Is a Ford Diesel Worth it
aaajn
I need your opinions. Myu wife and I are thinking about buying a 25
foot Airstream International. The question remains; What should I tow
it with?
I want (that is my word) a Ford F-250 SD Diesel. I heard they get
better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
the ULSD fuel. How does a Diesel compare to a gas model as far as
emissions go? I am wondering if any of you would be willing to offer
an opinion.
thanks,
John
Hunter
>I need your opinions. Myu wife and I are thinking about buying a 25
>foot Airstream International. The question remains; What should I tow
>it with?
The choice of diesel or gas is yours. I would definitely go with a
3/4 ton truck, over a 1/2 ton. IOW a GM 2500 or Ford F250.
I tow a 25' Airstream Classic with an F-250 Diesel. (7.3 Powerstroke).
It's wonderful in the mountains, my trailer is heavier than the CCD.
It's not inexpensive to have a diesel, the truck initially costs more
and fuel is more. It does get better mileage, but the costs of buying
and feeding it won't be made up in the mileage difference.
If you plan to do lots of mountain driving and use it often, get the
diesel, the torque is worth it.
If you live in flat country and plan to use it for occasional
weekends, get gas.
You are welcome to join my Airstream elist....
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AirstreamList/
Hunter
Frank Tabor
I have an '01 F350 with the 7.3. The emissions are different, not more
than gas. I get way better mileage towing than the V10 gas motor does.
Stay away from the '03 to '07 6.0 liter engine. There's been lots of rear
seal problems and other issues. If possible, get an '07 with the newer
engine, 6.9 L I believe. It uses the newer Ultra Low sulfur fuel. It's
supposed to be a more reliable engine than the 6 L.
--
Frank Tabor
mixed emotions:
Watching your mother-in-law back off a cliff...
in your brand new Mercedes.
Frank Tabor
>>"aaajn" <aa...@comcast.net> wrote:
>
>>I heard they get
>>better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
>>the ULSD fuel.
>
> All diesels will be using ULSD fuel by next week.
>
Not necessarily. There will be plenty of stations that haven't changed
over yet, and haven't used up their stock of LSD yet. Besides, it will
still be awhile before the engines requiring ULSD will become commonplace.
The engines are only required in vehicles produced after Jan 1.
--
Frank Tabor
The F-15 Eagle:
If it's up, we'll shoot it down. If it's down, we'll blow it up.
-- A McDonnell-Douglas ad from a few years ago
Jud Hardcastle
says...
>
> Stay away from the '03 to '07 6.0 liter engine. There's been lots of rear
> seal problems and other issues. If possible, get an '07 with the newer
> engine, 6.9 L I believe. It uses the newer Ultra Low sulfur fuel. It's
> supposed to be a more reliable engine than the 6 L.
>
available until the 08 models--afaik ALL the 07 diesel's have the 6.0
and can use either LSD or ULSD--the new engine HAS to have ULSD, a mute
point since there won't be any LSD by then.
Some of the experts :-) over at Ford diesel group are actually
recommending the last 6.0's over the unknowns--and major complications--
of the new one!
--
Jud
Dallas TX USA
SnoMan
wrote:
>Not necessarily. There will be plenty of stations that haven't changed
>over yet, and haven't used up their stock of LSD yet. Besides, it will
>still be awhile before the engines requiring ULSD will become commonplace.
>The engines are only required in vehicles produced after Jan 1.
Not so because stations refill often and it does not matter if new
engines require it or not because it is a EPA mandate the ALL fuel
will be low sulpher period. When I filled up my heating oil tank in
october it was low sulpher. I can tell because when the wind is right
the furnace has a different smell to it now. (basically no sulpher
smell now) Below is a link to some info on LSD and ULSD fuel.
http://forum.snoman.com/viewtopic.php?t=227
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
SnoMan
wrote:
>I have an '01 F350 with the 7.3. The emissions are different, not more
>than gas.
How very untrue. Diesels may be low on CO and hydrocarbon emissions in
PPM but they are bad on soot emissions and suck on NOx emmision (5 to
10 times worse than a gas motor) Diesels have gotten by because they
have had the excause of poor fuel quality well no more. Starting in 08
they will actually have CATs too (not just thermal reactors to help
control soot that are typically mistaken for CATs) They will also have
strict requirements to reduce NOx emmisions a lot and not just LD
trucks either. Semis will soon have CATs too. If you look at PPM on
emmisions they might not look too bad but when you consider them in
grams per mile they suck because they move a lot moper air through
engine which while this may dilute PPM it does not dilute grams per
mile. The EPA stated when they made the rule change on fuel that
diesel are now today the single biggest source of transportion
emission problems. They supassed gas vehicles as the leading cause
some time ago. Some would like to believe otherwise though. Strict
emission controls on diesels are long overdue as gas engine have been
"fighting" them for over 30 years now.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
SnoMan
<I5i5changeth...@xemaps.com> wrote:
>Some of the experts :-) over at Ford diesel group are actually
>recommending the last 6.0's over the unknowns--and major complications--
>of the new one!
Let someone else be the test dummy for the new PS from Ford. Be it a
engine or tranny from Ford, GM or Dodge it is not usually wise to buy
the first year of a completely new design as it can take a while to
get the bugs out of it. The 6.0 PS's track record was trouble some at
best whne new though it promised otherwise
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
FMB
news:1167377430.0...@a3g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
Powerstrokes have been having major engine issues for 3-4 years now with
nothing 'greatly' improved in the very near future. Its a wonder folks
still purchase Ford Diesels. Maybe it is the need to be yet, another guinne
pig.
FMB
(North Mexico)
Tom J
The only point I'll address is on fuel. I was driving a ford diesel
until I bought the 2000 ford V-10 that I tow my 35 foot Avion with. It
has more than enough umpt to pull any pull behind trailer. The V-10 is
a proven engine, unlike the new diesel. Last, because of cost
difference in engines and fuel, you'll never make up the difference in
cost because of lower mileage and the V-10 is less noisey and smells
better!!
Tom J
Nate
"Frank Tabor" <fta...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:12pa8ja...@corp.supernews.com...
Rear seals? Lots?
The 6.0 is plaqued with retarded turbos that don't respond to fuel pedal on
take-offs. They are plagued with piss poor pcm PROGRAMS THAT MAKE THE
TORQUER SHIFT TRANNY SHIft at the wrong times (bucking and jerking when
towing). They are plaqued with EGR valves that get crusted over and stop
working. They are plagued with oil driven injectors...and therefore prone
to HPOP failures. But I have seen very very very few with rear seals on the
engine, tranny or differentials failing. One thing neat about the 6.0 is
that International decided the best way to stop diesel engines from leaking
is to put all the oil seals inside the crankcase. This way...if the engine
leaks oil it leaks it right back into the crank case. No more worrying
about that dreaded oil spot in the drive way that 7.3 liter engines left.
Ford and International put an awful lot of seals in the 7.3s under warranty.
I was scheduled to have my pan gasket replaced right beofre I totaled
it...that would have required removal of the engine...that's a big ticket
item for Ford to take a hit on for a silly oil leak that does not cause
performance issues.
Nate
Nate
"Jud Hardcastle" <I5i5changeth...@xemaps.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ffee8a62...@news.dallas.sbcglobal.net...
> Some of the experts :-) over at Ford diesel group are actually
> recommending the last 6.0's over the unknowns--and major complications--
> of the new one!
> --
> Jud
> Dallas TX USA
They are recommending it only because they got gun shy when the 6.0 was
released. It turned out to be a lesser engine than it's predesecsor. Fact
is...the 6.4 is an improved 6.0. They replaced the HPOP driven injectors
with piezo electric injectors. They replaced the big turbo that has very
noticable turbo lag with a dual, smaller turbo. One turbo spins up for take
off from a stop and the other kicks in when needed. The smaller turbo
spools up faster.
Will there be problems with the 6.4? Posible. Will Ford stand behind it
and fix the problems? They've been trying like hell to fix the issues with
the 6.0. A new PCM calibration seems to come out monthly from
International. YOu have to give credit when it is due...they are trying
like hell.
Nate
Nate
"FMB" <fm...@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:PSalh.1063$ji1...@newssvr12.news.prodigy.net...
People buy Ford PSDs because you get more bang for you buck with them. Most
of the trucks work just fine. But they do have a higher than normal rate of
return.
Nate
Frank Tabor
> How very untrue.
fuck off,
Snoman. You're an idiot.
--
Frank Tabor
I live the way I type; fast, with a lot of mistakes.
Frank Tabor
> Not so
Fuck off, Snoman, you're an idiot.
--
Frank Tabor
Take an astronaut to launch.
Frank Tabor
The so called '08 is being released shortly after the New Year.
--
Frank Tabor
To our sweethearts and wives. May they never meet.
-- 19th century toast
William Boyd
bought a 2000 V-10 to replace a diesel of
undoubtedly older vintage. With the advancing
technology of the automotive world, you must
compare the same model year engines. If the
2000, V-10 was not better than an older vintage
diesel something would be bad wrong. The Ford
engine in the late 90's had many problems and
was very noisy and smelly. But then most
diesels were.
In my opinion, the diesel has much better
performance and reliability than any gas engine
of comparable vintage. However the Cumins has
the most reliable performance history. Of
course, obviously I drive a Dodge Ram with the
Cumins. But I bought it only due to
availability, my knowledge of it's reliability
came from experience, with it.
I find that Ford is like riding a steel wheeled
wagon, take a cushion with you.
I really do not think the Duromax has built a
reputation yet, not that it wont, but it is a
relatively new kid on the block. Not to mention
the earlier GM feasko in providing a
counterfeit diesel, retooled gas block.
--
BILL P.
Just Me
and DOG
2004, 2500 SLT Quad Cab, Dodge Ram,
SWB, 2WD, Short Bed
5.9 HO Turbo Diesel, 48RE Auto Trans,
Anti-Spin 3.73 Dif.Rhino Liner,
Husky 16K,Slider. Voyager Controller
2005, 27RL Wildcat, DT/PC Wi-Fi.
Dual Battery Banks,one Gp.31 and
two 6volt AGM Trojan Batteries,with selector
for either bank or both at the same time.
1500watt Vector Inverter
Dual EU2000i Hondas
SnoMan
wrote:
>Fuck off, Snoman, you're an idiot.
You are the inmature child here as other can plainly see by you
comments. Does it give you a fix and make you feel powerfull to cuss
and name call in a news group??? When you do not understan sometihing
it must be wrong huh?
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
SnoMan
wrote:
>fuck off,
>Snoman. You're an idiot.
Twice in one thread!! What every helps you get you fix. You must be
VERY insecure. I actually feel sorry for you.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
Nate
John...a lot of advice has been given so far. You'll have to wade through
it all and make your own mind up. I'll give you my own opinion now that I
have tried to clear up some of the info posted.
I owned a 2003 PSD with a 7.3 liter in it. I loved that truck. It leaked
oil. I hated that. It was scheduled to be fixed. At 73,000 miles it ran
like it was brand new. I beat the hell out of that truck and could not
break it. My wife figured out how to break it. It is now totaled. I
replaced it with a 2006 6.0 liter PSD. The 6.0 has noticably less
power...but they make up for that by authorizing it to have higher RPMs (in
the PCM) and 5 usable gears in the transmission (the 7.3 was linked to a 4
speed). The torque bands have just been moved. It will move a big load. I
liked the power of the 7.3 more...but I am not unhappy with the power of the
6.0.
The 6.0 came out in the later part of the 2003 MY offerings. I purposely
looked for a 7.3 when I bought my first truck. I did not want to be part of
the testing of the new engine. I was very pleased.
The 6.0 had been out over three years when I bought mine. It still had some
problems. Mine had to be reporgrammed at less than 2000 miles because it
bucked and jerked when pulling a load. When I went down a grade and
started to climb back out...right in the valley...the truck just got bogged
down and could not get the right gear to climb out of that valley. You let
off the go pedal for just a second and it cleared itself and ran fine. The
new PCM program changed the shifting stratagy to eliminate this issue.
I now have 20,000 miles and my instrument cluster crapped out. This is a
known issue. Ford knows the supplier of the clusters put out a bad batch of
them...for like three years. They are replacing them as they go out. Mine
is on back order...to be delivered in the first quarter of 2007. The dealer
I use for repairs has 7 of them on back order...or at least they did two
weeks ago when I called the regional rep to discuss the saftey issue of
driving without a speedometer. The regional rep told me to call him if I
get a speeding ticket or in an accident related to me not knowing how fast I
am going...LOL Gotta love those guys...they are good at controlling
customer's tempers.
The only other issue I have had with my truck is the weak flimsy front
bumper. I tried crossing a small creek back in Novemebr but did not realize
the creek had washed out the road bed. The bumper hit the oposite side bank
of the creek and just folded. I was not traveling fast...it was a two rut
trail and it was dark so I was moving very slowly on this road I'd never
been on before. My license plate braket just fell off. I used a tanker bar
and straightened it out...but then hit a doe on the way back to camp and
re-bent it. I was going about 25 MPH when I hit her. I guess I would
expect the bumper to fold on that impact. But it should not have folded on
the creek. But that is a very minor issue in my humble opinion.
The 6.0 liter engine has a very noticable turbo lag. When you are at a stop
and you mash on the go pedal the PCM ignores the command from the go pedal
until it builds up aenough turbo pressure (boost) to handle the amount of
fuel being called for. This usually happens on my truck at 2,000 RPMs.
So...when you try to pull out into traffic from a stop you are going to have
some people behind you get pissed. It takes about 4 seconds for the truck
to slowly roll out there and get the RPMs up to 2,000...then hold onto your
belley cuz your head will be in the back seat...I mean it really goes! I
hate this about this truck. And there is nothing Ford or International is
going to do about it. They designed it to do this so that they could reduce
the amount of black smoke out of the tail pipe.
Chevy and Dodge both eliminated the black smoke without retarding the turbo.
Why can't Ford? The 6.4 that comes out this year (MY 2008 will be released
soon) eliminates the black smoke without a retarded turbo.
In my opinion...if you can afford paying just a little more...take a close
look at the Duramax. I wanted one real bad but the local dealers all
stocked these trucks with leather interior, DVD players in the back,
On-Star, useless security systems and other crap I did not need that is
designed to increase the profits for ther local dealers. I could not even
order the truck the way I wanted it configured...no matter how I ordered it
I got something I did not want that was very expensive. But now that I have
20,000 miles on my Ford I wish I had just paid for the stupid On-Star and
DVD player cuz no one tells you you have to turn them on.
Am I completely unhappy? No! I love my truck. Do I have my fair share of
problems? Yes. But all brands have some problems. The Chevy/Duramax has
less leg room in the back seat of a crew cab...but otherwise was a much
nicer truck and I would own one if I was not such a cheap bastard.
Theres more to this story...but I have to get back to work now. Hope some
of this helps in your decision. Don't expect to recoup the initial expense
in fuel savings. ...your wife will just throw that in your face after a few
months. If you want to pull a heavy load without worrying...get a diesel.
If you want to save money and don't care about driving slow on big
passes...get a gasser.
The difference between a f250 and an f350 is a spring pack in the rear axle.
There are some other minor differences...but that's the jist of it. An F250
will pull the same load a F350 will...but you can put more weight in the bed
of an F350. The price difference is negligable. Take a close look at the
350...you'll be happy if you do. I don't know the difference on the other
brands...but I expect they are the same deal.
Nate
Ron Recer
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 06:52:01 -0500, Dapper Dave wrote:
>
>>>"aaajn" <aa...@comcast.net> wrote:
>>
>>>I heard they get
>>>better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
>>>the ULSD fuel.
>>
>> All diesels will be using ULSD fuel by next week.
>>
>
> Not necessarily. There will be plenty of stations that haven't changed
> over yet, and haven't used up their stock of LSD yet. Besides, it will
> still be awhile before the engines requiring ULSD will become commonplace.
> The engines are only required in vehicles produced after Jan 1.
>
> --
> Frank Tabor
>
Just out of curosity I went to the Flying J web site to see how many of
their stations had each type of diesel. The site showed both LSD and ULSD
were available at 81 stations, ULSD only was available at 122 stations and
only 36 stations did not have ULSD. Only about 15% of Flying J stations
don't have ULSD. This may or may not be representative of all stations.
Seems like I heard or read somewhere that some types of off road vehicles
could continue to use LSD for years to come. Probably applies to heavy
equipment, farm tractors, etc.
Ron
Nate
"William Boyd" <willi...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:4595...@newsgate.x-privat.org...
The older Fords (2004 and earlier) were rough riding. The new coil over
suspension made them as smooth as a Dodge. But Chevy still has the best
ride with that IFS front end.
Who told you the Cummins is most reliable? Or are you specifically talking
about YOUR Cummins?
All the dealers told me that they were the only ones offering a true diesel
engine. At least two of them lied...me thinks they all lied. Even
so...what is specifically wrong with the 're-tooled' gas block? And what
proof do you have that it used a 're-tooled gas block'?
Nate
jwlbal
Educate yourself on the three brands of diesels. These three websites cover
the good and the bad in detail:
http://www.thedieselstop.com/
http://www.turbodieselregister.com/
http://www.thedieselpage.com/
Also, the forums at www.rv.net are invaluable.
Diesels cost more, deliver better fuel economy, and are MUCH better with a
load behind going uphill. Being from the east, I decided on my first trip
out west that I would have a diesel before I went west again!
Good Luck!
John
rvfulltime
Asking questions like this is likely to start a religious war.
My brother is a field rep for Blue Diamond Motors, the marketing company
jointly owned by Ford and International (Navistar). His job is to call on Ford
dealers to help them sell and service Powerstroke Diesel engines. Contrary
to some ill informed opinions found on this and other newsgroups, the 6.0L
engine has more hp and torque than the 7.3L engine that preceeded it. The
6.0L had some serious problems in the factory for the first 6 months of
manufacture. Since that time the engine has been rock solid.
I bought a 2005 F350 diesel two years ago and except for a fuel filter sensor
that was covered by warranty at 34,000 miles my engine and truck have
been perfect. I pull a 13,000 pound 5th wheel and have driven 40,000 miles
in the past 24 months, which 20,000 pulling the trailer. I average 10mpg
pulling the trailer and 18mpg not pulling it. I barely have to touch the brakes
going down mountain passes thanks to the towing mode of the transmission.
I all my travels from WA to CA to FL to MI and places in between diesel
sometimes costs 50 cents a gallon more than gasoline and sometimes it
costs less than gasoline.
Now if only it would wash itself.
--
Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
SnoMan
>Seems like I heard or read somewhere that some types of off road vehicles
>could continue to use LSD for years to come. Probably applies to heavy
>equipment, farm tractors, etc.
Only from stocks. By 2013 sulpher will basically be gone from all
diesel fuel (less than 2 PPM) in current time line.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
RCE
"Jud Hardcastle" <I5i5changeth...@xemaps.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1ffee8a62...@news.dallas.sbcglobal.net...
I think .. (I hope) ... that the problems in the 6.0L have been pretty much
worked out and eliminated.
It's actually starting to earn a decent reputation. I had some early issues
with the one in my '05
F-350 but they were addressed under warranty. Since then, I haven't had any
problems with it.
RCE
RCE
"Tom J" <tom...@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:i1blh.8351$X72....@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net...
Only problem with the V10 is the terrible gas mileage, even when not towing.
My son has one (same year as my diesel) and since he uses it daily, his only
complaint is the mileage.
BTW ... since the local fuel stations around here made the switch to
ultra-low sulfur content fuel (15 ppm) I have noticed that my truck is
completely "smell free". I used to get an occasional whiff of diesel
exhaust, particularly when the engine was cold at idle, but that has gone
away with the new fuel.
RCE
RCE
"Nate" <nsaptaem...@nsvpbaemll.net> wrote in message
news:ztclh.27638$hI.2...@newssvr11.news.prodigy.net...
>> I really do not think the Duromax has built a reputation yet, not that it
>> wont, but it is a relatively new kid on the block. Not to mention the
>> earlier GM feasko in providing a counterfeit diesel, retooled gas block.
>>
And what
> proof do you have that it used a 're-tooled gas block'?
>
> Nate
>
I think he is referring to many years ago when GM attempted to make a diesel
out of their 350 gas engine block. It *was* a disaster.
The Duromax engines are from Isuzo.
RCE
William Boyd
Could have told you to go back and read it, but
just as easy this way. " However the Cumins has
the most reliable performance history. Of
course, obviously I drive a Dodge Ram with the
Cumins. But I bought it only due to
availability, my knowledge of it's reliability
came from experience, with it."
>
> All the dealers told me that they were the only ones offering a true diesel
> engine. At least two of them lied...me thinks they all lied. Even
> so...what is specifically wrong with the 're-tooled' gas block? And what
> proof do you have that it used a 're-tooled gas block'?
>
> Nate
>
>
Lon VanOstran
> They are recommending it only because they got gun shy when the 6.0 was
> released. It turned out to be a lesser engine than it's predesecsor. Fact
> is...the 6.4 is an improved 6.0. They replaced the HPOP driven injectors
> with piezo electric injectors. They replaced the big turbo that has very
> noticable turbo lag with a dual, smaller turbo. One turbo spins up for take
> off from a stop and the other kicks in when needed. The smaller turbo
> spools up faster.
>
> Will there be problems with the 6.4? Posible. Will Ford stand behind it
> and fix the problems? They've been trying like hell to fix the issues with
> the 6.0. A new PCM calibration seems to come out monthly from
> International. YOu have to give credit when it is due...they are trying
> like hell.
>
> Nate
>
>
Sorry, trying isn't good enough when you are talking about a $50,000
truck. Buy a Duramax.
Lon
JerryD(upstateNY)
> Stay away from the '03 to '07 6.0 liter engine. There's been lots of rear
> seal problems and other issues. If possible, get an '07 with the newer
> engine, 6.9 L I believe. It uses the newer Ultra Low
> sulfur fuel. It's supposed to be a more reliable engine than the 6 L.<<<
I have a friend who is a Ford man and he has 7.3 PSD dually. (not sure of
the year)
He bought a new 5th wheeler and it weighs too much for the F450 they have
now.
He is going to buy a 2007 F550/650 with the 6.9 PSD.
I can't believe he will spend all that money on an unproven engine when he
could buy a Chevy that has a proven engine and a proven transmission.
I doubt he has even looked at Chevy's.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
JaySeeBee
to use the ULSD fuel as mentioned. I understand the 06's and earlier can
use low sulfur or ultralow sulfur fuels with no damage.
The reason we purchased our diesel was for engine longevity and fuel
economy. Pulling our 33 ft fiver we get between 9 1/2 and over 14 mpg.
The trailer is around 13.5k loaded. A gas engine PU normally won't come
near that for pulling. Solo we get over 22mpg taking it easy between 58
and 62mph. We use the same speed when towing.
But with all the new fangled emission controls, filters and breathing
stuff on the 07's will they perform as I mentioned or worse now?
Ours does not have to have emission tests in WI here cause we are
licensed as a Heavy Truck (3/4 ton up to 10k gvw) with a XC commercial
plate.
JCB
aaajn wrote:
> Hello Esteeed Smarter People than me,
>
> I need your opinions. Myu wife and I are thinking about buying a 25
> foot Airstream International. The question remains; What should I tow
> it with?
>
> I want (that is my word) a Ford F-250 SD Diesel. I heard they get
> better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
> the ULSD fuel. How does a Diesel compare to a gas model as far as
> emissions go? I am wondering if any of you would be willing to offer
> an opinion.
>
> thanks,
>
>
> John
>
Nate
"Lon VanOstran" <RV...@stopspamwmconnect.com> wrote in message
news:4vlgukF...@mid.individual.net...
Why would you pay $50,000 for a $30,000 truck?
Nate
Jud Hardcastle
69re...@yahoo.com says...
> The 07's
07 ENGINES that is--the 07 TRUCKS have the "old" 6.0L engine.
> are gonna be cleaner (than previous years) and they will have
> to use the ULSD fuel as mentioned. I understand the 06's and earlier can
> use low sulfur or ultralow sulfur fuels with no damage.
>
My 07 F350 crew SB with 2600 miles is getting 18mpg highway non-pulling,
13-14mpg mixed city and highway, and 8-9mpg pulling a 35' 5er. Is that
mixed mpg normal or a bit low? And no I don't have a heavy foot at stop
lights :-)
Lon VanOstran
> The older Fords (2004 and earlier) were rough riding. The new coil over
> suspension made them as smooth as a Dodge. But Chevy still has the best
> ride with that IFS front end.
You can say that again. Compared to my Duramax, the 05 Ford rides like
it has steel wheels and no springs. I kinda like forgetting that my
Chevy is a truck. <G>
Lon
William Boyd
Maybe They seen Lon comming and knew they could get a good up charge.
I have been observing the number of tow vehicles here in this park. I am
going to make a tour and count what is being used. Reason is, another
2500 Ram just pulled in with a triple axle 5er, this is not a toy hauler
either. To add to that the Ram is 4WD, I thought that reduced the tow
capacity.
--
Can't we all just get along?
BILL P.
Just
Me
&
DOG
Nate
"JaySeeBee" <af65_6...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:4595a3f8$0$17204$39ce...@news.twtelecom.net...
> The 07's are gonna be cleaner (than previous years) and they will have to
> use the ULSD fuel as mentioned. I understand the 06's and earlier can use
> low sulfur or ultralow sulfur fuels with no damage.
>
> The reason we purchased our diesel was for engine longevity and fuel
> economy. Pulling our 33 ft fiver we get between 9 1/2 and over 14 mpg. The
> trailer is around 13.5k loaded. A gas engine PU normally won't come near
> that for pulling. Solo we get over 22mpg taking it easy between 58 and
> 62mph. We use the same speed when towing.
>
> But with all the new fangled emission controls, filters and breathing
> stuff on the 07's will they perform as I mentioned or worse now?
>
> Ours does not have to have emission tests in WI here cause we are licensed
> as a Heavy Truck (3/4 ton up to 10k gvw) with a XC commercial plate.
>
> JCB
Be aware that many states are moving towars emissions testing on diesels
regardless of weight. The commercial registration may save you, but watch
for that protection to disapear soon too.
Nate
Frank Tabor
Maybe, but being an idiot is permanent.
--
Frank Tabor
Conformity is the refuge of the unimaginative.
Frank Tabor
You're still an idiot.
--
Frank Tabor
To be or not to be.
-- Shakespeare
To do is to be.
-- Nietzsche
To be is to do.
-- Sartre
Do be do be do.
-- Sinatra
Nate
>
> I have been observing the number of tow vehicles here in this park. I am
> going to make a tour and count what is being used. Reason is, another 2500
> Ram just pulled in with a triple axle 5er, this is not a toy hauler
> either. To add to that the Ram is 4WD, I thought that reduced the tow
> capacity.
>
> --
> Can't we all just get along?
>
> BILL P.
> Just
> Me
> &
> DOG
>
> --
> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
>
That's a good point I wish I had thought of when I bought my truck. I got a
4x4 because I was planning to trade in my old 4x4 but they did not want it.
They actually gave me an extra 500 incentive to keep my old truck. You
shouild see it...you'd think they would have offered more. Anyrate...once I
knew I was keeping my old 4x4 I no longer had a need for the front axle and
transfer case. I could have got a bigger 5er! Durn it all to hell.
Nate
Nate
Is this a 4x4? If so you have basically the same truck I have only newer.
My milage used to be close to yours till I got the latest flash on my PCM.
I now get 12.78 mixed city/highway empty. I used to get 20 on the highway
if I kept it under 65 MPH. 18 if I go over. But I have not been on the
highway since the reflash. I also used to get 8.3 pulling my fiver...and
again...have not pulled since the reflash.
The numbers seem disappointing...but they seem normasl to me.
Wait till you see Lon's numbers when he posts about his Duramax.
Nate
Tom J
>
> My 07 F350 crew SB with 2600 miles is getting 18mpg highway
> non-pulling, 13-14mpg mixed city and highway, and 8-9mpg pulling a
> 35' 5er. Is that mixed mpg normal or a bit low?
Real close the actual mileage to be expected from that truck. The
difference is you are telling what your mileage actually is and not
what you would like it to be!!
Tom J
David Moffitt
I'll stick with my 97 Ford F250HD extended cab 4X4 with 289,000 miles. I get
20 open highway non pulling and 14 pulling my 28' 5er.
>
>
Frank Tabor
I've always felt like the biggest difference in the ride and handling of a
Chevy and a Ford could be best described as follows;
A Chevy feels like you are riding IN it. A Ford feels as if you are
riding ON it.
--
Frank Tabor
volcano, n.:
A mountain with hiccups.
e8...@hotmail.com
Hunter wrote:
>
> You are welcome to join my Airstream elist....
>
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/AirstreamList/
>
> Hunter
Another group that makes you sign up to lurk. I can see having to sign
up to post.
Must be a lot of embarrassing stuff that Airstream owners don't want
you to read.
Get a clue Hunter. Open the group to lurkers.
Hunter
>Another group that makes you sign up to lurk. I can see having to sign
>up to post.
>
>Must be a lot of embarrassing stuff that Airstream owners don't want
>you to read.
>
>Get a clue Hunter. Open the group to lurkers.
Get a clue yourself. If I wanted it open I would have left it open.
Hunter
Frank Tabor
I had one exactly like that. Traded it on my wife's Subaru Forrester and
then bought a F350 Dually. While I really like the auto transmission, I
really miss the 5 speed and the fuel mileage it got.
--
Frank Tabor
<markm> c++: the power, elegance and simplicity of a hand grenade
Lon VanOstran
>>
>>Sorry, trying isn't good enough when you are talking about a $50,000
>>truck. Buy a Duramax.
>>
>>Lon
>
>
> Why would you pay $50,000 for a $30,000 truck?
>
> Nate
>
>
I wouldn't, but it seems that Ford owners would. <G>
Lon
Mark Jones
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 15:50:44 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>
>> How very untrue.
>
>
> fuck off,
> Snoman. You're an idiot.
SnoMan is a good person to not listen to.
Frank Tabor
All I see there is a shill for his so called web forum where he probably
collects advertising fees for sucking visitors in.
--
Frank Tabor
Driver does not carry cash.
Lon VanOstran
>> Why would you pay $50,000 for a $30,000 truck?
>>
>> Nate
>>
>>
>>
> Maybe They seen Lon comming and knew they could get a good up charge.
Actually, sticker on my 05 SRW extended cab long box 4X4 Duramax was
over $46,000, but I bought it new/ordered for $34,000, including tax,
title and plate. Go to the dually crew cab, and it would have been over
$50,000 sticker.
Price out a comparable Ford or Dodge, and the pricing is similar. If yer
happy without any options, that's fine with me, but no reason to
ridicule those who aren't.
My point was that Ford should be ashamed of using truck owners as test
drivers, and the street as a test track. It was a valid point in spite
of the fact that some wish to obfuscate and ridicule instead of
addressing the point. The Ford 6.0 shouldn't have been released until it
was ready for market. GM has made their share of bonehead blunders. This
time it was Ford.
Maybe Nate's smart ass response indicates that he thinks it's ok to use
people as test drivers if they only buy a stripped down version of the
Ford Power Smoke, instead of the more expensive versions.
Lon, who is growing weary of the Boydbrainlessness epidemic.
Lon VanOstran
>
>
> That's a good point I wish I had thought of when I bought my truck. I got a
> 4x4 because I was planning to trade in my old 4x4 but they did not want it.
> They actually gave me an extra 500 incentive to keep my old truck. You
> shouild see it...you'd think they would have offered more. Anyrate...once I
> knew I was keeping my old 4x4 I no longer had a need for the front axle and
> transfer case. I could have got a bigger 5er! Durn it all to hell.
>
> Nate
>
This past spring, I used my 4 X 4 Duramax to tow a friend's F-550 and
39' fifth wheel off of wet grass. I doubt that either he or I will be
without 4 X 4 on our next trucks.
Lon
bill horne
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>
>
>
> You're still an idiot.
Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
Have you changed something recently?
--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
aaajn
names, Chevy, Ford and Dodge and I found out I really liked Chevy. The
Ford is nice but the Chevy was nice too. Here is where I am at: The New
Chevy 1500 has a Vortec Max engine and is rated to tow 10000 pounds. We
plan on an Airstream 25 footer, which should be at least 2K under.
Any more thoughts? I had to make a decision right now, I would go with
the Gas Chevy, I liked the way it rode and the web site, dealer, etc...
all say there is more than enough power to tow.
But then again, that Diesel was nice. The thing about the Diesel that
holds me back is who knows what the future will bring. Will I save
money going gas? Better for the environment?
John
William Boyd
That is a definite, weight of the engine makes it like the rear wheels
have to push and when there are no weight in the rear you just aint
going any where. I suppose the F-550 was actually stuck and not a front
end over weight thing, different from what I am talking about. Rest
assured I dont get down to the beach like I did with my gas job. Yes my
next one will be a 4X4, so far another Ram.
William Boyd
So you want to start that shit for the new year. Maybe you should
consider what you have posted about your truck, because $34,000 is not
necessarily a bang up price either. But I picked up on a small bit of
added information you dropped, SRW. Making that comment, your truck
could be a 3500 and could be worth that price.
My Name Is Nobody
"Frank Tabor" <fta...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:12pa8ja...@corp.supernews.com...
> On Thu, 28 Dec 2006 23:30:30 -0800, aaajn wrote:
>
>> Hello Esteeed Smarter People than me,
>>
>> I need your opinions. Myu wife and I are thinking about buying a 25
>> foot Airstream International. The question remains; What should I tow
>> it with?
>>
>> I want (that is my word) a Ford F-250 SD Diesel. I heard they get
>> better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
>> the ULSD fuel. How does a Diesel compare to a gas model as far as
>> emissions go? I am wondering if any of you would be willing to offer
>> an opinion.
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>>
>> John
>
> than gas. I get way better mileage towing than the V10 gas motor does.
>
> Stay away from the '03 to '07 6.0 liter engine. There's been lots of rear
> seal problems and other issues. If possible, get an '07 with the newer
> engine, 6.9 L I believe. It uses the newer Ultra Low sulfur fuel. It's
> supposed to be a more reliable engine than the 6 L.
>
> --
> Frank Tabor
> mixed emotions:
> Watching your mother-in-law back off a cliff...
> in your brand new Mercedes.
Spewing misinformation:
The Ford 6 liter rear seal problems were identified, corrected and long gone
by early 2004.
The 6.0 liter beats the crap out of the 7.3 for mileage, emissions and
especially power. That is simple fact.
Just had occasion to put that to the test yesterday, an acquaintance with a
01 F-350 7.3 couldn't believe how much quicker my 05 6.0 was... He was all
google-eyed and full of questions, could hardly get him away from my truck
when we got to our destination.
22 months 35,000 smile filled, absolute trouble free 6.0 Powerstroke miles
and counting...
My Name Is Nobody
"JerryD(upstateNY)" <jer...@wherever.com> wrote in message
news:459596ad$0$5262$4c36...@roadrunner.com...
> Frank Tabor wrote:
>> Stay away from the '03 to '07 6.0 liter engine. There's been lots of
>> rear seal problems and other issues. If possible, get an '07 with the
>> newer engine, 6.9 L I believe. It uses the newer Ultra Low
>> sulfur fuel. It's supposed to be a more reliable engine than the 6 L.<<<
>
> the year)
> He bought a new 5th wheeler and it weighs too much for the F450 they have
> now.
> He is going to buy a 2007 F550/650 with the 6.9 PSD.
> I can't believe he will spend all that money on an unproven engine when he
> could buy a Chevy that has a proven engine and a proven transmission.
> I doubt he has even looked at Chevy's.
> --
> JerryD(upstateNY)
>
To get the tow and weight carry capacity of the Ford F-550 (exact same size
hood and cab as the F-350) in a Chevy you have to subject yourself to their
ridiculously styled Kodiak T-series. Chevy detunes the Duramax in this line
of trucks, Ford does not detune their Class 4 MDT diesel engine, it makes
the same power as their pickups.
If he goes with a F-650/750 then a whole different line of engines is
available.
Power Stroke up to 620 torque
Caterpillar up to 860 torque
Cummins up to 660 torque
My Name Is Nobody
"aaajn" <aa...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:1167453988.9...@i12g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> Well here is what I found out today. Everybody said look at all the big
> names, Chevy, Ford and Dodge and I found out I really liked Chevy. The
> Ford is nice but the Chevy was nice too. Here is where I am at: The New
> Chevy 1500 has a Vortec Max engine and is rated to tow 10000 pounds. We
> plan on an Airstream 25 footer, which should be at least 2K under.
>
> Any more thoughts? I had to make a decision right now, I would go with
> the Gas Chevy, I liked the way it rode and the web site, dealer, etc...
> all say there is more than enough power to tow.
>
> But then again, that Diesel was nice. The thing about the Diesel that
> holds me back is who knows what the future will bring. Will I save
> money going gas? Better for the environment?
>
> John
What possibly could the future bring that would change the advantages of the
diesel?
There will not be emission tests implemented that the engine could not meet.
Diesels are the future (look at Europe) you will see more and more of them
on the road. If GM or Ford were selling a decent diesel car today, (just
wait, they will) I would own it.
You may save money buying gas, but is saving money the main objective here,
or getting the right truck for the job?
RCE
"Jud Hardcastle" <I5i5changeth...@xemaps.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1fff69487...@news.dallas.sbcglobal.net...
>
> 13-14mpg mixed city and highway, and 8-9mpg pulling a 35' 5er. Is that
> lights :-)
> --
> Jud
> Dallas TX USA
Sounds a bit low, but will probably improve as you get more miles on it.
Mileage is also affected by:
1. Seasonal fuel blends. Winter blends will yield slightly lower mileage
(usually starts in October)
2. Ultra low sulfur versus low sulfur. Ultra low yields slightly lower
mileage.
3. Speed.
My '05 F350 PS, crew cab, 4x4, SRW currently is getting about 18-19 mpg
highway and 15-16 mpg mixed. This is with winter ultra low sulfur fuel and
highway speeds of 70 mph or less.
The last time I towed heavy ... a 37' Raptor Toybox ... it got between 10-11
mpg at speeds of 60-65 mph. That was summer blend, low sulfur (500 ppm)
fuel.
RCE
JerryD(upstateNY)
out I really liked Chevy. The Ford is nice but the Chevy was nice too. Here
is where I am at: The New Chevy 1500 has a Vortec Max engine and is rated to
tow 10000 pounds.<<<
It doesn't make any difference which brand you pick, a 150/1500 series truck
is not a good tow vehicle.
Get a 250/2500 series truck, no matter which brand you buy.
(I should say don't buy a ˝ ton, buy a ž ton) <g>
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
William Boyd
I agree, controllability of the towed load is much less with a 1500
series truck. You will severely limit your range of trailers that you
can tow, along with the increased inability to stop or control the tow.
This part of the subject is much greater than what brand name you put on
the vehicle of weather or not you choose four wheel drive or even dual
wheels for a 3500 series.
I had a 94, 1500, GMC for several years and towed a TT all over the
southern states. I also had an old one ton, (that is what they called
them back when it was built, 1978) I learned real quick that if I was
headed for Tennessee of any where that had other than flat straight and
level roadways, the bigger truck was much safer.
I have been observing the many tow vehicles down here in the Lower Rio
Grand Valley, and there are thousands of them at this time of the year.
Hardly ever see a 1500 series, other than a few as a toad behind some
40' diesel pusher or towing a pop-up camper.
People no longer make that big of a mistake after gaining some
experience with RVing. Now if a TT in the range of 17' and 3,000# is
your choice of camper, then a 1500 series would be correct.
Ron Recer
"My Name Is Nobody" <nob...@msn.com> wrote in message
news:D2nlh.148$Am5.118@trndny03...
Duramax HO in the 2500 and 3500 has 650 foot pounds of torque!
Ron
Ron Recer
"Nate" <nsaptaem...@nsvpbaemll.net> wrote in message
news:ZAilh.1159$ji1...@newssvr12.news.prodigy.net...
(including some 4 wheel drive miles) last summer in MT. Many of those miles
were in Yellowstone NP where the speed limit runs from 35-45 and my Duramax
doesn't shift to 5th until 45 and never got to 6th in the park.
After 4,855 miles towing our 35' 5er I have averaged 8.7 mpg and ranged from
7.0 to 11.5 mpg depending on wind and elevation change.
Ron
'06 Chevy 3500 Crew Cab Long Bed Dually 4x4 Duramax HO Allison 6 speed
Lon VanOstran
You might want to read my post again.
Lon
Lon VanOstran
Jerry, it DOES make a different which truck he is talking about. The
Chevy 1500HD isn't even slightly comparable to the 1500, or the F-150.
This understandable confusion is why the terms 1/2 ton, 3/4 ton, and 1
ton, are meaningless today. There is a HUGE difference between the Chevy
1500, and the 1500HD.
Lon
Ron Recer
"Lon VanOstran" <RV...@stopspamwmconnect.com> wrote in message
news:4vm4gfF...@mid.individual.net...
> William Boyd wrote:
>
>
>>> Why would you pay $50,000 for a $30,000 truck?
>>>
>>> Nate
>>>
>>>
>> Maybe They seen Lon comming and knew they could get a good up charge.
>
> Actually, sticker on my 05 SRW extended cab long box 4X4 Duramax was over
> $46,000, but I bought it new/ordered for $34,000, including tax, title and
> plate. Go to the dually crew cab, and it would have been over $50,000
> sticker.
> Price out a comparable Ford or Dodge, and the pricing is similar. If yer
> happy without any options, that's fine with me, but no reason to ridicule
> those who aren't.
I drive my Duramax 25,000 miles a year and want all the comforts. On those
cold mornings I really appreciate the heated seats and wouldn't be without
satellite radio. The split a/c heater controls does away with a lot of
'discussion' between me and my wife over how cool or warm is should be.
Unless you are getting a 'work truck' adding all the 'bells and whistles'
doesn't add a great deal (percentage wise) to the cost of the truck and all
those goodies go a long ways in increasing your enjoyment when using it!
Ron
Hunter
>But then again, that Diesel was nice. The thing about the Diesel that
>holds me back is who knows what the future will bring. Will I save
>money going gas?
Gas is cheaper than diesel. I suggest you get a 3/4 ton truck. They
are built stronger for towing, no matter what the 1/2 ton is rated.
Hunter
William Boyd
The OP has not mentioned the 1500HD, just a 1500.
SnoMan
wrote:
>On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>
>
>
>You're still an idiot.
Knock yourself out. Some kids never grow up.
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
SnoMan
wrote:
>Maybe, but being an idiot is permanent.
You are free to act like a child Frank but just because you say
something it does not "make it so"
-----------------
TheSnoMan.com
JerryD(upstateNY)
I understand this but if the poster thinks he can tow 10,000 pounds with a
Chevy 1500, he isn't going to realize a 1500HD is better than a 1500.
He probably doesn't know anything about towing so he believes anything the
salesman says.
If the dealer doesn't have a 1500HD on the lot the salesman will tell the
guy that there isn't much difference between the two.
With those facts in mind, I would recomend he get a 250/2500 series truck.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
William Boyd
I initially set out to upgrade from my 1500 1994 GMC to a Duromax, 2500
or a SRW 3500.
Was unable to find any thing due to the production of the Duromax being
installed in the combat Hummers.
Even tried the Ford PS, but they were having problems with lower end
cracks, thought I would ride better in something else any way. Finely
drove the Ram, made a U turn in the middle of the street, found with
that short turning radius, I had to do some serious consideration.
Researched the Cummins engine as well as the 48re auto trans, looked
good enough to give a try. That is how I wound up with a Dodge, only
mistake was not getting the 4WD. But then I do not know how short a
turning radius that front end can provide, I'll be checking it out. Also
the SRW 3500 could be worth looking in to.
William Boyd
I would agree with that except the part "250" implies a Ford! ;-)
cougar
interesting reading,I'd like to know if anybody ( Consumer Reports,Road
and Track,etc) has some real data regarding real-world pulling
ability,repair frequency/severity,milage etc.for the "3/4" class.
I vaguely recall a study done comparing the P.S 6.0 very favorably
with the Dodge and Chevy shortly after it's coming on line (and I went
to test drive the P.S. and it barely made it back to the dealership,as
though it had a lawnmower engine).But is there any more recent study?
-Thanks
William Boyd
Where is the HD?
*1500 models with Vortec 4.3L V6
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/4300_en.jsp>*^1
2WD 4-speed automatic 17/21
4x4 4-speed automatic 16/19
*1500 models with Vortec 4.8L V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/4800_en.jsp>*
2WD 4-speed automatic 16/20
4x4 4-speed automatic 15/19
*1500 models with Vortec 5.3L iron-block V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/5300_iron_en.jsp>*
2WD 4-speed automatic 16/22
4x4 4-speed automatic 16/20
*1500 models with Vortec 5.3L aluminum-block V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/5300_aluminum_en.jsp>*
4x4 4-speed automatic 16/20
*1500 models with FlexFuel Vortec 5.3L iron-block V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/5300Flex_iron_en.jsp>*
2WD 4-speed automatic 16/21
4x4 4-speed automatic 16/20
*1500 models with FlexFuel Vortec 5.3L aluminum-block V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/5300Flex_aluminum_en.jsp>*
4x4 4-speed automatic 16/20
*1500 models with Vortec MAX 6.0L V8
<http://www.chevrolet.com/pop/silverado/2007/vortec_max_en.jsp>*
2WD 4-speed automatic 15/19
4x4 4-speed automatic 15/19
Dusty
news:MPG.1fff69487...@news.dallas.sbcglobal.net...
> My 07 F350 crew SB with 2600 miles is getting 18mpg highway non-pulling,
> 13-14mpg mixed city and highway, and 8-9mpg pulling a 35' 5er. Is that
> mixed mpg normal or a bit low? And no I don't have a heavy foot at stop
> lights :-)
21.9 with careful driving and keeping it below 70 or so.
We just did a weekend trip to Yuma, from Everett, and return. And got an
overall 18.1. That includes several hundred miles around town in Yuma, San
Jose, Quartzsite, Mojave, Boron, desert backroads, and others; and the rest
on the cruise control at just a touch over the SL (never under...(:-o)!).
We were (relatively) lightly loaded and weren't towing anything. Just
runnin' the AC and enjoying life as it drifted by. And I'm well satisfied
with that mileage in such a big, heavy truck. We'll be going down again
next week. So we'll have a good comparison doing this while towing...
L8r all,
Dusty
aaajn
John
JerryD(upstateNY)
A salesman will tell you anything to get a sale.
At least you posted here BEFORE you bought a truck.
Just knowing that a 1500 Chevy is not enough truck to tow 10,000 pounds will
save you both money and grief........and maybe your life.
I have never seen anyone here complain they bought too much truck to haul
their trailer/5th wheeler.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
bruce
Well, we have yet to hear from someone who bought a MDT to haul a Scamp.
<g>
Bruce
Yukon
Interesting. I drive 2005 F350 supercab, 1 ton and get as much as 12.1
while towing our 37' Montana across Texas and Oklahoma. I average
11.6. On the other hand, I don't get as much per gallon without the
trailer as you do, just 17 mpg. I am really happy with our Ford.
Drove thru the mountains of Alaska and Canada and it pulled my fiver
like a faithful mule. :-) When I boutht it, I thought I am buying too
much of a pickup. That was before we made the decision to do fulltime
RVing. Before I owned 1500 Chevy which I rolled and totalled a few
years ago after I hit an ice patch. Yukon
Frank Tabor
Is that the voice of experience speaking?
--
Frank Tabor
Shipping not included.
Frank Tabor
You're still an idiot.
--
Frank Tabor
Marriage, in life, is like a duel in the midst of a battle.
-- Edmond About
Frank Tabor
> Frank Tabor wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> You're still an idiot.
>
> Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
> Have you changed something recently?
>
Nope, not that I know of. Plain ol, monospace 10 point font.
--
Frank Tabor
Absence makes the heart grow frantic.
Frank Tabor
> Nate wrote:
>
>
>>
>>
>> That's a good point I wish I had thought of when I bought my truck. I got a
>> 4x4 because I was planning to trade in my old 4x4 but they did not want it.
>> They actually gave me an extra 500 incentive to keep my old truck. You
>> shouild see it...you'd think they would have offered more. Anyrate...once I
>> knew I was keeping my old 4x4 I no longer had a need for the front axle and
>> transfer case. I could have got a bigger 5er! Durn it all to hell.
>>
>> Nate
>>
>
> This past spring, I used my 4 X 4 Duramax to tow a friend's F-550 and
> 39' fifth wheel off of wet grass. I doubt that either he or I will be
> without 4 X 4 on our next trucks.
>
> Lon
My '97 had those damn automatic hubs on it, and I had to get my BIL with
his Escalade to drag me off level wet grass with the RV on the back when
one of the hubs stripped out.
I went and ordered the Warn manual hubs that day. Never again.
--
Frank Tabor
The moon is made of green cheese.
-- John Heywood
bill horne
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:45:40 -0500, bill horne wrote:
>
>> Frank Tabor wrote:
>>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You're still an idiot.
>> Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
>> Have you changed something recently?
>>
>
> Nope, not that I know of. Plain ol, monospace 10 point font.
Your headers say:
Content-Type: ext/plain; charset=UTF-8
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
The ones that don't mess with my fonts say:
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
Neon John
are so why don't you just stick a sock in it?
John
On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 21:19:41 -0000, Frank Tabor <fta...@gmail.com>
wrote:
>On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 14:47:00 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>
>> On Sat, 30 Dec 2006 00:24:27 -0000, Frank Tabor <fta...@gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>You're still an idiot.
>>
>>
>> Knock yourself out. Some kids never grow up.
>> -----------------
>> TheSnoMan.com
>
>Is that the voice of experience speaking?
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.neon-john.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
Don't let your schooling interfere with your education-Mark Twain
Eregon
@mid.individual.net:
> Well, we have yet to hear from someone who bought a MDT to haul a Scamp.
> <g>
Properly mounted (preferably on a LWB model), a Scamp would make a wonderful
Sleeper on an MDT/HDT!
jhh
> Well here is what I found out today. Everybody said look at all the big
> names, Chevy, Ford and Dodge and I found out I really liked Chevy. The
> Ford is nice but the Chevy was nice too. Here is where I am at: The New
> plan on an Airstream 25 footer, which should be at least 2K under.
>
> Any more thoughts? I had to make a decision right now, I would go with
> the Gas Chevy, I liked the way it rode and the web site, dealer, etc...
> all say there is more than enough power to tow.
>
> But then again, that Diesel was nice. The thing about the Diesel that
> holds me back is who knows what the future will bring. Will I save
>
> John
>
> aaajn wrote:
>> Hello Esteeed Smarter People than me,
>>
>> I need your opinions. Myu wife and I are thinking about buying a 25
>> foot Airstream International. The question remains; What should I tow
>> it with?
>>
>> I want (that is my word) a Ford F-250 SD Diesel. I heard they get
>> better mpg than gas, they have more power and the 07's and later use
>> the ULSD fuel. How does a Diesel compare to a gas model as far as
>> emissions go? I am wondering if any of you would be willing to offer
>> an opinion.
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>>
>> John
>
I've just put 50K miles on a 2003 Duramax 3500 crew cab dually in the
last 8 months, since I started using for my hot-shot freight business.
It handles a 40' flat-bed with no problem and when I put the 37' fifth
wheel behind it I almost forget it's there. I bought this truck after
15 years of Ford diesels - the Chevy stands head and shoulders above the
Ford for ergonomics and power. You don't need a 3500 but I seriously
advise you to go bigger than the 1500 if you're going to tow anything.
An old friend of mine once said that a half-ton pickup (1500; F150) was
good to go get a loaf of bread, but if you wanted to pull anything, get
a truck. The 2500 diesel will you a great job with that Airstream.
John
Frank Tabor
> Frank Tabor wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:45:40 -0500, bill horne wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Tabor wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're still an idiot.
>>> Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
>>> Have you changed something recently?
>>>
>>
>> Nope, not that I know of. Plain ol, monospace 10 point font.
>
> Your headers say:
> Content-Type: ext/plain; charset=UTF-8
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
> The ones that don't mess with my fonts say:
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
This is Western ISO 8859-1
--
Frank Tabor
Friction is a drag.
Frank Tabor
> Frank Tabor wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:45:40 -0500, bill horne wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Tabor wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're still an idiot.
>>> Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
>>> Have you changed something recently?
>>>
>>
>> Nope, not that I know of. Plain ol, monospace 10 point font.
>
> Your headers say:
> Content-Type: ext/plain; charset=UTF-8
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
> The ones that don't mess with my fonts say:
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
This is Western New ISO 8859-15
--
Frank Tabor
War isn't a good life, but it's life.
-- Kirk, "A Private Little War", stardate 4211.8
Frank Tabor
> Frank Tabor wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 22:45:40 -0500, bill horne wrote:
>>
>>> Frank Tabor wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2006 17:11:10 +0000, SnoMan wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> You're still an idiot.
>>> Either your charset or your encoding is overriding my chosen fonts.
>>> Have you changed something recently?
>>>
>>
>> Nope, not that I know of. Plain ol, monospace 10 point font.
>
> Your headers say:
> Content-Type: ext/plain; charset=UTF-8
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit
>
> The ones that don't mess with my fonts say:
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
>
>
This is Western Windows 1252. This is the only choices I got.
--
Frank Tabor
Worth seeing? Yes, but not worth going to see.
bill horne
Neither that one nor the other two messed with my fonts.
Dave
Nate
"Lon VanOstran" <RV...@stopspamwmconnect.com> wrote in message
news:4vm4gfF...@mid.individual.net...
> William Boyd wrote:
>
>
>>> Why would you pay $50,000 for a $30,000 truck?
>>>
>>> Nate
>>>
>>>
>> Maybe They seen Lon comming and knew they could get a good up charge.
>
> Actually, sticker on my 05 SRW extended cab long box 4X4 Duramax was over
> $46,000, but I bought it new/ordered for $34,000, including tax, title and
> plate. Go to the dually crew cab, and it would have been over $50,000
> sticker.
> Price out a comparable Ford or Dodge, and the pricing is similar. If yer
> happy without any options, that's fine with me, but no reason to ridicule
> those who aren't.
>
> My point was that Ford should be ashamed of using truck owners as test
> drivers, and the street as a test track. It was a valid point in spite of
> the fact that some wish to obfuscate and ridicule instead of addressing
> the point. The Ford 6.0 shouldn't have been released until it was ready
> for market. GM has made their share of bonehead blunders. This time it was
> Ford.
>
> Maybe Nate's smart ass response indicates that he thinks it's ok to use
> people as test drivers if they only buy a stripped down version of the
> Ford Power Smoke, instead of the more expensive versions.
>
> Lon, who is growing weary of the Boydbrainlessness epidemic.
>
A...it was not a smart ass response...it was a legitimate question.
B...you proved my point...it's a 34,000 dollar truck. You would not have
been able to order it for such a price if it was not the correct profitable
price...no matter who worked for GM.
Sticker on my truck was about 12,000 over what the dealer wanted to sell it
to me for. That does not make it a $46,000 truck. It's a sales gimic and
some folks do fall for it. Not the smart ones. And here I was thinking you
were one of the smart ones.
I agree that the 6.0 should not have been released to the public when it
was. But that has nothing to do with the price of the truck. If the truck
only sold for $1,000 it was still a big mistake for Ford to release it
before it was properly tested and determined to be a worthwhile engine.
BTW...mine is pulling just fine.
Nate
bruce
"Nate" <nsaptaem...@nsvpbaemll.net> wrote
>
> B...you proved my point...it's a 34,000 dollar truck. You would not have
> been able to order it for such a price if it was not the correct
> profitable price...no matter who worked for GM.
You know, I read a marketing study one time that said if most people are
given a choice between two trucks (actually the same truck - and more
importantly any two vehicles) one with a sticker price of $46k and discounts
and rebates bringing the total cost down to $34k and the second with both a
sticker price and final sale price of $34k, they will pick the one with the
higher sticker price. Makes them feel good like they are good businessmen
to get that good a deal. (And as an added bonus to the dealer, some people
are stupid enough to actually pay list.)
Bruce
Nate
"bruce" <bruce...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:4vvh0vF...@mid.individual.net...
Lots of people are dumb enough to pay list. I have an acquantance (notice I
refuse to call him a friend) who is a salesman at a local dealership who
tells me most of his customers (more than half) pay sticker.
Nate
William Boyd
the right time. There are buyer incentives and
there are also dealer incentives. Dealers that
has a higher sales rate are given a higher
incentive. In amongst it all are the salesman
incentives. Vehicles are delivered to dealers
on consignment with a small percentage of the
cost of the vehicle charged to the dealer each
month.
So you can see here where you can work your way
in to a deal. Some of this information is
available to you on the internet. But it would
be advisable to select a large dealer that
sells a lot of vehicles in the name brand of
your choice. At the slow down sales period, for
what ever reason, would be a good time to deal.
I bought my Ram for 60% of sticker price as
well as 66% for my RV.
--
BILL P.
Just Me
and DOG
2004, 2500 SLT Quad Cab, Dodge Ram,
SWB, 2WD, Short Bed
5.9 HO Turbo Diesel, 48RE Auto Trans,
Anti-Spin 3.73 Dif.Rhino Liner,
Husky 16K,Slider. Voyager Controller
2005, 27RL Wildcat, DT/PC Wi-Fi.
Dual Battery Banks,one Gp.31 and
two 6volt AGM Trojan Batteries,with selector
for either bank or both at the same time.
1500watt Vector Inverter
Dual EU2000i Hondas
James
> The 350 Vortec and a 1500 is not the best combo for towing. I tow a
> 27.5 foot fiver and only get 8 mpg. I now have a Dodge 2002 Cummins
> 24 valve turbo and get 15 mpg
Sounds like us. We went from a '81 454 K30 Chevy (6 mpg anytime) to an
'02 F250 Powerstroke (14 mpg around town).Haven't towed with it yet.
This summer. Jim
--