Hello rmimers
Jay
78rpms) Google groups.
You will have the opportunity of listening rare wonderful songs in
both, HFM & TFM... to learn and imbibe the art of melodic creativity .
I have made a trial attempt to provide the best of both HFM as well as
TFM...from the music point of view.
Kindly offer your feedback accdgly
Jay
18/11
surjit singh
UVR
Shri Jayaraman,
Thank you very much for making these songs available. The song from
Kalyani, particularly. TMS actually sounded good to me in it -- very
well-rounded voice. Jamuna Rani, not so much (due to my personal
preference for a softer tone).
Technical/technological question: why is the Dulari mp3 much noisier
and of decidedly worse quality in terms of recording/encoding-wise
than the Kalyani mp3? Is this how your 78s of these songs also sound
relative to each other?
-UVR.
Sanjeev Ramabhadran
> On Nov 18, 5:09 am, Jay <sjhh...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > W.E.F. today. Wed, 18th; please LOGIN to BCSP (until the reign of
> > 78rpms) Google groups.
>
> > You will have the opportunity of listening rare wonderful songs in
> > both, HFM & TFM... to learn and imbibe the art of melodic creativity .
>
> > I have made a trial attempt to provide the best of both HFM as well as
> > TFM...from the music point of view.
>
> > Kindly offer your feedback accdgly
>
> > Jay
> > 18/11
>
> Shri Jayaraman,
>
> Thank you very much for making these songs available. The song from
> Kalyani, particularly. TMS actually sounded good to me in it -- very
> well-rounded voice. Jamuna Rani, not so much (due to my personal
> preference for a softer tone).
Very interesting - who is credited as the music director for
"Kalyani"?
> Technical/technological question: why is the Dulari mp3 much noisier
> and of decidedly worse quality in terms of recording/encoding-wise
> than the Kalyani mp3? Is this how your 78s of these songs also sound
> relative to each other?
Another technical/technological note - it is a bit unusual to hear TMS
singing in this low pitch (though perhaps like Rafi his songs were
more often set in such scales early on?). Is playback speed correct
(it sounded fine for the Dulari song)?
Sanjeev
Vishwanath
>
> - Show quoted text -
Yes, my memory of TMS is at a higher pitch.
Jay - thanks for posting.
Vishwanath
Jay
I don't know - maybe, the present cartridge or stylus of it needs a
change. On my Spider Player with equaliser its wonderful. But in 78rpm
recordings, always a minor percentage of hiss/noise has to present
with ceramic cartridges, I guess !
Jay
19/11
Jay
You have not commented ...whatever ..about the two songs
comparritively in terms of 'melodic appeal' overall by an impartial
judgement!
The 2 voices TMS and JR vs Rafi - Lata.. Herein, comes the 'bias' in
your 'already programmed system' of the self.
Your REAL LOVE4MUSIC comes when you are ready to DUMP even your hot
favorites..whoever it be, for the sake of music, remember.
Still plenty to follow from BCSP
Jay
19/11
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
Some credit it to GR while some say it is V.Dakshinamurthy.
Jay
19/11
Balaji Murthy
S.Dakshinamurthy perhaps!! And I agree with other that the speed may
be causing TMS to sound softer than normal.
Looking forward to more of these.
- Balaji
Deepak
Thanks for posting. Enjoyed the music even though I don't understand Tamil.
By the way, are both the songs from your collection of 78 rpm records? I ask
because in the past, you had once told me that you were exploring some Tamil
music from some website and downloading from there. So, if you downloaded
the Tamil song from some source other than digitizing from one of your own
collection of records, that may explain the difference in speed.
Deepak
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
No Tamil records in my stock ...I had previously. These have been
dispatched to me by a collector in abundance ( the older ones from
1941 to 64-Tamil films on seeing my credentials. His only request was:
'Please do not ask me any details of the songs provided'.
Being a Tamilian , I do not know to read and write Tamil even
now..though I can follow and speak so-so. Coupled to these, no
reference books of any sort available in Mumbai nor any connoisseurs
deeply rooted in TFM, like Mr Saravanan or Mr Manisekharan of
Dhool.com based in U.S. Tried to contact them desperately...but no
response
What to do?
But one thing: I can very much spot out the music of
G.Ramanathan,...invariably, by his style which many, many of the other
MDs lacked in essence.
One must hear and learn a lot about him:
G.Ramanathan between 1934-39
G.Ramanathan between 1940-49
G.Ramanathan between 1950-59
G.Ramanathan between 1960-64
The Carnatic base & the theater style was deeply rooted in his works,
which he never compromised till his end. He kept on changing his style
of composing lighter tunes keeping with the times.
I shall be putting all these up on my groups gradually.
Jay
20/11
Sukesh
Now you are talking. Your posts without a mention of G Ramanathan (may
his soul rest in peace) seem so incomplete. Please do carry on and
remember to mention the composer in every post and for a good measure
slam the rest of composers.
Sukesh
kcp
> Technical/technological question: why is the Dulari mp3 much noisier
> and of decidedly worse quality in terms of recording/encoding-wise
> than the Kalyani mp3?
I have modified Jai's file and uploaded...it sounds good ( to me )
Thanks Jay for this wonderful song. I had enjoyed a lot recently, on
youtube to see the picturization. One can download MP3 from there too
( I use free software : http://www.vdownloader.es/files/vdownloader.zip
)
UVR
Now, as one of our other friends said, you're talking! :) Thanks for
this, KCP.
-UVR.
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
Since you are learned in Carnatic music , I would need your assistance
in identifying raagas of certain songs that I would be posting up
gradually ! And give me the correct answers please. If you have any
doubts of your abilities, even then let me know...but the
identification must be cent percent correct.
Jay
22/11
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
What / which speed r u referrin to?
Nothing of that sort, please.
BTW, are you the moderator of dhool sotd groups?
Your name sounds similar, I don't know..pls clarify?
Jay
22/11
AR
Thank you for creating this new group and thanks a lot for posting the
Lata-Rafi duet from Dulari and its Thamizh version sung by TMS and
Jamuna Rani. I have always loved the voice of Jamuna Rani and TMS, and
both songs you've uploaded were a treat. I look forward to listening
to more songs from your group, especially the ones from south Indian
films.
I listened to both aforementioned songs several times over the past
couple of days to try and discern the difference between the Hindi and
Thamizh versions. I agree with you that the prelude to the Thamizh
version is very nice and a bit different from the Hindi song by
Naushad. However, as such, the tune has been copied entirely by G
Ramanathan (possibly under pressure from the producer) and therefore
this is a glaring instance of plagiarism in Hindi film music. I mean,
the website for plagiarism in Indian music has listed some songs of R
D Burman where he has copied very tiny snippets from western
originals. On the other hand, G Ramanathan has taken Naushad's tune
almost entirely (and the additional embellishments to the interludes
are indeed minor). Did any journalist ever ask GR about why he did
such a thing?
Kalyan
I guess Jay needs to explain why such a great composer needed to copy
(and I believe this isn't the only instance). And more so, why copy
such an average song from an average soundtrack by an average
composer :)
Kalyan
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
GR's greatness was unquestionable ...but the Producer of the film
concerned has always been the boss during every stage of film
production, be it Hindi, Tamil or any. The others only SERVE HIM to
his ideas. DULARI film songs were commercially very popular all over
India around 1949 onwards. Maybe, the Producer of KALYANI took a
facination for this duet in question and instructed the MD concerned
to provide a suitable imitation. The MD had to abide and accomplished
the task accordingly.
Jay
23/11
Sukesh
Now that would be your explanation, not a very convincing one though,
given the greatness of the composer you have attributed to him. It is
one the easiest excuses one can give for plagiarising.
The question is how do you know that this indeed is the fact? You were
not part of the film or the composer's team, thus having no first hand
information.
Regards
Sukesh
.
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
Let me give you an example ...a realistic one, even today or tomorrow
also.
Suppose you are producing a Hindi musical film titled: BBB and you
have utilized the services of a MD who is more than OK.
Won't u like to him to give his best creativity for a commercial
success of the film?
And presuming, you as a Producer having some basic knowledge and
tastes in filmy music ..which you may be well aware of in film circles
everywhere...And if you know that a certain MD had created a fabulous
duet WHICH HAS HYPNOTISED YOU very much.won't u like your present MD
could bring out something of that sort for you film too ??
A logical YES would be anyone's answer...since you are the Producer,
actively looking out for COMMERCIAL SUCCESS desperately !! Obviously,
you relate your 'wants' to the MD becoz u r the boss !!
Your MD, however talented he may be, listens to your 'wants' and tries
his best to evolve a similar tune as sugested and approved by the
boss !!
Thats it !!
NAGIN (5) was a commercial hit .a musical blockbuster from Filmistan.
The Producer attempted a second venture of NAGIN in TAJ by/from the
same MD. The result was a commercial flop. So too, was ALBELA ('51)
followed by JHAMELA ('52)
Jay
24/11
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
Came to learn thatthe music for KALYANI ('51) was composed by MD:
Dakshinamurthy
Jay
24/11
AR
Yes, but you've overlooked three crucial points.
Firstly, if the music director had courage of conviction and ethics,
he would tell the producer - "I'll create a wonderful tune that will
far surpass the original. In fact, here are ten tunes for you from my
repertoire of tunes already composed. Why don't you pick the one that
you like best? If you don't agree, you are not worthy of the services
of G Ramanathan". Now, in this case, GR would've risked alienating one
producer, but certainly given his sheer genius he would have been able
to convince most producers and eventually they would've begun to think
twice before trying to pressurize him unduly. The true test of all
these qualities is under difficult circumstances.
Secondly, as Sukesh has pointed out, all this is just conjecture. GR
may have very well done this on his own, and maybe the producer didn't
force him to copy the tune!
Thirdly, in any case, you do agree that the tune originally being
Naushad's, GR's creative input to the particular song you've uploaded
is close to zero. So it's a very wrong example to cite when you are
trying to introduce people to his work and his genius.
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
The points I have mentioned apply to MDs other than GR...not
GR,please .
GR's favorite was Naushad from the Hindi side . Someone asked him why?
He replied that Naushad's tunes were easier to be improvised.!!
And GR proved it not once, but a no.of times Examples are Chandni
Raat; Dillagi; Anmol Ghadi, Shahjaha..to mention a few. A super
improvisation of 2 songs from DULARI in ONE Tamil 5.5 mins dance song.
One antara of each song + a 3rd antara in his style.
The GREATNESS of any MD can be discovered in his/her ability in
composing tunes/songs of the 'devotional / bhaktiras' & classical2semi
classical involving dance jugalbandi, besides the other various
types.In this context, he was par de excellence, outclassing many
stalwarts. TRUST me, I have yet to come across a MD of his type.
One has to listen to his repertoire in depth.
One unique style of of GR that I have noticed in his style is that he
COMMENCES the song straight away without any instrumental interlude
or orchestra.Secondly, his greatest forte was COMPOSING MUSIC ON
PROSE LYRICS. One gets immersed in his raaga elaboration.
Thats the GR - music circulating in my system day-n-night..24 hrs
giving me that wonderful ENERGY to accomplish my daily chores
tirelessly
Jay
24/11
Deepak
news:57e827ed-90d0-4806...@d9g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
On Nov 24, 9:18 am, AR <aji...@gmail.com> wrote:
> GR's favorite was Naushad from the Hindi side . Someone asked him why?
> He replied that Naushad's tunes were easier to be improvised.!!
If he had permission from Naushad to "improvise" and use Naushad's music,
then I would use the word (improvisation). If not, I will call it
plagiarization. Finally, it takes grreater skills to create some thing new.
Deepak
vijay...@my-deja.com
> One unique style of of GR that I have noticed in his style is that
> he COMMENCES the song straight away without any instrumental
> interlude or orchestra.
> Jay
> 24/11
I think the word you are looking for is "prelude"
not "interlude".
Irrespective, GR is hardly unique in this trait.
Guru Dutt & OPN made a specialty of this somewhat -
- jaane kahaa.N meraa jigar gayaa jii
- aji dil par huaa aisaa jaadoo
- sun sun sun sun zaalima
- udhar tum hasii.n ho
are examples that come readily to mind.
There are any number of HFM songs that start
with an alaap not preceded by any instrumental
music, and a very large number of songs that
start with a prelude, also without an instrumental
introduction.
- ramayya vastavayya
- laagaa chunari me.n daag
- mai.n bahaaro.n kaa ... Rs. 5.75
are songs that start with a long (or short)
alaap.
- akelii mat jaiyo ... tuu ganga ki mauj me
- bhaaii he ... apani kahaanii chho.D jaa
- khushii ke saath ... meraa jeevan saathi
are examples where the verbal prelude precedes
the instrumental part.
HTH.
Vijay
Kalyan
>
> The points I have mentioned apply to MDs other than GR...not
> GR,please .
> GR's favorite was Naushad from the Hindi side . Someone asked him why?
> He replied that Naushad's tunes were easier to be improvised.!!
>
>
Reminds me of something Sajjad said of Naushad :)
Kalyan
Sukesh
Jay has not been listening to his collection of 'mint' 78 rpms
( probably that is why they are in mint condition), there are hundreds
of songs which have no prelude.
Here are few more candidates (I have looked only at films starting
with A, B and C in my small collection).
AMAR DEEP=1958=dekh hame aawaaz naa denaa=Asha Bhosle + Mohammad
Rafi=Rajinder Krishan=C Ramchandra
ARMAN=1953=chaahe kitnaa mujhe tum=Talat Mehmood + Asha Bhosle=Sahir
Ludhianvi=S D Burman
BANDINI=1963=moraa goraa angg=Lata Mangeshkar=Gulzar=S D Burman
BASANT BAHAR=1956=baDi der bha.ee=Mohammad Rafi=Shailendra=Shankar
Jaikishan
BOMBAY KA CHOR=1962=hasrat hi rahi=Kishore Kumar=Rajinder Krishan=Ravi
C I D=1956=aa.nkho.n hi aa.nkho.n mei.n=Mohammad Rafi + Geeta Dutt=Jan
Nissar Akhtar=O P Nayyar
C I D=1956=ai dil hai mushqil jeenaa yahaa.n=Mohammad Rafi + Geeta
Dutt=Majrooh Sultanpuri=O P Nayyar
CHALTI KA NAAM GADI=1958=haal kaisaa hai janaab kaa=Asha
Bhosle=Majrooh Sultanpuri=S D Burman
CHHOO MANTAR=1956=gam nahin kar musskuraa=Mohammad Rafi + Geeta
Dutt=Jan Nissar Akhtar=O P Nayyar
Regards
Sukesh
UVR
This is all very nice and great, but in fairness to GR, wasn't most of
his (GR's) work done in the years preceding most of these songs? I
thought GR's period was the mid-40s to mid-50s stretching a bit into
the late 50s.
In any case, let's not hasten to take credit away from someone just
because Jay seems to like them a lot! :-P
-UVR.
Afzal A. Khan
> GR's favorite was Naushad from the Hindi side . Someone asked him why?
> He replied that Naushad's tunes were easier to be improvised.!!
I wonder if GR was aware that his real favourite should have
been Ghulam Mohammed !!!
>
> And GR proved it not once, but a no.of times Examples are Chandni
> Raat; Dillagi; Anmol Ghadi, Shahjaha..to mention a few. A super
> improvisation of 2 songs from DULARI in ONE Tamil 5.5 mins dance song.
> One antara of each song + a 3rd antara in his style.
I think corresponding examples from GR's compositions may be
provided in relation to these additional Naushad songs.
Afzal
> Jay
> 24/11
Jay
> "Jay" <sjhh...@gmail.com> wrote in message
You may call by anything to any degree...tumko / humko kaun poochhta
hai?? Plagiarization is only when the NEW TUNE is an exact / almost
to the ORIGINAL in question !!
Here the DULARI & KALYANI duets as well as the AMAR SHAHEED &
KATTABOMAN duets again.
Here is an ideal example of plagiarization:
==============================
SANGDIL & AAKHRI DAO ( the Talat solo & Rafi's solo resptly) &
theKhurshid solo from PARDESI('41) & the Chitalkar solo from ZABAN
('43).
The latter song bowls you out lock,stock & barrel through my googly.
Many more one can find too.
Jay
25/11
Jay
>
> - Show quoted text -
No UVR - His film career started from about 1932 as assistant to
Papanasam Sivan alongwith the Alathur Bros...as related by historians
Manisekharan and Suresh Even then, if you are a keen student in the
study of GR's talent, you will observe all the styles of Papanasam
Sivan in GR's repertoire down the years.Ofcourse, he did add his own
features from time2time as the rigid classical style gave in to semi-n-
light classical gradually. He had fully grasped the filmi culture-n-
trends. No wonder the major no.of films from Modern Theaters / Salem,
went to GR and GR alone. His boss was Mr.T.R.Sundaram B.A.(Leeds).
There was NONE to outscore him when it came to 'devotional music' in
films like Siva Kavi/42; Haridas/44; Aryamala/42; Jagadalaprathapan/
44; Apoorva Chintamani/47; Bhoja/48; Sri Andal/48; Mangayarkarasi/
48...an endless list till his last film , Arunagirinathar/64 wherein
he could compose only two songs.
TMS in his interview says: if one can sing under GR; you can rest be
assured you will be able to sing under every other MD.
=====================================================================================
I will be putting up one 'clip' from a GR-film soon.. Just observe the
'pallavi' or 'mukhda' of that song ,rendered by P.Leela. OMG!
Unbelievable that GR could have created that!
Once someone asked GR as to who were his favorite female singers! He
replied: S.Varalaxmi & Jikki
Keep watch for my GR postings and songs
Jay
25/11
Sukesh
> One unique style of of GR that I have noticed in his style is that he
> COMMENCES the song straight away without any instrumental interlude
> or orchestra.Secondly, his greatest forte was COMPOSING MUSIC ON
> PROSE LYRICS. One gets immersed in his raaga elaboration.
> Jay
> 24/11
There is nothing unique about this. I am sure R C Boral, Pankaj
Mullick and other composers of the 30s would have also composed songs
minus the instrumental prelude.
Here are two
MADHURI=1932=ahmkaar kar ke hameshaa=Prof. Vinayakrao
Patwardhan=Composer: Prasunsukh Nayak
MADHURI=1932=kaise dekhoo.n baa.nsuri=Prof. Vinayakrao
Patwardhan=Composer: Prasunsukh Nayak
In 1932, GR had just started as an assistant. Senior citizen members
would be able to ferret many more songs.
So what else is new?.
Regards
Sukesh
AR
> On Nov 24, 9:38 pm, "Deepak" <deepak.sab...@hp.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jay" <sjhh...@gmail.com> wrote in message
>
> >news:57e827ed-90d0-4806...@d9g2000prh.googlegroups.com...
> > On Nov 24, 9:18 am, AR <aji...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > > GR's favorite was Naushad from the Hindi side . Someone asked him why?
> > > He replied that Naushad's tunes were easier to be improvised.!!
>
> > If he had permission from Naushad to "improvise" and use Naushad's music,
> > then I would use the word (improvisation). If not, I will call it
> > plagiarization. Finally, it takes grreater skills to create some thing new.
>
> > Deepak
>
> You may call by anything to any degree...tumko / humko kaun poochhta
> hai?? Plagiarization is only when the NEW TUNE is an exact / almost
> to the ORIGINAL in question !!
>
>
> 25/11
Jayaramanji - your assertion that plagiarism is about only exact
copying is erroneous. Plagiarism is defined as copying any part of
someone else's work - to any extent, however small or big. The small
or big part defines only the extent of plagiarism (a small extent does
not absolve you of the act in itself).
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/plagiarize
"to steal and pass off (the ideas or words of another) as one's own :
use (another's production) without crediting the source"
In case of the song you have quoted, G Ramanathan has stolen Naushad's
tune entirely and the changes to the interludes are certainly
insignificant in comparison. This is unethical on his part, as even
further indicated by his statement that it was easier to "improvise"
Naushad's tunes. His usage of the word "improvise" is incorrect and
his usage of the word "easier" in fact indicates that he didn't want
to spend time and effort in creating his song. These kind of blithe
statements have also been made by none other than Annu Malik.
Your responses to these doubts and objections raised on this thread
have largely been "red herring". You also seem to have avoided
Sukesh's correct assertion that it takes greater creativity to come up
with something very new.
Sukesh
I have listed two songs from a 1932 film, when GR started as an
assistant (that is what Jay says).
I have no opinion about GR. He may have been a genius, I haven't heard
enough of his compositions to form one and I may choose not to listen
for any number of reasons.Yet my opinion, if any, would be a personal
one.
All I am doing is trying to debate Jay's assertions vis-a-vis GR,
which so far seem to hold no water.At the moment it is just his views,
which he expects us to swallow lock, stock and barrel. Let us see if
he comes up anything 'unique' and 'original' about GR's songs, that
would propel 'lazy rmimers' (Jay's words to describe rest of us) to
listen and form an opinion.
Regards
Sukesh
Regards
Sukesh
UVR
>
> All I am doing is trying to debate Jay's assertions vis-a-vis GR,
> which so far seem to hold no water.At the moment it is just his views,
> which he expects us to swallow lock, stock and barrel. Let us see if
> he comes up anything 'unique' and 'original' about GR's songs, that
> would propel 'lazy rmimers' (Jay's words to describe rest of us) to
> listen and form an opinion.
>
> Regards
> Sukesh
Sukesh,
I do understand that you are merely disputing Jay's assertions about
GR. As is your prerogative.
But what I am saying is that GR's own caliber as a music director
should not be judged based on what Jay thinks of him. And I am also
saying that instead of spending time countering Jay's "lazy" claims
about RMIMers or his praise of GR, we could spend time actually trying
to see if GR's music is worth our time. We already know that Jay's
opinions (or rather, arguing with Jay about his opinions) is not.
-UVR.
UVR
> On Nov 25, 4:33 am, UVR <u...@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> > This is all very nice and great, but in fairness to GR, wasn't most of
> > his (GR's) work done in the years preceding most of these songs? I
> > thought GR's period was the mid-40s to mid-50s stretching a bit into
> > the late 50s.
>
>
> Papanasam Sivan alongwith the Alathur Bros...as related by historians
> Manisekharan and Suresh Even then, if you are a keen student in the
> study of GR's talent, you will observe all the styles of Papanasam
> Sivan in GR's repertoire down the years.Ofcourse, he did add his own
> features from time2time as the rigid classical style gave in to semi-n-
> light classical gradually. He had fully grasped the filmi culture-n-
> trends. No wonder the major no.of films from Modern Theaters / Salem,
> went to GR and GR alone. His boss was Mr.T.R.Sundaram B.A.(Leeds).
>
Thank you for that information on GR. I checked out some of his 40s
and 50s songs that I found online (thanks to Google) and I came to the
same conclusion that you have stated above: that GR adapted very
nicely to the times and kept in step with the demands of the changing
styles of film music.
> There was NONE to outscore him when it came to 'devotional music' in
> films like Siva Kavi/42; Haridas/44; Aryamala/42; Jagadalaprathapan/
> 44; Apoorva Chintamani/47; Bhoja/48; Sri Andal/48; Mangayarkarasi/
> 48...an endless list till his last film , Arunagirinathar/64 wherein
> he could compose only two songs.
>
> TMS in his interview says: if one can sing under GR; you can rest be
> assured you will be able to sing under every other MD.
My opinion is that anyone who can make TMS actually sound good (as he
did in the Kalyani song) has to be a good music director :) That may
sound flippant, but it's not. Being able to understand the
specialities and shortcomings of another person's voice (as GR seems
to have done with TMS') takes real talent. Many people aren't even
able to understand what their own voice is capable of.
> =====================================================================================
> I will be putting up one 'clip' from a GR-film soon.. Just observe the
> 'pallavi' or 'mukhda' of that song ,rendered by P.Leela. OMG!
> Unbelievable that GR could have created that!
>
> Once someone asked GR as to who were his favorite female singers! He
> replied: S.Varalaxmi & Jikki
Interesting. To me, this is identical to OPN saying Shamshad and
Geeta were his favorite female singers :)
>
> Keep watch for my GR postings and songs
> Jay
> 25/11
I will look forward to them.
-UVR.
Sukesh
But what I am saying is that GR's own caliber as a music director
> should not be judged based on what Jay thinks of him..
> -UVR.
UVR
I am not doing so. As I stated, I have no opinion about him one way or
the other.
Over a period of time, if I get the time I would definitely like to
hear more of GR and others too, and then have a personal opinion.
Regards
Sukesh
Jay
Yes, yes... by all means ...first listen to his works thoroughly as I
post them as well as that of other colleagues of him.
Jay
28/11