun of the sport but i have to eat too and
this is what makes me really nervous because i don't know how much time
i've got..should i order or shan't i? and then eat eat eat i going to be
late..or the kitchen is very slow..this is what breakes me up..in the plane
i am not a nervous wreck because of the jump but because of the servere
stress i've been through eating..:-)
<snip>
> > I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not
know
>
> > how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I
don't
>
> > know who signed their licence app.
>
> Ummmm, no one at any of the dz's I've been to would have signed them off,
> of that I'm pretty sure. And, seriously, not knowing how to pack could
be
> a real liability for an experienced jumper ... what do you do on the
> weekend the packers are busy? Sit on the ground?
>
> I know that I, for one, wouldn't want to be signed off for a license
> application without having satisfactorily demonstrated that particular
> skill. I probably wouldn't enjoy the process, but packing seems to me to
> be something that every serious skydiver should at least have some
working
> knowledge of, even if there are occasions when he would rather just pay
> someone to take care of that for him.
>
I've packed for me own since my second jump...(the weather was really
rotten) and i took my packing test just recently with pride.."hey guys..i
may not know how to fall out of an airplane but i sure know how to pack!"
And about the test...man the screwed the risers and steering lines up..but
then again i always liked a challenge..heck i go to school don't I!
Happy Newyear,
Paul C. Renting
"Don't make me wanna pack for yea!"
H.renting
:-)
Also the instructors and the Tandem masters always know how to make you
laugh with passengers..i remember this summer we had an holding for 9000
foot and we went up (i was gonna do a 10 sec so i went out at 5000 this
also ment i was next to the door and next to me there where a tandem
"couple" then the news came that the holding was lifted and we would go to
12000 (well the rest of the jumpers..i would jump out at 5000) so the j/m
asked at the t/m you wanna go to 12000 too? "yeah sure" ok...then a few
seconds silence...and then at the passenger very off-hand.."well this is
your...3th 4th jump?" "no my first !" "Your FIRST???" then looked at the
t/m with a face which only Henk Post could make. (the j/m currently in New
Zealand with his g/f Emma) you should have seen his face..it said something
like "WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU DOING.....12000!!!!!..OH MAN!" unfortunatly i
was to tensed myself to laugh about it....(well you had to be there...:-))
Happy New Year..and if you know Henk Post say hello to him from we will
yea!
Paul C. Renting
"nothing to worry about people..just a little turbulence..."
Robert Haig
In article <01bd14fd$015570e0$9696...@pnioper.phillypapers>,
Rita <kr...@philly.infi.net> wrote:
>I'm having a ball with this thread! Just the thing I needed to chase away
>the wintertime blues! :)
>
>
>I won't argue one bit with you here. That truly sucks. I guess I've just
>never experienced that. I've done just about all of my tandems at Skydive
>Cross Keys, and I have never, ever seen an experienced skydiver sit on the
>ground because of tandem traffic.
then you have found a good place to jump. My complaint points mainly to the
attitude of the DZO at dropzones like I described.
>
>> yea for the vidiots who can make a living shooting tandems. God forbid
>they
>> get skilled enough to shoot something more challenging. (not to say that
>
>> shooting a tandem isn't challenging the first 1 or 2 times you do it)
>
>Shooting my videos was always challenging ... not to mention entertaining
>for the "vidiot!" :)
>
>My first AFF, I had a conversation that went something like this:
>
shooting AFF L1 jumps is a hell of a lot more challenging than tandems,
And a hell of a lot more scary too I bet.
>Well, to be perfectly honest ... we prefer it when you guys don't get a
>chance to eat ... then we don't have to worry about smelling your farts all
>the way to 'tude! :)
Rita dear, that has to do with the mexican food we ate last night while
drinking copious amounts of dark beer. And then with the potato, egg &
cheese (with peppers) breakfast tacos we ate this morning and washed down
with a pot of strong black coffee. And if we're particularly nasty, we'll
eat a few pickled eggs also.
> Surely you can cut them just a little slack?
see the below discussion of beer purchasing
>> I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not know
>> how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I don't
>> know who signed their licence app.
>
>Ummmm, no one at any of the dz's I've been to would have signed them off,
once again. this is due to the attitude of suspect DZOs
I sometimes pack for hire on the weekends, and I will not work for the people
whom I know don't know how to pack. I'll teach them for free if they ask.
>> I'm not saying tandem is a bad thing.
>> All things in moderation...
>
>Is ten tandems moderation, in your humble opinion? :)
no comment :)
>> great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the
>>fsck off the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real
>>skydivers, then let them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
>
>Fine. But then perhaps you should make the effort to get to know some of
>them and invite them to do just that! You might be pleasantly surprised at
>all the beer that suddenly begins flowing after sunset, as all these eager
>newbies contribute their case and then sit down to join you around the camp
>fire. And think of all the fun you'll have too! You'll have a whole new
>set of people to listen to your tired old bullshit stories! :)
>
more than happy to do so if they come back. or if they linger after sundown
(or if they're cute) but I'm not going to waste my time talking to some
one jump wonder who is never coming back. (note the above 'cute exception')
--
Rob
Robert Haig
In article <01bd153e$e1ee7a20$6a39...@boehrgw-cn.DaytonOH.NCR.COM>,
Gwyn Boehringer <Gwyn.Bo...@DaytonOH.NCR.COM> wrote:
>> the plane (not running, waiting on the tandems) for 20min while manifest
>> follows DZO orders to not bump the tandems.
>
>Yes, that would tick me off too. Can you find another DZ to go to?
see a thread from the end of this summer
(subject: I'm being forced th change drop zones)
>> I know of at least 2 jumpers that have more than 50 jumps and do not know
>
>> how to pack. Not 'forgotten how', but 'never knew how'. And, no I don't
>
>> know who signed their licence app.
>
>Is this common on all DZs? I have only started to travel to new DZs within
>the past season, and I have been paying attention to how each one operates
>just to see what is common at all DZs, and what isn't. 50 jumps and can't
>pack doesn't seem right to me. Maybe it depends on whether they are SL or
>AFF jumps.
no, I'd say it's not common. (God, I hope not) Most student programs have
some sort of structured packing class or test.
>Most tandems that only want that one jump for bragging rights leave right
>after they land. They got what they came for, now they can go home and
>tell their friends. However, those who may be interested in learning more
>need to be made to feel welcome first if they are to stay, watch, and
>listen. I judge DZs by the general attitude or atmosphere of the place.
>If it seems warm and friendly, I will stay. If it seems hostile, I will
>leave.
During the day, I'm not usually standing on place long enough to talk to
the whuffs. If I am however, I make small talk. After sunset, if there are
any still around, I'm happy do discuss skydiving with them. (and drink their
beer)
>I can't understand why some skydivers feel so threatened by tandems
>(unless, the DZ continues to bump experienced people like you
>indicated...this should be taken out on the DZ, not the tandems).
That's why I rarely jump there anymore. I also know of at least 2 JMs
who don't work for him any more and 2 other jumpers that are jumping
elsewhere more often.
>Tandems
>have never got in my way on a load, never held up a load for a dirt dive
>which should have been over 10 minutes earlier, never harassed me on the
>plane, never walk on my rig while I am packing, etc. In other words, they
>don't bother me!
If that were the case where I learned to jump, I'm sure they wouldn't bother
me either.
--
Rob
Tom Beals
t>
>I love being on loads with tandems,
>remind me of how it felt when I first started jumping.
was just sitting there enjoying the ride when the lady asked the t/m
about me. "Oh, he'll get out before us", was the answer. "You mean
you're going out alone?" she says to me. As a newbie with a brand new
"A" it made my day.
Tom Beals
A28026
Rita
Brings back memories. My first AFF dive ... first Otter ride ... plane
takes off and everyone on board starts whooping and hollering as soon as we
clear the ground. I innocently turn around to a jm behind me ... "What?
Is this the pilot's first time too?"
Blue ones!
--rita
Brian Darnell <cog...@mcs.net> wrote in article
<NEWTNews.8835553...@cogtech.mcs.net>...
> I agree bill. The funnest rides to altitude usually involve an
> otter with our 4-way and the rest tandems. They hoot and holler
> on take-off and remind me that this is supposed to be fun. I also
> like watching their faces on jump run as their eyes get real big
> and they start getting kinda pale.
Robert Haig
>> great, then they should enjoy their one time experience, and get the fsck off
>> the DZ. and out of my way. If they want to become real skydivers, then let
>> them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer.
>
>generally pretty happy, are a good source of amusement, and can quite
>easily be talked into buying beer - a good thing. have we gotten so
>snobby that we can't hang out with anyone but experienced jumpers?
>
no, but like I said... "let them stay, watch, listen, and buy their beer"
If they do stay after sunset, then they are interested in more than just
the bragging rights on monday at the office. Then they are probably fun
people, and I'll ask them if they want to go on a beer run with me.
(of course they end up buying beer too :)
I hope I haven't gotten snobby like that. I still talk to the whuffos.
especially if it's after sunset & they have beer. :)
--
Rob
TooyT
>From: "Rita"
>Brings back memories
>My first >AFF dive ... first Otter ride .
case of BEER BEER BEER ;-)USS
H.renting
I know the feeling...it's great ain't it?
Paul C. Renting
"Don't worry folks, it's just a little turbulence"
Tom Beals <tbe...@tir.com> schreef in artikel
<34a9ba15...@news.tir.com>...
FREFALLGUY
In article <NEWTNews.8835553...@cogtech.mcs.net>, Brian Darnell
<cog...@mcs.net> writes:
>I agree bill. The funnest rides to altitude usually involve an
>otter with our 4-way and the rest tandems. They hoot and holler
>on take-off and remind me that this is supposed to be fun.
Hey, its all good.
>I also like watching their faces on jump run as their eyes get
>real big and they start getting kinda pale.
Are you talking about ME or my victi, er, uh...Tandem
Passengers? ;-)
Marc