OT-Blame The Teachers Union-Supported by Democrats....
Lone Haranguer
Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
week that revealed most of the state’s high school students wouldn’t
pass the test to become American citizens.
The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
the 10 questions.
The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
The Institute lamented the “troubling” results, stating the students
displayed a “profound level of ignorance about American history,
government and geography.”
***************
I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
just as ignorant.
But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers know
what the latest fashion is.
LZ
Chuck Norris
EJ Montini, in today's AZ Republic (7-5-09) just couldn't blame the
system he supports (socialism). He had to blame the students and
everyone else when the real fault lies with those in charge. We no
longer allow competition, grading, saying not only NO but HELL NO! The
teachers union has managed to funnel the majority of school funding to
administrators. When a school district allows a text to state that
the US attacked the Japanese in Hawaii to start WWII, you know you
have a problem.
Chuck
--
Liberals. You can't talk to them and bullets are just so damned expensive!
Chuck Norris
nothermark
Don't know about AZ but in NY the teachers unions are constantly
comlaining about overpaid administration as a foil for their
irrationally high salaries. It is clear that the public unions own
many state legislations. I often wonder f anybody has done a red/blue
correlation to the power of the public unions.
Mike Hendrix
<linu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Dumb Americans revealed
>
>Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
>
>The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
>week that revealed most of the state�s high school students wouldn�t
>pass the test to become American citizens.
>
>The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
>questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
>
>In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
>the 10 questions.
>
>The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
>six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
>
>The Institute lamented the �troubling� results, stating the students
>displayed a �profound level of ignorance about American history,
>government and geography.�
>***************
>I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
>just as ignorant.
Totally agree.
>But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers know
>what the latest fashion is.
Totally agree again.
However, I do not know how to turn things around.
mike
--
bill horne
> On Sun, 05 Jul 2009 10:41:04 -0500, Lone Haranguer
> <linu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dumb Americans revealed
>>
>> Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
>>
>> The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
>> pass the test to become American citizens.
>>
>> The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
>> questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
>>
>> In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
>> the 10 questions.
>>
>> The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
>> six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
>>
>> displayed a �profound level of ignorance about American history,
>> government and geography.�
>> ***************
>> I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
>> just as ignorant.
>
> Totally agree.
>
>> But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers know
>> what the latest fashion is.
>
> Totally agree again.
>
> However, I do not know how to turn things around.
>
> mike
Ban sports and all clothes except muumuus?
--
bill
Theory don't mean squat if it don't work.
Jared
> Dumb Americans revealed <REST OF PIGGIE SQUEAL> snipped.
You got that right. Just look at the dumb Americans who responded and
agreed to yet another of your pitiful whiny-assed horseshit posts. If
you had even half a brain someone besides these fellow sucking
sycophantic Repukes clusterfuck groin-rubbing buddies of yours might
even respond. But keep it up, there's nothing more gratifying to the
ears of an intelligent person (insert LIBERAL here) than the
whhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnneeeeeee of a hurting and
kicked-in-the-head suckass loser from the Repugnant Party.
HAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAW
Janet Wilder
> On Sun, 05 Jul 2009 10:41:04 -0500, Lone Haranguer
> <linu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Dumb Americans revealed
>>
>> Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
>>
>> The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
>> pass the test to become American citizens.
>>
>> The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
>> questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
>>
>> In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
>> the 10 questions.
>>
>> The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
>> six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
>>
>> displayed a �profound level of ignorance about American history,
>> government and geography.�
>> ***************
>> I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
>> just as ignorant.
>
> Totally agree.
>
>> But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers know
>> what the latest fashion is.
>
> Totally agree again.
>
> However, I do not know how to turn things around.
>
Too many of today's parents think it's the school's responsibility to
care for their children. They abdicate their responsibilities to the
schools. Things like religion, sex education, moral guidance should come
from the home, not from a public school 10 minutes of silent prayer or a
text book.
The pay for teachers, union or no union, is lower than comparably
educated people in the private sector, so you are either going to get
extremely dedicated teachers who want to make a difference in the lives
of our children, or the dopes who manage to get a college degree but
can't do anything else with it but teach. Unfortunately, most of our
teachers are the latter.
As long as today's parents don't take an active part in raising their
own young and demanding (and paying for) qualified educators, our
education system is going to sink even lower than it is today.
You reap what you sow and you get what you pay for.
--
Janet Wilder
Way-the-heck-south Texas
Spelling doesn't count. Cooking does.
Mike Simmons
"Janet Wilder" <kellie...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:000a3835$0$16842$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...
Not to mention being "educated" in colleges and universities that
indoctrinate them with leftist ideas and doctrines.
Lone Haranguer
For openers I would abolish tenure and a teacher's job would depend on
the knowledge of their students at the end of the school year.
But try and find politicians with the cojones to pass such legislation.
LZ
Mike Hendrix
wrote:
>Mike Hendrix wrote:
>> On Sun, 05 Jul 2009 10:41:04 -0500, Lone Haranguer
>> <linu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dumb Americans revealed
>>>
>>> Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
>>>
>>> The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
>>> week that revealed most of the state�s high school students wouldn�t
>>> pass the test to become American citizens.
>>>
>>> The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
>>> questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
>>>
>>> In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
>>> the 10 questions.
>>>
>>> The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
>>> six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
>>>
>>> The Institute lamented the �troubling� results, stating the students
>>> displayed a �profound level of ignorance about American history,
>>> government and geography.�
>>> ***************
>>> I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
>>> just as ignorant.
>>
>> Totally agree.
>>
>>> But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers know
>>> what the latest fashion is.
>>
>> Totally agree again.
>>
>> However, I do not know how to turn things around.
>>
>> mike
>
>Ban sports
That would probably be a good start.
Emphasizing science fairs & spelling bees might be another.
>and all clothes except muumuus?
I am not sure clothing has a large impact.
But emphasis on band & sports & choir do. Parents seem to be involved
in their children's ball games to a far greater extent than their
education.
But that is just what I see.
mike
--
Lone Haranguer
> Mike Hendrix wrote:
>> On Sun, 05 Jul 2009 10:41:04 -0500, Lone Haranguer
>> <linu...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Dumb Americans revealed
>>>
>>> Published/Last Modified on Sunday, Jul 05, 2009 - 02:16:45 am MST
>>>
>>> The Goldwater Institute in Phoenix released results of a survey last
>>> pass the test to become American citizens.
>>>
>>> The survey included 1,140 high school students who were asked 10 random
>>> questions from the U.S. Citizenship and Immigration Services exam.
>>>
>>> In order to become an American citizen, immigrants must answer six of
>>> the 10 questions.
>>>
>>> The survey results revealed only 3.5 percent of the students answered
>>> six of the 10 sample questions correctly.
>>>
>>> displayed a “profound level of ignorance about American history,
>>> government and geography.”
>>> ***************
>>> I blame parents too, not only teachers. The parents are most likely
>>> just as ignorant.
>>
>> Totally agree.
>>
>>> But the fathers know who is winning in each league and the mothers
>>> know what the latest fashion is.
>>
>> Totally agree again.
>>
>> However, I do not know how to turn things around.
>>
>
> Too many of today's parents think it's the school's responsibility to
> care for their children. They abdicate their responsibilities to the
> schools. Things like religion, sex education, moral guidance should come
> from the home, not from a public school 10 minutes of silent prayer or a
> text book.
a “profound level of ignorance about American history,
government and geography.”
The article didn't mention religion, sex or moral guidance. Pay attention.
>
> You reap what you sow and you get what you pay for.
>
Obviously the taxpayer is NOT getting what they pay for.
LZ
Ralph
.
> Don't know about AZ but in NY the teachers unions are constantly
> comlaining about overpaid administration as a foil for their
> irrationally high salaries. It is clear that the public unions own
> many state legislations. I often wonder f anybody has done a red/blue
> correlation to the power of the public unions.
Last month I heard an interview with someone starting a Charter School
in NY. As you may know Charter Schools get the same funding (per
student) at NY Public schools.
By eliminating almost all the "admin" positions, and having the
teachers do the admin "reports" required by law, he was able to raise
the -starting- salary to $125,000.
He said he was having no, zero, problems getting qualified teachers.
cj
Lone Haranguer
Cat got your tongue,cj?
LZ
Bruce S
>
> As long as today's parents don't take an active part in raising their
> own young and demanding (and paying for) qualified educators, our
> education system is going to sink even lower than it is today.
>
> You reap what you sow and you get what you pay for.
That is simply not true - there is no correlation between teacher pay and
student performance. In fact, some school districts with the highest paid
teachers produce the worst students. One of the problems is that the
dumbest college students are the ones in the education programs. In fact,
the last time I checked, education majors had the lowest SAT scores of all
declared majors.
Bruce
nothermark
wrote:
1. Figure he was getting $12,000 - 15,000 per pupil. More in NYC.
2. Depending on how the student body was picked he may not have needed
much admin. Among other things NY has an extremely generous "special
needs" requirement that buries the big cities, and some not so big, in
paperwork and folks most students don't need.
matt_colie
the case or make a reasonable argument. All they ever seen to do is
start the name calling and shouting down. I someone disagrees, is it
more productive to call him stupid and tell him to shut up or would it
be better to try to educate him?
I guess there is just something I don't understand.
Matt
TS
>
> - Show quoted text -
I wonder how many people realize how big public education is in our
country. In most towns it is the biggest employer. On a statewide
basis it is one of the biggest employers if not the biggest. And, of
course, it is government run. In other words it is a giant
bureaucracy and the teachers unions have much more pull than many
realize. It is no wonder that legislators cater to the teacher's
unions. Unlike regular union employees teachers are in charge of
educating most of our children,,,guess what attitudes about government
and socialism the teachers espouse. Sooooo good luck folks education
is going down the drain just as fast as our political system.
TS
Janet Wilder
and what is your explanation for that? What would be your remedy? What
would attract more intelligent people into teaching?
Higher pay in one district over another district is a result of unions,
not qualifications of the teachers. You should know that. Your own pay
was negotiated by a union.
Janet Wilder
> On Sun, 5 Jul 2009 17:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Ralph <n7...@callsign.net>
> wrote:
>
>> On Jul 5, 1:38 pm, nothermark <notherm...@not.here> wrote:
>> .
>>> Don't know about AZ but in NY the teachers unions are constantly
>>> comlaining about overpaid administration as a foil for their
>>> irrationally high salaries. It is clear that the public unions own
>>> many state legislations. I often wonder f anybody has done a red/blue
>>> correlation to the power of the public unions.
>> Last month I heard an interview with someone starting a Charter School
>> in NY. As you may know Charter Schools get the same funding (per
>> student) at NY Public schools.
>>
>> By eliminating almost all the "admin" positions, and having the
>> teachers do the admin "reports" required by law, he was able to raise
>> the -starting- salary to $125,000.
>>
>> He said he was having no, zero, problems getting qualified teachers.
>
> 1. Figure he was getting $12,000 - 15,000 per pupil. More in NYC.
You've been out of touch. NYC stopped paying "combat pay" when the city
almost went bankrupt in the 70's. Most NYC teachers looked for jobs in
the suburbs where the pay was and is better.
> 2. Depending on how the student body was picked he may not have needed
> much admin. Among other things NY has an extremely generous "special
> needs" requirement that buries the big cities, and some not so big, in
> paperwork and folks most students don't need.
The fact that there are too many administrators and too much paperwork
in the NYC school system is a result of the unions.
Max
"matt_colie" <ma...@charter.net> wrote in message
news:XHo4m.14910$Kn1....@newsfe09.iad...
As difficult as it may seem to be, there is a class of humans lower than a
liberal.
The euphemism is locally known as "troll".
Max
Bruce S
Just a correction, Nevada is a right to work state, and the unions are so
weak that even the government employees union only has about 30% membership,
so unions had almost nothing to do with what I was paid. I realize that for
most government jobs that is not true, but for State of Nevada jobs (other
than education), unions have very little influence.
Now, as to how to improve the education industry - First get the Federal
government completely out of education. No federal money for books,
teachers, buildings, buses, school lunches, nothing. No Federal involvement
in curriculum; no Department of Education; no federal standards for anything
school related.
Second - reduce State involvement to the absolute, bare minimum. No State
involvement in pay, books, bussing, or anything else that can be done at a
local level.
Education is a local issue and every decision, in every school, should be
made by a local school board elected by local people. That way if you don't
like things at your school, you can either get involved and change them, or
you can move to the next school district where things will be done
differently.
Third - get rid of teacher's unions. Teachers are government employees,
they have no right to strike, and should be fired en masse if they are
involved in any type of strike, slowdown, sick out, etc. (Remember the Air
Traffic Controllers?)
Forth - put an end to tenure - make pay and continued employment contingent
on performance - and performance is based on students actually staying in
school and learning things.
Fifth - put a real emphasis on real educational classes - stop supporting
elective classes like Ecology, and start emphasizing English, Math, History,
Geography, Science and Government.
In the end, the reason teaching draws the worst people is because they know
that they won't have to work very hard, and if they can manage it for a
couple years, they can never again be fired. Teaching is a part time job
with full time pay, and that draws lazy people. And before you argue about
it being a part time job, most schools are only open 180 days per year, and
only about 6 hours per day - that's part time in anybody's book. I don't
know anyone who only works 180 days per year - 250 is the standard, and even
with a good vacation, its 235 actual work days. And while teachers may
complain about having to grade papers at home, they are only at school a
little over 6 hours, they have plenty of time to grade papers.
Make teaching a real job. A job that is done by real professionals, like
lawyers and doctors. When was the last time you saw a doctor work a 35 hour
week? If you elevate the position you will attract professionals. It is
not a matter of money, it is a matter of pride.
Bruce
Bob Giddings
<bruce...@gmail.com> wrote:
>Education is a local issue and every decision, in every school, should be
>made by a local school board elected by local people. That way if you don't
>like things at your school, you can either get involved and change them, or
>you can move to the next school district where things will be done
>differently.
This is a recipe for mediocrity. Without broad standards, there
will be a race to the bottom. As the tax base fills up with
aging anti tax Boomers (who can't see why they should educate
other people's kids), the next generation of kids will find their
schools chronically underfunded.
After that, it's sort of like child abuse. Those who experience
it tend to practice it later.
Bruce S
> On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 12:49:55 -0700, "Bruce S"
> <bruce...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Education is a local issue and every decision, in every school,
>> should be made by a local school board elected by local people.
>> That way if you don't like things at your school, you can either get
>> involved and change them, or you can move to the next school
>> district where things will be done differently.
>
> This is a recipe for mediocrity. Without broad standards, there
> will be a race to the bottom.
Bullshit! We became the best educated country in the world at a time when
there was no department of education, and absolutely no Federal involvement
in education.
And what gives the government any right to determine what kind of education
any person should receive. That is the responsibility of the parents. If
the parents want the kid to be taught that the earth is flat, it is none of
the government's business. In the end, of course most parents will seek the
best education they can get for their kids, and if all the decisions are
local, then parents will be able to influence those decisions. Just like
they do in private schools.
>As the tax base fills up with
> aging anti tax Boomers (who can't see why they should educate
> other people's kids), the next generation of kids will find their
> schools chronically underfunded.
That only happens because the older people see what a disaster the public
education system is, and don't want to put any of their hard earned money
into more of the same failure. For myself, I voted no on a tax increase
that would have raised the school budget 15% (per student) a couple years
ago simply because the school district could not guarantee that I would see
a 15% better educational system for my money. If they could promise that
15% more kids would graduate, or that test scores would be 15% higher, or
that they would be 15% better educated in preparation for college, I would
have voted yes, but they said they would probably get the same results, even
spending more money. Not a good enough deal to support financially.
When I will see some benefit for my money, then I will spend the money.
Bruce
Max
"Bruce S" <bruce...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:00006c45$0$7745$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...
But, Bruce.
Just off-hand, I would have to say that you don't fit the description of the
average voter. <G>
Max
Carl A. in FL
> news:00006c45$0$7745$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...
>>
>> when there was no department of education, and absolutely no Federal
>> involvement in education.
>>
Define "best."
Relative to the universe of what was available in knowledge, the average US
high school graduate never came close to the percentage level of education
in several European countries. Literacy rate has never been close to
Central European levels.
However, I would agree that there is no persuasive evidence that a central
ministry of education has improved matters in the slightest.
--
Carl A. in FL
http://sky.prohosting.com/chainfl/
Lone Haranguer
>> "Bruce S" <bruce...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:00006c45$0$7745$c3e...@news.astraweb.com...
>>>
>>> Bullshit! We became the best educated country in the world at a time
>>> when there was no department of education, and absolutely no Federal
>>> involvement in education.
>>>
>
> Define "best."
>
> Relative to the universe of what was available in knowledge, the average
> US high school graduate never came close to the percentage level of
> education in several European countries. Literacy rate has never been
> close to Central European levels.
But decisions on education in Europe were usually out of the hands of
the parents. The outcome of tests decided who would get higher
education and
the family's hierarchy in the social pecking order was also a factor.
One's career was usually decided at an early age and you were educated
in that direction.
My experience in Germany was that they turned out people who were really
good at their trade or craft but not always happy with the direction
their lives had taken because they had no voice in the decision.
LZ
JerryD(upstateNY)
back because the graduation rate had gone over 50% for the first time in
many years.
Can you imagine that ?
Almost half of the students didn't graduate and they think they are doing a
tremendous job...........:-(
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
"nothermark" <nothe...@not.here> wrote in message
Lone Haranguer
> This past year in Rochester, NY, they were all patting themselves on the
> back because the graduation rate had gone over 50% for the first time in
> many years.
> Can you imagine that ?
> Almost half of the students didn't graduate and they think they are doing a
> tremendous job...........:-(
In MN the graduation rate is good in the outstate school districts. The
cities have far lower rates, strictly depending on how many minority
students they
have enrolled. Minority students have a much lower graduation rate. I
wish Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton would show up to fix that.
LZ
JerryD(upstateNY)
the case or make a reasonable argument. All they ever seen to do is
start the name calling and shouting down. I someone disagrees, is it
more productive to call him stupid and tell him to shut up or would it
be better to try to educate him?
I guess there is just something I don't understand.<<<<<<<<<<<<<
The answer is really quite simple.
All they can do is shout and call people names because THEY DON'T HAVE ANY
DATA.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
Bob Giddings
I notice you do not offer any data to support your claim.
And most of the name calling around here, save one troll, seems
to come freely from the right.
Bruce S
> On Mon, 06 Jul 2009 12:49:55 -0700, Bruce S wrote:
>
>> Just a correction, Nevada is a right to work state, and the unions
>> are so weak that even the government employees union only has about
>> 30% membership, so unions had almost nothing to do with what I was
>> paid. I realize that for most government jobs that is not true, but
>> for State of Nevada jobs (other than education), unions have very
>> little influence.
>
> participation in order to remain certified to represent. Has this
> changed?
I tried some Googling but couldn't find the information I was looking for.
What I did learn is that only about 17.7% of all Nevada employees are union
members; that nationwide, American Federation of State, County, and
Municipal Employees (AFSCME), represents about 44% of government employees;
and State employee associations represent another 18% of employees. Those
last two numbers seem high for Nevada, but four years has passed since I
retired, and things could have changed. Additionally, those numbers seem to
suggest that a Union does not have to have 51%, or AFSCME would not exist.
Bruce
JerryD(upstateNY)
I notice you do not offer any data to support your claim.
And most of the name calling around here, save one troll, seems to come
freely from the right.
All you have to do is look up any statement from the lefties here and try to
find some legitiment data to back it up.
I'm not going to spend hours looking for something that doesn't exist.
Here's a statement and backup data..............
The White House Warned Congress About Fannie Mae Freddie Mac 17 Times In
2008, Alone
September, 21, 2008 - nicedeb
The White House attempts to set the record straight:
(I'm copying this post from the White House webpage in it's entirety because
I want people to read the whole thing).
For many years the President and his Administration have not only warned
of the systemic consequences of financial turmoil at a housing
government-sponsored enterprise (GSE) but also put forward thoughtful plans
to reduce the risk that either Fannie Mae or Freddie Mac would encounter
such difficulties. President Bush publicly called for GSE reform 17 times in
2008 alone before Congress acted. Unfortunately, these warnings went
unheeded, as the President's repeated attempts to reform the supervision of
these entities were thwarted by the legislative maneuvering of those who
emphatically denied there were problems.
2001
April: The Administration's FY02 budget declares that the size of Fannie
Mae and Freddie Mac is "a potential problem," because "financial trouble of
a large GSE could cause strong repercussions in financial markets, affecting
Federally insured entities and economic activity."
2002
May: The President calls for the disclosure and corporate governance
principles contained in his 10-point plan for corporate responsibility to
apply to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. (OMB Prompt Letter to OFHEO, 5/29/02)
2003
January: Freddie Mac announces it has to restate financial results for the
previous three years.
February: The Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight (OFHEO)
releases a report explaining that "although investors perceive an implicit
Federal guarantee of [GSE] obligations," "the government has provided no
explicit legal backing for them." As a consequence, unexpected problems at
a GSE could immediately spread into financial sectors beyond the housing
market. ("Systemic Risk: Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and the Role of OFHEO,"
OFHEO Report, 2/4/03).
September: Fannie Mae discloses SEC investigation and acknowledges OFHEO's
review found earnings manipulations.
September: Treasury Secretary John Snow testifies before the House
Financial Services Committee to recommend that Congress enact "legislation
to create a new Federal agency to regulate and supervise the financial
activities of our housing-related government sponsored enterprises" and set
prudent and appropriate minimum capital adequacy requirements.
October: Fannie Mae discloses $1.2 billion accounting error.
November: Council of the Economic Advisers (CEA) Chairman Greg Mankiw
explains that any "legislation to reform GSE regulation should empower the
new regulator with sufficient strength and credibility to reduce systemic
risk." To reduce the potential for systemic instability, the regulator
would have "broad authority to set both risk-based and minimum capital
standards" and "receivership powers necessary to wind down the affairs of a
troubled GSE." (N. Gregory Mankiw, Remarks At The Conference Of State Bank
Supervisors State Banking Summit And Leadership, 11/6/03).
2004
February: The President's FY05 Budget again highlights the risk posed by
the explosive growth of the GSEs and their low levels of required capital,
and called for creation of a new, world-class regulator: "The
Administration has determined that the safety and soundness regulators of
the housing GSEs lack sufficient power and stature to meet their
responsibilities, and therefore.should be replaced with a new strengthened
regulator." (2005 Budget Analytic Perspectives, pg. 83)
February: CEA Chairman Mankiw cautions Congress to "not take [the
financial market's] strength for granted." Again, the call from the
Administration was to reduce this risk by "ensuring that the housing GSEs
are overseen by an effective regulator." (N. Gregory Mankiw, Op-Ed,
"Keeping Fannie And Freddie's House In Order," Financial Times, 2/24/04).
June: Deputy Secretary of Treasury Samuel Bodman spotlights the risk posed
by the GSEs and called for reform, saying "We do not have a world-class
system of supervision of the housing government sponsored enterprises
(GSEs), even though the importance of the housing financial system that the
GSEs serve demands the best in supervision to ensure the long-term vitality
of that system. Therefore, the Administration has called for a new, first
class, regulatory supervisor for the three housing GSEs: Fannie Mae,
Freddie Mac, and the Federal Home Loan Banking System." (Samuel Bodman,
House Financial Services Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations
Testimony, 6/16/04).
2005
April: Treasury Secretary John Snow repeats his call for GSE reform,
saying "Events that have transpired since I testified before this Committee
in 2003 reinforce concerns over the systemic risks posed by the GSEs and
further highlight the need for real GSE reform to ensure that our housing
finance system remains a strong and vibrant source of funding for expanding
homeownership opportunities in America. Half-measures will only exacerbate
the risks to our financial system." (Secretary John W. Snow, "Testimony
Before The U.S. House Financial Services Committee," 4/13/05).
2007
July: Two Bear Stearns hedge funds invested in mortgage securities
collapse.
August: President Bush emphatically calls on Congress to pass a reform
package for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, saying "first things first when it
comes to those two institutions. Congress needs to get them reformed, get
them streamlined, get them focused, and then I will consider other options."
(President George W. Bush, Press Conference, The White House, 8/9/07).
September: RealtyTrac announces foreclosure filings up 243,000 in August -
up 115 percent from the year before.
September: Single-family existing home sales decreases 7.5 percent from
the previous month - the lowest level in nine years. Median sale price of
existing homes fell six percent from the year before.
December: President Bush again warns Congress of the need to pass
legislation reforming GSEs, saying "These institutions provide liquidity in
the mortgage market that benefits millions of homeowners, and it is vital
they operate safely and operate soundly. So I've called on Congress to pass
legislation that strengthens independent regulation of the GSEs - and
ensures they focus on their important housing mission. The GSE reform bill
passed by the House earlier this year is a good start. But the Senate has
not acted. And the United States Senate needs to pass this legislation
soon." (President George W. Bush, Discusses Housing, The White House,
12/6/07).
2008
January: Bank of America announces it will buy Countrywide.
January: Citigroup announces mortgage portfolio lost $18.1 billion in
value.
February: Assistant Secretary David Nason reiterates the urgency of
reforms, says "A new regulatory structure for the housing GSEs is essential
if these entities are to continue to perform their public mission
successfully." (David Nason, Testimony On Reforming GSE Regulation, Senate
Committee On Banking, Housing And Urban Affairs, 2/7/08).
March: Bear Stearns announces it will sell itself to JPMorgan Chase.
March: President Bush calls on Congress to take action and "move forward
with reforms on Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. They need to continue to
modernize the FHA, as well as allow State housing agencies to issue tax-free
bonds to homeowners to refinance their mortgages." (President George W.
Bush, Remarks To The Economic Club Of New York, New York, NY, 3/14/08).
April: President Bush urges Congress to pass the much needed legislation
and "modernize Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. [There are] constructive things
Congress can do that will encourage the housing market to correct quickly
by . helping people stay in their homes." (President George W. Bush,
Meeting With Cabinet, the White House, 4/14/08).
May: President Bush issues several pleas to Congress to pass legislation
reforming Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac before the situation deteriorates
further.
a.. "Americans are concerned about making their mortgage payments and
keeping their homes. Yet Congress has failed to pass legislation I have
repeatedly requested to modernize the Federal Housing Administration that
will help more families stay in their homes, reform Fannie Mae and Freddie
Mac to ensure they focus on their housing mission, and allow State housing
agencies to issue tax-free bonds to refinance sub-prime loans." (President
George W. Bush, Radio Address, 5/3/08).
b.. "[T]he government ought to be helping creditworthy people stay in
their homes. And one way we can do that - and Congress is making progress on
this - is the reform of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. That reform will come
with a strong, independent regulator." (President George W. Bush, Meeting
With The Secretary Of The Treasury, the White House, 5/19/08).
c.. "Congress needs to pass legislation to modernize the Federal Housing
Administration, reform Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to ensure they focus on
their housing mission, and allow State housing agencies to issue tax-free
bonds to refinance subprime loans." (President George W. Bush, Radio
Address, 5/31/08).
June: As foreclosure rates continued to rise in the first quarter, the
President once again asks Congress to take the necessary measures to address
this challenge, saying "we need to pass legislation to reform Fannie Mae and
Freddie Mac." (President George W. Bush, Remarks At Swearing In Ceremony
For Secretary Of Housing And Urban Development, Washington, D.C., 6/6/08).
July: Congress heeds the President's call for action and passes reform of
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac as it becomes clear that the institutions are
failing.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
Bob Giddings
Your claim had nothing at all to do with any of that. Your claim
was succinct. To try and bring you back on point, I present it
here:
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
""matt_colie" <ma...@charter.net> wrote in message
What is it about liberals that they can never present data to
support
the case or make a reasonable argument. All they ever seen to do
is
start the name calling and shouting down. I someone disagrees,
is it
more productive to call him stupid and tell him to shut up or
would it
be better to try to educate him?
I guess there is just something I don't understand.<<<<<<<<<<<<<
The answer is really quite simple.
All they can do is shout and call people names because THEY DON'T
HAVE ANY
DATA.
--
JerryD(upstateNY)
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Now how does a long meandering self justification about GSEs from
the Bush Administration prove that "liberals never present data"
or "all they can do is shout and call people names"?
And what has any of it to do with a thread on Teacher Unions?
Why are conservatives always so incoherent?
Bob
Max
"JerryD(upstateNY)" wrote
> The answer is really quite simple.
> All they can do is shout and call people names because THEY DON'T HAVE ANY
> DATA.
> --
> JerryD(upstateNY)
DON'T SHOUT!!!
By the way, do you have any data to support that opinion?
Chuck Norris
Most intelligent post you ever made!
--
Liberals. You can't talk to them and bullets are just so damned expensive!
Chuck Norris
JanO...@aol.com
> "matt_colie" <m...@charter.net> wrote in message
Damn, Max!
I just love it when you come in here and
hit a Grand Slam Homerun.
8^)
Jan
nothermark
You want data go here:
http://www.aft.org/salary/2007/download/AFT2007SalarySurvey.pdf
If you look at the tables you will find that, among other things,
teacher raises have matched or exceeded the CPI most years. Tha tis
better than industry.
You will also notice the tone of the report is the typical "we are
getting screwed" attitude when the numbers don't really show it.
The first thing they left out was the number of private sector jobs
lost to downsizing and outsourcing.
You will also find tidbits like the table of average salaries. What
they are leaving out is the maximum salaries that determine pensions
and the speed they get there.
Look at who they are comparing themselves too. All technical degree
folks with a solid math background that teachers can not usually
handle. I looked for English majors but they turn into teachers as an
option...
Then Look for the number of teachers compared to the number of folks
in the other jobs. Not there either but a big issue in how to pay
their salaries.
They are also not comparing themselves to the salaries of the factory
and retail trade folks who make most of the work force and need to be
taxed to pay the teachers. Compare the salaries of the teachers to
the salaries of the communities they live in. (They really do pretty
well but they don't think so.)
That's a start. I am going to work so somebody else can play from
here.
Max
<JanO...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:a7f113e9-3dc1-4acf...@p18g2000pra.googlegroups.com...
>Jan
LOL. Some of the pitches are so slow, you just can't help yourself.
Max
Carl A. in FL
news:2dJ4m.2994$8r....@nlpi064.nbdc.sbc.com...
Especially when one is operating at that low level.
matt_colie
>> What is it about liberals that they can never present data to support
>> the case or make a reasonable argument. All they ever seen to do is
>> start the name calling and shouting down. I someone disagrees, is it
>> more productive to call him stupid and tell him to shut up or would it
>> be better to try to educate him?
>> I guess there is just something I don't understand.
>> Matt
>
> It appears there may be lots of things a "pollyanna-type" virgin-in-
> the-woods person like yourself doesn't "understand." Have your Mommy
> and Daddy let you out from under that big shady elm tree where they
> have you isolated and protected and venture out into the real world
> replete with its negative environmental stimuli and variances of
> opinion and reactions.
>
> And, BTW dipwad, probably 80% of all the hatemongering and name-
> calling comes from Repukes like yourself, not the liberals, so take
> your little whiny squealing post and go sit in them corner. You've
> been bad Little Matt and you must be punished.
>
> -Chucker
You might read the other posts before you do this again.
Thank you for making MY case so very clearly Chunk.
Matt
Chuck Norris
wrote:
>Jared wrote:
>> On Jul 5, 8:41 am, Lone Haranguer <linus...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Dumb Americans revealed <REST OF PIGGIE SQUEAL> snipped.
>>
>> You got that right. Just look at the dumb Americans who responded and
>> agreed to yet another of your pitiful whiny-assed horseshit posts. If
>> you had even half a brain someone besides these fellow sucking
>> sycophantic Repukes clusterfuck groin-rubbing buddies of yours might
>> even respond. But keep it up, there's nothing more gratifying to the
>> ears of an intelligent person (insert LIBERAL here) than the
>> whhhhhhhhhhiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiinnnnnnnnnnnneeeeeee of a hurting and
>> kicked-in-the-head suckass loser from the Repugnant Party.
>>
>> HAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAWHAW
>>
>What is it about liberals that they can never present data to support
>the case or make a reasonable argument. All they ever seen to do is
>start the name calling and shouting down. I someone disagrees, is it
>more productive to call him stupid and tell him to shut up or would it
>be better to try to educate him?
>I guess there is just something I don't understand.
>Matt
You can always tell a lib/socialist ... but you can't tell him much.
nothermark
<jer...@rochester.rr.com> wrote:
>This past year in Rochester, NY, they were all patting themselves on the
>back because the graduation rate had gone over 50% for the first time in
>many years.
>Can you imagine that ?
>Almost half of the students didn't graduate and they think they are doing a
>tremendous job...........:-(
But they need another big raise...that will fix it. Same story for
the last 30 years.
nothermark
<kellie...@yahoo.com> wrote:
>nothermark wrote:
>> On Sun, 5 Jul 2009 17:08:51 -0700 (PDT), Ralph <n7...@callsign.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On Jul 5, 1:38 pm, nothermark <notherm...@not.here> wrote:
>>> .
>>>> Don't know about AZ but in NY the teachers unions are constantly
>>>> comlaining about overpaid administration as a foil for their
>>>> irrationally high salaries. It is clear that the public unions own
>>>> many state legislations. I often wonder f anybody has done a red/blue
>>>> correlation to the power of the public unions.
>>> Last month I heard an interview with someone starting a Charter School
>>> in NY. As you may know Charter Schools get the same funding (per
>>> student) at NY Public schools.
>>>
>>> By eliminating almost all the "admin" positions, and having the
>>> teachers do the admin "reports" required by law, he was able to raise
>>> the -starting- salary to $125,000.
>>>
>>> He said he was having no, zero, problems getting qualified teachers.
>>
>> 1. Figure he was getting $12,000 - 15,000 per pupil. More in NYC
>
>You've been out of touch. NYC stopped paying "combat pay" when the city
>almost went bankrupt in the 70's. Most NYC teachers looked for jobs in
>the suburbs where the pay was and is better.
I'm not talking about combat pay. I was remarking about the level of
state aid money combined with the local tax money on a per pupil
basis.
Here is a link that will give you a starting point:
http://empirezone.blogs.nytimes.com/2007/05/24/the-highest-per-pupil-spending-in-the-us/
A 15 student classroom brings in more than $180,000 in NY. The
question is where does the money go after that.
>
>> 2. Depending on how the student body was picked he may not have needed
>> much admin. Among other things NY has an extremely generous "special
>> needs" requirement that buries the big cities, and some not so big, in
>> paperwork and folks most students don't need.
>
>The fact that there are too many administrators and too much paperwork
>in the NYC school system is a result of the unions.
Indirectly. The Unions combined with various parent groups with real
special needs children pushed an amenable state government into
requiring ever increasing amounts of special treatment. A lot of
guilt is involved.
The special treatment involves other professionals besides the
teachers as well as setting class sizes by needs codes and tracking
the "progress" of each child in much more detail than normal students.
Some teachers also milk the system as as a way to get rid of annoying
children. The only diffference between NYC and the upstate cities is
the size of the swamp.
BTW, Anybody visiting a "normal" inner city classroom would easily see
why there is a difference between them and the suburban schools.
nothermark
As opposed to the current US system where everybody is forced into a
poorly run BA program. Few teachers understand math or science so
they do not teach or encourage it.
nothermark
wrote:
>Bob Giddings wrote:
>> On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 12:49:55 -0700, "Bruce S"
>> <bruce...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Education is a local issue and every decision, in every school,
>>> should be made by a local school board elected by local people.
>>> That way if you don't like things at your school, you can either get
>>> involved and change them, or you can move to the next school
>>> district where things will be done differently.
>>
>> This is a recipe for mediocrity. Without broad standards, there
>> will be a race to the bottom.
>
>Bullshit! We became the best educated country in the world at a time when
>there was no department of education, and absolutely no Federal involvement
>in education.
>
>And what gives the government any right to determine what kind of education
>any person should receive. That is the responsibility of the parents. If
>the parents want the kid to be taught that the earth is flat, it is none of
>the government's business. In the end, of course most parents will seek the
>best education they can get for their kids, and if all the decisions are
>local, then parents will be able to influence those decisions. Just like
>they do in private schools.
Private schools still have to meet state standards around here.
What you are proposing is a way to facilitate the cult mentality. The
way around it is to provide a basic curriculum requirement at the
Federal level then to get out of the way. The local schools can then
teach it however they want with whatever they want. Somebody has to
set the standards for reading, writing, math and basic citizenship
knowledge. Local folks can't.
nothermark
wrote:
One of the many gaping holes in modern education is the lack of
knowledge about the rest of the world. A second one is the
gullibility of the average person.
Lone Haranguer
I guess we were wise to move back to my home turf when I retired because
my older son's 3 children all like math.
The oldest is a computer programmer for a defense contractor, the second
oldest just graduated with degrees in Physics and Astronomy and the
youngest (daughter) is interning at a nuke plant this summer while she
pursues an engineering degree.
All 3 took college level math courses while still in high school.
Naturally we encouraged their efforts and took a close interest in their
studies.
They wanted us to be proud of them and of course we are.
LZ
Bruce S
> On Mon, 6 Jul 2009 13:19:57 -0700, "Bruce S" <bruce...@gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> And what gives the government any right to determine what kind of
>> education any person should receive. That is the responsibility of
>> the parents. If the parents want the kid to be taught that the
>> earth is flat, it is none of the government's business. In the end,
>> of course most parents will seek the best education they can get for
>> their kids, and if all the decisions are local, then parents will
>> be able to influence those decisions. Just like they do in private
>> schools.
>
> Private schools still have to meet state standards around here.
>
> What you are proposing is a way to facilitate the cult mentality. The
> way around it is to provide a basic curriculum requirement at the
> Federal level then to get out of the way. The local schools can then
> teach it however they want with whatever they want. Somebody has to
> set the standards for reading, writing, math and basic citizenship
> knowledge. Local folks can't.
Where do you, or the government, get the authority to determine what is
taught in schools? And why do you believe that parents won't seek the best
possible education for their children if options exist?
As far as I am concerned, education should be a private decision made by the
parents for their children. If they want their kids to learn that the earth
is flat, that is none of your business (and none of the government's
business either). In the end, a few parents might choose to give their
children a bad education, but most parents want the best for their kids, and
will seek out the best schools they can find - if they have that choice.
That is why private schools and charter schools have no problem filling
seats, even with high tuitions.
Bruce
Lone Haranguer
miserable.....which is why they are working so hard to make that
condition universal.
LZ