Old and New
Michael Berenstein
Only now I appreciated the weight of accordion popularity discussion.
I borrowed a tape: Accoridon: Styles and techniques by Joey Miskulin.
He is a great (to me ) player. Watching him play is a thrilling
experience.
But.
Boy, what a set of 50-es! And note, not just a music which happend to be
written in 50-es, may be before or after, whatever. But a style, the
mentality. He plays some cajun (or pretends) on his piano 3 reed
accordion and it sounds just as jazzy, 50-ish, slick and cold. Not even
close to cajun. Same goes with polkas and some other tunes. I got bored
and thrilled at the same time.
Now I understand.
Toby Hanson
<mi...@pixar.com> wrote:
>Boy, what a set of 50-es! And note, not just a music which happend to be
>written in 50-es, may be before or after, whatever. But a style, the
>mentality. He plays some cajun (or pretends) on his piano 3 reed
>accordion and it sounds just as jazzy, 50-ish, slick and cold. Not even
>close to cajun. Same goes with polkas and some other tunes. I got bored
>and thrilled at the same time.
One thing to keep in mind: Joey is a Nashville session player now and he
plays a very commercial style of accordion: his Cajun isn't authentic
Cajun; it's Cajun-lite as used in country recording sessions. I have
Joey's "Country Polkatime" album and I have to say I found it to be
somewhat disappointing. I was expecting some lively Yankovic-style
polkas. What I got was a very slick, sequenced, commercialized elevator
music version of some otherwise great tunes. Some of Joey's best playing
comes with "Riders in the Sky".
--
-Toby Hanson
jtha...@aa.net.TREET
http://members.aa.net/~jthanson
"Subsidy is the death of art."
-John Philip Sousa
Remove ".TREET" (Armour's immitation Spam) to make address edible.
Michael Berenstein
> What I got was a very slick, sequenced, commercialized elevator
> music version of some otherwise great tunes.
Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
Thanks
Chris Timson
>Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
>I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
I read it as muzak, what you would expect to hear played in a lift or a
supermarket.
Chris
--
Chris Timson Have concertinas, will travel
and Phone (UK) 01225 863762
Anne Gregson For our home pages and for the Concertina FAQ:
http://www.harbour.demon.co.uk/
L. McD.
I just ordered "Best of the West" last night...
Unc.
Cliff Bentz
Michael Berenstein wrote:
>
> Toby Hanson wrote:
>
> > What I got was a very slick, sequenced, commercialized elevator
> > music version of some otherwise great tunes.
>
> Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
> I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
> Thanks
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
"Elevator" music is "mindless, white on white, plain
vanilla, empty, nowhere, tuneless and on and on........... Best example:
Kenny G.
Elevator music ain't got no SOUL! It just fills a
soundless void.
Cliff Bentz
Doug Cumming
Hello:
There is an interesting article by Canadian composer John Beckwith on "Muzak".
See pp. 915-16 in the Encyclopedia of Music in Canada [2nd Ed.]. From the
first couple paragraphs:
"Muzak: name of a company formed to record and program a specially prepared
music product, bearing the same name as the company, for distribution mainly
to public environments in which it is intended to affect its hearers
psychologically in specific ways without drawing undue attention to itself or
making any demand to be listened to consciously. In Canada, as in more than 20
other countries, this US brand of programmed background music is ubiquitous.
The brand-name has been so successful as to be used generically -- like Xerox,
Coke, or Kleenex. Its inventors and franchise-owners are quick to point out
that not all background music is Muzak; there are several competing companies.
Muzak Inc. started in New York in 1934. Its product was nurtured by the 'music
while you work' movement in World War II and the company began its
international growth in the immediate post-war period. Its earliest Canadian
franchises date from 1946 . . . ."
The article continues "public areas infiltrated by Muzak include restaurants,
supermarkets, banks, car salesrooms, apartment elevators, school corridors,
and funeral homes. It has been installed in many doctors' and dentists'
offices and is also used as a supplement to anaesthesia in some hospital
operating rooms . . . ."
-- Doug Cumming
gat...@d-and-d.com wrote:
> Really-From: Chris Timson <ch...@harbour.demon.co.uk>
>
> Michael Berenstein <mi...@pixar.com> writes
> >Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
> >I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
>
> I read it as muzak, what you would expect to hear played in a lift or a
> supermarket.
>
> Chris
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Ralph Stricker
Michael Berenstein <mi...@pixar.com> wrote:
>Toby Hanson wrote:
>
>> What I got was a very slick, sequenced, commercialized elevator
>> music version of some otherwise great tunes.
>
>Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
>I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
>Thanks
>
It is a degrading term for labeling music that is played on elevators. a company called Musack
sold this idea to office buildings, doctor's offices. Years ago they were all "standards" when
music used to make sense. How many times people would say when I would show/play a song for them
trying to describe the kind of music that was played in my era, they would remark "oh' elevator
music" AARRGGHH
Regards,
Ralph Stricker
L. McD.
Chris Timson wrote:
> Michael Berenstein <mi...@pixar.com> writes
> >Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
> >I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
>
> I read it as muzak, what you would expect to hear played in a lift or a
> supermarket.
>
> Chris
Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
MUSIC. It's background sound designed for use as part of an
architectural installation. It's intended to be as ignorable and
inoffensive -- and, yes, uninteresting -- as possible. In the case of
Muzak, the granddaddy of the form, the programming was deliberately
organized to try to fit the work rhythms of the stores/offices it was
pumped into.
It bears about the same relationship to music that a coat of beige paint
on the walls and contrasting trim on the doorways does to a highly
engaging painting. Sometimes you don't _want_ to engage the passerby;
you just want a splotch of color.
I'm not defending it. I'm just pointing out that before you complain
about it, you should be aware that it is generally a VERY deliberate job
of sound design, and often a very successful one. It just isn't music in
the usual sense. You aren't _supposed_ to listen to it; if it's
bothering you, someone is using it incorrectly.
------------------------------------------------------
Joe Kesselman, http://www.lovesong.com/people/keshlam/
February 13th at Walkabout Clearwater: TOM PAXTON.
http://www.lovesong.com/walkabout/coffeehouse.html
Toby Hanson
<cbe...@execpc.com> wrote:
>Michael Berenstein wrote:
>>
>> Toby Hanson wrote:
>>
>> > What I got was a very slick, sequenced, commercialized elevator
>> > music version of some otherwise great tunes.
>>
>> Again, if you would be patient with me: what is "elevator music"? I guess
>> I have the clue, but would rather know for sure.
>> Thanks
Elevator music is the music played in elevators and other public places
where constant, inoffensive, unobtrusive background music is desired.
Standard musical repertoire of elevator music is popular songs of the past
50-or-so years re-orchestrated in what could be described as a "lite jazz"
manner: flutes, strings, subdued electric guitar, other generally soft
instruments. The new versions of the songs bear little stylistic
resemblence to the original songs. They are designed to be only
marginally noticeable.
>"Elevator" music is "mindless, white on white, plain
>vanilla, empty, nowhere, tuneless and on and on........... Best example:
>Kenny G.
>
>Elevator music ain't got no SOUL! It just fills a
>soundless void.
It's very interesting how Seattle is home not only to the two largest
purveyors of elevator music in the world, AEI and Muzak, but also to Kenny
G, known by locals as "Notes" Gorlich for his propensity to play several
fast, notey passages in his student days at the University of Washington.
jnatoli
Doug Cumming wrote:
> Hello:
>
> There is an interesting article by Canadian composer John Beckwith on "Muzak".
> See pp. 915-16 in the Encyclopedia of Music in Canada [2nd Ed.]. From the
> first couple paragraphs:
>
> "Muzak: name of a company formed to record and program a specially prepared
> music product, bearing the same name as the company, for distribution mainly
> to public environments in which it is intended to affect its hearers
> psychologically in specific ways without drawing undue attention to itself or
> making any demand to be listened to consciously. In Canada, as in more than 20
> other countries, this US brand of programmed background music is ubiquitous.
> The brand-name has been so successful as to be used generically -- like Xerox,
> Coke, or Kleenex. Its inventors and franchise-owners are quick to point out
> that not all background music is Muzak; there are several competing companies.
> Muzak Inc. started in New York in 1934. Its product was nurtured by the 'music
> while you work' movement in World War II and the company began its
> international growth in the immediate post-war period. Its earliest Canadian
> franchises date from 1946 . . . ."
>
> The article continues "public areas infiltrated by Muzak include restaurants,
> supermarkets, banks, car salesrooms, apartment elevators, school corridors,
> and funeral homes. It has been installed in many doctors' and dentists'
> offices and is also used as a supplement to anaesthesia in some hospital
> operating rooms . . . ."
>
> -- Doug Cumming
>
Thank you for that Doug! John Beckwith is an outstanding Canadian composer and
historian. He was one of my professors at U of T and it is good to see something
from him again after all these years.
Best,
Joe
+---------------------------------------------------+
JANPress Publications
http://www.pathway.net/jnatoli/janpress.htm
Your on-line source for original and creative
accordion compositions/arrangements/transcriptions.
+---------------------------------------------------+
Ralph Stricker
How in the world can you say "it is not music"? Are you saying that "Jackie Gleason and
Strings" is not music? (used many times) The problem is the public has been conditioned to
accept loud, heavy beat, no harmonic structure as what constitutes music today. It may be true
that the music is supposed to be "background" and not have the listener pay much attention to
it, but that is only because the music used is too good in most cases for the average public to
appreciate. I hear songs by Gershwin, Porter, Kern etc. Are you saying that this is not music?
SHEEESH
Ralph Stricker
L. McD.
I believe the misunderstanding here is that the reason 'elevator music' is being called "not music"
is that "music" by it's definition is designed to be heard, listened to, enjoyed.... 'elevator
music' is designed to NOT be heard.....
therein lies the rub, not that the structure isn't musical, or that the CONTENT is offensive, just
that they don't want you to pay attention to it or enjoy it. It's just supposed to be "there"
Unc.
L. McD.
Sully5154
purveyors of elevator music in the world, AEI and Muzak, but also to Kenny
G<<
Maybe it's the cloud cover. :-)
Tom Sullivan
Think Globally Act Logically
Ralph Stricker
"L. McD." <unca-...@sff.net> wrote:
It is impossible to hear music and not listen to it and hen ignore it. When I hear a recording
i can not ignore the chord changes, lines being played. If I want to ignore something I don't
listen to it.(I shut it off, change stations etc.) I believe I know what you are trying to say,
i just don't believe you are saying it in a way that makes sense.
Regards,
Ralph Stricker
SNAV88
Gleason and Strings" is not music? (used many times) The problem is the public
has been conditioned to
accept loud, heavy beat, no harmonic structure as what constitutes music today.
It may be true that the music is supposed to be "background" and not have the
listener pay much attention to it, but that is only because the music used is
too good in most cases for the average public to appreciate. I hear songs by
Gershwin, Porter, Kern etc. Are you saying that this is not music?
SHEEESH
Ralph Stricker >>
Muzak plays soft strings and the like, and all are recordings made by the
Melachrino Strings, 101 Strings, etc. All is music and all is beneficial and
all is quality music. It's there for us to receive in whatever way we want. I
looked through my disks for this wonderful thought provoking column by one of
my favorite writers, Sidney J. Harris, who is now deceased; It's worth reading.
Steve Navoyosky
*Music Is for the Soul* BY SYDNEY J. HARRIS
I was sitting in the car, letting the engine warm up, waiting for my mate. We
were late for a dinner party, the weather was wretched, the laundry had put too
much starch in my collar, and I could find only an unmatched set of studs to
put in my dress shirt. My mood, in short, was foul, and getting fouler by the
moment.
I switched on the car radio, turned to my favorite FM station, and was
inundated by the flow of a Schubert trio -- within two bars, I had relaxed in
my seat, starch and studs forgotten, all the irritations and inconveniences of
high-pressure urban living washed away by Sydney Harris the eternal melody of
Opus 99.
Whatever is petty and provoking and transitory shrinks down to negligible size
under the impact of great music. Its beauty is more than esthetic, in a narrow
sense, it is therapeutic in the broadest human sense, because it restores to us
a sane perspective about ourselves, our brief lives, our giddy little egos, and
our ultimate oblivion within the cosmos,
The Real Purpose of Art
This is what great art of any kind is meant for; to make us see more clearly
both the stature of man and his insignificance; to draw sharply the contrast
between our noblest dreams and our vain concerns with status and comfort and
the satisfaction of childish needs. Art is not understood (or is dismissed as
a toy) in our material-oriented society, because it is considered as just
another product to cater to our boredom or to make the culture-vultures feel
superior. Like religion, it is paid tribute by those who have not the slightest
intention of taking its message seriously.
Indeed, music especially has taken on the exact opposite of its proper role in
our society. We are exposed to "background" music everywhere we turn -- in
dentists offices, elevators, restaurants. This is so pervasive, we scarcely
hear it any more; it is meant to pacify us, to narcoticize us, to make us
behave like robots under a kind of melodic anesthesia.
Music Is for the Soul
But the true role of music is to make us more human, not less; to be heard not
merely by the ears, but by the soul; to integrate the personality, not to
deaden it; to give us a more powerful awareness of our wasted potentialities
for loving, not to lose itself in a humming of voice and a tapping of foot.
Music, like all the arts, is a process, not a product. But we have turned it
into a product, and in so doing have sacrificed its essential worth - in fact,
have rendered ourselves almost incapable of hearing it as it was meant to be
heard. For, as our whole environment becomes "packaged" in music, the message
expires within the medium.
L. McD.
worry about is too much starch in his collar and mismatched cufflinks no bloody
wonder he can be calmed by the car radio....
Let him try going to work with an aching back, screaming customers, violent stupid
kids at home and bills that simply aren't going to get paid this month. THEN let
him tell me that four bars of ANYTHING will calm and soothe his soul.
this is getting silly and out of hand.
Unc.
--------
"I was sitting in the car, letting the engine warm up, waiting for my mate. We
were late for a dinner party, the weather was wretched, the laundry had put too
much starch in my collar, and I could find only an unmatched set of studs to
put in my dress shirt. My mood, in short, was foul, and getting fouler by the
moment.
I switched on the car radio, turned to my favorite FM station, and was
inundated by the flow of a Schubert trio -- within two bars, I had relaxed in
my seat, starch and studs forgotten, all the irritations and inconveniences of
high-pressure urban living washed away..."
[snip]....
"Whatever is petty and provoking and transitory shrinks down to negligible size
under the impact of great music. Its beauty is more than esthetic, in a narrow
sense, it is therapeutic in the broadest human sense, because it restores to us
a sane perspective about ourselves, our brief lives, our giddy little egos, and
our ultimate oblivion within the cosmos..."
Cliff Bentz
Ralph Stricker wrote:
> It is impossible to hear music and not listen to it and hen ignore it. When I hear a recording
> i can not ignore the chord changes, lines being played. If I want to ignore something I don't
> listen to it.(I shut it off, change stations etc.) I believe I know what you are trying to say,
> i just don't believe you are saying it in a way that makes sense.
> Regards,
> Ralph Stricker
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Ralph:
I'm curious as to how you handle the so-called music which occurs when
you're on telephone hold or sitting in the doctor's office and un-invited,
annoying background noise (aka music) is attacking one's senses from every
corner. I try very hard to block it out. I'm not always successful and
that annoys me.
Unfortunately, I don't find the old big band sounds of which you speak, on
canned music. Much of what I hear is "new-age" and "soundscapes". The
people responsible for programming are not from our era, Ralph. If they
were, the music might be more palatable.
I'm also curious as to how you manage to respond so rapidly and frequently
to the ng. I usually find my time on the computer limited to about an hour
in AM and an hour in PM. How on earth do you do it?
Cliff Bentz
Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
>How in the world can you say "it is not music"?
By _my_ definition, which is that music is sound structured to produce
an emotional response (which is why I listen happily to everything from
folk to "new music"), it's music. But I don't think that's the
definition most folks use.
Apologies for shorthanding my statement for effect.
Joseph Kesselman, yclept Keshlam
> >> >Joe Kesselman, http://www.lovesong.com/people/keshlam/
> >> >February 13th at Walkabout Clearwater: TOM PAXTON.
> >> >http://www.lovesong.com/walkabout/coffeehouse.html
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >> Strings" is not music? (used many times) The problem is the public has been conditioned to
> >> accept loud, heavy beat, no harmonic structure as what constitutes music today. It may be
> true
> >> that the music is supposed to be "background" and not have the listener pay much attention to
> >> it, but that is only because the music used is too good in most cases for the average public
> to
> >> appreciate. I hear songs by Gershwin, Porter, Kern etc. Are you saying that this is not
> It is impossible to hear music and not listen to it and hen ignore it.
I'll accept that as a statement of your own responses.
Ralph Stricker
"L. McD." <unca-...@sff.net> wrote:
If I had violent stupid kids at home and couldn't pay my bills, I would look at myself to solve
the problem and not the music. In your case I doubt if any music has any value as far as
theraphy, relaxation etc. In the first place you have to have some conception of what good music
is. Obviously you have no idea. That's why you play a squ^#*@$!*
Ralph Stricker
Ralph Stricker
sna...@aol.com (SNAV88) wrote:
>"L. McD." <unca-...@sff.net responded:
>
>
><< With due respect for the tone and tenor of the article... if all this guy
>has to worry about is too much starch in his collar and mismatched cufflinks no
>bloody wonder he can be calmed by the car radio....
>
>Let him try going to work with an aching back, screaming customers, violent
>stupid kids at home and bills that simply aren't going to get paid this month.
>THEN let him tell me that four bars of ANYTHING will calm and soothe his soul.
>
>this is getting silly and out of hand.
>
>Unc. >>
>
>Sorry, Unc. but you missed a unique delivery of Sidney Harris.
>His beginning remarks in the article were of a facetious nature and not a "true
>to life" experience. I regret having included that intelligent writing as it
>was misconstrued and it seems to have upset you.
>
>Sidney Harris was a syndicated writer of high intelligence who also was
>involved in developing The Great Books of the Western World, along with such
>great minds as Mortimer J. Adler and Robert M. Hutchins. In the article, Harris
>was relating that music is to make us more human and that it is a process, but
>with such means to present it in "background" matters, it becomes a product,
>instead. It really is a very good article, and it sides with everyone posting.
>I hope you reread it with new perspective.
>
>Steve Navoyosky
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
Maybe he took my advice and shoved the sque#@&*%# where the sun don't shine. It is blocking his
reading and comprehension ability.
Regards,
Ralph Stricker
Ralph Stricker
Cliff Bentz <cbe...@execpc.com> wrote:
>
>
>Ralph Stricker wrote:
>
>> It is impossible to hear music and not listen to it and hen ignore it. When I hear a
recording
>> i can not ignore the chord changes, lines being played. If I want to ignore something I don't
>> listen to it.(I shut it off, change stations etc.) I believe I know what you are trying to
say,
>> i just don't believe you are saying it in a way that makes sense.
>> Regards,
>> Ralph Stricker
>
>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>
>Ralph:
>
>I'm curious as to how you handle the so-called music which occurs when
>you're on telephone hold or sitting in the doctor's office and un-invited,
>annoying background noise (aka music) is attacking one's senses from every
>corner. I try very hard to block it out. I'm not always successful and
>that annoys me.
If I don't like the type of music being played, it also annoys me. (Kenny G.)
>
>Unfortunately, I don't find the old big band sounds of which you speak, on
>canned music. Much of what I hear is "new-age" and "soundscapes". The
>people responsible for programming are not from our era, Ralph. If they
>were, the music might be more palatable.
You are right. There is not as much of the kind of music that used to be played.
>
>I'm also curious as to how you manage to respond so rapidly and frequently
>to the ng. I usually find my time on the computer limited to about an hour
>in AM and an hour in PM. How on earth do you do it?
Easy. I am up at 6:30am and don't waste time. I teach disadvantaged children music, maintain a
web site, write books. It takes me exactly one hour a day to do all of my internet fulfillments.
Regards,
Ralph Stricker
>Cliff Bentz
bgant
, you should appologize for refering to your children as being "violent and
stupid". What if, tomorrow, you awake to find one missing.
I hope you were just upset.
How-'bout 'em accordions!!!!!!!!
BG
Dan Lavry
<36D87865...@sff.net>...
> With due respect for the tone and tenor of the article... if all this guy
has to
> worry about is too much starch in his collar and mismatched cufflinks no
bloody
> wonder he can be calmed by the car radio....
>
> Let him try going to work with an aching back, screaming customers,
> kids at home and bills that simply aren't going to get paid this month.
THEN let
> him tell me that four bars of ANYTHING will calm and soothe his soul.
>
> this is getting silly and out of hand.
>
> Unc.
One can really listen to music, shutting out all other inputs. Then one can
"listen" to music as background. Of course, these are the 2 extremes, and
they depend on both the individual listeners and specific circumstances. As
a listener, I tend to get fully involved, especially when the music carries
real emotions (from real sad to very up-beat).
Listening to music on an elevator, or while being put "on hold" on the
phone, is the most un inviting set of circumstances - not only the sound
quality is mostly bad (poor speakers, acoustics, bandwidth and so on), but
you "get started" at the middle of a melody, and rarely get to hear it to
the end, because the elevator stopped, the line has been picked and so on.
In short, I personally, find elevator music to be really irritating. Its
not the music itself, it's the setup...
Best
Dan Lavry
SNAV88
<< With due respect for the tone and tenor of the article... if all this guy
has to worry about is too much starch in his collar and mismatched cufflinks no
bloody wonder he can be calmed by the car radio....
Let him try going to work with an aching back, screaming customers, violent
stupid kids at home and bills that simply aren't going to get paid this month.
THEN let him tell me that four bars of ANYTHING will calm and soothe his soul.
this is getting silly and out of hand.
Unc. >>
Sorry, Unc. but you missed a unique delivery of Sidney Harris.