Lighting set up for table tops and portraits?
Rebecca Ore
flash. This isn't really a lot of light for smaller f stops. What
sorts of systems do people recommend? I've seen a Calumet system with a
softbox and umbrella -- and I've considered getting a power supply and
starting with one good head and softbox, and continuing to use the Metz
and slave for additional lights.
--
Rebecca Ore
Rich Satterlee
Since you are doing tabletops, I am assuming that you are using a tripod.
I suggest that you do it in the dark and use multiple "pops" from the
same flash head.
Under room lights and some sort of modeling light(s) determine your
setup (you might consider homemade flat panel diffusers as a cheap
alternative for umbrellas, or softboxes).
Determine the f/stop that you want. From that, determine the number
of f/stops that the flash will produce in the dark. The required number
of "pops" are determined by the following formula.
2 pops-1/f stop gain
4 pops-2/f stop gain
8 pops-3/f stop gain
etc.
With the room lights out (i.e. dark) open your shutter and wait for the
tripod/camera to stop shaking. An alternative is to place a black card
in front of the lens, then open the shutter. After things stop shaking,
remove the card.
Manually pop the flashes the number of times you have calculated.
Put the black card in front of the lens.
Finish with the time exposure.
Return to normal room lighting.
Regarding flash units. This can be a very expensive proposition and
not needed when doing tabletop work (unless it's ice-cream and the like).
A much cheaper alternative is tungsten hotlights. These 3200 degree Kelvin
lights require either Tungsten balanced color film or the use of a filter
(not recommended). Here you use a time exposure as long as required to
get the exposure. I have used up to several seconds with this method.
For B&W film, you don't need any filtering (normally).
Inexpensive clamp lamps, which can be purchased in the hardware store
will work quite well with the 250 Watt versions of the light. Don't
leave the lights on too long (they get quite hot) and if you have the
option, find the clamp lamps with ceramic bulbholders. I would suggest
that you buy an extra bulb or two, the operating life of the bulbs is
quite short (about 4 hours) and there is nothing like loosing a setup
just because a bulb burned out. Again, you might want to look at
homemade light modifiers.
Cheers,
Rich S.
Rebecca Ore (rebec...@op.net) wrote:
: I've been playing around with my Metz 45 flash and a tiny GN 40 slave
Ken Rice
do what they call, "multiple pops." With the shutter open you fire the
flashes more than once. If the recycle time is long, then you'd make
multiple exposures on the same piece of film. I may not have made that
clear. If the studio light level is low, and the flashes recycle quickly,
you can fire them two or three times with the shutter open—it minimizes
camera movement coming from the shutter. But, doing multiple exposures on
one piece of film (assuming the camera is locked down well on the tripod)
usually works well.
Karl Wolz
just put something dark in front of the lens between pops.
Karl Wolz
Rebecca Ore <o...@ogoense.net> wrote in message
news:slrn7qcd4...@ogoense.net...
> On Mon, 02 Aug 1999 21:30:35 GMT, Ken Rice <kr...@utahisp.com> wrote:
> > For portraits, you'll need more light. But, for table tops, you
can
> >do what they call, "multiple pops." With the shutter open you fire the
> >flashes more than once. If the recycle time is long, then you'd make
> >multiple exposures on the same piece of film. I may not have made that
> >clear. If the studio light level is low, and the flashes recycle quickly,
> >you can fire them two or three times with the shutter open-it minimizes
> >camera movement coming from the shutter. But, doing multiple exposures on
> >one piece of film (assuming the camera is locked down well on the tripod)
> >usually works well.
>
> I actually did this but not with the room dark. Recocking the shutter
> caused a bit of blur in one of the polaroids, seemed okay in the other.
>
>
> The portrait lights are more a concern -- I got defuser for the Metz but I
> don't think that's going to be as useful with the large format camera as
it
> will be with the Yashicamat.
>
> Could I get away with as little as a 400 or 500 watts per second system?
>
> --
> Rebecca Ore
Patrick Bartek
> I've been playing around with my Metz 45 flash and a tiny GN 40 slave
> flash. This isn't really a lot of light for smaller f stops. What
> sorts of systems do people recommend? I've seen a Calumet system with a
> softbox and umbrella -- and I've considered getting a power supply and
> starting with one good head and softbox, and continuing to use the Metz
> and slave for additional lights.
One head, a 3x4 foot softbox, and homemade reflectors of various sizes
is a good starter outfit for both table top and portraits, but get a
box with the recessed diffuser for better light control. The flat
panel boxes, and umbrellas especially, "spill" light too much into
unwanted areas.
However, I have used a 60 inch diameter Brittedome for general and
glamour portraiture and shadowless table tops. A Brittedome is a two
umbrella contraption -- one silver and one translucent -- face to face
with the light head between them, directed into the silver umbrella,
which becomes a very broad light source diffused by the translucent
one. Very soft, directionless light. In a small, all white studio,
you don't even need a fill light or supplemental reflectors. It works
best on a heavy duty boom.
As to power, for large format, I would start with at least an 800 WS
pack, 1600 WS would be better. This gives you the advantage of adding
several more heads without having to get another pack right away. It
is always better to have at least two packs and an extra head in case
of equipment failure. For table top work, you will have to do
multiple pops to be able to shoot at f-stops smaller than about f11 or
16 for the necessary increased depth of field.
I own 4 1000 WS packs and 9 heads. I can shoot large spaces with this
setup on 4x5 and get f22 to f32 with a single pop. For portraits, I
use 2 packs: 1 as the main; the other handles accent and background
lights. For most table tops, one or two packs into a single head
works well.
Good Luck....
--
Patrick Bartek
NoLife Polymath Group
bar...@access1.com
Rebecca Ore
> For portraits, you'll need more light. But, for table tops, you can
>do what they call, "multiple pops." With the shutter open you fire the
>flashes more than once. If the recycle time is long, then you'd make
>multiple exposures on the same piece of film. I may not have made that
>clear. If the studio light level is low, and the flashes recycle quickly,
Dick Weld
the studio strobes from Photographer's Warehouse. PG3001 units with only 100ws
will be good for both applications, and cost you $135 each. If you want to
shoot tabletop stuff at f/32, multiple pops are quite easy. The inexpensive
Shepherd flash meter (FM990?)is also a good buy. I've been using
Photographer's Warehouse lights for 3 years and they're an exceptional value (I
have 5 of them). If you want to upgrade later to more powerful lights, you can
relegate them to hair lights and background lights.
Dick Weld
waco
a piece of black velvet around it) and cover the lens between pops. You
will eliminate any ambient exposure and possible camera shake/movement.
IMHO if you are serious about shooting table-top commercially, you will do
well to invest in some serious studio strobes. We shoot alot of still-life
/ table top, and generally use 2400 ws Speedotron Black line packs with a
varity of heads and light modifiers (softboxes, grids, fresnels, dishes,
etc). It is not unusual to use 2-3 2400 packs and 3-6 heads on a table top.
If is is a still life on a room set, it could be much more...
BUT, it all depends on your style, the subject and your goals. Sometimes
that big hot light in the sky can be your best friend!! Experiment and find
what works for you. (you might try renting a full strobe system and see how
you like it...)
good luck
waco
Rebecca Ore
>Don't recock the shutter, just take a black card (ideally a small card with
>a piece of black velvet around it) and cover the lens between pops. You
>will eliminate any ambient exposure and possible camera shake/movement.
Thanks. I spent some of the day at various camera stores collecting
catalogues. And I thought the low end Metz 45 was pricey.
>
>IMHO if you are serious about shooting table-top commercially, you will do
>well to invest in some serious studio strobes. We shoot alot of still-life
>/ table top, and generally use 2400 ws Speedotron Black line packs with a
>varity of heads and light modifiers (softboxes, grids, fresnels, dishes,
>etc). It is not unusual to use 2-3 2400 packs and 3-6 heads on a table top.
>If is is a still life on a room set, it could be much more...
>BUT, it all depends on your style, the subject and your goals. Sometimes
>that big hot light in the sky can be your best friend!! Experiment and find
>what works for you. (you might try renting a full strobe system and see how
>you like it...)
Renting was actually the recommendation of the salewoman I talked to -- and
I found that if I moved to use a window as a back light, I could probably
get by with fewer pops.
At this point, it's something I'm experimenting with -- an ancient long-rail
Calumet 400, a compact Caltar 210 lens, The still lifes, from the sound of
it, can be fudged with multi-pops. Seems like portraits are where I'd need
more light.
>
>good luck
>
Thanks.
--
Rebecca Ore
Patrick Bartek
> On Mon, 02 Aug 1999 21:30:35 GMT, Ken Rice <kr...@utahisp.com> wrote:
> >
> > For portraits, you'll need more light. But, for table tops, you can
> >do what they call, "multiple pops." With the shutter open you fire the
> >flashes more than once. If the recycle time is long, then you'd make
> >multiple exposures on the same piece of film. I may not have made that
> >clear. If the studio light level is low, and the flashes recycle quickly,
> >you can fire them two or three times with the shutter open—it minimizes
> >camera movement coming from the shutter. But, doing multiple exposures on
> >one piece of film (assuming the camera is locked down well on the tripod)
> >usually works well.
>
> I actually did this but not with the room dark. Recocking the shutter
> caused a bit of blur in one of the polaroids, seemed okay in the other.
>
>
> The portrait lights are more a concern -- I got defuser for the Metz but I
> don't think that's going to be as useful with the large format camera as it
> will be with the Yashicamat.
>
> Could I get away with as little as a 400 or 500 watts per second system?
For head and shoulder portraits in 4x5? Just barely. Remember, that
you'll loose 2 to 2 1/2 stops of light, when you use an umbrella or
lightbox. You'll also have to compensate for bellows extension on
your camera which amounts to about 1/2 to 1 stop. So, let's do the
math.
A top of the line 400 WS ... Oh, by the way, it's watt-seconds, not
watts per second. In Europe, it's joules. Different term. Means the
same: a unit to measure the stored electrical power. Okay, a top of
the line 400 WS unit has a basic GN of about 200 for 100 speed film.
In a lightbox, that reduces to about 95 -- 2 1/2 stops less. Distance
from the flash head to the subject should be around 5 to 6 feet -- 3
to 4 feet from the front of the box. (A 3x4 box is about 2 feet
deep.) 95 divided by 6 (let's be conservative) equals an f-stop of
about 16. Open up the lens about 1/2 to compensate for bellows
extension beyond infinity. So, that's 11 1/2. When shooting
negatives, I like to over-expose about 1/2 stop -- f11. And this
doesn't take into account any other exposure variables. If you're
using a 210 to 250mm lens, f11 will give you a depth of field of
about 6 inches, just barely enough to be "in focus" from the tip of
the subject's nose to about the middle of the ear.
Get yourself AT LEAST an 800 WS unit. Better to have too much power,
than not enough. You can always use less power. Plus with a 400 WS
pack, when you want to add another flash head or two (unless you're
considering monolights), you need to add another pack, since 400 WS is
JUST BARELY ENOUGH power for the main light.
For table top work, 400 WS is totally inadequate. At least 1000 WS is
needed for simple setups. 2000 would be better.
Lastly, about multiple pops: after about 3 to 4 pops most daylight
transparency films begin to suffer reciprocity failure: They loose
film speed and color shift, sometimes to the point of being
uncorrectable. Negative film is more tolerant. I've found that 8
pops is the practical limit even with a flash unit that recycles to
full power in 1 sec like mine. And there is always the possibility of
camera movement when cocking the shutter between pops, that is, if you
can't shoot in a darkened space. If you intend to do a lot of
popping, get your lenses set in self-cocking shutters -- pressing the
release cable cocks the shutter and trips it all in one smooth, single
motion.
PS. The only transparency I know of that is somewhat immune to the
reciprocity failure due to multiple popping is Fuji Astia 100. It is
a daylight film that can be exposed up to 30 sec without loss of film
speed or color shifts. This characteristic comes in handy in large
format work, when even in daylight exposures can be 1 to 5 seconds.
Good Luck.....