z-prophoto digest 16 with some conversation on marketing
zeitgeist
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There are 4 messages in this issue.
Topics in today's digest:
1. Re: Lisa's Studio
From: Lisa Horton <
2. Re: Re: Lisa's Studio
From: "zeitgeist" <
3. RE: VALUED product?
From: "Reyes, Matthew"
4. Re: VALUED product?
From: "zeitgeist"
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Message: 1
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 11:22:50 -0800
From: Lisa
Subject: Re: Lisa's Studio
Hey Z, thanks for the thoughts. I'm
actually going to be moving away
from the Bay Area before opening the studio,
but I'm sure it wouldn't
be
a bad idea to get hooked up with the local
associations while I'm still
here. That's one thing that virtually all
of the books I've read have
strongly suggested.
The way that the books that I've read have
addressed the high/low road
issue was more in terms of what your market
area will support than pick
one and go with it, but it seems logical
that in any but the smallest
markets one would want to pick a path and
pursue it. I know that I
don't want to try to compete with the mall
places. For a lot of
people,
price is at or near the top of their
priorities. I'm not sure that I
want to butt my head against the brick wall
of trying to sell them on
quality. People with money don't intimidate
me, I deal with them a lot
at our retail store (we're in the most
affluent county in the country
here). And theoretically at least, it seems
like it would be easier to
back down from a high end approach than to
upscale from a low end
approach if sales didn't meet expectations.
I've been doing some reading on non-contract
seniors, and that market
seems like a good fit for me. Again it's
selling to the premium
market,
those who want "something better", which I'm
comfortable with. I get
along well with teens and understand them
fairly well, partly due to
extensive experience with them as customers
and employees.
I'm running out of time this morning, but
one big question for me is
how
to estimate sales for the business plan.
How can it be anything but
speculation? How do you pick a number to
put on the plan?
Lisa
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Message: 2
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 16:25:15 -0800
From: "zeitgeist" <
Subject: Re: Re: Lisa's Studio
>The way that the books that I've read have
addressed the high/low road
>issue was more in terms of what your market
area will support than
pick
>one and go with it, but it seems logical
that in any but the smallest
>markets one would want to pick a path and
pursue it.
Everybody knows that Tacoma is a 'blue
collar town" but Scott Bourne
moved
in a couple years ago and charges among the
highest prices in the
country.
At a talk at the local pro association he
got a laugh out of the local
lab
good natured from the heart attempt to have
a good talk with him, sorta
like
a group of concerned friends staging an
intervention on a friend with a
behavior problem, trying to tell him that
"you can't charge those kinds
of
prices here."
It is sorta like a reverse NIMBY. People
think they can't do this in
this
area cause of the market conditions. but
the weird thing is that folks
do
do it in the most frugal hard pan chicken
scratch areas. either in
nowhere
small town america, or center of urban
decay.
I know that I
>don't want to try to compete with the mall
places. For a lot of
people,
>price is at or near the top of their
priorities. I'm not sure that I
>want to butt my head against the brick wall
of trying to sell them on
>quality.
the middle road competes with price against
the volume.
but we are not comparing apples and oranges.
we are comparing hamburger to steak hashe'
restaurants are good to compare marketing
with.
You can buy a 99 cent hamburger at most fast
food places, and the
middle of
the road places that charge $2.99 for it
have lost out, gone are most
of the
lunchrooms so blighted in cartoons. They
offered superiour service,
they
put it on a plate with a sprig of parsly.
but a french restaurant would charge 15 to
25 bucks for steak hashe'
with a
little sauce and a few juleined carrots.
People with money don't intimidate me, I
deal with them a lot
>at our retail store (we're in the most
affluent county in the country
>here). And theoretically at least, it
seems like it would be easier
to
>back down from a high end approach than to
upscale from a low end
>approach if sales didn't meet expectations.
Start an art project, photograph people who
are movers and shakers of
the
community and/or are in the target market.
These do not have to be the
most
obvious examples. There is a synergy (I
don't know if I'm using the
word
right) a critical mass of gathering these
people together, even if
photographically, that creates an aura
greater than the parts. And it
transfers to you as the artist, to the
gallery showing location, even
if
just a coffee shop.
You get sales from the subjects, and by
association, from others in the
community would desire similar work.
I will ask a friend from another group that
has a program on this
approach
if I can repost it here. This guy does
$2,000 portraits in a texas
border
town.
This is a time honored system of promoting
high end work. In urban
areas
places like the symphony, masters of
hustling the 'a' list now charge
photographers for the privelege of pursuing
this avenue. some folks
have
gone after all the ministers in town, (not
usually all that affluent
but a
lot of followers) business people, some
focus on particular
professions.
One woman in Petaluma gathered portraits of
Harley riders, eventually
sold a
coffee table book and now gets paid to ride
around the country shooting
portraits of riders. Polo, there's a sport
that requires serious time
and
money to be involved in. Sailing.
You don't have to chase yuppies and trust
fund babies. Some put
together
interesting exhibits of blue collar and
other professionals, a show of
the
people from the local firehouse, their
diverse free time activities.
For an excellent example of the high end
approach, run down to Los
Gatos and
check out Paul Tumason. This is the guy
whose methods I've been trying
to
work with, the one who taught me the
northlight system and the gallery
approach to studio display.
Marty Rickert put together a more
traditional sales program, a little
to
pushy for most tastes but it's nice to know
to nudge a few people
along,
worked out of New Sharon Iowa, pop 35.
would sell a couple hundred
wall
portraits a year, did promotions
>
>I've been doing some reading on
non-contract seniors, and that market
>seems like a good fit for me. Again it's
selling to the premium
market,
>those who want "something better", which
I'm comfortable with. I get
>along well with teens and understand them
fairly well, partly due to
>extensive experience with them as customers
and employees.
cool, senior portraits can be fun, they seem
to want to be photographed
like
models and superstars, and in fact it
doesn't take to much to become
cool to
the youth market. a few school reps, an
exhibit in a local pizza
parlor, a
cable TV show you can sponsor.
>
>I'm running out of time this morning, but
one big question for me is
how
>to estimate sales for the business plan.
How can it be anything but
>speculation? How do you pick a number to
put on the plan?
>
You need to figure out your overhead and
profit requirements, then the
amount of sales required to meet those draws
and the cost of producing
the
product. It is not a matter of predicting
the future but seeing if the
numbers are possible.
The average photographer looks at what the
others are charging and pegs
their prices at or below that, with little
consideration of their
costs.
The studio in that small town may not have
to pay rent since it's their
property or other considerations, (yeah a
lot of businesses hang on due
to
stuff like that, never realizing that they
could rent the space to a
real
business and make more money than they are
now working.)
its gonna cost you rent and utilities,
insurance, car, communications
(land,
cell, fax internet etc) depreciation, taxes.
don't forget benefits,
your own
retirement, etc. seems the last couple
years most of us would have
made
more money if we sold our cameras and bought
stocks.
You know it can cost you a $100 bucks a day
to say you are open for
business. If you figure out the time you
are available to serve your
clients, your studio can cost $20 to $50
bucks an hour, something to
think
about when your client doesn't show.
Then you need to figure the cost of
producing the product, the
percentage of
the sales price that the products will cost,
print and retouching and
finishing costs.
You need to know if it is possible to get
enough business with your
prices
and service level or you will find yourself
leaving some minor things
off,
like your retirement funds, (who knew I was
gonna get old, huh? we were
all
supposed to get blown up in a nuke war)
low end photographers need to keep that
assembly line running, they
can't
take January and Feb off as they have staff
to keep busy, even though
you
know you are not making any money, you keep
the machinery going. a low
end
wedding photographer doesn't book two
weddings each weekend doesn't get
paid
that week.
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Message: 3
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 16:25:01 -0800
From: "Reyes, Matthew"
Subject: RE: VALUED product?
"...A high end product in wedding or
portraiture can be from many
styles as
long
as it is perceived as a valued product and
is consistent with the
values of
art,..."
Zeitgeist-
I've read your ideas about high end and low
end photography business
models
several times. It makes complete sense to
me. I plan to "retire" from
computers in 7-10 years and want to become a
full time photographer.
My
question is about that tangent. How do you
make your product be
perceived
as a VALUED product? So far most of my
clients only care about the
expressions captured. If the expression
matches the personality they
want
to project, then they are happy. I could
print on any paper, using any
developer, any film, and any camera.
Clearly I must be working with
the low
end business model. What are the marks of a
high end business model?
What
do the high end portrait clients look for
that says VALUED product to
them?
Matt-
PS Thank you VERY much for setting up the
list. Quite informative and
enjoyable.
http://www.r
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Message: 4
Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 21:49:41 -0800
From: "zeitgeist"
Subject: Re: VALUED product?
>From: "Reyes,
>>
>I've read your ideas about high end and low
end photography business models
>several times. It makes complete sense to
me.
It does, good, explain to me then <G>
I plan to "retire" from
>computers in 7-10 years and want to become
a full time photographer.
I've talked about my emperical observation
that the majority of successful
photogs coming from other technical
professions. They are generally not the
most creatiive ones, but they come from an
industry that billls for and pays
professional rates for services rendered.
Now that Boeing is on strike, I
expect another dozen to join the ranks.
My
>question is about that tangent. How do you
make your product be perceived
>as a VALUED product?
The short answer is, You tell them it is.
A marketing exerise is to go buy some soap.
record your impressions and
save everything from your trip to buy both
the cheapest bar and the most
expensive. Just our assumptions on where
to get either one is our first
clue. What does the store look like, how do
the clerks treat you, how is
the product packaged, how is it prepared for
travel.
So far most of my clients only care about
the
>expressions captured. If the expression
matches the personality they want
>to project, then they are happy.
A famous portrait painter used to complain
about the same thing.
I could print on any paper, using any
>developer, any film, and any camera.
Well, yes you could, but it has to be the
best you can do, what makes the
difference between a $39 motel painting and
a 390 print from a consumer
gallery, from a $3900. which one would be
the most obvious difference.
Clearly I must be working with the low
>end business model. What are the marks of
a high end business model? What
>do the high end portrait clients look for
that says VALUED product to
them?
>
I don't think folks really decide one day
based on an ad or a price
reduction to go and spend a couple thousand
on a wall portrait. It needs
to be presented in an inticing way. It
needs to fit into their
psychological needs. Folks don't NEED fancy
cars, but many spend three or
four times what a basic car costs. They see
it in a display, their friend
bought one for their family, and someone who
did a study says that it takes
three years for the concept to percolate
from seeing a display to acting on
the impulse.
How does an art deco nic nac become more
valuable in an antique store than
in a junk shop or your great aunt's living
room?
Nobody needs photography. we can't breathe
it, eat it and probably
unsatisfactory in keeping us warm.