Why this is here....
Joseph Dunphy
The title on the second post I put up, might be a bit confusing. This
issues that arose in "Kara's" case, were similar to those that arise
in the case of surrogate motherhood, and what I wrote about her (with
names changed) was posted elsewhere, in that context.
"Kara" (not her real name) was a Scadian. Apparently, one of the Scadian
values, in some places, is the willingness to manipulate others, to the
advantage of those one identitfies with - predation, in other words.
A value, perhaps, that would bear some reexamination.
As of right now, the SCA strikes me as being the sort of place, that I
wouldn't allow any children of mine to come anywhere near - at least, not
until they were old enough, had enough life experience, and their heads
were hard enough, that their mentalities could not be remolded into
ones that would incline them to let themselves be taken advantage of.
I wonder if anyone ever gets that old.
I suppose, though, as was pointed out to me, it is only a tiny minority of
the SCA that ever has anything to do with those mailing lists, and it may
not be a representative one. They might not even all be Scadians, for all
I know. But, let me put it to you this way.....
I have worked as a substitute teacher in the Chicago Public School system,
at times in the Housing projects. My students, more often than not, were
street gang members. What I got from the mailing list that I peeked in on,
by "private" e-mail, in response to a mild disagreement, was enough to
even shock me. One of the "ladies" present, responded to my willingness to
get mildly rude with someone, who had been attributing statements to me
that I had not made, and who had been more than slightly rude to me for
some time previous, by e-mailing me a detailed description of what she
thought my mother's sexual predilections were. Household pets, and various
pieces of machiniery were involved, in addition to some very dark wishes,
for the well being of my family in the coming year.
And no, I'm not going to show a thing like that around, thank you.
I started to write a rebuttal, and found that I just had to clear out the
whole damn account. Rereading that, to write a smartass reply, was
something that I just couldn't do
In real life, one wouldn't dare offer a remark like that in person, for
fear of what would happen next. I'm not ashamed to admit, that, while
making it clear that I had no intention of doing anything violent to her,
I made it clear that I sure hoped that she'd encounter someone who would.
Someone like that darkens the light of day, merely by being under it.
This reply of hers' was unusual in degree, but not in kind.
So, is this what the SCA is about ?
_____________________________________________________________________________
My filter has been sent to intercept incoming e-mail, so please
don't send any. It will be lost, and the work you put into writing
it, will go entirely to waste. Please respond by followup instead.
I hope that this causes no inconvenience. While you, yourself, are
probably a perfectly reasonable and intelligent individual, I have
found that those who answer to neither description, are extremely
fond of sending abusive "private e-mail" to people who they will
never have to face in person. As a personal choice, I've decided
to never make it easy for these people to spoil my day with their
presence again. Let us see how "courageous" they are, when their
trolling can only be done, where all can see.
____________________________________________________________________________
Lila A. Bednar
In article <69qo1j$27p$4...@flood.xnet.com>, st...@typhoon.xnet.com says...
<major snippage here>
> So, is this what the SCA is about ?
>
No, it's what one sicko's version of SCA is about. Or a few sickos. I'd
make the standard request that you (or anyone else) don't condemn the
entire organization on the basis of some twisted fools with a
prediliction for cowardly, hateful and anonymous behavior that ran over
you.
You can find cunning, manipulative behavior in any group, affiliation or
organization. I have seen some of what you describe and feel (from my
limited perspective) that if those folks weren't involved with SCA,
they'd have some other playground to poop in...... not all of us are like
that.
--
To prevent spamming, my email has been altered. To send me email remove
the capitalized words from my domain name.......
Robert Newmyer
Can you say "Flame Bait"
Bob Newmyer
rnew...@epix.net
http://www.epix.net/~rnewmyer
"Ahh said 'Pay Attention, Son!' All the good ones are whizzin'
right past ya!" -- Foghorn Leghorn, the Senior Rooster
Kat...@webtv.net
Trolling, trolling, trolling the SCA.......
I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but what you do
not realize is that what you heard is not what I meant. ;-)
Dietmar
Greetings good gentles,
Laurie, responding to Joseph, wrote:
>I would have preferred to respond via private e-mail on this issue,
>but understand your reasons for requesting open postings.
I, too, would've preferred private posts and must admit that it raises
more questions than it answers.
>I appreciated your original posting, as it gave me food for thought,
>not only in my own life, but in considering how I am raising my son.
>I recently subscribed to this newsgroup to learn more about the SCA
>and whether it would be a positive environment for us.
No offense. I appreciate your desire to learn more about the SCA, but
learning about the SCA through observing this newsgroup is kind of
like learning about stamp collecting by visiting a post office. They
are related, and you may find some useful information, but neither one
gives you a good grasp of what the other is all about.
>Your comment about the SCA not being the best place for a child
>unless they had developed beyond the potential for manipulation
>concerned me, and I would appreciate it if you could elaborate either
>through the newsgroup or directly to my e-mail. . . .
>
>Laurie
This is only my opinion, and I'm sure Joseph will not agree, but there
is no point at which a child will "develop beyond the potential for
manipulation". Part of the responsibility of a parent is to observe
all of the incoming stimuli that their child comes into contact with
on a daily basis, and TEACH their child through discussion and
interaction about what is positive and negative about each. These
influences are everywhere, from the school they attend and the
television shows they watch to the church they attend. To paint the
entire SCA as a negative influence based on the kind of observations
that he observed is not a fair conclusion.
Joseph wrote:
>Apparently, one of the Scadian values, in some places, is the
>willingness to manipulate others, to the advantage of those one
>identitfies with - predation, in other words. A value, perhaps,
>that would bear some reexamination.
I hope you realize that the same could be said about many organized
religions...by a rather biased observer standing on the outside.
>As of right now, the SCA strikes me as being the sort of place, that
>I wouldn't allow any children of mine to come anywhere near - at
>least, not until they were old enough, had enough life experience,
>and their heads were hard enough, that their mentalities could not be
>remolded into ones that would incline them to let themselves be taken
>advantage of.
If you have this kind of attitude Joseph, you might as well
hermetically seal up your kids and never let them out of your sight or
your house where you MIGHT be able to control their every influence.
You have to take some responsibility in their upbringing. Otherwise
it's like leaving fresh meat out in the sun and blaming the
neighborhood for letting it spoil...for being such a bad environment.
>I wonder if anyone ever gets that old.
Nope. Not without the proper guidance in their formative years.
(Which may not end at 18, or 21...or even 41.)
Yours in service,
Dietmar
"Victory or Defeat lies in God's hands;
over Honor, we ourselves are Lord and Master."
Laurie
Dear Joseph;
I would have preferred to respond via private e-mail on this issue, but
understand your reasons for requesting open postings. I appreciated your
original posting, as it gave me food for thought, not only in my own life,
but in considering how I am raising my son. I recently subscribed to this
newsgroup to learn more about the SCA and whether it would be a positive
environment for us. Your comment about the SCA not being the best place for
Tamela R. Germano
This person is trolling like he was in a Bass fishing contest.
Sir Vinnie
Dino in Reno
Judwiga
>"Kara" (not her real name) was a Scadian. Apparently, one of the Scadian
>values, in some places, is the willingness to manipulate others, to the
>advantage of those one identitfies with - predation, in other words.
>A value, perhaps, that would bear some reexamination.
>
>So, is this what the SCA is about ?
>
Because you are trying to paint us all with the same brush, are you not?? I
mean, that would be quite prejudgidial. That would be like saying all
Christians eat babies or something of the like!! I am truly sorry that one
lady, that any lady, was raped. I am sorry also that you choose this forum,
however politely worded to attack all members of the SCA. So, have a nice day,
and No, I dont wish to manipulate others. I have no wish to, and 90% of my SCA
friends dont wish to either!!!
Lady Judwiga Czarny Jagello Ze Smokza Jamy
formerly known as Celeste Cathan
Ygraineogf
This whole thread is from a troll. I've been on Dejanews tonight looking for
lost postings and found the original post from Joseph Dunphy. I did an "Author
Profile" and found that he regularly posts and cross-posts to perhaps 75 - 100
newsgroups (with interesting titles), mostly in 3 to 9 page rants.
Do yourselves a favor and don't grace this person with any further responses.
FYI . . . In various posts he has described himself as a pagan, Jew or
Christian.
>>"Kara" (not her real name) was a Scadian. Apparently, one of the Scadian
>>values, in some places, is the willingness to manipulate others, to the
>>advantage of those one identitfies with - predation, in other words.
I didn't cite the source of the quote above, it's not necessary.
merlyn
Judwiga <jud...@aol.com> wrote in article
<19980118062...@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
> >"Kara" (not her real name) was a Scadian. Apparently, one of the Scadian
> >values, in some places, is the willingness to manipulate others, to the
> >advantage of those one identitfies with - predation, in other words.
> >A value, perhaps, that would bear some reexamination.
> (Big Snip>
> >
> >So, is this what the SCA is about ?
>
Granted there are a lot of individuals that participate in the manipulation
of others, and they are by nature highly visible. In my fifteen years in
the Society I have known many like that, and still do. However, while some
do it for personal glorification, others do so for what they believe to be
the benefit of the Society as a whole. In truth, administration in all its
forms throughout the world is such manipulation. The predatory type are
more noticed because of the nature of what they do. Fortunately they are a
very small minority. Most of us are here because we love what we do and
wish to share the experience with as many as possible.
Sk8Maven
Mr. Dunphy, you know nothing about the SCA, you know nothing about any
members thereof (save one), and yet you have the nerve to condemn us
based on some crackpot theories of your own which you are misapplying to
all situations.
Go away, troll.
Maven
Sk8Maven
Ygraineogf wrote:
> This whole thread is from a troll. I've been on Dejanews tonight
> looking for lost postings and found the original post from Joseph
> Dunphy. I did an "Author Profile" and found that he regularly posts
> and cross-posts to perhaps 75 - 100 newsgroups (with interesting
> titles), mostly in 3 to 9 page rants.
>
> Do yourselves a favor and don't grace this person with any further responses.
Fool me once, shame on him; fool me twice, shame on me. :-)
> FYI . . . In various posts he has described himself as a pagan, Jew or
> Christian.
And in his posts here he has posed as being religion-neutral. Yeah,
sure. If I were required to place a bet on his likely affiliation, I
would probably say "Objectivist/Randite". All that negative valuation of
"altruism" and positive valuation of "selfishness" is usually a strong
indicator.
Since "Objectivism" is a 20th-century philosophy, there's no point in
discussing it here -- except to note that the founding figure(s) did not
know, and did not care to know, the difference between the "Dark Ages",
during which the old world order was crumbling to ruin, and the Middle
Ages, in which a new and different social order was being built up.
Maven
david hughes
Joseph Dunphy <st...@typhoon.xnet.com> wrote in article
<69qo1j$27p$4...@flood.xnet.com>...
> <SNIP>
. Apparently, one of the Scadian
> values, in some places, is the willingness to manipulate others,
> <long, rambling, "I'm so abused" story snipped>
> So, is this what the SCA is about ?
>
> < explanation of why he insists on replies being in the n.g. rather than
by e-mail snipped>
No, the SCA is about studying history. Like any other group ( Red Cross,
BSA, VFW, Church and/ or School organizations, anything with more than 1
member) a certain number of participants are in it for a power trip, ego
boost, etc. Those who can't get this by their own efforts, may try to
manipulate others. This is not what the SCA is about, rather it is an
unfortunate aspect of human nature.
And 20th century Western society doesn't permit us to eliminate such
individuals from the gene-pool, we can only refuse to associate with them.