tennis/guitar elbow
tom walls
I've had a sore elbow for several weeks now, and -- after a period of
denial -- I'm beginning to associate it with my playing. I can play
fine(well, as good as ever) but when I quit my elbow is REALLY stiff.
I'm already seeing a physical therapist, so I'll continue working with
him on this, but I'm curious whether anyone else has experienced this.
Phil
Hey, Tom,
In my early 20's (18 or so years ago) I had a bout of tendonitis in my
elbows from guitar playing. Being a young fella, I wasn't warming up
or stretching properly at all, constantly practicing fast bop heads,
and I also had the guitar in my hands ALL the time as I was practicing
during the day and teaching at night. I also recall one particular
incident where I was jamming with some folks at a party, and I was
playing an acoustic with a lot of intensity, for a very long time.
After that night, the pain and tingling became more serious.
After, like you, I realized the soreness in my elbows (sometimes
extending down my arms into my wrists) wasn't going away, I went to a
sports medicine clinic at the hospital. The MDs watched me play,
declared that I had decent technique, made a little pad for me to
stuff in my shirt to cushion the upper forearm of my picking arm from
the edge of my guitar, and prescribed physical therapy. The PT (who
was a violinst) showed me some stretches and posture-related
exercises. This helped a little, but not fast enough, so I also
pursued a holistic path, seeing an Acupuncturist, who recommended
epsom salt soaks, exercise and B vitamins.
What helped most? I don't really know. After about a year and a
half, it slowly went away -- I noticed it less and less until I didn't
notice it at all. But I also played/practiced much less because of
it. Rest and time seemed to be the key. I haven't had any real re-
occurrances, maybe a few days here and there, but I take it much
easier these days.
-Phil
335
yes, i had a severe bout with tennis elbow this year and I couldn't
believe how painful it was. It seemed to be caused by a combination of
playing guitar, carrying a heavy amp and excessive computer
keyboarding. Mainly, I think it was the amp that did it and then once
it flared up everything else seemed to aggravate it.
I applied ice packs and avoided using that arm as much as possible for
awhile. I also changed my amp from an Evans JE 150 to a Clarus RE
which has reduced considerably the weight I have to lug around. I saw
a doc about it and he recommended a little number called an elbow
strap for support. You can get those at a pharmacy. That did help
some.
He also recommended a cortisone shot...said it would clear up the
inflammation very quickly. I never got that together though; too
afraid of needles I guess. I've heard there are other exercises that
can help; your PT probably knows the score on those. Mine has cleared
up considerably since I stopped carrying the big amp. Hope yours gets
better fast.
charles robinson
"tom walls" <tomw...@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:0436b5cb-17c7-4a3f...@k4g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
I've had the same thing for about a month in a half now, constant on the
left side and sporadic on the right. At first I thought it was from carrying
my amp but now I'm not so sure. It seems to be lessening but I have a fat
gig coming up in a coupe of days so I'm headed to the doctor today, I'll let
you know what transpires.................Charlie
charles robinson
"charles robinson" <robins...@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:hdrqs2$ues$1...@news.albasani.net...
Love that spell check:) P.S. I just stared practicing and it came back
strong ---- Charlie
tom walls
> After about a year and a
> half, it slowly went away -- I noticed it less and less until I didn't
> notice it at all. But I also played/practiced much less because of
> it. Rest and time seemed to be the key. I haven't had any real re-
> occurrances, maybe a few days here and there, but I take it much
> easier these days.
>
> -Phil
A year and a half? Damn. Thanks for the reply, Phil.
tom walls
You guys are confirming my suspicions. I'm wearing the strap, as I
speak(type). Thanks.
tom walls
wrote:
> "tom walls" <tomwa...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> I've had the same thing for about a month in a half now, constant on the
> left side and sporadic on the right. At first I thought it was from carrying
> my amp but now I'm not so sure. It seems to be lessening but I have a fat
> gig coming up in a coupe of days so I'm headed to the doctor today, I'll let
> you know what transpires.................Charlie
I guess I'd be okay if I used my elbow for guitar only(extreme but
possible option), but some days I'm even having trouble lifting a cup
of coffee. Good luck, Charlie.
Mark Guest
Yeah, I've got it right now, too. Mine was caused by holding a guitar
while I sanded it down. I now understand why the luthier suggested I
brace the guitar instead of holding it... Rest, massage, acupuncture,
stinky Chinese herbs (Dragon's Blood) are what I've been doing. Really
sucks, as I had settled into a nice, nearly disciplined practice
routine that I'm finding it tough to forego. Instead of practicing for
2-3 hours at a stretch (with short breaks), I've been told to do
shorter sessions with more rest between them. grrrr
All the best,
Mark Guest
Jazz Guitar
www.markguest.net
www.cdbaby.com/cd/markguest
Music produces a kind of pleasure which human nature cannot do
without."
Confucius (c.551-479 BC)
Phil
Yeah, to compleletely go away. It got better during that time though.
335
Your PT may already know about this treatment: this ( somewhat long)
article appeared in the NYT awhile ago. It might be worth a try.
http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/08/25/phys-ed-an-easy-fix-for-tennis-elbow/
tom walls
> Yeah, I've got it right now, too. Mine was caused by holding a guitar
> while I sanded it down. I now understand why the luthier suggested I
> brace the guitar instead of holding it... Rest, massage, acupuncture,
> stinky Chinese herbs (Dragon's Blood) are what I've been doing. Really
> sucks, as I had settled into a nice, nearly disciplined practice
> routine that I'm finding it tough to forego. Instead of practicing for
> 2-3 hours at a stretch (with short breaks), I've been told to do
> shorter sessions with more rest between them. grrrr
>
> All the best,
>
> Mark Guest
> Jazz Guitarwww.markguest.netwww.cdbaby.com/cd/markguest
>
I literally feel your pain.
Mark Guest
Yeah, that sucks, doesn't it?
I forgot to mention I'm also trying to stay on Aleve and White Willow
bark tincture.
All the best,
Mark Guest
Mark Guest
> Your PT may already know about this treatment: this ( somewhat long)
Sounds hopeful! Figures that "eccentric exercise" would work for the
maladies that afflict guitarists...
edspyhill01
I'm still going through the healing process. A week ago I cautiously
started practicing 30 minutes a day since I stopped all playing at the
end of April. It was more that tendinitis in my left elbow, it was
also bicep tendinitis.
Find a Myofascial Release Therapist. This was the core therapy that
worked. My therapist has goddess status. What was fortuitous is she
has experience working with guitar players, bass players, and
drummers. Acupuncture did nothing for me.
Try to find an Alexander Technique practitioner who works with
musicians and have your playing posture evaluated. I also took some
Alexander Technique classes and did a lot of reading on that subject.
Ed S.
Nil
rec.music.makers.guitar.jazz:
I've had tennis elbow for about 2 1/2 years now. At first it was in my
left arm - sore elbow, soreness traveling down my forearm. Weak grip. I
sucked it up for about ten months, thinking it would go away on its
own, before seeing the doctor. Unfortunately, they told me there was
little they could do about it, that it would go away on its own. They
prescribed me some ibuprofen as and anti-inflammatory, and gave me a
brace to wear, and showed me some stretches. Otherwise, they mentioned
having cortisone shots, but they said that would relieve the discomfort
for a certain period of time, but not really cure it. I took the
ibuprofen when I had pain, wore the brace to bed, didn't do the
stretches much. Finally, after a year and a half it faded away.
Now the pain is in the OTHER arm. I'm treating it the same way, but
it's not gotten much better yet. I may see the doctor again, I guess.
I'm not happy about having to wait another year before it (maybe) goes
away.
I don't think my condition is due to guitar playing, although that may
aggravate it. I think it may have been more due to weight lifting
(which I stopped) and/or the way I hold my arms when I sleep. Playing
guitar doesn't seem to cause me pain, but I also play ukulele, and that
DOES (because my arms are folded tighter, I think.)
Bob Agnew
it.
"Nil" <redn...@REMOVETHIScomcast.net> wrote in message
news:Xns9CC59F26...@130.133.1.4...
Dom Minasi
> Mine was diagnosed as Bursitis and calcium deposits. Playing just agravated
> it.
>
>
> news:Xns9CC59F26...@130.133.1.4...
>
>
>
> > On 16 Nov 2009, tom walls <tomwa...@gmail.com> wrote in
Hey Tom
About 10 years ago I was diagnosed with a combo of tennis and golf
elbow. It was brought on by using my arm and elbow for picking alla
the Johnny Smith Aides to Technique book. I tried everything. Doctors,
massage therapists. I had to take Advill before and after I played and
at one point I couldn't play at all.
What finally helped was going to a chiropractor. For some reason when
he adjusted my neck I could feel a release in my arm. I also changed
the way i picked and began using more wrist movement. I hope this
helps.
Dom
Bg
need the elbow to be at about a 90 degree angle, and not bent too far
back.
Bg
tom walls
April! Oy vey. Yeah, I've got tendinitis in my rotary cuff.
tom walls
> On 16 Nov 2009, tom walls <tomwa...@gmail.com> wrote in
I have yet to hear from someone who doesn't sound like the image of me
(god help your souls). I quit weight lifting for a month due to the
pain in my rotary cuff, then tried to start up again with lighter
weights and immediately inflamed my neck. I applied heat and quit
weights altogether, and the neck felt better but began to get some
inflammation lower in my arm which settled in my elbow. Finally saw
the doctor who sent me to the physical therapist and a month later
here I am. I've got the brace, seeing the therapist three days a week,
and I'm doing a variety of exercises. Sucks. And I just got this
terrific new guitar, too!
tom walls
Yeah, I've been thinking about that because I'm a real elbow guy. The
physical therapist thinks maybe in three weeks or so I can try playing
for short periods. I'll give it a shot. Hope it doesn't mess up my
time.
edspyhill01
Take the time to organize your practice, read books about other
musicians, revisit your goals, look through all the books you have
collected. Most important, evaluate how you hold the guitar, how much
pressure you use while fretting, how your right hand affects other
areas. One exercise I did when I could no longer "not play" was to
play chromatic scales and just touch the strings (classical guitar).
I started to disconnect the act of fretting notes from applying
pressure to the string. I now play those exercises with just enough
pressure to play buzzing notes then add just a bit more pressure to
play the note clearly. That exercise is widely known.
During the Myofascial work the therapist pushes along a muscle on the
left side of my neck and something is pulled sharply under my shoulder
blade. Fascia covers muscle and is like the covering in brake
cables. The muscle must move freely through the fascia tube or it
gets stuck and starts to pull on another muscle.
There are three levels of fascia. Each muscle fiber is wrapped in
fascia; then each bundle of muscle fibers is wrapped in fascia; and
finally each complete muscle (bicep, tricep, etc) is wrapped in
fascia.
Here is a good place to start.
http://www.myofascialrelease.com/home.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Myofascial_release
Don't neglect to wrap the arm above the elbow. The tendons above the
elbow are probably also affected. Here is the best elbow support I
found for my problem, and I must have about 8 different kinds.
http://preview.tinyurl.com/yenwnwf
Ed S.
tom walls
>
> Don't neglect to wrap the arm above the elbow. The tendons above the
> elbow are probably also affected. Here is the best elbow support I
> found for my problem, and I must have about 8 different kinds.
>
> http://preview.tinyurl.com/yenwnwf
>
>
> Ed S.
Thanks for the help, Ed. I'm printing this out.
Joe Finn
news:0436b5cb-17c7-4a3f...@k4g2000yqb.googlegroups.com...
I played tennis since I was a little kid. I was an everyday player for many
years. I played in local tournaments and did some scholastic coaching and
"tennis pro" teaching. I finally blew out my elbow at age 48. I could still
hit a backhands, serves and overheads but my forehand was gone. The pain was
too much. This caused me to greatly curtail my tennis schedule. Nowadays I
just play once in a while.
The elbow problem requires rest. Nothing else helps. In my case the pain was
such that I could not lift anything or even brush my teeth right handed. The
pain would wake me up in the middle of a sound sleep too. It took two years
for this to subside and I could never hit a full blooded forehand again.
My specific injury was caused by the motion that puts topspin on the
forehand. This is a twisting counterclockwise motion similar to unscrewing a
lid from a jar. The injury never had an effect on playing the guitar. The
way I play I only move my wrist and forearm when picking; the elbow stays
pretty still.
I think it's a good idea for you to see a therapist or a doctor. I never
experienced what I would describe as stiffness associated with tennis elbow.
Maybe you have something else? ...joe
--
Visit me on the web www.JoeFinn.net
Martin Roman
Hi,
have a look here: http://www.tennisarm.ch/
This is what helped me a lot and I was surprised how fast the
stretching exercises helped. I had the pain for months and tried
various things before.
The site is in German, English and Dutch. And the pictures for the
stretching excercises are pretty self explanatory.
Good luck
Martin
tom walls
> "tom walls" <tomwa...@gmail.com> wrote in message
My therapist actually calls it "lateral arterial mumbo jumbo" -- I
think I got that right :-) -- says it's commonly called "tennis elbow"
but nowadays should properly be called "computer elbow". I do get
stiffness after using the computer keyboard -- although not so on my
laptop -- and after playing guitar. I'm doing about a dozen exercises,
wearing a elbow strap, a wrist splint at night, taking anti-
inflamatories, ice packs, etc. I think that my case is not so bad,
there is just stiffness, soreness, no throbbing pain. My therapist
thinks I may see some improvement if I take a total break for 3 weeks,
one week of which is already past. I'm such a pathetic baby that I'm
in deep despair over the three week moratorium. My problem is
compounded by some tendonitis in my rotary cuff, which is more serious/
chronic.
Thanks for the advice.
tom walls
Interesting. Some of the stuff on the site is totally according to my
experience, and some totally contradictory. I have been doing the
stretching exercise. Food for thought.Thanks.
charles robinson
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I just got back from the doctor that I was supposed to go to the other day.
Mine's not too bad, the treatment is similar to yours, anti-inflammatory,
limit use of wrist and elbow, apply ice pack after playing if it hurts. For
steroids or Cortisone if it were to get worse plan on a week of not playing
(this one is unacceptable at the present time).
Charlie
Robert
> Anybody have trouble with "tennis elbow" related to guitar playing?
> I've had a sore elbow for several weeks now, and -- after a period of
> denial -- I'm beginning to associate it with my playing. I can play
> fine(well, as good as ever) but when I quit my elbow is REALLY stiff.
> I'm already seeing a physical therapist, so I'll continue working with
> him on this, but I'm curious whether anyone else has experienced this.
Maybe you are straining when you play (unconsciously). Maybe your
overall stress level is affecting the healing process- anger can
affect you body in many negative ways if unresolved. Lack of sleep.
Lay off the guitar for awhile: COMPLETELY! Ibuprofen.