I am alive and still kicking
Matthew
fully put my time back into the groups. Needed a break from a lot of
things
So blanket purrs and prayers to all that need them.
Right now Phantom is doing better. He still gets sick easily. I think he
has arthritis and having trouble with his stomach. He still is a grouchy
old pain but I still am happy I did not have to make that decision a while
ago. I just reordered his hyperthyroidism medication. You can tell he is
getting old
Jammer is a little shit. ( typical fur nut kitten) He has developed all of
the others bad habits So he has gained the title of why you little
^%&(#%^*(#%^(Q%^#)%&Q)%&Q)_#&* early on.
Phantom and Jammer have little spats you can tell it is dominance but a few
minute later they are laying back to back trying to see who can take the
most space up. Jammer tried to take over Rumble alpha spot and was
politely chased under daddy's feet with a very stern who do you think you
are whooping by Rumble. ;-)
Rumble I think is still a little mad that Jammer is still here. He only
comes into my room now when the time to be feed has past the time or a
snack. Any other time he is hanging out in the living room or somewhere in
between there and mom's room.
Limo is still fine she still wishes she was the only cat in the house.
Ka'shay aka golden girl has turned a beautiful golden color from her red
tabby shade. I need to get her in for her updated rabies and distemper
shots. She is definite mom's cat. Her and jammer play with each other but
I can tell she still misses her best friend may the furball rest in peace
Spirit. ( I still do myself )<tears>
Dumplin is dumplin still no comment from me. That is mom's doing letting
him have those bad habits and letting me break him of them
Mom is fine. A pain in the ass but that is nothing new
Ok here is my good news and bad news. Allergies have been extreme for the
last few weeks. I still need to get my head straight I need to do more and
get out more before I head back down the depression highway. I have also
lost a few people recently. My mom's friends husband died of complications
from lung cancer. He beat the cancer but it left him broken and it was his
time. I believe he was in his 50's. We lost a family member; not close, on
Saturday to the normal flu. He had other complications such as COPD and
hillbilly stubbornness did not help. He was 61 I think. He refused to go
to the hospital so it got him. Many of my friends either have the swine
flu or a family member has the swine flu. Even though it has been around
along time. It is still a scary thing. The Doc wants me to have a flu
vaccination I said HELL NO last year it put me in the hospital NEVER
AGAIN.
Good news my sugars are still doing great on the new meds. My tri are up a
bit but that is my fault I have not been taking my fish oil. I got some
news on my gastric surgery I wanted to done to help me with my weight. The
insurance will finally admitted they have to cover but Now comes all the
hurdles to jump through. So it will still be about 8 months to a year
before I fully qualify to have it done. But at least the option is on the
table and out in the open.
So there it is in a nut shell
I am still around lurking ;-)
Joy
--
Joy
There is something about the presence of a cat... that seems to take the
bite out of being alone. - Louis J. Camuti
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4ae8e1b5$0$5641$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
Stormmee
--
Have a wonderful day
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4ae8e1b5$0$5641$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
MLB
We are glad you are lurking. Now, when you consider Mom to be a pain in
the butt, try to think of the one you gave her when you came into this
world! MLB
Christina Websell
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4ae8e1b5$0$5641$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>fully put my time back into the groups. Needed a break from a lot of
>things
>
It's nice to see you again, Matthew.
I'd like to say two things to you. First. Mothers are often a pain in the
butt but appreciate that pain in the butt when you still have it. I miss my
mother terribly.
Second. Don't you dare have gastric surgery to correct your weight. It's a
dangerous short cut to losing weight and it does not help people who've got
used to, just, well, eating too much.
The secret is to learn to eat less over a period of time, unless you want to
endure a major operation that makes your stomach so small that if you eat
more than an couple of tablespoons you will vomit.
So - what to do? Eat less to lose weight over a period of time or have the
gastric operation? Up to you.
Tweed
Matthew
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7ku1rcF...@mid.individual.net...
I love her to death but she drives me nuts.
That is the old stomach surgery. The one I am trying to get uses a band
that is saline filled that wraps around the top part of the stomach where it
connects to the esophagus not cutting of the stomach check it out
http://www.lapband.com/ the new part of the surgeries is all micro
incisions. You go home the next day and back to work in about 2 weeks.
My problem is like a lot of obese people I have been tested and I lack the
chemical that is produced that tells me I am full.
I eat healthy but I can't not try to pronounce or type out the condition it
is but I just can't lose the weight. The weight loss medication makes me
sick as a dog and screws with my sugar levels badly.
I know it is not an instant fix If it was I would never do it. I learned my
life lesson along time ago if it was easy to do than how do you feel
accomplished. It is a way of life it gets you used to the benefits are
that people that have it most with in the first year become non diabetic,
sleep apnea goes away if you have high blood pressure it goes down. Plus
many more benefits. There is a lot of steps to go through like 6 to 8
months of weight and stress management. Therapy and evaluations to go
through. 99% of obese people who try to lose weight fail on their own.
Besides the surgery this gets you in the frame of mind to get the job done
and 40% of the people end up not needing the surgery. I am hoping I can be
one of the 40% if not I know I need help and I want help
Christina Websell
PLEASE don't have the gastric surgery. If you truly want to lose weight you
can do it without that.
Tweed
tanadashoes
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4ae8e1b5$0$5641$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>fully put my time back into the groups. Needed a break from a lot of
>things
>
> So blanket purrs and prayers to all that need them.
>
Blanket purrs and good thoughts and wishes back atcha. Take care of
yourself. We love you. Am glad that Phantom is better and would love to
see pictures of all of them. Jammer sounds like a hoolikitten after my own
heart. Do you think that Pine Cone is mentally mentoring him?
Pam S. who thinks that Piney would mentor all the wild childs if he could.
tanadashoes
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7ku1rcF...@mid.individual.net...
>
>
> I'd like to say two things to you. First. Mothers are often a pain in the
> butt but appreciate that pain in the butt when you still have it. I miss
> my mother terribly.
> Second. Don't you dare have gastric surgery to correct your weight. It's
> a dangerous short cut to losing weight and it does not help people who've
> got used to, just, well, eating too much.
> The secret is to learn to eat less over a period of time, unless you want
> to endure a major operation that makes your stomach so small that if you
> eat more than an couple of tablespoons you will vomit.
> So - what to do? Eat less to lose weight over a period of time or have
> the gastric operation? Up to you.
>
> Tweed
>
What right do you have to tell Matthey or anyone what to do? I've seen
Matthew at the dinner table and my 140 lb daughter ate more than he did.
Matthew is a responsible person who is intelligent enough to do the research
and check out his options before proceeding. Don't you think that people
have a right to make their own decisions without you telling them what to
do?
Pam S. disgusted again
moonglow minnow
> PLEASE don't have the gastric surgery. If you truly want to lose weight you
> can do it without that.
> Tweed
Losing weight, especially large amounts of weight, is often more
complicated than whether you truly want to or not. If you're constantly
hungry even after gradually reducing your rations and sticking to it for
months, you're *very* likely to binge eat and break your diet because
being hungry all the time is miserable. Many people can get by with
discipline alone, but a small percentage of people *do* need the extra
help that surgery can provide.
Maeve >^..^<
--
http://moonglowminnow.wordpress.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minnow/
Christina Websell
"tanadashoes" <tan...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:atSdnVmgip4Cg3fX...@earthlink.com...
surgery can be dangerous and as I care about him I would prefer him to take
another option.
Do you have a problem with that, Pam?
You seem to think I'm making some sort of judgement here. I am not and I'm
surprised that you think I am.
Tweed
Mishi
cousin Chris had the gastric bypass surgery in Feb 2004; she was
morbidly obese, and had tried many different diets, both dr recommended
and OTC before she had the surgery. She immediately started losing
weight, and after 3 months she was able to get into size XL clothes. She
was so happy she could just go out and buy stuff off the rack! Her hubby
and she decided that they didn't want anymore children - they had 2
girls, age 10 and 14, so in April she went to her gyn to get her tubes
tied. They asked her if she was pregnant, and she said no. They decided
to do a pregnancy test anyway.... Emma Rose was born in Dec 2004. <G>
The drs were worried that the baby (Emma) wouldn't get enough nutrition
because of the restrictive diet Chris was on, but Emma was fine. She
weighed over 6lbs at birth.
Good luck with the surgery!
Mishi
bastX...@sonic.net
> I have no right at all to tell Matthew what to do. I just know that gastric
> surgery can be dangerous and as I care about him I would prefer him to take
> another option.
> Do you have a problem with that, Pam?
> You seem to think I'm making some sort of judgement here. I am not and I'm
> surprised that you think I am.
I agree with you, Tweed. (Wow, we agree on something regarding weight! :))
Of course, nobody here can tell anyone else what to do. But I do understand
your concern. Bypass surgery is brutal on the body. People often have
severe health problems after the fact. And I'm not convinced that Matthew
has received all the information about these potential problems, because
doctors are very invested in doing this surgery. I'm not saying it's a big
conspiracy or that the doctor wants to harm Matthew. I'm just saying that
doctors have their perspective, and it's NOT the only perspective out there.
There are others. Matthew, I can send you info if you'd like me to. It's
good to look at things from various angles and read up on the pros and cons,
from *different* people (not just from the medical industry). Then if you
still choose to have the surgery, you will be doing so fully informed.
My feeling about all this - which will come as absolutely no surprise to
anyone - is that our society pays far too much attention to weight and
not enough to health. I mean, getting a piece of your stomach or intestine
cut out (or closed off) for your health? Does that even make sense??
Why not focus on living a healthy lifestyle, rather than on the scale or
the measuring tape? I think we'd all be healthier if we learned to eat
more healthy food, to stop eating when we're full, and to get plenty
of exercise. And to get enough REST, for god's sake. I never hear anyone
talking about that as part of a healthy way to live, but it's just as
important as diet and exercise. I'm not saying this specifically to
Matthew, BTW. I think it's good advice to anyone and that's how I try
to live.
As for Pam's average-sized daughter eating more than Matthew does? That's
just a good example of why I believe that weight is not necessarily
related to what or how much you eat - not in the long run. Sure, you can
starve, and you'll lose weight. But chances are (98% of the time), you'll
gain it back. So I don't put a lot of stock in diets, much less in surgery.
I just try to live well and be as healthy as I can be, at whatever size
I am. So far, I seem to be doing OK.
Here's a great site with info about this:
Joyce - gave away her scale years ago!! :)
--
Annoying nerdspeak: whenever a woman tells me that she loves me with
all her heart, I patiently explain that the heart is an autonomic
blood pump incapable of emotion, and that her statement is therefore
without meaning. **No woman has made that mistake with me twice.**
Jofirey
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in
message news:7ku1rcF...@mid.individual.net...
>
To present the other side, my niece and sister in law had the
surgery about eight years ago. It has worked wonderfully for both
of them. I really don't think my SIL would still be alive if she
had not had it.
Long term they think they should have done it much sooner.
Wish I were a candidate. They considered it when they were in
messing around doing a fundoplasty on my stomach and rewiring my
diaphragm but said there was just too much going on already to add
that as well.
Jo
Matthew
www.lapband.com
Also did anyone actually take the time to see what I actually said or look
at the website
http://www.lapband.com/get_informed/obesity_weight_loss/lapband_realizeband/#chart
Second NO FIGHTING between anyone PLEASE. If you want drama go over to some
of the other cat groups we get enough trolls there to have fun with. I am
almost sorry I even shared my good news right now
One I am not starving myself
Two I am eating healthy
Three I CAN'T keep the weight off I am not even going to look up how to
spell the condition. Beside the medications that keep me functioning. I
also am lacking the chemical that normal people have to tell their body that
they are full and what to do with the calories intake. This has been
diagnnosed and is finally recongizied that many many many obese pople have
this and CAN'T HELP THEMSELVES. My calorie intake is about 2000 calories a
day I also go to the gym at least 3 times a week with a trainer. This is
have been a long battle that I am losing. It is breaking me down slowly
both mentally and physically. It hurts to think about all I have lost and
can loss unless I considered drastic change and maybe a radical change.
MY sugars are holding at 104 my tri are in normal range My cholesterol
is so good that my doctor said it is too good and my bad cholesterol is way
to low. I am actually feeling better. My kidneys don't bother me as much
right now. So far holding off needing insulin shots
I thank you for your worries but this is also help in all ways from
mental to physical. Look at it from my point not your experience. I could
care less what people think when they see me. They don't like what they see
I tell them to start kissing one of my fat ass cheeks and keep on going till
they get to the Hershey center. I am doing this for my health and to stay
around for my Mom and fur balls.
Think about it from my point. I can live longer actually go by
regular clothes maybe find a better job with out having to worry how it
will effect and affect my life. I want to go out biking, horse back riding
again with out killingthe horse or breakingthe bike ;-). Hell I want to go
skydiving again and get on a roller coaster but my weight is a major issue.
I have tried If you have never been with issues like this please don't
assume that one can just lose by eating smaller portions. DISCIPLINE has
nothing to do with it. I have the discipline. I quit smoking and drink at
the same time 13 years ago. I have never had either since. I don't go sit
at McDonald and eat the fast food all day. If I do go out for fast food I
have a honey oat wheat sub turkey breast with Swiss with all the veggies no
mayo a little mustard and black pepper from subway with a diet coke or I get
a grilled chicken salad from steak and shake if subway is closed.
Everywhere you look all it is Food Food Food. I know I damn sure feel
sometimes like pulling a chair up to a all you can eat place and going at
it. I know if I do it will make me sick as a dog if I do and will make me
feel like shit in the morning
Let me repeat what I wrote to a response to Tweed.
"That is the old stomach surgery. The one I am trying to get uses a band
that is saline filled that wraps around the top part of the stomach where it
connects to the esophagus not cutting of the stomach check it out
http://www.lapband.com/ the new part of the surgeries is all micro
incisions. You go home the next day and back to work in about 2 weeks.
My problem is like a lot of obese people I have been tested and I lack the
chemical that is produced that tells me I am full.
I eat healthy but I can't not try to pronounce or type out the condition it
is but I just can't lose the weight. The weight loss medication makes me
sick as a dog and screws with my sugar levels badly.
I know it is not an instant fix If it was I would never do it. I learned my
life lesson along time ago if it was easy to do than how do you feel
accomplished. It is a way of life it gets you used to the benefits are
that people that have it most with in the first year become non diabetic,
sleep apnea goes away. If you have high blood pressure it goes down. Plus
Joy
every less drastic measure has been explored. Best wishes for a good
outcome.
--
Joy
Don't believe everything you think
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4aea6bfc$0$4983$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
Stormmee
i purposely stayed out of the other thread, but since this is a new thread i
am going to have my say.
by way of credintails...
Highest weight 251.6
current weight 172
lowest weight in the last six years; 151.2
goal weight 146
i am fifty, five foot four and a female.
having said all of that. mathew please do what works for you. i have every
confidence you are an intelligent man who is not going to do anything rash.
part of my weight issues were from meds i took to keep my sight for as long
as possible... now one well two last things... on a diabetic group i read
because of my brother they were just discussing the effects in a positive
way this surgery has on the "gut" hormones... and lastly good luck with your
endeavors, it has been hard for me and i wouldn't wish weight issues on my
worst issues,
Lee
--
Have a wonderful day
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4aea6bfc$0$4983$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
Kyla `=^..^=`
> glad you checked in, Lee
>
> --
> Have a wonderful day
>
> "Matthew"
jmcquown
news:4aea4ca1$0$1668$742e...@news.sonic.net...
> Christina Websell wrote:
>
> > I have no right at all to tell Matthew what to do. I just know that
> > gastric
> > surgery can be dangerous and as I care about him I would prefer him to
> > take
> > another option.
> > Do you have a problem with that, Pam?
> > You seem to think I'm making some sort of judgement here. I am not and
> > I'm
> > surprised that you think I am.
>
> I agree with you, Tweed. (Wow, we agree on something regarding weight! :))
>
> Of course, nobody here can tell anyone else what to do. But I do
> understand
> your concern. Bypass surgery is brutal on the body. People often have
> severe health problems after the fact. And I'm not convinced that Matthew
> has received all the information about these potential problems, because
> doctors are very invested in doing this surgery.
You mean the way the gastroenteroligist insisted I needed to have half my
colon removed after my diverticulitis? That is, until he found out I didn't
have insurance. Heh. My doctor told me I'd wind up back in the hospital
within a year, probably several times, if I didn't have this colon surgery.
It's well over a year later and I feel just fine (knock wood).
Doctors are very vested in the lap band (which is different from gastric
bypass, as Matthew has pointed out). I see commercials all the time for the
lap band, telling people to talk to their doctors. They call it a "simple
procedure", as if tying off part of a person's stomach is as simple as tying
a shoelace. Obviously Matthew can and should do whatever he wants; I
certainly hope he's been fully informed.
I had some co-workers who had the "old" surgery (gastric bypass) with not so
wonderful results. One guy had to have it done twice because he wouldn't
stick to the prescribed diet of liquids only for the first week then
graduate to 3 oz. of soft foods only for two weeks. It was his own fault,
of course; he chose to ignore the instructions and went full tilt boogy for
a cheezeburger and slices of pizza the week after the surgery. He wound up
in the hospital and had to have the procedure again. I'm sure our medical
insurance premiums suffered.
Another woman had gastric bypass but no one ever noticed she lost any
appreciable weight. Last time I saw her she'd lost maybe 15 lbs, which
wasn't really enough for anyone who didn't know her to notice. It was
pretty extreme surgery considering no one ever saw the results the doctor
claimed she'd see.
My point: Don't expect miracles. It's not a television commercial. And
don't necessarily trust a doctor who insists it will be right for you... it
might not be. I'd consult a licensed dietition, first. I don't how how
Matthew eats. He may not eat as much as Pam's 140 lb daughter, but who can
say he's eating the right stuff on a regular basis? I dunno.
I simply don't trust surgeons who have a vested interest in promoting
unnecessary surgery. Been there, done that.
Jill
Jack Campin - bogus address
> the measuring tape? I think we'd all be healthier if we learned to eat
> more healthy food, to stop eating when we're full, and to get plenty
> of exercise.
The idea that genes completely explain obesity doesn't make any sense.
The people who are obese in our generation are descended from people
in earlier generations who weren't obese. The genes haven't changed,
the culture has.
The area a few miles around where I live has one of the worst obesity
problems in Europe, comparable to the worse areas in the US. It's had
very little immigration; the population is the same genetically as it
was 40 years ago. But 40 years ago there was virtually no obesity.
Back then, the main industries were coal mining, farming and paper
making, virtually nobody owned a car, all children walked to school,
nobody sat at home playing computer games, and they watched TV for
only a fraction of the time they do now. Diet had more micronutrients
and less additives (you will eat more bulk to get more vitamins or to
dilute toxins) - there are now very places where you can buy fresh
fruit and vegetables and nearly everybody eats packaged stuff heated
in a microwave. Hunting for genetic explanations instead of confronting
these obvious cultural changes is ignoring the elephant in the room.
==== j a c k at c a m p i n . m e . u k === <http://www.campin.me.uk> ====
Jack Campin, 11 Third St, Newtongrange EH22 4PU, Scotland == mob 07800 739 557
CD-ROMs and free stuff: Scottish music, food intolerance, and Mac logic fonts
****** I killfile Google posts - email me if you want to be whitelisted ******
NettieCat
'not knowing when you're full' is a real condition, I have it too, and
I am sick to death of people saying "Why don't you just stop eating
when your body tells you to?" My body won't tell me to stop until my
stomach is so full that it's painful. I've only stopped eating because
I'm 'full' after a huge Christmas dinner.
I'm also tired of the theory that if everyone eats the same food and
gets the same exercise, they'll be the same weight. It's rubbish. We
are not mechanical, factory built, standardised engines. People have
different gut bacteria, differences in intestine length (natural
differences, not surgical), differences in metabolic efficiencies, and
all of them contribute to the fact that some people can eat
'healthily', get exercise, and still pile the pounds on. I'm semi-
vegan, I have a meal with cheese in it twice a week, I eat a couple of
slices of toast for breakfast, a nice lunch, and then that's it,
unless I get really hungry and have a handful of nuts in the evening
so that the hunger pangs will shut up enough to let me sleep. I don't
drink, can't remember the last time I had a dessert, and I'm twice the
weight I should be and only just holding steady on this regime.
Please, remember, what works for you might not work for other people.
On the other side of the coin, I've got a friend who isn't very mobile
because of arthritis, so doesn't get much exercise, she eats almost
constantly, downs a bottle of wine a day, and has never weighed more
than seven stone in her entire life.
bastX...@sonic.net
>> Why not focus on living a healthy lifestyle, rather than on the scale or
>> the measuring tape? I think we'd all be healthier if we learned to eat
>> more healthy food, to stop eating when we're full, and to get plenty
>> of exercise.
> The idea that genes completely explain obesity doesn't make any sense.
> The people who are obese in our generation are descended from people
> in earlier generations who weren't obese. The genes haven't changed,
> the culture has.
I don't understand how your comment is a response to what I said above.
I didn't say anything about genes. I said that it makes more sense to
focus on healthy living than on weight.
Joyce
--
I care not for a man's religion whose dog and cat are not the better
for it. -- Abraham Lincoln
bastX...@sonic.net
Thanks, Nettie. I couldn't agree with you more. We're *not* made to
factory standards. Everyone's case is different.
But really, what I can't stand is all the moralizing and judgement.
Regardless of what one's opinion is on fat and health, there's never
a place for contempt or prejudice toward someone whose body doesn't
fit your standard of health. A person's body weight is not a moral
issue. It *just isn't*.
Jack Campin - bogus address
>>> the measuring tape? I think we'd all be healthier if we learned to eat
>>> more healthy food, to stop eating when we're full, and to get plenty
>>> of exercise.
>> The idea that genes completely explain obesity doesn't make any sense.
>> The people who are obese in our generation are descended from people
>> in earlier generations who weren't obese. The genes haven't changed,
>> the culture has.
> I don't understand how your comment is a response to what I said above.
> I didn't say anything about genes. I said that it makes more sense to
> focus on healthy living than on weight.
The cultural changes I was talking about were moves away from healthy
living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
that effect.
bastX...@sonic.net
>> I don't understand how your comment is a response to what I said above.
>> I didn't say anything about genes. I said that it makes more sense to
>> focus on healthy living than on weight.
> The cultural changes I was talking about were moves away from healthy
> living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
> as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
> that effect.
And working in coal mines is a good example of "healthy living"?? Jack,
that takes the focus on losing weight, at the expense of health, to new
heights of absurdity. It's kind of like the "cancer diet": you might be
all rotted inside, but at least you're thin!
I get your point - modern conveniences allow us to conserve a lot more
energy, and that equals weight gained for those who don't burn it off
easily. But your example just makes it clear how much people think that
"weight loss" = health. They are far from synonymous.
Jofirey
<bastX...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:4aeb403d$0$1583$742e...@news.sonic.net...
> Thanks, Nettie. I couldn't agree with you more. We're *not* made
> to
> factory standards. Everyone's case is different.
>
> But really, what I can't stand is all the moralizing and
> judgement.
> Regardless of what one's opinion is on fat and health, there's
> never
> a place for contempt or prejudice toward someone whose body
> doesn't
> fit your standard of health. A person's body weight is not a moral
> issue. It *just isn't*.
>
> Joyce
That should be just plain common sense. But in the current
judgmental climate it isn't, its profound.
Jo
Stormmee
core program with a disaster happening, the main component of that is you
eat from a specific list and stop when you are satisfied... after four weeks
i figured out if i knew when i was full i wouldn't be overweight... i went
back to the points and am doing fine. the points system is like an external
monitor of what i have eaten so i in no way depend on what my body tells me.
it did take a bit for me to get used to and i did gain at first, i was used
to eating so little that my body was in starvation mode so it took a bit to
get my body used to more food... its an option you might consider. Lee
--
Have a wonderful day
"NettieCat" <ver...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6bcbc443-3a8d-45de...@j19g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
MLB
You certainly have the will, so purrs that you find the way. Best
wishes. MLB
>
tanadashoes
this subject.
First of all, I also have the same (don't know when full) condition as Matt
does. Mine is partly genetic and partly from being force fed as a child.
Nothing was ever permitted to remain on the plate at the end of a meal and
my father dished up the food, not us. One tends to lose one's ability to
cry quits when never allowed to when young. I raised my kids that they
served them selves and all I asked was that they try a bite of anything that
they didn't like, as tastes change over the years.
Secondly, I've found out that I actually lose a little weight if I don't
think about my diet. I am not obsessing about food. I get tired of people
like Tweed saying that all one needs to do is change their intake. It isn't
that blasted easy. I wish it were. As one's body is getting fewer
nutrients, it will actually start hoarding and storing all the calories it
can. That is one of the reasons that one is warned about those periods
without weight loss.
Pam S.
"NettieCat" <ver...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:6bcbc443-3a8d-45de...@j19g2000yqk.googlegroups.com...
tanadashoes
> factory standards. Everyone's case is different.
>
> But really, what I can't stand is all the moralizing and judgement.
> Regardless of what one's opinion is on fat and health, there's never
> a place for contempt or prejudice toward someone whose body doesn't
> fit your standard of health. A person's body weight is not a moral
> issue. It *just isn't*.
>
> Joyce
>
Thank you!!!! That is my main problem with Tweed's post.
Pam S.
tanadashoes
I'm sure you are surprised. Most people in here are scared of you for some
reason. I generally ignore your bigoted bossiness as I don't consider it
worth the effort. Sometimes you actually write something profound. Even a
broken clock is right twice a day.
If you were to objectively re-read your post to Matthew, I think you'd see
what my own problem is. "Don't you dare have gastric surgery to correct
your weight." "The secret is to learn to eat less over a period of time,"
"Eat less to lose weight over a period of time ."
Matthew, like any overweight person has heard this over and over, and guess
what? It isn't necessarily so. So come off your high horse and be glad
that I'm harassing you about YOUR weight.
Pam S. pissed all over again
Stormmee
the leader warned me i might gain weight, as when i spoke with her she had
asked about my dieting attempts after i told her all i had tried she told me
this was a real possibility, now i do lose, but much slower than most other
people, .2 or .4 a week... and in the space of 3 weeks i gained over nine
pounds and wasn't eating much differently but wasn't eating the foods i need
to stay healthy. Lee
--
Have a wonderful day
"tanadashoes" <tan...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:YLqdnZPkD4SlFHbX...@earthlink.com...
tanadashoes
"Joy" <toa...@real-me.net> wrote in message
news:4aea8e89$0$22778$bd46...@news.dslextreme.com...
> The bottom line is, it's your business. From what you say, it seems that
> every less drastic measure has been explored. Best wishes for a good
> outcome.
>
Thank you. It is Matthew's business and I know he will do exactly what he
needs to do to keep himself in good health. I respect his judgment and,
even if I didn't, it is his body. Not anyone else's. I shouldn't have
blown up at Tweed, but I see too many of her posts judging others and this
one just got to me.
Pam S.
Takayuki
you're very serious about losing weight. And I don't doubt that what
you're trying to do is very hard.
If a person wants to lose say, 100 lbs of fat, doesn't that represent
about the number of calories needed to maintain a person's life for
about a year or so? I don't think any normal diet would seem to make
a dent in that. And our Ice Age brains lie. :) It's a tough job!
Kyla `=^..^=`
body can and can't do. You have a good mind, have explored the options, and
you will do what's best for you, and for those who tell you 'don''t you
dare', it's really none of their business. I eat very little, I do have a
sweet tooth that I'm working on, and I take meds that make me so sick I
can't eat that much. You do what YOU think is best for you and let the
busybodies grouse to their hearts content. You're a wonderful man and a
good friend. Thank you for being YOU and best wishes on whatever you decide
to do:) And I agree with what Pam said as well.
We love you Matthew.
Thanks for the funnies about your kitties too, I needed a good LOL.
Kyla
Kyla `=^..^=`
>
> "Joy"
>> The bottom line is, it's your business. From what you say, it seems that
>> every less drastic measure has been explored. Best wishes for a good
>> outcome.
>>
>
> Thank you. It is Matthew's business and I know he will do exactly what he
> needs to do to keep himself in good health. I respect his judgment and,
> even if I didn't, it is his body. Not anyone else's. I shouldn't have
> blown up at Tweed, but I see too many of her posts judging others and this
> one just got to me.
>
> Pam S.
Thank you Pam and Joy, you're both right on the mark.
We love Matthew and he is a grown man who can make his own decisions.
Tweed can be very judgemental.
She's snarked at me many times and I've felt very much like an outcast here.
Peace
Kyla
bastX...@sonic.net
> If a person wants to lose say, 100 lbs of fat, doesn't that represent
> about the number of calories needed to maintain a person's life for
> about a year or so?
100 lbs = 350K calories. Spread over a year, that'd come out to just
below 1000 calories a day - definitely not enough to maintain weight
(except maybe for someone with an exceptionally slow metabolism). I
usually lost 2 lbs a week on a 1200 calorie/day diet.
--
I prefer to live with Feline Sapiens, thank you very much.
Cheryl
>
> The cultural changes I was talking about were moves away from healthy
> living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
> as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
> that effect.
How on earth do you peel potatoes that *isn't* by hand? Oh, I realize
factories and big restaurants must have machines to do it, but ordinary
people, in their own homes....is there a way for them to peel potatoes
that isn't by hand?
Inquiring minds want to know.
--
Cheryl
Adrian
I have seen potatoe peeling machines intended for use in the home but I've
never used one.
<http://www.amazon.co.uk/CLASSIC-CUISINE-AUTOMATIC-POTATO-PEELER/dp/B002BX1HO2/ref=sr_1_1/277-1495595-5864257?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1256996814&sr=1-1>
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy, Bagheera & Shadow)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
NettieCat
> i think this i the reason that weight watcher works for me. i tried their
> core program with a disaster happening, the main component of that is you
> eat from a specific list and stop when you are satisfied... after four weeks
> i figured out if i knew when i was full i wouldn't be overweight... i went
> back to the points and am doing fine. the points system is like an external
> monitor of what i have eaten so i in no way depend on what my body tells me.
> it did take a bit for me to get used to and i did gain at first, i was used
> to eating so little that my body was in starvation mode so it took a bit to
> get my body used to more food... its an option you might consider. Lee
>
> --
> Have a wonderful day
>
Hiya Stormmee. I've tried the WeightWatchers points system, and whilst
I did lose weight for a few weeks, I ended up in such a black
depression that I ended up quitting and piling on the pounds in
reaction to it. I found that I was constantly focusing on food,
planning meals around points, thinking about how many points I had
left, plotting how to earn more points ... I became utterly obsessed
by food, whilst being constantly aware that I wasn't allowed as much
as I wanted. This 'miss a meal' works better for me, because it's
simple, and it's working. I'm still hungry all the time, but on the
plus side, I'm not being encouraged to think about it. I left
Weightwatchers after our leader passed around a tray of Weightwatchers
pork sausages and told me off when I passed them straight on without
sniffing them.
However, I know that it works for a lot of people, but I have a
naturally contrary nature, and it definitely didn't work for me.
Christina Websell
<bastX...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:4aea4ca1$0$1668$742e...@news.sonic.net...
> Christina Websell wrote:
>
> > I have no right at all to tell Matthew what to do. I just know that
> > gastric
> > surgery can be dangerous and as I care about him I would prefer him to
> > take
> > another option.
> > Do you have a problem with that, Pam?
> > You seem to think I'm making some sort of judgement here. I am not and
> > I'm
> > surprised that you think I am.
>
<smile>
>
> Of course, nobody here can tell anyone else what to do. But I do
> understand
> your concern. Bypass surgery is brutal on the body. People often have
> severe health problems after the fact. And I'm not convinced that Matthew
> has received all the information about these potential problems, because
> doctors are very invested in doing this surgery. I'm not saying it's a big
> conspiracy or that the doctor wants to harm Matthew. I'm just saying that
> doctors have their perspective, and it's NOT the only perspective out
> there.
It concerns me very much that Matthew is diabetic and few tablespoons of
food won't be enough for him to be safe If you are diabetic and don't do
the diet thing properly, you can lose your sight and/or your limbs.
> My feeling about all this - which will come as absolutely no surprise to
> anyone - is that our society pays far too much attention to weight and
> not enough to health. I mean, getting a piece of your stomach or intestine
> cut out (or closed off) for your health? Does that even make sense??
No. But when you see your weight rising year by year you know you are
eating just that bit too much and that it's not a good idea.
If we are all maybe 14lbs overweight, it's not so much a health problem, but
more than that it might be sensible to consider what you eat.
My opinion on this is:
Everyone knows whether they eat too much and whether that makes them fat.
No-one came out of Belsen fat, did they? No, they were skeletal. Because
they did not have enough to eat.
And there you have it, my opinion on food. Eat too much, get fat, eat too
little, get thin.
Tweed
Jack Campin - bogus address
> > living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
> > as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
> > that effect.
> How on earth do you peel potatoes that *isn't* by hand? Oh, I realize
> factories and big restaurants must have machines to do it, but ordinary
> people, in their own homes....is there a way for them to peel potatoes
> that isn't by hand?
Get the McCain's or Bird's Eye factory to do it.
Jofirey
"Cheryl" <cper...@mun.ca> wrote in message
news:7l2qlfF...@mid.individual.net...
of thing. Mostly we avoid it nowadays by buying potatoes in forms
that are already pealed and ready to heat and serve. Or leaving the
peels on and calling it gourmet.
Still, I don't think peeling potatoes was ever much of a weight
controlling effort. Back in the day you sat in a rocking chair on
the back porch and took your time.
Jo
MLB
I prefer them well scrubbed and cooked with the skins on -- more
nutrients too. MLB
Cheryl
>>> living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
>>> as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
>>> that effect.
>> How on earth do you peel potatoes that *isn't* by hand? Oh, I realize
>> factories and big restaurants must have machines to do it, but ordinary
>> people, in their own homes....is there a way for them to peel potatoes
>> that isn't by hand?
>
> Get the McCain's or Bird's Eye factory to do it.
>
Well, yes. Somehow I never thought of it that way.
--
Cheryl
Cheryl
> Cheryl wrote:
>> Jack Campin - bogus address wrote:
>>
>>> The cultural changes I was talking about were moves away from healthy
>>> living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
>>> as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
>>> that effect.
>> How on earth do you peel potatoes that *isn't* by hand? Oh, I realize
>> factories and big restaurants must have machines to do it, but
>> ordinary people, in their own homes....is there a way for them to
>> peel potatoes that isn't by hand?
>>
>> Inquiring minds want to know.
>
> I have seen potatoe peeling machines intended for use in the home but I've
> never used one.
> <http://www.amazon.co.uk/CLASSIC-CUISINE-AUTOMATIC-POTATO-PEELER/dp/B002BX1HO2/ref=sr_1_1/277-1495595-5864257?ie=UTF8&s=home-garden&qid=1256996814&sr=1-1>
That is really overkill unless you have an enormous family and eat a lot
of potatoes!
--
Cheryl
moonglow minnow
> No-one came out of Belsen fat, did they? No, they were skeletal. Because
> they did not have enough to eat.
> And there you have it, my opinion on food. Eat too much, get fat, eat too
> little, get thin.
Many studies actually back that, given both reasonable amounts of food
(somewhere around 2000 calories a day) and exercise that is neither
restricted nor forced, the vast majority of people will tend toward a
set weight, and it takes a *dramatic* and *sustained* increase or
decrease of calories to shift that weight by more than 20 lbs or so.
Your opinion is your opinion, but it's much more complicated than you
put it. Anyone will lose weight in starvation conditions, yes, but for
some people that's actually what it takes to lose weight. Almost anyone
will gain weight on a sumo wrestler's diet as well, and likewise, that's
what it would take for some people to be able to gain weight.
Oversimplifying it to "eat too much, get fat, eat too little, get thin"
honestly comes off as condescending and insulting to people who struggle
with their weight in either direction.
Maeve >^..^<
--
http://moonglowminnow.wordpress.com/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/minnow/
bastX...@sonic.net
> No-one came out of Belsen fat, did they? No, they were skeletal. Because
> they did not have enough to eat.
> And there you have it, my opinion on food. Eat too much, get fat, eat too
> little, get thin.
That is true in the short run only. It doesn't take into account the fact
that the body rebounds once the period of eating too little or too much
is over. And it usually goes back to a weight range that is biologically
and internally regulated. Also, the rebound effect is much stronger when
the body is starved - that's a survival mechanism. The body does its very
best to conserve fuel when it starts burning off those fuel stores.
Joyce
--
I want freedom, the right to self expression, everyone's right to
beautiful radiant things. -- Emma Goldman
Kyla `=^..^=`
> I prefer them well scrubbed and cooked with the skins on -- more nutrients
> too. MLB
I'm with you on that. I never peel my potatoes, and love them cooked, with
the skin on, nearly any way. Not too crazy about French fries.
Yes, they do have more nutrients if you leave the skin on.
I love a good homemade cream of potato soup on a cold Winter day, and it's
good comfort food. too. I have a great recipe if anyone wants it.
Kyla
needing a baked potato
Kyla `=^..^=`
I'm sure he has brains enough to consult the Drs about these issues. Geez.
If he does decide to have the surgery, he says it'll be in about a year.
Aways off yet and it's HIS decision.
He wants to improve his health, not make it worse. It's NOT a matter of him
just overeating, like you seem to think.
Kyla
MLB
in the microwave for four to five minutes and it tastes great I also
cook a yam this way. I usually top it with margarine or picante sauce.
MLB
Kyla `=^..^=`
I found out the hard way that you need to poke the potato a few times
before micorwaving it or it will explode (the potato, not the micorwave)
I like mine with margarine, sour cream and fresh basil.
Kyla
MLB
Joy
news:hcj8jn$nu7$2...@news.xmission.com...
I was taught to poke a potato even before baking it in the regular oven.
Joy
Stormmmee
cover about all one needed to know about potato soup. Lee
--
Have a great day
"Kyla `=^..^=`" <kyla.w...@comcats.net> wrote in message
news:7l46rnF...@mid.individual.net...
Stormmmee
--
Have a great day
"Kyla `=^..^=`" <kyla.w...@comcats.net> wrote in message
news:7l4ea1F...@mid.individual.net...
Stormmmee
understand where hhyou are... but your opinion of weight loss and weight
issues is about the same as someone telling you to just get over being
depressed... while on a technical level fewer calories generallyy means
weight loss not always, there are emtional components and medical components
beyond just the calories... one time i went on a four hundred, yes four
hundred calorie a day plan... followed ot a t DH prepared and counted the
calores... after thirty days... oh i gained a half pound...
what i am saying is that if you have not done the research please show the
same compassion for this issue as you would like to see for people who
suffer depression, Lee
--
Have a great day
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7l3eroF...@mid.individual.net...
>
Stormmmee
diabetic symptoms to the point that they are researching it further,
something to do with hormones they didn't know resided in the "gut" pathway,
Lee
--
Have a great day
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7l3eroF...@mid.individual.net...
>
Stormmmee
pattern or regime, pills or surgery, i simply must have the external support
that the points gives, and i have always been a foodie anyway so this just
gives more structure. you4 leader was way out of line treating you that
way, i go to a very large center and none of the leaders would do such a
thing... now instead of core its set points, so say you are going to eat
fruit, you eat what fyou need but for two points, i am not even going there,
you know i need a lot more watermelon tan te next guy, good luck whatever
you do, Lee
--
Have a great day
"NettieCat" <ver...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:31817c91-fb4b-40ea...@a32g2000yqm.googlegroups.com...
Stormmmee
out some of this your two pound losing amount would have put me up about a
quarter pound to a half pound a week. Lee
--
Have a great day
<bastX...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:4aebdcfd$0$1650$742e...@news.sonic.net...
Jofirey
At least they will usually split before they explode. Potatoes like
to explode. If I'm going to microwave a potato I stab a deep x into
the top and the bottom with a paring knife.
Jo
Kyla `=^..^=`
"Jofirey" ...
>
> "MLB"
Hmmm, that I hadn't thought about. Thanks I just stab em.
Kyla
>
Kyla `=^..^=`
"Joy"
> "MLB"
Me too, after a couple of messy disasters, years ago LOL.
Kyla
>
>
Kyla `=^..^=`
"Stormmmee"
> you should post yours and get gramby to post hers, the two would probably
> cover about all one needed to know about potato soup. Lee
>
> --
> Have a great day
> "Kyla `=^..^=`"
>>
>>
Kyla `=^..^=`
"Stormmmee"
> you know tweed i generalltyy agree with you and when i don't i at least
> understand where hhyou are... but your opinion of weight loss and weight
> issues is about the same as someone telling you to just get over being
> depressed... while on a technical level fewer calories generallyy means
> weight loss not always, there are emtional components and medical
> components beyond just the calories... one time i went on a four hundred,
> yes four hundred calorie a day plan... followed ot a t DH prepared and
> counted the calores... after thirty days... oh i gained a half pound...
>
> what i am saying is that if you have not done the research please show the
> same compassion for this issue as you would like to see for people who
> suffer depression, Lee
Thank you for being so straightforward with her, Lee, I agree with you
totally.
Kyla
Yowie
Cheryl <cper...@mun.ca> typed:
> Jack Campin - bogus address wrote:
>
>>
>> The cultural changes I was talking about were moves away from healthy
>> living. People didn't work down coal mines and peel potatoes by hand
>> as a weight reduction plan, but levels of activity like that did have
>> that effect.
>
> How on earth do you peel potatoes that *isn't* by hand? Oh, I realize
> factories and big restaurants must have machines to do it, but
> ordinary people, in their own homes....is there a way for them to
> peel potatoes that isn't by hand?
>
> Inquiring minds want to know.
I just leave the skins on - adds flavour and leaves in alot of the
nutrition.
Mmmmm, jacket potatoes.... mmmmm
Yowie
Christina Websell
"Stormmmee" <rgr...@consolidated.net> wrote in message
news:7l50coF...@mid.individual.net...
> you know tweed i generalltyy agree with you and when i don't i at least
> understand where hhyou are... but your opinion of weight loss and weight
> issues is about the same as someone telling you to just get over being
> depressed... while on a technical level fewer calories generallyy means
> weight loss not always, there are emtional components and medical
> components beyond just the calories... one time i went on a four hundred,
> yes four hundred calorie a day plan... followed ot a t DH prepared and
> counted the calores... after thirty days... oh i gained a half pound...
>
> what i am saying is that if you have not done the research please show the
> same compassion for this issue as you would like to see for people who
> suffer depression, Lee
>
If you eat more that you expend in calories daily you will gain weight, if
you eat less you will lose weight. It really is that simple.
I know my view is not popular but it's a fact.
Every Brit I know that went to USA was surprised by the size of the portions
offered in the restaurants, they could not eat them, they were far too much.
Tweed
Cheryl
> "Stormmmee" <rgr...@consolidated.net> wrote in message
> news:7l50coF...@mid.individual.net...
>> you know tweed i generalltyy agree with you and when i don't i at least
>> understand where hhyou are... but your opinion of weight loss and weight
>> issues is about the same as someone telling you to just get over being
>> depressed... while on a technical level fewer calories generallyy means
>> weight loss not always, there are emtional components and medical
>> components beyond just the calories... one time i went on a four hundred,
>> yes four hundred calorie a day plan... followed ot a t DH prepared and
>> counted the calores... after thirty days... oh i gained a half pound...
>>
>> what i am saying is that if you have not done the research please show the
>> same compassion for this issue as you would like to see for people who
>> suffer depression, Lee
>>
> Depression is an illness. Obesity is not.
> If you eat more that you expend in calories daily you will gain weight, if
> you eat less you will lose weight. It really is that simple.
> I know my view is not popular but it's a fact.
An incomplete fact. There are other aspects to weight and weight loss/gain.
> Every Brit I know that went to USA was surprised by the size of the portions
> offered in the restaurants, they could not eat them, they were far too much.
So? Does this prove that Americans are fat because their restaurants
serve too much food per meal, and Brits are thin because theirs don't?
That can't be right; I've read reports of obesity in Britain, which
shouldn't be the case if small restaurant portions in Britain are a
determining factor in peoples' weight.
Even back in the days when they didn't have convenience food and
machines, some people were fat and some tried fad diets to deal with it.
Not as many as today - no doubt our sedentary culture contributes to
the overall picture, just as food intake does. But the problem always
seems to have existed, and not to have been solved in all cases as
simply as you suggest.
--
Cheryl
Matthew
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk>
<snipped for post making me ill>
You truly can't be this ignorant can you??? None so blind as those who will
not see.
If so than there is no help for you. I am not even going to try to make you
open your eyes. You are on your high horse again and think you are
absolutely right. I will let you continue to make a fool of yourself to
everyone. At least it will give the group something to talk about for
awhile.
At least there is help for me and I am going to take it. If surgery is
necessary than that is the road I may have to take. I trust people that
actually know what they are talking about not the ignorant, prejudice people
out there like yourself.
Try Google once Tina maybe it can actually open your eyes if you can see
past that foot you have so buried in your mouth.
I am going to go lurk for a bit while the nauseated feeling I have from
reading the snipped post goes away.
Stormmmee
there are many misconceptions, the condition mathew and pam have is a fact,
and there is also a mental health component to over weight, the actual
weight is really a symptom of something else going on physically or
mentally... as to portions... its not relvant. when we eat out we either
split an entree or get a to go box making the expense worthwhile, but again
that is not relevant. Lee
--
Have a great day
"Christina Websell" <spam...@tinawebsell.wanadoo.co.uk> wrote in message
news:7l8nspF...@mid.individual.net...
moonglow minnow
> Depression is an illness. Obesity is not.
This is where you're wrong. Obesity is an illness too, especially if it
originates from an eating disorder or hormonal imbalance. Your attitude
toward fat people is insulting, and becomes more so every time you
repeat your mantra.
MLB
Yes. Excess weight can definitely be an illness. I had a brother who
was very very large. He actually was not a big eater. He smoked to try
to curb his eating with little success., He went to a new hospital for
tests and they told him he had the lowest ,metabolism they had ever
recorded. They put him on a 700 calorie a day diet which did not work
either.\\\He died from an industrial accident at age 53.
Stormmee
in a lot of ways, society treats people with weight issues like the victims
of sexual abuse. i mean after its YOUR fault THIS happened. Lee
--
Have a wonderful day
"MLB" <mlbr...@nonesuch.com> wrote in message
news:hcnilm$1hg$1...@news.xmission.com...
bastX...@sonic.net
> Depression is an illness. Obesity is not.
> If you eat more that you expend in calories daily you will gain weight, if
> you eat less you will lose weight. It really is that simple.
> I know my view is not popular but it's a fact.
This is what I was talking about a couple of months ago when I said that
you are closed-minded about ideas other than your own. At the time you
seemed very surprised to hear that, and stated that you are very open to
other points of view, and that you had no idea why I would have that
impression of you. This is why.
I realize that no argument, no matter how well-reasoned or well-supported,
is going to sway you, because the more people oppose you, the more you
dig your heels in. So I would just like to call your attention to the
fact that you are once again responding to ideas that are new to you with
the same rigid, refuse-to-budge response that I have seen several times
before. It's very frustrating, as is your extremely judgemental attitude
about this issue.
Joyce
--
I want freedom, the right to self expression, everyone's right to
beautiful radiant things. -- Emma Goldman
Christina Websell
<bastX...@sonic.net> wrote in message
news:4aef5612$0$1674$742e...@news.sonic.net...
> Christina Websell wrote:
>
> > Depression is an illness. Obesity is not.
> > If you eat more that you expend in calories daily you will gain weight,
> > if
> > you eat less you will lose weight. It really is that simple.
> > I know my view is not popular but it's a fact.
>
> This is what I was talking about a couple of months ago when I said that
> you are closed-minded about ideas other than your own. At the time you
> seemed very surprised to hear that, and stated that you are very open to
> other points of view, and that you had no idea why I would have that
> impression of you. This is why.
>
> I realize that no argument, no matter how well-reasoned or well-supported,
> is going to sway you, because the more people oppose you, the more you
> dig your heels in. So I would just like to call your attention to the
> fact that you are once again responding to ideas that are new to you with
> the same rigid, refuse-to-budge response that I have seen several times
> before. It's very frustrating, as is your extremely judgemental attitude
> about this issue.
>
you wil gain weight and if you eat less than you need you will lose.
Why do you get annoyed when I say that?
Tweed
Cheryl
As far as I'm concerned, 'annoyed' is a bit strong for my reaction to
this discussion, but it does strike me as a bit odd that such an
over-simplification about obesity is so important to you.
Of course, you can, if you want to, believe that's all there is to
weight control. People believe and talk about lots of weirder things,
all the time. What you believe about obesity wouldn't really be any of
my business, except that you seem so set on repeating the point, again
and again, long after it seems likely that everyone has read it, and
that those who disagree with you have shown that they are highly
unlikely to change their minds.
--
Cheryl
tanadashoes
Is depression an illness because you've had it and obesity not because
you are not fat? What part of chemical imbalance do you not understand?
What part of genetics do you not understand? What part of
conditioning, training, and so forth do you not understand? I wish
dieting were as simple as you seem to think. Anyway, get off your high
horse and learn something for once. You are acting like an ignorant
twit. I feel sorry for you.
Pam S.
tanadashoes
You ROCK!! This is the sort of thing I was trying to get through to her
ignorance. Thank you.
Pam S.
Kyla `=^..^=`
And I totally agree with you Lee. BTDToo:( the SA thing and the weight
issue both.
I'm 5 foot 2 and weigh about 155 lbs, and my weight varies because some of
the the meds I have to take make me gain weight. I have, among other things,
a hyperactive thyroid, have to take horrid meds which make my weight go up,
So? I'm a rotten person because I don't weigh 98 lbs like I did when I was
in high school?
Forget it..I'm not going to argue with you Tweet. Nothing gets through,
.
Matthew, you know what you need to do, I've seen pix of a few of you, at the
Get Together at Charleens (where IS Charleen?), and I see smiling happy
faces, so don't let the 'misinformed know it all' get to you.. You are a
very smart guy and will do what's best for you because you want to live a
long happy life:). And you have a lot of support from people who love you:)
And your words to Tweet were right on!!
Kyla
>i am sorry to read this. but at least he found out it wasn't his fault...
>in a lot of ways, society treats people with weight issues like the victims
>of sexual abuse. i mean after its YOUR fault THIS happened. Lee
>
> --
> Have a wonderful day
>
> "MLB" >> Matthew wrote:
>>> "Christina Websell" <
Kyla `=^..^=`
> I find a scientific fact that says if you eat more calories than you need
> you wil gain weight and if you eat less than you need you will lose.
>
Where, MAD Magazine?
Kyla
bastX...@sonic.net
> Where, MAD Magazine?
LOL!!!!
Joyce
--
I'm in favor of animal liberation. Why? Because I'm an animal.
-- Edward Abbey
tanadashoes
The joke side of the instant oatmeal packet.
Pam S.
Adrian
Once again you're posting about a subject you know nothing about. If, as
you, it's a scientific fact then quote the research. If not, get down off
your high horse and stop being so judgemental.
--
Adrian (Owned by Snoopy, Bagheera & Shadow)
Cats leave pawprints on your heart
http://community.webshots.com/user/clowderuk
Granby
Have a friend, not lose, who went through this. The hard part comes on the
day to day eating after the surgery. You can do it.
Unless you have dealt with a weight problem, a severe one, you cannot be
expected to understand what a monster it cam be.
Sending purrs and prayers for the prep period ahead.
"Matthew" <iamacat...@proudtoserve.com> wrote in message
news:4ae8e1b5$0$5641$9a6e...@unlimited.newshosting.com...
>I know that I am in and out. Trying to get my head on straight before I
>fully put my time back into the groups. Needed a break from a lot of
>things
>
> So blanket purrs and prayers to all that need them.
>
> Right now Phantom is doing better. He still gets sick easily. I think
> he has arthritis and having trouble with his stomach. He still is a
> grouchy old pain but I still am happy I did not have to make that decision
> a while ago. I just reordered his hyperthyroidism medication. You can
> tell he is getting old
>
> Jammer is a little shit. ( typical fur nut kitten) He has developed all
> of the others bad habits So he has gained the title of why you little
> ^%&(#%^*(#%^(Q%^#)%&Q)%&Q)_#&* early on.
>
> Phantom and Jammer have little spats you can tell it is dominance but a
> few minute later they are laying back to back trying to see who can take
> the most space up. Jammer tried to take over Rumble alpha spot and was
> politely chased under daddy's feet with a very stern who do you think you
> are whooping by Rumble. ;-)
>
> Rumble I think is still a little mad that Jammer is still here. He only
> comes into my room now when the time to be feed has past the time or a
> snack. Any other time he is hanging out in the living room or somewhere
> in between there and mom's room.
>
> Limo is still fine she still wishes she was the only cat in the house.
>
> Ka'shay aka golden girl has turned a beautiful golden color from her red
> tabby shade. I need to get her in for her updated rabies and distemper
> shots. She is definite mom's cat. Her and jammer play with each other
> but I can tell she still misses her best friend may the furball rest in
> peace Spirit. ( I still do myself )<tears>
>
> Dumplin is dumplin still no comment from me. That is mom's doing letting
> him have those bad habits and letting me break him of them
>
> Mom is fine. A pain in the ass but that is nothing new
>
> Ok here is my good news and bad news. Allergies have been extreme for
> the last few weeks. I still need to get my head straight I need to do
> more and get out more before I head back down the depression highway. I
> have also lost a few people recently. My mom's friends husband died of
> complications from lung cancer. He beat the cancer but it left him
> broken and it was his time. I believe he was in his 50's. We lost a
> family member; not close, on Saturday to the normal flu. He had other
> complications such as COPD and hillbilly stubbornness did not help. He
> was 61 I think. He refused to go to the hospital so it got him. Many of
> my friends either have the swine flu or a family member has the swine
> flu. Even though it has been around along time. It is still a scary
> thing. The Doc wants me to have a flu vaccination I said HELL NO last
> year it put me in the hospital NEVER AGAIN.
>
>
> Good news my sugars are still doing great on the new meds. My tri are up
> a bit but that is my fault I have not been taking my fish oil. I got some
> news on my gastric surgery I wanted to done to help me with my weight.
> The insurance will finally admitted they have to cover but Now comes all
> the hurdles to jump through. So it will still be about 8 months to a year
> before I fully qualify to have it done. But at least the option is on the
> table and out in the open.
>
> So there it is in a nut shell
>
> I am still around lurking ;-)
>
Kyla `=^..^=`
.
LOL
Kyla
Christina Websell
"Adrian" <an...@bigfoot.com> wrote in message
news:od-dnVqUEq5juW3X...@brightview.com...
Don't be so ridiculous. If you eat more than you need you will put on
weight, if you eat less than you need you will lose weight. It really is
that simple if you like it or not.
T
Joy
news:7lmehuF...@mid.individual.net...
Considering the fact that some people eat very little, yet still gain
weight, while others eat huge amounts and never gain, it isn't simple at
all.
Joy
John F. Eldredge
Well, the issue is that "more than you need" varies from individual to
individual, even if they are the same weight. My father had a high
metabolic rate; he could eat large meals and yet remain skinny. My
mother had a low metabolic rate, and was overweight for most of her life
as a result. Unfortunately, my sister and I both inherited my mother's
metabolism.
--
John F. Eldredge -- jo...@jfeldredge.com
"Reserve your right to think, for even to think wrongly is better
than not to think at all." -- Hypatia of Alexandria
bastX...@sonic.net
> Well, the issue is that "more than you need" varies from individual to
> individual, even if they are the same weight. My father had a high
> metabolic rate; he could eat large meals and yet remain skinny. My
> mother had a low metabolic rate, and was overweight for most of her life
> as a result. Unfortunately, my sister and I both inherited my mother's
> metabolism.
Only someone who lives in a society that doesn't have famines, and who
has enough resources not to go hungry, could say "unfortunately" as you
did in your last sentence. If you lived in a time and/or place where you
never knew when you would eat next, you would be very fortunate indeed
to have your slow (ie, fuel-efficient) metabolism. In evolutionary terms,
human have lived in that kind of environment, at least some of the time,
for the vast majority of the time we've been around.
This makes me think that maybe the reason the human race has both high-
and low-metabolism genes among our population is because we evolved in
times of intermittent food supply. Sometimes people got lucky and had lots
to eat for a time. Other times they went hungry and many starved to death.
During times of plenty, the high-metabolism people would have an advantage
because they'd be less likely to gain weight, and so they'd be more agile
and able to move faster. But during lean times, the ones with a low
metabolism would have the advantage, as they'd be the ones most likely
to survive long periods of hunger. The fact that both kinds of metabolisms
are still around tells me that both afforded an advantage, although at
different times or in different situations.
Joyce
--
A clean house is a sign of a broken computer.
moonglow minnow
> Don't be so ridiculous. If you eat more than you need you will put on
> weight, if you eat less than you need you will lose weight. It really is
> that simple if you like it or not.
It's not that simple when "less than what you need" deprives your body
of vital nutrients no matter how well the diet is planned, and sends
your body into starvation mode which further reduces caloric "need"...
Attitudes like yours breed deadly eating disorders.
bastX...@sonic.net
> Christina Websell wrote:
>> ...It really is that simple if you like it or not.
> It's not that simple when "less than what you need" deprives your body
> of vital nutrients no matter how well the diet is planned, and sends
> your body into starvation mode which further reduces caloric "need"...
The issue is really calories, not so much nutrients. If you deprive
yourself of sufficient calories so that your body needs to burn its own
fat for energy, that's when it goes into starvation mode. Your body's
hormones don't know the difference between hunger due to a famine or
poverty, etc, and voluntary starvation due to dieting.
> Attitudes like yours breed deadly eating disorders.
As well as legitimizing discrimination and social stigma. If you're
not on the receiving end of that, then you might think it's trivial,
but trust me, it ain't.
Joyce
--
"Sentimentality" -- that's what we call the sentiment we don't share.
-- Graham Greene
Stormmee
thinner, one of the things i discovered for me is that all calories are NOT
equal. i am by no means a vegetarian, its just that i would never think to
eat meat, never thing oh i would like a steak. one of the rude facts for me
is that if i don't eat animal protien on a regular basis my body freaks out
and i gain, i could eat exactly the same for a period of two weeks, and if i
actually ad the calories of a three ounce portion of meat three or four
times a week i lose more, so in effect more calories with meat means better
health and therefore weight loss, Lee
--
Have a wonderful day
"John F. Eldredge" <jo...@jfeldredge.com> wrote in message
news:7lmnj9F...@mid.individual.net...
Lesley
My father had a high
> metabolic rate; he could eat large meals and yet remain skinny.
My friend Belinda has an apetite that would not shame a large horse
and a twenty inch waist. I've seen her sit down for mid morning
breaking and accompany 2 cups of coffee with 2 sandwiches and 3 slices
of cake and she had a large breakfast so it's not that she's making up
for missing a meal. In the Tudor peroid there were 13+ course
banquets and she could easily work her way through one of those and
probably look round for the next course or ask for seconds. Guess
what? She really hates being so skinny- she finds it hard to find
clothes she would really like to have a bust
Lesley
Slave of the Fabulous Furballs
Jofirey
"moonglow minnow" <tahee...@charter.net.invalid> wrote in message
news:7ln0p1F...@mid.individual.net...
> Christina Websell wrote:
>
>> Don't be so ridiculous. If you eat more than you need you will
>> put on weight, if you eat less than you need you will lose
>> weight. It really is that simple if you like it or not.
>
> It's not that simple when "less than what you need" deprives your
> body of vital nutrients no matter how well the diet is planned,
> and sends your body into starvation mode which further reduces
> caloric "need"...
>
> Attitudes like yours breed deadly eating disorders.
>
> Maeve >^..^<
The whole attitude makes me feel a little sick. I know only too
well how many anorexics there are out there exercising like mad and
starving themselves because they believe what Christina does.
People are not machines with strict input and output guides that the
engineers can control. They are living breathing organisms that
have evolved over generations of hardship most of us no longer face.
Sometimes the design doesn't adapt well to current conditions and
sometimes it malfunctions. It is that simple.
Jo
Christina Websell
"Jofirey" <jof...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:7lohv9F...@mid.individual.net...
you need you will lose it.
It's that simple.
Why do you say it is not? What is the problem with this? It's true.
I need to eat 1800 calories a day for my lifestyle and activity. If i eat
2500 for several weeks I will put on weight and won't get rid of it unless I
undereat for a while. If I got back to 1800 I still wouldn't get rid of
that extra weight I gained, 1800 would be enough to maintain it.
Tweed
I hate this fat woman stuff. I'm not fat but does it matter if I was? would
you like me better at my present weight (130lbs) or if I weighed 300?
Is it important at all? If so, why?
>
moonglow minnow
> No, if you eat more than you need you put on weight and if you eat less than
> you need you will lose it.
> It's that simple.
> Why do you say it is not? What is the problem with this? It's true.
> I need to eat 1800 calories a day for my lifestyle and activity. If i eat
> 2500 for several weeks I will put on weight and won't get rid of it unless I
> undereat for a while. If I got back to 1800 I still wouldn't get rid of
> that extra weight I gained, 1800 would be enough to maintain it.
Actually, research suggests that if you ate 2000 calories a day you
probably wouldn't gain weight, and if you ate 1600 calories a day you
probably wouldn't lose weight, long term. Your metabolism would
compensate to keep you as close to your set weight as possible. So
getting back to 1800 calories/day probably would get rid of that extra
weight over time. There's also strong evidence that what you're getting
your calories from affects how many of those calories are actually taken
into your body from your gut. So you may be eating 2000 calories and
only absorbing 1800 of them. Added to that is that the calorie system is
an imperfect approximation based on the change of water temperature by
burning the food...
So in reality, someone *can* eat the exact same number of calories per
day and gain or lose weight depending on what those calories are coming
from, and someone *can* eat more or less than they need (within reason)
and not gain or lose weight. It's very individual, very real, and very
proven by science.
It's just not as simple as you think it is.
Jofirey
"moonglow minnow" <tahee...@charter.net.invalid> wrote in message
Thank you Maeve for putting that so calmly, rationally and
accurately.
Jo