THE TEN MOST OVERRATED ROCK BANDS EVER
CMSC 330
Hey you rock-n-roll fans out there, I read this article in REQUEST magazine,
and saved it. So now I'm posting it so you all can read it and see what you
think.
It was on page 16 in REQUEST magazine. Author of the article: Jim DeRogatis
I'm not sure what the date of the magazine is but it's in late 1991. Enjoy.
Hal
===============================================================================
THE TEN MOST OVERRATED ROCK BANDS EVER
Rock critics are always complaining that some bands are underrated(presumably
because said bands don't sell many records), but rarely does anyone target
those slight artists whose reputations as patron saints of rock'n'roll are
gross exaggerations of what they've actually accomplished. You'd never know
from the countless entries in the rock encyclopedias, but here are the 10
most overrated rock artists ever, and a few runners-up:
1. ERIC CLAPTON: What Cream passed off as improvisation was just indulgent
wanking, plain and simple. If this Michelob salesman is
God, it's a good argument for atheism.
2. THE WHO: Roger Daltrey? Get serious.
3. THE DOORS: Sure Jim Morrison was a great poet. Inspirational verse:
"Dead cat in a top hat/Thinks he's an aristocrat/That's crap."
4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
5. BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN: He started believing he was the working man's Dylan
sometime after 'Darkness on the Edge of Town', but
it didn't stop him from firing his band. He's boring
and pretentious, and I'm allowed to say it 'cause I'm
from Jersey.
6. THE BAND: Has anyone ever stayed awake through 'The Last Waltz'? If you
hired this Band to play for your wedding, the guests would
leave before dinner.
7. CREEDENCE CLEARWATER REVIVAL: So what if they were a good bar band. They
doomed us to an eternity of "Proud Mary"
covers.
8. CROSBY, STILLS, & NASH: Even the great Neil Young couldn't redeem these
sorry yodelers.
9. STEVE WINDWOOD: He may be able to play 43 different instruments, but he
still sounds like a Holiday Inn lounge act.
10. FRANK ZAPPA: Classical fart with punk pretensions.
THE RUNNERS-UP: The Police/Sting; George Harrison; Fleetwood Mac; Elvis
Costello; and almost every band California ever produced,
especially the Eagles.
-Jim DeRogatis
REQUEST magazine
===============================================================================
Charles Fee
>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
Spare me.
Jimi Hendrix changed the music establishment more in 3 years than had been
done before in 3 decades. No other person has ever been more emulated in the
history of rock music, including the truly overrated Elvis Presley, who easily
should be considered the most overrated personality of all time.
Jimi Hendrix may not have been the greatest lyricist of all time, but he
is without a doubt the greatest guitarist ewver. It is a shame that people can
simplify such an incredible musician to a one line blurb.
-Chuck
Dave Low
I think they are the all time most over rated band!!!!!!
Dave Low
dg...@descartes.waterloo.edu
Victor Kamutzki
>In article <12...@umd5.umd.edu>, ap...@linus.umd.edu (CMSC 330) says:
>>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
> Spare me.
> Jimi Hendrix changed the music establishment more in 3 years than had been
>done before in 3 decades.
Anyone who thinks Hendrix invented feedback should have been listening
to Link Wray in 1954. "Rumble" contains as much chaos, distortion and
feeback as Hendrix ever "invented". That's not to say that Hendrix
wasn't a great guitar player - he was! But please give credit where
credit is due. Link Wray was way ahead of his time.
If you want to check it out, there was a live album released in '79
that contains a version of "Rumble" that is very true to the original
version from '54. Earlier recordings of "Rumble" have the massive
feedback edited out - it was deemed undesirable - but the live version
from '79 is positively heart-stopping. Sorry, but I can't remember
what label that album was released on...
>No other person has ever been more emulated in the history of rock
>music,
And not without due cause. As I said, he was a truly great guitarist.
However, as is very often the case (even today), people tend to
overlook the talent that was building in the underground long before a
lot of musicians became the heroes they are today. Another good
example of this is Gun, who were recording rock-n-roll back in the
mid- to late-60's that is still pretty heavy by today's standards.
Victor
--
__________________thankstomodernchemistrysleepisnowoptional_______________
| "[I wasn't expecting] a chain-smoking, | - - - Victor Kamutzki - - - |
| coffee-swigging bearded red-head..." |- - wcs...@ccs.carleton.ca- - |
| - Nikki Cattrell | DoD#303, and I'm not telling. |
""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""""
We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.
Jimi was one of the greatest guitarist of all time. This is true.
The question why he is refered to as "over-rated", I think I have that answer.
Jimi wrote just for HIS guitar playing, and the rest of the band was just
there, not doing anything but basics. He was not a good vocalist, nor
was he a team player. He was egotistic as they come. Playing great
guitar is all he did. His writing and other interests were lacking.
*******************************************************************************
"Groovy!" - Ash "Evil Dead II : Dead By Dawn" (1987)
*******************************************************************************
"Fans are interesting things. Rush fans just can't comprehend why the
rest of the world doesn't like Rush. REM fans consider the rest of the world
beneath their social level to notice. Kate Bush fans love the rest of the
world, and the world loves them, but spend long nights plotting to knife
one another." --Richard Darwin
Richard Darwin #33, "Gradenza"
*******************************************************************************
"It's Nothing. It's just a private joke between me and whoever is going to
be my analyst." - Cary Grant "Mr. Blandings Builds His Dream House" (1948)
*******************************************************************************
v129j6ed@ubvms
The KaTeFan(tm)
Ray Charbonneau
|> HOW ABOUT THOSE ROLLING STONES
|>
|>
|> I think they are the all time most over rated band!!!!!!
|>
And of course, what about Rush?
--
Ray Charbonneau | I feel so inar-inar-inar-inar tic-u-late
rcha...@athena.mit.edu | -- Roger Taylor (Queen)
MIT and the Library Systems Office are glad that I'm posting my opinions
here so that they don't have to listen to them anymore.
We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.
>In article <1992Mar29.0...@descartes.waterloo.edu>, dg...@lambert.waterloo.edu (Dave Low) writes:
>|> HOW ABOUT THOSE ROLLING STONES
>|> I think they are the all time most over rated band!!!!!!
>And of course, what about Rush?
John Henry Bonham
>Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
ARE YOU MAD?????????
Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
Flames required! :)
Led...@wam.umd.edu
John.
"I may not be the best, but I'm sure in hell the loudest!"
Mike Mustaine
>In article <1992Mar29.1...@acsu.buffalo.edu> v129...@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.) writes:
>
I don't think he is. Are you?
>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal.
I'm sure that albums like Black Sabbath's _Paranoid_ (released in 1970, it was
their 3rd album), Deep Purple's _Machine_Head_ (1973? Anyway, that wasn't
their first, either), Aerosmith's debut (early '70's), and many others
(insert your favorite 70's hard rock group here) had no influence on today's
crop of headbangers.
>Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own.
As did every other '60's guitarist of note. Read any interview from a
musician/guitarist from that era and they'll all talk about locking themselves
up in their room and listening to the Sun and Chess records releases.
>Plant's own Voice was an instrument.
So was David Coverdale's. For that matter, so was Jon Anderson's.
> JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
I am definitely influenced by Jones' riffs. He and Bonham made a killer
rhythm section. But the only thing I've ever seen that matches in contemporary
metal is the use of a gong, and they could've gotten that from Queen as much
as from the end of "The Song Remains the Same."
>
>You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
I owned every Zep album put out, and grabbed the Immigrant Song 45 so I could
have "Hey, Hey, What Can I Do?" I owned (and still have a couple) many Zep
boots. When I went CD about 5-6 years ago, I bought 'em all again on CD.
>
>Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
>
I have one, thank you.
Bottom Line:
I think Zep are one of the most original bands ever. I love their music,
even after listening to them to death for over 10 years. But enough is
enough. They're good. But not _that_ good. They are not the raison d'etre
of rock music for the last 20 years. They've got 10 albums, and they haven't
done anything in 10 years. _I_ need more than 10 albums in my collection,
sorry.
They _are_ overrated. No one's that good.
>
>Flames required! :)
>
You got 'em. :-)
>Led...@wam.umd.edu
>John.
>
>"I may not be the best, but I'm sure in hell the loudest!"
>
Mike
--
Mike Mustaine |"...they also rip the throats out of
Starving College Student (tm) | two-bit quacks who spew psychobabble
smus...@magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu | just to hear themselves talk."
st...@cis.ohio-state.edu | - Northern Exposure
andy
Charbonneau) writes:
>In article <1992Mar200...@descartes.waterloo.edu>,
>dg...@lambert.waterloo.edu (Dave Low) writes:
>|>
>|> HOW ABOUT THOSE ROLLING STONES
>
>And of course, what about Rush?
>--
>Ray Charbonneau | I feel so inar-inar-inar-inar tic-u-late
>rcha...@athena.mit.edu | -- Roger Taylor (Queen)
>MIT and the Library Systems Office are glad that I'm posting my opinions
>here so that they don't have to listen to them anymore.
And of course, what about Queen?
ho hum ho hum ho hum. yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaawn
7 best = 3 songs = 10 overrated
haven't we been through this a million times tooooo many already?
--
_____ _____ _____ _____ ____ _____ I'm... too stoned to sing this song,
__|_____|_____|_____|_____| __ |_____|_____ too stoned to sing this song,
|_____|_____|_____|_____|__|=\/=|__|_____|__ __ dazed and confuzed for so long.
___|_ah...@isis.cs.du.edu_|____|_____|_____|_____|___ -friend of a friend
Gerald Sylvester
>>Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
>^^^^^^^^^^^^
>ARE YOU MAD?????????
>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers
>
>Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
>
>
>Flames required! :)
I used to be a huge Led Zep fan so it is not as though I not familiar
with them. Led Zeppelin was an incredible and very influential band but
I definitely thought they were overrated. Maybe not to be on the TEN MOST
List but they were overrated. They were also a bunch of drug addicted,
immature musicians who were treated like gods. Of all th bootlegs I have
heard from them, they were all stoned off their as* and could barely play
(much less probably stand up) on all them. Even on records, there is
sloppy playing. Yea, they were a great band and don't deserve to be the
LIST but they were and still are overrated.
Hey everyone, watch what you say about Zep, you might offend someone. 8-)
Gerald Sylvester
Stephen Swann
Well, I really shouldn't do this, but it was just too good to resist.
>>Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
>^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>ARE YOU MAD?????????
<whoever posted that> might be. But it just might be a lunatic we're
looking for... ;-)
>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal.
Which is basically a correct comment, leaving aside for a moment the
fact that it's wrong.
>Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own.
Jimmy Page borrowed riffs and didn't give them back. They're way overdue
at the library.
>Plant's own Voice was an instrument.
Of torture.
>JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time,
What a multi-talented fellow. He's my favorite member of Zep though,
because I can almost never hear him.
> and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
How did he get in there, did the two of them eat his body?
>You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
>
Well, I own 5 Zeppelin albums, and I have heard all the others. In fact,
since Zeppelin still gets more airplay than any current band, I think I
have pretty much been Zeppelin-saturated since I was 16 (that's 9 years,
if anybody's counting).
>Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
>
For the humor impaired :-) :-)
As Herakles reputedly said to a Centaur, "Get down off your high horse".
--
Steve Swann | Speak to me in many voices; make
sw...@acsu.buffalo.edu | them all sound like one... -BOC
Stephen C. Miller
Milli Vanilli!!!
--
--------------------
=Steve Miller (oracular priest) stcm...@copper.ucs.indiana.edu
OOOOh bigol jetairliner. Dontcarry metoo faraway. Ooooh bigol
jetairliner. Causeits herethat Igot tostay. Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah.
We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.
>In article <1992Mar29.1...@acsu.buffalo.edu> v129...@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.) writes:
>>Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
>^^^^^^^^^^^^
>ARE YOU MAD?????????
Some have claimed........
>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
No. They were the first band to make alot of money from it.
They are far from being the first heavy metal band.
Black Sabbath has that title.
>You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
I hear it every day at least 3 songs.
The stations in Buffalo play little else.
>Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
With a commendation like that, you think I will listen to your side
seriously?
>"I may not be the best, but I'm sure in hell the loudest!"
Far from it.
Mark McKinzie
>In article <1992Mar29....@wam.umd.edu>, led...@wam.umd.edu (John Henry Bonham) writes...
>>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
>No. They were the first band to make alot of money from it.
>They are far from being the first heavy metal band.
>Black Sabbath has that title.
Hmmm. So just who *IS* the first heavy metal band?
Nominees: 1. LZep. simply because the media thinks so.
2. BlSabs. Certainly heavier that #1, although they
don't pre-date #1.
3. Cream. heavy enough at times to rate as heavy, and
precede BS and LZ.
4. Steppenwolf. on syntactic reasons alone.
5. Megadeth. on semantic reasons alone.
Send your votes to musi...@math.wisc.edu , and I'm
sure he'd LOVE to tabulate the responses!
--
Mark McKinzie | Tra la la, Tra la la la, Tra la la la la la la la
mcki...@math.wisc.edu | -The Banana Splits, 1968-
UW Dept. of Mathematics | Oy oi oi, Oy yoi oi oi, Oy oi oi oi oi oi oi oi
Madison, WI 53706 | -Bob Marley, 1974-
92S00302
You left out one band often credited with being the first
heavy metal band.
Uriah Heep
I'm not sure when their first album was but I think it was around 1968
which would pre-date Led Zepplin(1969) or at least tie them.
-Ken
dis...@jetson.uh.edu
Don Becker
>In article <1992Mar29....@wam.umd.edu>, led...@wam.umd.edu (John Henry Bonham) writes...
>>In article <1992Mar29.1...@acsu.buffalo.edu> v129...@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.) writes:
>>>Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
>>^^^^^^^^^^^^
>>ARE YOU MAD?????????
>Some have claimed........
No comment, even though I do know this man.
>>Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two best of drummers.....
>No. They were the first band to make alot of money from it.
>They are far from being the first heavy metal band.
>Black Sabbath has that title.
Agreed. Zep may have claimed to be the influence for the majority of metal
bands, but the dark elements that most metal songs have came fron BLACK
SABBATH, not Led Zeppelin.
>>You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
I've listened to too much. When I was 16, I thought Zeppelin was the greatest.
Then I broadened my horizons and listened to Pink Floyd, and recently Yes. Now,
Led Zeppelin is nowhere in my personal top 10. Why? They didn't come up with
anything innovative. They're a good group, but they are hardly the gods people
(such as the original poster -- what else would you expect with a userid like
'ledzep' and a personal name like John Henry Bonham?) make them out to be.
I would have to say right now that Led Zeppelin is the most overrated rock
group ever, followed closely by Bruce Springsteen.
--
/ Don Becker at the University at Buffalo -- Any comments? Post or mail 'em \
| Internet: v112...@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu BITNET: v112...@ubvms.BITNET |
| Unix: bec...@acsu.buffalo.edu Voice: (716) 636-4339 On IRC: BillZeCat |
\ "The pain of war cannot exceed the woe of aftermath." -- Led Zeppelin /
U36...@uicvm.uic.edu
rr
Mr. Scott Hannon; PHYS (GRAD)
>Jimi was one of the greatest guitarist of all time. This is true.
>The question why he is refered to as "over-rated", I think I have that answer.
>Jimi wrote just for HIS guitar playing, and the rest of the band was just
>there, not doing anything but basics. He was not a good vocalist, nor
>was he a team player. He was egotistic as they come. Playing great
>guitar is all he did. His writing and other interests were lacking.
OK. I guess I just don't share your opinions on Jimis song writting and
singing. Its true songs like _Fire_ and _Foxey Lady_ and some others
are "fluff"-type songs, and some of his others are amazingly sappy
(_May This Be Love [Waterfall]_ for instance), but he did write quite a
few good ones as well (and he didn't write many songs before dying). Certainly
songs like _Castles Made Of Sand_ and _Wind Cries Mary_ feature both
good singing and lyrics. As do many of his others.
And while I agree very much with Jimis music being guitar oriented to the
point of distraction, I'm amazed you can consider Mitchs drum playing
as basic. If anything, he is frequently wild to the point of being sloppy
and off beat (_Purple Haze_, _Fire_, etc...). He is one of my favorites
precisely because he is so non-basic.
As for Noels bass playing...you're right, pretty basic on records. Live
could be a whole other story!
PS there is a Hendrix mailing list. If interested, send e-mail to
hey-joe...@ms.uky.edu
Scott.
--
Scott Hannon, Mon Mar 30 1992 (han...@umbc4.umbc.edu)
John Morgan Morris
>In a previous article v129j6ed@ubvms writes...
>>Jimi was one of the greatest guitarist of all time. This is true.
>>The question why he is refered to as "over-rated", I think I have that answer.
>>Jimi wrote just for HIS guitar playing, and the rest of the band was just
>>there, not doing anything but basics. He was not a good vocalist, nor
>>was he a team player. He was egotistic as they come. Playing great
>>guitar is all he did. His writing and other interests were lacking.
>OK. I guess I just don't share your opinions on Jimis song writting and
>singing. Its true songs like _Fire_ and _Foxey Lady_ and some others
>are "fluff"-type songs, and some of his others are amazingly sappy
>(_May This Be Love [Waterfall]_ for instance), but he did write quite a
>few good ones as well (and he didn't write many songs before dying). Certainly
>songs like _Castles Made Of Sand_ and _Wind Cries Mary_ feature both
>good singing and lyrics. As do many of his others.
Hendrix *wanted* the other musicians to contribute to the songs, which
explains his frustrations with Noel Redding, since he often had to tell
Noel (a guitarist-turned-bassist) what to play. Hendrix was also
frustrated with Buddy Miles in Band of Gypsies for the same reason. I
personally believe that he would have formed a bigger band with better
musicians had he lived. (He spoke of this in the weeks before his death
when Billy Cox was unable to continue playing.)
Hendrix was not egotistical in any way imaginable. He had an incredible
imagination, and wanted the songs he imagined to make their way to records.
He was often frustrated by his own inability to do this, particularly his
singing. He hated the way that he sang. He often turned his back to everyone
else in the studio, or even hid himself away in a room where noone else could
see him. In the video for the Isle of Wight festival, I noticed that he started
"Voodoo Chile" and sang the first line way off key. He got a disgusted look on
his face, played guitar through the verse, and started over singing.
He was rarely ever happy with his singing, but it's hard to imagine someone
else singing the songs -- a lot would be lost.
He was extremely capable of being a team player, or else he never would
have backed up Little Richard, the Isley Brothers, etc. in the early
1960's.
I have a hard time believing the statements that his writing was lacking.
I've heard several songwriters state that Hendrix was a big influence, and
compositionally several jazz performers have been interested in his songs,
particularly Gil Evans.
No way was Hendrix over-rated. He has influenced nearly everyone who has
picked up an electric guitar since...
Later,
Morgan
--
John Morgan Morris
Department of Mathematics and Computer Science
Georgia State University
Atlanta, GA. 30303-3083
mat...@gsusgi1.gsu.edu
(404) 651-2253
John Becker
) Hey you rock-n-roll fans out there, I read this article in REQUEST magazine,
) and saved it. So now I'm posting it so you all can read it and see what you
) think.
) It was on page 16 in REQUEST magazine. Author of the article: Jim DeRogatis
) I'm not sure what the date of the magazine is but it's in late 1991. Enjoy.
) Hal
Actually, this article is great proof of my long-held contention that REQUEST
magazine is about the biggest joke in the world of music magazines! It's so
bad that even the people who work for Musicland/Sam Goody are embarrassed by
it. (For those who don't know, REQUEST magazine is published by Musicland/Sam
Goody.)
It makes absolutely no sense to me that they publish this kind of crap. They
are presumably in the business of selling tapes and CDs, and trying to make a
profit doing it right? So they repeatedly publish articles that rip into many
well-established and successful artists. What effect does this have? Well,
for me, when they rip up somebody I like, it encourages me to take my
business elsewhere. And if they rip up somebody that I don't know anything
about, if I believe their review I sure won't buy anything by that artist.
Seems to me that they have a few things to learn about business! Objective
criticism is one thing, but when you ridicule a multi-platinum-selling artist
like any of the 10 on this list, you just end up looking like a f...ing
idiot, IMHO.
John
Mathew A. Hennessy
How about the MC5?
--
+-------======++> Sen~or Biggles is henn...@acsu.buffalo.edu <++=====--------+
| "There's only one thing left for me to do, and that's | Mathew Hennessy |
| to ding-a-ding dang my dang-a-long ling long!" | M-x insert-disclaimer |
| - Ministry | |
Walker Aumann
>In article <1992Mar30.0...@schaefer.math.wisc.edu>, musi...@math.wisc.edu writes...
>>v129...@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu (We dont play old music or new music. We play U2 music.) writes:
>>
>>Hmmm. So just who *IS* the first heavy metal band?
>>
>>Nominees: 1. LZep. simply because the media thinks so.
>> 2. BlSabs. Certainly heavier that #1, although they
>> don't pre-date #1.
>> 3. Cream. heavy enough at times to rate as heavy, and
>> precede BS and LZ.
>> 4. Steppenwolf. on syntactic reasons alone.
>> 5. Megadeth. on semantic reasons alone.
>>
>>Send your votes to musi...@math.wisc.edu , and I'm
>>sure he'd LOVE to tabulate the responses!
>>
> You left out one band often credited with being the first
>heavy metal band.
>Uriah Heep
>I'm not sure when their first album was but I think it was around 1968
>which would pre-date Led Zepplin(1969) or at least tie them.
>-Ken
>dis...@jetson.uh.edu
I've also heard the beginning of the term at least contributed to Blue Cheer.
Don't know much more about it than that, though (from _The_Rolling_Stone_ a
few years ago, I think).
Walker
Norm
of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
This band is only popular because they look good on TV.
Man on a Mission
>
> Milli Vanilli!!!
Sorry, they're not an overrated band.
Heck, they werent' even a band.
Where's my rifle? AAAHH Shoot it shoot it it's a lipsync
--
"And please bless Grandma, and Grampa..." ,----------- Ron A. Echeverri
"...And please, give me a million dollars, | BSAE 1994 Univ. of So. Cal.
and, *chuckle* oh yeah, huge pectoral muscles." `---------------\ MUDaholic
- Ren and Stimpy, "The Littlest Giant" \___________
Man on a Mission
>...and then there was Supertramp. The ONLY good song they did was "School".
HA! (it embitters me that the only mention of Supertramp in this group besides
my own is a downer :-)
The Logical Song, Breakfast in America, Give a Little Bit, Crime of the
Century, Fool's Overture and MANY more. Especially Fool's Overture, my personal
fav, it's just an epic. School is a good song. But it's not the ONLY good song
Is there a Supertramp mailing list out there?
Aron Gamman
> In article <1992Mar29.1...@acsu.buffalo.edu> v129...@ubvmsd.cc.buffa
> >Led Zepplin is an obvious choice.
> ^^^^^^^^^^^^
>
>
> ARE YOU MAD?????????
> Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs an
>
> You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
Ok, I'll be blunt...
Aren't you dead?
(:
This is from
th...@bluemoon.rn.com
who doesn't have their own obnoxious signature yet
soren--Ms. Jackson if you're nasty
> Milli Vanilli!!!
This thread might be improved if more of the contributors knew what
"overrated" meant.
Milli Vanilli was never overrated.
--
"Tell me, who *hasn't* felt close to the edge and down by the river"
soren f petersen : i AM NOT : --Andy Whitman
spet...@peruvian.utah.edu : THE university OF utah :
"How could I dance with another/When I saw him standing there" --Tiffany
Victor Kamutzki
> How about the MC5?
Or for that matter, how about Blue Cheer?
Craig Burley
Because no matter how good they are, were, or will be,...
...they can't POSSIBLY be as good as I think they are!
Other overrated rock bands I know: Alice Cooper, Gentle Giant, Brand X (rock?
well, maybe), Tangerine Dream (yes, they used to be considered rock),
Renaissance.
Sure I _can_ be objective, but I _enjoy_ being subjective when it comes to
things I like! (E.g. most overrated wife: mine! Even _she_ admits she can't
be nearly as wonderful as I think she is. :-)
--
James Craig Burley, Software Craftsperson bur...@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Member of the League for Programming Freedom (LPF)
George Robbins
> In article <12...@umd5.umd.edu> ap...@linus.umd.edu (CMSC 330) writes:
> ) Hey you rock-n-roll fans out there, I read this article in REQUEST magazine,
> ) and saved it. So now I'm posting it so you all can read it and see what you
> ) think.
> ) It was on page 16 in REQUEST magazine. Author of the article: Jim DeRogatis
> ) I'm not sure what the date of the magazine is but it's in late 1991. Enjoy.
>
> magazine is about the biggest joke in the world of music magazines! It's so
> bad that even the people who work for Musicland/Sam Goody are embarrassed by
> it. (For those who don't know, REQUEST magazine is published by Musicland/Sam
> Goody.)
>
> It makes absolutely no sense to me that they publish this kind of crap. They
> are presumably in the business of selling tapes and CDs, and trying to make a
> profit doing it right? So they repeatedly publish articles that rip into many
> well-established and successful artists. What effect does this have? Well,
> for me, when they rip up somebody I like, it encourages me to take my
> business elsewhere. And if they rip up somebody that I don't know anything
> about, if I believe their review I sure won't buy anything by that artist.
Well, I suspect it's to provide the illusion that the prople who write/publish
the magazine have some degree of independence, even though it's bought and paid
for by the outlet. If they limited themselves to saying everything new is just
great and you should by a copy, who would bother? It's pretty safe to criticize
the top historical groups, people are going to buy them anyway. Likewise at
least a few new releases are born for the cutout bin, little harm in taking a
whack at them.
In the case of the most 10 overrated, I suspect is some of this, plus an attempt
to poke a little fun at the sacred - some of the most popular groups really
don't have that much that objectively justifies their standings, just that they
had the right music at the right time, a good record and a lot of airplay. If
you read the listing, it's pretty obvious that it's at least partly tongue in
cheek anyway.
Are you sure you disagree with the list? It's amusing that while I'll admit
that all the groups/performers mentioned are "great", the only one that
consistantly gets any airtime on my CD player is Clapton.
The real value of such a magazine is where it can tell you enough about some
music that you are not really familiar with to aid in making a decision. Given
the limited programming flexibility of todays radio formats, this has to be an
improvement over making a decision based on the cover art. Request isn't all
that bad in this role, and since it's free...
more abuse follows:
> ===============================================================================
> THE TEN MOST OVERRATED ROCK BANDS EVER
> Rock critics are always complaining...
> 1. ERIC CLAPTON: What Cream passed off as improvisation was just indulgent
> wanking, plain and simple. If this Michelob salesman is
> God, it's a good argument for atheism.
How many times can you listen to Wheels of Fire? At least his "proving God
can't sing" later day stuff has interesting lyrics and musical variety.
> 2. THE WHO: Roger Daltrey? Get serious.
Who cares about the who?
> 3. THE DOORS: Sure Jim Morrison was a great poet. Inspirational verse:
> "Dead cat in a top hat/Thinks he's an aristocrat/That's crap."
Better the second time around, but is is the music or nostalgia?
> 4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
I've never been motivated by buy any albums, ok in small doses.
> 5. BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN: He started believing he was the working man's Dylan
> sometime after 'Darkness on the Edge of Town', but
> it didn't stop him from firing his band. He's boring
> and pretentious, and I'm allowed to say it 'cause I'm
> from Jersey.
Springsteen, yeech. And I first saw him in '74 when he was still playing
$2 shows at local community colleges and probably bars for all I know...
> 6. THE BAND: Has anyone ever stayed awake through 'The Last Waltz'? If you
> hired this Band to play for your wedding, the guests would
> leave before dinner.
Music from Big Pink was cool, but do you have any idea how long ago that was?
> 7. CREEDENCE CLEARWATER REVIVAL: So what if they were a good bar band. They
> doomed us to an eternity of "Proud Mary"
> covers.
Sadly, some of the bar bands do better covers than the recorded performances.
> 8. CROSBY, STILLS, & NASH: Even the great Neil Young couldn't redeem these
> sorry yodelers.
Anything good since Deja Vu?
> 9. STEVE WINDWOOD: He may be able to play 43 different instruments, but he
> still sounds like a Holiday Inn lounge act.
Remember any of his solo work except "Arc of the Diver"?
> 10. FRANK ZAPPA: Classical fart with punk pretensions.
Heh, heh, heh...
> THE RUNNERS-UP: The Police/Sting; George Harrison; Fleetwood Mac; Elvis
> Costello; and almost every band California ever produced,
> especially the Eagles.
Especially the Eagles, with Police and Sting close behind... 8-)
--
George Robbins - now working for, uucp: {uunet|pyramid|rutgers}!cbmvax!grr
but no way officially representing: domain: g...@cbmvax.commodore.com
Commodore, Engineering Department phone: 215-431-9349 (only by moonlite)
Michael Silverman
>And of course, what about Rush?
Do you have any reasons for thinking Rush is an overrated band (if so,
share them with the net) or are you another mindless Rush-flamer!
If you actually have reasons, myself (and most Rush fans, I am sure)
will respect you, but one-line posts like that don't present a very good
picture of yourself to us.
--
__o cub...@buhub.bradley.edu Mike Silverman
_ \<,_
(*)/ (*)
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
"You can do a lot in a lifetime / If you don't burn out too fast
You can make the most of the distance / First you need endurance
First you've got to last..." - Neil Peart, RUSH
Andrew Brezinski
> THE TEN MOST OVERRATED ROCK BANDS EVER
>
>
All this tells me is that I don't agree with this guy's opinions about
overrated bands and would therefore probably not read REQUEST magazine.
I will say that I agree with some if the list and totally disagree with
the rest of the list. The reason I disagree is because the ones he
considers overrated but I don't are bands that I never hear people saying,
for example, "CCR are GOD."
Andy Brezinski
Intergraph Corporation
Huntsville, AL 35894-0001
U51...@uicvm.uic.edu
v129...@ubvmsd.cc.buffalo.edu (We dont play old music or new music. We play U2
music.) says:
>
>In article <1992Mar29.1...@athena.mit.edu>, rcha...@athena.mit.edu y
>(Ra
>Charbonneau) writes...
>>In article <1992Mar29.0...@descartes.waterloo.edu>,>>|> I think they are the all time most over rated band!!!!!!
>>And of course, what about Rush?
>
can't even spell it right. Led Zeppelin has changed the music scene forever.
Other than that, I agree about all the other overrated bands, especially
Hendrix and Rush.
>******************************************************************************
Jeffrey Samuel Finn
While I CAN see why you think that the Police are an overrated band (I
don't, tho. They're my favorite ever) I don't see how you can say
that sting is over-rated. His works are truely original and he is a
great entertainer, as well as songwriter and musician.
JeFFFiNN
------------------
If I knew what I was doing, why did I Choose 4 more years of School???
William J. Heights FOREVER!!!!!!!
Christopher Meyer (Fax Department)
>
> Hal
>===============================================================================
>
> THE TEN MOST OVERRATED ROCK BANDS EVER
>
> wanking, plain and simple. If this Michelob salesman is
> God, it's a good argument for atheism.
I dunno, that's a little harsh...
>
>2. THE WHO: Roger Daltrey? Get serious.
Ok, I'll give 'em that one. But I'm not really the greatest judge of the
Who. (I only really like two songs).
>
>3. THE DOORS: Sure Jim Morrison was a great poet. Inspirational verse:
> "Dead cat in a top hat/Thinks he's an aristocrat/That's crap."
Yep, I have to admit, I "strongly dislike" the Doors. I'm
also having trouble with such timeless prose "Come on baby, light my fire."
Oh, come on...
>
>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
Wait, hold your fire (apologies to the HYF thread and Rush). The guy might
have been a little wacked out now and then, but he was something else...
>
>5. BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN: He started believing he was the working man's Dylan
> sometime after 'Darkness on the Edge of Town', but
> it didn't stop him from firing his band. He's boring
> and pretentious, and I'm allowed to say it 'cause I'm
> from Jersey.
Well, I sorta like him. Unpretentious (sp?), y'know?
(BANDS I REALLY COULDN'T JUDGE DELETED)
>
>9. STEVE WINDWOOD: He may be able to play 43 different instruments, but he
> still sounds like a Holiday Inn lounge act.
Maybe, but you gotta admit, it's the best of Holiday Inn...
>
>10. FRANK ZAPPA: Classical fart with punk pretensions.
>
Ha, ha, ha...
>
>THE RUNNERS-UP: The Police/Sting; George Harrison; Fleetwood Mac; Elvis
> Costello; and almost every band California ever produced,
> especially the Eagles.
>===============================================================================
Yeah, I can see the deserved criticism of the Police and the
Eagles, but ELVIS COSTELLO??? I'm hardly a fan of his, but that guy's
about as overrated as...as...well, let's just say he is NOT overrated.
thanks for your time,
chris
SHAILESH CHINCHALKAR
Whatever you say about Rolling Stones, Rush and Led Zeppelin(how dare you?)
I am sure about one thing......
"PINK FLOYD" CAN NOT BE THE OVERRATED BAND ANY TIME.
David Roger Foss
I am not the original poster, but I may be able to answer this.
Too many people are confusing "overrated" with "poor quality".
I myself think Rush is overrated not because they are bad. They aren't
bad at all. Its just that so many people look to these guys as "Gods".
They get violently defensive when anyone expresses an unfavorable
opinion about the band. I mean, no band is _that_ good.
That's why these discussions are kind of pointless, a band may be really
good but still overrated.
I hope this is better than a one-line blurb.
David Foss
U19...@uicvm.uic.edu
says:
>
>In article <1992Mar29.1...@bronze.ucs.indiana.edu> "Stephen C. Miller"
><stcm...@copper.ucs.indiana.edu> writes:
>>
>> Milli Vanilli!!!
>Sorry, they're not an overrated band.
>Heck, they werent' even a band.
>Where's my rifle? AAAHH Shoot it shoot it it's a lipsync
Shoot it? Bah. Leave it there for posterity so they can't get a job in the
entertainment biz ever again. Now THAT's revenge.
** Chris Krolczyk,esq. * DISCLAIMER: My opinions are in **
** Maniac-at-Large * no way endorsed by the Univer- **
** U19...@UICVM.BITNET * sity of Illinois at Chicago. **
** u19...@uicvm.uic.edu * So there. Nyaah. **
U19...@uicvm.uic.edu
>Well for my .02, I think that GNR is far and away the most overated band
>of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
>got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
>from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
GnR is a surrogate for Bon Scott-era AC/DC primarily aimed at MTV dorks
who missed the _real_ thing the first time around. More below the belt I
cannot get.
>This band is only popular because they look good on TV.
...in comparison to a car crash,maybe,but so what?
Walker Aumann
>Well for my .02, I think that GNR is far and away the most overated band
>of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
>got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
>from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
And how many other bands were like this at the time? Granted, this is what the
LA metal scene looked like at the time, but they were the first to make it.
Faster Pussycat, L.A. Guns, etc. all hit afterwards. I'm not saying that
GN'R is God's gift to rock 'n' roll, but they are a pretty good band. It's not
their fault that most everyone coming out of LA since then has made them cliche.
I'm not sure if it's still true now, but during the first 3-6 months, I'd say
that the Doors were the most overrated band (given the sudden surge in
popularity that accompanied the movie). Another good candidate would be the
Grateful Dead (at least around here).
Walker
Jeff Wilson
<1992Mar30.0...@acsu.buffalo.edu>
<1992Mar30....@acsu.buffalo.edu>
The Velvet Underground
The Doors
Bob Dylan (I *know*, he's not a band, he's just overrated.)
Boston
Jefferson Airplane-Starship
Some incarnations of Yes.
Springsteen
U2
Steve Miller
and the # 1 overrated band of all time . . .
CROSBY STILLS AND NASH!
--
jwi...@ncratl.atlantaga.ncr.com (Jeff Wilson)
"BEANS!"
Matthew R Hodges
>
>don't, tho. They're my favorite ever) I don't see how you can say
>that sting is over-rated. His works are truely original and he is a
Hahahahahahahaha, Sting is the only musician I know to quote himself in
his own songs. This is by far from original.
matt
Gerald Sylvester
If GNR is not the most overrated (I couldn't say b/c I don't listen to them),
they are definitely the most immature band. Axl(sp?) Rose makes me sick.
How can anyone show up an hour and a half, two or three hours
late to their own concert? How can anyone jump into an audience to go
after someone who "the guards were beating up" or because "they were
taking illegal pictures" from the the 20th row. Lets see, 20th row....
if each row is 2 1/2 feet (sorry about the non-metric) wide and there
is a 8 foot barrier between the stage and front row, that makes the
person at least 58 feet away from the stage. I have taken pictures when
I was less than 7 or 8 feet away and most of the time it is practically
shear (sp?) luck that you get more than a quarter of them coming out
acceptable (this is not just me by the way). If you are 58 feet away
you are going to have to sneak in a 600 mm/f4 lens which is 3 feet long (?).
Tell me how you are going to sneak that in? Even if a person did get it
in, from that far back you will *NEVER* get anything that is worth while.
But, then again, it is worth trashing a brand new arena, isn't it? I
think it is time for Axl Rose/ GNR to grow up.
Gerald Sylvester
KE...@cunyvm.bitnet
respond and expose the others to low iq bullshit.
if you feel the urge to start a war, go get your manupilative devices and
have some fun,and netlife will be better for all of us.
if you have problems with someone else's opinions,then go hump a horse or
depending on your sex go get humped by a horse.(get the point yet becker).
now some of you will just die, if you don't get to reply to this message-
then just die. if you feel you just have to get the last word in- note
i will not reply,i will let you win.
pissed off at the
world,
kenny.
the greatest band of the 90's- guns'n'roses
*******************************************************************************
...........anarchy,anarchy,anarchy,anarchy,anarchy,anarchy....................
*******************************************************************************
Jeffrey Samuel Finn
>Hahahahahahahaha, Sting is the only musician I know to quote himself in
>his own songs. This is by far from original.
Well, if he's the only musician that does it, then it IS original
Gerald Sylvester
> How can you say Zeppelin is overrated?! What do you know about Zeppelin, you
> can't even spell it right. Led Zeppelin has changed the music scene forever.
>Other than that, I agree about all the other overrated bands, especially
>Hendrix and Rush.
Boy, is that a contradiction. I am not even a big or for that matter
a minor Hendrix fan and I have to point this out. Most (or many, many)
guitarists list Hendrix as a major influence or at least many guitarists
influences had Hendrix as a major influence. I do not know of anyone
who has not said Hendrix was not a major influence (but I am sure
this group can find a few 8-) ). Now Rush is another story. Most
people will contend that they are ok/good/very good/excellent band
but not that very influential. Maybe influential to a few but not
enough to cause a minor revelution like Hendrix did.
Gerald Sylvester
Ray Charbonneau
|> rcha...@athena.mit.edu (Ray Charbonneau) writes:
|>
|> >And of course, what about Rush?
|>
|> Do you have any reasons for thinking Rush is an overrated band (if so,
|> share them with the net) or are you another mindless Rush-flamer!
|>
|> If you actually have reasons, myself (and most Rush fans, I am sure)
|> will respect you, but one-line posts like that don't present a very good
|> picture of yourself to us.
I actually have reasons, I don't expect anyone to really care what they are, and
I really don't care what you think. As if my reasons would convince a
net.rush.fan that he was wrong to like them...
Why are Rush-fans so defensive?
I really shouldn't post this, but...:)
--
Ray Charbonneau | I feel so inar-inar-inar-inar tic-u-late
rcha...@athena.mit.edu | -- Roger Taylor (Queen)
MIT and the Library Systems Office are glad that I'm posting my opinions
here so that they don't have to listen to them anymore.
U36...@uicvm.uic.edu
THREADS EVER?! This would actually come in at #11.
Just kidding.
rr
Paul Mather
> Jimi was one of the greatest guitarist of all time. This is true.
> The question why he is refered to as "over-rated", I think I have that answer.
> Jimi wrote just for HIS guitar playing, and the rest of the band was just
> there, not doing anything but basics. He was not a good vocalist, nor
> was he a team player. He was egotistic as they come.
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Upon what evidence do you base this statement? I have recently
finished reading the mammoth biography of Jimi by Shapiro and Glebbeek
entitled JIMI HENDRIX: ELECTRIC GYPSY (recommended reading, BTW) and,
if anything, Jimi-in-real-life as opposed to Jimi-up-on-the-stage
was a very shy and retiring person. Most of his contemporaries will
attest to this.
Jimi was certainly very uncompromising in his attitude towards his music.
If that is being egotistic, then I'd counter that all serious musicians
with an interest in creating their own unique sound are "egotistic."
As for the rest of the band being "just there, not doing anything but
basics", I think you do Mitch Mitchell (Experience drummer) a massive
disservice. Many feel that the Jimi/Mitch combination produced much
of the magic of the Experience, something that was lacking when Jimi
parted ways during his "Band of Gypsys" period. (Jimi himself admitted
the value of Mitch to the synergy of the live performance.) Equally,
many admit that Noel Redding was a much better Experience bassist than
Billy Cox, and a very solid foundation from which Jimi and Mitch
could launch their wild improvisational forays.
Cheers,
Paul.
--
e-mail: p.ma...@sees.bangor.ac.uk
If your mailer can't reach me, I'm obviously not worth talking to.
U19...@uicvm.uic.edu
>if anyone reads something on the net, why do they feel that they have to
>respond and expose the others to low iq bullshit.
Well,that's fine sentiment,but if you're worried about "low iq (sic) bullshit",
why do we get _this_ following statement?:
>if you have problems with someone else's opinions,then go hump a horse or
>depending on your sex go get humped by a horse.(get the point yet becker).
>now some of you will just die, if you don't get to reply to this message-
>then just die. if you feel you just have to get the last word in- note
>i will not reply,i will let you win.
Kinda sounds "low IQ bullshit" to _me_,Kenny.....
>the greatest band of the 90's- guns'n'roses
Ah,the hidden agenda. What a cutting-edge argument you have here,Kenny.
John Fereira
|From: mode...@iastate.edu (Matthew R Hodges)
|
|>Hahahahahahahaha, Sting is the only musician I know to quote himself in
|>his own songs. This is by far from original.
|
|Well, if he's the only musician that does it, then it IS original
like most of their songs talked about themselves. Oh, that's right we're
talking about musicians.
--
+=============================================================================+
| John Fereira Al Bundy for President
| jo...@auspex.com "He's as good as the next guy" |
+=============================================================================+
Martin-Martin Nike
>of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
>got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
>from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
>
And they are just a rip off from spinal tap.
--
/\/\artin-/\/\artin Nike, Coventry Polytechnic, England.
JANET:cmg...@uk.ac.coventry
INET:cmg996%coventr...@nsfnet-relay.ac.uk
"Just like margarine our name is spreading.." - Fairport Convention
Michael Silverman
>Why are Rush-fans so defensive?
Because, with the exception of "bands" like Millie Vanilli and NKOtB,
Rush is the most attacked band on the net. If people keep attacking you,
you tend to get defensive!
jlwo...@eos.ncsu.edu
with the fact that they are "Overrated". When deciding if a band
is overrated, one must consider the bands influence and think of
reasons why the band was/is popular. Led Zeppelin brought us
Heavy Metal. They may have not been the FIRST, but they brought
it to us. Nirvana cannot be overrated because they have brought
"punk" (or at least, some form of punk) into the mainstream.
To give a band "Overrated" status, we must consider bands who
are popular for no apparent reason. Gn'R is out. Remember when
they first came around? We hadn't seen much like that on our
MTV yet, had we? Of course, Gn'R doesn't offer much anymore, which
is why they will die soon. Typically, a band that is overrated would
be a band that people listen to merely because everyone else is, but
offers us nothing new or exciting. New Kids come to mind.
I think it is better to discuss "Underrated" bands. Bands that
DO bring us new and challenging music on a consistent basis, but never
really hitting the ten - million mark. Could Rush be underrated?
How about Yes? Marillion (definately) King's X?
Jeff
jlwo...@eos.ncsu.edu
WHAT? Dave Mustaine formed MegaDeath after his boot from Metallica!
Mark McKinzie
>>5. Megadeth. on semantic reasons alone
>WHAT? Dave Mustaine formed MegaDeath after his boot from Metallica!
And Ritchie Blackmore formed Deep Purple after his boot from the Outlaws.
(I believe the comparison is apt.)
--
Mark McKinzie | Tra la la, Tra la la la, Tra la la la la la la la
mcki...@math.wisc.edu | -The Banana Splits, 1968-
UW Dept. of Mathematics | Oy oi oi, Oy yoi oi oi, Oy oi oi oi oi oi oi oi
Madison, WI 53706 | -Bob Marley, 1974-
Joseph M Goodwin
mistaken they pre-date all the others.
Mike Goodwin
John Becker
)In article <1992Mar30.1...@lmpsbbs.mot.com> bec...@areaplg2.corp.mot.com (John Becker) writes:
)> Actually, this article is great proof of my long-held contention that REQUEST
)> magazine is about the biggest joke in the world of music magazines!
)
)Well, I suspect it's to provide the illusion that the prople who write/publish
)the magazine have some degree of independence, even though it's bought and paid
)for by the outlet.
)
)In the case of the most 10 overrated, I suspect is some of this, plus an attempt
)to poke a little fun at the sacred
)
)Are you sure you disagree with the list?
Actually, I don't 100% disagree with it, but I think more than half of them
don't deserve to be there. I think you're right about the attempt to poke fun
at the sacred etc. Well, who gets the last laugh? Most of these guys are
rolling in dough from royalties, even if they aren't making new records.
Just for fun, I'll poke some fun at a few others:
(Pretend this is April 1st; the following is NOT my real opinion)
THE 10 ABSOLUTE GOD-AWFUL WORST MUSICIANS OF ALL-TIME:
1. U2
2. R.E.M.
3. Pink Floyd
4. Led Zeppelin
5. Grateful Dead
6. Nirvana
7. Sinead O'Connor
8. Beatles
9. Rolling Stones
10. Guns 'N' Roses
OK, would I have managed to offend just about everybody if I had published
this in REQUEST magazine, or maybe SPIN???
In case you missed the point, it is this: If I like The Doors, then for me
they're a good group. If you like U2, then for you they're a good group. What
qualifications does this bozo who writes for REQUEST magazine have to tell us
who is good and who isn't? Are those of us who have bought tapes and CDs
by artists on these lists, and enjoyed them, and told our friends so they
bought them too, stupid or something? That's what Mr. REQUEST music critic is
essentially saying. I say to hell with critics! I'll damn well listen to what
I like, and you should too!
Rock on, people!
John
Daniel Lane Edelen
>The Velvet Underground
>The Doors
>Bob Dylan (I *know*, he's not a band, he's just overrated.)
>Boston
>Jefferson Airplane-Starship
>Some incarnations of Yes.
>Springsteen
>U2
>Steve Miller
>and the # 1 overrated band of all time . . .
>
>CROSBY STILLS AND NASH!
>
For the most part a good list. Boston is overrated, but they still have that
great sound, so I tend to disagree.
My own list:
The Rolling Stones - Haven't had a decent song in twenty years.
John Lennon -Apart from the Beatles he made painfully dull music.
Madonna - 'Nuff said.
Public Enemy, NWA, all rap music, etc. - Hey, the joke's on us and it ain't
funny.
Lou Reed - Does this guy actually sing?
GnR - Of course. Axl Rose sings like a cat being strangled.
Motley Crue, Poison, and other Metal Glam Bands -The first up against the
wall when the revolution comes.
The Who - Lets not be fooled again.
Eric Clapton - Hit or miss performer. Mostly misses in the last twenty years.
Bad Company - Really bad.
The Eagles - Nice sound. Limp music.
Jethro Tull - One decent album a long time ago.
Steve Vai, Yngwie Malmsteen - Where's the melody?
Actually, you could probably lump most of today's music in that last group.
Rap music's rise had lead to the death of the melody line. Can you hum
anything anymore as you walk to work or school? We are in a pretty sad state
of affairs.
Dan
--
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Daniel Lane Edelen @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ dled...@david.wheaton.edu @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @
@ @ @ @ @ @ @ uunet.uu.net!tellab5!wheaton!dledelen @ @ @ @ @ @ @
@ @ @ @ @ @ "No matter where you go, there you are." @ @ @ @ @ @
un03...@wvnvms.wvnet.edu
>
>
> ARE YOU MAD?????????
> Led Zeppelin basically invented Heavy Metal. Jimmy Page borrowed old riffs
> and made them his own. Plant's own Voice was an instrument. JOnes was one of
> the best keyboardests and bassists of all time, and Bonham, in the top two
> best of drummers.....
>
> You sure havent listened to much Zeppelin have you?
>
> Go get a life and stop listening to NKOTB.....
blah blah blah... here we go again. "My band's better than your band"
Seems to me that these folks haven't grown out of the 3rd grade "my dad can
kick your dad's butt" mentality. <sigh>
Mephistopheles
TZE...@vm.bgu.ac.il
Oh, c'mon, cut the bullshit. Practically every Tull album in the Seventies
was a masterpiece, and they covered almost every musical style - Blues, Rock,
Classical, Folk, and... Tull. So just because you can't find a good melody
line to hum on the way to school, don't sum up Tull in the same pile of shit
with Mick Jaggers and such, or Rap for that matter...
Matthias Ulrich Neeracher
>>Jethro Tull - One decent album a long time ago.
> Oh, c'mon, cut the bullshit. Practically every Tull album in the Seventies
>was a masterpiece, and they covered almost every musical style - Blues, Rock,
>Classical, Folk, and... Tull.
Reggae ? Punk ? Death Metal ? Funk ? Soul ? Seems like they didn't cover so
many music styles after all. But "covering almost every music style" is not
an useful way to characterize the quality of an album. Lou Reeds "Metal Machine
Music" does indeed cover every music style, but it'd take you a fourier
analysis to find out :-)
> So just because you can't find a good melody
>line to hum on the way to school, don't sum up Tull in the same pile of shit
>with Mick Jaggers and such, or Rap for that matter...
Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
Matthias
-----
Matthias Neeracher ne...@iis.ethz.ch
"I came to the conclusion that sex is a sublimation
of the work instinct" -- David Lodge, _Small World_
fsm...@acad3.alaska.edu
> Well for my .02, I think that GNR is far and away the most overated band
> of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
> got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
> from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
>
> This band is only popular because they look good on TV.
For your information... Though I am sure you have been told more than once
about this post... Gun's 'N Roses first broke onto the scene as a Club band...
With the release of their Appetite for destruction album... No one was buying
it... None of their songs were getting air play or video play... But some
intelligent person bought the album... Word spread from there and they had sold
over a million copies of Appetite for Destruction before a video was released
for Sweet Child O' Mine... Overrated? Maybe but not to millions of us who
happen to enjoy what they sing... Racist most likely not... They simply relate
the world to their fans as they see it... In fact Slash is half black
himself... Stupid... Now that is a matter of opinion... And if it happens to be
yours, well you probably aren't alone... But seriously out numbered... Sexist
most likely not... Axl writes his lyrics based on experience... So if that is
what you hear then that is what he has experienced... And personally even if
they are racist, I prefer this kind of racism to the kind that is kept in the
closet and allowed to fester within the minds of children... But that is only
my humble opinion... Feel free to VMS me and differ...
Cleopatra
Who the hell is Jethro Tull????
-Cleopatra
--
"To be or not to be..." "Life's like a dick...when it gets hard... -Hamlet Fuck It!!"
"Today is a good day to die" -me
-Kiefer Sutherland (Flatliners)
Don Becker
>In article <1992Mar30....@sdc.com>, no...@sdc.com (Norm) writes:
>> Well for my .02, I think that GNR is far and away the most overated band
>> of all time. These guys are the biggest cliche I've ever seen. They've
>> got a tattooed phoney from Indiana, a doped-up bozo in a top hat, covers
>> from Wing's Greatest Hits, and stupid, racist, sexist lyrics.
>>
>> This band is only popular because they look good on TV.
>Overrated? Maybe but not to millions of us who happen to enjoy what they sing.
Overrated? Most definitely. People treat them like gods when the simple fact is
Axl can't sing, Slash can't play in tune, and they got rid of the only talented
member of the band (Izzy. At least the songs he wrote were good.)
>Racist most likely not... They simply relate
>the world to their fans as they see it... In fact Slash is half black
>himself...
"Police and NIGGERS get outta my way."
^^^^^^^
Duh...gee...that line doesn't sound racist. Why, Axl must love and cherish
black people enough to use such a complimentary term for them (heavy sarcasm).
And once Axl caught flak for that, he started kissing ass by saying
that Public Enemy was his favorite group one night, N.W.A. the next. Right now,
I'd be willing to bet that Naughty By Nature is his favorite, and he'll say
he's down with O.P.P.
>Sexist most likely not...
"Back off BITCH"
"I used to love her, but I HAD TO KILL HER"
"Fuck you, BITCH"
Duh...gee...I see absolutely no misogyny here...(even more heavy sarcasm)
>Axl writes his lyrics based on experience... So if that is
>what you hear then that is what he has experienced...
And Axl's experiences have turned him into a sexist, racist idiot. No, wait.
He was ALWAYS that way.
>And personally even if
>they are racist, I prefer this kind of racism to the kind that is kept in the
>closet and allowed to fester within the minds of children...
But it's this racism that festers in the mind, not the stuff that isn't made
public.
--Don
--
/ Don Becker at the University at Buffalo -- Any comments? Post or mail 'em \
| Internet: v112...@ubvmsb.cc.buffalo.edu BITNET: v112...@ubvms.BITNET |
| Unix: bec...@acsu.buffalo.edu Voice: (716) 636-4339 On IRC: BillZeCat |
\ "The spirit of misplaced childhood is rising to speak his mind." -Marillion /
Man on a Mission
>Who the hell is Jethro Tull????
Hahahahahahahahaha..... You're probably one of the judges who gave them the
Grammy for Best Heavy Metal in 1989 :-)
--
"And please bless Grandma, and Grampa..." ,----------- Ron A. Echeverri
"...And please, give me a million dollars, | BSAE 1994 Univ. of So. Cal.
and, *chuckle* oh yeah, huge pectoral muscles." `---------------\ MUDaholic
- Ren and Stimpy, "The Littlest Giant" \___________
Daniel Lane Edelen
>Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
>problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
>
>Matthias
In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks do
you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
album of rantings about this and that" syndrome. Needless to say, here today,
gone tomorrow....
If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
Christopher Ferguson
>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
>
I disagree with almost all of the groups you listed, but this is ridiculous.
All of the other groups you listed at leasted have some basis for making your
list. If you think all Hendrix did was invent feedback, you've never really
listened to Hendrix. Some of his greatest songs such as the Wind Cries Mary,
Crosstown Traffic, et.c don't even use feedback. In fact a majority of his
recorded material doesn't. All that aside, though, this is a list for the most
overrated...how can you overrate someone who is the greatest of all time?
If you could name even one person who plays or played guitar that could even
stand Hendrix's shadow, I would retract this.
ferg
Derek Tearne
>>>Jethro Tull - One decent album a long time ago.
>>
>> Oh, c'mon, cut the bullshit. Practically every Tull album in the Seventies
>>was a masterpiece, and they covered almost every musical style - Blues, Rock,
>>Classical, Folk, and... Tull. So just because you can't find a good melody
>>line to hum on the way to school, don't sum up Tull in the same pile of shit
>>with Mick Jaggers and such, or Rap for that matter...
>
>Who the hell is Jethro Tull????
He was a famous English horticulturalist and he invented the seed drill.
The name was later used for one of the most innovative bands of the late
sixties/seventies who hung in their during the eighties and survived punk
and are still hanging in their today. Quite a remarkable achievement really.
Getting on for 25 years now! Not many other bands can boast that longevity.
Oh they had some pretty good melodies as well - well I used to hum them
on the way to school anyway!
Derek "Don't give away your age" Tearne
--
Derek Tearne de...@fivegl.co.nz | If yo
rek l .nz | yo
New Zea
and while he wasn't looking the .sig eaters were busy at work
D. Nathan Hood
>>
>>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
>>
>If you could name even one person who plays or played guitar that could even
>stand Hendrix's shadow, I would retract this.
>ferg
IMHO:
Eric Johnson
Stevie Ray Vaughan
Eric Clapton
D. Nathan Hood
fal...@buhub.bradley.edu
fal...@camelot.bradley.edu
--
____ ____ //////////////////////
/ \ / \ //Nathan of the Hood////////
|----| |--| //fal...@buhub.bradley.edu////
\____/ \____/ //fal...@camelot.bradley.edu//
THETA XI //x2095///////////////////////
John Fereira
|I'd rather see Jethro Tull win a Grammy than Metallica anyday.
Do you have an objective reason for believing this or is this just
and emotional preference? I would prefer that the group that creates
the best music win the grammy.
U14...@uicvm.uic.edu
fal...@buhub.bradley.edu (D. Nathan Hood) says:
>
>In <28...@brahms.udel.edu> fe...@brahms.udel.edu (Christopher Ferguson) writes:
>
>>>
>>>
>
>>If you could name even one person who plays or played guitar that could even
>>stand Hendrix's shadow, I would retract this.
>>ferg
>
>IMHO:
>Eric Johnson
>Stevie Ray Vaughan
>Eric Clapton
then any of these contempory guitarists. The three people mention above
deserve the Golden Spleen the award for overrated guitar player.
Chris Lott
> In <28...@brahms.udel.edu> fe...@brahms.udel.edu (Christopher Ferguson) writes:
>
>>>
>>>4. JIMI HENDRIX: Was inventing feedback really that difficult?
>>>
>
>>If you could name even one person who plays or played guitar that could even
>>stand Hendrix's shadow, I would retract this.
>>ferg
>
> IMHO:
> Eric Johnson
> Stevie Ray Vaughan
> Eric Clapton
>
> D. Nathan Hood
> fal...@buhub.bradley.edu
> fal...@camelot.bradley.edu
> --
Not a flame, but Clapton and Vaughan both acknowledged the greatness of, and
their debt to, Hendrix. All three people mentioned here are fantastic
guitarists, but none have revolutionized electric guitar playing the way he
did, me he and Stevie r.i.p.
Of course, it wouldn't be fair to demand that they do, their music stands on
its own...
--
__________________________________________________________
| Christopher L. Lott --- Poet and Pauper |
|__________________________________________________________|___
| fscll@alaska | "And now what shall become of |
| fs...@acad3.alaska.edu | us without any barbarians? |
------------------------------| Those people were a kind of |
| solution." |
-------------------------------
soren--Ms. Jackson if you're nasty
>If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
>where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
Oh Lord, here we go again.
If anyone wishes to prove to me that Rap is not "real" music, then please
give me an acceptible definition of "real" music that which excludes rap.
(Hint: are drum solos "real" music? Do they have a "transcriptable melody
line"? How about Terry Riley's *In C*? How about Husker Du's "Plans I
Made" (from *New Day Rising*)?)
--
"Tell me, who *hasn't* felt close to the edge and down by the river"
soren f petersen : i AM NOT : --Andy Whitman
spet...@peruvian.utah.edu : THE university OF utah :
"How could I dance with another/When I saw him standing there" --Tiffany
andrew.j.whitman
>
>>Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
>>problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
>>
>>Matthias
>
>In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
>to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks do
>you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
>music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
Well, your parents (and mine) were wrong then, and you're wrong now. Try
listening to it. Really, seriously listening to it, without pre-judging
it as crap. Play a De La Soul and a Public Enemy track back to back.
If they sound the same, then so do Elvis and AC/DC.
>Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
Seriously, this is one of the more ignorant lines I've ever heard. I
suppose that all rappers look alike, too, right?
>Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
>album of rantings about this and that" syndrome.
Yep, rappers generally have an attitude. Me? I like people with
attitudes, and I find that they often have more interesting things to
say than people who think that the world is just hunky dory. There's
a long and proud history of social protest in western music, from
"Cam Ye O'er Frae France" and "My Son John" through Brendan Behan
through Woodie Guthrie through Bob Dylan through Chuck D., with a
lot of stops in between. I don't like all rap music, but what I
*do* like fits very much into the tradition of angry, disenfranchised
members of society protesting their plight. And you'd better believe
that, not only as a music fan but also as a human being, I think
that's worth listening to and heeding.
>Needless to say, here today,
>gone tomorrow....
Needless to say, here today, here twelve years ago, and probably
around for a lot of years to come.
>If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
>where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
The dreaded "real music" comment again. Want to define that? On
second thought, don't. But here's a clue: melody isn't the point.
> @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ Daniel Lane Edelen @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @
> @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @ dled...@david.wheaton.edu @ @ @ @ @ @ @ @
> @ @ @ @ @ @ @ uunet.uu.net!tellab5!wheaton!dledelen @ @ @ @ @ @ @
> @ @ @ @ @ @ "No matter where you go, there you are." @ @ @ @ @ @
Andy Whitman
AT&T Bell Laboratories, Columbus, Ohio
att!cblpo!ajw or
a...@cblpo.att.com
Dudley Gaman
> ... [Lots of stuff about RAP's not music and I-don't-listen-to-it-because-I-know
> I-don't-like-it-even-though-I-don't-know-what-it-is deleted] ...
>
> ... [Some intelligent reasoning by Andy Whitman deleted] ...
Andy,
Thanks for the voice of reason. I've generated a couple of threads here lately
which deal with the "What is rock-n-roll?" and "Rock is dead" questions posed
in your post. I think it amusing that rock has become so much an establishment
tool whereas rap has picked up the ideals of what rock used to be. Today's kids
are just like my parents' generation. They don't like something they know nothing
about because it is different!
So, kids, listen to Andy. Open your minds. Expand your horizons. There is some
great rap out there that you've never heard.
Rebel music!
Dudley
.
John Fereira
|
|>Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
|>problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
I don't see a problem. However, If I don't like Public Enemy or Jethro
Tull or neither that shouldn't be a problem either.
|In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
|to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks do
|you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
|music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
|Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
I disagree. I have heard quite a few Rap albums. I bought "Fear of a Black
Planet" as it was rated highly by quite a few people here on the net. I have
a good friend that has a 13 year old son that listens to a lot of rap music.
I can differentiate between different rap artist quite well. I find very
little of it that I like however. I just don't care for that style of music.
|Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
|album of rantings about this and that" syndrome.
This is one of the things that I don't like about it. I don't care for the
bragdacio. I don't like music forced down my throat. I don't like the
attitude. The mannerism (pointing, folding arms across the chest) don`t do
anything for me.
|If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
|where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
If someone wished to prove to me the real music must have a transcriptable
melody line you might have a point, however some rap does have a transcriptable
melody line. Unfortunately that melody line is usually not original.
Alexander Feygin
}In article <1992Apr14.1...@cbnews.cb.att.com> a...@cbnews.cb.att.com (andrew.j.whitman) writes:
}> ... [Lots of stuff about RAP's not music and I-don't-listen-to-it-because-I-know
}> I-don't-like-it-even-though-I-don't-know-what-it-is deleted] ...
}> ... [Some intelligent reasoning by Andy Whitman deleted] ...
}which deal with the "What is rock-n-roll?" and "Rock is dead" questions posed
}in your post. I think it amusing that rock has become so much an establishment
}tool whereas rap has picked up the ideals of what rock used to be. Today's kids
}are just like my parents' generation. They don't like something they know nothing
}about because it is different!
}So, kids, listen to Andy. Open your minds. Expand your horizons. There is some
}great rap out there that you've never heard.
}Rebel music!
The only problem with that statement, is that rap is not music.
--
Alexander Feygin | "If I go insane, please don't put your wires
a-fe...@uiuc.edu | in my brain" -- Roger Waters
Derek Tearne
>In article <13...@xenna.Xylogics.COM> re...@steam.Xylogics.COM (Scott Reeve) writes:
>
>|I'd rather see Jethro Tull win a Grammy than Metallica anyday.
>
>Do you have an objective reason for believing this or is this just
>and emotional preference? I would prefer that the group that creates
>the best music win the grammy.
Absolutely on hope whatsoever of that happening!
Nice idea though.
kmag...@eagle.wesleyan.edu
Not necessarily. It's all a matter of opinion, like the people who flame
Rush to hell and those who say they are gods. I have heard enough rap to
distinguish between groups of different styles, but I still hate it. The
lyrics may be good, but the only type of musical instruments are (mostly but
not all the time) drums and bass, which tends to give me a massive headache,
especially when played at extremely high volume, which it often is.
I'll stick with Pink Floyd and the Beatles, thank you very much.
Karl Magnacca
__________________________________________________________________
| "Lastly, I come to China in the hope | "Jesus creeping shit! |
| of fulfilling a lifelong ambition - | We've walked into a |
| dropping acid on the Great Wall." | time capsule!" |
------------------------------------------------------------------
Chuck, the Fencing God
This is all opinion....the subject "TEN MOST OVERRATED BANDS"A
In your case, these opinions are based on minimal knowledge of music and
musicians, and founded merely on anti-trend tendencies.
If John Lennon is so 'overrated', why the hell are 50%+ of today's songwriter's
influenced so heavily by him? Why Lennon and not McCartney?
Imagine vs. Love me Do
Ballad of John and Yoko vs. She Loves You (yeah, yeah, bleah)
Give Peace a Chance vs. Silly Love Songs (Wings-era)
Eric Clapton may be hit or miss, but he IS one of the founding fathers of
Rock guitar......Beck, Page, Hendrix, and Clapton......that's it!!!
With all the record sales, these 10 bands must be doing SOMETHING right.
When you can fill Rich Stadium (Buffalo, NY) with a reunion tour
10 years after breakup, give me a call. (I am referring to the Who, here)
Chuck "The most UNDERRATED,etc." Farnsworth
P.S....who DO you like????? Led Zeppelin is the
classic you didn't slam....
Markku Sorto
> Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
> Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
> album of rantings about this and that" syndrome. Needless to say, here today,
> gone tomorrow....
>
> If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
> where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
>
Well I don't understand rap music either, but that's not a reason to say it's
crap. Attitude of "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an album of
rantings about this and that" is no criteria of categorising a style of music
as non-important and forgettable. Remember punk (and who doesn't?)! Punk was
done with same kind of attitude (ie no skill, just attitude) and it still
today affects many important bands today. Besides many punk bands evoluted into
greatness (Joy Division, The Cure, The Banshees, Clash etc.). They started
with no skill and made better music than many 'ultratalented' bands of musical
history (Yes, Genesis etc. AAAAAARGGGHHH! Now I've done it! I'll be flamed to
death! :) ).
Tumpa
andrew.j.whitman
>In article <kum4tn...@exodus.Eng.Sun.COM>, dud...@treefort.Corp.Sun.COM (Dudley Gaman) writes:
>> Open your minds. Expand your horizons. There is some
>> great rap out there that you've never heard.
>
> Not necessarily. It's all a matter of opinion, like the people who flame
>Rush to hell and those who say they are gods. I have heard enough rap to
>distinguish between groups of different styles, but I still hate it. The
>lyrics may be good, but the only type of musical instruments are (mostly but
>not all the time) drums and bass, which tends to give me a massive headache,
>especially when played at extremely high volume, which it often is.
Fair enough. You don't like rap. I like rap. I have no problems with
those kinds of statements. But Dudley's point is still a good one.
I have yet to find a musical genre that didn't offer *something* that
was worthwhile and interesting. That doesn't mean that I like each
musical genre equally well, because I don't. But it *does* mean that
if I automatically discount a particular genre as worthless, then I'm
bound to miss some good music.
That's what I see happening with the "rap is crap/rap isn't music/
rap isn't "real" music" postings. People have written off an entire
genre of music to the point where they're unwilling or unable to
distinguish between different performers/performances within that
genre - it's the old "it all sounds the same" argument. Well,
rap simply *doesn't* all sound the same, as you've noted in your
posting. And if you've honestly paid attention and tried to
understand what the music is all about and *then* decided that you
simply don't like it, then we'll simply have to agree to disagree.
As you said, it's all a matter of opinion.
But here, at least, is some food for thought: rap isn't going away.
It's been around for more than a decade, it's more popular now than
ever, and it's "infiltrated" almost every other genre of rock music,
from R.E.M. albums to Anthrax albums to Sonic Youth albums to Rush
albums. Rather than covering up their ears and running away
screaming, people who automatically dismiss rap might want to
examine *why* the music has such wide appeal.
For some reason, a lot of people hate musical change. It's nothing
new. People booed Stravinsky at the premiere of "Le Sacre du Printemps."
Early twentieth century evangelists like Billy Sunday and Amy Semple
MacPherson denounced the evils of the new music jazz from the
pulpit. Lots of people threw their Elvis and Beatles albums onto
bonfires. I'm not suggesting that the "rap is crap" crowd is
a bunch of unthinking reactionaries. But there does seem to be
some historical evidence that innovations in music are viewed as
threatening by a lot of folks. In each case, there were plenty
of people who were clamoring that the new stuff was "crap" and
not even really music at all.
Well, maybe this time those folks are right. But don't bet on it.
"Crap" has a way of entering the establishment and becoming the
musical mainstream. And the people who denounce the crap simply
get left behind, and are as culturally relevant as the old
codgers who nostalgically look back on the good ol' days of
Tommy Dorsey and Glenn Miller. Take a good look around. Watch
MTV, and look at the Billboard charts. Rap *is* the dominant
movement in music today. It's already happened. You don't have
to like it. But at least be open to the possibility that there
is worth there, that there might be merit in listening closely
to what is being said, and that, God forbid, some of the stuff
might not only be music, but good music at that.
>I'll stick with Pink Floyd and the Beatles, thank you very much.
>
>Karl Magnacca
>
> __________________________________________________________________
>| "Lastly, I come to China in the hope | "Jesus creeping shit! |
>| of fulfilling a lifelong ambition - | We've walked into a |
>| dropping acid on the Great Wall." | time capsule!" |
> ------------------------------------------------------------------
Andy Whitman
Clayton Glad
>The lyrics may be good, but the only type of musical instruments are
>(mostly but not all the time) drums and bass, which tends to give me a
>massive headache, especially when played at extremely high volume, which
>it often is.
>I'll stick with Pink Floyd and the Beatles, thank you very much.
I don't think that Dudley's point was that everyone is compelled to like
rap, but rather that people who complain about it do so in terms very
reminiscent of the complaints conservative, suburban parents of the
50s and 60s made about rock-n-roll.
A point to which your response serves more as confirmation than
contradiction.
-- Clay
Clayton Glad
>The only problem with that statement, is that rap is not music.
[cruise control ON]
What's music? Why doesn't rap qualify?
-- Clay
Allen Garvin
Churck Farnsworth writes:
>Eric Clapton may be hit or miss, but he IS one of the founding fathers of
Excuse me, but JEFF BECK??!!! He has hardly recorded any rock'n roll. After
a couple of hits with the yardbirds ("Shapes of Things" is the only slightly
interesting one) he went on to record a number of worthless fusion albums
that I doubt have any significant influence. His first solo album, Truth, was
interesting only because it introduced Rod Stewart as a vocolist. I have
several others, but I can't remember anything of worth on them.
Certainly Hendrix and Page had a lot of influence on modern Heavy Metal, but
I would also question Clapton's role in the development of guitar style. With
John Mayall and the Yardbirds his style seems mainly derivative of Chuck
Berry, with some styles of other various blues artists thrown in. His blues
playing reminds me of no one other than B.B.King. On his solo albums he tends
to lean towards the singer/songwriter tradition of the seventies. Only on
Layla and Other Assorted Love Songs is any real, unique talent displayed, and
then it's hard to tell which guitar is Clapton and which is Almann (though both
are truly magnificent!). With Cream he sinks into murky self-indulgence that
is rarely really interesting.
I would think Chuck Berry is probably the greatest influence on Rock'n Roll
guitar. How many songs can you think of that has that distinctive, machine-gun-
speed riff he made famous? Too many to mention. Also at Chess Records was
another great influence: Bo Diddly, a fine guitar player remembered mostly
for his chuck a-chuck-chuck chuck-chuck (is that a good approximation)
rhythm.
From the blues, T-bone Walker towers above most as the inovater (sp?) of
many electric guitar techniques, and a big influence on BB King, who in turn
influenced many up-and-coming guitarists in the blues revival of the last
half of the sixties.
A later influence who should not be ignored was Steve Cropper, at Stax records.
He consistently played music of high-quality, original nature, and is to be
remembered by the restraint he displayed. He never showed up the singers
he backed. Billy Gibbons of ZZ Top lists Steve Cropper as a big a influence
as Hendrix in his guitar style, and Gibbons opened for Hendrix in the late
sixties in many concerts (as a member of Moving Sidewalks) (I'm not a ZZ Top
fan, it's just that Dusty Hill, the bassist, is my Dad's half-brother, so I
know a lot about them.). Many studio guitarists greatly admire Cropper.
Unfortunately, with the demise of Stax, he lost all concept of self-restraint.
His two or three solo albums should be avoided. He sunk so low as to make a
cameo appearence in "The Blues Brothers" in 1981 (?), without even any
speaking parts (if I can remember correctly, the drummer of the MG's
appeared also (Al I-can't-recall-his-last-name)).
Anyway, sorry about my long-windedness, but I'm surrounded by people here
that have no concept of what rock'n roll is, so I have these opinions all
built up inside me with little way to release them! 8-)
-Earendil
___________________________________________________________________________
/ eare...@wizard.etsu.edu \ "A lie is only a vice when it does harm. It is\
| s723...@etsuacad.etsu.edu | a great virtue when it does good. So be more |
| s723...@etsuacad.bitnet / virtuous than ever. You must lie like the |
|--------------------------| devil, not timidly, not for a while, but |
| snail: 738 Connally | boldly, and all the time." |
| Sulphur Springs, TX 75482\ -Voltaire, 1736 |
|___________________________|________________________________________________|
| Aleph-null bottles of beer on the wall, Aleph-null bottles of beer ... |
|----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
| Free will is an illusion. We are all slaves to heredity and our upbringing |
| and environment. Hence the opinions expressed here are not my own. |
| Please feel free to flame my parents and friends. |
|____________________________________________________________________________|
Daniel E. Platt
|>
|> Churck Farnsworth writes:
|> >Eric Clapton may be hit or miss, but he IS one of the founding fathers of
|> >Rock guitar......Beck, Page, Hendrix, and clapton ......that's it!!!
|>
|> Excuse me, but JEFF BECK??!!! He has hardly recorded any rock'n roll. After
|> a couple of hits with the yardbirds ("Shapes of Things" is the only slightly
|> interesting one) he went on to record a number of worthless fusion albums
|> that I doubt have any significant influence. His first solo album, Truth, was
|> interesting only because it introduced Rod Stewart as a vocolist. I have
|> several others, but I can't remember anything of worth on them.
Jeff Beck started out after Yardbirds with 'Truth,' followed by
'Beck-Ola' with Ron Wood on Bass and Rod Stewart on vocals. They
played a sort of heavy-blues and rock very much like early Zeppelin.
Following that, he worked with another band called 'Jeff Beck Group'
with Max Middleton on keyboards and Bob Tench on vocals; they did
sort of funky R&B or rock. Then there was Beck, Bogert, and Appice.
That was one heavy band (some years before, a group of people tried
to create a band called 'cactus;' it was supposed to feature Jeff on
guitar, but it didn't happen. BB&A was essentially the line up for
that original version of Cactus. BB&A put out several albums
including a live one in Japan. It was only after that that Jeff
moved on to fusion stuff (Wired, Blow by Blow, etc).
|> Anyway, sorry about my long-windedness, but I'm surrounded by people here
|> that have no concept of what rock'n roll is, so I have these opinions all
|> built up inside me with little way to release them! 8-)
|>
|> -Earendil
I was about to comment that many of the musicians you quoted would
have been on my list as well... but giving you a compliment after
that snide paragraph made me gag.
One of the problems in trying to assign influence to a guitarist is
how much a style was communicated to the public and all of those
kids in their basements that went on to become popular musicians in
their own rights...
For example, did Billy Gibbons (ZZ Top) or Steve Cropper, who
strongly influenced Gibbons, have the greatest impact? In a way,
Gibbons did (more folks were playing his songs and getting their
licks from him).
Dan
Jeff Davis
>
[dismissals of a couple of fine musicians deleted]
>
>Also at Chess Records was
>another great influence: Bo Diddly, a fine guitar player remembered mostly
>for his chuck a-chuck-chuck chuck-chuck (is that a good approximation)
>rhythm.
>
>Anyway, sorry about my long-windedness, but I'm surrounded by people here
>that have no concept of what rock'n roll is, so I have these opinions all
>built up inside me with little way to release them! 8-)
>
Not to get too testy, but the rhythm you ascribe to Bo Diddley is an ancient
one, known mostly as the hambone. Diddley is a fine guitarist whose
technique inspired the whammy-bar. He managed his shimmering riffs (at least
in the early footage I've seen) w/ touch alone.
Your dismissal of Jeff Beck is a real question mark. I can't imagine a
more enjoyable rock guitarist. Whether he has had no imitators is also
questionable...since I can't imagine guitarists like Joe Satriani w/o him.
Regardless, Beck is a fine, explosive talent whose solos are as
imaginative as rock gets: fast and funny, w/ a real buzz.
Clapton may not be an enormous talent as a guitarist (I think he's fine;
his fans worship him) but he has become a first rate blues singer. Anyone
who caught his acoustic set on MTV can attest to that. He consistently
gives his lyrics a lot of attention and his delivery has become very full
and warm. As a bluesman, he's earned his stripes.
re
--
Jeff Davis <da...@keats.ca.uky.edu>
You know, there's many a damned fool woulda swallered that.
Richard Caley
af> [Everybodies least favorite mindless comment deleted].
Someone shoot this airhead now. He won't notice and we can stop a lot
of mindless flaming.
--
r...@cogsci.ed.ac.uk Should never have tried to rock,
Should never have tried to roll,
But lord I don't regret the 33RPM soul.
- Michelle Shocked.
Michael B. Prime
>
> ). Many studio guitarists greatly admire Cropper.
>Unfortunately, with the demise of Stax, he lost all concept of self-restraint.
>His two or three solo albums should be avoided. He sunk so low as to make a
>cameo appearence in "The Blues Brothers" in 1981 (?), without even any
>
Sunk so low? Along with James Brown, Cab Calloway, Aretha Franklin, John
Lee Hooker,...
I also believe he had a speaking part. He was in the Blues Brothers band
and they all had a line or two in the movie
Mike
Alexander Feygin
Before I get involved in a flame-war, I'd like to add an "IMVHO"
to my last statement.
Geoff Bronner
>In article <neeri.702569173@iis> ne...@iis.ethz.ch (Matthias Ulrich Neeracher) writes:
>>Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
>>problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
>In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
>to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks do
>you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
>music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
Sure... but didn't your dad sound stupid when he said that? Generalizations
always sound stupid to me.
>Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
>Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
>album of rantings about this and that" syndrome. Needless to say, here today,
>gone tomorrow....
How much rap have year heard? How many groups? How many different types of
rap (there are different types you know) I'm not asking you to love rap
but give me a break. You sound like you don't know the first thing about
it.
I don't like metal. So I say, "I don't like metal." I don't try to explain
it beyond that and I don't try to make it sound like I'm the only
intelligent person on the planet by dissing the whole genre.
If you don't like rap... DON'T! But don't bother me with this lame bull
about it all sounding the same. It isn't my fault that you're lyric-deaf.
>If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
>where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
Where'd that come from? Since when does music have to have a
"transcriptable melody line" to be music? Plenty of metal, rock, pop, etc
could be dismissed with a vague comment like this.
A lot of stuff we call 'music' isn't very musical. The term refers to
several different forms of artistic impression. The common theme is use of
sound, not "transcriptable melody lines."
-Thumper
-Geoff
--
geo...@Dartmouth.EDU - Computing Support Consultant, Tuck School of Business
"I just hope you didn't think it sucked."
-Garth Algar
david j warner
>>In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
>>to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks
>>do you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
>>music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
>>Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
>>Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
>>album of rantings about this and that" syndrome. Needless to say, here today,
>>gone tomorrow....
I have now lost my patience with the world....
YOU STUPID-ASS, CLOSED-MINDED, CONSTIPATED, WHITE BREADED, PEANUT-HEADED, VAN
HALEN LIKIN', DIRT BIKIN', GRITS EATIN', DICK BEATIN', IGNORAMUS FATHERFUCKER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YOU DON'T KNOW JACK SHIT FROM JACK SWING ABOUT RAP MUSIC OR HIP HOP CULTURE,
AND IF YOU DID, YOU WOULDN'T BE LAYIN' OUT THAT RODENT SHIT YOU CALL A USENET
NEWS POST! IF RAP WAS HERE TODAY GONE TOMORROW, WE WOULDN'T BE TALKING ABOUT
IT. YOU SAY YOU SOUND JUST LIKE YOUR FATHER, SO I GUESS IGNORANCE RUNS IN THE
FAMILY. I'D TAKE ALL YOUR ASSES AND HANG 'EM OUT TO DRY IN THIS LIFE AND THE
NEXT, AND I DON'T RAISE FISTS. I RAISE CONSCIOUSNESS! I BET ALL YOU RAISE IS
A BOTTLE OF EVERCLEAR! LET'S SEE YOU COMPARE PUBLIC ENEMY WITH ARRESTED
DEVELOPMENT, OR BRAND NUBIAN WITH GETO BOYS, OR DAS-EFX WITH BDP, OR TRIBE
CALLED QUEST WITH ICE-T. I'LL WAGER YOU RECOGNIZED ONLY TWO OF THOSE ACTS
OVERALL. AND NONE OF 'EM WILL DROP BEFORE YOU DO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
IF ANYTHING IS HERE TODAY AND GONE TOMORROW, IT'S YOU AND YOUR IGNORANCE!!!!
JUST LIKE YOUR PAPA BEFORE YOU! AND YOU'LL BE PROVEN WRONG, TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!
"There's more wit to one of my turds of shit - you ain't shit, never was shit!"
- Kris Parker
"Rap is here to stay."
- Quincy Jones
5000...
--
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- David J. Warner - SIGNATURE FILE UNDER CONSTRUCTION - BLASTING ZONE -
- dwa...@ucs.indiana.edu - SLOW DOWN OR FALLING DERBIS WILL KILL YOU. -
- - THANK YOU FOR YOUR COOPERATION. -
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Michael J. Carpenter
cl...@cheshire.oxy.edu> Is all this hostility really necessary?
DJW> No, it wasn't necessary, and as the author of the original post, I
DJW> apologize for it.
I, too, apologize for my own criticism wherein I assumed much of you (DJW)
without any substantive foundation, save for your commentary to which all
of this is referred. If it makes you feel any better, the style of rhetoric I
used merely mimicked your message, and was moreso a provocative suggestion
than indictment of character.
DJW> This apology, however, does not supremely change my views on rap, though
DJW> I will repeat, I do not promote gangsta rap acts or other violent groups,
DJW> among them NWA, 2 Live Crew, Geto Boys, and other wannabes or Rap-A-Lot
DJW> Records acts.
Your views weren't the object of criticism; but, the above says much more than
what I was able to get from your previous post. Much respects for your views -
keep the faith!
As for me, I'm not anti-gangsta rap so much as I am concerned that everyone is
clear as to the separation of the act/artistry and reality. Sometimes the
two merge; but, the subtleties have to be understood in this case as well.
DJW> As KRS-1 says, however, "Who taught the masses of the people to respect
DJW> sex and violence?"
Heh, I just paraphrased this very phrase earlier today :-)
DJW> If you listen to the very first rhyme styles in hip hop, you will notice
DJW> that there are few verses that even resemble most of the gangster styles
DJW> you hear today. Most of these "ghetto" acts are the result of a bunch of
DJW> guys who are nothing more than Ice-T or NWA wannabes trying to make a
DJW> record, but falling flat on their faces. Hopefully, that will be the part
DJW> of rap that does not last.
DJW> As for the responses, I find it interesting that while some are quick
DJW> to deem me a hypocrite, others have e-mailed me saying, essentially,
DJW> "Great flame. Those suckas needed it."
The hypocrite line was mine. Out of curiosity, why did you find the range of
responses interesting? I have this sense that what you weren't all that taken
by the negative criticism, but found solace in the words of encouragement.
While it's only human to be averse to negative feedback, I've learned that
the resulting introspection weighs more than the few minutes of ego-stroking.
In retrospect, it's obvious that your thinking is clear as to what hip hop is
about, and my input was unnecessary; but, it's up to you to determine which
of all the responses have the most value to you.
As for the characterization of the comments as a "great flame," I note here
the particular choice of the word "flame." In a sense, it perpetuates the
very nonsense that you seem to downplay above, the same nonsense I do not
agree with on any level. IMHO, it would have been more personally satisfying
if feedback used descriptors such as "insightful," "provocative," or
just plain "nice." To classify a comment a "flame" implies a degradation of
the comment to something "less," no matter how "great" the flame is.
DJW> Hip Hop and violence are like oil and water. As hip hop fans, we should
DJW> do our best to keep 'em separate and eliminate the negativity.
Word.
Mc
============
I am my Father's son
You are your Mother's child
Sometimes we act as if we hate each other
A different fate
A different state of mind
It's all the difference I can remember
A different need
A different means to survive
Does not mean we all can't be satisfied
We are all Brothers and Sisters
A different face
A different smile
But we are all Brothers and Sisters
- Ziggy Marley
Family Gotta Get Busy
_Civilization Versus Technology_
Charles L Isbell
|>Anybody who lumps all of Rap together shows his ignorance of it. What is the
|>problem with liking both Jethro Tull and Public Enemy ?
|In reply to your comment about my inablility to distinguish Rap, I would have
|to say that at the ripe old age of 29 I do sound like my father. Yes, folks do
|you remember the days when your parents would make comments about all rock
|music sounding the same? Well now I find myself saying that about Rap.
*This* is a straight line.
|Seriously, once you've heard one Rap album you've basically heard them all.
|Rap also suffers from the "any couple of guys with an attitude can record an
|album of rantings about this and that" syndrome. Needless to say, here today,
|gone tomorrow....
(which is what they'e been saying for almost 15 years now)
In any case, I'd pay money to read or hear someone rationally and
convincingly argue that Ten Tray and Disposable Heroes of HipHoprisy;
Arrested Development and Paris; Laquan and A Tribe Called Quest;
Public Enemy and PM Dawn; De La Soul and X-Clan; Poor Righteous
Teachers and EPMD; Young Black Teenagers and Main Source; Black Sheep
and BDP; Criminal Nation and Ice-T; Ice Cube and Jungle Brothers; Eric
B and Rakim and Intelligent Hoodlum; Leaders of The New School and
Isis; or Vanilla Wafer and someone with some talent sound the same.
In fact, I'm so amazed that anyone with enough exposure to ruin film
could possibly think such an obviously ridiculous claim that I'm
willing to pay $50 by money order to anyone who can do it
convincingly. In fact, send me two 90 minutes tapes (Metal or CrO2)
and return postage and I'll record enough of a sampling to provide you
with enough research material for your essay. Write it and post it
and make a good argument and I'll send you $50. Of course, once it
becomes obvious that you can't, feel free to write a 200-word essay on
why silly assertions shouldn't be made in a public forum.
I mean, ignorance is bliss, but really. That's like saying that all
singing sounds the same.
|If someone wishes to prove to me that Rap is real music then please show me
|where the majority of Rap songs have a transcriptable melody line.
Haven't we had this thread before. I refer you to the last twenty
threads on why this is as silly a definition as "because I like it."
--
Peace.
"The main thing I like about New Yorkers is that they understand
that their lives are a relentless circus of horrors, ending in
death. As New Yorkers we realize this, we resign ourselves to
our fate, and we make sure that everyone else is as miserable as
we are. Good town."
-Kyle Baker, Why I Hate Saturn
-\--/-
Don't just adopt opinions | \/ | Yes, it is I,
develop them. | /\ | The Homeboy from hell
-/--\-
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
Yo, why you sweatin' the punk? Save him and that sort of Martha-type
Bullshit for the toilet bowl.
Don't take up space on the net dissin clowns like that Jack.
Selector Man
"You are Bad boy but you are garbage fi me. Me nuh matter how you bad true you
still can't test me!" - Chrisey Banton
Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi
Get off my block 'long with the New Kids.
In person.
Michael G. McMahon
ekun...@athena.mit.edu (Enuma Olanrewaju Ogunyemi) writes:
>And DON"T quote Quincy Jones (JR. or SR.)
>
>Get off my block 'long with the New Kids.
Step off your own block. If that's all you know about Quincy, then
stop now, while you're behind.
Go listen to some arrangements he did for Basie back around '50 -
study the way he played the horns out against the saxes, brings the
lower pitched instruments out in front - he is the shit.
Catch a clue - "Back on the Block" was not _supposed_ to be a rap
album. It's pop. And its concept, arrangements, and choice of tunes
WORKS. You don't have to like Quincy's pop stuff, but don't come out
sayin he's musical trash because he's friends with some rappers, and he
got them to drop in for a couple tracks.
Go back to your played-out Too Short tapes.
Peace.
-mike
--
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////
There is a level of cowardice lower than that of the conformist:
the fashionable non-conformist. -ayn rand
\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\
Craig Burley
For some reason, a lot of people hate musical change. It's nothing
new. People booed Stravinsky at the premiere of "Le Sacre du Printemps."
They didn't just boo it. They rioted in the streets, from what I've read!
Rap music causes that sort of reaction as well.
I have yet to "get into" rap (or blues or folk or "real classic" jazz, for
that matter), but I'm not going to assume it's all garbage based on what I
hear on the radio or on the streets.
After all, after ignoring my favorite band (Yes) for over 10 years, including
yawning at "Owner of a Lonely Heart", I finally started exploring their
recent output about a year ago and fell in love with it all (including
"Owner"). Hearing "Owner" on the radio wasn't enough to convince me they
were still doing great stuff (while I explored classical music to pretty much
the exclusion of any other newer music), but exploring their stuff did.
(In fact, my favorite song I didn't like at all the first five or so times
I listened to it -- "Gates of Delirium".)
Whether rap or blues or folk or jazz has much to communicate to me as far
as non-musical content is definitely an open question -- but the same goes
for opera (which I'm learning to appreciate) and much artsong (which I
have gotten to where I really enjoy -- fyi, it's basically classical folk,
I suppose). What I get into, primarily, is the music, not the words.
So if and when I explore rap, I'll be looking for the gems that, for me,
serve the same role in relation to rap as Yes, Genesis, Tangerine Dream,
and other favorite bands of mine serve to rock, and so on for other
categories (where my favorites often are not particularly popular). Only
after I find those gems will I be able to determine the extent to which rap
music is generally interesting to me. Very likely, I'll find that it is,
and get to where I enjoy even the radio-played rap more than I now do.
There are elements of rap that are fairly new (not _exactly_ new with rap --
they keys ones existed in various forms, but not as musical elements per se)
and I also expect to see them develop into fairly intricate (and, to me,
possibly more interesting) forms as they influence existing musical styles.
For example, the basic rhythmic rap _style_ could serve as an excellent
replacement for the (typically rather boring) recitative in opera and
oratorio, and might even spur composers to actually write such works again!
(It might fail before it succeeds, of course.)
Certainly it is likely that if you decide you don't like a musical style
before you seriously explore it, you won't seriously explore it and therefore
won't ever learn to like it. I used to not like most pop music until my
sister suggested I try getting some CDs by Basia, and now I actually can
enjoy listening to pop radio (not that my opinion concerning the musical
sophistication of much of that stuff has changed -- but at least _I_ enjoy
it more). I actually _own_ all the Basia CDs, Enya CDs (ok, I might have
gotten into these anyway, they aren't quite "pop"), Mariah Carey CDs, and
CDs by Cathy Dennis and Tara Kemp (definitely pop CDs), and enjoy them all!
Whether I'll be listening to and enjoying them all in another five, ten, or
fifteen years remains to be seen.
I know one thing for sure. Fifteen years from now, I'll still be listening
to and enjoying "Gates of Delirium", and it'll probably still be my
favorite song (though if not, I'll be happy to have found something I actually
like better). (Plug, plug :-)
--
James Craig Burley, Software Craftsperson bur...@gnu.ai.mit.edu
Member of the League for Programming Freedom (LPF)