Pool Chemicals
Jason P Curole
suggested looking at a pool supply store. I've dropped by a couple but I
cannot identyify any of the chemicals used for devoloping/fixing as part
of the active ingredients for any of the pool chemicals. Can
someone help me out with what I might find and how to look for it.
Thanks, Jason
Jason P. Curole
Hubbard Center for Genome Studies and Program in Genetics
Genomics I, ETB
35 Colovos Rd.
University of New Hampshire
Durham NH 03824-3534
http://tilapia.unh.edu/WWWPages/curole.html
007
"Jason P Curole" <jcu...@cisunix.unh.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.OSF.4.44.020517...@hypatia.unh.edu...
> When I asked about purchasing chemicals for B&W developing someone
> suggested looking at a pool supply store. I've dropped by a couple but I
> cannot identyify any of the chemicals used for devoloping/fixing as part
> of the active ingredients for any of the pool chemicals. Can
> someone help me out with what I might find and how to look for it.
I dont know about a pool supply store, but a pool supply store SUPPLIER will
have the following (in bulk):
sodium carbonate-developers (I just use washing soda from the grocery store)
sodium sulfite-used in everything
sodium thiosulfate-aka hypo, fix
citric acid--stop bath
and others
they arent going to have reducing agents such as metol, phenidone,etc. The
pool supply store can probably order these for you, but they will also
probably take a cut. Go straight to the source, unless you only want smaller
quantities.
Wayne
Francis A. Miniter
swimming pool, and does that mean that we swim in fixer baths???
Francis A. Miniter
Michael A. Covington (Portable computer)
"Francis A. Miniter" <min...@attglobal.net> wrote in message
news:3CE5C5CA...@attglobal.net...
> Now you have me thinking backwards. What is Sodium Thiosulfate used for
in a
> swimming pool, and does that mean that we swim in fixer baths???
Small amounts of thiosulfate are used to dechlorinate water in aquariums.
This might be something similar, to bring down excessive chlorine levels.
007
"007" <inv...@nospam.com> wrote in message > they arent going to have
reducing agents such as metol, phenidone,etc. The
> pool supply store can probably order these for you, but they will also
> probably take a cut. Go straight to the source, unless you only want
smaller
> quantities.
I meant the store can probably order everything BUT reducers. It didnt quite
come out sounding that way though.
007
Must be the fixer in your swimming pool. ;-)
Richard Knoppow
A caution about the carbonate and thiosulfate.
Sodium carbonate comes in three forms, crystaline, monohydrated, and
anhydrous. The amount used must be adjusted to the form. Crystaline
carbonate, usually sold as washing soda, is the least stable of the
three tending to loose water and to absorb carbon dioxide. If its
fresh it will work just fine.
Thiosulfate also comes in two forms, crystaline and anhydrous. Old
formulas usually specify the crystaline form but packaged fixers are
usually the anhydrous form.
Crystaline hypo needs to be mixed in very hot water because it cools
the water as it absorbs energy to break down the crystals. Anhydrous
should be mixed at moderate heat, not over 90F, to avoid decomposing
it.
Make sure what form of chemical you get and what condition its in.
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA.
dick...@ix.netcom.com
Bill Laut
Another thing to keep in mind (especially when compounding developers --
fixers are not as sensitive to this) is that chemicals are classified by
the ACS into varying grades of purity, ranging from "industrial" to
"reagent" (and probably even purer but which I cannot remember at this
ungodly hour of the morning).
For compounding developers I recommend that you stick with chemicals that
are rated ACS Photo Grade or better.
--
Bill Laut
PGP public key - www.i2k.com/~laut/pgp/dh_3072.asc
Fingerprint - 0A64 07B2 1F45 B823 ABD5 CD54 DEB8 3ED3 AC9E 8EB8
Other encryption and signing keys -- www.i2k.com/~laut/pgp/
007
"Bill Laut" <wl...@alpha.delta.edu> wrote in message
news:3ce60...@speedtrap.i2k.com...
>
> Another thing to keep in mind (especially when compounding developers --
> fixers are not as sensitive to this) is that chemicals are classified by
> the ACS into varying grades of purity, ranging from "industrial" to
> "reagent" (and probably even purer but which I cannot remember at this
> ungodly hour of the morning).
>
> For compounding developers I recommend that you stick with chemicals that
> are rated ACS Photo Grade or better.
The hypo I bought from the pool supply supplier was photo grade! Said so
right on the bag. No kiddin
Malcolm Stewart
formaldehyde) from my local pond supplier where it's used highly diluted to cure
some types of fish ailments. I use it to make the final E6 stabilising bath.
--
M Stewart
Milton Keynes, UK
Jason P Curole <jcu...@cisunix.unh.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.OSF.4.44.020517...@hypatia.unh.edu...
> When I asked about purchasing chemicals for B&W developing someone
> suggested looking at a pool supply store. I've dropped by a couple but I
> cannot identyify any of the chemicals used for devoloping/fixing as part
> of the active ingredients for any of the pool chemicals. Can
> someone help me out with what I might find and how to look for it.
snip
Richard Knoppow
>On Sat, 18 May 2002 05:44:29 GMT, dick...@ix.netcom.com (Richard
>Knoppow) wrote:
>
>
>>>
>> A caution about the carbonate and thiosulfate.
>> Sodium carbonate comes in three forms, crystaline, monohydrated, and
>>anhydrous. The amount used must be adjusted to the form. Crystaline
>>carbonate, usually sold as washing soda, is the least stable of the
>>three tending to loose water and to absorb carbon dioxide. If its
>>fresh it will work just fine.
>> Thiosulfate also comes in two forms, crystaline and anhydrous. Old
>>formulas usually specify the crystaline form but packaged fixers are
>>usually the anhydrous form.
>> Crystaline hypo needs to be mixed in very hot water because it cools
>>the water as it absorbs energy to break down the crystals. Anhydrous
>>should be mixed at moderate heat, not over 90F, to avoid decomposing
>>it.
>> Make sure what form of chemical you get and what condition its in.
>>
>>---
>>Richard Knoppow
>>Los Angeles, CA, USA.
>>dick...@ix.netcom.com
>
>more important is to avoid contamination. Recommend Analytical or
>Photographic Grade chemicals. Sodium carbonate can be contaminated
>with some sulfur compounds making it unusable for color photography.
>Crystalline thiosulfate does cool the solution, but it is
>insignificant due to excellent solubility of said salt. Going above
>48°C is counterproductive. Anhydrous thiosulftae does opposite - warms
>up the solution.
Analytical Reagent grade (I think there is another name for this
now) is always safe but it can be expensive. Photo grade is guranteed
not to contain impurities which affect potography and tend to be of
specified strength. A.R. grade may not actually be any purer but comes
with an analysis of what exactly is in it with amounts, its the
analysis which makes it so expensive.
Commercial grade chemicals are often entirely satisfactory for photo
use. Some imputities to watch out for are trace metals, especially
iron and copper.
Crystaline thiosulfate has a very considerable cooling effect. In
fact, an old lab trick is to use a solution of dissolving crystaline
thiosulfate to cool other solutions where ice is not available.
The anydrous form has some warming effect. Kodak recommends using
water not over 90F for mixing anhydrous thiosulfate to avoid geting
the water hot enough to decompose the thiosulfate.
For crystaline hypo water of around 125F is good to start with and
some means of heating the solution as its mixed is helpful. If it
cools enough the thiosulfate will dissolve very slowly.
Packaged powder fixers are now almost all the anhydrous form, its
lighter and cheaper to ship, if nothing else.
Carbonates and hydroxides can be of considerably varying strength
depending on hydration and the way its been stored. About the only
formulas I've ever seen calling for crystaline carbonates are very old
British ones. Nearly all others call for anhydrous or monohydrated.
Monohydrated carbonate is the most stable form because it neither
absorbs or releases moisture. Crystaline is the least stable form and
should be avoided. So called Washing Soda is usually crystaline
carbonate.
DblHelix
store in your area (usually a few around anywhere there is a college)
"Jason P Curole" <jcu...@cisunix.unh.edu> wrote in message
news:Pine.OSF.4.44.020517...@hypatia.unh.edu...
007
"Richard Knoppow" <dick...@ix.netcom.com> wrote in message
news:3ce82add....@nntp.ix.netcom.com...
> Carbonates and hydroxides can be of considerably varying strength
> depending on hydration and the way its been stored. About the only
> formulas I've ever seen calling for crystaline carbonates are very old
> British ones. Nearly all others call for anhydrous or monohydrated.
> Monohydrated carbonate is the most stable form because it neither
> absorbs or releases moisture. Crystaline is the least stable form and
> should be avoided. So called Washing Soda is usually crystaline
> carbonate.
I'm a little confused here. Does crystalline refer to a state of hydration
(deca, penta etc) ? Arm and Hammer Washing Soda may be crystalline (and may
not be, I dont know), but according to their tech support it is definitely
monohydrated. I called them about that several years ago. I've used it for
years and know people who have used for years in color photography without
any problem. I would guess that this is one of the biggest brands of soda in
the US. In my area, its the only brand.
Thor Lancelot Simon
This isn't so surprising when you consider that Eastman Chemical is, to
this day, the largest supplier in the U.S. market for many chemicals
commonplace in photography. Among his other oddities and talents, George
Eastman was something of a genius of vertical integration...
--
Thor Lancelot Simon t...@rek.tjls.com
But as he knew no bad language, he had called him all the names of common
objects that he could think of, and had screamed: "You lamp! You towel! You
plate!" and so on. --Sigmund Freud
Richard Knoppow
Yes its the hydration. I didn't know that A&H was monohydrated. If
so its fine for photography and will be of constant strength since the
hydration doesn't change with time.
Richard Knoppow
Not many camera shops, even pro ones, carry much in the way of raw
chemicals anymore. Futher, and I think maybe important to Jason, is
that you are paying a premium for packaging. If perfectly acceptable
chemicals can be bought cheap from some other kind of supplier why not
do it? Some photo chemicals are avialable at pool supply stores,
stores catering to home fabric dyers, etc. Sometimes an unexpected
supplier turns up as the result of a web search for a chemical or
compound.
brookmartin
I recently found a commercial chemical dealer with sodium sulfite intended
to act as an oxygen scavenger in water towers. The dealer told me it was
better than photo grade, federal regs and all. So far so good, for $1.50 US
per pound.
Wholesalers can be a bit reluctant to sell to the general public. I show up
with a sales tax# and talk a bit of shop.
Brook
Frank Schifano
brookmartin
area will have such suppliers, and the advantage of buying local is not
paying for shipping. I just looked in the phone book and called till I found
some place with what I wanted. Lloyd Erlick suggested finding places close
to railroad tracks, seems to be a good idea.
Brook