guitar question

[Peter Weber]

Hi All
Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now planning
to spend some money (≈1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably
dreadnought again. I looked at a Gibson J-45 which was OK, but not a
massive improvement over what I've got already. Any recommendations (I'm
lost as far as the various Martins are concerned)?
many thanks in advance
Peter

[JD]

I don't know how the exchange rate is or what the
U.K. guitar market looks like but I'd suggest
Larrivee as a good bang for the buck. I'd also
suggest trying something besides a dreadnought,
perhaps an OM. Unless you're hung up on brand
names 1800 pounds (or less) worth of Larrivee is
going to be a lot more guitar than 1800 pounds
worth of Martin or Gibson. Taylor is also worth
looking at.

[Tom from Texas]

I'd agree with JD on bang for buck. I've found the Blueridge and Road
King brands great value for the money. Make sure yer gettin' solid
woods though. Might think about an archtop by Eastman or Loar for
something completely different. Buying used can get you more for your
money, too.

Tom from Texas

[JimLowther]

On Jun 2, 11:06 am, Peter Weber <p.we...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

I also really like Larrivees. I have four, all very responsive.
However, I would say play a lot of guitars until one speaks (or sings)
to you. We all perceive things differently, which is probably why so
many different guitars exist. I am not surprised that the J-45 did
not especially impress. This has been my experience as well.

Best wishes,

Dr. Jim Lowther

[JD]

I've only played 2 J-45's that were good. One was
re-topped by Cat Fox and the other was built by
Roy McAlister.

[Steve Hawkins]

Peter Weber <p.w...@ntlworld.com> wrote in news:ORqyr.1324127$xD4.526306
@fx06.am4:

If you can muster a wee bit more funds, I'd go with Brook. You might also
be able to find one used over there for a very good price. I have a Lyn
(00), they are excellent instruments.

http://www.brookguitars.com/

Steve Hawkins

[Tony Done]

"Peter Weber" wrote in message news:ORqyr.1324127$xD4.5...@fx06.am4...

***************

You don't need to spend big$, or big sterling in your case, to get good
sound, I've recently played a $150 Chinese Ashton that sounded as good and
played as well as the most expensive guitars in the shop; my own favourite
guitar for fingerpicking has a plywood top. However, I'm strongly prejudiced
against non-resettable necks, and that does cost. I could find something I
really liked in any of the Big Three - Martin, Taylor and Larrivee. Maton
would also be on that list here in Oz. Beyond that, only you can decide what
you like. Most recently the inexpensive Taylor 114 and 214 have impressed me
a lot. I've played a (very!) few nice modern Gibsons I liked, in the J-45
and Blues King models.

Tony D

[Colin Irvine]

On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 17:06:06 +0100, Peter Weber <p.w...@ntlworld.com>
wrote:

>Hi All
>Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now planning

>to spend some money (?1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably

>dreadnought again. I looked at a Gibson J-45 which was OK, but not a
>massive improvement over what I've got already. Any recommendations (I'm
>lost as far as the various Martins are concerned)?
>many thanks in advance
>Peter

I'd be looking for an M or OM Martin.

--
Colin Irvine
http://www.colinandpat.co.uk

[Tony Done]

"Tony Done" wrote in message news:jqdsdv$chu$1...@dont-email.me...

*******************

The way this thread is likely to shape up I would like to offer a comment on
something I feel quite strongly about:

Take any specific advice with a large grain of salt. We know nothing about
your tastes in music, tone, string gauges, aesthetics, whatever, so I think
the best anyone do is comment on what they like, and what options are
available. For example, of the Big Three I mentioned, I know from experience
that I stand a lot less chance of finding one I like in one of those than
the other two, but it is a **personal** opinion with which many would
disagree, and I wouldn't want to impose it on anyone else. Just go out and
try a lot of guitars in all the price ranges that you can afford.

Tony D

[Peter Weber]

Thanks for all the comments so far. I realized that I should add a bit
more info: I tried a few different guitars, e.g. Tanglewood and
Breedlove, at a local shop (fine guitars in Abingdon). I didn't like
them that much (I tend to play anything from Indie to Blues, I mainly
play with a pick). None of them were Dreadnoughts, which is why I
thought I should maybe stick to those (also liked the J-45 much better
than the J-200).
Hope this makes sense, thanks again
Peter

[Al Evans]

In article <XnsA0667ABA0A290st...@74.209.131.10>,

Steve Hawkins <stephen....@frontier.comREMOVETHIS> wrote:

> If you can muster a wee bit more funds, I'd go with Brook. You might also
> be able to find one used over there for a very good price.

I agree with Steve. Brooks are very nice guitars. Buy local if you can:-)

--Al Evans--

[hank alrich]

Peter Weber <p.w...@ntlworld.com> wrote:

> I tend to play anything from Indie to Blues

How would you characterize "Indie" as a genre? I'm just curious. So far
I've thought of it as a marketing category with little specific musical
meaning.

--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://www.youtube.com/walkinaymusic
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidri

[Carl]

hank alrich wrote:
> Peter Weber <p.w...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
>
>> I tend to play anything from Indie to Blues
>
> How would you characterize "Indie" as a genre? I'm just curious. So
> far I've thought of it as a marketing category with little specific
> musical meaning.
>

Yours is a good question, Hank, and the same one I've asked myself a couple
of times. My son's band, The Narrative, is classified as an "indie" band.

While it doesn't really define an exacting genre of music, it stems from the
fact (as I think you know) that they retain complete control over their
artistic production. If you think about it, what is "rock"? We consider that
a genre, but The Stones don't sound anything like The Eagles, neither of
which seem related to, say, U2.

In the genre of "bluegrass", a band with a 5-string Scruggs-style banjo and
a fiddle and 5 men is going to sound somewhat different than one that
features the mandolin, dulcimer and a female vocalist.

I think this article does a pretty good job of answering our question (much
better than my feeble attempt anyway)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indie_rock

[hank alrich]

Carl <crot...@NOSPAMoptonline.net> wrote:

> hank alrich wrote:
> > Peter Weber <p.w...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> >
> >> I tend to play anything from Indie to Blues
> >
> > How would you characterize "Indie" as a genre? I'm just curious. So
> > far I've thought of it as a marketing category with little specific
> > musical meaning.
> >
> Yours is a good question, Hank, and the same one I've asked myself a couple
> of times. My son's band, The Narrative, is classified as an "indie" band.
>
> While it doesn't really define an exacting genre of music, it stems from the
> fact (as I think you know) that they retain complete control over their
> artistic production.

Lately I've seen it used as an add-on buzzword for loads of stuff,
particularly "indie folk".

> If you think about it, what is "rock"? We consider that
> a genre, but The Stones don't sound anything like The Eagles, neither of
> which seem related to, say, U2.

Agreed. Then there is rock 'n' roll, which from that list only the
Stones can muster, sometimes, IMO.

> In the genre of "bluegrass", a band with a 5-string Scruggs-style banjo and
> a fiddle and 5 men is going to sound somewhat different than one that
> features the mandolin, dulcimer and a female vocalist.

In my view the latter ensemble may draw material from bluegrass, but
that can't be an actual bluegrass band. Shaidri and I appeal to some
bluegrass fans, though I can't call us a bluegrass ensemble.

My mind wants at least a guitar, a five-string banjo, and a mandolin for
bluegrass. The rest of it I feel is optional. That's just me. These
things get blurred as time passes, people jam, and bands arise
therefrom.

> I think this article does a pretty good job of answering our question (much
> better than my feeble attempt anyway)
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indie_rock

Yes, the standard outline, cogently presented.

[don hindenach]

That's one of the ones I was trying to think of while reading this thread. The other is AJ Lucas.

Luthier-built is a whole new world. Go looking . . . .

--
-donh-
donh at audiosys dot com

[JD]

I didn't think 1800 pounds was enough to get into
a boutique guitar.

[Steve Hawkins]

JD <jdblac...@gmail.com> wrote in
news:4fcb7d78$0$308$c3e8da3$4db3...@news.astraweb.com:

Depends on the boutique. My Brook 00 was 1375 pounds new. The current
price on a new Teign (dreadnought) right out of the Brook shop is 2075
pounds.

Steve Hawkins

[Geezer]

"Steve Hawkins" <stephen....@frontier.comREMOVETHIS> wrote in message
news:XnsA067608F7F9A0st...@74.209.131.10...

Don't listen to Hawkins. He doesn't even know how to tune a guitar...


Geezer

[Tom from Texas]

On Jun 2, 5:31 pm, Colin Irvine <l...@bottom.of.home.page> wrote:
> On Sat, 02 Jun 2012 17:06:06 +0100, Peter Weber <p.we...@ntlworld.com>

Ah, but that implies a "standard scale" instrument, not the short
scale of the SP6 or J45, which I prefer. So many characteristics to
consider. Maybe Peter should visit a local luthier and at least
discuss the aspects of the different choices he has available.

Tom from Texas

[Carl]

Just to make that part clearer, I took the guitar as a"given" in both band
setups. I was not leaving it out because I didn't mention it in the list.

Prior to Earle Scruggs joining Bill Monroe's band, the banjo was a minor
part of the "original" bluegrass sound as far as I understand it. Scrugg's'
playing style brought it to prominence. I think Monroe's mandolin, and the
fiddler played the key soloist roles until then.

I have seen bands that classified themselves as "bluegrass" that did not
have a 5-string banjo. And, likewise, Lester Flatt was not much of an
instrumentalist on his geetar, nor did I hear the guitar used much as an
instrumental instrument in bluegrass until The Greenbriar Boys and John
Herald made use of his skills on several tunes. I do recall there was, at
the time (early 60's) a 15 year-old guitar prodigy (whose name I've long
forgotten) who was a featured instrumentalist with Roger Sprung.

[Tony Done]

"Peter Weber" wrote in message news:PPGyr.1002343$Up1....@fx30.am4...

**************

I can't tell you how to choose guitars, but I can explain how I do it. For
fingerpicking in the John Hurt style I like tight-sounding guitars eg
Matons, rather than ones with big orchestral voices. For slide I like
evenness across the whole range, especially the high registers, loud and
with good sustain. Requirements for ensemble playing would be different
again, but these days the pickup system often has a lot to do with
suitability for that role rather than the instrument itself.

One thing I have found is that it is easy to be beguiled by interesting big
sounds in the music store, but I get the guitar home and find it isn't that
well suited to the more intimate environment of my lounge room or
amplification via a pickup system.

FWIW, I never tried a J-200 I liked, though I understand that good ones do
exist, and J-45s seem well suited to my style - <g> I also like that Gibson
teardrop sunburst.

Tony D

[Ty Ford]

On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:06:06 -0400, Peter Weber wrote
(in article <ORqyr.1324127$xD4.5...@fx06.am4>):

> Hi All
> Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now planning

> to spend some money (â 1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably

> dreadnought again. I looked at a Gibson J-45 which was OK, but not a
> massive improvement over what I've got already. Any recommendations (I'm
> lost as far as the various Martins are concerned)?
> many thanks in advance
> Peter

The J45 is one of those guitars that doesn't make a point of sticking out.
It's a great box and good for recording.

Regards,

Ty Ford

Try my new blog; http://tyfordaudiovideo.blogspot.com/
Try my audio sample archive: http://tinyurl.com/796z25d
Try my gear reviews: http://tinyurl.com/79q797r

[Stephen Calder]

On 4/06/2012 11:04 AM, Ty Ford wrote:
> On Sat, 2 Jun 2012 12:06:06 -0400, Peter Weber wrote
> (in article<ORqyr.1324127$xD4.5...@fx06.am4>):
>
>> Hi All
>> Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for>13yrs I'm now planning

>> to spend some money (≈1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably

>> dreadnought again. I looked at a Gibson J-45 which was OK, but not a
>> massive improvement over what I've got already. Any recommendations (I'm
>> lost as far as the various Martins are concerned)?
>> many thanks in advance
>> Peter
>
> The J45 is one of those guitars that doesn't make a point of sticking out.
> It's a great box and good for recording.
>
> Regards,
>
> Ty Ford
>
> Try my new blog; http://tyfordaudiovideo.blogspot.com/
> Try my audio sample archive: http://tinyurl.com/796z25d
> Try my gear reviews: http://tinyurl.com/79q797r
>

The J45 I played sounded great for lead lines with a pick. But it was
very bright for strumming.

--
Stephen
Ballina, NSW

[Al Evans]

In article <1kl3rpg.gf28a6kueorcN%walk...@nv.net>,

walk...@nv.net (hank alrich) wrote:

> Lately I've seen it used as an add-on buzzword for loads of stuff,
> particularly "indie folk".

Ain't no money in poetry,
That's what sets the poet free.

> ...Shaidri and I appeal to some

> bluegrass fans, though I can't call us a bluegrass ensemble.

Dang, I thought you must be, since you play Bluegrass Breakfasts! :-)

--Al Evans--

[hank alrich]

Al Evans <a...@tbtm.org> wrote:

> In article <1kl3rpg.gf28a6kueorcN%walk...@nv.net>,
> walk...@nv.net (hank alrich) wrote:
>
> > Lately I've seen it used as an add-on buzzword for loads of stuff,
> > particularly "indie folk".
>
> Ain't no money in poetry,
> That's what sets the poet free.

"There's no money in poetry, but then there's no poetry in money,
either." – Robert Graves.

I especially enjoy it when people describe their music along the lines
of "indie folk country pop blues alternative americana".

> > ...Shaidri and I appeal to some
> > bluegrass fans, though I can't call us a bluegrass ensemble.
>
> Dang, I thought you must be, since you play Bluegrass Breakfasts! :-)

The perfect foundation for a genre!

We do twist the set lists that direction, and I may start borrowing a
banjo in Austin.

[Tom from Texas]

On Jun 3, 1:57 pm, "Carl" <croth...@NOSPAMoptonline.net> wrote:
> hank alrich wrote:

> > Carl <croth...@NOSPAMoptonline.net> wrote:
>
> >> hank alrich wrote:

> > Yes, the standard outline, cogently presented.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

From what I've read and heard, when Monroe was forming his band, he
experimented with instrumentation. At times, using a piano or
accordian. He didn't like dobro in his band. Charlie was a more than
adequate guitarplayer but did seem to stick with a solid rhythm.

Tom from Texas

[Tom from Texas]

On Jun 4, 6:15 am, Al Evans <a...@tbtm.org> wrote:
> In article <1kl3rpg.gf28a6kueorcN%walki...@nv.net>,

>  walki...@nv.net (hank alrich) wrote:
>
> > Lately I've seen it used as an add-on buzzword for loads of stuff,
> > particularly "indie folk".
>
> Ain't no money in poetry,
> That's what sets the poet free.
>
> > ...Shaidri and I appeal to some
> > bluegrass fans, though I can't call us a bluegrass ensemble.
>
> Dang, I thought you must be, since you play Bluegrass Breakfasts! :-)
>
>                                         --Al Evans--

In Austin, isn't it Blowgrass as in the Mexican variety? I always
hear people on Guadalupe saying, "Man, this grass is smokin' ".

Tom from Texas

[Tom from Texas]

On Jun 4, 9:07 am, walki...@nv.net (hank alrich) wrote:
> Al Evans <a...@tbtm.org> wrote:

> > In article <1kl3rpg.gf28a6kueorcN%walki...@nv.net>,

When people ask me what kind of music I play (Shut up, Milam!), I say,
"What ye gonna pay me for?"

Tom from Texas

[Carl]

Tony Done wrote:
> "Peter Weber" wrote in message
> news:PPGyr.1002343$Up1....@fx30.am4...
> On 03/06/2012 00:02, Tony Done wrote:
>>
>>
>> "Tony Done" wrote in message news:jqdsdv$chu$1...@dont-email.me...
>>
>>
>>
>> "Peter Weber" wrote in message
>> news:ORqyr.1324127$xD4.5...@fx06.am4... Hi All
>> Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now

>> planning to spend some money (?1800 pounds) on a quality guitar,

What's your take on an early '20's Gibson L-3 for the style you play? I have
one. It's a c.1923 in excellent original condition. Or are you strictly a
flattop man? (for those who don't know, the early L3's were archtop guitars
with round holes).

[Tony Done]

"Carl" wrote in message news:4fcd2367$0$6080$607e...@cv.net...

****************

I've never really played archtops; we don't get to see a huge selection of
anything here in O, except beer. What I would be looking for is a playable
neck and bright well-defined notes that jump out like peas from a pea
shooter, also very good note separation in chords and double stops - that
last is a major attraction of the plywood Maton I've mentioned before. The
other thing I notice immediately and avoid is any hint of dullness in the
bass.

Tony D

[esha...@yahoo.com]

You want Fresh Strings!!! Ed

[Tony Done]

wrote in message
news:10e2b5b0-6f87-4dc2...@googlegroups.com...

****************

FWIW, I change my strings more often than I change my socks.

If buying a new, it is always a good idea to ask for a new set of strings to
be installed if the guitar sounds a bit dull. Sometimes it is just the
strings, but often enough the guitar is inherently clunky. A few years ago a
lot of Martins were like that. You'd put new strings on, and the bass couple
would sound OK for about an hour, then everything would go dull again.

Tony D

[esha...@yahoo.com]

>
> FWIW, I change my strings more often than I change my socks.
>
> If buying a new, it is always a good idea to ask for a new set of strings to
> be installed if the guitar sounds a bit dull. Sometimes it is just the
> strings, but often enough the guitar is inherently clunky. A few years ago a
> lot of Martins were like that. You'd put new strings on, and the bass couple
> would sound OK for about an hour, then everything would go dull again.
>
> Tony D

smelly feet : ' ) - yeah new string can make a big dif. ed

[jgoska]

On Jun 2, 12:06 pm, Peter Weber <p.we...@ntlworld.com> wrote:
> Hi All
> Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now planning

> to spend some money (≈1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably

> dreadnought again. I looked at a Gibson J-45 which was OK, but not a
> massive improvement over what I've got already. Any recommendations (I'm
> lost as far as the various Martins are concerned)?
> many thanks in advance
> Peter

Official advice on this matter: Take your sweet time shopping.
Play everything. Travel, if necessary, for a better selection. You
owe it to yourself to play a number of Martins at least before even
thinking the word "Gibson." Become an expert. Do not, under any
conditions, just "settle" for anything. Wait until you fall madly in
love and you know. THE guitar is out there, waiting for you.

[hank alrich]

jgoska <jgo...@my-deja.com> wrote:

> You
> owe it to yourself to play a number of Martins at least before even
> thinking the word "Gibson."

Perhaps not if one includes older, as in decades older, Gibsons.

--

[Tony Done]

"jgoska" wrote in message
news:ab3a103a-b662-412f...@e20g2000vbm.googlegroups.com...

************

OK, I know I've got a fixation about this, but I just can't risk the
temptation.

It isn't just Martin, Larrivee and Taylor should be treated with equal
consideration, plus a number of European and boutique makers, to say nothing
of Maton. Gibson fill a specific niche, like the old Guilds (and maybe the
new ones), and should IMO not be dismissed out of hand - it all depends what
you are looking for in terms of tone and aesthetics.

It is certainly true that making an informed decision involves a fair amount
of educational effort, but it is a whole lot better than taking someone
else's word for it or buying on a name.

Tony D

[gtr]

I would recommend a system that evolved the last time I had saved a
goodly stash and decided to buy a really nice acoustic. I figured at
my age I oughta have a really nice box sometime before I get planted in
one.

I took my wife to a number of places (a unique situation, but we were
out of town). I wouldn't play some guitars that were out of my price
range, but didn't like some that were in my price range.

The wife was adamant that I disregard the price and my accrued attitude
(good and bad) towards certain brands. She began bringing me guitars
(with little general knowledge of the brands/qualities) and I sat there
with my eyes closed and gave my viewpoints. It was *fantastic*. The
Martins I had longed for felt uncomfortable and didn't sound so great.
Some German guitars played and sounded excellent great but were way out
of the price range. We continued this across a few towns over the next
few months and at least 6 stores.

Frankly I was surprised how few I liked. But she encouranged me not to
buy something because it "was in range", but first to assess that it
was something I would really enjoy regardless of cost. This blindfold
thing was a friggin' revelation!

Finally I found a guitar that sounded excellent, played well and was in
my price range. It was a Larivee L-09 40th Anniversary that they had
at a Sam Ash. It listed much higher but I managed to get the price way
down. I was quite happy.

Sadly, I've not playing acoustic these days so it has languished in the
closet. But one of these days…!

[Peter Weber]

Just had a look at a dreadnought by David Webber
(http://www.webberguitars.com),very nice indeed. I'll take your advice
though and play more...
many thanks for all your comments
Peter

[esha...@yahoo.com]

I'd say FORGET looking at the names - I've played Yamahas that sound better than Martins. Just go find one that talks to you.. Also don't fret to hard cause 1 guitar just isn't enough.. I have 17 now.. prob enough.. Ed

[hank alrich]

<esha...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Tuesday, June 5, 2012 11:09:50 AM UTC-5, hank alrich wrote:
> > jgoska <jgo...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> >
> > > You
> > > owe it to yourself to play a number of Martins at least before even
> > > thinking the word "Gibson."
> >
> > Perhaps not if one includes older, as in decades older, Gibsons.

> I'd say FORGET looking at the names - I've played Yamahas that sound
> better than Martins. Just go find one that talks to you.. Also don't
> fret to hard cause 1 guitar just isn't enough.. I have 17 now.. prob
> enough.. Ed

Well, there are names that appeal to me, like McCollum, McAlister,
Wingert, and more. Were I factory guitar chasing I'd go see Bill
Collings.

I have two steel string acoustics, both McCollums. They'll do unless I
get to a point that I have to travel outside the US with a guitar. I
have spent almost no time at all in my life shopping for guitars.

[esha...@yahoo.com]

Pretty bad argument - since you have spent so little time trying/compairing
other guitars. ed

[hank alrich]

<esha...@yahoo.com> wrote:

> On Thursday, June 14, 2012 6:36:44 PM UTC-5, hank alrich wrote:
> > <esha...@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > On Tuesday, June 5, 2012 11:09:50 AM UTC-5, hank alrich wrote:
> > > > jgoska <jgo...@my-deja.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > You
> > > > > owe it to yourself to play a number of Martins at least before even
> > > > > thinking the word "Gibson."
> > > >
> > > > Perhaps not if one includes older, as in decades older, Gibsons.
> >
> > > I'd say FORGET looking at the names - I've played Yamahas that sound
> > > better than Martins. Just go find one that talks to you.. Also don't
> > > fret to hard cause 1 guitar just isn't enough.. I have 17 now.. prob
> > > enough.. Ed
> >
> > Well, there are names that appeal to me, like McCollum, McAlister,
> > Wingert, and more. Were I factory guitar chasing I'd go see Bill
> > Collings.
> >
> > I have two steel string acoustics, both McCollums. They'll do unless I
> > get to a point that I have to travel outside the US with a guitar. I
> > have spent almost no time at all in my life shopping for guitars.

> Pretty bad argument - since you have spent so little time trying/compairing
> other guitars. ed

Doesn't mean I don't know something about guitars, or buying guitars.
Apparently with little time and effort I have been able to get the
guitars I've needed.

I started on a Silvertone Deadnought in 1959. Moved form there to a J-50
a year and a half later. Played my first real gig in the summer of 1962,
six sets a night, seven days a wekk, first week of June through the
first week of September. Got a J-200 in late 1963. Played that until it
collapsed about fifteen years ago. Switched to a '57 000-28 that is a
fabulous instrument, until we sent it off with my singing daughter. Had
Lance build a guitar for me.

There were other guitars along the way, many different electrics, a few
acoustics, some 12-strings, a couple of nylon stringers, of which I
still have a good one.

I'm not arguing with you. I'm saying I don't need to play guitars all
over the place to find ones that suit me. I don't know if you're
familiar with builders on Lance's level, but that world of instruments
is rather different from any factory guitars I've ever met.

Along the way I have played hundreds of guitars that have belonged to
others. I've spent a bit of time in Luke WIlson's shop, playing guitars
ranging from an 1865 Martin to a variety of new, inexpensive factory
offerings, as well as mandolins and banjos of many vintages, makes, and
styles.

We're all differnt. No biggie.

[Steve Hawkins]

esha...@yahoo.com wrote in
news:87d2dd8f-fcd5-48fa...@googlegroups.com:

Not an issue when you have them made for you.

Steve Hawkins

[hank alrich]

But... but... but... you won't know what you're going to get!!! <g>

[Steve Hawkins]

walk...@nv.net (hank alrich) wrote in news:1klq39l.qi9kxjb69rseN%
walk...@nv.net:

You're right!!!! It might sound like a sousaphone!

Steve Hawkins

[JD]

If you're able to articulate what you want a
guitar to sound like and what physical features
that get in the way of your playing many luthiers
will exceed your expectations. Roy McAlister has a
real talent for building *your* guitar.

[hank alrich]

Oh yeah? Let's see him make one that sounds like Sousaphone.

[esha...@yahoo.com]

Bass guitar!

[hank alrich]

I dunno, man, I have my trouts about that.

[Tony Weber]

Sounds like the device to use when drinking and dialing...

[Kevin Hall]

Peter;

Unless you bump into a very old J-200 you're well advised to stay clear of
them. The 16" J-185 body is a much better design than the 17" 200. If
you like the real, old time Gibson sound you need to find something ( J-45,
J-50, SJ, Country Western etc etc.) made prior to about 1967, and you
won't find those in even moderate shape for 1,800 quid. Don't get tempted
by any of their models made between about '69 and the mid 80s.

If you're adventurous you could, however, find a good Martin D-28 from the
70s up to the early 2000s in online ads on this side of the water for
between $1,500 and $1,800 at the moment. Early 70s Martins aren't the best
they ever built, but many of them are quite good. If you are hung up on an
adjustable neck rod you'd have to shop for something made in the 80s and up.

You might consider contacting Chris Larkin who builds just outside Dingle on
the southwest coast of Ireland. He's a great guy and a very good and
versatile builder. If he can't help you in your price range he can
probably put you in touch with reliable folks over there who can.

As others have mentioned, Jean Larrivee and his crew provide excellent
value for the money but those instruments, like Taylors do not appeal to
every musical taste. That's a personal choice of course and no-one else
can make that for you.

The best advice is play a LOT of guitars before you plunk the cash down,
and when you play them take your old guitar with you so you can get a valid
'A-B' comparison. Acoustic guitars sound different in different
surroundings and the only way to compare the new with the old is beside each
other under the same conditions.

Good luck.
KH
Timberline Guitars and Ukes,
Canada.


"Peter Weber" <p.w...@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:ORqyr.1324127$xD4.5...@fx06.am4...

> Hi All
> Having played a Simon and Patrick SP6 spruce for >13yrs I'm now planning

> to spend some money (?1800 pounds) on a quality guitar, probably

[Tony Done]

Just a comment on dates. I think that Martins were dodgy from sometime
in the early 70s until maybe the mid-80s, ie when CFM IV started to have
an impact on production. I had a 1983 D37K that was a dog, bad tone,
badly finished fretboard, low neck angle plus non-adjustable truss rod.
Buying any guitar by mail order is tricky, I've been generally
suaccessful, but I wouldn't buy either Martins or Gibsons from that
period without thorough testing. They weren't all bad, but you have to
treat them to a very critical eye and ear.

Tony D

[Kevin Hall]

Some of the instruments that came out of Martin in the late 70s and early
80s were excellent. Many really fine sounding HD-28s, for example or the
M-38s of the time. Chris Mark 4's influence on the plant was mainly
positive and mainly on the business rather than production side. When he
took over the firm had virtually been destroyed by his father Frank and by
unforseen events like the infamous 9 month long strike, but he managed to
bring it back from the brink so he doesn't deserve much stick on that score.
He's not his grandad, of course, but I doubt whether the grand old
gentleman would have been able to save the company and bring it on to
greater prosperity than ever before the way young Chris did.

In my opinion koa is a poor choice for a dreadnaught, and the
non-adjustable rod plus shallow neck set shouldn't have come as a surprise
to any buyer unless the purchase was made by mail. Can't blame a cow for
being a cow. A significant part of the apparent tone problem was probably
attributable to the shallow set angle. Moral of that story is don't buy a
guitar which has to have the bridge height under 3/8" to make it play well.
Yes the plant may have been guilty of making the thing, but the buyer
shares responsibility to some extent. Probably a cheap lesson in the end
as you'll no doubt not do that again. ;-)

All the best,
KH
"Tony Done" <tony...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
news:js111v$fj6$1...@speranza.aioe.org...

[Tony Done]

On 23/06/2012 6:53 AM, Kevin Hall wrote:
> Some of the instruments that came out of Martin in the late 70s and early
> 80s were excellent. Many really fine sounding HD-28s, for example or the
> M-38s of the time. Chris Mark 4's influence on the plant was mainly
> positive and mainly on the business rather than production side. When he
> took over the firm had virtually been destroyed by his father Frank and by
> unforseen events like the infamous 9 month long strike, but he managed to
> bring it back from the brink so he doesn't deserve much stick on that score.
> He's not his grandad, of course, but I doubt whether the grand old
> gentleman would have been able to save the company and bring it on to
> greater prosperity than ever before the way young Chris did.
>
> In my opinion koa is a poor choice for a dreadnaught, and the
> non-adjustable rod plus shallow neck set shouldn't have come as a surprise
> to any buyer unless the purchase was made by mail. Can't blame a cow for
> being a cow. A significant part of the apparent tone problem was probably
> attributable to the shallow set angle. Moral of that story is don't buy a
> guitar which has to have the bridge height under 3/8" to make it play well.
> Yes the plant may have been guilty of making the thing, but the buyer
> shares responsibility to some extent. Probably a cheap lesson in the end
> as you'll no doubt not do that again. ;-)
>
> All the best,
> KH
> "Tony Done" <tony...@bigpond.com> wrote in message
> news:js111v$fj6$1...@speranza.aioe.org...

>
>

Yeah, I bought this by mail order while I was living in Darwin (about
1986) and, except for the Maton I owned, new to higher-end guitars. I
wasn't aware of the pitfalls, and I really only started learning about
neck angles and the like a few years after that. My experience makes me
wonder how many not-very-good high-end "name" guitars go to naive buyers
with more money than sense.

FWIW, I'm a big fan of CFM IV, I think he's doing a great job in a
not-easy environment.

Tony D