Seeking advice: photographing a school play
Darryl Shpak
In a couple months, I'm going to be the official photographer for a
play put on by a local school. This is the first time I've ever really
done photography for anyone other than myself, and as such am a little
nervous about getting it right. (Please note: They understand that I'm
a hobbyist, not a professional.)
So I'm just seeking some general advice on technique, things to look
out for, etc. The details have not been hammered out, but it looks like
I'll have two responsibilities: Getting at least one decent portrait of
each cast member in their costume and makeup, and taking pictures of
the play itself, which would likely be done during dress rehearsal.
As far as equipment goes: I've got a Digital Rebel (300D), the 18-55
kit lens, and the Canon 75-300 IS. I've been planning to (eventually)
pick up the EF-S 17-85 IS lens (or another replacement for the kit
lens; haven't made up my mind yet), and possibly the 50mm f/1.8; this
might be the excuse to go ahead with one or both of those. I've also
got the infrared remote, a tripod (of course), a Sigma EF-500 DG Super
flash, and the camera's battery grip.
Anyone have experience with this sort of thing before? I could just
show up with my gear and snap away, but if anyone's got some experience
I can benefit from, so much the better. If I get the 50mm f/1.8, I'd
probably use that for the portraits, and I expect to be using the
75-300 for the actual stage shots.
Thanks,
- Darryl
Eatmorepies
"Darryl Shpak" <madh...@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:1140126103.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Tomorrow I'm snapping at our school's eisteddfod. I will be using a 350D
with a 24 - 105 F4 L lens with IS for most of the snaps. I have a Canon
(580EX) dedicated flash similar to the Sigma 500 DG. The IS will allow me to
shut the flash off when the floods are on, shooting in RAW will allow me to
correct the white balance.
I may resort to the 70-200mm lens to get portraits on stage. Be assured that
parents will be pleased to see reasonbly sharp pictures of their children.
The 24-105 will do a better job than the 50mm f1.8 prime; but it is a bit
dearer.
John
Joseph Meehan
> Hi,
>
> In a couple months, I'm going to be the official photographer for a
> play put on by a local school. This is the first time I've ever really
> done photography for anyone other than myself, and as such am a little
> nervous about getting it right. (Please note: They understand that I'm
> a hobbyist, not a professional.)
>
> So I'm just seeking some general advice on technique, things to look
> out for, etc. The details have not been hammered out, but it looks
> like I'll have two responsibilities: Getting at least one decent
> portrait of each cast member in their costume and makeup, and taking
> pictures of the play itself, which would likely be done during dress
> rehearsal.
You got it. Dress Rehearsal is the time. Don't bother trying during
any actual presentations other than to get a nice wide view of people on the
stage WITH people in the audience.
I would also suggest things like the cast members practicing without
costumes and getting ready (getting made-up) and sitting around studying
lines. Be sure to get photos of those who are pulling the curtains and
other behind the scene work as well as the director.
>
> As far as equipment goes: I've got a Digital Rebel (300D), the 18-55
> kit lens, and the Canon 75-300 IS. I've been planning to (eventually)
> pick up the EF-S 17-85 IS lens (or another replacement for the kit
> lens; haven't made up my mind yet), and possibly the 50mm f/1.8; this
> might be the excuse to go ahead with one or both of those. I've also
> got the infrared remote, a tripod (of course), a Sigma EF-500 DG Super
> flash, and the camera's battery grip.
I like the kit lens. Frankly it is far better than its feel or price
would indicate. The 50mm is likely to come in handy. I would not bother
with the 75-300.
>
> Anyone have experience with this sort of thing before? I could just
> show up with my gear and snap away, but if anyone's got some
> experience I can benefit from, so much the better. If I get the 50mm
> f/1.8, I'd probably use that for the portraits, and I expect to be
> using the 75-300 for the actual stage shots.
No do the stage shoots during dress and make sure you can be on stage
with the shots set up. I would recommend not trying to make do with what
you might or might not get with the telephoto as the results are not likely
to be what they should and it will end up with you looking like you don't
know what you are doing. Telling them now that you need to do the work
during dress will let them know you know what you are doing.
>
> Thanks,
> - Darryl
--
Joseph Meehan
Dia duit
Hunt
madh...@geocities.com says...
>
>Hi,
>
>In a couple months, I'm going to be the official photographer for a
>play put on by a local school. This is the first time I've ever really
>done photography for anyone other than myself, and as such am a little
>nervous about getting it right. (Please note: They understand that I'm
>a hobbyist, not a professional.)
>
>So I'm just seeking some general advice on technique, things to look
>out for, etc. The details have not been hammered out, but it looks like
>I'll have two responsibilities: Getting at least one decent portrait of
>each cast member in their costume and makeup, and taking pictures of
>the play itself, which would likely be done during dress rehearsal.
The best way to get a portrait of each actor, would be to position youself
outside the "Green Room," and do that shot for each there. You will be able to
use your flash then, and with a good bounce, and perhaps a diffuser, get some
good shots. Can you mount the flash on something like a stroboframe to get it
up above, and to the side of the camera? If you do this at a dress-rehersal,
you can then spend the actual performance, getting shots of the scenery with
the actors.
>
>As far as equipment goes: I've got a Digital Rebel (300D), the 18-55
>kit lens, and the Canon 75-300 IS. I've been planning to (eventually)
>pick up the EF-S 17-85 IS lens (or another replacement for the kit
>lens; haven't made up my mind yet), and possibly the 50mm f/1.8; this
>might be the excuse to go ahead with one or both of those. I've also
>got the infrared remote, a tripod (of course), a Sigma EF-500 DG Super
>flash, and the camera's battery grip.
For shooting the stage, it seems that you have the bases covered. In most
theatrical events, flash is not permitted during the performance. Check this
one out carefully. If these is much action on the stage, the actors know how
the stage lighting will effect them. A flash in the eyes can cause problems,
plus can cause problems for an audience. If you can, attend a rehersal, and
take light readings of the set(s) with the stage lights. Make notes, so when
the scene changes, you know how the lighting will change. With digital, one
can come pretty close with the WB, even when the lights are gelled. In the old
film days, this could be more of a problem.
>
>Anyone have experience with this sort of thing before? I could just
>show up with my gear and snap away, but if anyone's got some experience
>I can benefit from, so much the better. If I get the 50mm f/1.8, I'd
>probably use that for the portraits, and I expect to be using the
>75-300 for the actual stage shots.
Yes, I paid much of my expenses in film school, by shooting the Drama Dept.
productions. My biggest advice is to plan, plan, plan. If you can feel that
you know the production, you will be ahead. Also, when it's done, the audience
should never know you were there, and be amazed at the great shots that you
got. Man, I wish that I had had digital way back then!
>
>Thanks,
>- Darryl
Hunt
Robert R Kircher, Jr.
news:1140126103.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Darryl.
I filled in for my wife, who has been shooting plays for several years now,
for our highschools fall show this past fall. Here is what I learned from
that shoot and watching/assisting my wife in the past.
Dress rehearsals are invaluable. Make sure you are at every one. Our
school does a weeks worth just before the show opens.
A few reasons for this.
1) You can use a flash.
2) You can learn the show for actual performance shots. Take notes. Note
the lighting changes. Note exposure setting.
2a) Get your meter readings from up on the stage. You'll get more accurate
readings this way.
3) You can get all the individual and group shots out of the way during the
down time. You'll never get those shots the at the actual performances;
back stage and the dressing rooms are usually way to busy during the show
and you'll just be in the way.
4) If you miss the shot the first time you know they'll do the scene again
so you'll get another chance.
5) depending on the show and the director you may even be able to shoot from
the stage w/ the actors.
Shooting the actual performances.
We usually shoot a minimum of two shows. The first show is done from the
front row. Here we concentrate on close ups, small groups, face shots, etc.
The second show one of us sets up in the back with a tripod and the other
will walk up and down the isle for different angle shots. Here we're
looking for larger group shots and entire scene shots.
The last show I did was easy from a metering stand point because there were
no lighting changes. I took my initial meter readings up on the stage, set
the camera's in manual mode and shot away. If you're going to meter from
your shooting location I suggest using Partial metering mode. You don't
want the dark theater throwing off your meter readings.
Equipment.
My wife shoots film and I shoot digital. The last show I did I used my
28-135 and my 100-400 on my 20D and 300D. When shooting from the back of
the stage the 100-400 was mounted on the tripod and I carried the 28-135.
The 20D was set to partial metering. We just bought a 70-200 if/2.8 IS for
our next show. Can't wait to use the faster lens.
Lastly, Although I shot in RAW mode I didn't need to do much "fixing." I
still suggest RAW in case you get into any trouble. Bring lots of CF cards
and fresh batts.
If you email me directly I'll send you a link to the proof page for the show
I just shot.
--
Rob
"A disturbing new study finds that studies are disturbing"
Robert R Kircher, Jr.
friends with the performers. If you can do this you're more likely to get
their cooperation when setting up group shots and getting those candid shots
in the green room/dressing rooms. They're there to have fun so have fun
with them and make the photo taking fun for them too. Let them be silly in
front of the camera. The key is to get them to be comfortable with the fact
that your there then to them you'll disappear and be free to shoot what you
want.
Pat
The dress rehearsal is for the actors to try everything out before it
is "real". You also need a rehearsal. Go a night or two before that
and watch them rehearse. Watch how the actors move, what they do,
where they go, what the lighting is what you like, etc. Take a few
pictures so you can go home and look at them. Also, talk over with the
director what you can and can't do.
For the pictures, get up on the stage and get in fairly close. You
don't want compression from being too far away.
Stages are well lit but lit for an audience viewing from the front, not
necessarily for a photographer on the stage. So you might want to use
a flash. Read up a little on "fill flash" if you aren't comfortable
with it already (also, a good thing to practice during YOUR
rehearsal). Let the spotlight and overheads be the main light, but use
your flash to help balance things out so you have lighting under the
chin, etc.
As suggested, the lights might be gelled (colored). If so, you will
probably want to white-balance before they turn on the colored lights
because you want to capture the colors. Also, you will want to use
less flash so you can see the colors.
For the portraits, standard techniques. You can either use a very dark
background (sort of traditional for head-and-shoulder shots or be a bit
more creative and maybe take the pictures from the seating area with
the lit stage behind the actor - but if you do, make sure your lighting
is brighter than the stage's.
Good luck.
David Dyer-Bennet
Always exciting!
I've shot various stage productions, starting back when I was in
highschool myself, but not doing it very *often* along the way to
here.
I'll skip over the portrait part -- that's relatively straightforward
(technically). Do get a decently plain background, or at least an
interesting one, and get things lit so the background looks okay too.
The first point is that the flash is a bad idea for the stage shots at
least. Not only is it impossible if there's an audience (too
distracting), the pictures also won't look like the play, because the
lighting design is an important part of what you see on stage. At the
dress rehearsal, where you could probably use flash, it might be
useful for some fill-in to reduce contrast.
It's good that you get to shoot at the dress rehearsal; that means you
can move around a lot more freely, maybe even go into the wings and
shoot from there some.
When possible, getting reasonably close is a better choice than
extreme telephoto lenses. The longer the focal length, the higher the
shutter speed you need for sharp photos, and hence the harder it is to
hand-hold the camera+lens. Yes, the IS substitutes for a faster lens
*to a degree*, but you'll still have a higher sharp picture rate at
70mm (standing closer) than at 300mm (far away).
I strongly suggest reading the play a time or two first, or watching
an earlier rehearsal before you shoot. Knowing what's coming, and
what the "key shots" are, will help *immensely*.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, <mailto:dd...@dd-b.net>, <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/>
RKBA: <http://noguns-nomoney.com/> <http://www.dd-b.net/carry/>
Pics: <http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/> <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/>
Dragaera/Steven Brust: <http://dragaera.info/>
Gene Palmiter
temp and direction. It helps to put light sheets or foam core on the ground
to bounce it up and even it out. Get a custom white balance.
When I have done it the players had standard posed places throughout the
play. I think they use them to set a standard scene for rehearsals. These
often work well for a shot.
While you might have to interrupt a dress rehearsal...these are supposed to
be like the real thing and interrupting them messes that up...also family
might attend and that will piss them off. It might be better to take notes
on scenes you like and have them pose. Work out with the director which
would be better.
With small casts some players will play many parts....so you can sell to
them over and over if you get them in all the costumes.
--
Thanks,
Gene Palmiter
(visit my photo gallery at http://palmiter.dotphoto.com)
freebridge design group
"Darryl Shpak" <madh...@geocities.com> wrote in message
news:1140126103.3...@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Randy Berbaum
: While you might have to interrupt a dress rehearsal...these are
: supposed to be like the real thing and interrupting them messes that
: up...also family might attend and that will piss them off. It might be
: better to take notes on scenes you like and have them pose. Work out
: with the director which would be better.
One thought about this. Since the lighting and costumes, etc can be
repeted after the dress rehersal (or even durring scene breaks) when
interrupting the show is not as much of a problem, notes (as mentioned
above) would be good, but just simple snapshots with no overt attempt at
getting a good image can be used as refference images for the actors as to
what poses and scenes you wish to later snap in much more controlled
situations. Then once the scene is reset to these snapshot moments you
could take the time to adjust for lighting levels (and white balance) and
can even catch the same pose from many different angles, even from the
stage.
Also don't forget to do some posed small group images that are not
specificly scenes from the play. Also a few candid shots behind the scenes
of the performers touching up makeup or hands shifting scenery or props.
Back in HS drama club some of these last images I caught with a simple
camera have become some of the most treasured images I have of those days.
Randy
==========
Randy Berbaum
Champaign, IL
Darryl Shpak
> The best way to get a portrait of each actor, would be to position youself
> outside the "Green Room," and do that shot for each there. You will be able to
> use your flash then, and with a good bounce, and perhaps a diffuser, get some
> good shots. Can you mount the flash on something like a stroboframe to get it
> up above, and to the side of the camera?
Unfortunately, I don't have a bracket or anything for the flash - it's
got to go on the hotshoe. I'll probably set up some sort of reflector,
though, and bounce the flash off that.
> For shooting the stage, it seems that you have the bases covered. In most
> theatrical events, flash is not permitted during the performance. Check this
> one out carefully. If you can, attend a rehersal, and
> take light readings of the set(s) with the stage lights. Make notes, so when
> the scene changes, you know how the lighting will change. With digital, one
> can come pretty close with the WB, even when the lights are gelled.
Well, I'll be doing very little shooting during the actual performance
- most will be done during dress rehearsal. I'll be shooting in RAW, so
I can deal with white balance after the fact, and I know most of the
people involved in the production (the director, the people doing the
sets and lighting, etc) so I'll be able to get a copy of the script,
show up at practices, etc. without any problems. I'm hoping to be
involved in the production for at least a month, showing up during
practices and set-building and everything so that I can get a good feel
for what's going on, and record a lot of the behind-the-scenes stuff.
Thanks for the advice!
- Darryl
Darryl Shpak
> Stage lighting is a bright as daylight...well...almost. The problem is color
> temp and direction. It helps to put light sheets or foam core on the ground
> to bounce it up and even it out. Get a custom white balance.
Yeah, I'm going to have to experiment with white balance; I'll be
shooting in RAW, but if the lighting is particularly warm, I want to
make sure I maintain that in the final image. I'll probably be using
some sheets of white posterboard to use as reflectors (for both flash
and overhead lighting); this is something I've never done before
though, so I'll need to experiment with this too.
> While you might have to interrupt a dress rehearsal...these are supposed to
> be like the real thing and interrupting them messes that up...also family
> might attend and that will piss them off. It might be better to take notes
> on scenes you like and have them pose. Work out with the director which
> would be better.
Yes, I definitely need to talk to the producers and work some of this
stuff out. Right now, our communication has been essentially "Will you
take pictures?" "Sure." I'll be setting up a meeting in the next week
or two so that we can figure out the details.
> With small casts some players will play many parts....so you can sell to
> them over and over if you get them in all the costumes.
While my goal here isn't profit, the point about getting people in
multiple costumes is a good one. I'll have to remember to ask about
that.
Thanks for the advice,
- Darryl
Darryl Shpak
Joseph Meehan wrote:
> I would also suggest things like the cast members practicing without
> costumes and getting ready (getting made-up) and sitting around studying
> lines. Be sure to get photos of those who are pulling the curtains and
> other behind the scene work as well as the director.
Good point - the stagehands etc. aren't the first people that come to
mind as subjects, but they're part of the production too.
> I like the kit lens. Frankly it is far better than its feel or price
> would indicate. The 50mm is likely to come in handy. I would not bother
> with the 75-300.
Yeah, I think I'll end up getting the 50mm; having only owned zoom
lenses in the past, it feels very inflexible, but it's cheap and
apparntly high-quality, and I think an f/1.8 lens will be useful in all
sorts of situations.
I've found the 75-300 to be an excellent lens for candid portraits; I
can get head-and-shoulders shots of people from across the room,
without them even knowing I'm there. I'll probably be using it
primarily for that purpose, though I might end up using it, at the wide
end, for the posed portraits.
> Telling them now that you need to do the work
> during dress will let them know you know what you are doing.
The nice thing here is low expectations :-) I've been told that the
photographer for a previous production shot one (!) roll of 24-exposure
film, and that was it. I suspect my standards are going to end up being
a lot higher than theirs...
Thanks for the suggestions,
- Darryl
Hunt
madh...@geocities.com says...
Darryl,
Sounds like a fun project! One additional thought: as you might end up needing
to shoot at a higher ISO, than would otherwise be optimal, you might want to
look into one of two (there are probably a half-dozen others, as well) plug-
ins/standalones, Neat Image and Noise Ninja. I use NI, so I can tell you that
there are several "flavors" of it. I use a combo, which is either a plug-in
for Photoshop, or offers a standalone outside of photoshop. Both work very
well at noise reduction, which will crop up, if the ISO is increased. I even
use NI for reducing film grain in high-rez scans of 4x5 trans. They look like
they were done on Kodachrome 4x5, when done. Since you are shooting RAW, it's
easy to place a noise reduction app. into your workflow. I'd suggest doing it
as the next to last step, just before final sharpening.
Have fun, and good luck.
Hunt
Darryl Shpak
> Be assured that parents will be pleased to see reasonbly
> sharp pictures of their children.
This I know. I've taken pictures of relatives' children playing sports
(football, soccer, and hockey), and the football snaps (taken at 3-4 PM
on a sunny summer day) are the only ones I'm at all proud of; the
others are, in my opinion, terrible, suffering from high ISO noise,
camera shake, and motion blur (both were in low-light conditions, which
also results in less-than-lovely colours). The parents loved all three
sets (and were/are completely ecstatic about the football images).
That said, I want pictures that meet my standards, not someone else's
:)
- Darryl