Voyage gets new Timberliner Trains
ace
feel faster and a lot smoother in 2010, thanks to a new set of trains,
engineered by the same team who designed the record-breaking coaster.
“When the engineers at The Gravity Group told us they designed
Timberliner trains with The Voyage in mind, they definitely got our
attention” says Holiday World & Splashin' Safari president Will Koch.
“The Voyage is extreme and we want to keep it that way season after
season. These new trains will help a lot.”"
http://holidayworld.com/node/3071
Can't wait until next year;
BaSSiStiSt
Holy crap!
(User checks date to ensure it's not April 1)
Keith Hopkins
news:2084aeb8-1e8d-42c6...@g27g2000yqn.googlegroups.com...
"The padded seats will also accommodate wider-hipped and longer-legged
riders."
BLESS YOU HOLIDAY WORLD AND GRAVITY GROUP.
--
Keith "wide hips and long legs" Hopkins
suss...@sssssssssgmail.ssssssssscom
[clear up the hissing to email]
"Excuse me, sir, but you appear to be sitting
on my gown. Would you be so kind as to move?"
Mark McKenzie
I hack as good as I give birth
don't like the lap bars... voyage will probably lose it's #1 status
BaSSiStiSt
<sussk...@sssssssssgmail.ssssssssscom> wrote:
> "The padded seats will also accommodate wider-hipped and longer-legged
> riders."
The trains also reportedly use gravy for lubrication. When the rails
get heated up, Voyage will CRUSH the competition in the "best-smelling
woodie" poll.
BaSSiStiSt
<steelfo...@aol.com> wrote:
> don't like the lap bars... voyage will probably lose it's #1 status
Have you sat in one and tried them out? They're not currently running
on anything, correct?
I hack as good as I give birth
I've been on similar seats. I personally am ok with this, but the
purists that love they airtime will have issues.
mamoosh
wrote:
> I've been on similar seats. I personally am ok with this, but the
> purists that love they airtime will have issues.
Similar seats? If you're referring to GCI's Millennium Flyers the only
thing "similar" is the single bench design. The restraint systems are
completely different.
mamoosh
> Similar seats? If you're referring to GCI's Millennium Flyers the only
> thing "similar" is the single bench design. The restraint systems are
> completely different.
I forgot to mention: I'm pretty certain Timberliners will not have
seatbelts.
I hack as good as I give birth
Lap bars that encircle your midsection are what I meant as similar. I
hope these are the greatest seats in the world, we'll see...
BaSSiStiSt
wrote:
They look similar to the Maurer Sohne X-Car restraints...ouchy.
Maybe Voyage will have "Big Boy" seats now, LOL!
AirtimeJunkie
I'll wait for the TRs to come in before I get excited about this news.
Kevin
NoGodForMe
Looks like a B&M hyper design on a wooden track. Bucket seats,
smooth ride.
It's a great idea after the disaster of SOB, looks like they listened
to everyone complaining about the cramped seats on that one. The
purists are going to complain it's too smooth, it's not a true wooden
coaster. I say screw that, the old wooden train designs are not
meant for adults. And that's why SOB is history, even after
removing the loop and trying to retrack it. I'll give this a
thumbs up. Looks like the loading times will be much faster too.
kirk_ri...@yahoo.com
>
> It's a great idea after the disaster of SOB, looks like they listened
> to everyone complaining about the cramped seats on that one. The
> purists are going to complain it's too smooth, it's not a true wooden
> coaster. I say screw that, the old wooden train designs are not
> meant for adults. And that's why SOB is history, even after
> removing the loop and trying to retrack it. I'll give this a
> thumbs up. Looks like the loading times will be much faster too.
SOB is history because it was too big. Wooden coasters were never
meant to be that big
mamoosh
> They look similar to the Maurer Sohne X-Car restraints...ouchy.
Funny...we rode that together and I felt no discomfort with those
restraints.
BaSSiStiSt
They didn't bother me so much on X-Coaster, but they really did on G-
Force. Maybe because I'm fatter, LOL!
AlRx60
From the photo, it appears each seat is directly on top of the wheel.
On a PTC train, that can equate to a bumpier ride (depending on the
actual coaster). I hope that doesn't equate the same with the
Timberliner trains.
Regardless, I am due back to HW for some Voyage rides.
KenR
mamoosh
> From the photo, it appears each seat is directly on top of the wheel.
> On a PTC train, that can equate to a bumpier ride (depending on the
> actual coaster). I hope that doesn't equate the same with the
> Timberliner trains.
> Regardless, I am due back to HW for some Voyage rides.
Ken - from the press release: "The seats are ergonomically designed
for greater comfort, including an exclusive seat-suspension design."
Mike Parker
manufactured in Indianapolis. The Gravity Group is headquartered in
Cincinnati."
2 trains?
Andrew Brawley
"Mike Parker" <FPark...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:hda98e$ut9$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
> "The Voyage�s two new trains, which will each seat 28 riders, will be
> Cincinnati."
>
> 2 trains?
How often do they actually run all three PTCs? With no seatbelts, one can
expect dispatches to be faster than they are now. (Not that they ever
seemed slow to me anyway.) It may end up being more feasible to run three
with these trains, but will it really be necessary? They may opt to buy a
third one in the future, but even though they have a unique relationship
with TGG, you have to expect that each train is going to run around a
million a pop. It seems rather bold of them to buy *two* at once until they
are tested and public reaction is assessed. But I'm fairly sure that both
HW and especially TGG want to make a statement here, and a lot of homework
has been done. I intend to sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride while I
watch where things go from here.
mamoosh
> How often do they actually run all three PTCs? With no seatbelts, one can
> expect dispatches to be faster than they are now. (Not that they ever
> seemed slow to me anyway.) It may end up being more feasible to run three
> with these trains, but will it really be necessary? They may opt to buy a
> third one in the future, but even though they have a unique relationship
> with TGG, you have to expect that each train is going to run around a
> million a pop. It seems rather bold of them to buy *two* at once until they
> are tested and public reaction is assessed. But I'm fairly sure that both
> HW and especially TGG want to make a statement here, and a lot of homework
> has been done. I intend to sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride while I
> watch where things go from here.
Not to mention the wheel assembly is specifically designed to handle
the curves and banking, thus lessening the amount of speed lost due to
friction. It is expected that Voyage will be running faster! (I am the
only one who read the entire press release? lol)
slayinthename
> They may opt to buy a
> third one in the future, but even though they have a unique relationship
> with TGG, you have to expect that each train is going to run around a
> million a pop.
According to this article the park is spending $540,000.00 on these
two new trains.
http://www.courierpress.com/news/2009/nov/09/new-trains-should-make-award-winning-coaster-feel-/
Wolf
"mamoosh" <msul...@ntmllc.com> wrote in message
news:1a1f0436-078e-45ee...@x6g2000prc.googlegroups.com...
-----------
Yeah, but you like being stuck in tight places.
--
|\-/|
<0 0>
=(o)=
-Wolf
Wolf
---------------
SoB's fundamental problem wasn't its size.
Wolf
>> manufactured in Indianapolis. The Gravity Group is headquartered in
>> Cincinnati."
>>
>> 2 trains?
>
> How often do they actually run all three PTCs? With no seatbelts, one can
> expect dispatches to be faster than they are now. (Not that they ever
> seemed slow to me anyway.) It may end up being more feasible to run three
> with these trains, but will it really be necessary? They may opt to buy a
> third one in the future, but even though they have a unique relationship
> with TGG, you have to expect that each train is going to run around a
> million a pop. It seems rather bold of them to buy *two* at once until
> they are tested and public reaction is assessed. But I'm fairly sure that
> both HW and especially TGG want to make a statement here, and a lot of
> homework has been done. I intend to sit back, relax, and enjoy the ride
> while I watch where things go from here.
It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
Might be fun to run the 3rd PTC head to head against the TL.
slayinthename
> It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
>
They won't have them around. The PTCs are going to another park.
Wolf
"slayinthename" <hype...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1f4318ba-b019-4219...@p8g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 9, 10:30 pm, "Wolf" <bill.buss...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
>
They won't have them around. The PTCs are going to another park.
--------
What park needed 3 PTCs?
slayinthename
> "slayinthename" <hyperd...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> news:1f4318ba-b019-4219...@p8g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
> On Nov 9, 10:30 pm, "Wolf" <bill.buss...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
>
> They won't have them around. The PTCs are going to another park.
>
> --------
>
> What park needed 3 PTCs?
The article from the Courier Press didn't say where.
It just stated "The old trains, which are in good condition, will go
to another park’s roller coaster."
Dave Althoff, Jr.
:
: It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
:
: Might be fun to run the 3rd PTC head to head against the TL.
I guess they did exactly that when they were testing the rolling chassis on
the Raven. The PTC train screeched and rattled its way around the course.
The Timberliner...rolled.
--Dave Althoff, Jr.
/X\ _ *** Respect rides. They do not respect you. ***
/XXX\ /X\ /X\_ _ /X\__ _ _ _____
/XXXXX\ /XXX\ /XXXX\_ /X\ /XXXXX\ /X\ /X\ /XXXXX
_/XXXXXXX\__/XXXXX\/XXXXXXXX\_/XXX\_/XXXXXXX\__/XXX\_/XXX\_/\_/XXXXXX
NEW! When emailing this account, include the 'canonical magic word' in
the body of your message for a quicker response.
Dave Althoff, Jr.
That's a pretty extreme sign of confidence if they aren't keeping the PTCs
around for at least one full season. My expectation is that if the
Timberliners are successful, we might see a third one on the Voyage. If
they are ridiculously successful, we might see a set running on the Legend
next. And if they are abject failures, we'll see the PTCs back on the
Voyage before the end of the season.
My impression is that where this kind of stuff is concerned, Holiday World
doesn't mess around.
Wolf
> :
> : The article from the Courier Press didn't say where.
> :
> : It just stated "The old trains, which are in good condition, will go
> : to another park?s roller coaster."
>
> That's a pretty extreme sign of confidence if they aren't keeping the PTCs
> around for at least one full season. My expectation is that if the
> Timberliners are successful, we might see a third one on the Voyage. If
> they are ridiculously successful, we might see a set running on the Legend
> next. And if they are abject failures, we'll see the PTCs back on the
> Voyage before the end of the season.
>
> My impression is that where this kind of stuff is concerned, Holiday World
> doesn't mess around.
>
> --Dave Althoff, Jr.
Is Legend the first coaster since Riverside Cyclone to potentially go
through three rolling stock changes in ten years?
I hack as good as I give birth
that probably includes new track in areas and a re fit of the station
brakes and lap bar release mechanism. and of course, R&D for the
trains was probably part of the deal.
NoGodForMe
> It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
>
> Might be fun to run the 3rd PTC head to head against the TL.
If the new trains are faster, that will lead to brakes, which will
really frustrate the purists. How much faster can the new trains
be? We'll have to wait and see. The problem is the forces
heading in to turns. They can't keep all that speed if the ride
becomes violent. That was the problem with the beast. And yes,
everyone is correct in saying that a traditional wooden coaster was
never meant to be that big. SOB went over the limit, and now it's
history.
2 trains will be fine. It takes people a few seconds to put their
bags on the other side and for the ride ops to take bags away from
people who brought them on the platform. If you're at an ERT event,
they could probably cycle 3, but not with the GP who take their
time.
I hack as good as I give birth
> > It's not like they won't still have the PTCs around in emergency cases.
>
> > Might be fun to run the 3rd PTC head to head against the TL.
>
> If the new trains are faster, that will lead to brakes, which will
> really frustrate the purists.
Actually with 2 train operation there'll be less braking, making the
triple down constantly spectacular. If they had left the PTCs on this
track it may have lead to additional braking, I don't see that now...
Shawn Mamros
>Is Legend the first coaster since Riverside Cyclone to potentially go
>through three rolling stock changes in ten years?
Even the Cyclone didn't change them that quickly. The Morgans ran on
it for 15 years (give or take a year).
-s
CoasterFanatic
guess they are fairly confident about them.
- Ted
NoGodForMe
Well yeah, it's got everything you could ask for in terms of extreme
elements.
Huge drop to start, mini helix for a turn around, triple down, banked
turns that wind under the track.
I'm surprised they haven't made a quad down, or 10 down. Why not?
If people want so much air, just make a huge hill with 10 step hills
that toss people out of their seat a bunch of times. 10 is probably
extreme, but you get the idea. A quad down will be the next
marketing gimmick.
Chris Godsey
I would guess the maintenance cost annually they will save with these
new trains will pay for itself in a few years. I would bet the
maintenance is FAR more on Voyage than its two older siblings. It
makes perfect sense from that aspect of it. From talking to TGG guys
at Holiwood Nights, they mentioned the friction numbers were like 1/4
of the PTC trains and they were VERY confident of the new train style
and it's success in the future.
Funtype
I believe they have been testing the new train on Raven for a while now.
I thought they would be run on Raven for one full season before stepping
up to either of the 2 other woodies, they must be really confident!
--CM
(wonder if it will ad the 'spark' back to Legend as well)
Wolf
"Shawn Mamros" <mam...@mit.edu> wrote in message
news:4af9aab7$0$507$b45e...@senator-bedfellow.mit.edu...
I'm thinking of the change *to* the Morgans, as opposed to the change *from*
the Morgans.
Dave Althoff, Jr.
They might have to fiddle with the lap bar release a bit, since it's a
14-car train instead of a 7-car train, but the brakes probably don't need
any adjustment. Remember, they ran the rolling chassis on an unmodified
Raven!
Dave Althoff, Jr.
: > : > What park needed 3 PTCs?
Does the nearly annual refit on the Screechin' Eagle count? I realize
there was only two sets of chassis, but it was three completely different
trains...!
Wolf
> PTCs
> : > around for at least one full season. My expectation is that if the
> : > Timberliners are successful, we might see a third one on the Voyage.
> If
> : > they are ridiculously successful, we might see a set running on the
> Legend
> : > next. And if they are abject failures, we'll see the PTCs back on the
> : > Voyage before the end of the season.
> : >
> : > My impression is that where this kind of stuff is concerned, Holiday
> World
> : > doesn't mess around.
> :
> : through three rolling stock changes in ten years?
>
> Does the nearly annual refit on the Screechin' Eagle count? I realize
> there was only two sets of chassis, but it was three completely different
> trains...!
>
> --Dave Althoff, Jr.
Forgot about that one.
Any others?
Not counting something like Lakeside, which has trains built in various
decades and occasionally replaces their classic train with their even more
classic train.
Bill Buckley
>Actually with 2 train operation there'll be less braking, making the
>triple down constantly spectacular.
With 2 trains, there should be NO breaking!! Absolutely no need for it from
a blocking standpoint. Only to trim train speed.
Reading though this thread, am I the ONLY person concerned the new lapbars
look like a tight fit? I barely rode Steel Hawg with its similar style
bars!!! If I do the "walk of shame" at HWN 2010, The Voyage is being moved
directly behind PGA's Grizzly in my Top 155 list!
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4611 (20091116) __________
The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus.
Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think it's #2)
wrote:
> "I hack as good as I give birth" wrote:
>
> >Actually with 2 train operation there'll be less braking, making the
> >triple down constantly spectacular.
>
> With 2 trains, there should be NO breaking!! Absolutely no need for it from
> a blocking standpoint. Only to trim train speed.
My comment was meant to mean less "braking" than is currently used.
One would hope that HW sees this as a reason to allow an even faster
speed thru the block brake after the turn around, making the triple
down, and etc a little faster.
> Reading though this thread, am I the ONLY person concerned the new lapbars
> look like a tight fit? I barely rode Steel Hawg with its similar style
> bars!!!
This is my concern, the current lap bars are fine for me, yet, the
bars that are on the new train appear to be very similar to the ones
used on HRRR and they were quite tight. On the other hand, being
manufactured by a coaster company in the states, one would hope that
the size of the average american would be considered in designing this
rides restraints. They do say that these trains will be more
comfortable for people with long legs and wide hips, but say nothing
about people with a little guttage.
SAM
jrkstl
it's #2)" <steelfo...@aol.com> wrote:
> My comment was meant to mean less "braking" than is currently used.
> One would hope that HW sees this as a reason to allow an even faster
> speed thru the block brake after the turn around, making the triple
> down, and etc a little faster.
Sam - FYI, HW only used the trim for a few month period, during it's
second or third season. They haven't used it at all in the last
couple of seasons and I cannot imagine that they'd need to start using
it with the new trains.
Jeff
Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think it's #2)
I'm not saying that they would! I'm saying that with 2 trains they
wouldn't need braking!
Victor Canfield
I don't understand your reasoning. Block brakes prevent collisions--if
the preceding train is not clear of the block ahead, the following train
must be stopped, completely, and not released until the block is clear.
Slowing would merely decrease the energy in the collision, if one
occurred. Trimming doesn't have anything to do with it, even if it
happens to be convenient to put the trim brakes in the same place, or
even use the same equipment (differently controlled) for both functions.
If the timing is really tight, slowing a train at the block brakes
would, by increasing the time spent in the block, actually increase the
need to halt a following train. (But that would be bad block design.)
Wolf
"Bill Buckley" <vze1...@DELETEME.verizon.n-e-t> wrote in message
news:hdrkt0$h5d$1...@aioe.org...
> "I hack as good as I give birth" wrote:
>>Actually with 2 train operation there'll be less braking, making the
>>triple down constantly spectacular.
>
> With 2 trains, there should be NO breaking!! Absolutely no need for it
> from
> a blocking standpoint. Only to trim train speed.
>
> Reading though this thread, am I the ONLY person concerned the new lapbars
> look like a tight fit? I barely rode Steel Hawg with its similar style
> bars!!! If I do the "walk of shame" at HWN 2010, The Voyage is being
> moved
> directly behind PGA's Grizzly in my Top 155 list!
I wouldn't worry too much about *tall* guys fitting...
But TGG knows what ACErs look like.
Bill Buckley
> I wouldn't worry too much about *tall* guys fitting...
>
> But TGG knows what ACErs look like.
True, they do. However, from the 3D renderings of the seat/lapbar design,
it looks like these were designed with lawyers and state inspectors in
mind -- not ACE members.
__________ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 4613 (20091116) __________
Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think it's #2)
> Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think it's #2) wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Nov 16, 2:00 pm, jrkstl <king_jeff...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Nov 16, 8:18 am, "Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think
>
> >> it's #2)" <steelfo...@aol.com> wrote:
> >>> My comment was meant to mean less "braking" than is currently used.
> >>> One would hope that HW sees this as a reason to allow an even faster
> >>> speed thru the block brake after the turn around, making the triple
> >>> down, and etc a little faster.
> >> Sam - FYI, HW only used the trim for a few month period, during it's
> >> second or third season. They haven't used it at all in the last
> >> couple of seasons and I cannot imagine that they'd need to start using
> >> it with the new trains.
>
> >> Jeff
>
> > I'm not saying that they would! I'm saying that with 2 trains they
> > wouldn't need braking!
>
> I don't understand your reasoning. Block brakes prevent collisions--if
> the preceding train is not clear of the block ahead, the following train
> must be stopped, completely, and not released until the block is clear.
WOW! I know that.. and have for decades.
NGFM Suggested that faster trains would require more braking. I said
that since there's only going to be 2 trains, the brakes would not be
needed as much. I'm not saying they should remove any safety devices.
sheesh.
CoasterFanatic
like the GCI Flyers lost more energy than PTCs. Granted, these trains
are different, but still similar.
// Curious to what the lap times on Raven were in comparison to the
PTCs. Paula?
- Ted
Voting for Grizzly as #1 (cause you all think it's #2)
my guess would be this is more about maintenance savings than speed
Charles Nungester
wrote:
Bill, I know they are more accomidating than the MF trains based on a
friends test fitting. Im told there were more modifications afterward
as well.
Hope someone at IAAPA gets pics up soon!
Chuck
Charles Nungester
Within a second and that was using a unbroken in Four bench train vs a
12 bench PTC
Theme Park Review
>
> - Show quoted text -
Will Koch very excited about his new Timberliner trains:
http://www.themeparkreview.com/forum/files/iaapa17_174.jpg
Our IAAPA update has some IN DEPTH photos of the new Timberliner
Trains:
http://themeparkreview.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=827143#827143
--Robb Alvey
www.themeparkreview.com
BaSSiStiSt
wrote:
> Our IAAPA update has some IN DEPTH photos of the new Timberliner
> Trains:http://themeparkreview.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=827143#827143
Looking at those pictures I'm betting this is Voyage's last poll-
winning year. The trains are pretty but don't look gravy friendly!
VFTB Matt
They do look cozy, don't they? :-P
BaSSiStiSt
> They do look cozy, don't they? :-P
I think they look awesome...BUT, "X-Car" type restraints are bad
enough on a short steel coaster. On the Voyage?? Holy crap.
Mike Parker
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_fT2KqDFga4Y/SwLqDOhWxnI/AAAAAAAACBc/Vf9O0E_Fcjw/s1600/NPNTL1.jpg
There is another pic. I'm sure some of us know Scott Holmes, he's an
all around big buy but not huge or absurdly fat or anything. Now I
don't know if there are sensors on those lapbars, with TPR's pics
showing the hydraulic mechanism on the back of the car with the
electronics, there very well might be. I don't know what the sensor
thought of the positioning of the lapbar for Scott there. But if I was
a park, especially one as safety conscious as HW, I don't think I'd
allow that to go with that huge gap between the lapbar and the "center
divider".
I'm not sure I care for these trains, especially with the high density
foam "padding".
Keith Hopkins
news:he15pm$vt1$1...@news.eternal-september.org...
>
> http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_fT2KqDFga4Y/SwLqDOhWxnI/AAAAAAAACBc/Vf9O0E_Fcjw/s1600/NPNTL1.jpg
Could this be any nerdier?
Not that there's anything wrong with that.
--
Keith Hopkins
suss...@sssssssssgmail.ssssssssscom
[clear up the hissing to email]
"Excuse me, sir, but you appear to be sitting
on my gown. Would you be so kind as to move?"
Mark McKenzie
Tom Henderson
"Keith Hopkins" <suss...@sssssssssgmail.ssssssssscom> wrote in message >
> Could this be any nerdier?
>
> Not that there's anything wrong with that.
That pen in the dude's hand does seriously up the nerdishness of it all.
Where's a pocket-protector when you need one?
Plus, his facial expression looks like he is sitting in something rather
unpleasant.
Wolf
> > Trains:http://themeparkreview.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=827143#827143
>
> Looking at those pictures I'm betting this is Voyage's last poll-
> winning year. The trains are pretty but don't look gravy friendly!
They do look cozy, don't they? :-P
----------
They aren't as small as they look.