So I gotta flash fill black bears w/ a Quantum Flash?
chuck carlton
a couple of film tests of Brown angora cowboy chaps in sunlight, I
figure I gotta do the old flash fill to get any detail in shadows and
add catchlights. I've got a Q flash and can rig a coffecan fresnel to
extend it's range, and bring my stroboframe. Is it worth it, people?
My N90 dedicated cord doesn't seem to do a good job with the Q flash,
anyway. My SB28 works great 90% of the time but I don't think it will
light up Mr. Bear at 30 yards with ANY extender. Somebody fill me in!
Thanks in Advance. Chuck Carlton (Digital Man going back to film to
shoot the wild).
PS-My hi-tech photo illustration flash site : axiomimaging.com (no
bears or flowers)
Arno Daalder
> light up Mr. Bear at 30 yards with ANY extender. Somebody fill me in!
I think the 30 yards is NOT your biggest problem in terms of flashing
distance, as I think the bear may reach you about as fast as the flash
reaches the bear!
You may call me ignorant - I do come from a bear-less country after all -
but you GOT to be joking when you want use your flashgun for
photographing wild bears at THIS distance.
I have visited bear country several times and I have learned to respect
the bears, both black and brown. Not only for their well being, but
certainly for my own safety too. I have also learned something about
their behaviour and the way they act, so that I can determine a little
whether my presence is disturbing them in ANY way. If I AM disturbing,
even a little, I do not only violate the bears comfort zone, but I also
jeopardize my own safety. At 30 yards, I think you do both.
I will NEVER use a flashlight on a wild bear. If the light is not to your
satisfaction, then go and take photos elsewhere.
"If people persist in trespassing upon the grizzlies' territory, we must
accept the fact that the
grizzlies, from time to time, will harvest a few trespassers" -
Edward Abbey
I do not know what other people think about your plan, but I call it
plain stupid (for your sake) and criminal (bears sake).
I feel quite strongly about this as a) bear is one of my absolute
favourite animals, and b) apart from financially adopting bears, there is
nothing much I can do to support bears (I live in the Netherlands), while
YOU can make the difference whether bears are harassed and pushed to
aggression or not. And if he gets irritated by you, he will react in the
only way he knows: attacking you. This means that you have signed his
death sentence! Would YOU want that on your conscience????
Would you even consider risking this?? Just for a photo?
Remember: "No photograph is worth sacrificing the welfare of the subject"
- Moose Peterson
"You play games by the wildlife's rules or you don't play" – L.L. Rue II
I hope you accept this message as a warning. I once used a flashlight on
a moose, and we were both scared to death by it. The moose reacted in
pure panic and rushed towards me and I nearly shit my pants by the sight
of it. Luckily it changed directions very quickly, but if this had been
the reaction of a brown bear......... I have learned my lesson.
Have a great trip to Alaska (I envy you) and please, think about these
magnificent bears first. We all have their future in our hands; don't
throw that away.
Arno
--
Travel Photography by Arno Daalder
at http://www.photographs.demon.nl
My portfolio can be found at http://www.fotosurf.nl
n...@spam.com
my keyboard.
Nature photography is not just about photography. It's also about respecting
nature. Get fast film and a long lens and don't stress out the bear.
-G
BHilton665
>I'm Brooks Camp, AK bound with too much gear already.
Hey Chuck, I'm going to Brooks Lodge in Sept for 4 days to "shoot" the bears so
please let me know how it went when you return!
>figure I gotta do the old flash fill to get any detail in shadows and
>add catchlights. I've got a Q flash and can rig a coffecan fresnel to
>extend it's range, and bring my stroboframe. Is it worth it, people?
I'm taking a Canon 550 flash with me, using a $35 frensel kit (Better Beamer)
to extend the range. Should be worth it, from what I've heard.
>My SB28 works great 90% of the time but I don't think it will
>light up Mr. Bear at 30 yards with ANY extender. Somebody fill me in!
You don't have to light him/her up, just get a catchlight and maybe fill in a
bit for color balance. With ISO 100-200 film you should be OK out to 30 yards
since you'll probably be one stop or 1.3 stops underexposing anyway with the
flash (not sure of the power of the SB28 but can fill-flash this distance with
the 550 and the Better Beamer).
From talking to guys who made the trip in July one of the big exposure problems
was shooting the dark brown bears against the white water of the falls, since
that's where most of the action is during July. Also hear you are limited to
20 minutes on the viewing platform since they fly in loads of people just to
see the bears, and the platform was so crowded it can be hard to use a 'pod.
That's why we're going in Sept, when the bears are spread out over the lower
part of the river and on the lake shore feeding on spawned out salmon. We'll
see ...
>Thanks in Advance.
Good luck, we were in Alaska last week and it's an amazing place!
Bill
BHilton665
>> My SB28 works great 90% of the time but I don't think it will
>> light up Mr. Bear at 30 yards with ANY extender. Somebody fill me in!
>From: Arno Daalder ar...@photographs.demon.nl
>I do not know what other people think about your plan, but I call it
>plain stupid (for your sake) and criminal (bears sake).
In general I would agree with you but Brooks Camp/Lodge is an exception. The
bears congregate in July to feed on sockeye salmon temporarily stopped by a 6
ft waterfall. There's a viewing platform right on the edge of the falls and
the habituated bears feed as close as 10 yards from people. You might read up
on the place before you start calling people "stupid" and "criminal".
>And if he gets irritated by you, he will react in the only way he knows:
>attacking you. This means that you have signed his death sentence!
Since the mid-1960's there has been one bear-caused injury to a tourist in
Katmai Park (where the Lodge is located). There has never been a fatal bear
attack on a human in Katmai. I doubt Chuck will be the first. Bears wander
thru the campground and in front of the cabins often. Humans have to take a
bear awareness class before getting sent out amidst them and so long as certain
rules are followed the bears accept the humans and vice-versa.
>Remember: "No photograph is worth sacrificing the welfare of the subject"
>- Moose Peterson
And yet Moose doesn't hesitate to get within feet of these same Katami bears
... http://www.moose395.net/photos/2000.html To quote from the article "There
I am, forty feet away from a live, free roaming Grizzly Bear, nothing between
it and me but my 400f2.8 AFS with F5 mounted a top my Gitzo Carbon Fiber 1548."
And further down ... "When you are just two to forty feet away from beasts
weighing anywhere from 450lbs to 900lbs, the experience is hard to capture on
film." 'Two feet'? That's what I call DAMN close.
Maybe you should quote someone else, or do you think Moose isn't playing by his
own rules?
>"You play games by the wildlife's rules or you don't play" – L.L. Rue II
I was shooting in Denali last week beside L.L. Rue and shot grizzly bears in
Yellowstone beside him several years ago, so probably know him better than you
do ... his son little Lennie will be leading a group to Katmai to photograph
brown bears with John Shaw for Van Os when we're there in Sept and I know for a
fact big Lennie and Shaw and young Lennie have no problems approaching the
Katmai bears and using fill flash on them.
>You may call me ignorant ...
How about "uninformed" about the bears of Katmai and we let it go at that?
(grin)
Bill Hilton
chuck carlton
question answered about a technical issue. I didn't ask for some
ignoramus who probably drives a Ford Excursion to lecture me about
his self righteous views on animal rights. Sir, I hope you are a vegan
vegetarian or a jaine buddhist who wears masks over your mouth so the
flys don't die as a result of your existence. Edward Abbey (if you
even read any of his books) would probably burn the Brooks lodge and
the viewing platforms (with or without the photographers) to the
ground. The bears at Brooks camp are so gorged with salmon that they
have been known to take naps on the trails and the Rangers freeze all
movement of human observers.
It is sad that ignorant people must call others names and degrade them
if their opinion or attitudes are not in alignment with their own
narrow view of reality.
I am a life member of the Sierra Club and plan to spend time at a
wilderness camp, where flashing bears would perhaps be more of an
intrusion. Or an invitation to a meal.
So go in peace, "brother".
Chuck CarltonÖ
n...@spam.com
> It is sad that ignorant people must call others names and degrade them
> if their opinion or attitudes are not in alignment with their own
> narrow view of reality.
I just reread the posts (my own included) and nobody called you any names. In
fact everyone was pretty polite. Your posting, however, reaks of self
rightousness and bigotry.
> I am a life member of the Sierra Club
We are all duely impressed.
You asked a technical question and you got a technical answer - use fast film
and long lenses and learn to meter. Your opinions about who drives what
vehicle or how you feel about people's diets do not belong here. You were
the one who introduced them with obvious and blatant prejudice. As you have
shown your intolerance and lack of respect for others - don't expect much
respect in return.
Now go into your wilderness camp with your big Quantum flash and do whatever
it is that makes you happy.
-G
BHilton665
>
>> It is sad that ignorant people must call others names and degrade
>> them if their opinion or attitudes are not in alignment
>From: n...@spam.com
>I just reread the posts (my own included) and nobody called you any names. In
>fact everyone was pretty polite.
Well, not quite. Arno's post says "I do not know what other people think about
your plan, but I call it plain stupid (for your sake) and criminal (bears
sake)."
This would seem to question his intelligence ("stupid") and his ethics
("criminal") and it's easy to see how Chuck would take offense at that.
Especially since you and Arno apparently have no clue about the conditions at
Brooks Lodge/Camp.
>You asked a technical question and you got a technical answer - use fast film
>and long lenses ...
His technical question was about using fill-flash, which is used to cut the
contrast range and/or pick up a high light in the eye. Your "answer" is
worthless and indicates you don't even have the basic photographic skills to
understand the question since using fast film or a long lens do not address the
contrasty lighting issue.
Bill
n...@spam.com
> ("criminal") and it's easy to see how Chuck would take offense at that.
Absolutely, but there was nothing there to berate him personally, just a
passionate attempt to dissuade him from putting himself and a bear in
potential danger.
Mr. Carlton's response however exhibited blatant prejudice based on the type
of vehicle someone drives, their diet, ther religion etc. - a much more severe
and offensive post.
> Especially since you and Arno apparently have no clue about the conditions at
> Brooks Lodge/Camp.
He didn't ask about conditions at the lodge, he asked if it was worth bringing
his Quantum flash to light bears at 30 ft. (read the original post).
> His technical question was about using fill-flash, which is used to cut the
> contrast range and/or pick up a high light in the eye. Your "answer" is
> worthless and indicates you don't even have the basic photographic skills to
> understand the question since using fast film or a long lens do not address
> the contrasty lighting issue.
Actually his question was whether it was "worth it" to bring a flash. My answer
suggested "no" and offered an alternative.
Since Mr. Carlton said nothing to help us determine his level of experience
with either photography or bears - the answers were very basic. As we all
know there are a lot of folks out there who think grizzlies are the cute
animals they see in Yogi Bear cartoons and end up getting mauled, usually with
the result of a few scars to them and death to the bear. My first instinct
when someone asks me about getting close to bears is "don't".
I have not been to the Brooks Lodge (and probably never will - I don't see any
creative value in squeezing into a viewing ramp with a bunch of other lemmings
aiming for the exact same shot), but I have had at least twenty encounters
with black bears in the Sierra and one with a grizzly in Wyoming (a young male
who came out of nowhere and started chasing me). I read a great deal about
them and consulted with rangers and locals before entering their habitat.
I survived all my encounters with no damage whatsoever (not even
loss of food that is very common with Sierra bears). So I do know something
about them.
-G
Mike Jordan
get a lot of different responses to questions in here. It doesn't
matter that the other gentleman didn't answer the question you were
asking, your response was down right rude and ill mannered. Does
being a life member of the Sierra Club give you that right? If you
can't treat other people with respect I sure hate to see how you act
out in our natural wilderness. You probably have no respect for
that either.
Mike Jordan
--
Hillsboro, Oregon