Are VNV Aethiests?
Cyborg:26
Just wondering.
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VoltAire
Dayv!
> Are VNV Aethiests?
What's an aethiest?
--
-Dayv!
"Also, I suspect Jesus would not approve of Mrs. Tweedy
pinching the buttocks of Mr. Tweedy before a few million kids."
Siege
"Dayv!" <laug...@yourpainBAD-ASS-SPAMTRAP.com> wrote in message
news:VGoa5.89$bHk.3...@dca1-nnrp1.news.digex.net...
> Cyborg:26 <bosman3...@hotmail.com.invalid> was all like:
> > Are VNV Aethiests?
>
> What's an aethiest?
Someone who worships Autechre as gods.
-siege
TenSlayer
"Dayv!" <laug...@yourpainBAD-ASS-SPAMTRAP.com> wrote:
> > Are VNV Aethiests?
>
> What's an aethiest?
A dyslexic who doesn't believe in the Dog of spellcheck.
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
deat...@my-deja.com
Burtlynch
As far as I know, they do not proclaim themselves as such.
--BL
Bunkertor5
Are VNV Aethiests?
Just wondering.
>>
i dont know, but i think that guy from apoptygma berzerk is... yeah....
cable
Bunkertor5 <bunke...@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20000710194836...@ng-ch1.aol.com...
> <<
> Are VNV Aethiests?
> Just wondering.
> >>
> i dont know, but i think that guy from apoptygma berzerk is... yeah....
Yeah, yeah, and isn't that Leaether strip fellow an aethiest too?
-
c.
eschaton
Cyborg:26 wrote:
> Are VNV Aethiests?
> Just wondering.
Read the lyrics to 'Kingdom', or the vocal version of 'Saviour', and make up
your own mind, but they certainly seem very, anti-theistic, at least, to me.
There seem to be semi-religious allusions on some tracks ('further' for
example), but they might just be poeticism.
Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
--
The homeless don't want a handout so much as a handjob.
Sean McGill
Cyborg:26 wrote:
>
> Are VNV Aethiests?
> Just wondering.
They claim that "VNV Nation does not advocate any ideology" on their web
site. They may be personally, but apparently they aren't as musicians.
sm
np: Cabaret Voltaire - Mix-up
The Rattler
> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
--
"Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!
Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!"
**** Rattl...@hotmail.com
Oystein Alsaker
> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
>
I find it spooky each time american politicians use the word god. If they
had any sense and read the bible they'd see what a load of crap the whole
thing is. :) And that goes for any religion. :)
--
Oeystein Alsaker
http://www.fi.uib.no/~alsaker
Now the world has gone to bed
Darkness won't engulf my head
I can see by infrared
How I hate the night
-Marvin the paranoid android
Locke
> What's an aethiest?
I assume he meant anesthetists, in which case I have to say yes ...
they put me to sleep immediately.
CU,
Locke
NP: Needle Sharing "Warez"
--
_ __ ___ _ __ ___ \\|||//
| | / \ / _/| |/ /| _| / @ @ \
| |__| || || |_ | \ | _| (| \ |)
|____|\__/ \__\|_|\_\|___| \__=__/
| |
eschaton
The Rattler wrote:
> In article <396A7430...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net says...
> > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
>
> What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in society by making
some people have some happiness in their lives, and providing a deeper reason for
thing; I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious. Sure, you have
less wars and all, but the whole population seems to muddle through life, waiting to
die. When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you know there is a
problem with a national psyche. Then again, maybe I cam connecting two unrelated
things.
The Rattler
> > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
>
> Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in
> society by making some people have some happiness in their lives
Well, now my mother always told me never to discuss sex, politics or
religion with anyone so I'll keep this to a bare minimum... but I think
it's caused as much angst, guilty, depression and distress for people in
general as it has happiness. At least.
> I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious.
Wouldn't you feel more uneasy if an entire culture was, say, raving
fundamentalist Christians?
> Sure, you have less wars and all, but the whole population seems
> to muddle through life, waiting to die.
Err, speak for "the whole population" why don't you. I wouldn't consider
myself 'religious' but the last thing I do is "muddle through life,
waiting to die"... If anything that's what a lot of Christians and
whathaveyou do since they believe that the best things come *after*
you're dead. Personally I think the best things are right here and now
and I've every intention of enjoying them to the full! Certainly no
muddling or waiting to die here! In fact, if I can avoid death in any
way (which unfortunately doesn't look too possible from here!), I'm all
for it!
> When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you know
> there is a problem with a national psyche.
That coming from a Yank? I'd be inclined to mention something about glass
houses... ;))
The Black Oil
eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> wrote in message
news:396A7430...@snet.net...
> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of
people I
> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
Most of the people I come across around my age seem to be either
atheist/agnostic, or if not, hardcore born-again fanatics of whatever faith
they follow. There's rarely any middle ground. It is rather strange.
I guess whatever indoctrination they had as kids has either pushed them to
one extreme or the other.
--
Greg
np: still nothing
"Due to popular demand, we will forgo our National Anthem!"
-Micheal Buffer "The Simpsons"
NiteShade
NiteShade
eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> schreef in berichtnieuws
396A7430...@snet.net...
>
>
> Cyborg:26 wrote:
>
> > Are VNV Aethiests?
> > Just wondering.
>
> Read the lyrics to 'Kingdom', or the vocal version of 'Saviour', and make
up
> your own mind, but they certainly seem very, anti-theistic, at least, to
me.
> There seem to be semi-religious allusions on some tracks ('further' for
> example), but they might just be poeticism.
>
> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of
people I
> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
>
grrstomp
>Yeah, yeah, and isn't that Leaether strip fellow an aethiest
too?
Voltitare is a aethesit to.
-eriac
---------///\\\Noise Militia///\\\---------
-(music that is sort of bad, but noisy)-http://noisemilitia.iuma.com
-(home)New and IMPROVED! <+new pix+>-http://decoded.iwarp.com
-(e.mail <love letters, legal notices, etc)- grrs...@hotmail.com
-----------------------------------------------------------
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grrstomp
>Yeah, yeah, and isn't that Leaether strip fellow an aethiest
too?
Volitaire is a aetheist to.
Rian A. Miller
bad. You trash them for shoving it in your face, but you just shove it right back.
What a load of bullshit it is, blah, blah, blah. Why not just forget about it
instead of turning into the people you hate?
Rian
Don't take this the wrong way-I'm not bitching at anyone. It's just an observation.
Oystein Alsaker wrote:
> On Mon, 10 Jul 2000, eschaton wrote:
>
> > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
> >
>
grrstomp
>All you people complain about born-agains, but I have to say,
you are all just as
>bad. You trash them for shoving it in your face, but you just
shove it right back.
>What a load of bullshit it is, blah, blah, blah. Why not just
forget about it
>instead of turning into the people you hate?
To get a little off-topic, and to include a bit of a rant, you
hit the nail on the head on this one.
It's funny to find ANYONE who says that they are "accepting" or
very "openminded" and "tolerant"- because most people who say
that really, truly aren't. We're all guilty of it, actually. We
don't want other's ideas and beliefs forced on us but what do we
(and i use "we" as a general term) do? Exactly what we don't
want done to us.
It's called the golden rule. Do unto others.. blah blah..
</babble>
-erica
Mesh500
>Date: 7/11/00 2:19 AM Pacific Daylight Time
>Message-id: <Pine.OSF.4.10.100071...@asfys4.fi.uib.no>
>
>On Mon, 10 Jul 2000, eschaton wrote:
>
>> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of
>people I
>> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
>> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
>>
>
>I find it spooky each time american politicians use the word god. If they
>had any sense and read the bible they'd see what a load of crap the whole
>thing is. :) And that goes for any religion. :)
>
even buddhism?
Borg166
> had any sense and read the bible they'd see what a load of crap the whole
> thing is. :) And that goes for any religion. :)
Besides the obvious fact that they use religion to get more votes, here is a list of
things to support your "load of crap" theory.
Here is some good "family bible" reading.
*Everything below was written by Peter Barrett of alt.atheism*
God loves us all does he? Most christians believe abortion is wrong because life is
so sacred yet their own God has killed more of these sacred self
glorifying creatures than Hitler's Nazis did.
TAKE A LOOK AT THE FACTS (Feel free to cross check with the bible)
He killed, intentionally, every man, woman, and child on the planet save eight of
them.
(Gen 7:23)
He killed, intentionally, every man, woman, and child in Sodom and Gomorrah.
(Gen 19:24)
He killed, intentionally, every first-born child of every family in Egypt.
(Ex 12:29)
He ordered to be killed, seven nations.
(Deut 7:1,2)
He ordered to be killed, 3,000 Israelites for no greater crime than worshipping a
golden calf. Modern Christians worship a crucified lamb -
what's the difference?
(Ex 32:27)
He killed 250 Levite princes who disagreed with Moses' leadership and was so
bloodthirsty that he wanted to slay more until he was talked out of it.
Later he put a plague upon 14,000 Jews who thought there was something wrong in
killing 250 princes.
(Num 16)
He utterly destroyed the Canaanites at Hormah as a favor to the Jews. (Num 21)
He abetted Moses in utterly destroying the Amorites at Heshbon - "...the men, the
women, and the little ones."
(Num 21)
He ordered the death of all the males and Kings of the Midianites, all their wives,
and male children.
(Num 25 & 31)
He saw to it that Joshua slew all the citizens of Jericho (except for a whore and
her family) - men and women, young and old.
(Josh 6)
12,000 men, women, and children of Ai were slain in an ambush planned by god.
(Josh 8)
Joshua, under god's guidance, also killed all the people of Gezer, all the people of
Eglon, all the people of Hebron, and all the people of the land of
Goshen.
Judah, under god's guidance, killed all the people of Gaza, all the people of
Ashkelon, all the people of Ekron, 10,000 Moabites, and 10,000 Perizzites
and Canaanites.
(Judges)
Gideon killed 120,000 Midianites.
(Judges)
50,000 people of Bethshemesh were killed by god because they looked at the ark.
(I Sam)
Saul, whom god smiled upon, killed Ammonites and the Amalekites
("...slay man and woman, infant and suckling...").
(I Sam)
David, one of the most admired figures in Christendom, slew 200
Philistines to obtain their foreskins to purchase - yes, god's chosen ones bought
and sold women - Saul's daughter.
(I Sam 18:27)
David slew the Geshurites, the Gezrites, the Amalekites, the
Philistines, the Moabites, the Syrians, the Jebusites, the Ammonites, and the
Edomites. Jesus is known as the Son of David.
God himself killed 70,000 people with a pestilence.
(II Sam 24)
God killed 100,000 Syrians because they said he was the god of the hills and not the
god of the valleys. That's how petty your god is. (I Kings 20)
God killed 42 children by the cruel means of a bear simply because they made fun of
Elisha's baldness (god apparently cannot cure
baldness, and his inadequacy upsets him).
(II Kings 2)
God killed 70 children of King Ahab and 42 children of the King of Judah. It is
definitely not safe to go around in multiples of seven in the Middle East.
(II Kings 9 & 10)
God smote half a million men of Israel.
(II Chron 13)
And I won't even mention those people actually killed by christians because they
didn't share their beliefs in the holy sky critter.
Not to metion God has killed more than Satan himself. Maybe we
are worshiping the wrong one. Oh NO!!!!!!!
Thank you, Peter Barrett
Sean McGill
eschaton wrote:
>
> The Rattler wrote:
>
> > In article <396A7430...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net says...
> > > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> > > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> > > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
> >
> > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
>
> Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in society by making
> some people have some happiness in their lives, and providing a deeper reason for
> thing; I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious. Sure, you have
> less wars and all, but the whole population seems to muddle through life, waiting to
> die. When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you know there is a
> problem with a national psyche. Then again, maybe I cam connecting two unrelated
> things.
The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the most
destructive wars man has ever seen.
I don't see how atheism is progress either. At least Christians found
some value in life, unlike most atheists.
sm
Dayv!
>
> I don't see how atheism is progress either. At least Christians found
> some value in life, unlike most atheists.
Atheism is not equal to nihilism. Please understand this.
--
-Dayv!
"Argh! I am outgeeked by a girl! The shame! The horror!"
Sean McGill
"Dayv!" wrote:
>
> Sean McGill <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> was all like:
> >
> > I don't see how atheism is progress either. At least Christians found
> > some value in life, unlike most atheists.
>
> Atheism is not equal to nihilism. Please understand this.
Please read my post. I'm aware that they aren't the same;
unfortunately, they often go hand in hand.
sm
Lars Casteen
"Sean McGill" <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> wrote in message
news:396BD350...@cwpost.liu.edu...
>
>
> eschaton wrote:
> >
> > The Rattler wrote:
> >
> > > In article <396A7430...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net says...
> > > > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level
of people I
> > > > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest
(minus
> > > > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
> > >
> > > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
> >
> > Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in
society by making
> > some people have some happiness in their lives, and providing a deeper
reason for
> > thing; I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious.
Sure, you have
> > less wars and all, but the whole population seems to muddle through
life, waiting to
> > die. When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you know
there is a
> > problem with a national psyche. Then again, maybe I cam connecting two
unrelated
> > things.
>
> The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the most
> destructive wars man has ever seen.
>
> some value in life, unlike most atheists.
I would have disagreed with you up until a week ago, but after a near
crippling nervous breakdown last week, I'm feeling more confident about
religion and so on. It's just as bad for people to dislike religious people
for their religion as it is for people of different religions to be biased
against each other for that reason. This is why I subscribe to secular
humanism with a little dash of the Episcopal church tossed in.
-=-
Lars
Al Crawford
>
> Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited level of people I
> met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an athiest (minus
> 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
I'd attribute a lot of that to the fact that religion is (or at least,
was - might have changed since I were a lad) omnipresent and compulsory
in UK schools. From primary school right through the end of high school
we had a weekly assembly complete with minister, hymns, prayer, etc.
For most of primary school and at least half of high school we had a
religious education class every week too.
There's nothing quite like being required to be bored rigid by a
borderline senile minister (*) every week, with no way of getting out of
it (**) to give you a negative attitude towards religion. When you
combine that with the typical teenage tendency towards Deep Thoughts On
The Meaning Of Life, you end up with a lot more atheists.
Based on my experience of the way things worked in the UK when I was
growing up, I find the whole "we must bring prayer into schools" thing
in the US mildly amusing. I've *seen* what happens when you enforce a
single religion in school, and I suspect those who're backing the idea
would get a nasty shock if they got their way.
Al
(*) The school minister when I was at high school once gave the exact
same sermon, complete with identical anecdotes, three weeks running.
(**) Not strictly true - although the basic assumption was that everyone
was Church Of Scotland, if you *weren't* and your parents felt strongly
about it, you got out of it. I think we had three people (a Jew, a
Hindu and a Jehovah's Witness) who didn't have to attend.
--
Al Crawford - aw...@awrc.com
"Art/Empire/Industry"
eschaton
grrstomp wrote:
> "cable" <cable...@msn.com> wrote:
>
> >Yeah, yeah, and isn't that Leaether strip fellow an aethiest
> too?
>
> Voltitare is a aethesit to.
Actually, he just told me the other week he beleived in reicnanratoin.
eschaton
The Rattler wrote:
> In article <396B0D9D...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net says...
> > > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
> >
> > Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in
> > society by making some people have some happiness in their lives
>
> Well, now my mother always told me never to discuss sex, politics or
> religion with anyone so I'll keep this to a bare minimum... but I think
> it's caused as much angst, guilty, depression and distress for people in
> general as it has happiness. At least.
Perhaps, but then, why is it still around?
> > I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious.
>
> Wouldn't you feel more uneasy if an entire culture was, say, raving
> fundamentalist Christians?
That's why I won't be moving south of the mason-dixon line.
> > Sure, you have less wars and all, but the whole population seems
> > to muddle through life, waiting to die.
>
> Err, speak for "the whole population" why don't you. I wouldn't consider
> myself 'religious' but the last thing I do is "muddle through life,
> waiting to die"... If anything that's what a lot of Christians and
> whathaveyou do since they believe that the best things come *after*
> you're dead. Personally I think the best things are right here and now
> and I've every intention of enjoying them to the full! Certainly no
> muddling or waiting to die here! In fact, if I can avoid death in any
> way (which unfortunately doesn't look too possible from here!), I'm all
> for it!
Well, you know, science is always advancing. I am hoping before I die, they
will come up with a way to stop aging, or maybe download my mind. Failing
that, maybe some far-future civilization will be able to recreate my mind.
There is always hope, and without the possiblity of not ceasing to exist, I
think I would go totally nuts. Hell, I spent most every night for about 4
months in England terrified I might die in my sleep, ceasing to exist, and
never get to know that I died.
eschaton
The Black Oil wrote:
> Most of the people I come across around my age seem to be either
> atheist/agnostic, or if not, hardcore born-again fanatics of whatever faith
> they follow. There's rarely any middle ground. It is rather strange.
> I guess whatever indoctrination they had as kids has either pushed them to
> one extreme or the other.
I think it's a young person thing. 96% of americans believe in god, which is a
number that has been constant since the turn of the century (EG, there has been
no decline in faith at any time), and there is no reason to think that the
numbers are changing now. Thus, I assume that just about everyone you now know
will at some point in their life believe in god again, and it is just a matter
of time...seeing themselves age and death approaching inorexably does the trick
I would assume.
That said, I have met many young people who are neither born agains, or
athiests/agnostics. Strangly, most seemed to be catholic. I guess it's
because there is an inherent impossiblity between being catholic and
born-again, as I was raised in a catholic household, and far more disparaging
remarks are made about evangelist protestants then non Xians, or nonbeleivers.
eschaton
grrstomp wrote:
> To get a little off-topic, and to include a bit of a rant, you
> hit the nail on the head on this one.
> It's funny to find ANYONE who says that they are "accepting" or
> very "openminded" and "tolerant"- because most people who say
> that really, truly aren't. We're all guilty of it, actually. We
> don't want other's ideas and beliefs forced on us but what do we
> (and i use "we" as a general term) do? Exactly what we don't
> want done to us.
> It's called the golden rule. Do unto others.. blah blah..
But didn't you sign a few messages with 'god is dead' awhile back?
**confused look**
Anyway, I am almost totally openminded about religion, except for 2
things that fundies do. One of them is creationism...that is a huge pet
peeve of mine, as it is plain, home grown stupidity that even the
religious people in other countries have the sense not to believe
anymore. It's one thing where science hasn't discovered anything for or
against something, but it is another to deny what is a pretty rock solid
theory because it's not mentioned in the opening few chapters of the
bible.
The other one is the strange fundie beleif that faith in jesus is the
most important thing for salvation. When I grew up, and was forced to
attend chuch, I was told a person's good works got them into heaven, EG,
a good athiest would get into heaven over a bad christian (actually,
talking to friends who go to catholic colleges, I am not even sure the
church beleives in hell anymore). But evangelists actually believe that
non-xians will burn in hell forever, and I don't see why I should be
openminded towards those who think that I am so wicked, due to my
doubts, that I will suffer for eternity. That said though, in an odd
way I would still rather die and go to hell for eternity then cease to
exist. An eternity of pain is better then no eternity at all.
eschaton
"Dayv!" wrote:
> D00d, get over it. Elton John was right, all we are is dust in the
> wind.
That's too pessimistic for me to admit as total certainty. I mean, if true, what
difference does anything make? Why should I bother working for happiness in life,
why should I bother working for a better world, if everything is transitory in the
end? Somehow, some way, I will be immortal, and I would take any sort of
immortality, so long as it didn't bring suffering upon others.
Francois Labreque
"Dayv!" wrote:
>
> eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> was all like:
> >
> > Well, you know, science is always advancing. I am hoping before I die, they
> > will come up with a way to stop aging, or maybe download my mind. Failing
> > that, maybe some far-future civilization will be able to recreate my mind.
> > There is always hope, and without the possiblity of not ceasing to exist, I
> > think I would go totally nuts. Hell, I spent most every night for about 4
> > months in England terrified I might die in my sleep, ceasing to exist, and
> > never get to know that I died.
>
> D00d, get over it. Elton John was right, all we are is dust in the
^^^^
Candle.
> wind.*
>
> * anyone who corrects me on this has terrible taste in music.
Doh!
np: Gridlock - The synthetic form. (Does that help me redeem a few
points?)
--
Francois Labreque | Unfortunately, there's no such thing as a snooze
flabreq | button on a cat who wants breakfast.
@ | - Unattributed quote from rec.humor.funny
attglobal.net
Francois Labreque
Borg166 wrote:
>
> > I think it's a young person thing. 96% of americans believe in god, which is a
> > number that has been constant since the turn of the century (EG, there has been
> > no decline in faith at any time)
>
> I wonder how many would actually worship that monster (The Xian One) if they read
> my post...
I'm pretty sure it wouldn't change the mind of a single one of them,
actually.
np: Gridlock - The synthetic form.
Francois Labreque
Borg166 wrote:
>
> Francois Labreque wrote:
>
> > Borg166 wrote:
> > >
> > > > I think it's a young person thing. 96% of americans believe in god, which is a
> > > > number that has been constant since the turn of the century (EG, there has been
> > > > no decline in faith at any time)
> > >
> > > I wonder how many would actually worship that monster (The Xian One) if they read
> > > my post...
> >
> > I'm pretty sure it wouldn't change the mind of a single one of them,
> > actually.
>
> Opps, I forgot to mention that I was refering to my older post, not the one you just
> replied too...
I know. My point stands. Someone who Believes (notice the uppercase B)
in something will tend to overlook negative arguments. Not to mention
that pointing out the fact that the Bible says God drowned every land
creature except of pair of each species and Noah's family has nothing to
do with the belief in Redemption when Judgement Day comes.
You fall in the same trap the fundamentalists do. Reading the words of
the Bible, but not the message, which basically is "if you screw up,
you're going to end up in Hell". There is no mention anywhere of
whether this will happen at the end of your normal life or if your
licence to breathe just suddenly expired.
Borg166
How often
gen...@rpi.edu
: The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the most
: destructive wars man has ever seen.
You're *really* twisting facts here ...
"more" wars ... well, considering that a) It is *far* easier to war
someone across the fucking globe, and b) modern wars don't tend to last
all that long (a few years at most) - and it is really freaking easy to
see why we have more wars. Cut back a few hundred years .... wars lasted
20, 30, hell even a 100 years long. It was also much more difficult to
war someone - you generally fought against your neighbour, not some far
off land. With modern transportation, people are going to get pissed off at
a lot more other nations now - that means "more" wars .... furthermore,
since our wars tend to be shorter, we don't get nearly as much agression
out :)
"more destructive" ... errr, technology has freaking improved 10000000x
fold, jackass. Of course wars are going to get more destructive. You
honestly think that if the Crusaders had the A-Bomb that they wouldn't
have used it? Blah.
Bugger off, you're spouting nonsense.
--
Jeff Gentry jes...@rpi.edu gen...@rpi.edu
"You're one of those condescending UNIX users! ...."
"Here's a nickel kid ... get yourself a real computer."
neuralnoise
"Borg166" <bor...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:396BCA68...@hotmail.com...
> <snip God's body count>
Heh...sounds like God's been rehearsing for a role in the next Wes Craven
flick
Dayv!
>
> Well, you know, science is always advancing. I am hoping before I die, they
> will come up with a way to stop aging, or maybe download my mind. Failing
> that, maybe some far-future civilization will be able to recreate my mind.
> There is always hope, and without the possiblity of not ceasing to exist, I
> think I would go totally nuts. Hell, I spent most every night for about 4
> months in England terrified I might die in my sleep, ceasing to exist, and
> never get to know that I died.
D00d, get over it. Elton John was right, all we are is dust in the
wind.*
* anyone who corrects me on this has terrible taste in music.
np: Speedy J- A Shocking Hobby
Borg166
Borg166
> for eternity then cease to exist. An eternity of pain is better then no
> eternity at all.
Have you read my earlier post about God's Kill Total? If I was given a
choice of Heaven or Hell, I'd choose Hell over that monster known as YWHY.
He's an all loving being all right...
A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is worse
than Hitler.
nightmare
for a mile. Overdone, overdrive, overlive, override. You're not the one
who let me down, but thanks for offering:
Or Thrussel and Snog, "Don't run and hide, it's no use I know, sooner or
later, we all make the little flowers grow."
--
nightmare ICQ#34579920
http://home.hiwaay.net/~janus/Welcome.html
"don't you know I'm numb man
no I can't feel a thing at all
cause it's all smiles and business these days
and I'm indifferent to the loss"-Ben Folds Five
Borg166
> later, we all make the little flowers grow."
Omg I never even realized what that meant.
Thanks :-)
nightmare
down, but thanks for offering:
>> Or Thrussel and Snog, "Don't run and hide, it's no use I know, sooner or
No big deal. I thought it had a universal meaning that line (i.e., we all
gonna die). Then I remembered back to the first time I heard Ween's "Push
the Little Daisies and Make Them Come Up" and remembered that I wondered
what the fuck they were on about.
Borg166
Francois Labreque wrote:
lordfinesse
>than Hitler.
Word.
"the fall or scrapping of a culture puts us all into the same archetypical
cesspool" -H. Marshall McLuhan
Dayv!
Goth.
Borg166
> the Bible, but not the message, which basically is "if you screw up,
> you're going to end up in Hell". There is no mention anywhere of
> whether this will happen at the end of your normal life or if your
> licence to breathe just suddenly expired.
But many of the people God killed didn't screw up at all.
Did they all end up in Hell? Probably.
If Hell exists will I end up there? Definitely.
Will I give a fuck? No.
Will Dayv! destroy God and free the universe of his evil wrath? Yes.
Meshlife
my view is that people don't need the negative baggage that comes with
organized religion in order to have faith or providence or whatever. religion
and faith are 2 different things in their very concepts. as for bashing
religion, it doesn't really accomplish everything, but since there are bad
points to it, i just don't see why people can't have simple faith, if 'God'
suits them. i angered by society's inability to evolve in this matter; as
humans evolve in various ways but religion does not, religion just becomes more
ridiculous and outdated...blah blah blah, anyway..
-cheating judas -
eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> >
> 96% of americans believe in god,
i thought that ~95% of americans believe in a "higher being"...not
necessarily god..
kelley..
===={ http://www.geocities.com/cheating_judas/ }====
==== }...{ kow...@hotmail.com }...{ ====
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
Sean McGill
gen...@rpi.edu wrote:
>
> Sean McGill <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> wrote:
> : The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the most
> : destructive wars man has ever seen.
>
> You're *really* twisting facts here ...
>
> "more" wars ... well, considering that a) It is *far* easier to war
> someone across the fucking globe, and b) modern wars don't tend to last
> all that long (a few years at most) - and it is really freaking easy to
> see why we have more wars. Cut back a few hundred years .... wars lasted
> 20, 30, hell even a 100 years long. It was also much more difficult to
> war someone - you generally fought against your neighbour, not some far
> off land. With modern transportation, people are going to get pissed off at
> a lot more other nations now - that means "more" wars .... furthermore,
> since our wars tend to be shorter, we don't get nearly as much agression
> out :)
>
> "more destructive" ... errr, technology has freaking improved 10000000x
> fold, jackass. Of course wars are going to get more destructive. You
> honestly think that if the Crusaders had the A-Bomb that they wouldn't
> have used it? Blah.
>
> Bugger off, you're spouting nonsense.
I was replying to a comment eschaton made which basically said there is
less war when there is less religion... all I meant was that there has
been just as much war in these more secular times than any other time -
which you seem to agree with. So don't get your panties all tied in a
knot.
sm
Sean McGill
Borg166 wrote:
>
> > That said though, in an odd way I would still rather die and go to hell
> > for eternity then cease to exist. An eternity of pain is better then no
> > eternity at all.
>
> Have you read my earlier post about God's Kill Total? If I was given a
> choice of Heaven or Hell, I'd choose Hell over that monster known as YWHY.
> He's an all loving being all right...
>
> A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
>
> Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is worse
> than Hitler.
Now I'm not a Christian, but you've got to have a little respect for a
book which details several thousands years of history of a culture and
which has lived for thousands of years (the book, that is).
sm
Lars Casteen
"Dayv!" <laug...@yourpainBAD-ASS-SPAMTRAP.com> wrote in message
news:XLOa5.115$rhm.3...@dca1-nnrp1.news.digex.net...
> D00d, get over it. Elton John was right, all we are is dust in the
> wind.*
>
> * anyone who corrects me on this has terrible taste in music.
Well, fuck... I'll bite.
*AHEM*
Kansas, not Elton John.
-=-
Lars
Marian Try Slaughter
reading your last few posts in this thread, how can you honestly call
yourself an athiest?
--
Simon
http://listen.to/gftm/
Lars Casteen
> > That said though, in an odd way I would still rather die and go to hell
> > for eternity then cease to exist. An eternity of pain is better then no
> > eternity at all.
>
> Have you read my earlier post about God's Kill Total? If I was given a
> choice of Heaven or Hell, I'd choose Hell over that monster known as YWHY.
> He's an all loving being all right...
>
> A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
>
> Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is worse
> than Hitler.
>
That's ridiculous. You're being equally as holier-than-though than the
worst christian. One must really take a good look at the possibilities.
Only if one were a fundamentalist would one take such numbers as gospel.
And it seems that you aren't, so you just aren't making sense. Also, you're
being narrow minded, not taking into account that if there were a god,
he/she/it would obviously be of greater mental capacity/understanding than
you are, so killings that perhaps might not make sense to you would make
perfect sense to a deity. This entire portion of this conversation is
ridiculous. Yes, yes, that's nice, if you believe that God killed all of
these people, than you must also believe that God created a heaven (since
taking such details as word-for-word truth would be a fundamentalist
endeavor), and the meaning that this would provide for your life would be
heartwarming, to say the least.
-=-
Lars
neuralnoise
"-cheating judas -" <cheatin...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
news:8kgstq$qid$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> In article <396BC685...@snet.net>,
> eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> >
>
> > 96% of americans believe in god,
>
> i thought that ~95% of americans believe in a "higher being"...not
> necessarily god..
I thought 95% of Americans just believed in "being higher"... : )
Dayv!
>
> Will Dayv! destroy God and free the universe of his evil wrath? Yes.
I haven't signed that contract yet; we're still in negotiations.
Rev Ammonia D
(I still have my all my Kansas 8 tracks as well as "Point of Know Return"
concert T...my very first rock concert!!)
I guess it is just like what Trent Reznor said "I wish everyday was
Holloween"
--
The Rev
Manhole Vortex
http://www.manholevortex.com
http://www.artsindustria.com
"People handing out insults with such casualty"......Jewel
Lars Casteen <la...@SPAMTRAPrlc.net> wrote in message
news:8kguig$ofv$1...@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU...
The Rattler
night...@subdimension.com says...
> Or Thrussel and Snog, "Don't run and hide, it's no use I know, sooner or
> later, we all make the little flowers grow."
Yeah, but Lee Hazlewood wrote it... :)
--
"Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!
Ramalamalama Kenickie Kenickie!"
**** Rattl...@hotmail.com
eschaton
The Rattler wrote:
> In article <8F6EDDC62night...@207.126.101.100>,
> night...@subdimension.com says...
> > Or Thrussel and Snog, "Don't run and hide, it's no use I know, sooner or
> > later, we all make the little flowers grow."
>
> Yeah, but Lee Hazlewood wrote it... :)
What does the original sound like anyway? I have always been curious.
--
The homeless don't want a handout so much as a handjob.
eschaton
-cheating judas - wrote:
> In article <396BC685...@snet.net>,
> eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> >
>
> > 96% of americans believe in god,
>
> i thought that ~95% of americans believe in a "higher being"...not
> necessarily god..
well, 96% of americans beleive in god or a universal spirit to be more
precice. As I see it, they are the same thing, since god can mean
anything from a humanlike, but infinite, concious entity, to something
akin to the laws of nature.
eschaton
neuralnoise wrote:
> "-cheating judas -" <cheatin...@my-deja.com> wrote in message
> news:8kgstq$qid$1...@nnrp1.deja.com...
> > In article <396BC685...@snet.net>,
> > eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> >
> >
> > > 96% of americans believe in god,
> >
> > i thought that ~95% of americans believe in a "higher being"...not
> > necessarily god..
>
> I thought 95% of Americans just believed in "being higher"... : )
Does it count if you want others to go down?
eschaton
Borg166 wrote:
> Have you read my earlier post about God's Kill Total? If I was given a
> choice of Heaven or Hell, I'd choose Hell over that monster known as YWHY.
> He's an all loving being all right...
>
> A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
>
> Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is worse
> than Hitler.
Actually, the old testement, since it gives a more balanced picture of god
then the new, I find a more honest deception of god. The big theological
problem I have with christianity is the fact that it is impossible to have a
god that is both infinate and all good at once. You can get around the
good/evil question if you define everything god is as being good, but still,
god must contain infinate amounts of anger, hatred, jealousy, suffering, and
so on and so forth.
Look in history, and you will see the god of the old testement is much like
gods the world over...people had cruel lives, and they wanted an at least
partially cruel god to explain their lives. Frankly, I find this more honest
then the sanitized 'buddy god' deceptions that have filled christian America
these days. I expect god, if he exists, in some ways to be awesome and
terrible beyond beleif, as within infinty, all things must be, both the good
and the bad.
Locke
> Actually, the old testement, since it gives a more balanced picture of god
> then the new, I find a more honest deception of god.
I found the telephone book to be the most honest ... he's not in there.
CU,
Locke
NP: V/Vm "Machine Components" pt.4
--
_ __ ___ _ __ ___ \\|||//
| | / \ / _/| |/ /| _| / @ @ \
| |__| || || |_ | \ | _| (| \ |)
|____|\__/ \__\|_|\_\|___| \__=__/
| |
eschaton
Francois Labreque wrote:
> I know. My point stands. Someone who Believes (notice the uppercase B)
> in something will tend to overlook negative arguments. Not to mention
> that pointing out the fact that the Bible says God drowned every land
> creature except of pair of each species and Noah's family has nothing to
> do with the belief in Redemption when Judgement Day comes.
>
> You fall in the same trap the fundamentalists do. Reading the words of
> the Bible, but not the message, which basically is "if you screw up,
> you're going to end up in Hell". There is no mention anywhere of
> whether this will happen at the end of your normal life or if your
> licence to breathe just suddenly expired.
I ought to mention, the bible has next to nothing about heaven and hell in it. Most of our
ideas about the afterlife were co-opted wholely by the early church from Egyptian
paganism. Modern Jews themselves don't believe in an afterlife per-se I think even, only
that come the end of time, they will all be ressurected by god.
eschaton
Locke wrote:
> eschaton wrote:
> > Actually, the old testement, since it gives a more balanced picture of god
> > then the new, I find a more honest deception of god.
>
> I found the telephone book to be the most honest ... he's not in there.
He is unlisted. Can you imagine the number of telemarketers who would call him
otherwise? I mean, infinate power, infinate amount of money, infinite amount of
credit cards and magizine subsciptions are indeed possible.
Jessica Webster
"Sean McGill" <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> wrote in message
news:396BDCC2...@cwpost.liu.edu...
>
>
> "Dayv!" wrote:
> >
> > Sean McGill <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> was all like:
> > >
> > > I don't see how atheism is progress either. At least Christians found
> > > some value in life, unlike most atheists.
> >
> > Atheism is not equal to nihilism. Please understand this.
>
> Please read my post. I'm aware that they aren't the same;
> unfortunately, they often go hand in hand.
>
It's just that by itself, atheism does not mean that there is no value
found/placed on life. Atheism is simply an adamant belief that there is no
God/gods/higher power...It's still very possible for an atheist to find
meaning, beauty, value etc.. in life. Atheism is often found married with
nihilism, but as Dayv! says, they don't necessarily equate. The difference
is very similar in degree as that from an agnostic to an atheist.
--
Jessica Webster
________________
"Carl never dreamed of killing his parents, not until the day he tried to
show them how to operate the timer on the new VCR."
Dayv!
>
>> eschaton wrote:
>> > Actually, the old testement, since it gives a more balanced picture of god
>> > then the new, I find a more honest deception of god.
>>
>> I found the telephone book to be the most honest ... he's not in there.
>
> He is unlisted.
Maybe in your copy. If he wants you to find him, he will. He's listed
with the escort services, under the name "Trixie."
--
-Dayv!
eschaton
"Dayv!" wrote:
> eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> was all like:
> >
> > Locke wrote:
> >
> >> eschaton wrote:
> >> > Actually, the old testement, since it gives a more balanced picture of god
> >> > then the new, I find a more honest deception of god.
> >>
> >> I found the telephone book to be the most honest ... he's not in there.
> >
> > He is unlisted.
>
> Maybe in your copy. If he wants you to find him, he will. He's listed
> with the escort services, under the name "Trixie."
Ahh, so god shaves his cunt then?
eschaton
Jessica Webster wrote:
> It's just that by itself, atheism does not mean that there is no value
> found/placed on life. Atheism is simply an adamant belief that there is no
> God/gods/higher power...It's still very possible for an atheist to find
> meaning, beauty, value etc.. in life. Atheism is often found married with
> nihilism, but as Dayv! says, they don't necessarily equate. The difference
> is very similar in degree as that from an agnostic to an atheist.
True, but I can't help but think the people in general to athiesm have nihilist
tendencies, or at least a tendency towards global pessimism. I mean, no one can
no the answer, for or against god's existence. Therefore, the logical decision
is to be agnostic. The decision benefiting ones emotional and physical well
being is to be religious, in conrast (this is not just a personal
opinion...studies have shown religious people live much longer lives then
nonbeleivers, and suffer much less, from depression).
Athiests, at least all the ones I have known, seem to have at their base this
supposition: 'The world is an uncaring, random place, and I see this for
certain. I accept the horrible truthes, like my life has no meaning past what I
give it, and my death is destined to be final.' My problem with this conclusion
is that they seem to be often concluding that there must be no god because it's
the 'hard' decision to make, the one most people don't want to make, and that
it's truth is shown by its unappealing nature. I don't see how this works
though, as it would also be unappealing to say, for example, that every time
your head was turned little gremlins jumped out of the earth and horribly
mutilated everyone outside your view, and they only appeared to return to normal
when you looked at them again. Just because somthing is unpleasent doesn't make
it right, and just because something seems all warm and fuzzy doesn't make it
wrong.
Flaming Fish Music
> > I wonder how many would actually worship that monster (The Xian One) if they read
> > my post...
>
> I'm pretty sure it wouldn't change the mind of a single one of them,
> actually.
You're probably right. For starters, there's nothing there that any
Bible-reading Christian isn't already aware of. And as someone else
already pointed out, equating the actions of an omnipotent God with a
deranged human (Hitler) is kind of silly. One is actually in a
position to judge and one was doing what he did for evil purposes.
--
carson @ Flaming Fish Music
http://www.flamingfish.com
http://www.underground-collective.com
Flaming Fish Music
> my view is that people don't need the negative baggage that comes with
> organized religion in order to have faith or providence or whatever. religion
> and faith are 2 different things in their very concepts. as for bashing
I think that more and more Christians are rejecting established
"religion" in favor of simply a spiritual relationship with their
Creator. If you look at the things that make Christianity "bad", it's
not the fundamental beliefs but rather the corruption that humans have
integrated into it via organized religion. Certainly the things like
wars and political corruption are driven this way and have nothing to
do with the essence of Christianity.
Joseph Culbert
Borg166 <bor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
>
>Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is worse
>than Hitler.
According to the Hitler Argument Principle, you just lost.
--
--- "brother, you're living in the land of the bland"
---- neckro at yellow 5 dot com
----- (you work it out)
Per Ekman
> Jessica Webster wrote:
>
> > It's just that by itself, atheism does not mean that there is no value
> > found/placed on life. Atheism is simply an adamant belief that there is no
> > God/gods/higher power...It's still very possible for an atheist to find
> > meaning, beauty, value etc.. in life. Atheism is often found married with
> > nihilism, but as Dayv! says, they don't necessarily equate. The difference
> > is very similar in degree as that from an agnostic to an atheist.
>
> True, but I can't help but think the people in general to athiesm have nihilist
> tendencies, or at least a tendency towards global pessimism. I mean, no one can
> no the answer, for or against god's existence. Therefore, the logical decision
> is to be agnostic. The decision benefiting ones emotional and physical well
> being is to be religious, in conrast (this is not just a personal
> opinion...studies have shown religious people live much longer lives then
> nonbeleivers, and suffer much less, from depression).
You are very quick to project your own feelings and values onto
others, you'll never understand the other persons view that way.
And I'd really like to get a reference to that study.
> Athiests, at least all the ones I have known, seem to have at their base this
> supposition: 'The world is an uncaring, random place, and I see this for
> certain. I accept the horrible truthes, like my life has no meaning past what I
> give it, and my death is destined to be final.' My problem with this conclusion
> is that they seem to be often concluding that there must be no god because it's
> the 'hard' decision to make, the one most people don't want to make, and that
> it's truth is shown by its unappealing nature. I don't see how this works
> though, as it would also be unappealing to say, for example, that every time
> your head was turned little gremlins jumped out of the earth and horribly
> mutilated everyone outside your view, and they only appeared to return to normal
> when you looked at them again. Just because somthing is unpleasent doesn't make
> it right, and just because something seems all warm and fuzzy doesn't make it
> wrong.
I'm an atheist (or at least a non-believer if you want to bandy words) because
I see no evidence whatsoever of a god. It's not at all unpleasant to not believe
in god in the same way as it's not unpleasant not to believe in the little
gremlins.
*p
np. Cyberage Radio 07.02
(that Absurd Minds track is pretty good, anyone know if they have an album out
or on the way? I miss the Project Pitchfork of yore.)
Dayv!
> nihilist tendencies, or at least a tendency towards global pessimism.
> I mean, no one can no the answer, for or against god's existence.
> Therefore, the logical decision is to be agnostic.
Please learn what agnosticism is before referring to it in
conversation. Agnosticism is not the profession of a lack of knowledge,
it is the belief that absolute knowledge of the existence of god is
impossible, that it must be held on faith alone. It is possible to be
agnostic and still have faith.
Rian A. Miller
vessel in your brain. Just learn to deal with the fact that even though you
think it's stupid, some people believe in God and Christianity..Sorry!
Rian
Borg166 wrote:
> > You fall in the same trap the fundamentalists do. Reading the words of
> > the Bible, but not the message, which basically is "if you screw up,
> > you're going to end up in Hell". There is no mention anywhere of
> > whether this will happen at the end of your normal life or if your
> > licence to breathe just suddenly expired.
>
> But many of the people God killed didn't screw up at all.
> Did they all end up in Hell? Probably.
> If Hell exists will I end up there? Definitely.
> Will I give a fuck? No.
> Will Dayv! destroy God and free the universe of his evil wrath? Yes.
gen...@rpi.edu
: Well, you know, science is always advancing. I am hoping before I die, they
: will come up with a way to stop aging, or maybe download my mind. Failing
A friend of mine does research in this area. For a while, he was adamant
that "in our lifetime" we would "cure aging" .... he has since rescinded
this comment.
However, he recently stated that with genetic engineering, biotech, etc -
the lifespan of current and future generations is going to be huge. He
also had a funny thing the other day akin to that paradox (forget what the
name of it was) whereby an arrow could never reach its target since you
can always divide the distance by 2. Anyhow, he said that the average
lifespan is increasing (obviously) but also the amount of increase over
time is increasing ...
Anyhow, it is predicted that by the time our group gets up in the 70s,
that we will pass the "one more year per year" mark - that is, every year
the average lifespan increases more than a year - and thus we would never
die :)
--
Jeff Gentry jes...@rpi.edu gen...@rpi.edu
"You're one of those condescending UNIX users! ...."
"Here's a nickel kid ... get yourself a real computer."
gen...@rpi.edu
: less war when there is less religion... all I meant was that there has
: been just as much war in these more secular times than any other time -
: which you seem to agree with. So don't get your panties all tied in a
: knot.
Uh, if you meant that there was "just as much", why didn't you say that
instead of asaying that there was more?
Lars Casteen
<gen...@rpi.edu> wrote in message
news:JX0b5.22421$Q8.1...@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net...
>. He
> also had a funny thing the other day akin to that paradox (forget what the
> name of it was) whereby an arrow could never reach its target since you
> can always divide the distance by 2
This is Zeno's Paradox, and it's bullshit, since it works on a geometric,
rather than an algebraic, model of the way that things move. An arrow would
move in a linear manner moving x feet per second, with the distance from the
staring location increasing at a (for our purposes) constant manner. So,
technically, whether or not it crosses half way is unimportant. I don't
know what bearing this has on the current conversation, but perhaps it has
something to do with your friend's research.
gen...@rpi.edu
: This is Zeno's Paradox, and it's bullshit, since it works on a geometric,
: rather than an algebraic, model of the way that things move. An arrow would
: move in a linear manner moving x feet per second, with the distance from the
: staring location increasing at a (for our purposes) constant manner. So,
: technically, whether or not it crosses half way is unimportant. I don't
: know what bearing this has on the current conversation, but perhaps it has
: something to do with your friend's research.
Not anythign at all. I just thought it was similar in that, while
obviously bullshit, it is one of those "hey, yeah" type of things ...
The equivalent "paradox" that I was stating was that in about 50 years,
the average life span will be increasing at greater than one year per
year. And thus, it would seem that no one would ever die.
Of course, since it is the "average" life span, that isn't true (just as
you pointed out, there is an obvious logical reason why the arrow hits the
target)
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
Christ in his albums?
Erek
In article <20000710194836...@ng-ch1.aol.com>,
bunke...@aol.com (Bunkertor5) wrote:
> <<
> Are VNV Aethiests?
> Just wondering.
> >>
>
> i dont know, but i think that guy from apoptygma berzerk is...
yeah....
>
Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
pick it up. www.edge.org for a blurb. Sounds pretty cool along the
lines you were speaking of.
Erek
In article <20000712001536...@ng-fc1.aol.com>,
mesh...@aol.com (Meshlife) wrote:
> >snip< all these posts...<
>
> my view is that people don't need the negative baggage that comes
with
> organized religion in order to have faith or providence or whatever.
religion
> and faith are 2 different things in their very concepts. as for
bashing
> religion, it doesn't really accomplish everything, but since there
are bad
> points to it, i just don't see why people can't have simple faith,
if 'God'
> suits them. i angered by society's inability to evolve in this
matter; as
> humans evolve in various ways but religion does not, religion just
becomes more
> ridiculous and outdated...blah blah blah, anyway..
J. Wood
> "Borg166" <bor...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:396BCA68...@hotmail.com...
> > <snip God's body count>
>
> Heh...sounds like God's been rehearsing for a role in the next Wes Craven
> flick
...or Cecil B. De Mille.
J
Borg166
Marian Try Slaughter wrote:
> Borg166 <bor...@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:396C14DD...@hotmail.com...
> > > You fall in the same trap the fundamentalists do. Reading the words of
> > > the Bible, but not the message, which basically is "if you screw up,
> > > you're going to end up in Hell". There is no mention anywhere of
> > > whether this will happen at the end of your normal life or if your
> > > licence to breathe just suddenly expired.
> >
> > But many of the people God killed didn't screw up at all.
> > Did they all end up in Hell? Probably.
> > If Hell exists will I end up there? Definitely.
> > Will I give a fuck? No.
> > Will Dayv! destroy God and free the universe of his evil wrath? Yes.
>
> reading your last few posts in this thread, how can you honestly call
> yourself an athiest?
I am. I was just kidding. It was all sarcasm.
In the event that God(tm) actually existed...those things I said would be true.
Borg166
> these people, than you must also believe that God created a heaven (since
> taking such details as word-for-word truth would be a fundamentalist
> endeavor), and the meaning that this would provide for your life would be
> heartwarming, to say the least.
I don't believe God killed all of those people since I don't believe God(s)
exists.
Borg166
Borg166 wrote:
I want to correct myself, I forgot that you weren't mentioning me directly.
Sorry
Borg166
"Rian A. Miller" wrote:
> Woah, you need to calm down Borg. You're going to end up bursting a blood
> vessel in your brain. Just learn to deal with the fact that even though you
> think it's stupid, some people believe in God and Christianity..Sorry!
> Rian
I need a woman like you in my life to keep me sane.
Want to come over my house for a few drinks? ;-)
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
in my life generally adhere to a fairly distinct
philosophy/theology/ideology. It basically supports the theory that it
doesn't matter what you have faith in as long as you have faith. It's
all well and good to put Nietzche up on a pedestal as one of the
premier geniuses of the modern age, but one should also know that he
spent his last years in a mental institution.
Society is much more of hive than we believe, especially now with the
internet (hive mind [television in it's more primitive incarnation])
and sanity, contentment, mental health is all based upon a rigid code
of ways that are acceptable to think to belong to your society, that's
why the only philosophies that are adopted are ones that have the good
of the people as whole at their heart in their inception. Communism,
Democracy, even feudalism were all based upon the greater good
otherwise they would never have worked as well as they did. This is
why anarchy and nihilism don't hold much water because for society to
hold together we need common beliefs. Whether or not there really is a
god becomes irrelevant because his place as the complete and total
sovereign of humanity is assured, regardless of his actual existance.
Erek
In article <396B0D9D...@snet.net>,
eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> wrote:
>
>
> The Rattler wrote:
>
> > In article <396A7430...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net says...
> > > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited
level of people I
> > > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an
athiest (minus
> > > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
> >
> > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
>
> Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in
society by making
> some people have some happiness in their lives, and providing a
deeper reason for
> thing; I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious.
Sure, you have
> less wars and all, but the whole population seems to muddle through
life, waiting to
> die. When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you
know there is a
> problem with a national psyche. Then again, maybe I cam connecting
two unrelated
> things.
>
> --
> The homeless don't want a handout so much as a handjob.
>
>
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
John mistake.
Erek
In article <y4Va5.2059$4U4.3...@paloalto-snr1.gtei.net>,
"Rev Ammonia D" <ammo...@gte.net> wrote:
> Lars, you beat me to the punch.
> (I still have my all my Kansas 8 tracks as well as "Point of Know
Return"
> concert T...my very first rock concert!!)
>
> I guess it is just like what Trent Reznor said "I wish everyday was
> Holloween"
>
> --
> The Rev
> Manhole Vortex
> http://www.manholevortex.com
> http://www.artsindustria.com
>
> "People handing out insults with such casualty"......Jewel
>
> Lars Casteen <la...@SPAMTRAPrlc.net> wrote in message
> news:8kguig$ofv$1...@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU...
> >
> > "Dayv!" <laug...@yourpainBAD-ASS-SPAMTRAP.com> wrote in message
> > news:XLOa5.115$rhm.3...@dca1-nnrp1.news.digex.net...
> > > D00d, get over it. Elton John was right, all we are is dust
in the
> > > wind.*
> > >
> > > * anyone who corrects me on this has terrible taste in music.
> >
> > Well, fuck... I'll bite.
> >
> > *AHEM*
> >
> > Kansas, not Elton John.
> >
> > -=-
> > Lars
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
lifespan?
Erek
In article <JX0b5.22421$Q8.1...@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,
gen...@rpi.edu wrote:
> eschaton <hzimm...@snet.net> wrote:
> : Well, you know, science is always advancing. I am hoping before I
die, they
> : will come up with a way to stop aging, or maybe download my mind.
Failing
>
> A friend of mine does research in this area. For a while, he was
adamant
> that "in our lifetime" we would "cure aging" .... he has since
rescinded
> this comment.
>
> However, he recently stated that with genetic engineering, biotech,
etc -
> the lifespan of current and future generations is going to be huge.
He
> also had a funny thing the other day akin to that paradox (forget
what the
> name of it was) whereby an arrow could never reach its target since
you
> can always divide the distance by 2. Anyhow, he said that the average
> lifespan is increasing (obviously) but also the amount of increase
over
> time is increasing ...
>
> Anyhow, it is predicted that by the time our group gets up in the 70s,
> that we will pass the "one more year per year" mark - that is, every
year
> the average lifespan increases more than a year - and thus we would
never
> die :)
>
> --
> Jeff Gentry jes...@rpi.edu gen...@rpi.edu
> "You're one of those condescending UNIX users! ...."
> "Here's a nickel kid ... get yourself a real computer."
>
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
most destructive wars that we had in our most "irreligious" century
were caused by people who adhered to an EXTREMELY strict code of
ideology. I don't think that you can seperate the nazis from
fundamentalist christians just because their method of madness included
more realistic goals. Trying to create a race of supermen is task of
mythic proportions just as spending your whole life praying to be taken
up in the rapture is. The greatest conflicts are usually caused in the
name of religion. Look at Israel and the Arab nations that surround
it. Israel was given a nation by the UN under the condition that it be
a JEWISH state, while kicking out the current Palestinian occupants.
The thing stopping the peace process there is that the Arabs are
Fundamnetally Islamic and the Israelis are Fundamentally Jewish. The
Christians have bowed out of the holy land more or less and this is the
most likely catalyst for World War III. My wife is Israeli and she
explained to me that if Israel went into Iraq it would cause World War
III which is one of the main reasons the US did it instead. As an
interesting sidebar however, it is the complete faith that Jews have in
themselves being the chosen people of God that keeps them from losing,
and Israelis don't lose.
So I think calling this the most irreligious century is a misnomer.
Erek
In article <396BD350...@cwpost.liu.edu>,
Sean McGill <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> wrote:
>
>
> eschaton wrote:
> >
> > The Rattler wrote:
> >
> > > In article <396A7430...@snet.net>, hzimm...@snet.net
says...
> > > > Besides that, I have lived in england, and in my very limited
level of people I
> > > > met, almost everyone I met who was reasonably young was an
athiest (minus
> > > > 2...and only 2, born-agains)...it was fucking spooky.
> > >
> > > What's spooky about that? It's serious progress!
> >
> > Eh. While an agnostic, I feel religion plays an important role in
society by making
> > some people have some happiness in their lives, and providing a
deeper reason for
> > thing; I have a deep unease when an entire culture is irrelegious.
Sure, you have
> > less wars and all, but the whole population seems to muddle through
life, waiting to
> > die. When most of the really happy people you know are drunks, you
know there is a
> > problem with a national psyche. Then again, maybe I cam connecting
two unrelated
> > things.
>
> The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the most
> destructive wars man has ever seen.
>
> I don't see how atheism is progress either. At least Christians found
> some value in life, unlike most atheists.
>
> sm
Rian A. Miller
drink with you?! I suppose I would have to go out and buy the alcohol, huh?
Rian
Borg166
"Rian A. Miller" wrote:
> You're not even old enough to get into clubs legally, and you want me to have a
> drink with you?! I suppose I would have to go out and buy the alcohol, huh?
Ask Ian to buy it, I'm sure he'd pick some good shit.
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
means "to know" and the Gnostics were early Christians.
Erek
In article <aL%a5.46$otn.5...@dca1-nnrp1.news.digex.net>,
> "Will Dayv! destroy God and free the universe of his evil wrath?"
>
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
Erek
In article <j5Pa5.20590$DJ2.1...@typhoon.ne.mediaone.net>,
gen...@rpi.edu wrote:
> Sean McGill <smcg...@cwpost.liu.edu> wrote:
> : The 20th century - the most irreligious century - had more & the
most
> : destructive wars man has ever seen.
>
> You're *really* twisting facts here ...
>
> "more" wars ... well, considering that a) It is *far* easier to war
> someone across the fucking globe, and b) modern wars don't tend to
last
> all that long (a few years at most) - and it is really freaking easy
to
> see why we have more wars. Cut back a few hundred years .... wars
lasted
> 20, 30, hell even a 100 years long. It was also much more difficult
to
> war someone - you generally fought against your neighbour, not some
far
> off land. With modern transportation, people are going to get pissed
off at
> a lot more other nations now - that means "more" wars ....
furthermore,
> since our wars tend to be shorter, we don't get nearly as much
agression
> out :)
>
> "more destructive" ... errr, technology has freaking improved
10000000x
> fold, jackass. Of course wars are going to get more destructive. You
> honestly think that if the Crusaders had the A-Bomb that they wouldn't
> have used it? Blah.
>
> Bugger off, you're spouting nonsense.
>
> --
> Jeff Gentry jes...@rpi.edu gen...@rpi.edu
> "You're one of those condescending UNIX users! ...."
> "Here's a nickel kid ... get yourself a real computer."
>
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
In article <19e352b6...@usw-ex0104-032.remarq.com>,
grrstomp <grrstomp...@mindspring.com.invalid> wrote:
> "Rian A. Miller" <Ri...@USTEK.com> wrote:
>
> >All you people complain about born-agains, but I have to say,
> you are all just as
> >bad. You trash them for shoving it in your face, but you just
> shove it right back.
> >What a load of bullshit it is, blah, blah, blah. Why not just
> forget about it
> >instead of turning into the people you hate?
>
> To get a little off-topic, and to include a bit of a rant, you
> hit the nail on the head on this one.
> It's funny to find ANYONE who says that they are "accepting" or
> very "openminded" and "tolerant"- because most people who say
> that really, truly aren't. We're all guilty of it, actually. We
> don't want other's ideas and beliefs forced on us but what do we
> (and i use "we" as a general term) do? Exactly what we don't
> want done to us.
> It's called the golden rule. Do unto others.. blah blah..
> </babble>
>
> -erica
>
> ---------///\\\Noise Militia///\\\---------
> -(music that is sort of bad, but noisy)-http://noisemilitia.iuma.com
> -(home)New and IMPROVED! <+new pix+>-http://decoded.iwarp.com
> -(e.mail <love letters, legal notices, etc)- grrs...@hotmail.com
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------
>
> Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com.
> Up to 100 minutes free!
> http://www.keen.com
isoldmys...@my-deja.com
Based on your comment we believe two things
A) God exists
B) He's a motherfucker
Now I will adress our issues
A) The basic assumption in the belief in god is that he's all powerful
and all knowing. (Christian God) According to the basic belief in an
afterlife with God in heaven, life on earth is just a fetal stage.
B) You are assuming Death is a big deal, which a beliefe in god would
tend to put less importance on. 4 year olds tend to thing your a
motherfucker when you take the tasty nailgun out of their mouth too.
Your Mom is a cunt for making you get out of her womb.
Erek
In article <396BF520...@hotmail.com>,
Borg166 <bor...@hotmail.com> wrote:
> > That said though, in an odd way I would still rather die and go to
hell
> > for eternity then cease to exist. An eternity of pain is better
then no
> > eternity at all.
>
> Have you read my earlier post about God's Kill Total? If I was given
a
> choice of Heaven or Hell, I'd choose Hell over that monster known as
YWHY.
> He's an all loving being all right...
>
> A being who loves to KILL and TORTURE
>
> Fuck the bible. Christians and Jews are worshiping someone who is
worse
> than Hitler.
>
>
gen...@rpi.edu
: Doesn't murder and accidental death get factored into the average
: lifespan?
I believe everything involving the length of one's life is factored into
the average lifespan :)