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Cell Repeater
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Otto Frailing
Sep 21, 2012, 2:09:35 PM9/21/12
to
As I've traveled around, sometimes I have poor cell phone reception at
camping spots. At times it gets better if I go outside and walk around a
bit and at others not so much. I've seen the cell phone/3g/4g repeaters
advertised, but not experienced them. These are the ones where you mount an
external antenna on the roof or ladder or something else outside, and have
an amplifier and another antenna inside. Understand that if I'm parked at a
signal null in between two mountains, nothing is going to work. Also been
told that if you can't get a call through walking around the camping area
nothing will help. Question is, do the repeaters work or is it all hype?
camping spots. At times it gets better if I go outside and walk around a
bit and at others not so much. I've seen the cell phone/3g/4g repeaters
advertised, but not experienced them. These are the ones where you mount an
external antenna on the roof or ladder or something else outside, and have
an amplifier and another antenna inside. Understand that if I'm parked at a
signal null in between two mountains, nothing is going to work. Also been
told that if you can't get a call through walking around the camping area
nothing will help. Question is, do the repeaters work or is it all hype?
Lone Haranguer
Sep 21, 2012, 2:20:12 PM9/21/12
to
broadband. Both were 3G but work off
regular cell towers if 3G is not available. Verizon has far
better coverage than Sprint.
LZ
Message has been deleted
nothermark
Sep 21, 2012, 4:27:00 PM9/21/12
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On Fri, 21 Sep 2012 14:57:23 -0400, richard <nor...@example.com>
wrote:
>They work quite well. Given there is some sort of service within the area
>that the repeater can "hit".
>Considering that internal cell phone antennas are miniscule, it's a wonder
>they get the range they do.
Part of the reason is the frequncy they work on. A high gain antenna
is still pretty small. ;-)
>
>My brother has a ranch in seligman, az which has no local coverage.
>One resident though, uses an external yagi antenna and claims she can hit a
>nearby tower fairly easily.
If it's pointed correctly and has enough gain.
>
>The yagi antennas for cell phones are like miniature old style tv antennas.
>Mount one on the roof and you should have some service.
>But let's face it, if you can't see a tower, ya ain't gonna get no service
>no how no way.
>
>In the early days of cell phones, Procter and Gamble employees could be
>seen with dual exernal antennas on their cars. Inside the trunk was a
>mini-repeater system. So they could hit a tower practically anywhere in the
>cincinnati area.
How far back are you talking?
Back on topic, two interesting sites:
http://www.unwiredsignal.com/?c=146&cn=Building+Antennas
http://www.wilsonelectronics.com/ - thnk "building"
wrote:
>that the repeater can "hit".
>Considering that internal cell phone antennas are miniscule, it's a wonder
>they get the range they do.
Part of the reason is the frequncy they work on. A high gain antenna
is still pretty small. ;-)
>
>My brother has a ranch in seligman, az which has no local coverage.
>One resident though, uses an external yagi antenna and claims she can hit a
>nearby tower fairly easily.
If it's pointed correctly and has enough gain.
>
>The yagi antennas for cell phones are like miniature old style tv antennas.
>Mount one on the roof and you should have some service.
>But let's face it, if you can't see a tower, ya ain't gonna get no service
>no how no way.
>
>In the early days of cell phones, Procter and Gamble employees could be
>seen with dual exernal antennas on their cars. Inside the trunk was a
>mini-repeater system. So they could hit a tower practically anywhere in the
>cincinnati area.
How far back are you talking?
Back on topic, two interesting sites:
http://www.unwiredsignal.com/?c=146&cn=Building+Antennas
http://www.wilsonelectronics.com/ - thnk "building"
Otto Frailing
Sep 22, 2012, 2:06:10 PM9/22/12
to
nothermark <nothe...@not.here> wrote in
news:j2jp585atlr1nsvfk...@4ax.com:
Thanks for the info. Seems like a lot of expense when I could probably
walk or drive the toad up the road a bit and get a good signal. Not sure
I'd want to go through the hassle of pointing a yaggi for a two or three
day stop. If I ever stop for a month or two some where it might be worth
it.
news:j2jp585atlr1nsvfk...@4ax.com:
walk or drive the toad up the road a bit and get a good signal. Not sure
I'd want to go through the hassle of pointing a yaggi for a two or three
day stop. If I ever stop for a month or two some where it might be worth
it.
nothermark
Sep 22, 2012, 8:55:01 PM9/22/12
to
directionals or the signal boosters.
The signal boosters use an omni directional antenna, probably with
gain, and an amplifier:
http://www.wilsonelectronics.com/store/index/category/38/wireless
The antenna choices would be here:
http://www.wilsonelectronics.com/store/index/category/51/outside-mobile
Looking at the specs one can get 5-6 DB with a vertical antenna. Every
3 DB is a power doubling. The problem is the cable is lossy at those
frequencies so I might be tempted to run a couple of feet of cable but
I would start calculating losses at more than a maybe 6 or 8 ft.
The only other thing I can think of off hand is the pattern.
Yagi's or any other beam antenna concentrate signal in a narrow
pattern along the axis of the beam that holds the antenna elements.
Pointing it can be a PITA.
Verticals have a pattern like a doughnut around the vertical element.
The higher the gain the flatter the doughnut. If you are in a
mountain area with the cell towers high up it might be worth a few
minutes to pull the antenna off vertical with a piece of string. It
might make 1 or 2 of bars difference.
Otto Frailing
Sep 23, 2012, 1:31:20 PM9/23/12
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nothermark <nothe...@not.here> wrote in
news:3ols5895thhjh3mtl...@4ax.com:
Thanks, I'll have to think on it a spell to decide.
Would be nice, especially on a wet day, to answer the phone instead of
making an appointment to go up the hill to check for missed calls.
news:3ols5895thhjh3mtl...@4ax.com:
Would be nice, especially on a wet day, to answer the phone instead of
making an appointment to go up the hill to check for missed calls.
Vito
Sep 23, 2012, 2:45:36 PM9/23/12
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"Otto Frailing" <Ot...@fengwen.org> wrote
| > Looking at the specs one can get 5-6 DB with a vertical antenna. Every
| > 3 DB is a power doubling. The problem is the cable is lossy at those
| > frequencies so I might be tempted to run a couple of feet of cable but
| > I would start calculating losses at more than a maybe 6 or 8 ft.
Choose cable types wisely.
| > 3 DB is a power doubling. The problem is the cable is lossy at those
| > frequencies so I might be tempted to run a couple of feet of cable but
| > I would start calculating losses at more than a maybe 6 or 8 ft.
gregz
Sep 23, 2012, 9:10:09 PM9/23/12
to
antenna jacks. I never used them, and I never read about others using them.
In the early days of cell phones mounted in vehicles, vertical gain
antennas were used, as well as higher output power. 10 times power times 4
times antenna gain, is about 40 times the power, and 2 times the receive
voltage.
You could also stand on top of RV. Height has advantage. Don't fall off.
I was considering a passive system. Might work up on tree next to parked
trailer, and knew direction of best tower. Using a small area inside RV, at
least to receive messages.
Greg
nothermark
Sep 24, 2012, 12:21:01 AM9/24/12
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On Mon, 24 Sep 2012 01:10:09 +0000 (UTC), gregz <ze...@comcast.net>
wrote:
As I recall for a given impedance 3 db is double the power, 6 db
double the voltage and 20 db is 1 decimal point. 40 DB would be 100
times the voltage or 2 decimal points.
That much gain will buy 2 things. You can afford some loss in a
longer cable run and you can make a poor signal usable. OTOH 100
times 0 is still 0. I would guess that if one can walk outside or
upthe road a bit chances are pretty good something is around as long
as one is not walking to a point where the cell tower comes out from
behind a mountain. ;-)
Just for a point of reference I took a look at the Belden catalog for
small 50 ohm low loss cable. It looks like 20 - 30 db /100 ft at cell
phone frequencies so a figure move the decimal point for 10 ft antenna
lead to the phone or amp and you can account for a lot of antenna
gain. Here is the table:
http://www.belden.com/pdfs/03Belden_Master_Catalog/06Coaxial_Cables/06Coaxial_Cables.pdf
That's why it pays to keep the leads short.
wrote:
double the voltage and 20 db is 1 decimal point. 40 DB would be 100
times the voltage or 2 decimal points.
That much gain will buy 2 things. You can afford some loss in a
longer cable run and you can make a poor signal usable. OTOH 100
times 0 is still 0. I would guess that if one can walk outside or
upthe road a bit chances are pretty good something is around as long
as one is not walking to a point where the cell tower comes out from
behind a mountain. ;-)
Just for a point of reference I took a look at the Belden catalog for
small 50 ohm low loss cable. It looks like 20 - 30 db /100 ft at cell
phone frequencies so a figure move the decimal point for 10 ft antenna
lead to the phone or amp and you can account for a lot of antenna
gain. Here is the table:
http://www.belden.com/pdfs/03Belden_Master_Catalog/06Coaxial_Cables/06Coaxial_Cables.pdf
That's why it pays to keep the leads short.
gregz
Sep 24, 2012, 1:16:17 PM9/24/12
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line. They make specific microwave cable that's lower loss type. I ordered
some cables for wifi. There are also some junk being sold on eBay. Says
it's for wifi, but not low loss. I found out the hard way.
Found.
The good stuff is designated LMR, and there is more than one size. LMR 240,
LMR 400. One has 1/3 the loss, and 400 has 1/6 the loss of RG 58.
Greg
nothermark
Sep 24, 2012, 6:30:29 PM9/24/12
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On Mon, 24 Sep 2012 17:16:17 +0000 (UTC), gregz <ze...@comcast.net>
It's also different sizes. I just bought LMR 400 for an antenna job.
;-)
;-)
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